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U.S. Leads World in Confirmed Coronavirus Cases; Surgeon Generals Says New Orleans a Coronavirus Hotspot; Interview with Mayor Carlos Gimenez (R-FL) about Stay-at-Home Order; British Prime Minister Boris Johnson Tests Positive for Coronavirus; Trump to Unveil Distancing Guidelines Based on County Risk. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired March 27, 2020 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:56]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Good Friday morning to you. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington. Let's get right to the news.

The United States now has more reported cases of coronavirus than any other country in the world. The death toll here in the U.S. now at nearly 1200 and as medical experts say we are still in the early days of this fight. The president is digging in on his hopes to reopen the country or parts of it in just weeks. Dr. Anthony Fauci has called President Trump's Easter target date a, quote, "aspirational projection" to give people some hope.

But it is not just hope that people are looking for right now. States need supplies. On the front lines in New York City, and in new hot spots now emerging across the country. 24 states are seeing more than 100 new cases in just a single day yesterday. We're seeing tension build between the president and governors over their need for critical supplies. The president even casting doubt on the needs for tens of thousands of ventilators.

Also, breaking this morning, more proof that the virus can strike anyone, the U.K. prime minister Boris Johnson has tested positive for coronavirus.

Covering this story as only CNN can, all over the world and here in the U.S., we're going to go to those hotspots as they emerge around the country. Let's begin, though, with CNN national correspondent Brynn Gingras in New York where the cases remain the most numerous.

Tell us the update today.

BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. That's right, Jim. Here in New York City alone there have been 281 deaths ever since this outbreak started. This is the center of the epicenter where we are right now, outside Elmhurst Hospital. Here alone just within the last 24 hours, there were four deaths, an improvement from the day before, which was 13 deaths, but still we never like hearing those numbers.

Let me get out of the way so you can see this line, which we've been showing to you every single day of this week and it still looks the same. Sometimes it's longer, but quite honestly it's never shorter. It's people trying to, again, see a doctor.

This hospital alone as I said, they have four deaths within the last 24 hours. Health officials tell us those are all because of ventilators. Those patients were on ventilators and those deaths were associated to that. They have received four shipments of ventilators just within the last 10 days, replenishing those ventilators. I mean, that's what the state has been saying. We need ventilators. The state even approved splitting ventilator for patients just to keep up with this demand.

And listen, they're adding other supplies as well all across this city. We know about four new field hospitals that are happening in the state. And we also know that that U.S. naval ship Comfort is on its way here and it should arrive on Monday -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: As you say, they're the center of the epicenter. The New York Police Department says now that 10 percent of uniformed officers, they have called out sick during this week. And clearly first responders, they're on the front lines. They're in contact with people who need help here. How is that impacting their jobs of keeping the city safe and responding to this?

GINGRAS: Yes, I mean, I've been talking to officers all along and, you know, even just having the communication which officers have to have face to face in order to do their jobs, they're being told to possibly do some interviews over the phone, they're being told to wear masks. But, yes, their workforce has definitely been impacted and in fact the NYPD saw its first death, a custodian who was in charge of really making sure the headquarters of One Police Plaza were taken care of. He passed away from coronavirus. His name is Dennis Dixon.

We want to, of course, put names to these faces. But the NYPD not only seeing all these sick calls, but also seeing its first death as well.

SCIUTTO: Goodness. That is indeed sad news. Brynn Gingras, thank you very much.

Well, if you think this is just a New York problem, it is not. Let's go to New Orleans, where the U.S. surgeon general is now calling the city a coronavirus hotspot. CNN's Ed Lavandera is there.

Ed, tell us about the situation there on the ground because I've been speaking to officials there, and they describe how the rate of growth in Louisiana faster than really anywhere in the state, even compared to other places in the world.

[09:05:12]

ED LAVANDERA, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That is the troubling thing we've seen here, Jim, as you noticed over the last few days, cases, the number of new cases has been growing over the last few days here in New Orleans and that is causing officials here in New Orleans and across the state in Louisiana to really sound the alarm.

The governor says that there is a question of medical supplies and ventilators and hospital bed space. And all of this stuff could start running out by early April. And to do that, imagine here at the convention center in New Orleans, there is a plan in place to start setting up hospital beds. And many -- perhaps as many as more than a thousand beds inside that convention center, which is quite eerie if you think about what it was like at that convention center 15 years ago.

That was one of the scenes of the most dramatic scenes in the days after Hurricane Katrina, so much despair there. And now 15 years later, essentially the process beginning here in New Orleans to turn that into a hospital for coronavirus patients. But there is an eerie sense across the city, we walk through the French Quarter, the famed French Quarter district yesterday, eerily quiet throughout there, as many people beginning to take this seriously here in the state -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: Yes. And the death rate of those cases in New Orleans specifically higher than elsewhere in the country. Certainly a statistic I know that officials there are watching.

Ed Lavandera, thanks very much.

Let's go to Florida now. Again, this is not just a one-city or a one- state problem, we're seeing it around the country. Florida, cases surging. The highest number in Miami-Dade County. The city of Miami has now enacted a curfew starting tonight while the Miami-Dade County mayor has ordered public gatherings to be limited to no more than 10 people.

The Miami-Dade mayor, Carlos Gimenez, joins me now.

Mayor, thanks so much for taking the time. We know you got a lot on your plate here. So we appreciate you, you know, getting the word out with us. First question, Miami-Dade has issued these restrictions, stay-at-home order, et cetera. The state has not. Governor DeSantis has not gone there. Do local stay-at-home orders work or do you need broader state wide restrictions?

MAYOR CARLOS GIMENEZ (R-FL): Well, there are differences throughout the state. I mean, we are the hotspot down here in southeast Florida. It's us, Broward and Palm Beach that have, you know, the bulk of the cases. And so there are some counties that don't have any cases in Florida. And so the governor is very supportive of the measures that we're taking down here.

We actually call measure safer at home. We allow our folks to do the things, the necessities that they need to do. And then we urge them to stay at home if they're not. The city of Miami has imposed a curfew on the city. The city is about 34 square miles of 2,000 square mile area, which is Miami-Dade County.

And -- but overall Miami-Dade has not put a curfew because our police chief said that it's not necessary, the streets are quiet. There's really no place to go because we shut down all nonessential businesses. There is no gathering places that people can go to. And then we've also put laws that said no more than 10 people can gather in any one place and also you have to remain at least six feet apart. And we're enforcing those laws. We're going into -- SCIUTTO: OK.

GIMENEZ: -- different stores et cetera, and saying, hey, you got to keep part, if not, we're going to shut you down. And so what's going on down then.

SCIUTTO: OK. I'm just curious how that distinction plays out in reality. Of course there is no wall around Miami-Dade County or the city of Miami. How do you keep people from moving outside of the city to other areas of the country that haven't been impacted because one thing that this virus has proven all over the world is that it does not know borders, whether they're borders of countries, towns, cities, states.

GIMENEZ: You're talking about coming from the city of Miami, Miami- Dade County and Dade County into the city of Miami, after 10:00, there's a curfew in the city of Miami at 10:00. Miami Beach has a curfew, too. And a couple of other cities --

SCIUTTO: But during the day. People are driving back and forth I assume during the day. They're going back and forth. They're visiting people, visiting family. I mean, I'm just curious how you control the spread if folks are moving around.

GIMENEZ: The folks -- every city, they're pretty uniform here. There is no lockdown here. There is no city that says stay at home. They may call it an order, but it's not. It really says it's an urging because people have to do the things they have to do. They have to get their groceries, they have to go get pharmacy. They got to go to a doctor, et cetera. So those essential services are open and people are free to go and partake of those essential services.

I mean, government can't feed everybody here, so they have to -- people have to take care of themselves. When they do go out, everybody has to stay six feet apart and then there are measures that we've taken to make sure that those things are happening. And then at night, certain cities have curfews. But in reality, it's only interconnected. It's going to be very difficult for one city to really enforce a curfew when in fact, you know, all the cities here is interconnected.

[09:10:05]

And people really don't know what the boundaries are here. And so it's all one big community and, you know, greater Miami, which is about, again, 2,000 square miles, 200 of which happen to be inhabited and the city is about 34 square miles of that.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Yes.

GIMENEZ: And so, you know, we're trying to get everything, you know, together, but cities do have the right to do certain things on their own, although as county mayor, my orders are for the entire county. Cities can go a little stricter if they so desire. But they can't go any less lenient than what I've already ordered around the county.

SCIUTTO: Understood. Well, Mayor, we wish you, we wish the people living there in Miami-Dade the best of luck as we go forward in these next couple of weeks.

GIMENEZ: Thank you. Thank you very much.

SCIUTTO: Let's talk about all this -- to you as well -- with an infectious disease expert. Joining me now, Dr. Michael Osterholm. He's director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy at the University of Minnesota.

And, Doctor, I've been looking forward to speaking to you. I saw an interview you gave a short time ago on Joe Rogan, just talking about what the data shows you, not just data from other countries, but just what we know about this disease, this virus rather, and how it spreads.

You described the U.S. being at just the beginning here. And you described models that show that over time perhaps as there have been multiple waves of this that many millions of Americans could be infected. Based on the data you're seeing so far in this country, do you still believe that to be the case, that that's what the kind of extensive spread that the country needs to prepare for?

DR. MICHAEL OSTERHOLM, DIRECTOR OF THE CENTER FOR INFECTIOUS DISEASE RESEARCH AND POLICY, UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA: Well, thank you very much for having me today, Jim. First of all, that interview I did with Joe Rogan was actually several weeks ago. So I can actually talk about what I said then and what is actually happening now. Just to put perspective on this, we knew in January that this was going to be a worldwide pandemic. Our center put out a statement on January 20th saying that it would be.

The first week of February we've said it would take about a month before cases started showing up around the world because it would just take that long for this transmission to occur. And then we actually said once it started in countries like the United States, it would first start in the larger cities, where there was people coming from international sources, there were just the density of population, but that over time, just like seasonal influenza, this was spread out across all the counties in the country.

And I think it's right on mark right now to do that. We have estimated anywhere from 20 percent to 60 percent of the population over the course of the coming months will get infected and I see nothing that's going to change that.

SCIUTTO: Twenty percent to 60 percent. I want to show a graph that shows the progress of the spread here in the U.S. particularly as it compares to two other countries that have been hardest hit, that of course being China and Italy. I'll put that up on the screen there, for our viewers to see. And I know you're at a disadvantage, Doctor. But what we see here is that the -- the angle of the growth of U.S. infection rates is sharper than Italy or China.

Is that the data you're seeing? In other words, infections are increasing more rapidly here, even in Italy and China. Is that what you're seeing and why? OSTERHOLM: Well, first of all, let's just be clear that these numbers

in large part are just the people who get tested that are found to have it in anyone who had a problem with testing like we have are only reflecting a small number of the actual true cases that are there. Second of all, though, what happened in China was really the focus on Wuhan, one major metropolitan area that they were able to then wall that off from the rest of China.

The same thing is true in Italy. We keep talking about Italy. But really it's the Lombardy region, the northern part of Italy only that's involved. What we're seeing here in the United States is pretty much an entire United States involved, East Coast, West Coast, the south, we're now seeing it in the Midwest, Detroit, and Chicago, are beginning to see major activity. We expect to see it here in Minneapolis. So part of one of the reasons why we're showing the numbers we are is we have so many places all at once that are becoming a problem.

And this is why also from a supply standpoint we're in trouble. We're all going to need these ventilators all at the same time. We're going to need the protective equipment for employees all at the same time and we're just not going to have it.

SCIUTTO: The president, as you know, he was talking yesterday about designating high and low risk zones here, and he's still sticking to the hope, the aspiration as Dr. Fauci calls it, of relaxing some of these restrictions by Easter in just a couple of weeks' time. Based on the data and what you know how these things spread, can you do that? Would that make sense?

OSTERHOLM: Yes, first of all, it is happening at a different level and different places in the country. And high-density populations are going to spread it much faster and much easier than -- I'm from rural Iowa -- than is going to happen there. But in the end, just like with seasonal flu, we shut down long-term care facilities, hospitals in rural America every year from too much influenza cases.

[09:15:02]

And so, I think you're going to see the very same thing here. Will take longer, is not going to happen overnight. So, a global -- a national shut down right now, the right thing to do. Well, will surely help slow it down substantially and give us time to plan. We still don't have a plan. I do not know what the national plan is for responding to this virus.

And until we get that, it is a piece-meal situation. And I think we do need to give ourselves a couple of weeks of just shutting down, knowing the implications of that, getting a plan, and then figuring out how we're going to bring back the world. How are we going to -- we have to have people every day who are essential workers, you talked about this earlier. You know, people who pick up the garbage, people who are the firemen, the policemen --

JIM SCIUTTO, ANCHOR, NEWSROOM: Yes --

OSTERHOLM: We've got to --

SCIUTTO: Yes --

OSTERHOLM: Have those. We can't shut down totally. But right now, I think we need that pause to get some control until we figure out what we're doing.

SCIUTTO: Well, those are sobering words. We don't have a plan. Dr. Osterholm, I hope we can stay in touch with, you're doing great work --

OSTERHOLM: Sure again --

SCIUTTO: And it's a --

OSTERHOLM: Thank you very much --

SCIUTTO: Real benefit for our viewers to hear from you.

OSTERHOLM: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: We have this breaking news just in to CNN. British Prime Minister Boris Johnson, he's now self-isolating after he tested positive for coronavirus. And we've just learned he's not the only senior official there who has tested positive. The U.K. Health Secretary also receiving a positive test for coronavirus. CNN's Max Foster joins us now from Berkshire, England.

But let's begin with CNN's international diplomatic editor, Nic Robertson, he's at 10 Downing Street in London. Nic, this is two senior officials in Britain who have now tested positive for this. More evidence if we needed it, that this is the truly -- everyone potentially is at risk.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Oh, absolutely. And perhaps no more evidence required than this at all. Of course, the concern will be, does it spread further within the government? The question will be raised of course, how does this affect the country's capability and capacity to combat coronavirus? The Prime Minister has said that he'll continue his work, that he'll continue leading the effort from self-isolation, self-isolation for the next seven days there in the flat above Number 11 Downing Street next to his offices.

Staff will be able to knock on the door and drop off documents, papers, whatever he requires there. But when you have the health secretary also who's been leading the charge on tackling the virus here as well. Does that raise that question? He says he's going to continue to, you know, to work from home from self-isolation. But the government here knows this has been a possibility.

There have obviously been discussions in the background about what to do, if somebody in leadership position becomes incapacitated. The government is not talking about that right now. They're saying -- officials are saying that people can continue to work from Downing Street, no additional people working there will require testing unless they show to have symptoms in the coming days. So the message from here, I think, at the moment is they've got it, they're going to continue, and you have the health minister just two weeks ago tested positive, was actually back in parliament, having recovered yesterday. So I think that's the message the Prime Minister would point to also.

SCIUTTO: Yes, well, it's notable because of course his approach early on was to go for herd immunity, avoid some of these restrictions, of course, the U.K. taking a different tack. Now, Max, you're up in Berkshire, Buckingham Palace, they've released a statement saying that Queen Elizabeth, she remains in good health. This after news that Boris Johnson tested positive for coronavirus. Do we know about their last in person meeting between the queen and the Prime Minister?

MAX FOSTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, and have weekly audiences, the last two were on the phone. So that's the crucial thing here. But we do know that they met on the 11th of March in person with Boris Johnson gaining those symptoms yesterday. That means it was just over two weeks between the meeting and Boris Johnson getting the symptoms.

So potentially, outside this contagious zone, but very close indeed. Particularly, when you consider that the day after the queen met Prince Charles who has also since developed coronavirus. So very worrying for a lot of people because obviously, the queen meets lots of people and these are just two very prominent people that we know about who have caught the virus.

The palace aren't giving any more information apart from saying that she remains in good health. And that's pertinent here because obviously, Jim, we're asking whether or not she's had a test. And they won't confirm or deny whether she's had a test. She is just down the road from where I am in isolation.

SCIUTTO: Yes, well, you think that would be a fair question that deserves an answer. Max Foster, Nic Robertson, both in the U.K., thanks very much.

[09:20:00]

Still to come this hour, President Trump says the White House is going to issue new guidance on social distancing. What could that mean for you? The larger fight against coronavirus going forward. Is it too early for relaxation? If that's what happens. And the White House says cities like Detroit could be the new hotspot in this crisis. The mayor of Detroit will join me to tell us what they're doing to prepare for that.

Plus, we're going to take you inside a factory that makes those key -- those important N95 respirator masks. What progress they're making, stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: Even as case numbers rise, President Trump is intensifying his push to reopen the economy. He says that he would relax some social distancing guidelines next week based on geographic risk factors. This despite warnings from health experts that it is too early to allow people to form large groups or return to work.

[09:25:00]

Early this week, the president said that he would like to see the country, quote, "raring to go by Easter", just a couple of weeks from now. One of Trump's top task force members, Dr. Anthony Fauci called that April 12th timeline, quote, "an aspirational projection designed to give people hope." Well, joining me now is Beth Cameron; she was the senior director of Global Health Security and Bio-defense for the National Security Council under President Obama, the job designed to handle something just like this.

But the team responsible for doing that under the Trump administration was absorbed into another office and shrunk. Beth Cameron, good to have you on this morning. First, I want to ask about something you wrote in the "Washington Post" earlier this month, you said our job, that is the job of the office that you were in, you led, was to be the smoke alarm. Keeping watch to get ahead of emergencies, sounding a warning at the earliest sign of fire, all with the goal of avoiding a six alarm blaze. Without that smoke --

BETH CAMERON, VICE PRESIDENT, NUCLEAR THREAT INITIATIVE: Yes --

SCIUTTO: Alarm, and given the slow response on things such as testing here in this country, has that six alarm blaze you described become more likely?

CAMERON: I think definitely we are seeing a six alarm blaze right now. And thank you so much, Jim, for having me on this morning. The goal of the office was really to create a senior level position and staff whose only job it was to be looking at outbreaks around the world and thinking exactly these thoughts. What about this outbreak, could make it more likely to become a six alarm blaze.

So I definitely think that time was lost by disbanding the office, especially in early January when it was pretty clear to the world that this was going to become something more like a six alarm --

SCIUTTO: Right --

CAMERON: Blaze and certainly had the elements of it. But we are where we are, there is a huge response that we need to be leading.

SCIUTTO: John Bolton, who, of course, was national security adviser at the time, other Trump administration officials have denied that the office was disbanded. They say it was streamlined, absorbed into other units under the National Security Council. What is correct? And did that make a difference in your view?

CAMERON: So, it is true that the office was dissolved. So it was -- it was dissolved and folded into another directorate. And what this means, I mean, it's a bureaucratic challenge, right, that governments and White House can absolutely organize the way that they want to. But what happens when you fold a directorate focused on pandemics into a larger directorate, as you're de facto, saying that the person in charge of that directorate, the senior official, has a number of jobs, and in this case including Iran, including North Korea, including nuclear non-proliferation.

An what that means is that the staff whose day-to-day responsibility are pandemics are lower level and they're one step removed again from the National and Homeland Security adviser. So, I definitely think that this issue set deserves a full time human and a full time staff whose only job it is to focus on biological --

SCIUTTO: Yes --

CAMERON: Threats if we're going to make a difference.

SCIUTTO: As you heard, the president is now talking about divvying up the country in effect to high and low risk zones, already relaxing some of these social distancing standards that all the health experts including Dr. Anthony Fauci who is often standing next to the president when he makes comments like this, have said are necessary. Can you do that?

Can you divvy the country up? Can you sort of draw lines between places where it's a real risk and not so much of a risk? Or is that -- is that just by its nature impossible?

CAMERON: I don't think that you can. I think you know, I was listening to your segment with Michael Osterholm just a few minutes ago, and I really agree with and respect Michael's expertise and others like him who are saying the same thing. Right now, we're seeing so many outbreaks and hotspots moving across our country. And we literally don't know who is infected and who is not.

And so right now, without a national pause, we really can't tell who has the virus and who hasn't. That means that we really need to keep -- we need to keep a shelter in place going in the places that have it --

SCIUTTO: Yes --

CAMERON: And probably need it around the country so that we can save our hospital system for those that are most at risk.

SCIUTTO: There was a remarkable moment with President Trump on "Fox News" yesterday where he dismissed states' calls for essential equipment, particularly ventilators, which are so essential in saving lives for the most severe cases of this. He says -- he said that those needs in his view -- I don't think they will materialize. A lot of equipment is being asked for, he said, that I don't think they will need. Is that the real -- is that the reality?

CAMERON: I think that unfortunately right now, there are two realities. One reality is that we absolutely don't have enough life- saving medical equipment like ventilators. We don't have enough supplies like personal protective equipment. But we also really don't have a national plan. There is no Defense Production Act, hasn't been fully implemented. There's been sparks where it looks like it might, and then they've been walked back.

Really right now, what we're hearing from the press conferences is that the federal government is in support of the states. That's true, and I think that works for a hurricane that's only affecting three states or maybe even the whole eastern seaboard.