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Pence Staffer Tests Positive For Coronavirus; Record-Worst 20.5 Million People Lost Jobs In April, Unemployment Rate Spikes to 14.7 Percent. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired May 08, 2020 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:00]

DR. ASAF BITTON, PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIAN: And the case numbers have gone down a little bit. They're in a sort of plateau, in long plateau, which I think is an important message to a lot of state leaders, that these curves don't just go up and then magically go down. They often plateau, especially once COVID is deeply in (INAUDIBLE) community.

So what we know about COVID is that it's spread by human contact and interaction. And we understand and understand as a primary care doctor that humans are social creatures, they want to be connected, they want to be out. They want to close to other humans. But we know about this condition that social distancing is one of the most effective means to get it under control.

And it really worries me as a person who has been practicing in a state that's been so hard hit, that other states that perhaps haven't been so hard hit and might not quite understand the strain and stress that it puts on your hospital and healthcare system to have thousands of patients flood in. I am really worried of the trends that we are seeing of all of these social distance indexes.

JOHN KING, CNN ANCHOR: Well, we'll keep an eye on those trends. Dr. Bitton and Professor Zheng (ph), I really appreciate your insights. Thank you very much.

It's the top of the hour now. Hello to our viewers in the United States and around world. I'm John King in Washington. This is CNN continuing coverage of the coronavirus pandemic.

There is high anxiety at the White House this hour. A second positive coronavirus test inside the White House complex, this time a staffer for the vice president, Mike Pence. The fear now that the virus is circulating possibly among senior U.S. officials.

The vice president through departing for Iowa today on the tarmac. Some his staffers were pulled off Air Force 2 over concern that they had come in contact with the infected individual. The confirmed positive is a reminder that the White House is like any other American workplace, susceptible to this virus.

Moments ago, the White House's press secretary insisting the White House is safe.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAYLEIGH MCENANY, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: We'll have this individual, there is a member of the vice president team who is positive for coronavirus. We have put in place the guidelines that experts have put forward to keep this building safe, which means contact tracing, all of the recommended guidelines that we have for businesses that have essential workers, we're now putting in place here in the White House. So as America reopens safely, the White House is continuing to operate safely.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Let's get straight to the White House, CNN's Kaitlan Collins. Kaitlan, Kayleigh McEnany there saying that they are following the guidelines and yet they are not. At least if you read the initial guidelines that came out, if you came in contact with somebody who tested positive, those initial guidelines that the vice president held up, there were 14 days and extended to 30 days, said you are supposed to self-quarantine. The president and the vice president are not self- quarantining.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: No. And when they were actually asked about that yesterday in the Oval Office, the president didn't really offer a clear answer. He was asked specifically, is the west wing getting a deep clean now that you found out that one of your personal valets has coronavirus or are you guys going to quarantine. And the president didn't answer, then the vice president took over. It wasn't clear.

They did reference the guidelines but didn't say what they're going to do. And now, of course, we do have the White House press secretary confirming that a member of Vice President Pence's staff has tested positive for coronavirus.

Of course, they have not said which staffers it is, which, of course, is going to be a big concern because the question is, is that someone who spent a lot of time inside the west wing. Because if you're familiar with how the White House offices are laid out, the vice president's staff is mainly in the building next door. Of course, they often come into the west wing. But there are a few of his staffers who often accompany him to meetings in the west wing.

So that's, of course, a big question, and I'm sure they are going through contact tracing right now, as they did with this valet, when we reported yesterday that that person had tested positive. So the question is what is the change going forward.

Because you saw earlier Air Force Two was idling on the tarmac for about an hour after it was supposed to take off because there was concern not that this person who had tested positive was on the plane, John, but that those people who were traveling with the vice president to Iowa today may have come in contact with that person.

So you saw a few people getting off the plane, it is not clear how they made those decisions. They didn't make any decision to cancel the trip all together. That's something we're likely to learn as the day goes on. But they have landed in Iowa. They are there now. And so we'll be waiting to see what the changes going forward and whether or not it's going to cause any more social distancing measures to be taken in the west wing.

KING: Kaitlan Collins live from the White House, I appreciate your reporting. Again, come back if you learn more about this aide (INAUDIBLE) or new protocols at the White House.

With us now to share his expertise and insight, CNN Chief Medical Correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta. Sanjay, I just want to start with a point I was making with Kaitlan, and that the press secretary saying, we're following the guidelines when it comes to quarantining and contact tracing. In fact, they're not.

And there may be a good case. This is the president and the vice president. This is not John Q. Public in a sense that they might have to say in the case of the president or the vice president who are doing things a little bit differently. But that's not what she said. That's the reason I brought that up in a sense.

[13:05:01]

And so just help me out. As the doctor in the conversation, a close aide to the president, now an aide to the vice president have tested positive. Aides were pulled the vice president's plane as a precaution. Rightly so, I think you would agree. He's about to fly to Iowa. They may have been in contact with this aide. Let's remove them.

What should the White House be doing right now to trace all these contacts?

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, this is a contagious virus and nobody, regardless of who you are, is going to be necessarily more protected than the next person. I mean, if this valet, going back to the president yesterday, the valet for the president, had close contact with the president.

And, again, we're not sure if he did. I heard that maybe the valet was in close proximity serving meals and things like that. That would qualify as a contact. It does depend on not only the distance, how close you are, but also the duration.

So contact tracers looking at those things. Not every single person who sort of walk by or sort have a glancing sort of contact may necessarily count, but this sounds like it was close contact, that's as concern. And given that this is a contagious virus, what is being done to sort of protect people within the White House, including the president and vice president.

I was talking to Ambassador Birx about this. I said, in some ways, you've got to think about this the same way you think about Secret Service. I mean, what are all things being done to protect the principals in the White House and it's not clear those things are being done. Testing every day, first of all, I'm not sure if you need test every day regardless. It's not like the moment you become exposed, you are going to test positive the moment after that. That's not really how it works. Regardless, testing is sort of after the fact, right? The main objective is everything happening in the White House and other places for that matter to reduce exposure.

And I think, pretty clearly, it's not. I mean, people are not wearing masks, they're not maintaining physical distance. We see people at the lectern in close proximity to one another. This is serious stuff. I mean, nothing changes in terms of the microbiology of this depending on whether you are in the White House or not.

KING: And raise the point about the mask. You talked to Dr. Birx about this last night. I believe we have the sound bite for it where you asked the question about masks at the White House and their answers are a little bit careful. Let's listen.

we don't have that. I'm sorry.

So, Sanjay, let me ask you something else in the meantime. As this is playing out today. This is a conversation I would have had with you. At the top of program, we learned this news about the vice president.

The Infectious Disease Society writing a letter to the White House, essentially saying, we think you're going too fast here, so we understand the economic crisis to reopen. But until we have widely available effective treatment and a safe and effective vaccine, policies that promote physical distancing are our best defense.

When it is safe to reopen, state and local governments need specific evidence-based guidance from our nation's top public health agency. This seems a pushback from the Infectious Diseases Society. So the White House decided to take those cautious, detailed CDC recommendations and shelter (ph).

GUPTA: Every public health organization in the United States, I think, feels the same way about this. I am talking to leaders at these organizations on a regular basis.

John, look, if the United States were my patients right now, it would be a tough conversation, right? There is an illness, which you have. It's a treatable illness, we have proof of that from certain place in the country, we have proof of that from other countries in the world. The treatment can work. It's a tough treatment. But if you don't do the treatment, the illness will continue to progress. I mean, that is essentially what the Infectious Disease Society and other public health organizations are saying.

We have spelled out the treatment. We have spelled out what needs to be done. It is not going to be perfect but it's going to allow you to get back to your way of life as safely as possible. Again, those 14- day downward trends, that number was picked for a reason, John, the idea that you have to have testing in place so that you can sort of keep the illness from coming back over and over again. That's the key.

And if somebody -- those have just been ignored despite the fact that they came from the task force.

KING: Dr. Sanjay Gupta, I appreciate your expertise and insights. We'll continue to stay on top of the story as we go forward.

When we come back, the economic impact. The April jobs report shows unemployment at the highest level since the great depression. We'll go inside the numbers, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:10:00]

KING: The devastating jobs report from the federal government today, more than 20 million Americans losing their jobs because of the coronavirus. Christine Romans takes us inside the numbers.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: John, the numbers are really just unprecedented and the speed with which this job market has unraveled is just unbelievable. I mean, look at the jobs losses in the past two months, 21.3 million jobs lost. It took months during the great recession to ultimately lose 8.7 million jobs. And that was so bad, that recession got its own nickname, the great recession.

This is single month of job loss is far way the worst we have ever seen, certainly a record and it's ten times worse than the previous record. Back in September of 1945 when Japan surrendered and America's industrial war machine wound down. That's right. Our comparisons are to wars and the great depression here. The difference is this is something we have done on purpose to try to fight a health problem.

No playbook for how we get out of this, but what we can see here is where the damage is concentrated. Black unemployment was a record low two months ago. It has spiked now to 16.7 percent, also spikes in the unemployment rates of women and teenagers.

[13:15:01]

Half of restaurant workers lost their job in the month of April. And when you look at the sectors, you can see the pain was widespread, healthcare losing jobs again as so many doctor's offices are closed, dentist's offices are closed and that hospitals are reserved for emergencies only, not for elective surgeries.

Overall, this is a devastating picture of what American families are going through right now. John, every single one of these numbers is someone who has lost a paycheck, struggling to find out how to apply for unemployment benefits, trying to teach their kids at home, take care of their parents and wondering what the job market landscape is going to look like on the other side. John?

KING: Christine Romans, thank you so much.

The House speaker, Nancy Pelosi, issuing a statement because of that jobs report, saying it proves to her the need for a giant fourth stimulus package, a coronavirus stimulus package. So that debate will play out in in Congress. Also there's a debate over the implementation of the money already passed, specifically small business funding that the administration wanted, the Congress has passed. Let's just look. These are your top five states in terms of coronavirus, right, New York, New Jersey, Massachusetts, Illinois and California, the number of coronavirus cases.

But look here when you look at states receiving loans. They are getting only 18 percent of small businesses in New York, New Jersey, Massachusetts, Illinois and California.

So if you look at the data, at least so far, the states hardest hit not on the high end receiving some of this critical small business funding.

Let's take a look. This is the Goldman Sachs' survey last month about small businesses. That is the biggest engine of the American economy. Partially open, about 42 percent were partially open last month. Fully opened, about 40 percent. Temporary closed, about 20 percent of those small businesses, again, a major engine of the United States' economy.

And just look here at these numbers, you are talking about the impact that's crushing. Christine just talked about the job losses on smaller businesses, more than 3.4 million jobs lost in businesses with fewer than 20 employees. 20 to 50 employees, more than 2.6 million job lost in those business. 50 to 500 employees, 5.3 million. That's a medium- sized business, right, 500 to 1,000, a bit larger but still 1.3 million. Just look at the devastation of the jobs losses in small and medium-sized businesses.

The president this morning insisting things will get better quickly.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: We had the strongest economy in the history of the world, the strongest economy we've ever had and we had to close it, which is artificial. We artificially closed it. Those jobs will all be back and they'll be back very soon. And next year, we're going to have a phenomenal year. People are ready to go. You got to get it open.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Let's bring in some guests now. Joining me now is Jackie Victor. She's the CEO of Avalon International Breads in Company in Detroit, Kirby LaShae, one of the company's furloughed employees.

Jackie, let me start with you as you go through. There is an aid available from the federal government? Is it helping you? And where are you now in terms of staying afloat?

JACKIE VICTOR, CEO, AVALON INTERNATIONAL BREADS: Well, we are really excited to get it. And we thought it could help us. Unfortunately, it's not going to really help us right now the way it is currently structured. Fortunately, right now, we only have 60 days to use it and the grant turns -- the loan turns into a grant only if we employ 100 percent of our employees again. And we stopped for five weeks. And out of 135 employees, right now, we have 13 back. So we're slowly opening but we're a food-based business and we are in Detroit. And so it's going to take a long time. So PPP definitely will have to have some serious changes for us to help us survive.

KING: And, Kirby, as one of the people most impacted by this, number one, do you expect to be able to get your job back? And number two, are you able to get benefits in the meantime?

KIRBY LASHAE, FURLOUGHED EMPLOYEE, AVALON INTERNATIONAL BREADS: Yes, I was able to apply for unemployment. So that really helped me a lot, especially me being an artist and having Avalon being my primary job. And, yes, I do plan on returning as soon as possible.

KING: Just take me through what it's like, I'll stick with you, Kirby, for a minute, in your community in the sense when you look at these national numbers, when you look at the numbers in Michigan, 25 percent of the workforce, I mean, how many people do you know who are in your situation now who had a job that I hope you loved and suddenly feeling now I got nothing.

LASHAE: A lot of people -- a lot of my co-workers are actually in that boat of loving to come to work and helping out the community in a very positive way, and then all of a sudden not being able to go to work the next day and then not knowing when we'll all return. So, yes, it's definitely affected and impacted a lot Of people that I know.

KING: And, Jackie, from a business standpoint, take us through -- you see right there those numbers. It just snaps your neck back.

[13:20:00]

27 percent of the Michigan workforce filing for unemployment in the last seven weeks. Jackie, just take us through, because as a small business, you're part of this business cycle in the community. And as you look to see as things are coming are coming back, you saw the grocery stores and you also saw the restaurants, so take us through how you are going to know when orders start to come in, or maybe when they don't, about -- is it coming back? And if it is coming back, at what speed?

VICTOR: So we have a sort of like -- we have a diverse business. So about a quarter of our -- about 10 percent of our businesses to grocery stores, and so bake house right to grocery stores. We have four retail establishments, so cafes and restaurants. And then, yes, we wholesale to restaurants. We also wholesale to food distributors.

And so that entire part of the business, our cafes that we make for, bake for all the restaurants, all the distributors that is done. That's overnight, just completely evaporated. It will come back and I think it will come back very slowly overtime as the food business reemerges. But I don't know that it's ever going to be the same. And in terms of our retail business, it's the same. We're going to open our small flagship store in a few weeks and it will be only to-go and we're going to change our model a little bit. But it's really one day at a time.

KING: Jackie and Kirby, we appreciate both of you. It's critical to us to put a human face on this as we go through it, to make sure that what we're reporting is just not numbers. I appreciate both of you coming on to share your perspective and wish you the best of luck in the days ahead.

When we come back, more on breaking news this hour, staffer of the vice president of the United States testing positive for the coronavirus.

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[13:25:00]

KING: More now on today's major breaking news. An update, an aide to the vice president testing positive for coronavirus. We have the latest information. CNN's Kaitlan Collins joins us now live from the White House. Kaitlan, what are we learning?

COLLINS: Well, Air Force Two has now landing in Iowa, so we're getting more details about exactly what happened this morning, John, Air Force 2, was sitting on the tarmac for so long, an hour after they were scheduled the take off.

And a senior administration official told the reporters on the plane that basically they found out that a staffer has tested positive.

What's really notable here, John, is that this is someone who yesterday was tested and was tested and was negative. They did not have any symptoms and they were tested again at the White House as they are now testing people daily, they announced yesterday, and that is when this person tested positive. So, negative yesterday and no symptoms, and according to this official, they tested positive this morning.

They had six staffers get off the plane because they had come into contact. They were concerned with this official who now has coronavirus. And so they wanted him out of abundance of caution, they said, to go and be tested again. So those staffers got off the plane, they did not make this trip to Iowa. And then the vice president and the rest of his staff continued on.

So, of course, this is notable, they are confirming another person has tested positive and this comes, of course, after the president's personal valet tested positive in recent days.

So the question going forward is what does this look like now, how does this change, if anything, going forward and, really, how much contact did this person have with the vice president.

They told reporters on Air Force 2 that this person did not have contact in recent days with the president himself, though it's not clear when was their last contact. But they did not say that this person has not had contact with the vice president. So that is really going to be a question that a lot of people have. Though they did reiterate to reporters that the vice president is now tested daily as well.

KING: Kaitlan Collins with the latest from the White House. Kaitlan, thanks very much for continuing to track the developments.

And including this, just moments ago, the White House press secretary, Kayleigh McEnany, was asked if the president thought about wearing a mask with meeting earlier today with World War II veterans.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: Did he consider wearing a mask while he was with these veterans?

MCENANCY: Well, this president is regularly tested. This president will make the decision as to whether to wear a mask or not. I can tell you that those veterans are protected. They made the choice to come here because they have chosen to put their nation first. They wanted to meet their commander in chief on this momentous day. And it was their choice to come here, and I can tell you that the president always puts the safety of our veterans first.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: I want to bring into the conversation CNN Congressional Correspondent Phil Mattingly and CNN National Security Correspondent Vivian Salama. thank you both for being here.

I want to start with this. The vice president is in Iowa. The president of the United States, of course, is at the White House. An aide of the president tested positive yesterday. An aide to the vice president tested positive today. I just want you listen. This is the vice president of the United States, as we were all coming to grips of coronavirus and how we should act, how we should protect ourselves. Here is the vice president's advice.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE PENCE, U.S. VICE PRESIDENT: The CDC guidelines have been very clear from the beginning of this outbreak for anyone that comes into contact with someone with coronavirus, we, early on, recommended that people self-quarantine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Again, they are exceptional, Vivian. But the president and the vice president have come in contact with somebody with the virus and they are not self-quarantining.

[13:30:00]

VIVIAN SALAMA, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: They're not self- quarantining. And this is a pattern, John, that we've seeing now for the last couple of months, where I suppose their appetite for the risk is higher.