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Iranian Oil Tanker Seized by U.K. Leaves Gibraltar; Iran Warns Against Any New Seizure of Its oil Tanker; Iranians Speak Out About Tension with West; Greenland Melting Faster than Scientists Expected; Interview with Mohamed Salah, Liverpool Forward, Discusses Warda Controversy and Women's Rights in Middle East; Leaked Documents Show U.K. Preparing for No- Deal Scenario; Leaked Brexit Report Warns of Food, Medicine Shortages; Sudan's Ex-President Faces Charges of Corruption. Aired 11a-12p ET

Aired August 19, 2019 - 11:00   ET


[11:00:00] (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Iran took all diplomatic and legal ways and succeeded.


They haven't taken our ships and they better not.

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: But Iran still has a British tanker here in the port of Bandar Abbas. We'll have an update on

that in a moment -- Becky.


BECKY ANDERSON, CNN HOST: Well this hour CNN gets you rare access on the ground inside Iran as the country seems to be teaching the world a master

class in state craft.

Then a CNN exclusive for you.


MOHAMED SALAH, LIVERPOOL FORWARD: The most important thing is the fear of the wife, fear from her husband, from their father which is that's the main

point, I think. So the fear is not healthy for anyone, so we have to fix that.


ANDERSON: Perhaps the most famous Arab in the world opens up to me about the controversies -- step right into. You can only watch that right here

on CNN.



FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It is absolutely awe inspiring to see the size of this glacier, to see how much

ice is coming off that glacier that's obviously then going to flow into the world's oceans.


ANDERSON: When people in the future ask if we knew we were helping ruin our planet, we'll have to admit it was happening right in front of our

eyes. CNN takes you flying above a fast melting glacier in the middle of our climate crisis.

It is half past 7:00 at night in Tehran, 5:00 p.m. in Khartoum, 4:00 here in London where we are connecting your world live this afternoon. I'm

Becky Anderson, a very warm welcome to you all.

An oil super tanker that was at the center of a six-week standoff between Iran and the West is now on the move. This hour the renamed Iranian

tanker. Adrian Darya, is sailing through the Mediterranean. It was released by Gibraltar which refused a request from Washington to transfer

it into U.S. custody. Iran now warning that any further attempts to seize the ship would have and I quote, adverse consequences.

Meantime, we're still waiting to see what happens with a British flagship detained by Iran in what London called a tit for tat move. Well that ship

the Stena Impero is being held off the Iranian port of Bandar Abbas. And we are reporting live tonight from that very location. CNN's chief

international correspondent Clarissa Ward joining, Clarissa, us with the very latest.

WARD: That's right, Becky. We're here in Bandar Abbas, the port, and of course the question on everybody's lips at the moment is when will the

Iranians go ahead and release that British tanker that was seized two weeks after the grace one around July 22nd. It has been there -- been here since

then, but we still have no word on when the Iranians will reciprocate and when they will let this tanker go.

Earlier on today, we heard that there needed to be some kind of a court order. We have also been trying through various sources so get a better

sense on the timing here. There does seem to be a wide belief that the taker will be released. But no one seems to want to be drawn upon the

specifics with regards to timing, whether it will be in the coming days, whether it will be coming weeks, and whether it will depend on the

continued free and open course of the Grace 1 tanker.

As you mentioned, the Iranians have warned that if the Americans tried to impede their tanker's progress in any way, that that would have adverse

effects. The last we know with regard to that tanker is that it is on course heading to Greece, not clear yet if that is the final destination.

And haven't really heard yet either a reaction from the U.S. as to how they feel about the fact that this tanker, which they had very much hoped would

not be released is now free and sailing towards Greece -- Becky.

ANDERSON: Iran's response to all of this and the fact that it is still yet to release its British flagged tanker, we suggested at the beginning is

almost a sort of master class in state craft here. You know, with regard how the Iranians are dealing with sort of U.S. rhetoric around these

tankers, what's your thoughts at this point?

[11:05:00] WARD: Well, it's interesting, Becky, because we've been traveling around the country a bit. We were in Tehran. We're were in Oom.

We are here in Bandar Abbas. And broadly speaking, Iranians -- and it doesn't matter which side of the political divide they fall on, even those

who are highly critical of the current Iranian government and the supreme leader -- they all seem to support Iran's response to the seizure of the

Grace 1 tanker. They support the seizing of the Stena Impero. And there really is a sense of unity in a strange way right now, not just where

regards to the sort of tit for tat of taking this tanker but a sense of a feeling of a betrayal by the West. As the U.S. has pulled out of the

nuclear deal and reinstated sanctions. Take a look at what we've seen along the way.


WARD (voice-over): This is the city Oom. Home to one of the holiest sites in Iran, it is deeply conservative. A bastion of support for the country's

supreme leader. Ali Reza Bander is a lawyer and cleric. He supported Iran's seizure of a British oil tanker and says he does not trust the West

at all.

ALI REZA BANDER, IRANIAN LAWYER AND CLERIC: This is your culture that you say that tit for tat. No, you captured our ship. We captured your ship.

WARD (on camera): Do you think the people here in Iran, they want to see a war with the United States?

REZA BANDER: You know, the people of Iran believe in their leaders. Our leader Ayatollah Khamenei has said we don't like war, but we are ready for


WARD: Do you have a message for President Trump?

REZA BANDER: Mr. Donald Trump, you are -- you know, you are an unpredictable person. You are a liar. You have lied more than 2,000 lies

during your short time of presidency, so you are dangerous. Of course you are dangerous, and we don't believe -- and we don't trust in you.

WARD (on camera): But even in the bizarre of cosmopolitan Tehran, opposition to Iran's leaders is much more common. 46-year-old Nasar tells

us people feel betrayed by the West following the collapse of the nuclear deal.

NASAR, IRANIAN CITIZEN: But they didn't do what they signed but everything we signed, we did that, we don't have any problem with that.

WARD: So do you feel it's unfair?

NASAR Yes, exactly, it's unfair for Iran.


WARD: And you know, Becky it's important to underscore I think for our viewers that people in Iran have been accustomed to sanctions after decades

and decades. And while there was this sort of brief period under the JCPOA where there was a flourishing of the economy where things started it look

up for people, they know how to survive under sanctions.

This is not a country where people are starving to death. At the same time, there is a lot of frustration. There is definitely bitterness about

all of the Iran's vast untapped potential going to waste. And there is, as you heard in those statements from those people we were speaking to, a real

sense of betrayal as well and a sense that they can't trust the West again.

You know, we've heard President Trump talking about let's renegotiate. Let's have another deal. Iran wants to talk. Well everybody we've spoken

to here -- and grant it this is not everybody in the country. But those we have spoken to here say there's no way there can be more negotiations, and

there's no way we can have another deal because how could we ever be able to trust the U.S. again to uphold its end of the bargain -- Becky.

ANDERSON: We heard one gentleman in your report with some pretty choice words for the U.S. President. I wonder as you've traveled now around the

country, has concern, at least about the specter of war, an outright conflict with the U.S., now receded amongst those that you have spoken to?

WARD: It's interesting, most of the people who we have spoken to do not believe that there will be a war between Iran and the U.S. And when we

probe them on that where they have that sense of confidence from, you know, it's not just a sense of national pride. It's actually deeper than that.

They say, listen, you know as well as we do that if there is a war between Iran and the U.S., it will not be contained to those two countries. Iran

has a presence in many other countries in the Middle East where the U.S. also has a presence, and that's what Iran sees as being its leverage in

terms of, you know, decreasing the incentive for the U.S. to get involved with some kind of militarized conflict. Because Iran believes very firmly,

that it can hit American citizens where it hurts on the ground in other countries in the U.S.

[11:10:04] And so most people here do not believe that the U.S. would be foolish enough -- in their words -- to try to take on Iran in a militarized

conflict. Now, at the same time, Becky, of course when you're walking this tight rope, when the tensions have been this ratcheted up, when the

rhetoric is this high and charged, there is always the risk that one small incident can quickly precipitate things devolving into conflict -- Becky.

ANDERSON: Yes, we hear that line reflected around the region. It has to be said. You're in Bandar Abbas tonight with extremely rare access of what

is a sort of flash point as it were just off that coastline of where this Iranian spat with not just the U.S., it's people around the region and

indeed with the West is really focused for the time being, thank you.

When it comes to the climate crisis, there are three letters that matter right now O, M, G. That is the Oceans Melting Greenland Project at NASA.

Who are right now monitoring what's said to be Greenland's biggest ice melt ever recorded. Now, the ice sheet there has been steady melting away for

years, but scientists say it is getting worse and faster than we thought. And that, folks, is very bad news for everyone, you, me, everyone.

Researchers say if the melt continues, rising sea levels will put some of the world's major cities like, for example, Tokyo, New York, at risk. CNN

international correspondent Fred Pleitgen just got a firsthand look at the ice melt in Greenland. You flew with NASA scientists over one of the

world's largest glaciers. How dire is the situation?

PLEITGEN: It's extremely dire. And it was interesting because we also spoke to some local folks there in Greenland. And we asked them, and we

went out with them, how much have the glaciers receded in your lifetime in the past maybe 10, 20, 30 years, and they said it's considerable. It was

not only hundreds of meters and sometimes kilometers that the glaciers had receded but also, they'd gotten a lot thinner. So they've gotten a lot

lower. Which means in general the amount of ice is simply a lot less.

And one of the things that the folks from the Ocean's Melting Greenland Project told us, they said look a lot of people when they think about ice

melt that's induced by climate change, by a hotter climate on our earth. They think it's almost like a blow-dryer that's basically putting hot air

on a giant ice cube. Obviously, that being the arctic. But they say don't underestimate the effects that hotter ocean water is having as well. But

also leading to that attrition that makes these glaciers lose ice a lot quicker. Here's what we saw.


PLEITGEN (voice-over): Take-off from a tiny airfield in South Greenland. NASA embarking on its mission to map how warmer ocean water is melting

Arctic ice.

Chief scientist Josh Willis shows me the probes they're launching all around Greenland. It's like dropping thermometers into the sea.

JOSH WILLIS, OCEANS MELTING GREENLAND LEAD SCIENTIST, NASA: They got out of the plane right through this tube right here. They fall down to the

ocean and then they separate into two parts. The part falls all the way down to the seafloor, so it gives us a profile for the surface to the

bottom on the shelf.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): We've reached today's drop zone -- the massive Helheim Glacier. What you're seeing from our cockpit camera is not even

the glacier itself, it's just the ice it has lost in the past days, and this goes on for miles.

PLEITGEN (on camera): It is absolutely awe-inspiring to see the size of this glacier -- to see how much ice is coming off that glacier that's

obviously then going to flow into the world's oceans. It is one of the largest glaciers in Greenland. The amount of activity is just absolutely


(voice-over): But the scientists spot an ice-free zone right at the mouth of the glacier. It's pretty unusual. With great precision, they have to

drop a probe right in that pond.

WILLIS: Five, four, three, two, one -- drop, drop, drop. Fourteen away. I can see water.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): Bullseye.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It goes in the drink -- perfect.

PLEITGEN: I saw it -- yes, yes. Oh, wow.

WILLIS: I see it.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): But the readouts they get are troubling. Warm water along the entire depth of the glacier more than 2,000 feet below the


DR. IAN FENTY, OCEANS MELTING GREENLAND SCIENTIST, NASA: And these warm waters now are able to be in direct contact with the ice over its entire

face, supercharging the melting.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): And it's not just this glacier. The ice melt has been supercharged in all of Greenland recently.

[11:15:00] (on camera): This year is on pace to set a record for ice melts here in the Arctic and the NASA scientists are finding out that it's not

just hotter air but also warmer ocean water that's causing a lot of the attrition that's making these glaciers lose so much ice.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): And while it may look majestic, the ice melt is also dangerous. These billions of tons of ice are causing sea levels to

rise. The scientists from NASA's Oceans Melting Greenland Project saying all of us need to pitch in to try and slow down global warming or face the


WILLIS: There's enough ice in Greenland to raise sea levels by seven and a half meters. So it's an enormous volume of ice -- that's about 25 feet --

and that would be devastating to coastlines all around the planet.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): The changes to our planet's environment can already clearly be seen here in Greenland, a remote Arctic paradise whose warming

climate will affect us all.


PLEITGEN: That was quite a humbling experience being out there, and I asked the NASA scientists, you know, what can we do to maybe slow all this

down. They said the only thing you can do is try to cut emissions. But they also say that if things are going to go the way they're going right

now -- we had that graphic up before we had our report on -- some of these cities are really going to be in jeopardy, and people should really think

about moving away from coastal areas because that could happen very soon.

ANDERSON: Some of that footage was absolutely incredible. I know you work with an extremely good team here at CNN --

PLEITGEN: Yes, I have to say --

ANDERSON: -- on a regular basis. I mean, they really have shot some terrific stuff to support your reporting there, and I know our viewers can

find more of that on digital at I can't think of a better report that really lays it out and lays out what it is that we are facing.

And as we -- as we continue with our series on climate crisis this week and don't expect us to be on this story one hopes for more than a decade.

Because one hope what will help prevent what we see as the challenges ahead. Fred, thank you.

But yes, climate crisis extremely important. And while a warming climate melts our glaciers, it also ravages our forests with wildfires. But

Portugal may have found a solution. Have a look at this. Its government is trading in high-tech tools for goats. The "New York Times" says they

are being used to eat the part of the grass that fuels the fires. That is one way to do it, folks.

Up next, an exclusive sit-down interview for you.


SALAH: My position is still the same. As I told you, the people misunderstand what I'm saying.


ANDERSON: Football superstar Mo Salah explains why he thinks he is misunderstood.

And from a leader of Sudan to accused criminal on trial, what investigators say ex-President Omar al Bashir told them about who gave him money.

And later British opposition leader Jeremy Corbyn says his party will do all it can to stop a no-deal Brexit. How he is trying to stop the new

British Prime Minister in his tracks. All that coming up after this.


ANDERSON: Well that was the UEFA Super Cup earlier this month, and the man at the center of the celebrations Mo Salah. Another trophy for Liverpool

and its superstar Egyptian striker. It has been quite a year for one of football's biggest stars.

He closed out last season as one of the Premier League's top scorers and went on to win the Champion's League with his teammates at Liverpool.

Disappointment though for Salah during the summer as Egypt flamed out at the African Cup of Nations and social media controversy about sexual

harassment overshadowed the team's efforts. Well Mo talked about all of that and more sitting down with me for what was a very rare and exclusive



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The goalkeeper out of his penalty area! He's just slaughtered it! Liverpool are running right, and this is Salah.

SALAH: Mohamed Salah, take one.

ANDERSON: I want to take you back to that Champion's League glory, and you lifting that trophy. How was it?

SALAH: Obviously, it was great, you know. It's a dream for everyone, city, the player to win a Champion's League, so something great is

something very great.

ANDERSON: June 2019, and triumph for Mo Salah and his Liverpool teammates as they're crowned champions of Europe. For Salah, club glory was followed

by a disappointing turn of events with the Egyptian National Team at this year's Africa Cup of Nations. Just months before the tournament started

Egypt stepped in to host, but the home turf advantage didn't help the pharaohs who flopped out in the knockout stages.

SALAH: We had been performing at the top level, honestly, So I'm not just talking -- I'm not talking about the player and hiding myself, but as a

team within the didn't perform good, but there was a lot of pressure. The players on the team they were not as happy about a lot of things.

ANDERSON: How do you think that Egypt comes back from that experience? Does there need to be wholesale reform do you think in the Egyptian

footballing association? I mean, you've had a number of run-ins with the association.

SALAH: I have a lot (INAUDIBLE). I think it was just need to be honest with our self. Sometimes the nationalist team -- it's the difference --

the competition was me. You know, my position is a little different than the players. So not because I'm a star but because also it makes me

uncomfortable. For example, African Nation, we weren't in the hotel and the people comes to the hotel very easy. The see (INAUDIBLE) very easy,

which is not normal. We had one day off and I couldn't go down from the room until 9:30. When I tried to go down, there was like 200 person like

that with me. And they say why are you complaining? I complain because I'm a human being. I want to be with the players.

ANDERSON: Have you ever considered retiring from the national squad?

SALAH: It's so difficult, you know. I love this country from my heart. It's always in my mind. When I left Egypt when I was 19 years old, it was

always in my mind something pushed me forward to perform good. To be iconic for the kids. To be like dream for the kids to be one day like me.

It was in my mind. I want to be that person, so just to retire from the national team is something huge for me inside.

ANDERSON (voice-over): The lackluster performance on the pitch was overshadowed by controversy off it. Earlier in the tournament, Egyptian

forward, Amr Warda, was kicked off the team by Egypt's football association after allegations of sexual harassment surfaced online. But the 25-year-

old was reinstated after key players including Salah seemed to offer him support on social media.

[11:25:02] (on camera): Let's talk about the controversy over Amr Warda in the summer. Did your intervention help him get reinstated in the squad

after he was initially suspended over allegations of sexual harassment?

SALAH: Certainly not. Because I'm not the national team captain. I'm not the team manager. I'm not the coach. Believe me if I'm powerful, I could

have changed a lot of things there. But I'm a player but I just (INAUDIBLE).

ANDERSON: Can we have a look at the tweet and remind our viewers what you said.

Women must be treated with the utmost respect. No, you said, means no. Those things are and must remain sacred. You went on, though to say, I

also believe that many who make mistakes can change for the better and shouldn't be sent straight to the guillotine, which is the easiest way out.

We need to believe in second chances. We need to guide and educate. Shunning is not the answer.

Let's remind ourselves, this wasn't the first time that Amr Warda had been accused of sexual harassment. What do you say to people who criticize that

tweet you put out and say you're endorsing his behavior?

SALAH: What I meant to say is that happened before and it's happening now, so --

ANDERSON: Sexual harassment.

SALAH: Yes. He's someone -- he has to get the treatment or have rehabilitation. So that's just to make sure that it's not going to happen


ANDERSON: So let me be quite clear, Amr Warda and others who are guilty of sexual harassment, you use the term need rehabilitating.

SALAH: Yes, what I mean is not someone in particular but in general. Yes, they need rehabilitation and treatment for that. So you just make sure

that it's not going to happen again.

ANDERSON: You were accused of hypocrisy, when you were voted one of "Time's" 100 most influential. You talked about the need to change

attitudes towards women in the Middle East, and then the tweet. So just explain what your position is to me, if you will?

SALAH: No, my position is still the same. As I told you, there's -- the people misunderstand what I'm saying, but in the meantime, what I'm talking

about the woman has to get her right in the Middle East.

ANDERSON: You are arguably one of, if not the most famous, Arab in the world today. How do you use this platform to promote change?

SALAH: First of all, we have to accept that there is a problem, and I know it's very difficult to accept that. But 100 percent the problem's running

deep and deep and deep. So the second thing, my opinion is the woman, she has a right to talk about anything she doesn't like. I'm talking about


I want when my daughter has a problem, she has to feel like support from me to come to talk to me about her problem. The most important thing is the

fear, the wife fear from her husband, from her father. Which is that the main point, I think. So the fear is not healthy for anyone so we have to

fix that.

ANDERSON: Mohamed, Personally, have you changed your attitudes towards women as you have grown, developed, moved away from Egypt, become

successful in Europe?

SALAH: I think, yes, I've changed a lot. Changing from the person which I'm talking about it like the family scare from him or the wife or the

daughter, whatever, to the person who is talking now. Like he's fighting against a subject because he sees that he's wrong. Yes, of course before I

even had my daughter because I was, I was a lot less start to change. Like nine years ago or ten years ago, but to that person now is fighting against

the subject because I can say it's very wrong.


ANDERSON: Mohamed Salah there speaking to me about a number of issues, perhaps most importantly setting the record straight about his views on

women's rights in the Middle East.

Now as somebody who normally lives in the Middle East, I'm very familiar with the host of issues facing women across the Arab world. Be it

harassment, inequality or lack of opportunity, those challenges, of course, aren't limited to that region, and more needs to be done everywhere as we

fight for change. It was good to see one of the most famous Arabs right now come out and clarify his position and lend his voice and platform to


[11:30:03] The second part of what is my exclusive chat with Mo Salah tomorrow. If you can't wait that long, do head to where we take a

look at his relationship with the Egyptian National Football Association.

Still to come, it's a big week for Britain's Prime Minister after a very rough weekend, and it only seems to be getting worse. Everything that's

going on just ahead.


ANDERSON: The clock is ticking, 73 days until Brexit. Will we ever get there? Opposition leader Jeremy Corbyn is calling on lawmakers to support

a no-confidence motion against Boris Johnson. Calling a no-deal exit from the EU more a Trump deal Brexit. But Mr. Johnson maintains that the U.K.

will divorce the EU with or without a deal in place. Meantime, Monday the European Commission spokesperson said that scenario would be a loss for the

U.K. Have a listen.


NATASHA BERTAUD, EUROPEAN COMMISSION DEPUTY CHIEF SPOKESWOMAN: President Juncker himself said in an interview a few weeks ago on the 10th of August

that if it comes to a hard Brexit -- and this is in no one's interest -- it is the British that will unfortunately be the big losers. This is the



Well if this feels like a deja vu, folks, you're feeling it. And I feel your pain. Our Nina dos Santos joins me now from Downing Street. Look,

we're 75 odd days away from what is this deadline on October the 31st. Just break down exactly what is going on as we speak.

NINA DOS SANTOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, what's going on at the moment is that Westminster, the Parliament is not actually sitting. MPs are enjoying

their summer recess. But there's more than 100 MPs from different political parties, including some rebels from the Conservative Party that

occupies 10 Downing Street with Boris Johnson. Would actually like to come back to Westminster to try and hammer out where to go ahead of that October

31st deadline.

In the meantime, the Prime Minister Boris Johnson has got a really big week planned. He's going to be heading across the channel to meet with Angela

Merkel of Germany and the other powerbroker of Europe, Emmanuel Macron in France later on this week before the big G-7 summit. And he is determined

to say to other MPs across this country that the best chance the U.K. stands of getting a deal with the EU before October the 31st is if they

play hardball.

[11:35:05] He was reiterating that statement just earlier today in a trip across the country in Cornwall -- Becky.


BORIS JOHNSON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: I'm afraid very much up to our friends and I hope that they will compromise, that they have seen that the

U.K. Parliament is three times rejected the withdrawal agreement, the backstop. It just doesn't work. It's not democratic. I hope that they

will see fit to compromise, but in the meantime, we get ready to come out on October the 31st.


DOS SANTOS: And Becky, there have been all sorts of strategic leaks over the last couple of days, trying to reiterate the difficulty of this

position and the fact that number 10 Downing Street under Boris Johnson's tenure means business here. It's been confirmed that freedom of movement

according to this current government would end on October the 31st. That last deadline if the U.K. crashes out of its membership without a deal.

And over the course of the weekend, obviously, there was this big leak of documents suggesting that the U.K. could face shortages of medicines, food,

fuel, and even that the Irish border -- that hard border that everybody's trying to avoid -- could be a fait accompli. It could be just too

difficult to get over that if we were to see a no-deal Brexit. So Boris Johnson over the week is going to go armed with these types of arguments

for his first set to with those European leaders after taking office just under a month ago -- Becky.

ANDERSON: That's right. You've done well to compete with whatever that noise is behind you, thank you for that. Good explanation. Nina sorting

it out for us while Europe scrambles to sort itself out before Brexit.

People are still desperate to get to the continent. Take a look at these pictures. Migrants taking extreme and dangerous measures, several

attempting to swim ashore from a rescue ship on Sunday after being stranded for weeks. The ship carrying more than 100 migrants and submitted an

urgent request to dock on the Italian island of Lampedusa. Italy thus far has refused to let that happen but Spain's Prime Minister said Sunday that

his country will accept that ship.

Live from London, you're watching CONNECT THE WORLD. Coming up, stunning images as we see Sudan's ousted leader in court and on trial. The shocking

details we are now learning from investigators about his alleged corruption. That story is after this.


ANDERSON: Let's get to something many in Sudan thought they would never see. Images of their former iron fisted President Omar al Bashir sitting

in a court cage, the defendant's cage dressed in white as he faces major corruption-related charges. And while Bashir sat there for the first

hearing of his trial, we learned a fascinating detail.

A state investigator told the court the ex-President received $25 million from the Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman to spend on, quote,

donations and gifts for the poor.

[11:40:00] CNN senior international correspondent, Nima Elbagir, joins me now. She has reported extensively on Sudan. I just want to bring that

image up again. Because you better than most will be able to describe what that image will mean to the people of Sudan. Many of whom I'm guessing

would never have expected to have seen the ex-president in a defendant's cage.

NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It's hair raising for people to see him with his beard undyed. He was famous for his over

dyed hair and over dyed beard, to see that in that moment of dishevelment. And then also to hear the details of the fact that his wife, his favorite

wife who is considered by many to be Sudan's Marie Antoinette. Who was flaunting wealth and gold bracelets has been to visit him in jail with her

younger children. This really is unexpected.

That moment where he was told state your name, and he had to say Omar Hassan al Bashir, like any other defendant. State your profession. The

former leader of Sudan just for many Sudanese it's still difficult to process.

ANDERSON: What are we learning about the investigation?

ELBAGIR: Well we have now spoken to the head of Bashir's legal team, and he is justifying to us how several million dollars in cash was found in

former grain sacks in the Presidential palace. He says that it would have been unthinkable. It would have been difficult for the relationship

between Sudan and Saudi Arabia for Bashir to refuse the money that they are insisting came directly from Mohammed bin Salman, the Crown Prince of Saudi

Arabia. And he said they have proof and they will be showing this proof in court. They have proof that the Crown Prince of Saudi Arabia they say

directly gave this money to Omar al Bashir.

ANDERSON: The timing of this court appearance, of course, just after the news that we received yesterday that we now can expect effectively a

government of unity. Just place this then, this imaging context, if you will.

ELBAGIR: It brings it home to people. Nine months after those first demonstrations to see Omar al Bashir in that court. But of course, we have

to say he was in court heavily guarded. The streets surrounding the court were sealed off, which speaks to the security concerns and the fact that

there are still elements within the former regime out there. And they have, we understand, attempted to break him out already once. So while it

is an extraordinarily iconic moment, it really should not be overstated with regards to how vulnerable this new government still is.

ANDERSON: Nima, thank you. I'm Becky Anderson, that was CONNECT THE WORLD. Thank you for watching wherever you are in the world.

[11:45:00] (WORLD SPORT)