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Clinton Goes on Howard Stern; Impeachment Drama Sways Voters; Pelosi to Give Announcement; Aired 8:30-9a ET
Aired December 5, 2019 - 08:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HILLARY CLINTON, FORMER DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Best face possible and I'm, you know, Bill and I are sitting with George and Laura Bush. And then he started on that speech, which was so bizarre. And that's when I got really worried. And then that carnage in the street and the dark dystopian vision, I was sitting there like just, wow, couldn't believe it. And George W. Bush says to me, well that was some weird shit.
HOWARD STERN: Wow.
JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Clinton also took aim at Republican leaders, such as South Carolina Senator Lindsey Graham, a man she once worked with across the aisle when she was a New York senator.
CLINTON: Lindsey was good company. He was funny. He was self- depreciating. He also believed in climate change back in those days and --
CLINTON: Yes. I mean --
STERN: Like he would say, I'm concerned about the future for my children?
CLINTON: Well, he doesn't have any children --
CLINTON: But he was concerned about the future, yes, absolutely. And so I saw him as somebody who, you know, had been working to try to figure out what he believed and how he could do things.
STERN: Has he sold his soul to the devil?
CLINTON: I don't know the answer to that. I think that's a fair question, however. And what I don't understand is how he went from being the friend and the, you know, real confidante of the maverick, John McCain, who, you know, I didn't agree with politically, but I found him to be a man of integrity, a man of, you know, real strength of conviction. Now, you know, I don't know what's happened to Lindsey Graham, I -- I
-- I'll be honest with you. I haven't talked to him in a long time. He wrote -- you know how "Time" magazine has like the top 100 people and all that? One year, I don't know, back a couple of years ago when I was in it, he wrote the tribute to me.
STERN: My God.
CLINTON: And then now it's like -- he -- it's like he had a brain snatch, you know?
CARROLL: Clinton uncharacteristically candid regarding whispers about her personal life.
CLINTON: Well, contrary to what you may hear, I actually like men.
STERN: Oh, no, right, yes, that's the other thing.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, that's the other thing --
CLINTON: You know what I'm saying, right?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Women are friends and --
STERN: Raise your right hand. You've never had a lesbian affair?
CLINTON: Never --
CLINTON: Never, never, never even been tempted, thank you very much.
CARROLL: There were no questions during the sit-down about former White House intern Monica Lewinsky and the inappropriate relationship she had with then-President Bill Clinton. Stern did get Clinton to open up about life and love before Bill Clinton.
STERN: Somebody before Bill that you would have considered marrying?
CLINTON: No. I would not have considered marrying.
STERN: But -- but in love?
CLINTON: But in love.
CARROLL: Stern tried to press Clinton on the field of 2020 candidates. She pledged to support whoever the Democratic nominee might be, though she did have a few choice words for Bernie Sanders.
STERN: Do we hate Bernie Sanders?
CLINTON: No, I don't hate anybody.
STERN: Bernie could have endorsed you quicker. (INAUDIBLE) -- CLINTON: He could have. He hurt me. There's no doubt about it, he hurt me. But going back to the indictments, case that's what's really important --
STERN: Have you even spoken to Bernie about that?
CLINTON: No. No. I mean --
STERN: You don't talk to him?
CLINTON: I don't talk to him. Yes, I mean we did when he finally endorsed me and all that.
STERN: But you're upset with him?
CLINTON: No, disappointed. Disappointed.
So -- and I hope he doesn't do it again to whoever gets the nomination.
CLINTON: Once is enough.
CARROLL: A lot there.
Clinton also talked about that special something that she says people like Barack Obama have, people like Bill Clinton have, something she wishes she had more of. Clinton also said that one of the mistakes that she made during her campaign is that she didn't do enough media. She said Trump was all over the place talking to a lot of different media outlets at the time. And, in retrospect, she wishes that she had done more.
Back to you guys.
ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: You think? I mean, honestly, I remember talking to her handlers back with John Avlon and Dana Bash back -- her handlers and saying, you know, Donald Trump calls in to our show. Hillary Clinton could call in. We'd take that call any time.
DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Of course.
CAMEROTA: And they were like, let's go back and talk about it at headquarters.
BASH: Yes. Yes.
CAMEROTA: So what -- why didn't she do this in 2016?
BASH: First of all, let's just say -- wow.
JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes.
BASH: I could watch that over and over again because that is the Hillary Clinton that, if you get a little bit of, you know, private time with him -- with her --
BASH: That you see and you certainly hear from all of her friends who want her to sit back, have a glass of wine, maybe a little vodka, and she can talk about things and be more open.
If Hillary Clinton did that, to your point, in 2016, we could be having a whole different discussion right now because she was a human being. She allowed her humanity to come forward. She also said in there why she didn't. She was very clear, she is a 70-something woman who came of age at a time where women weren't supposed to be human. They had to act like, you know, serious in order to be taken seriously by men, and she never got over that. She never evolved to the 2016, now 2019 culture.
AVLON: And it -- that's why those sorts of conversations we're hearing is such a revelation because you see this very endearing sort of human person, sort of, you know, when she's -- when Stern asks about, you know, did you ever have a -- be in love before Bill Clinton. She's like, oh, yes, you know.
CAMEROTA: Of course.
AVLON: It's very disarming. Nothing you'd ever expect.
I think it shows the danger of politicians being too self-monitoring, too afraid of making a mistake. But that's a function of gotcha culture. That's a function of a politics and personal destruction, as well as the sexism that Dana -- that Dana spoke about, which is that, you know, you had to be incredibly tough to steel yourself to be a pioneer in that world. But those things conspired to not let people see the real her. And that's actually when politicians are most powerful.
BASH: How great was that -- that -- the moment that she was talking about when she was sitting at the -- at the inauguration with George Bush and he said, that was some weird -- I mean you can totally see that. You can see that whole thing.
BASH: And the fact that she puts it out there, again, it is the humanity. It is, frankly, the relatability that she couldn't get to in her campaign, any campaigns.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Yes.
BASH: She was more like this when she was secretary of state.
BERMAN: I will say this is the ironic curse of many losing candidates --
BERMAN: Is that they only discover who they are and what they should have been --
CAMEROTA: During their concession speech.
BERMAN: After the fact.
BERMAN: After the fact.
CAMEROTA: I know, it's so true.
Dana, John, thank you both very much and thanks to Jason. That was a great moment.
OK, what impact had the impeachment hearings had in some swing states? We'll let you know what some liberal Democrats from Wisconsin are saying as the investigation moves forward. Stick around for that.
CAMEROTA: The battle for 2020 swing voters in Wisconsin already heating up over the air waves and over cocktails.
CNN's Kyung Lah spoke with liberal voters in Milwaukee to see if they think the impeachment drama is moving the needle. She joins us live.
Now, were you imbibing or were they?
KYUNG LAH, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: They were because if I have anything, I turn bright red. So, no, absolutely not.
CAMEROTA: Oh, got it. Got it. Good to know.
LAH: But what I will tell you is here in the city of Milwaukee, those happy drinkers, they are part of a blue city. This is a city that Democrats learned in 2016 that if you don't win here, you can potentially lose the state.
So, we spent some time with these progressive Democrats, and they say, look, impeachment is coming. We're going to embrace it and we're going to use it to boost enthusiasm.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now live from the heart of liberal Wisconsin, where the political party is just beginning.
LAH (voice over): A drop of blue --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The impeachment of Donald Trump, it continues, Dom (ph).
LAH: In a sea of conservative talk radio in Wisconsin, two progressives, pounding impeachment.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Impeachment, is this sort of an optional thing?
LAH: To sway whatever swayable voters are listening to one of the only left-leaning talk radio stations in this swing state.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And will you, sir, be on the right side of history for a change?
LAH: Hillary Clinton lost Wisconsin by fewer than 23,000 votes in 2016. Energized Democrats and disaffected Republicans and these progressives believe the president won't win here again.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What I'm trying to convince are the reasonable Republicans.
LAH (on camera): Is your mission to flip the state?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely.
LAH: And to broadcasting the impeachment hearings?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Gavel to gavel.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We've got a big show, Dom.
LAH (voice over): From radio to television, wall to wall impeachment coverage.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hi. Welcome to (INAUDIBLE). How you doing?
LAH: At this Milwaukee diner, hot cakes are served with hearings in the background.
MALCOLM STEWART, WISCONSIN VOTER: I did not vote in 2016.
LAH (on camera): Will you vote this time?
STEWART: I think I will. I think I will.
LAH (voice over): Malcolm Stewart says he's a swing voter, not a fan of the president, but wonders if weeks of hearings will have any impact.
STEWART: But as far as public opinion, people pretty much already have, you know, pro-Trump or anti-Trump pretty much right now. So I don't think it really helps or hurts.
JEFF SCHMIT, WISCONSIN VOTER: Did you want something to drink?
LAH: Frustrating for Democrat Jeff Schmidt, who spends his day talking to table after table.
LAH (on camera): And is that the sense you get that people are stuck and they're not moving?
SCHMIT: Somewhat, yes. I don't -- I think -- I don't know what it's going to take for people to realize that there is -- this is an issue.
LAH (voice over): Progressives in Wisconsin say it just takes more work.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Here's to you, here's to me, here's to drinking liberally.
LAH: At an event called Drinking Liberally, the hearings have brought in new members. Among them, former Republicans.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In 2016, I was wrong. I should have voted for Hillary Clinton.
LAH: Instead, life-long GOP-er Aaron Perry left his ballot blank. Now he's working to elect Democrats. And like these progressives believes impeachment will eventually help his new party.
LAH (on camera): Is it helpful to Republicans?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: IN the long run, I don't think that's a winning hand.
LAH (voice over): Win or lose, these Democrats say they have no choice but to move forward.
LAH (on camera): Will it be worth it if Democrats lose the state in 2020?
KRISTIN HANSEN, "DRINKING LIBERALLY" WAUKESHA CHAPTER HOST: Yes. Yes. If we don't impeach Donald Trump, who in the world are we ever going to impeach? There is a reason that the framers put this out in the Constitution to say --
LAH: Even if you lose?
HANSEN: Even if we lose. We have to do it for future generations.
LAH: So you hear that determination. But underneath all of that there is concern among Democrats that the impeachment will backfire in this state in 2020.
State Democrats are not talking about it as they look to 2020, but state Republicans are. John and Alisyn, they are fundraising off of it and so far fundraising
BERMAN: I've got to say, all of that, so interesting, Kyung. Thank you so much for going out and getting those views.
And I will say, Milwaukee, Wisconsin, the site of the Democratic National Convention this summer.
CAMEROTA: Great point.
BERMAN: No coincidence, mind you.
CAMEROTA: No. We will be able to imbibe ourselves there with voters at some point.
BERMAN: If we have to. if we have to.
Listen, we're just minutes away from breaking news. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has scheduled an announcement on the impeachment inquiry. They're holding it very close to the vest. What will she say? That's next.
BERMAN: All right, live pictures of the U.S. Capitol where in about 10 minutes we are getting some kind of announcement from House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. At 5:30 this morning, the House speaker's office put out this mysterious release saying that she will have an update on the impeachment inquiry at 9:00 a.m.
We, frankly, do not know what it will be. Some of the speculation here this morning has been it will be about the schedule. Maybe she'll talk about what might be in articles of impeachment. We just don't know.
CAMEROTA: She's going -- she's doing it from the speaker's balcony, which sounds romantic, I feel. It sounds romantic but I'm -- it may not be a romantic announcement. It may be something, a status report. But the surprise element of it and the fact that her colleagues, her Democratic colleagues that we've spoken to this morning don't know what she has up her sleeve definitely lends some suspense to all of this.
BERMAN: The significance of the balcony may not be romance. It might be that that was the location where she announced the start of the impeachment inquiry. And this is the first time she has spoken from there since.
So, again, you get the sense this will be important.
There are a lot of questions. One of them, will the Mueller report and the Mueller investigation be part of articles of impeachment? She could clear that up this morning. And that might be something that the Democratic caucus wants some clarity on. CAMEROTA: She could, or she could just talk about the timing because
everybody wants to know if this will be done by Christmas or the end of the year or when.
But, meanwhile, CNN's live coverage will continue for you right after this very quick break.
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: A very good morning to you. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington.
POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Poppy Harlow in New York.
It is a big morning. We're glad you're with us.
We want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world.
We do begin with significant breaking news.
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi is just literally a few minutes away from delivering a statement on what comes next in the impeachment battle. Democrats are largely pushing for a vote on impeaching the president by Christmas.
There is a lot of work to do before that could even happen, though.
SCIUTTO: And we're going to learn a lot just in the next few minutes.
On the Senate side, Republicans working with the White House on an aggressive defense strategy ahead of a likely trial in the Senate. They all know that it is coming and very telling. The 2020 Senate calendar is out and the month of January is missing. They may not know exactly what is about to happen with articles of impeachment, but every single senator that CNN has spoken with says they are personally studying up ahead of this high-stakes showdown.
We have a team of reporters spread across Washington this morning to bring you the latest.
Let's begin with CNN's senior congressional correspondent Manu Raju on Capitol Hill.
Manu, do we know what to expect from the House speaker in a few minutes time?
MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I can tell you that a lot of people on Capitol Hill, even her closest allies, don't know exactly what she's going to say. Only the speaker and maybe a handful of aides ultimately do.
What we don't know yet is whether or not she will come out and say that she thinks the president should be impeached. She has not said that yet. She has also not laid out what the scope of articles of impeachment should be, what it should entail, whether it should include obstruction of Congress, obstruction of justice, including the Mueller report and, of course, abuse of power and bribery. All of those are under consideration right now at the highest levels of the House Democratic leadership. But Pelosi has yet to indicate exactly how she will come down.
So the fact that she's making this announcement is very significant. The last time she went out onto the speaker's balcony to make such an announcement was back in late September when she eventually got behind moving forward on an official impeachment inquiry. So we do expect some significant news from her today.
I can tell you, behind the scenes, she's been having a number of conversations with her colleagues, taking the temperature of her caucus to determine whether or not it would makes sense to go forward right now. And overwhelmingly, Democrats believe that the president should be impeached.
These conversations occurred in a number of group settings yesterday, including the full Democratic caucus that met yesterday morning behind closed doors. No staff were allowed. She asked the caucus, are you ready? And I'm told the answer was unequivocal yes. That means are you ready for the next step in this process?
Now, the next step ultimately is still on the House Judiciary Committee. We expect a vote -- we expect a hearing likely next week with the lawyers for the House Intelligence Committee, who are involved in the investigation to the president's handling of Ukraine policy and detailing that report. We expect them to talk about that report, testify about that report, answer questions from members about that report.
Then we -- we're expecting articles of impeachment could be voted on in the House Judiciary Committee as soon as next week, followed by a vote before Christmas on the House floor about whether or not the president should be impeached, making him just the third American president to be impeached by the House.
And then I can tell you, guys, the Democrats in the House are there. They believe House Speaker Pelosi will be there, too. So we'll see exactly what she has to say here in just a matter of minutes, guys.
HARLOW: Literally three and a half minutes.
Manu, thank you very much.
Both Senate Republicans and Senate Democrats working behind the scenes, already preparing for the expected impeachment trial.
Let's go to Phil Mattingly on Capitol Hill on that.
What would that look like, Phil?
PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it's kind of a surreal situation up here right now. Surreal being the words of an actual Republican senator who was explaining things to me yesterday. And the fact that everyone knows it's coming, I don't think there's any equivocation about whether or not the House is going to impeach the president, at least based on what I'm hearing from Senate Republicans and Democrats and their advisers. But they don't know what it's going to look like. They have no sense of what the structure of a Senate trial would be, how long it would last, who might testify, if anyone would testify at all. But that doesn't mean they're not preparing.
Take yesterday for example. Senate Republicans, in a closed door lunch, meeting with White House Counsel Pat Cipollone. Two of his top deputies. The White House making clear, both in that meeting and afterwards when the legislative affairs director talked to reporters that they want a full Senate trial. They want a robust defense and they want specific witnesses, including people like Hunter Biden.
Now, the Democrats, they also had a presentation from their leader, Chuck Schumer, behind closed doors at their caucus lunch. He walked through kind of the technical details of what may happen, showed video clips from CSPAN from the 1999 Bill Clinton trial.
The reality is, there is so many unanswered questions right now that nobody is totally sure what's coming forward. They just know it's about to happen and they're doing their best to prepare, sometimes each in their own way and sometimes in group settings, Jim.
SCIUTTO: Of course Republicans have a majority in the Senate.