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Former Police Officer Sentenced for Killing Mentally Ill and Unarmed Veteran in DeKalb County; Lori Loughlin Pleads Not Guilty to New Bribery Charge; Cuba Gooding Jr. Pleads Not Guilty to New Sexual Abuse Charges. Aired 6-7a ET

Aired November 2, 2019 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[06:00:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO)

REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA): Those in favor, please say aye.

AUDIENCE: Aye.

PELOSI: We have no choice. We took an oath to defend and protect our democracy, and that's what he's made an assault on.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The president quickly fired back.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You can't impeach a president who did nothing wrong.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Beto O'Rourke is out.

BETO O'ROURKE, FORMER 2020 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: It's been the honor of my lifetime. I love you all and I know that I'll be seeing you down the road. Thank you so much.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That fire is coming right up on it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everything is getting engulfed in flames.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fire season in California is no longer a season. We are responding to wild land fires year-round, 365 days.

(END VIDEO)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY WEEKEND with Victor Blackwell and Christi Paul.

CHRISTI PAUL, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you. So grateful to have you here.

Amid mounting evidence this morning, a growing list of witness testimony, President Trump still spinning the impeachment inquiry as what he calls a witch hunt. Last night in Mississippi he warned members of his base that a vast deep state conspiracy was trying to drive him from office. VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: House Speaker Nancy Pelosi says the scope of the inquiry could extend beyond the call to Ukraine that started all this.

PAUL: Also, Energy Secretary Rick Perry refusing to take part in any closed-door deposition, but he could consider testifying publicly.

BLACKWELL: And a source tells CNN that Lieutenant Colonel Alexander Vidman, a top Ukraine expert in the Trump Administration was told to keep quiet about the president's July phone call with Ukraine's leader.

PAUL: I want to bring in CNN correspondent Kristen Holmes in here. So Kristen, President Trump is maintaining that he believes, or that he is being unfairly targeted by democrats. Last night I know he asked, how do you impeach a president who didn't do anything wrong. What are you hearing?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Christi and Victor. Well that's right and we have to kind of take a step back and take a look at what is going on behind the scenes before we address what he's saying in public. Keep this in mind. All of these remarks are coming after this critical vote in the house essentially formalizing the impeachment probe here and moving into the public's sphere. We know that republicans behind closed doors are acknowledging that this trial in the Senate is probably going to happen and they're working on their messaging.

And on top of that, some of the top republicans who have been sitting in on these actually closed door hearings are now working informally with White House counsel helping them kind of gauge what the allegations are and the seriousness of them toward the president. So what's interesting here is that all of these separate forces are coming forward, trying to work on the messaging, but President Trump again always thinking of himself as his own messenger, top messenger here, and last night at a campaign rally he did the exact same thing and he hit some familiar targets.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

TRUMP: The media are continuing with the deranged impeachment witch hunt. This is one I never thought I'd never be involved in. The word "impeachment," to me it's a dirty word, not a good word. Totally phony deal. They know it. Everybody knows it.

HOLMES: So, you know, this is familiar messaging we've hear from President Trump. But of course we also we know that republicans were really hoping that he would stop talking about it, stop talking about it in public and kind of get on board with their messaging and their moving forward talking about the process.

And Christi and Victor, all of this is coming as the list of people the House committees want to hear from is continuing to grow. We did hear last night the Department of Energy Secretary Rick Perry has said he will not come testify behind closed doors, that he'll only come testify possibly if it's a public hearing. BLACKWELL: So Kristen, we know that on Thursday the House moved

forward with formalizing this impeachment inquiry, setting some rules. We understand that Speaker Pelosi talked about the vote. What did she say?

HOLMES: Yes, so this is a huge deal here. You know this is in response to the fact that we keep hearing these republicans really hitting the process, saying they don't want this to be behind closed doors and essentially the House democrats moving forward saying that they even might put some of their own House members who are in these vulnerable districts on the spot here because they're making them do the vote, making them get on the record here to basically answer to republicans, and Nancy Pelosi had a lot to say about this including that the scope might actually be broader of this impeachment inquiry than just the Ukraine. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

PELOSI: There were 11 obstruction of justice provisions in the Mueller report. Perhaps some of them will be part of it. Again, that will be part of the inquiry to see where we go.

(END VIDEO)

HOLMES: Yes, so some guidance there. Just to note the White House did come out after this vote and they said that the House democrats were unhinged. They said democrats in general had just been obsessed with impeaching the president since day one of his term.

PAUL: All right, Kristen Holmes, appreciate it so much this morning. Thank you.

BLACKWELL: Former federal prosecutor and CNN legal analyst Shan Wu is with us now. Shan, good morning to you.

SHAN WU, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Good morning Victor.

BLACKWELL: So let's start here with the outgoing Secretary of Energy Rick Perry saying that he will not participate in these closed-door depositions but maybe he will testify in an open hearing.

[06:05:00]

That's according to a department spokeswoman. What's the strategy here?

WU: It's delay. That's the strategy. They'll do anything to delay him showing up and it's part of their continuing attack on the process which has been greatly undermined by the vote. I mean originally Perry declined to give any documents saying it wasn't an authorized inquiry. He no longer has that option for that defense, nor does he have any legal basis for selecting which circumstance he wants to appear in. It's going to end up on a collision course in the Supreme Court based on their absolute immunity argument, and that's pretty much where he's going to be heading for and if that fails, which I think it will, then you'll see him and other witnesses perhaps sitting in the chair and then invoking the separate doctrine of executive privilege.

BLACKWELL: So you know you mentioned it briefly there but I'd like you to pull the thread a little more, the influences that potential witnesses have over the format and venue. For weeks we've watched this back-and-forth between Chairman Schiff and the whistle-blower and other members of the administration. How much say does Secretary Perry have?

WU: Honestly, he doesn't have any. He certainly can assert it and make these arguments, and it's a good political messaging point of view to try to claim it's secret hearings behind closed doors, but, in fact, it makes perfect sense it's behind closed doors because this is more or less the equivalent of the grand jury part of a criminal investigation where they're doing the investigation. I think it's important for us to remember that unlike the Clinton and Nixon impeachment proceedings; this one has not had the benefit of a special counsel or independent counsel investigating for a long time in privacy behind closed doors. They're having to react pretty much in real time. So before they can go public, they need do the investigation in private to shape it, to figure out who are the good witnesses that have value.

BLACKWEELL: Let's turn now to Colonel Vindman and his testifying that this week that he's a top Ukraine expert in this administration testified that White House lawyer John Eisenberg told him not to discuss the president's call with President Zelensky with anyone, and then he and other lawyers moved the rough transcript to this higher security server. Does that constitute a cover up or is just a prudent attorney?

WU: I think it constitutes a cover up. If I were representing Eisenberg, I'd be telling him to take the Fifth Amendment. I mean it looks like obstruction. Vindman comes to him raising concerns about an arguably illegal act; a campaign finance problem and he tells him to be quiet and then he goes and he hides the evidence in this classified server. So I think that's of great concern.

On the other side, I think it matters a lot exactly what and how he said it. For example, were he to say, well we're trying to figure this out. Don't say anything for now. Let us sort of sort things out some. That's a little bit more inocuous versus just ordering him to be silent forever. So I think those details are going to be important but Eisenberg has a lot to answer for and he'll definitely be in the hot seat if he actually chooses to answer anything.

BLACKWELL: Yes, we'll see. He's scheduled to be deposed on Monday. We'll see if he shows up. Shan Wu, good to have you.

WU: Good to see you.

BLACKWELL: And the impeachment inquiry, the witnesses, the testimony, the latest evidence join Anderson Cooper for a CNN special, "The White House in Crisis: The Impeachment Inquiry." That's tomorrow starting at 8:00 eastern; 8:00 p.m. only on CNN.

PAUL: This morning we know at least one person has died in a salmonella outbreak. It involves several states here but officials can't decipher where it's coming from.

BLACKWELL: Plus, it's a big weekend for democrats in Iowa as several 2020 candidates are there in the state to make their case to voters.

PAUL: It's Mayor Pete Buttigieg though who is making headlights after his speech at one of the state's biggest events last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

MAYOR PETE BUTTIGIEG (D-IN), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And I'm talking about hope and belonging. It sounds optimistic to you for a time like this, fine. Call it optimistic, but do not call it naive because I believe these things not based not on my age...

(END VIDEO)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:10:00]

PAUL: Oh, what a weekend it is for democrats in Iowa. This morning several 2020 candidates are making their way around the state. They're pitching themselves to likely voters there.

BLACKWELL: Missing from the big events, though, former Congressman Beto O'Rourke who called it quits Friday after failing to raise enough money. But it's Mayor Pete Buttigieg who's making a lot of news.

PAUL: Yes, he met by, well he was met by one heck of a crowd roaring for him, rounds of applause before his speech at Iowa's Liberty and Justice celebration last night. CNN's Jeff Zeleny was there.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

BARAK OBAMA, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Change that America can believe in.

(END VIDEO)

JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: At this point in that presidential campaign, this 46-year-old Senator from Illinois was still an underdog, but slowly starting to catch fire. This year the youngest candidate in the race is also on the move.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

BUTTIGIEG: Are you ready to go into that hall and leave no question about who has the momentum in Iowa right now?

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO)

ZELENY: It's too soon to know if Pete Buttigieg will follow the rise of Barack Obama, but he's turning some of the same heads in Iowa like Terri and John Hale. (BEGIN VIDEO)

ZELENY: So does he remind you of Barack Obama?

TERRI HALE, IOWA BUTTIGIEG SUPPORTER: Absolutely. It's the intelligence. It's that cool composure. It's the ability to be presidential.

JOHN HALE, IOWA BUTTIGIEG SUPPORTER: Pete is catching on. The more people that see him, the more people that support him.

(END VIDEO)

ZELENY: It was 12 years ago when Obama's long-shot candidacy turned the corner here dazzling thousands of democrats at the state party's fall gala. Two months after that speech, he won the Iowa caucus. This time the Hales are among the many Obama admirers now on the Buttigieg bandwagon.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

J. HALE: Pete and Obama both had a certain amount of pragmatism to them.

(END VIDEO)

ZELENY: At a recent rally, Terri Hale introduced the South Bend mayor.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

T. HALE: Right now, Mayor Pete Buttigieg.

(END VIDEO)

ZELENY: And she said she felt like she did in 2007.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

T. HALE: The energy and the excitement and the positivity and the hope. That's what I feel at events for Pete and I have not felt that since Barack Obama.

ZELENY: You didn't feel that four years ago?

T. HALE: No. No I didn't. No.

(END VIDEO)

ZELENY: Buttigieg was also watching that race closely volunteering for Obama in the final days of the Iowa contest.

[06:15:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO) BUTTIGIEG: It's what's going on on the ground and what relationships you're forming that serve you well when the caucus day actually rolls around.

(END VIDEO)

ZELENY: No two campaigns or candidates are the same yet both men represent a fresh face and are calling for change.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

BUTTIGIEG: I believe that we need a new generation of leadership to step forward.

OBAMA: Same old Washington textbook campaigns just won't do in this election.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO)

ZELENY: The Buttigieg campaign is embracing the comparisons, trying to use its $23 million cash on hand and momentum in the polls to build a modern-day Obama-like operation. Tommy Vietor, part of Obama's original Iowa team says the burden is now on Buttigieg to meet these expectations.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

TOMMY VIETOR, 2008 OBAMA IOWA PRESS SECRETARY: Barack Obama came up as a grassroots organizer and I think that made the whole campaign sort of make sense and flow from him but it like it still remains to be seen if that's going to deliver on caucus day.

(END VIDEO)

PAUL: Jeff Zeleny reporting there. Jeff, thank you so much.

With us now, Emily Larsen, political reporter for "The Washington Examiner." Good morning to you Emily.

EMILY LARSEN, REPORTER, "THE WASHINGTON EXAMINER": Good morning.

PAUL: How lasting is it, the potency of Buttigieg right now?

LARSEN: Well, certainly he does have the money to go through Iowa and beyond, and I think right now in the polls, there was just an Iowa poll is that came out yesterday, and he was in third place ahead of Joe Biden. And so that is boding very well for his candidacy in Iowa. There's sort of a debate within the Democratic Party about whether it's better to nominate somebody who's very progressive, has very bold drastic vision like Bernie Sanders or Elizabeth Warren, or somebody who can appeal to, sort of swing state voters like Joe Biden or maybe Pete Buttigieg I would put in the second category as well.

So I think that's the difference between him and Obama here is that Obama was sort of the new fresh face which Buttigieg also is but he's also going for sort of the more -- targeting the swing state voters rather than the bold change that Elizabeth Warren or Bernie Sanders are bringing.

PAUL: Since you mentioned it, let's throw that full screen back up of the poll in Iowa with Elizabeth Warren leading the way with 22%. The thing is there are other reports that people who vote for her and who are behind her still don't think that she can beat President Trump. With that said, how willing are people to stick by her because she's too progressive is basically is their argument?

LARSEN: Yes, and I think she tried to combat that a little bit last night in her speech at the Iowa dinner celebration because she was saying that, look, if we're going to win, we have to present bold change, bold action, but that really is a concern for a lot of democrats who are looking and trying to decide who they're going to vote for. Because there is a risk that her Medicare For All plan, which she now says will not raise taxes on the middle class, whether that's really going to fly with a lot of swing state voters that are crucial and necessary to win against Donald Trump, and so I think that's the biggest challenge she has to overcome so far.

PAUL: Well there are some potential voters out there who may need to find another candidate after we heard this from Beto O'Rourke.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

O'ROURKE: This has been the honor of my lifetime. I love you all, and I know that I'll be seeing you down the road. Thank you so much. I'm with you. Love you all very much. God bless.

(END VIDEO)

PAUL: Is there any prognostication, Emily, who was standing behind Beto? Where are those voters going go?

LARSEN: Well I think one of the reasons why Beto decided to drop out when he did was he was sort of struggling to get some support in the polls. You know, he did have supporters. There were definitely people at his rally last night expecting a very exciting celebration before this big Iowa event who were then sort of caught off guard and some of them were crying and a little bit depressed about it. But he didn't have such a huge base of support like you would see maybe with Bernie Sanders supporters, migrating to Elizabeth Warren.

So I think the people who like Beto, a lot of what I heard when I was on the campaign trail with him was that people really liked the new young fresh face, so they might be looking toward somebody like a Pete Buttigieg, but there are people who like his bold progressive vision and ideas, so maybe they'll look to somebody like Elizabeth Warren or maybe somebody who agrees with his proposal to have a mandatory buyback of assault weapons, which Cory Booker and Kamala Harris both support, so there are a lot of different ways it could go.

PAUL: No doubt. Emily Larsen, we appreciate your insight today. Thank you. LARSEN: Thank you.

BLACKWELL: This wildfire near Los Angeles, it's forcing thousands of people to leave their homes. What investigators say may have started this one.

PAUL: And indicted associates of Rudy Giuliani are pushing him to the center of the Ukraine investigation.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:20:00]

PAUL: So good to have you with us. Twenty-three minutes past the hour on this Saturday. I'm Christi Paul.

BLACKWELL: I'm Victor Blackwell; good to be with you.

A California power company says it may have caused the latest fire there. Southern California Edison says it turned off a circuit for safety reasons but when it turned it back on the Maria fire broke out shortly after.

PAUL: That Maria fire is one of the last remaining wildfires that's still a threat in that area. It's destroyed at least two homes now, forced thousands of people outside of L.A. to evacuate and at last check there are 13 wildfires burning in California right now. At least seven firefighters have been hurt just trying to put all of them out. They're really overworked right now.

BLACKWELL: People across the state are wondering is this California's new normal? Millions of people waking up to red flag warnings on a daily basis, and according to Michael Mohler, with the California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection, climate change is not helping. I asked him what's causing these disastrous fires.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

MICHAEL MOHLER, DEPUTY DIRECTOR OF CALFIRE: You have to remember, California went through a six-year drought just recently in the 2000s. That dead and dying landscape is still across California. You take the dead and dying landscape from that drought; we haven't recovered from that. Then you take what we're seeing as hotter temperatures and then these wind events. We're seeing wind events that are historical. In fact the Thomas fire in Ventura County in 2017, we had an offshore Santa Ana wind event that lasted for 14 days. It used to be a two-day to three-day wind event. So it's everything under Mother Nature. Any increase in temperature, we're seeing this explosive fire growth.

BLACKWELL: There's also the question of what now is fire season. Your department has said that this has extended about a month and a half with starting earlier and ending later. Is this now a fire season or is there something that the Californians specifically should expect at any time in the year?

MOHLER: No. That's a great question; it really is. We have what we call peak, which is our normal summer months, and what we call winter preparedness. But even that, it's really -- fire season in California is no longer a season. We're responding to wild land fires year-round, 365 days.

BLACKWELL: So there's this piece in "The Atlantic" out this week in which the author suggests that California is becoming unliveable in part because of the wildfire crisis also the housing crisis. Annie Lowrey writes this, "Climate change is turning into a tinderbox; the soaring cost of living is forcing even wealthy families into financial precarity. And, in some ways, the two crises are one: The housing crunch in urban centers has pushed construction to cheaper, more peripheral areas, where wildfire risk is greater."

I mean is the state doing enough to keep people from these more fire- prone areas?

MOHLER: Well you know we have a population of over 40 million in the state. I can tell you under Governor Newsom's administration, you could see from day 1, the priority he's put on not only emergency response but also preparedness, which in turn it includes working with the state fire marshal's office on looking at areas for hardening of structures. We have to remember this is not foreign to California. If you go back to 1993 and look at the early '90s, we had weather conditions similar to this. Now you increase that population, and of course, people are moving into what we would call the wild land urban interface extending into that area. I think with prevention, preparation, of course, we're going to see - we're a Mediterranean climate. We're going to see fires. But as we invest into that, there are safe communities. We're working on safe communities. That's something we will turn the corner on, absolutely.

BLACKWELL: But what reverses the trend of, as you pointed out, these more destructive and deadly wildfires?

MOHLER: Cal Fire, our mission, we were founded on resource management and working in over 30 million acres of state responsibility area, wild land across the state. The investment from the administration, from Governor Newsom is building these pre fire breaks preparation ahead of communities so it's really, it's the preparation, the continuing advancement in technology, and then also response. You know? The governor has invested in not only CalFire but agencies across the state for wild land fire response and I can tell you the fires we just had is a testament to that.

BLACKWELL: All right. CalFire Deputy Director Michael Mohler. Good luck toyou and your team and everybody be safe out there. Thank you so much.

MOHLER: Thank you, sir.

(END VIDEO)

BLACKWELL: And for ways that you can help wildfire evacuees in the short and the long term with shelter and food and really mental health services too. Those are important. Go to our website: CNN.com/impact. PAUL: We know At least ten people are sick and one person has died

from eating tainted ground beef. The CDC says Salmonella has spread across six states now but officials haven't been able to pinpoint who is supplying this meat. The person who has died was from California; we know that. Cases have also been reported in Colorado, Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas, and Iowa. Now of the nine who were sickened, eight were hospitalized. The CDC is still investigating by the way.

BLACKWELL: The legal troubles for Lori Loughlin, they are getting worse. The actress has pleads not guilty to new charges stemming from the college admissions scandal. Will a strategy of fighting back pay off?

PAUL: Also another athlete says he will snub President Donald Trump after getting an invite to the White House.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:30:00]

PAUL: Well, a former Georgia police officer is spending 12 years in prison for shooting and killing a mentally ill war veteran. This was something that happened back in 2015.

BLACKWELL: Yes, last month, a jury found Robert Chip Olsen guilty of aggravated assault, making a false statement and two counts of violation of both. But the former DeKalb County officer was acquitted of murder charges in the death of 26-year-old Afghanistan war veteran Anthony Hill.

Back in March of 2015, CNN affiliate "WSB" reported that Hill stopped taking his medications and ran naked at Olsen when he spotted the officer. Police said Olsen fired two shots after Hill ignored commands to stop.

PAUL: Lori Loughlin fighting back against a new charge that stems from the college admissions scandal now. The actress and her husband pleading not guilty to bribing university of Southern California employees to get their daughters admitted. This new charge could carry up to five years in prison.

Criminal Defense Attorney Janet Johnson with us now. Janet, are you surprised at this point that Loughlin is not trying to navigate some sort of deal? I mean, what is on the line for her?

JANET JOHNSON, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Good morning, Christi. I think she is probably behind the scenes, trying to navigate a deal. And I say that because when I have clients who turn down deals and then maybe get cold feet and realize that as the charges keep adding on, sometimes they come to me and say, can you go back to the government and try to negotiate?

[06:35:00]

I think that's probably happening behind the scenes, and you're seeing a little PR blitz where she's coming out now or sources close to her coming out and saying, she wanted to take a deal, but her husband talked her out of it. That may be paving the way to go to the government and say, listen, she made a mistake, she got bad advice, can we go back to where we began and make that deal?

PAUL: OK, so, the question is can she? I mean, is that -- is that a viable excuse?

JOHNSON: Well, the -- yes, I mean, the government will probably be hesitant because the damage is not work, they've had two superseding indictments. But in the end, I think she can, and I think that they may even agree to drop one or two of the additional counts, but she has to be prepared that she's going to prison, and it's going to be for longer than Felicity Huffman's 11 days. It could be two years or up.

PAUL: All right, I want to move on to actor Cuba Gooding Jr. here. He's fighting against new charges as well. A third woman now accusing the Oscar-winning actor of sexual misconduct. He's pleading not guilty to all of the charges, denies the wrongdoing. We understand that he is now facing three counts of forcible touching and three counts of third-degree sexual abuse.

The accusations in this third case from this third abuser -- I mean, accusations aren't convictions obviously.

JOHNSON: Right --

PAUL: However, when they're adding up like this with three different women, what does it mean for his case?

JOHNSON: It could cut both ways. If I were defending him -- and I think I've seen his defense attorney say this, there is a lot of publicity around this case. So, he could certainly say, well, now all these women have heard these stories, there's a civil lawsuit surrounding one of the accusations. They want to get their piece of the pie.

But on the other hand, there are also some -- a dozen other women who aren't charged, but who are going to come forward and could testify in a trial and say, he did the same thing to me. So, obviously, where there's smoke, there may be fire, but the allegations are that he improperly touched them, there was no purpose that was legitimate, and it was for some sort of sexual gratification.

He could certainly testify and say, listen, I don't remember touching anyone on purpose, it was a crowded club, I touched her accidentally, and there wasn't any gratification or sexual interest even. I think it's a triable case, quite frankly.

PAUL: OK, so his attorney Mark Keller says the video evidence that we've seen so far will prove his innocence. And he also says that the latest charge is less credible than the first accusation. Let's talk about that video though. Do you believe based on what you have seen the video shows a definitive defense for him?

JOHNSON: I don't think it shows a definitive defense, but remember, it has to show a definitive crime. It's on -- the burden is on the government to say, look at this video, it shows the crime of a willful touching with no legitimate purpose. I don't know that it does that. So, all it has to do is sort of be unclear, and the tie goes to the defense.

PAUL: OK, I want to talk as well about prosecutors in Boston here charging the girlfriend of that college student who died by suicide in May, saying that, that girlfriend repeatedly pushed him to take his own life during their relationship. They say that Inyoung You was her name was physically, verbally and psychologically abusive toward Alexander Urtula.

She sent messages that included go die, that she, his family and the world would be better off without him. She's currently back in her native South Korea right now. But with that kind of evidence, police cite 75,000 text messages, 47,000 of which are from her. How compelling is this case, especially compared to Michelle Carter, remember, she was convicted of involuntary manslaughter --

JOHNSON: Right --

PAUL: In 2017 for something similar.

JOHNSON: Right, and also in Massachusetts. And those two cases are going to be compared a lot, I think, Christi, because in that case, she -- Michelle Carter actually told the -- her boyfriend or her friend to get back in the car. And he was -- there was asphyxiation, that ultimately that's how he died. I think that the evidence in this case is not as strong.

And I think that just the statements -- you know, look, 75,000 is a lot of texts, but some of those actually came from him. The relationship may have been very toxic, but that doesn't necessarily prove involuntary manslaughter. I think that it's very -- it's again a defense. This is a first amendment issue. Michelle Carter tried that and it didn't succeed.

But in this case, just saying hateful words may not be enough to convict you for involuntary manslaughter.

PAUL: And what is the likelihood that she'll even be extradited because we understand --

JOHNSON: Right --

PAUL: That she went back to South Korea. I know that there's an extradition treaty that dates back to 1999, but can the U.S. get her back in the states?

[06:40:00]

JOHNSON: Yes, well, first they're going to try to get her voluntarily, which may or may not work. But I think the extradition, there is a defense because for that treaty to be in effect, they have to find that it's a charge that she could have been charged with in South Korea. So, it has to be a crime that has, you know, double application in South Korea and America. This is such a unique theory of prosecutions.

So, even though involuntary manslaughter may be recognized in South Korea, you know, death by text or involuntary manslaughter by words is not a crime in South Korea. And they may contest it and it may work. If nothing else, it will take years to get her back if she fights it.

PAUL: All right, Janet Johnson, always appreciate your insight, thank you ma'am.

BLACKWELL: Well, speaking of legal trouble, President Trump's personal attorney, Rudy Giuliani has found himself near the center of this impeachment inquiry and two indicted associates of his are making the scrutiny even more intense. A decision from a judge in their case. We'll talk about that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLACKWELL: Welcome back. Sixteen minutes to the top of the hour now. A federal judge has denied a request from one of Rudy Giuliani's associates to lift house arrest in GPS monitoring as part of his bail condition. Igor Fruman was arrested last month for violating campaign finance laws.

[06:45:00]

PAUL: And a picture of Lev Parnas; another of Giuliani's associates who was also indicted for campaign finance violation had surfaced where he's standing behind President Trump at a 2018 mid-term rally. Now, the video is the latest example of how the man who had little record of donations to candidates before 2018 used political donations and welded their proximity to Rudy Giuliani to gain access to the president and political campaigns.

BLACKWELL: CNN's Tom Foreman takes a look at what we know so far about Giuliani's role in the Trump administration's relationship with Ukraine.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

RUDY GIULIANI, ATTORNEY TO DONALD TRUMP: Truth is in truth, the president of the United States says, I didn't --

CHUCK TODD, MODERATOR, "MEET THE PRESS": Truth is in truth. Mr. Mayor, do you realize what --

GIULIANI: No!

TODD: This is going to become a bad meme --

GIULIAN: Don't do this to me.

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In the swirling storm of the Ukraine scandal, as much or more than the president --

GIULIANI: Shut up, moron, shut up!

FOREMAN: Rudy Giuliani, his lawyer is at the center.

GIULIANI: You're just repeating spin. The prosecutor --

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN: Oh, but you don't --

GIULIANI: The prosecutor --

CUOMO: Right? You're not spinning anything? Go ahead.

GIULIANI: I'm not spinning a damn thing.

FOREMAN: "Time" has put him on its front page, calling him a shadow Secretary of State. Even as witnesses have told Congress, it was Giuliani who set up back door communication with the Ukrainians, bypassing the State Department. Giuliani, who Trump wanted the Ukrainians to talk to when the president requested an investigation of Democrat Joe Biden, saying in that infamous phone call, "if you could speak to him, that would be great."

And Giuliani who continues to claim with zero proof that Russian interference to help Republican Donald Trump was not the problem in the last election, but meddling to help the Democrats was.

GIULIANI: There was actually real collusion, it involved the Ukrainians --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well --

GIULIANI: But the FBI did everything they could to keep this information away.

TRUMP: He's been a great crime fighter --

FOREMAN: The president's defense of Giuliani has been at times strong, at times tepid as Giuliani's behavior has careened into the surreal. For example, this week when he attacked Democrats for their probe into Trump's actions but simultaneously tweeted an admission that Trump did ask for a Ukrainian investigation or when he apparently butt-dialed an "NBC" reporter who overheard him complaining about Biden and looking for cash.

GIULIANI: The problem is we need some money. We need a few hundred thousand.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are you concerned that Rudy Giuliani could be indicted in all of this?

TRUMP: Well, I hope not.

FOREMAN: But after two of Giuliani's clients, Soviet-born American businessman were charged with circumventing U.S. election laws, Giuliani has been showing up in the media to defend the president less often. And sources say he's been shopping for an attorney of his own.

GIULIANI: Laura, this stings. FOREMAN (on camera): It's impossible to imagine that Giuliani will

remain out of the spotlight because like Trump, he clearly enjoys attention, but this kind of attention, maybe not so much. Tom Foreman, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLACKWELL: Thank you, Tom. So, the Washington Nationals World Series celebration now coming with some controversy.

COY WIRE, CNN SPORTS REPORTER: All right, yes, you know, Victor, this victory parade is just around the corner, a few hours away, but now the team's White House visit has become the focus. Which player says I just can't do it about meeting President Trump. It's coming up on NEW DAY.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:50:00]

PAUL: Well, when he was 20 years old, Richard Miles was wrongfully convicted and locked up in a Texas prison for 15 years. After a full exoneration and starting his life over in his mid-30s, Richard is now helping other people transform their lives after leaving prison. Meet one of our top 10 heroes for 2019.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RICHARD MILES, WRONGFULLY CONVICTED: My mom would always tell me when you look out the window, don't look at the balls, look at the sky. I could change my perception within the place of incarceration. At the end of the day, be confident in your change. The idea really started from inside. People get out and they come right back in.

I said if I ever get out, man, we're going to start a program and we're going to help people.

Acknowledgement, transparency and forgiveness. These are the three essential things we need when we're coming back home.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL: Oh, Richard's program "Miles of Freedom" has helped approximately a 1,000 people restart their lives, thank you, Richard. Go to cnnheroes.com. Vote for your favorite CNN Hero of the year.

BLACKWELL: A pitcher for the World Series champion, Washington Nationals says he will not be going to the White House.

PAUL: Yes, Coy Wire is here with more. Good morning!

WIRE: Good morning, Christi and Victor. All the Nationals are going to be celebrating and chanting and drinking their way down Constitution Avenue. The parade starts today at 2 O'clock. But when the team goes to the White House on Monday, there will be one notable absence, that's pitcher Sean Doolittle. He told the "Washington Post", it's because of President Donald Trump,

he referenced some of the president's policies, including those on immigration. He said quote, "as much as I wanted to be there with my teammates and share that experience with my teammates, I can't do it. I just can't do it", unquote.

Now, you may remember, some fans boo-ed the president and chanted "lock him up" when he attended game five of the World Series in Washington last weekend. There hasn't been any comment from the president about Doolittle. The president is expected to be in New York tonight for the UFC fight between Nate Diaz and Jorge Masvidal.

Right, let's go to hoops and some tough news for Steph Curry and Warriors fans, as Curry will miss at least three months after having surgery on his hand. Steph was still all smiles as you could see here on Instagram after the procedure. It happened on Wednesday, this injury against the Suns on this play here, 6 foot, 10, 260 pound Aaron Baines, look at him landing right on Steph's left hand --

PAUL: Oh --

WIRE: After a hard fall. The Warriors now without three of their biggest stars from a season ago, Clay Thompson still recovering from a torn ACL, Kevin Durant of course signed with Brooklyn. Now, it was the king versus a prince so to speak in Dallas last night. LeBron James taking on one of the game's rising stars and mavericks, reigning rookie of the year, Luka Doncic. LeBron was asked about him before the game, and listen to this question.

[06:55:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right, how do you and your hard-boiled cagers from Laker land plan to put a lid on Luka Doncic and his razzmatazz hop skiddily-doo on your money-making end of the court?

LEBRON JAMES, BASKETBALL PLAYER, LOS ANGELES LAKERS: No, I don't know if we can stop razz-tazz(ph) skiddily-doo.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL: What?

WIRE: Yes, exactly, Doncic is bringing all that razzmatazz in this game. The 20-year-old Slovenian doing it all. He was draining three- pointers, driving to the rack, 31 points and a triple-double for him on the night. The Mavs had a 3-point lead in the final seconds. But look at LeBron kick it out to Danny Green, tying it with the --

PAUL: Wow --

WIRE: Three-pointer. So, it goes into overtime, and that is where the king would rise. He gets a triple-double of his own in this game. The Lakers win 119-110, but look at game recognizing game. LeBron giving Luka some love afterwards, loving every moment of the competition. Now, Christi, Victor, I want to ask you, have you ever been caught on camera doing --

BLACKWELL: Yes --

WIRE: Something that you wish people wouldn't have seen?

BLACKWELL: Yes --

WIRE: Probably --

BLACKWELL: Yes --

WIRE: Especially Victor, well, check that out. That's coach Kenny Atkinson. Coach, I mean, come on, coach, what are you doing there? Maybe you forgot your ChapStick, just --

BLACKWELL: Oh, no!

PAUL: Oh, no!

WIRE: I mean, just ask somebody for the lip gloss. Lip glossing will not be popping. All right, so real quick --

PAUL: I can assure you that's not what Victor was doing.

BLACKWELL: No --

PAUL: I can assure you that.

BLACKWELL: One time I was eating bacon and we came back from commercial break.

PAUL: That's not a big deal --

BLACKWELL: Maybe network --

WIRE: All right, real quick shout out to South Africa, they defeated England to win the Rugby World Cup in Japan.

PAUL: All right --

BLACKWELL: All right --

PAUL: Coy, thank you so much for that moment of grossness --

WIRE: Yes --

BLACKWELL: Yes --

PAUL: This morning --

BLACKWELL: Stay with me. Next hour of your NEW DAY starts after a quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)