Return to Transcripts main page

Cuomo Prime Time

Dow Plunges 12 Percent In One Week On Coronavirus Fears; Trump Re-Nominating John Ratcliffe For DNI; Actor Danny Glover On Endorsing Sanders For President. Aired 9-10p ET

Aired February 28, 2020 - 21:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[21:00:00]

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: News continues. Want to hand it over to Chris for CUOMO PRIME TIME. Chris?

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN HOST: All right, thank you, my friend. I am Chris Cuomo and welcome to PRIME TIME.

We have new information. There are now 64 confirmed cases and, more importantly, there's now a second Coronavirus case of unknown origin in California.

For us, the task tonight is to test why this White House plan is fueling fear by not allowing for the testing that's going on literally everywhere else? They are keeping us from getting a handle on who has what and where.

Also, we have more proof tonight that Trump just fears no pushback on anything at all. He's reviving a name for Intel Chief that got derailed just months ago, and for good reason. Why he's doing it now is scary.

So, what do you say? Let's get after it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TEXT: CUOMO PRIME TIME.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: All right, sorry if my voice starts to go. I have a cold, not Coronavirus. But, in truth, I - I can't actually say that because I can't get tested.

And that's where we should be focused, not on this Trump and Co. fiasco trying to say this is all about people trying to hurt him politically. It's a farce. Here's the fact.

We have this second case in the West of a patient where it is not clear how she got the virus, and there was a delay in detection again. She's an older woman. She'd been hospitalized for a respiratory illness and a doctor requested a Coronavirus test.

Now, how does this information let us know what we need to do more of going forward? Here's the context with the World Health Organization just raised its global threat from "High" to "Very high."

Why? There are infections on every continent, except Antarctica. They have confirmed cases in 56 countries. Like I said, 64 here in the U.S., now, and rising. The Pentagon is now warning - warning of increased threat to U.S. troops everywhere, worldwide.

So, again, to be clear, this is not about us trying to sow fear. We're trying to do the opposite. And information is what empowers our calm and our understanding here, and you'll learn that throughout the show tonight.

What do they mean what we're learning now? How does it shape what we do going forward? We're lucky to have two of the world's top experts on this tonight, former Obama White House Health Policy Adviser and former Ebola Czar under Obama, we got Zeke Emanuel, and Ron Klain.

Gentlemen, thank you. So--

DR. ZEKE EMANUEL, FORMER WHITE HOUSE HEALTH POLICY ADVISER UNDER PRESIDENT OBAMA: Good to be here.

CUOMO: --64 cases, right? Now 64 matters why? Because it keeps going up every day. We'll put up on the screen. You'll see every day there's a little bit more, one day we had the same cases both days, so each day since we've been seeing this here, we've seen an increase in cases.

But we're really worried about the two unknown, Zeke. Tell us why. Why is unknown origin more of a pressing concern?

EMANUEL: Well it suggests that the virus has been spread.

And the people who are spreading it either don't know that they're infected, or have no symptoms, and continue to spread it, because you can't trace that person either to have gone to China, or to someone who was in China, and who's tested positive for the virus.

So, it seems to be out there, and people who have not been diagnosed seem to be spreading it.

CUOMO: Right.

EMANUEL: And that is a - it's a turning point. It's a different kind of infection now. It's not person-to-person.

CUOMO: Right.

EMANUEL: It's community-wide, and you can't identify the origin.

CUOMO: But just not to let the mystery become, you know, madness, Ron, that's what we expect is that it'll start to get transferred from person to person. And that's why you need a plan.

But, more importantly, a big part of that plan has to be testing. I don't get this notion of why the CDC, even though they've changed criteria somewhat, is not letting States do the testing they can do, so that we can be like South Korea, and all these other countries.

We have a graphic somewhere to show how much more--

RON KLAIN, FORMER EBOLA CZAR UNDER PRESIDENT OBAMA, HOST, "EPIDEMIC" PODCAST: Yes.

CUOMO: --so many other countries are testing than we are. Why?

KLAIN: Why because the White House was asleep on the job. When we found out that this virus was spreading widely in China, in December, in January, we should have rapidly accelerated the preparation and deployment of test kits in the U.S.

The CDC isn't letting people test because they don't have the testing kits, they don't have the diagnostic tools. They're supposed to be ramping up. They're supposed to be getting out. Supposedly, they'll be out by the end of next week.

But we're just behind on producing the tests. We're behind on getting them approved. We're behind on getting them distributed. This should have been Job One of the Coronavirus Task Force.

CUOMO: Right.

KLAIN: And what we're seeing is we're - we're just behind, Chris.

CUOMO: All right, so they're--

KLAIN: That's the - the truth.

CUOMO: --they're behind, and testing matters because it's the unknown that freaks people out. I'd rather know you have 8,000 cases because you'll start to see people going home.

KLAIN: Yes.

CUOMO: Getting better. And it's better than not knowing what you're dealing with.

But there's another reason also, Zeke, which is that States, I know for a fact, in New York, and also we saw in California, they have the protocols to test. They're very sophisticated at the state level.

[21:05:00]

They've asked for permission, and the CDC, to use the language of a Congressman, in California, is ghosting them, on giving them a yes. How does that make sense?

EMANUEL: Well I think the simple answer is it doesn't make sense.

As Ron has pointed out, you can't know the magnitude of the problem unless you've tested a number of people, who are suspicious, and you can see which portion of them tests positive for the Coronavirus.

And we also don't know the magnitude of the geographic spread. I mean, you've identified, and we've identified, California. But, remember, that's not the only place these people from the cruise ship in Japan or the people from China went to.

There's also the Air Force Base near San Antonio, in Texas, and we haven't seen any cases there, and that's probably because we haven't been looking, rather than the fact that there's none there.

And so, I think knowing what we're dealing with, knowing its geographic spread, is number one to addressing the problem, and trying to contain the problem. The other important element is knowing whether a patient has it, will change how you deal with the patient, if they get to a physician office or they get to a hospital.

One of the things we know is that patients who walk in might be, you know, having a respiratory symptom, we don't suspect Coronavirus, we might not take the right precautions, and that person could spread it to healthcare workers, could spread it to--

CUOMO: Right.

EMANUEL: --other patients. And that becomes - the hospital then becomes a mini, you know, Petri dish, and you knock out a lot of doctors and nurses from being able to--

CUOMO: Right.

EMANUEL: --provide care.

CUOMO: Right. And again, look, this isn't the boogeyman. This isn't like something in a movie where if we start getting cases of Coronavirus, everybody's going to start dropping dead, God forbid. But it's the unknown that's scaring.

And this piece about being so tough on the testing, it fuels a skepticism Ron, that it goes hand in hand with how the messaging is being handled by the White House, which is, you know, this wasn't like this with you guys in Ebola.

KLAIN: Yes.

CUOMO: Look, CDC had issues then too. You had to revise things, we were going up and down, and it seemed like there was a little bit of hype, and that's OK. It happens almost every time.

But I never heard that "Ron couldn't come out. It's only happening selectively. And all messaging has to be coordinated through the White House. And we all have to be on that," what's that about?

Why are they locking it down so tightly?

KLAIN: Yes. I'm - Chris, it's a great question. When we had the Ebola response, I didn't do press. We put Tony Fauci--

CUOMO: Right.

KLAIN: --who was the world's leading Infectious Disease Expert on television both to--

CUOMO: A lot.

KLAIN: A lot, right?

CUOMO: Yes.

KLAIN: Both to tell people what they needed to know and to show the American people that the experts were in charge. Here we have the exact opposite, right?

Tony Fauci kind of silenced by this. Anne Schuchat, this number two person at CDC, silenced. And I think that adds to the public suspicion and fear that we're not getting reliable information.

When you add to that that we have a President with a reputation for lying, and we're supposed to trust what he's saying about this, when we can't hear from the leading actual experts, that's a very bad combination.

CUOMO: Right. And look, I just want to put this up again, just in case you didn't grab it before.

It's not about cases for us, all right? We have 64. We're going to wind up having a lot more than that probably. So what, you know?

It's in - and the lethality of this, yes, right now, they think it's more than influenza. But they don't know how many cases that they've been dealing with that aren't just in the extreme, you know, cases that they're not hearing about where people got better.

So, we don't know that kind of reality. But the testing reality, we do know. Our number is this. If - Vaughn, put up the graphic if you have it.

CDC has only done 459 tests. Now, part of the reason is what they're saying. Their supply is no good. Some of the kits were flawed. They should have been on it sooner. They should have fixed it sooner. Fine! Fine! Fine!

But States could be doing it, and they're not. Look how many more cases have been confirmed through testing. So, that's why you don't see the U.K. dealing with it the way we are, in the media, with this fear of the unknown. I think that is really, really important.

Something else that's important, Ron, starting to see the people with the masks, even though you guys keep telling us, the mask is only effective if you have the virus, not if you don't want to catch it, you have to have a very special thing and all that. They're wearing them.

KLAIN: Yes.

CUOMO: You had said - you said something I haven't heard yet that I'm going to put under the category of "Good news" that you want to - you got to wash your hands, stay away from sick people, cough into your - your elbow, stay sick if you got a high fever - you know, stay home.

But there's something else you want people to do here that you think will make the country healthier on a whole.

KLAIN: Yes, look, I think we should do all those things you said, Chris. But we also should not practice prejudice. This virus attacks humans, not people of a particular race or ethnicity.

So, people should go shopping in Chinatown. They should go get a meal in Chinatown. Chinese-American-owned businesses are getting swamped by people who are afraid, who aren't - who aren't shopping there.

It's really hurting that community, needlessly. That's just prejudice. You're no more likely to get Coronavirus there than in Little Italy or any other part, any other neighborhood you go shopping, and - and whatnot.

So, we need to come together, as a country, to fight this disease. We don't need to spread prejudice, and really hurt one particular community.

CUOMO: And Zeke, even once the numbers start to go up, how well- equipped are we in this country to deal with it as a National Health System?

[21:10:00]

EMANUEL: Well our Health System is well equipped. The one thing I do worry about is we have less than a million hospital beds in this country.

If this thing really spreads, we have to have surge capacity because while we have a million hospital beds across the country, they're not evenly spread where all the population is, so we need surge capacity if it happens to hit some particular area hard.

And, you know, what really bothers me is there's no evidence that the Administration has planned--

KLAIN: Yes.

EMANUEL: --this out, has a plan for surge capacity so that all the other patients with all the other illnesses, whether it's cancer, or heart disease, or diabetes, can be traded - treated along with the people who have Coronavirus.

And similarly, we have to worry, you know, are we going to have enough personal protective equipment, that PPE--

KLAIN: Yes.

EMANUEL: --everything - everybody refers to.

Are we going to have enough drugs and the right kind of drugs since a huge number of the raw materials to make our drugs as well as a lot of generics come from China? At the moment, the FDA says there's no shortages. But that's at the moment, and this is not going away tomorrow.

As you point out, Chris, this is here for weeks and probably, you know, even on an optimistic level, months, at least two more months till we get warm weather. And we - again, that's an uncertainty and a prediction. We've got to prepare for that.

CUOMO: Right.

EMANUEL: And there's no evidence that that's what's happening--

KLAIN: Yes.

EMANUEL: --out of the Task Force at the White House.

CUOMO: Well, hopefully, the attention will create urgency and that will create action. And I know this. I will rely on you, Dr. Zeke Emanuel, and Ron Klain, on a regular basis, to help us give perspective to the information as it stands. Please, come back.

KLAIN: Thanks, Chris.

EMANUEL: Yes, thank you, Chris.

CUOMO: All right, little bit of perspective here for us, all right?

Imagine if I was forced to have to tell you, at some point, we've got hundreds of thousands of cases now, and I have to tell you there are people who are dying, and in fact there are a 100 dead children from this? Imagine the panic, right?

"I can't believe this happened." Wrong! Wrong response! Why?

That just happened in our country with the plain old flu. The CDC says we have hundreds of thousands of cases once again, and a 125 children so far this season, the highest number since reporting began in 2004, have been killed by it.

Did you know that influenza is one of the top 10 killers in this country? Top 10! Why no panic? Because it's not the unknown, because you know we have vaccines, we have ways to deal it, the system has a plan.

It is this fear of the unknown with Coronavirus, fueled in part, I have to say, by a President that most of you can't trust. That's what has people reeling, and I have more proof of that in our next segment, all right?

This has been a terrible week on Wall Street, the lowest number, you know, the biggest number drop in a decade. Dow lost 12 percent in five days. Why? Is this temporary or is it a sign of a bigger worldwide recession?

Top Economist, next.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TEXT: CUOMO PRIME TIME.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[21:15:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TEXT: LET'S GET AFTER IT.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: Worst week for the Dow since the 2008 financial crisis. Big question is why. Well Trump and Co. say it's the Democrats spreading false fear. His White House Economic Adviser, Larry Kudlow says "It's time to buy."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LARRY KUDLOW, DIRECTOR, U.S. NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: I'll say, so far, the numbers coming in on the economy have actually been quite good, including today.

You might think about buying the dip.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: Now, Kudlow keeps turning down invites to come on this show, and make his case to you. But Moody's Analytics' Chief Economist, Mark Zandi, is with me right now.

Now, Mark, thank you for being here. You do not believe this is just about people posturing in politics. What do you think is fueling what we're seeing?

MARK ZANDI, CHIEF ECONOMIST, MOODY'S ANALYTICS: I think the markets, investors are discounting the possibility of a global recession.

I think if - if the virus comes here in a significant way, you know, similar to what the CDC seems to be suggesting will happen, that the disruption to the economy will be so significant, so severe that we will suffer an economic downturn.

And that's, you know, what investors sense, that's what they feel, and that's why they're selling stocks. They - they see that global recession on the horizon.

CUOMO: Now, one step sideways into my natural skepticism about this.

You guys like volatility. You often trade on fear, and it gives you guys a chance to create action, in what is a very sophisticated form of bet-making that you make in the market. Isn't that part of this as well?

ZANDI: Who's - who's we? Are you talking about me? No, I mean-- CUOMO: Not - not you. You're at Moody's.

ZANDI: --I don't trade in the market. I'm an Economist.

CUOMO: But I'm saying--

ZANDI: Yes.

CUOMO: --people on Wall Street--

ZANDI: Yes.

CUOMO: --who do the trading. You can - except yourself, talk about the rest of them.

ZANDI: No. I don't - I don't think that's what this is about. I mean I think this is - you don't see a decline like we have seen over the past week by some traders trying to engage in mischief in the market. That's not what's happening here.

This is a broad-based reassessment of the risks that we face. And think about the timing, you know, you go back a week ago and, you know, markets were pretty sanguine about everything. Then we started to see cases show up in Italy. We started to seeing cases show up in Korea.

Then the CDC warned, and that - that was pretty explicit. I mean, the - the woman from the CDC got on - got on and said, "Look, I'm talking to the Superintendent of my kid's school."

CUOMO: Right.

ZANDI: So, when you hear that, investors globally say, "Hey, this is a - this is a big deal. And this is going to have a big impact." And - and then they can - they can connect the dots, right? Just go take a look at what's happening in China, and what happened to China.

CUOMO: Right.

ZANDI: If that happens anywhere else in the globe, we got a big problem. And that's--

CUOMO: But Apple and others--

ZANDI: --that's a recession. So no--

CUOMO: --Apple and others--

ZANDI: --this is - this isn't about mischief. This is real.

CUOMO: All right, I hear you. I hear you about it. But I'm saying that my skepticism is that I think people who trade in the market look for reasons for things to move. Sometimes, it's borne out. Sometimes, it isn't.

Look - look what we deal with the flu every year, all right? It is completely of a different magnitude of anything they expect to see here, never affects the markets.

[21:20:00]

They're saying that China seems to be coming back online. Apple said that this week. Do you believe them that's trying to protect their own stock price or do you think that maybe the worst fears are overstated about supply chains?

ZANDI: No. I mean China is trying to come back online. But this is going to be very difficult for them. One good indicator, just to give you a sense of it, is coal consumption.

So, Chinese utilities, electric utilities, and factories, use lots of coal. So, take a look at coal production that is a win - and that's real data. That's daily data. We know exactly what's going on.

Take a look at that. It is - it went straight down during the Lunar New Year, went flat, and has not recovered, and that's not indicative of a Chinese economy that's recovering quickly.

Now, they'll - they'll get back online, and they have used extreme efforts to get - get - to contain - contain the virus, and they may be having some success. So, they - this will pass, but it's done significant damage.

And - and in my view, and I think in most economists' view, the Chinese economy will actually contract in the first quarter. That - that's a negative number in an economy that generally grows about 6 percent.

So, if that's the kind of thing we're going to have to deal with here, that's going to be very, very disruptive. And, by the way, it's not just about, you know, the reality of things, about the perception of things, which you've been talking about.

I mean the American people are - are going to have a hard time with this. They're already having a hard time with us. And so, they're going to hunker down.

And - and, on top of that, if the stock market keeps sliding, you've got a lot of people who were invested very - boomers, like me in their 50s and 60s, are up to their eyeballs in the equity market because they haven't been able to get a return anywhere else. And so, they're focused, like a laser beam, on what's happening every day in the market. So, I don't think we can discount.

Now, maybe the virus doesn't turn out to be what the CDC says it's going to be. But if you're a prudent investor, if you're prudent businessperson, if you're prudent individual out there investing, you got to be thinking I got to prepare for this because that's what we're being told by the experts.

CUOMO: Got it. Mark Zandi, thank you very much, and thank you for indulging my skepticism. Be well. I'll talk to you soon.

All right, now-- ZANDI: Sure thing.

CUOMO: --another type of disease is dishonesty that we have in our politics, right, and that's almost impossible to beat.

"Only the best! Drain the swamp!" How can the President even say that to you with a straight face anymore? Just be honest, here's his rule, only those who think "He is the best," that's the rule.

That's why the President's trying to push Congressman Ratcliffe for DNI again, even though Republicans already voiced opposition to the pick last year over concerns about his qualifications, and by concerns, he didn't tell the truth about them.

One of Ratcliffe's colleagues in the House is going to make the case for him and be tested, next.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TEXT: CUOMO PRIME TIME.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[21:25:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TEXT: LET'S GET AFTER IT.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: House Intel Chairman Adam Schiff says "We now have an Intelligence Chief who should not have been fired, an unqualified nominee who should not be confirmed, and an Acting Director who is patently unfit, all while our elections are perilously at risk of foreign interference. Just the way the President likes it."

Tough criticism! Now, the DNI pick that he calls unqualified, that's Congressman John Ratcliffe, who lied about prosecuting terrorists. So, back in August, even Republicans had a problem with him, and his experience glitch.

Why put him up again? They say "A change in circumstance." Let's test what that change really means with Congressional colleague, Representative Lance Gooden.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CUOMO: Congressman, thank you for joining us.

First news item of the day, do you support the nomination of your colleague from Texas, Congressman Ratcliffe, to take on the lead position for the Intelligence Community?

REP. LANCE GOODEN (R-TX): Absolutely! I supported it last fall. I support it today.

I think it's a great decision. He actually lives just 20 miles from me. We are great friends. I think he's going to do - going to do a wonderful job for our nation, and I'm proud of the President's decision today.

CUOMO: His name was brought up before. It was basically withdrawn. There were reservations because he had grossly exaggerated his record when it comes to prosecuting terrorism. What has changed between now and then?

GOODEN: Well I think, since then, we've gone through an impeachment fight. And the President feels empowered and emboldened after winning that fight.

I think that Mr. Ratcliffe - Congressman Ratcliffe pulled his name down out of respect to the President. He didn't want it to be a distraction. I think the President was probably OK with moving forward for a fight, back in October. But, you know, Congressman Ratcliffe is one who wants to not be a distraction to the President.

Moving forward to now, I think the President is not really interested in some of these criticisms that continue to linger, perhaps unfairly. I think we are ready to move forward. Congressman Ratcliffe is going to do a great job, and I have full faith in him.

CUOMO: Well let's - let's unpack it for those who don't share your faith. I do think you're probably right the President does feel a new sense of freedom. He doesn't think that you guys will check him on anything, so he's going to take his own counsel.

And why wouldn't it bother you that the person who's going to be in charge of Intelligence and coordination had grossly exaggerated his own record, trying to make it seem like he has a background prosecuting terror cases, when he has basically none?

GOODEN: Well I'm not going to get into the back-and-forth about his record, and your opinion, and other opinions, Chris.

CUOMO: It's not an opinion.

GOODEN: It's my opinion.

CUOMO: It is a matter of fact.

GOODEN: I'm just going to say - I'm just--

CUOMO: He worked on one case.

GOODEN: --I'm just going to say that we're moving to this - moving forward to now. The President still has faith in him. I believe he had faith in him, back in October, before Mr. Ratcliffe pulled his name down.

And I think the President, if he'd had to do all over again would have probably said "Let's just move forward" at the time. I'm not speaking for the President. He hasn't expressed that.

[21:30:00]

But I think we're to the point now where nothing the President does is going to be good enough for Democrats, nothing, whether it's Coronavirus or this nomination, or anything else--

CUOMO: But that - well we'll get to Coronavirus in a second.

GOODEN: --is ever going to get a rubber stamp--

CUOMO: We'll get to - we'll get to Coronavirus. But--

GOODEN: --from Democrats in Congress.

CUOMO: --but let's not play the victim just yet, all right? What I'm saying is other than Mr. Ratcliffe's unflinching fealty during the impeachment process, why would it not bother you?

You say "I'm not going to get into the back-and-forth." There is no back-and-forth. He has zero experience in prosecuting terror, except for one case, where he was a side note, and he grossly exaggerated that.

It's not a back-and-forth. It's not a matter of opinion. It's a fact. Why doesn't it matter to you?

GOODEN: The qualifications of Mr. Ratcliffe, I think, are phenomenal. I think he's going to be a great Director. And I'm not going to argue with you about--

CUOMO: He has no experience in Intelligence or in dealing with terror.

GOODEN: --whether or not you think he's qualified or I think he's qualified.

CUOMO: But where is the--

GOODEN: I think he is. The President thinks he is.

CUOMO: --qualification?

GOODEN: I'm sure that will - I'm sure that will come out in the - on the Senate side during the approval process. But I think that the media is just, I guess that's you tonight, Chris. But I think that the media is--

CUOMO: But Lance, tell me, what am I saying that's wrong?

GOODEN: --is - is not going to be happy.

CUOMO: What am I saying that's wrong?

GOODEN: I mean, you're saying he's not qualified. I think he is.

CUOMO: No. No. I'm saying what are the qualifications? GOODEN: I - I'm I matter--

CUOMO: He exaggerated his record as a prosecutor to say he had terror experience. That's why he pulled his name down. Nothing has changed, except he did a beautiful job of defending the President during impeachment.

GOODEN: I think he has done a beautiful job of being a Member of the Intel Community. I think he's been a wonderful Member of Congress. I think he's going to be a great Director.

I think he's going to, as you say, do a beautiful job at his new position. And I think in months to come, after he's been in that role, his detractors will absolutely be singing his praises, just like--

CUOMO: His detractors include Republicans, by the way--

GOODEN: --I suspect you will. And - and the time--

CUOMO: --who say he's too partisan. And we sent Senator Burr to see what he would say. He had said some things that seem negative in the past. His staff walked away from them.

They just sent us a statement where he says nothing about Ratcliffe personally. He just says "I look forward to putting him through the process." It's not exactly a vote of confidence.

GOODEN: You know, if you have Senator Burr on your show, he may say something different than I'm saying. But I'm saying to you, you asked me how I feel about John Ratcliffe becoming the new Director.

I think it's a great move by the President. It has my full support. I'm not a Senator. I'm not going to be voting on confirmation. But I think--

CUOMO: Right.

GOODEN: --it's a great pick.

CUOMO: All right, let's talk about Coronavirus. The big cause for concern right now is, is the leadership good?

One quick point on that, and then I want to finish on testing, and what you know about us getting better with the testing, because this second case in California is, again, two cases. So, what? It's community spread. There's no reason for panic. But testing is, again, a factor.

Don't you think there should be focus on both sides of Congress and the White House, allow States to test who are competent to do it, get more testing out there to give people more confidence in the reality?

GOODEN: The answer is yes. And I have seen publications come out as recently as a few hours ago from groups like Bain Capital, who have said there could be 10,000 people with it right now.

CUOMO: Right.

GOODEN: And we won't know about it for another few weeks. So, absolutely I agree. There should be more testing. You and I may have it, and not even know it. So, we--

CUOMO: God forbid. But what I'm saying is--

GOODEN: Absolutely.

CUOMO: --that's the CDC, and they're saying--

GOODEN: Right.

CUOMO: --they're being kept very tight by the White House, in terms of what the criteria and protocols are. Why? Let people test.

GOODEN: I think you - well I think you'll see in this next week to come, there's already talk in Congress about passing a supplemental appropriations bill that's going to send more money, and more resources. I think seven days from now, if you and I have a conversation--

CUOMO: But the White House could do it today, Lance. They could call and say to California and New York, "Hey, you guys have your own protocols, go ahead and test."

GOODEN: My - my point is I think that's happening. I think that this is all--

CUOMO: It hasn't happened yet.

GOODEN: --every day is something new. I think this is happening though.

And I think that you're seeing the White House do a pretty good job, considering this is all new territory. This is very scary. But I'm pleased with the efforts so far. And I think we all need to be pulling together, and fighting this together, not playing politics.

CUOMO: I agree with you on that. And I'm telling you the testing is key. I know people think that if there are more cases, politically that looks bad. I'm telling you, it won't work like that, because you'll see people getting better.

And I'd rather know about 8,000 cases in California that aren't being monitored, that are actually active cases, and then see how many people go home in a week, 10 days.

GOODEN: Right.

CUOMO: People would be better for that. The White House can change it with a phone call. Hopefully, it happens. Lance Gooden, I appreciate you taking on the tough questions, as always.

GOODEN: Thank you.

CUOMO: Have a good weekend.

GOODEN: Thank you.

CUOMO: Stay healthy.

GOODEN: You too, take care, thank you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CUOMO: Hey, Republican admits there should be more testing. That's cause for hope. Now, when are they going to make that phone call to States, and let it happen? We'll see.

All right, we're on South Carolina watch, less than 24 hours from the big boat - from the big vote. It's huge for Biden and for Bernie. What about predictions about tomorrow through Super Tuesday? The Wizard of Odds, next.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TEXT: CUOMO PRIME TIME.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[21:35:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TEXT: LET'S GET AFTER IT.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: More new information about Coronavirus. A third case of the virus, community spread in America, all right?

Now, key point, this is a presumptive case. Why? State officials in Oregon, not California, say they found it. No known travel exposure for this individual is their quote. That's like the two other cases in California.

Now, these results need to be confirmed by the CDC. But it shows again, if the States can look, if they're freed up to do it, you'll know more sooner.

Let's turn to the 2020 race. Joe Biden could know by this time tomorrow whether he has a real path left for the nomination, all right?

If this South Carolina firewall withstands the heat of Bernie Sanders, he's going to have some time before Super Tuesday, or not. It's a question of debate between me and The Wizard of Odds.

Thanks for being here with us tonight, Wiz.

HARRY ENTEN, CNN POLITICS SENIOR WRITER & ANALYST: Thank you, Sir.

CUOMO: So, South Carolina, Nevada, what a difference we've seen?

ENTEN: Yes.

CUOMO: Why?

ENTEN: Yes, I mean, this is really shocking to me.

When I was on your program, earlier this week, you know, Joe Biden had a small little lead over Bernie Sanders. And if anything, you would have thought that lead would have shrunk, right, given the fact that Bernie won in Nevada by such a substantial margin.

[21:40:00]

But look at what happened. The lead has ballooned up to 16 percentage points. Tom Steyer all the way back at 14 percent. And so, to me, it'd be very, very surprising if Joe Biden does not come out with a win tomorrow.

Now, you asked why, right? You asked why.

CUOMO: Yes.

ENTEN: I think this gives you an indication of why. This left side here, look at the Black voters, the Black Democratic primary voters in South Carolina. In Nevada, it was just a 10-point margin for Biden over Sanders.

But look here, in the Monmouth University poll, he's up by over 30 points over Bernie Sanders, and Steyer all the way back at 17 as well, African-American voters powering Joe Biden in South Carolina.

CUOMO: Imagine if they were no him, what this might have looked like from Biden, and what the narrative might be. Now, why do we care? 2008.

ENTEN: Yes. Why do we care that he's going up so much? You know, 2008 top choices, you know, what we're really looking for here is whether or not Joe Biden will get a surge, coming out of South Carolina.

2008, what we saw in the national primary polls, before South Carolina, was that Clinton was leading by nine points nationally. Afterwards, look at this.

CUOMO: His win was a big boost.

ENTEN: It was a huge, huge boost.

CUOMO: I argue that there may not be enough time between tomorrow, and Tuesday, to make up for the difference of the momentum Bernie has, and others, and all the ad spending on Super Tuesday states that Biden is not doing.

ENTEN: Let me bring to you another example. 2012, on the Republican side, Newt Gingrich had the surprise victory in South Carolina.

CUOMO: Yes.

ENTEN: In the Florida polls, which was the next primary, what did we see? We saw Newt Gingrich basically gaining about 15 points overnight, and then that bounce basically receded, and Romney won the state by about 14 points.

I would actually argue that 72 hours is the perfect time period for a bounce to appear, especially when you don't have the campaign infrastructure that Joe Biden has in the Super Tuesday states.

CUOMO: Strong counterpoint, and we both agree, he needs it, because of this.

ENTEN: He absolutely needs it. These were polls put out by us earlier today. In California, 415 delegates, Texas, 228 delegates.

And in both of those states, in California especially, look at this large lead for Bernie Sanders, 35 percent, everyone else, under that 15 percent threshold, so important for delegates on the Democratic side.

And even in Texas, look at this, a 9-point lead. If Joe Biden gets a bounce, you might see in a state like Texas where that bounce could, in fact, perhaps help him close that gap with Sanders.

CUOMO: Truly one to watch. Wiz, thank you very much.

ENTEN: Shalom! Good Sabbaths everybody.

CUOMO: Big day tomorrow!

All right, Bernie Sanders, he doesn't just have a movement. He's got a Lethal Weapon helping his campaign. That's right, Actor Danny Glover. I got a smile. He's one of my favorites. But I'll be fair, I promise you that.

Why is he feeling the Bern? What does he think about Bernie's chances and a big question for him at the end, next.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TEXT: CUOMO PRIME TIME.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[21:45:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TEXT: CUOMO PRIME TIME.

(END VIDEO CLIP) (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROGER MURTAUGH, FICTIONAL MOVIE CHARACTER, "LETHAL WEAPON": Oh, Perfect.

Gun! Gun!

(MUSIC)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Rog, meet your new partner.

(MUSIC)

MURTAUGH: Oh, I'm too old for this (BEEP).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: A lot of us are feeling that way these days. Now look, I was a little sideways about using this clip because Danny Glover, obviously Roger Murtaugh there, I hear he's so much more than an actor.

He is certainly an artist who has a place in politics. He grew up in it. He's been active on social justice causes and political causes since he was young. He is backing Bernie Sanders since I think I believe April. He's working for him down in South Carolina and he is an effective advocate.

Danny Glover, thank you for joining us on PRIME TIME.

DANNY GLOVER, BERNIE SANDERS SUPPORTER, ACTOR/DIRECTOR/PRODUCER: You're welcome. Thank you very much, Chris.

CUOMO: So first, what's Bernie got that other Democrats don't have, in your opinion?

GLOVER: Well, he has authenticity, for one. He has a history. And that history has been one history of fighting on behalf of working people, fighting for justice.

And he has spoken out and - and whether he was Senator, whether he was a Mayor, whenever it was, whether he was a young student himself who was a part of the Civil Rights Movement, is the - and part of CORE in Chicago. So there's - there's history there, and it's consistent as well.

And the issues that Bernie brings to the attention, whether it's the cancellation of student debts, whether it's Medicare-for-All, all those things are things that really citizens are concerned about.

And we - we - it's not to take anything away from would - the Affordable Health Care, but certainly there are millions of Americans who are out without healthcare.

CUOMO: True.

GLOVER: And without adequate healthcare as well. CUOMO: So, the formidable Jim Clyburn says that the issues that Bernie cares about, so does Joe Biden, so does others, and they don't carry the risk of his radical ideas and rigidity that could cause problems for the Party. Here's how Clyburn put it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JAMES CLYBURN (D-SC): I talk to members on both sides of our political equation.

They were very, very concerned about whether or not we will do something - we'll have somebody on the ticket that will cause down- ballot carnage.

I've been in the Congress 28 years. It may not surprise you to know that 21 of those years were in the Minority and that ain't a good place to be.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: Why do you not share his concern?

GLOVER: Well, with all due respect to - to the Congressman and the work that he's done here in South Carolina, I certainly think that this is a moment, a transitional moment, and certainly the body politics.

The young people have come to the table. The - the fears that they have for the future, whether it's global warming and climate change, for the - the debt the massive debt that they have around the country, we're talking about 45 million citizens have, have debt, this overburdening of debt--

CUOMO: Absolutely.

GLOVER: --from just their students' loan. So, that's well in a sense.

[21:50:00]

And - and, certainly, what has happened is Bernie has furthered the conversation. He's deepened the conversation. And he's deepened the conversation. And - and with the deepening of that conversation, I think he's built a movement around this.

CUOMO: Well there's no question. And we can't sleep on a movement.

I argue, personally, I made that mistake in 2016. I underestimated how the President's lack of credentials and his vulgarity would disqualify him, when there were such a significant group of people that validated him.

Similarly here, with Bernie, while they're not similar stylistically at all, in my opinion, he's got the movement. But why can't he do this, Danny? Why can't he say, "My principle is Medicare-for-All."

But people, even in the Civil Rights Movements, obviously, they don't surrender their principles, but they changed positions to get things done.

"And it's not my way or the highway. I don't even know how many Democrats will have. I don't know what the state of play will be. I will try to get the best deal I can to move us as far in that direction as possible."

Why can't he say something like that instead of saying "It's all or nothing?"

GLOVER: Well I'm - I'm not familiar with that "All or nothing" scenario that you presented. But I think - I think the idea that we've changed the - the dialog, the discourse.

I mean this - this whole idea of Universal Healthcare is going on about 100 years in this - this country. Eleanor Roosevelt, the First Lady, at the end of World War II, proposed the idea of Universal Healthcare.

CUOMO: That's true, good one.

GLOVER: So, what we reached - and we've known that and struggled with that. You know, Unions, labor unions also fought on the - on the basis of Universal Healthcare.

And the fact that imagine what - what Universal - Universal Healthcare would have meant if you take healthcare out of the negotiation or - negotiation or collective bargaining that she would have had.

CUOMO: There's no question.

GLOVER: And so, what we - what we - OK, so here - here we are at this particular point in time. We - we know there's a serious issue with that, you know, among so many issues, you know. This is a discussion that is happening among the American people.

CUOMO: It is.

GLOVER: And whether you - whatever side you're on--

CUOMO: But the leaders have to figure out how to get it done, Danny. That's all I'm saying.

GLOVER: That's - that's - that--

CUOMO: Is if he seemed a little bit more malleable, he may get farther. That's all I'm saying.

You're right about the conversation. You're right that he's advanced it. And it's just about whether he can convince moderates that he would work with them. And that's why I'm referring to the "All or nothing" attitude.

Before I let you go, I had you here because you are - you deserve it as an advocate. I know what you're doing in South Carolina. I know what it means to Bernie's campaign.

But I'm also a fan. I hear there's going to be a Lethal Weapon 5.

GLOVER: Thank you.

CUOMO: Will you confirm and will you make my day by telling me that I will get to see you in it?

GLOVER: I can't confirm. You know that.

CUOMO: You must confirm.

GLOVER: We only that once - I must confirm, OK. There will be for you, only you.

CUOMO: Thank you.

GLOVER: There will be a Lethal Weapon 5.

CUOMO: And will I get to see my favorite part of it, Danny Glover?

GLOVER: Of course.

CUOMO: Oh, now we're talking.

GLOVER: Absolutely.

CUOMO: Thank you for sending this week off on a good note.

GLOVER: Absolutely.

CUOMO: Danny Glover, I respect your opinions. I wish you good luck with your candidacy with - with Bernie Sanders.

Good luck with your advocacy, and thank you for giving us something to smile about as an artist. You've given us so much meaning through the years, and I appreciate it as one of your fans.

GLOVER: All right, thank you.

CUOMO: Wow!

GLOVER: You're welcome.

CUOMO: Thank you, Danny Glover.

GLOVER: Bye.

CUOMO: Finally some good news, Lethal Weapon 5, and he'll be in it. I didn't even ask about Mel Gibson. That's how big a fan I am.

All right, so back to the news, the President's son-in-law spoke at CPAC today. He gave an eye-popping prediction for a second term. You know what? I'm not big on going after the President's family. I get why they defend him the way they do.

But Mulvaney! But Kushner! Wait until you hear what they said. What a BOLO. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TEXT: CUOMO PRIME TIME.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[21:55:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TEXT: LET'S GET AFTER IT.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: BOLO. Be On the Look-Out.

The President's son-in-law and Senior Adviser, Jared Kushner, is making quite the promise if Trump gets a second term.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JARED KUSHNER, WHITE HOUSE SENIOR ADVISER: The way that you're seeing the campaign being run, again, there's no leaks. There's no drama. I would say it's high-competence, low-drama. Everything is very efficiently run, and I think that that's exemplary of how President Trump would run his second term in Office.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: I wanted him to freeze it on his face. How with a straight face? How? How?

Like when the President claimed to be the most transparent President in history, to drain the swamp, only the best, to get things done and deals made, how does he say this with a straight face?

Be On the Look-Out to see if anything in the run up to the election proves Mr. Kushner right on any level.

Thank you very much for watching. CNN TONIGHT with the man known as D. Lemon starts right now.

DON LEMON, CNN HOST, CNN TONIGHT WITH DON LEMON: Know what? What was it? Opposite day at the--

CUOMO: No.

LEMON: --CPAC?

CUOMO: I mean, you know, look, you go to CPAC to preach to the converted. We get it.

LEMON: Yes. CUOMO: But no drama, things run in exemplary fashion? Is he not looking what is going on right now? We're not even testing for the damn virus in this country the way South Korea is.

LEMON: Was this--

CUOMO: I mean, come on.

LEMON: Was this the Obama Administration? He was "No Drama Obama" but.

CUOMO: "No Drama Obama" until he wore that suit. Whoo!

LEMON: He wore that - oh that's!

CUOMO: Still happy to cover it.

LEMON: I forgot. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I forgot.

CUOMO: I wear the same thing every day just because I'm so worried of getting that kind of criticism.

LEMON: I forgot - I forgot about the tan suit.

CUOMO: Career-ending.

LEMON: I'm sorry. I apologize.

CUOMO: Yes. Me neither. The guy that made a mockery of the Presidency. We still haven't recovered.

LEMON: Jeez! Sorry, man! Yes. There have been--

CUOMO: No drama!

LEMON: No drama! No drama and we say no leaks and no chaos?

CUOMO: And a straight face. I will never play poker with Kushner.