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Trump Considers Easing Social Distancing Guidelines; U.K. Order: "Stay Home"; Life-Saving Efforts in Italy. Aired 4-4:30a ET

Aired March 24, 2020 - 04:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[04:00:19]

ROSEMARY CHURCH, CNN ANCHOR: Hello and welcome to our viewers joining us here in the United States and, of course, all around the world. You are watching CNN NEWSROOM. And I'm Rosemary Church.

Just ahead, President Trump says the coronavirus will get worse in the U.S., so why is he itching to ease restrictions meant to curb the spread?

The U.K. clamps down, issuing a stay at home order, its most stringent restriction in modern times.

And we are live in Italy with a doctor on the front lines risking his life to save the most vulnerable.

(MUSIC)

CHURCH: Good to have you with us. Staying at home could save your life. That is the message from leaders all around the world, as the number of coronavirus cases soars past 334,000 with 14,000 deaths globally.

Now, in the United States, cases rose by at least 100 on Monday, the biggest jump yet, bringing the total to at least 42,000 cases. Right now, there have been 541 deaths in the United States, a significant spike over the last week.

And New York is by far the hardest hit state with nearly 21,000 cases and 157 deaths. It is one of 16 U.S. states that have issued stay at home orders. That's about 43 percent of the country's population.

But with the Dow dropping again, jobs in jeopardy, and lawmakers still debating a stimulus package, President Trump is appearing to put the economy before public health. He wants Americans to get back to work as soon as possible so the U.S. economy can recover, even if it means going against the advice of his own health experts.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: America will again and soon be open for business very soon. A lot sooner than three or four months that somebody was suggesting. A lot sooner. We cannot let the cure be worse than the problem itself.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CHURCH: His words very different from those of other world leaders who are putting the health and safety of the people first.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BORIS JOHNSON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: The time has now come for us all to do more. From this evening, I must give the British people a very simple instruction, you must stay at home.

JUSTIN TRUDEAU, CANADIAN PRIME MINISTER: We have all seen the pictures online of people who seem to think they're invincible. Well, you're not. Enough is enough. Go home and stay home.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CHURCH: And here in the United States, there appears to be a growing divide between President Trump and America's top health experts on how to manage the coronavirus crisis.

Our Kaitlan Collins has more now from the White House.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, President Trump has been weighing this idea of easing those federal guidelines that he and his administration put out just a week ago. They've got one more week left before the administration said they were going to reassess where they are.

And we're told by sources that the president is heavily weighing easing the restrictions. And the president seemed to confirm that in this briefing, arguing that he believes it's going to be a matter of weeks not months before a lot of businesses that have closed their doors will reopen.

Now, these are guidelines put out by the White House that had some of the strict measures that we've seen so far, telling people not to gather in groups of 10 or more. But now, the president says that that might be changing his mind. He says he wants the economy to be able to reopen. He says he doesn't want the government to be shutdown.

But, of course, this comes as health experts have said it just simply isn't enough time to be able to properly evaluate whether or not those two weeks did enough to flatten the curve, and the president seemed to hint that his own doctors aren't on the same page with him after he was asked, you know, do those doctors endorse this idea of potentially easing these guidelines just a week from now. The president said, no, they did not endorse it. He said that they have spoken about it. He said he thinks they're OK with it. But the president said if it was up to the doctors, they would shut down the entire world.

Clearly on two different pages there as the president has been fielding this internal divide between the economic focused advisers on his coronavirus task force team and the ones of course who are the health officials, the doctors and the scientists who said it's just simply not enough time to know if they've been able to effectively flatten the curve.

[04:05:00]

They've got about one week left on those. The question is going to be what the president himself decides as he's got about a week to look at the data that's coming in. And we know his surgeon general is only warning that the numbers are going to get worse before they get better. But when asked if he would commit to follow the advice that the doctors give him about what steps he should take, the president only said he'd be listening to them and others as well.

Kaitlan Collins, CNN, the White House.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHURCH: Joining me now is Dr. Anne Rimoin. She teaches at UCLA's epidemiology department.

Thank you so much for being with us.

DR. ANNE RIMOIN, PROFESSOR, DEPARTMENT OF EPIDEMIOLOGY, UCLA Pleasure.

CHURCH: Well, as the WHO launched its trial testing existing drugs to compare treatments, President Trump was touting the benefits of the anti-malarial drugs at his daily briefing. He talked about one man's whose life was saved, but some people have actually died as a result of using these drugs. How much hope do you think these anti-malarial drugs offer, and do you support their use starting Tuesday apparently?

RIMOIN: It's -- you know, it's an interesting situation, because we have never been collectively so concerned about having drugs in place and needing them in such an urgent time. Now, these drugs that we're talking about, a specific top of chloroquine, are drugs that have been around since the '40s, you know, known to be fairly safe and tolerable in standard doses. But they have never been used in this capacity. And there's very little data to suggest that they actually work.

You know, we -- we worry about any kind of mass distribution of drugs even in an emergency use setting when there's not enough data on the safety and efficacy for this particular indication.

CHURCH: Right.

RIMOIN: So I think that the idea of giving this to so many people in such a short period of time without any understanding of the true side effects or the effectiveness of it is not well-founded.

CHURCH: Right. And President Trump also said at his briefing that he wants to open up the United States in a matter of weeks, not months, despite the rising number of coronavirus cases, because he says we're not going to let the cure be worse than the problem.

What's your response to that?

RIMOIN: I think it's not very well grounded in science or what we have seen from any other country, that we have to be learning from the global experience. We're not different biologically than people in any other place in the world.

The countries that have been able to go through this quickly and be able to have less stringent lockdowns are countries that have personal protective equipment, that have massive capacity for testing and contract tracing. They are unprecedented in capacity and cooperation between all sectors, social, political, economic. And they have real national strategy and leadership along with many more hospital beds and hospital capacity to manage the number of patients coming in.

In the United States right now, we do not have those things in order. And as a result, it just doesn't make any sense that within two weeks, we'll be able to start opening things up.

CHURCH: The bigger part of this story, as you mentioned, the availability of ventilators and personal protective gear. Why do you think President Trump seems reluctant at this time to implement his power under the Defense Production Act? He's there, he hasn't implemented it, but he has the authority to do this now, to get companies to make more masks and ventilators, many of them so people don't die and doctors and nurses aren't putting their own lives at risk. How important is it that he does this sooner rather than later? What is he waiting for, do you think?

RIMOIN: I don't know. But I will say it is critical that we have maximum capacity to be able to handle PPE or to have enough PPE and to have enough ventilators, and all of the associated supplies and equipment that are required to be treating the number of cases that we're anticipating here. It is -- it is not -- it's not possible to be able to manage without the PPE that we need. And many, many people are going to die.

And people are going to have to start making decisions about triage and who will get a ventilator and who won't if they don't start coming into production. So, as far as I'm concerned, the sooner this happens, the better. We're already late. It is time to get moving.

CHURCH: Dr. Anne Rimoin, thank you so much for talking with us. And, again, we salute you, we salute all of your colleagues for all of those out on the front line waiting for more equipment.

[04:10:05]

We just find this ordinary. But thank you so much for speaking with us. Appreciate it.

RIMOIN: My pleasure.

CHURCH: Now, as we just mentioned, the U.K. is finally banning people from leaving their homes, except for essentials. The British Prime minister ordered the restrictions, calling the virus the biggest threat the country has faced in decades. And he added that if the virus is not contained, the health service could not be able to cope -- would not be able to cope.

So, Anna Stewart joins me now from London with more on all of this.

Good to see you, Anna.

And as we -- as we heard British Prime Minister Boris Johnson, he issued this sweeping stay at home order. What did he say and how does he plan to enforce this?

ANNA STEWART, CNN REPORTER: I think on the enforcement side, it's going to be very interesting, many of the measures he's announced are similar to the likes of Spain, Italy, Germany, France, other European countries which are being slightly overwhelmed, of course, by the spread of this pandemic. However, in the U.K., the enforcement doesn't appear at this stage to be too strict. Police can break up gatherings outside of more than two people.

They can also issue fines. Media reports say they could start at 30 pounds. It could be quite low.

Brits are being told to carry forms of identification, and forms from the government website to prove why they're heading outside. So, that means that it's not quite as strict as other countries. Now, it could get stricter. So, we could see the civil contingencies act that would allow much more draconian powers. I think at this stage, what the deposit wants to see is the public heeding the latest not advice, the latest command really that they must stay at home unless absolutely they have essential work.

They are allowed one trip outside in order to get exercise. They are allowed to buy things from shops if it is essential and they're allowed to help people. But we need to see that happening, otherwise it will be ramped up. Currently, it's a three-week window where they will review it and see whether or not they can enact these measures -- Rosemary.

CHURCH: (AUDIO GAP) Stewart joining us from London, many thanks to you.

Well, major news out of China's Hubei province, the region where this all began, it has announced travel restrictions for most of the region will be lifted on Wednesday. The world's first coronavirus case was reported from Hubei province three months ago.

CNN's Steven Jiang joins us now live from Beijing.

Good to see you, Steven.

This is, of course, very encouraging news, but how reliable is this and how sure is China that another wave of the virus won't return?

STEVEN JIANG, CNN SENIOR PRODUCER: Well, Rosemary, that's why this is such a delicate balance for the authorities to strike between continuing rigorous containment efforts but also getting the economic engine revved up again. Now, remember, before they announced this news, they actually recorded a new locally transmitted case in Wuhan after five days of zero local cases. So, this is very much a dynamic situation. But still, this

announcement marks a major step towards the lifting of the harsh lockdown measures place on Wuhan and its surrounding province since late January, really trapping many residents in their homes for over two months, wreaking havoc on their lives and livelihood. So, according to this latest announcement, starting on Wednesday, with the exception that Wuhan, the provincial capital, all people deemed healthy by the government as reflected in a green QR code on their mobile phones will be allowed to leave the province.

Now, residents of Wuhan will have to wait longer. Their freedom, if you will, will come on the 8th of April. That's the day when they will be allowed to leave the city and province if they have the all- important green QR code on their phones. So, already, you are seeing city officials preparing for this prospect by removing road blocks, check points, they're also deep cleaning, and disinfecting subway trains and stations, as well as resuming limited bus services -- Rosemary.

CHURCH: Let's hope this is the beginning of the end this coronavirus. We'll keep a very close eye on this.

Steven Jiang joining us with the latest from Beijing -- many thanks.

And negotiations over a massive stimulus package stalled again in the U.S. Senate, but Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin and Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer say they are optimistic about making a deal on Tuesday. And that sign of hope felt in the Asian markets, a positive day across the board. Of course, a lot of injection from the government's injection of funds into those markets. And Dow futures also looking bright for Tuesday.

So, let's bring in CNN business emerging markets editor John Defterios who joins us from Abu Dhabi.

Good to see you, John.

Those numbers look pretty encouraging.

[04:15:00]

But, of course, despite the rally, does a deeper recession seem inevitable here?

JOHN DEFTERIOS, CNN BUSINESS EMERGING MARKETS EDITOR: Well, it's interesting, Rosemary, because we have this relief rally because of the package that is being put forward to Congress. They're arguing over the final details, but we know that it's going to be some $2 trillion and we know that the U.S. Federal Reserve put forward a very strong case here and even reaching out to Main Street saying we will provide no limit to support your efforts here.

You asked about the recession. The IMF managing director, Kristalina Georgieva, was suggesting we will be matching what we saw in 2009 and 2010 or perhaps even worse because of this coronavirus and the impact it will have on jobs and the wider economy. It's not just a banking crisis like we saw 10 years ago.

And she singled out some of the developing markets which I thought was very interesting suggesting, look, they are short of money to deal with the medical challenge. They are facing a higher dollar, which is squeezing them on the debt side. They don't have the ability to provide the fiscal stimulus you see in the United States, European Union and Japan right now.

And should talk about some of the bigger economies around the world, we call the big five if you want to take a look. India, Indonesia, countries like Brazil, Nigeria, these Philippines, this total 2 billion people. So, you can see, Rosemary, it's not on our radar right now globally, but it should be because they are starting to deal with the coronavirus challenge, and that's just around the corner financially for them.

CHURCH: Right. U.S. markets, of course, opening in just a few hours from now. We will see what happens. John Defterios, joining us live from Abu Dhabi, many thanks.

And still to come op CNN, we will talk to a doctor at the center of the coronavirus response in Italy where the number of cases has been rising rapidly.

Back in just a moment.

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[04:20:44]

CHURCH: Welcome back, everyone.

I want to turn to Italy now, and a small sign of hope in the country hit hardest by the coronavirus. In just the past day, there were 601 deaths, which is a staggering number, of course. But that reflects a slight drop in the number killed for the second day in a row.

So far, Italy has reported more than 6,000 coronavirus deaths.

And CNN's Delia Gallagher joins us now live from Rome.

Good to see you, Delia.

So the numbers are still shocking, it has to be said. But we are seeing a new trend that is perhaps giving Italy some hope right now. Talk to us about that.

DELIA GALLAGHER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's right, Rosemary. Of course, we are still very much in the heart of this crisis with very high numbers. But what has happened in the past two days is that we have seen a slight decline in the number of total cases and in the number of deaths. Officials are saying they are cautiously optimistic about this.

But of course it is not time for Italy to let its guard down. We are at the two-week mark, Rosemary. This is when they wanted to see the numbers go down. They hope obviously that trend will continue. The health assessor in Lombardi which is the region that's been hardest hit said the slight decline has helped to boost morale on the ground. So that is important.

They are obviously policing very much all around the country. There have been drones flying over the beaches here in Rome to make sure that people understand the importance of still staying inside, helping to contain this virus. Also for the rest of the country. And international help has arrived from Cuba, and Russia. Doctors and equipment and the U.S. Department of Defense said Italy requested help from the United States in the form of masks and ventilators, also allowing U.S. military personnel to help out in field hospitals -- Rosemary.

CHURCH: Yes, this is -- it's nice to see a little bit of hope coming out of Italy.

Delia Gallagher joining us live from Rome, many thanks to you.

And at least 23 doctors have died in Italy since the pandemic began, most in the Lombardi region. That is according to the Italian Federation of Doctors. Not all of them died of the virus. But the federation attributes the deaths to the health emergency.

In all, nearly 5,000 Italian health workers have been infected by the coronavirus.

And Dr. Lorenzo Menicanti is the head of cardiac surgery at the IRCCS Policlinico San Donato and he joins me live from Milan in Italy.

Thank you, Doctor, for talking with us.

DR. LORENZO A. MENICANTI, HEAD OF CARDIAC SURGERY DEPARTMENT, IRCCS POLICLINICO SAN DONATO: Thank you very much indeed. Thank you.

CHURCH: So, many countries have been watching the experience offering that it could offer a vision into their own future. What has been the biggest challenge for you and your colleagues as you fight this virus?

MENICANTI: Well, the first big challenge is to change completely the hospital. That was really tough for us because this hospital was mainly devoted to cardiovascular medicine. We're the first program for cardiac surgery in our country. But because of the virus, we stopped all activity. And now, we send patient to (INAUDIBLE) before that, but, of course, we need to help our system. So we change completely the hospital.

Now, we have 250 COVID patients. We have 28 patients ventilated in our ICU. And this probably for our point of view is the worst things to face.

The second thing, of course, is the limitation of our freedom to move. And this is very, very difficult thing to accept.

CHURCH: Right. MENICANTI: But it is absolutely necessary. Italy is a very, very

small country, but the idea that we cannot travel from Milan to Rome is absolutely unbelievable. But --

[04:25:05]

CHURCH: Yes. Understood. I do want to ask you, Doctor, why you think it was so bad in the north, so much worse in the north of Italy compared to the south and of course other parts of Europe?

MENICANTI: Yes. You are right. There was an issue started to understand. I think the first question, the first possibility of this part of Italy is very industrial, and we have a lot of straight connection with China, and particularly around Bergamo, there are the industry that are straightly connected with China. So, the trip before the rules were imposed to our country, the trip between Italy and China were very, very frequent. This can be one possibility.

The other possibility is that, you know, that region is flat and the pollution is relative high. And this can play a role or so.

CHURCH: Right.

MENICANTI: The third thing is that this zone, this part of Italy, a very old population. You know, Italy is one of the oldest population in the world, fortunately, and this is the reason. In that part of Italy, there is a lot of very old people. And, of course, in the beginning that was the part of the population that was hit by virus.

So, the three components I think, they performed in very bad way against our health, and we have so high numbers of death and people that are affected.

CHURCH: Yes, it has been shocking for the rest of the world to watch what you have had to deal with there in Italy, particularly in the north. But you're seeing a slight improvement when it comes to the number of infections and the number of people dying. That at least is signaling possibly that this lockdown was working for you.

Dr. Lorenzo Menicanti, thank you so much for joining us. We do appreciate it.

MENICANTI: Thank you very much. Have a good day.

CHURCH: You, too.

Well, the U.S. president hopes a drug used to treat malaria can also help with the coronavirus. But just how effective is it? We will tell you what experts are saying.

Back in just a moment.

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