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NEW DAY SUNDAY

Sen. Bernie Sanders (D-VT) Returns To Vermont After Heart Attack; "Washington Post" Biden Op-Ed: Trump Won't Destroy My Family; Sen. Bernie Sanders (D-VT), Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-MA) Lead Democrats In Third Quarter Fundraising; At Least 100 Killed In Protests Sweeping Over Iraq; Buck Bursts Into Beauty Salon, Scaring Everyone; Trump Makes Baseless Claims About "Deep State" Whistleblower; President Trump Unloads Barrage Of Tweets Attacking Mitt Romney; Four Dead After Suspect Shoots up Kansas City Bar; U.K. Urges The Return Of U.S. Diplomat's Wife Who Left After Fatal Crash; "Saturday Night Live" Mocks Vice President Pence Over Impeachment Fears. Aired 6-7a ET

Aired October 6, 2019 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[06:00:14]

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Trump, on Twitter saying the first whistleblower has been discredited so a second whistleblower has been brought in. Keep them coming, he said.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He wrote on Twitter, "Mitt Romney never knew how to win. He is a pompous ass who has been fighting me from the beginning."

IVANKA TRUMP, DAUGHTER OF DONALD TRUMP: I think my father has definitely grown used to this. He is probably experienced more incoming than any person in the history of the world.

SEN. KAMALA HARRIS (D-CA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Based on what I know, it looks like there is probably be enough evidence to vote for impeachment.

AIDY BRYANT AS WILLIAM BARR: You worry too much, Mike. Presidents get impeached every 30 or 40 years. Now, come on. Relax. Have another glass of milk.

BECK BENNETT AS MIKE PENCE: Well, it's 5:00 somewhere.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHRISTI PAUL, CNN ANCHOR: Good Sunday morning. It's good to have you here. I'm Christi Paul.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Boris Sanchez in for Victor Blackwell. We hope you've had a great weekend and that you're not starting fights with people on Twitter.

(LAUGHTER)

PAUL: Well, because that's what we are talking about right now.

SANCHEZ: Right.

PAUL: Another weekend tweet storm it seems from President Trump. I mean, over the past 24 hours he has lashed out at Democrats for their impeachment inquiry, at the media. The latest target of his attacks though a senator from his own party.

SANCHEZ: Yes. In a series of tweets, the president took specific aim at Mitt Romney even calling for him to be impeached after the Utah senator rebuked him for calling on Ukraine and China to investigate the Bidens. We should point out senators can actually be impeached.

In a crude attack the president called Romney a -- quote -- "pompous ass." The president also seemed upset by "The New York Times'" report of a possible second whistleblower. He slammed the unnamed person for having second hand information and taunted Democrats to keep them coming.

PAUL: Another Republican senator, by the way, is criticizing the president. Senator Susan Collins told the Maine newspaper the president's request to China was -- quote -- "completely inappropriate."

Now, we have a couple of lines here from her because she is, as we know, being a Republican senator, it's going to be very interesting to see what comes out of that. If there's any sort of repercussion --

SANCHEZ: She is the third Republican senator now to come out against the president for his actions on that phone call with the Ukrainian leader --

PAUL: But the president has not said anything --

SANCHEZ: About her.

PAUL: -- about her.

SANCHEZ: Right.

PAUL: Which is notable. So, when it comes to the president's Twitter tirade, we want to go to CNN's Kristen Holmes in Washington.

So, I'm wondering, Kristen, if we -- if there is any expectation that the president will address what Senator Collins said?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Christi and Boris.

Well, we don't know right now because, of course, he is unpredictable. But yesterday what we saw was President Trump's one-man war room. He is clearly upset about this investigation going over anyone attacking anyone who stands up against him. And I want to start with that second whistleblower. It is no surprise that he is attacking him trying to discredit him even though the second whistleblower hasn't even come forward yet but he spent the last two weeks doing the same to the first whistleblower.

So, let's pull up that tweet first. It says, the first so-called second hand information whistleblower got my phone conversation almost completely wrong and now word is they are going to the bench and another whistleblower is coming in from the deep state, also with second hand info. Meet with Shifty. Keep them coming.

A lot to unpack here. Of course, Shifty there means Adam Schiff. But it's very interesting. He is essentially daring this whistleblower to come forward and he's also already discrediting this person that he knows nothing about.

To note here, we have learned that the second whistleblower, if they should choose to come forward does have more firsthand knowledge. But this whole idea that somehow he's coming in from the deep state is something President Trump is already trying to set the narrative on. And, of course, as you mentioned, it is not just the whistleblower also Senator Mitt Romney. Really vicious personal attacks and I'm going to read one of the many tweets that he sent out yesterday. It's the one you mentioned, Boris.

It said, Mitt Romney never knew how to win. He is a pompous ass who has been fighting me from beginning, except when he begged me for my endorsement for his Senate run, I gave it to him. And when he begged me to be secretary of state I didn't give it to him. He is so bad for R's -- clearly meaning Republicans there.

And I want to make one thing very clear here. President Trump is sending a message. He does not care what the strategy is that Republicans are going to put forward when this impeachment inquiry continues.

He is setting his own tone. He is telling any Republican, anyone who speaks out against him he is not going to just lash out at you, he is going to try and discredit you. He is going to try and humiliate you, talk about your past and really attack you.

[06:05:04]

He does not want anyone speaking out against him but as you mentioned that is not stopping everyone. Republican senator Susan Collins who is back home in Maine during this recess has spoke to the "Bangor Daily News" and this is what she had to say.

She said, I thought the President made a big mistake by asking China to get involved in investigating a political opponent. It is completely inappropriate.

But, Christi and Boris, no word yet from the president on Susan Collins. We have no idea if he has even seen these reports yet. And he has not yet tweeted today. So we will, obviously, be on the lookout for that and keep you posted. SANCHEZ: We will be refreshing our phones. Kristen Holmes, thank you so much for that.

Let's discuss further with CNN political analyst and congressional reporter for "The Washington Post," Karoun Demirjian. Good morning to you, Karoun. Thank so much for getting up early for us.

The president basically spent the day trashing Mitt Romney on Twitter. So, we were having this discussion before we went on air. How much of this is personal and how much of this is President Trump basically making an example of Mitt Romney warning other Republicans to not criticize him?

KAROUN DEMIRJIAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: I think that much of it is -- has to do with -- (INAUDIBLE) personal there but Mitt Romney is a really great person for him to pick on as well because of his stature in the party, because he is the previous standard bearer of the Republican nomination, though he was never president, and also because he has made a point that he is not really coward by President Trump. It's not that he owes President Trump really anything in this position and he is a potential danger to Trump if he can bring other people along.

Now, what has been happening thus far is that Mitt Romney's criticism of Trump has been escalating but he hasn't been really drawing tons and tons more Republicans with him and they are in this kind of standoff where if Trump can squelch that early he reduces the chances of other people joining suit and, of course, that's the threat. It seems almost inevitable that the House will impeach the president. The question thus being, will the Senate convict him?

You cannot do that without a significant number of Republican votes. Right now there is very little incentive for those Republicans who turn against Trump because of the political climate. And if that changes, that could be very dangerous for the president.

PAUL: OK. So, let me ask you about the second whistleblower because the president took aim at the second one whom we do not know who it is obviously.

SANCHEZ: Right.

PAUL: Hence calling them whistleblower. But he is saying they are coming from the deep state with second-hand information. How would the president know that? We are not behind closed doors but it seems like there is a lot of questions about who this is and what they know already.

DEMIRJIAN: Right. I mean, there are questions right now any way about how much the White House is getting to know about the identities of these whistleblowers and whether that is actually a danger, because as much as there are laws against outing whistleblowers, the president can kind of do what he wants in this environment and the main recourse for that is impeachment proceedings which were kind of already in. And so there is a question about whether Trump is going to try to retaliate against people that criticize him from within. And that is a real concern.

But then other -- the question is -- the other question is is Trump just kind of getting out ahead of this and trying to discredit whoever comes forward before they come forward by painting them in the worst possible light? The president is not necessarily known for always sticking to the exact facts of what's going on. "The New York Times" report on the second potential whistleblower did say that they are closer to the investigation than the one who came forward who of course the president allies have criticized for only having second- hand information.

If this next person has firsthand information then it behooves the president potentially to have colored the water enough before this person comes out that people who are inclined to support the president or be skeptical of those people who criticize him already think of them in a sort of disparaging dismissive way whether or not that is warranted when this person and if this person ever actually does surface with their claims against the president too.

SANCHEZ: Yes. And the president perhaps not surprising also mischaracterizing the depth of information that this whistleblower has reportedly by "The New York Times."

We have to ask you about this. Former Vice President Joe Biden speaking out directly and extensively about the Ukraine's scandal. He says Trump is wholly unfit to be president. He is vowing to stay in the race.

Take a look at this portion of an op-ed in "The Washington Post" written by Biden. He writes --quote -- "To Trump and those who facilitate his abuses of power, and all the special interests funding his attacks against me: Please know that I'm not going anywhere. You won't destroy me, and you won't destroy my family. And come November 2020, I intend to beat you like a drum."

Karoun, this is a bit of a new strategy for Joe Biden, getting aggressive in ways we haven't seen him do so before.

DEMIRJIAN: Yes. Well, in a way he needed to do that. I mean, it has about two weeks now since we started learning the details. I mean, not (ph) quite (ph). Time moves quickly in D.C. these days but it's been about that much time since we started learning the details of what was going on with this whistleblower complaint and since the president has become more forceful about directly tying the Bidens to his reasons for why he asked Ukraine to look into the -- to conduct these investigations.

[06:10:11]

That certainly has put a lot of the focus and the criticism on the president but there is no way that Biden emerges from that unscathed because there are people who do support the president and do question whether there was some sort of corrupt activity going on with the Biden family even though the investigations that the Ukrainians did were on this energy company for which Hunter Biden worked not on the Bidens themselves. However, we are in an environment where you can't just throw something out there and see what's going to stick to only one person and yet Biden has spent much of the last week -- has been escalating in Washington watching a speech that he made addressing these issues in Nevada did not really land that much because of the timing of all of how this is moving and so much of the focus being on how the president speaks openly about these things and thus advances the reporting and narrative within the hours for things that normally would take weeks to progress.

So, Biden has to date taken kind of, you know, try to be above it all approach to the way he has been campaigning but that doesn't work here when the story has become really about him as much as it is about the president. And so he has had to take a counterpunch. It seems like he is starting to but he has to be able to continue this not just in op-eds but in debates and other environments where he is going to be really having to think on his feet and make the same sort of counterarguments.

PAUL: Sure. Yes, that consistency. I understand. Karoun Demirjian, we appreciate it so much for being here. Thank you.

DEMIRJIAN: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: We should tell you we are following some breaking news this hour.

A fatal shooting, according to Kansas City police, four people are dead, a total of nine people shot.

PAUL: We know that a gunman started firing at a bar in the early hours of the morning. Police are still look for that suspect, though. They describe him as a Hispanic male. That's all they have. Our affiliate KSHB spoke with police a short time ago.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

OFFICER THOMAS TOMASIC, KANSAS CITY POLICE: Nine people shot, four confirmed deceased here. We got the call about 1:27, I believe when the call came in of a shooting 10th and Central area. Showed up.

There are four people inside of the bar that are deceased and there are five others that were transported to area hospitals. Last I've heard, I believe they are all in stable condition. But that is kind of -- that is kind of what we are working with right now.

Detectives are here. They are trying to look at any surveillance. We are waiting on the search warrant before we even go inside the bar. So I don't have I.D.s or anything yet on any of the victims.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. As far as the suspect goes, do you have anybody in custody?

TOMASIC: No. Nobody in custody. We do not have a good enough description yet to put anything out for suspect or suspects. We don't know how many. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So do you know what kind of weapon or anything that was used or is it too early?

TOMASIC: Too early. Yes, again, the guys were in there initially when they first got here, the officers. But as soon as -- as soon as they cleared the bar, we exited until we can get a search warrant and go back in there.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So, I don't know what else. Because you just told me all of the information.

TOMASIC: Yes. There is really -- it's, obviously, been going on for a while but this is definitely one of those that we are going to do everything very slowly and very methodically and correctly so this will take a little while.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. That's all I have. Thank you for your time.

TOMASIC: You're welcome.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PAUL: Again, four people dead. Five hurt in that shooting in a bar there overnight. We're going to obviously continue to watch that as the investigation is happening right now. And we will let you know what happens as we learn it.

SANCHEZ: Yes. Still ahead, Bernie Sanders is back home and recovering after a heart attack. But will the recent news about his health shake up the 2020 race? Our group of political commentators will weigh in.

PAUL: And the U.K. is urging the wife of an American diplomat who left the country, despite being a suspect in a fatal traffic collision, to return and face police questioning.

SANCHEZ: And video of an explosion that rocked an Oktoberfest celebration in Huntington Beach, California. Several people injured including two firefighters. More on that after a quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:17:59]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh my (EXPLETIVE DELETED).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't know. It just --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL: OK. Imagine there. That was an explosion. Look at that thing.

This is at a Huntington Beach restaurant. Two firefighters and two others are injured. This happened during an Oktoberfest celebration. Officials say firefighters were initially responding to an electrical fire.

SANCHEZ: Yes. They say two blasts occurred when they attempted to open this underground electrical vault. The fire battalion chief said that all four injuries are classified as minors, fortunately. Investigators and the Southern California Edison Power Company are now investigating the cause.

Police in the U.K. say the wife of a U.S. diplomat is being treated as a suspect after she was involved in a deadly car accident that killed a 19-year-old. She raised eyebrows when she left the U.K. after the accident. Officials there are now urging the U.S. to have her return to England.

PAUL: CNN's Anna Stewart is following the latest from London -- Anna.

ANNA STEWART, CNN REPORTER: Good morning. Yes. This morning we've heard from a spokesperson actually from this grieving family they say they will meeting with the British Foreign Secretary later this week Dominic Raab. Now he has already released a statement saying he has spoken to the American ambassador to the U.K. about the case and he is disappointed and publicly this is where we are at.

The government just saying they are disappointed by the situation. There is not much they can do with regards diplomat immunity. That is a question for the American government and, of course, the question that CNN has put to the State Department whether or not diplomatic immunity will be waived. So, the suspect, a woman who is 42 years old and married to a diplomat can be returned to the U.K. and face justice here.

This is the statement we received from the State Department. "Any questions regarding a waiver of immunity with regard to out diplomats and their family members overseas in a case like this receive intense attention at senior levels and are considered carefully given the global impact such decisions carry; immunity is rarely waived."

Rarely waived? Not. It can be waived. It's not saying that it won't be waived in a situation.

[06:20:01]

And given how much political pressure is mounting here is getting coverage not just in the U.K. but in the U.S. so we will see what the White House says cover all the latest developments.

SANCHEZ: All right. Anna Stewart, thank you so much for that.

PAUL: Well, still to come, a man who was a key witness in the murder trial of former Dallas police officer Amber Guyger was just shot and killed. We have more details on what happened.

SANCHEZ: Plus, SNL is taking jabs at the Trump administration's latest troubles.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BENNETT: Did you see those text messages they uncovered?

KATE MCKINNON AS RUDY GIULIANI: They totally exonerate us.

BENNETT: Really? What do they say?

BRYANT: Well, this one says, I think we should stop texting about the crimes and maybe tell the crimes over the phone so that the crimes don't leave little crime footprints.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BENNETT: As you know this impeachment farce is growing worse by the day and now a second whistleblower is coming forward.

MCKINNON: Right. It's all happening during my busy season, Halloween.

BRYANT: Where is the president, Mike?

BENNETT: He has more important things to deal with. He's meeting with an alligator breeder about filling the moat at the border.

MCKINNON: Oh, no. You should have told me. I know a couple of gators from when I lived in the Central Park Zoo.

BENNETT: Really? We need to get ahead of this story before it spirals out of control.

[06:25:02]

Did you see those text messages they uncovered?

MCKINNON: They totally exonerate us.

BENNETT: Really? What do they say?

BRYANT: Well, this one says, I think we should stop texting about the crimes and maybe tell the crimes over the phone so that the crimes don't leave little crime footprints.

See? It's all taken care of.

BENNETT: I can't believe I have to deal with this. I'm supposed to be seeing the new Judy Garland movie with mother!

BRYANT: You worry too much, Mike. Presidents get impeached every 30 or 40 years. Now, come on. Relax. Have another glass of milk.

BENNETT: Well, it's 5:00 somewhere.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Some of the highlights from SNL last night. Noticeably missing was President Trump. They mostly focused on Vice President Mike Pence.

PAUL: They're good.

SANCHEZ: Some of the chaos that has embroiled the White House in the last few days.

PAUL: Well, President Trump makes his own news, of course. So, we have -- we have a lot to talk about with him. But we also have to talk about Democratic presidential candidate Bernie Sanders because he is home this morning in Vermont. As we learned yesterday, he had a heart attack.

SANCHEZ: Yes. He experienced chest pain at a campaign event on Tuesday and the 78-year-old was taken to a hospital in Las Vegas. His doctor said they placed two stents in a blocked artery. All other arteries apparently are normal.

The senator's campaign has not said when he's going to return to the campaign trail but they have said he will be at next Democratic presidential debate on October 15. That is just nine days away.

PAUL: There is just so much to talk about and we have so many people to do it with today. White House correspondent, American Urban Radio and CNN political analyst April Ryan with us, as well as CNN Political Commentators, former South Carolina State Representative, Bakari Sellers, Angela Rye, former executive director Congressional Black Caucus, and former Mayor of Tallahassee, Florida Andrew Gillum.

Thank you all so much.

(CROSSTALK)

APRIL RYAN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good morning.

ANGELA RYE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: -- the squad.

PAUL: Getting up bright and early. Yes, the squad, the squad, the CNN squad. Yes.

First and foremost, Bernie Sanders. Do you think that this health scare -- and he looks great, we should point out. He was on Twitter yesterday talking about how he's going to be at the first debate here -- at this next debate on the 15th with CNN. But how does something like this affect the campaign?

RYAN: It affects the campaign tremendously. And forgive my voice this morning. But it affects the campaign because, one, people are going to wonder -- one, his age, stamina. After this health situation, a heart attack, a blockage is nothing to take lightly.

When you're on the road, you're traveling state-by-state, city-by- city, I mean, sometimes several states in a day. And then what compounds it is his age and that is being viewed through a very large microscope for many with this presidential campaign season, you have President Trump. You have Bernie Sanders. You have Elizabeth Warren. And you have Joe Biden.

PAUL: And when you talk age.

RYAN: Yes.

PAUL: They are all in -- about the same age bracket.

RYAN: Right, right. So it's time to heal. There is a season for everything. It's time to heal, but the question is, can he continue? Because that is a major issue. Can he continue after the debate? And we will see if the stamina is there.

ANDREW GILLUM, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I mean, first of all we should acknowledge Bernie Sanders is probably one of the hardest working candidates we have seen run for president. This is a person who is probably one of the more resilient folks who keeps up a very, very rigorous schedule. And I think we should probably, you know, look back on the example of Bill Clinton where after he had his health scare, had the stents put in, he lost weight, looks great, still moving around. We saw him last night --

RYAN: We saw him last night. Yes.

GILLUM: -- at Tyler Perry's event.

BAKARI SELLERS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: You didn't have to drop that early.

(CROSSTALK)

GILLUM: That is actually a shout-out to Tyler Perry.

(CROSSTALK)

PAUL: That is why her voice what it is.

GILLUM: Exactly.

RYAN: Yes. I was screaming last night. But go ahead. Bill Clinton --

(LAUGHTER)

GILLUM: No. But he set an example of the fact that you could have these health scares, get your life back in order and get immediately back out there. There is a time for healing but I have every bit of confidence that Bernie Sanders is fine.

RYAN: But this was post presidency for Bill Clinton.

GILLUM: Well, sure. Sure. But I want to follow the man's example which has been -- he is probably been out there working extremely hard and moving at a very, very fast pace. He will have to take some time down but it's a long season.

SANCHEZ: Before we pivot to another topic we have to ask because the first time we may see him again is at this debate nine days from now. Do you think it's going to up as a topic of conversation, his health, his age?

RYE: I think absolutely. It's come up several other times and it will probably come up as a debate question. Do you have any concerns? And I think it's an effective tool both of a moderator to get, you know, to see if a candidate will be defensive and it also could come up on the stage.

I think they have been fairly civil. There were a couple moments I remember especially in Detroit that I'm surprised they didn't say --

[06:30:00]

SELLERS: Endorsed Kamala Harris.

RYE: Endorsed -- yes. So, anyway but I -- I would be surprised if he doesn't come up in some way. I've got to sit a Bernie supporter yesterday, and I asked about it, and it's something that is a big deal and it's certainly -- you know, you don't want that kind of thing to happen in the middle campaign.

SANCHEZ: And it could backfire on a candidate too.

SELLERS: Well, I don't anticipate any other candidates, quote, unquote, attacking Bernie Sanders for his issues. But it's going to be a looming issue in the campaign. I mean, the fact is -- I go back to this. My dad is 75 years old and he went to his doctors, and the doctors told him that he was too old to be president of a small HBSCU, all right? And so we're talking about people who are 69, 78, 76, et cetera, running for president of the United States is an issue.

And for Bernie Sanders, I actually -- I've been Bernie Sanders' antagonist for the last, you know, four years he's been running for president. But I can honestly say, as Andrew said, he's been the hardest working candidate we've seen and he also has some of the most strident supporters. I spoke to Nina Turner and just said, my heart and prayers are with you.

It was a really, really hard day not just for Bernie but for his supporters. And I think that those individuals who are not those strident supporters, they're going to say, well, we need somebody who can take on Donald Trump. So if Bernie Sanders, if we are not sure he's strong enough to take on Donald Trump, we do have Elizabeth Warren.

PAUL: Okay, so let me ask you this.

SELLERS: It was a natural segue. You like that?

PAUL: It was. It was perfect. Yes, it was.

However, I need to get to Vice President Biden's op-ed in The Washington Post when you talk about who can take him on. He is saying now, I can take you on. You can come at my family, you can come at me but I'm not going anywhere. Are we seeing a different tactic in Biden, do you think? Are we seeing a shift?

RYAN: Sometimes you wonder if Joe Biden is biting off a little bit more than he can chew. And I say that as someone who knows Joe Biden, who has watched Joe Biden before and now. Those gaffes have cost Joe Biden to lose that double-digit lead that he had and he is so close in so many polls. Elizabeth Warren is beating him out in others. What Joe Biden has to do is pull it together. He's got to be gaffe-free.

Donald Trump is street. Joe Biden is, I'm this guy from Scranton and you know me. But he's going to have -- if he can take one Donald Trump, he's going to have to go toe for toe.

Now, the question is can he do that. There is blood in the water for Joe Biden. I mean, Kamala Harris came after him, Cory Booker, also Julian Castro, and they magnify these flaws that he has.

Now, Donald Trump is going to take it to the stratosphere with magnifying all these flaws. But the question is can he hold it together to be able to go toe-to-toe with Donald Trump. That is a huge question.

PAUL: All right. Everybody stay here for just a second. I'm sorry. They're wrapping this real quickly, but just for a minute. They are staying us. We'll be back on the other side of the break.

SELLERS: I've got some pancake.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:35:00]

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. Let's pick up the conversation right where we left off, questions about how Joe Biden is going to address some of the allegations against him, especially going into a debate, October 15th, just nine days from now.

Already, some of his competitors have brought up some of the allegations made by President Trump and his associates as a blunt- force weapon against Biden. Listen to what Beto O'Rourke had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FMR. REP. BETO O'ROURKE (D-TX): I would not allow a family member -- anyone in my cabinet to have a family member to work in a position like that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: So I guess the question is how aggressively do you think some of these other candidates are going to question Biden about this? Beto is already making a distinction.

SELLERS: Can I just point out a fact here? When you're president or vice president or United States senator in the United States and your immediate relative or son is working for an entity such as this oil this company in a very company in a very corrupt country such as Ukraine, it's going to raise red flags and issues. It's unforced error by the Bidens, especially if you're talking about running for president of the United States.

I don't think it's a bigger issue as -- or an issue that deals with Biden's ethics, per se. It's a lot like the Hillary Clinton email scandal. We go down in emails, emails, emails. There was nothing there. However, everybody -- all of us will agree why do you have a private email server, right? And so it's these unforced errors.

And so I don't think that -- and, in fact, I know that it's not an ethical issue with Joe Biden but I do think it looks and wreaks of it --

SANCHEZ: There's no evidence of wrongdoing by Joe Biden or his son, Hunter, but the optics are problematic.

RYE: Right. And I think that's exactly where we have to start. The unfortunate truth about where we are today is that Democrats have to operate under what looks bad, what appears a certain way. You know this well.

And to that point, Donald Trump has actual conflict in the thousands, right, from his kids, to himself, to his colleagues, to people who worked on the campaign, to people who were on the transition team, to folks currently in the administration.

But the barrier of entry to actually becoming president rests at the optics level for Democratic candidates.

PAUL: So let me point this out. We have some new fundraising numbers then, and I want to start with President Trump. He raised $125 million overall in the third quarter, $45 million online and it's up 25 percent from the prior quarter. And there were 313,000 first-time donors.

Now, from "The Wall Street Journal," they say this. One of the emails -- they talk about this campaign that the president has to raise these numbers. They said, one of the emails sent this week seeking donations as small as $5 said, the American people deserve to know the truth about Joe and Hunter Biden, and it's up to patriots like you to hold them accountable. That is getting President Trump money and it's working for him. How detrimental at the end of the day is it for Joe Biden?

GILLUM: Yes. Part of it is we going against this president have to have a very, very, very strong contrast. We are not trying to replicate Donald Trump. We are trying to replace him on the Democratic side. And therefore, it's unfortunate. I know there has been no evidence, but I honestly have to tell you I think they have drawn blood here as it relates to Vice President Biden.

And I'm hopeful that their team is coming up with a very vigorous strategy to push back on this and to help draw the real contrast between the lawlessness --

PAUL: What would that be? What would his strategy be to fight it?

GILLUM: I mean, it's definitely not an op-ed piece. I do think, I mean, one of the things that it appears that they are trying to do is, at every turn, they are attempting to punch back at this president. And the problem with punching back at this president, you have a president who sees no bounds, which means he doesn't operate by the normal rules of engagement in politics.

And when you're dealing with an opponent who is that way, I almost feel like you've got to go the exact opposite as way or a strategy to breaking through and to making sure that you are reminding Americans that what this is is not normal. And what we have got to get to is a place of normalcy, again, where you've got confidence in your government that your president is acting on your behalf and in the country's best interest.

RYAN: No, this is not normal but you have so many people out in this country who are still supporting the president, who are saying it's a warlock hunt -- I'm not going to call it a witch hunt -- a warlock hunt against this president.

But the bottom line is when this controversy, the most recent controversy happened, last week, or two weeks ago -- I can't even keep up with the dates now.

[06:40:04]

PAUL: I know, I know.

RYAN: But when it first happened, the RNC received $5 million that week in donations, okay? That's saying a lot. And if you go out to these town hall meetings, they are saying when people are trying to lay the case that impeachment is coming, you have many people in these districts that are almost purple or still red, it's a lie. They want to believe that this is not true when the president himself said that he wanted China, on tape.

And the problem is people want to believe that we are reporting something that's a falsehood but the president said it himself. It's about public opinion with this man who has a major megaphone and screaming, they are lying, they are fake or whatever.

PAUL: But here is the thing, Andrew. You said we have to get back to normalcy and people who have faith in our government. People didn't have faith in our government. And that's part of why Donald Trump was elected, because they believed that he was going to bring change to something that they thought to be broken. To that, and you say at what end (ph), or Bakari?

RYE: I mean, first, I say that it just shows how much of a divide there is in this country. But I'll tell you now, people really don't have faith in their government. What folks are saying, and it's so interesting because you see it about Joe Biden and now -- and April referenced this already, it's closer in the polls to Elizabeth Warren and corporate executives are more afraid of Elizabeth Warren than they are of Donald Trump.

And so what it tells you is that there is -- there are folks who have the pulse of the people' and there are folks who have the pulse of business. And Donald Trump won business over. He won greed over. He won dissention over. He won hate and bigotry over. And the rest of these folks are trying to just serve the people. That is where the divide exists.

And it's frustrating because I can't think of a time where I've been more disheartened and disillusioned with politics, not because of what's happening on the Democratic side, it's the most exciting thing I've seen since 2016, but the frustration is I don't know who they are running against because, again, the barometer keeps moving. There's not a fair race.

SELLERS: The problem with wrestling with pigs is that everybody gets dirty, right?

RYAN: That's a South Carolina thing.

SELLERS: But I would add to that saying because it's a great saying. Not only it's hard to wrestle with a pig because the pig likes it, but the pig actually enjoys getting dirty, it benefits the pig but the rest of us can't really quite frankly survive --

GILLUM: You destroyed my brain.

(CROSSTALKS)

GILLUM: And you just destroyed it.

SELLERS: I actually think you borrowed that from me.

RYE: There you go.

PAUL: There we go.

RYAN: The shade is growing right behind your head.

PAUL: I know we can (INAUDIBLE), but, Bakari, go ahead and finish this --

SELLERS: No. I was just going to say, and to the point, it's very hard to wrestle with Donald Trump in his realm. We talk about the money that Donald Trump raised, $125 million. But the Democrats have raised a ton of money at blue set records.

My friend, Jamie Harrison, raised $2.5 million in South Carolina to run against Lindsey Graham, numbers that are unheard of. So the energy and the money is going to be there for the Democrats.

The question who are we going to put up against --

PAUL: Who's going to have the ticket?

SELLERS: Yes. And that's going to be -- I mean -- PAUL: The big question.

SELLERS: That is a big question because there are a lot of people, and I had this discussion with everyone I talked to last night at Tyler Perry's studio. Everybody had the same question.

RYAN: We were at the Tyler Perry Studio.

SELLERS: Clearly.

RYAN: Yes.

(CROSSTALKS)

PAUL: I'm going to wrap it. But listen, they're going to be with us in the next hour.

SELLERS: People still believe that there are a lot of people, especially black voters who are still a little disinterested in the process/ And we have to have somebody who can energize the base of the party. That's what I would say.

SANCHEZ: Plenty more to discuss, plenty more shade to discuss. Thank you all so much for joining us. We'll see you on in just a few minutes.

PAUL: Yes, they're going to be back with us at 7:00.

We do have to talk to you about some more violence and deaths in Iraq.

SANCHEZ: Yes.

PAUL: Specifically, a protest that's sweeping across the country. We have a live report from Baghdad on what Iraqi leaders are doing, how they're working to put down these demonstrations.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:45:00]

PAUL: Starting a new week here with a renewed sense of violence in Iraq. More protests broke out again today in Baghdad and the pictures we have for you here are not pretty.

SANCHEZ: Yes. At least a hundred people have been killed since the protests began last week. At least 4,000 have been injured. These protests erupted in Baghdad and spread to several provinces over unemployment, alleged government corruption and the lack of basic services.

Arwa Damon is on the ground for us live from Baghdad.

Arwa, protesters are ignoring calls for calm from both the government and religious leaders.

ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: They are. And that is really an indication of exactly where the sentiment in the street is, the more violent these protests have become. The harsher the government crackdown, the greater the number of deaths, the more determined those we have been able to talk to are telling us that they are. They quite simply are rejecting the status quo.

And it's important to remember that they have heard these promises before. They have government pledges and political statements about how they will work towards economic reforms and employment opportunities and get the electricity back on and clean water. They don't want words anymore. They quite simply want to see that put into action.

A lot have really been shocked by the level with which the government has cracked down. We went around last night in Baghdad and the security forces have fanned out everywhere. A lot of roads have been entirely blocked off. Tahrir Square, the main square where the demonstrations would theoretically take place, that is entirely surrounded by a ring of security.

Demonstrators tried to gather in smaller numbers in other neighborhoods. We saw them burning tires. A number of them told us how their friends had been killed over the last few days. A lot of them are university students, university graduates and they say they just want job opportunity. Few understand why the government is reacting the way that it is but all of them are pledging to continue to take to the streets.

And there is another crucial point in all of this, and that is that this country's security is already extremely fragile. And if you look back on its recent history, instability here does not remain confined to Iraq's borders.

[06:50:02]

PAUL: A very good point. Arwa Damon, thank you so much. We appreciate it.

SANCHEZ: Still plenty more news ahead. President Trump is busy on Twitter yesterday. We will tell you who he is going after and who he may go after next. We'll discuss.

PAUL: And something quite unusual happened at a New York hair salon. We're going to show you more of this video and tell you how everybody is doing.

SANCHEZ: Tonight, the CNN original series, "Declassified: Untold Stories of American Spies," takes a look at a classic follow-the-money investigation. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It never dawned on us that the search warrants at Tele (ph) Austin to lead to one of Colombia's most violent cartels. But once we identified Norte Valle, we wanted to figure out who is behind the cartel and bring them to justice. Now, our focus was not just on taking down individuals. We knew shutting down one money remitter, two more would open the next day. So we focused on the organization itself.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Declassified, Untold Stories of American Spies, airs tonight at 9:00 Eastern right here on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:25:00]

PAUL: It's hard to see news reports about violence in our city. This week's CNN Hero had an idea. What if she help people regain a sense of community, and she did one block at a time. She began in West Englewood. That's one of Chicago's most turbulent neighborhoods. Meet Robbin Carroll.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROBBIN CARROLL, CNN HERO: I started coming out to the community. The lots were all empty. The houses were getting boarded up. People were not coming outside.

I stood on the corner and just asked anyone that walked by, are you interested in taking back your community? And everyone said, absolutely, yes, we are really brave spaced and courageous spaced. We're going to get there.

We will work through all of what is holding you back to becoming the person and the potential that you have to be.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL: To learn more about Robbin's incredible work, go to cnnheroes.com.

SANCHEZ: The last thing you want when you are getting a haircut is to be scared right out of your seat. That's happened to customers in a beauty salon in Long Island, New York, when, all of a sudden, watch this, a confused deer just bursts through the window and it smashes into a woman sitting on a sofa.

PAUL: And the owner told CNN she thought it was a car crashing through the building. That woman was taken to the hospital. Non-life threatening injuries, fortunately. (INAUDIBLE) deer, as you see, that eventually ran out the way that it came in, apparently disappeared in nearby woods. We think he's OK. We hope so.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:00:00]