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Commercial Plane Crashes In Karachi, Pakistan; Pakistan International Airlines; New York Archdiocese Releases Plan For Reopening Churches; Georgia Authorities Arrest Man Who Shot Video Of Arbery Killing. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired May 22, 2020 - 07:30   ET



JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: So this was an Airbus A320, one of the workhorses of the Airbus fleet. What do we know about the safety record of the A320, but also Pakistan International Airlines?

MARY SCHIAVO, CNN TRANSPORTATION ANALYST, FORMER INSPECTOR GENERAL, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION: Right, and all of those come together, obviously, in a very bad situation here.

But the A320 is a workhorse. I mean, it's been around forever. Airlines literally around the world fly them. But your aircraft is only as good as your maintenance crew behind you and your pilots -- and, of course, pilots in the cockpit.

Pakistan has had a lot of problems recently. As the world's crash rate -- airplane accident rate is going down, Pakistan has had many crashes in the last decade.

Pakistan was also plagued with a fake pilot with a false credentialing problem. About a year ago, they had to fire a number of pilots and other airline employees for having fake credentials. In other words, a fake pilot and others. And then with the crash record, they've had a lot of difficulties.

So here, the issue is also they'd just gone back to flying. They've only been back in the air for a little less than a week. And even in the United States, we worry about pilots who have been furloughed, maintenance people who have been furloughed because you really have to stay on top of your game. And so, did the fact the airline had not been flying for some time also play a role and perhaps, the maintenance or the readiness of this aircraft.

BERMAN: Again, we're looking at the pictures now of where this plane went down. It does appear to be in a residential area or at least near buildings.

One of the challenges now in going through this wreckage, what are they looking for, Mary?

SCHIAVO: Well, the first thing they want is, of course, the black boxes, which is if this plane has. It's about a 15-year-old aircraft, at least if I have the right aircraft when I looked it up. It's 15 years old and it will have a pretty good black box.

It won't have the newest black boxes but it will have hundreds of parameters, meaning in laymen's terms, hundreds of lines of data code about how the aircraft was performing on the -- on one of the black boxes.

Of course, on the cockpit voice recorder it will have the voices of the pilots as they worked to sort out what's going wrong with the flight, with the aircraft, and what they were doing on the go-round making their second attempt to land -- so the black boxes.

Of course, obviously, the recovery of any of the crew and passengers. The human recovery is always number one. The black box recovery will be number two.

BERMAN: All right. Mary Schiavo, thank you very much for helping us understand what we're looking at right now.

Again, a Pakistan International Airlines flight with more than 100 people on board has crashed. We are getting information and we'll bring you much more as it comes in -- Alisyn.


Back here in the U.S., guidance on reopening churches and other houses of worship could come as soon as today from the CDC. But the New York Archdiocese, the second-largest in the country, is not waiting. They have come up with their own plan.

And joining us to discuss is His Eminence, Timothy Cardinal Dolan, the Archbishop of New York. Good morning, Cardinal.

CARDINAL TIMOTHY DOLAN, ARCHBISHOP OF NEW YORK (via Skype): Hi, Alisyn. It's good to be with you again.

What somber news from Pakistan, though. My, oh my. God help them.

CAMEROTA: I know. A hundred people on board and it also looks like people on the ground may have been terribly injured. So obviously, we'll keep our viewers up-to-date about that.

In the meantime, I know that you've come up with a plan for what going to church is going to look like. And so, just tell us -- I mean, starting with Sunday Mass. How will the experience be different now?

DOLAN: Sure, Alisyn. Thanks for asking.

It's been a tough 10 weeks for everybody. And even spiritually, our people have been without public Mass and the sacraments. And boy, they just keep saying to us, please let us know when we come back. We miss Mass, we miss the community, we miss God's word, we miss the sacraments.

We have been enthusiastically cooperative with our health care professionals and our elected officials and we want to continue to do so. That's one of the reasons, Alisyn, you'll note that we didn't put any dates for reentry. We just said here is our layered return to normalcy and we're going to have to wait and see for the metrics that come out telling us when that can happen.

What you asked specifically, Alisyn is about Sunday Mass which, of course, is the high point of life for a sincere Catholic. That's probably not going to come until later because we still want to be very conscious of the crowds. We want to make sure we've got the safe distancing and the sanitation. So, Sunday Mass is probably going to be later.

But what we can begin to do under the careful guidelines that have been put out -- we can at least physically open our churches for prayer. We can begin with the sacrament of penance -- confession -- again, at safe distances.


We can begin the sacrament of the anointing of the sick.

We can slowly begin baptisms of our babies, even small weddings and funerals as long as the families say we know we're limited to 10 people. At least that's the -- that's the number that we get here in New York.

And then, Alisyn, the last two steps would be daily Mass and Sunday Mass. But again, I don't know the calendar for that.

We just thought this, Alisyn. We know it's going to come. Please, God, the sooner the better. We want to be ready.

I used the example -- I said we want to be like the batter in the -- in the batter's circle, waiting to jump into the batter's box as soon as we hear play ball. And that's what yesterday was about.

CAMEROTA: Well, that's really helpful to know. It's really interesting because I was wondering about Masses because the governor has given that statewide directive of no more than 10 people for religious gatherings. And I just didn't understand how you were going to be able to hold Mass with that. So I hear what you're saying -- baby steps. You're not planning --


CAMEROTA: -- to hold Mass yet.

DOLAN: No, and I'm glad you asked, Alisyn because that's a good clarification.

The governor also mentioned one of the things that we're thinking of -- outdoor Masses. The health care professionals tell us that outdoors are better. Obviously, the spaces are larger so we could have the safe distancing -- even people remaining in cars. That may be one of those antipasto steps to getting to a full return to Sunday Mass within our parish churches.

CAMEROTA: Thank you for putting it in food terms that I can understand. I always like a good food analogy, Cardinal.

DOLAN: (Laughing).

CAMEROTA: And so -- I mean, philosophically speaking, obviously you don't need to go inside a house of worship to worship or pray. And so do you want to see people coming back inside a church right now with all of these questions still?

DOLAN: Not in large numbers -- not in unsafe numbers. But you've got a good point and our people have learned that firsthand.

Jesus, himself, said look, when you pray, go into your room and pray to your father in private. So we know there's that private personal dimension in prayer. We can pray anywhere.

But we also know that, especially for Jews and Christians, a community is important, a place is important. There's a sense of family and spiritual solidarity. And that is very important as well and that's what we want to work to.

The point -- your point is well-taken and our people have learned that. The number of people that have said we're praying more often and better. We're turning to God's word in the Bible more often. We're using livestreaming and faith formation that the parishes are providing.

So they've learned that, but even they are chafing to get back to the -- to the embrace of the community that we call the church.

CAMEROTA: President Trump said yesterday that churches are not being treated with respect by Democratic governors. Has that been your experience?

DOLAN: Well, I can only talk, Alisyn, about New York and I compliment the job that Gov. Cuomo has done. I've complimented Mayor de Blasio. Yes, I've complimented President Trump.

I think our leaders have not let us down. I think they've worked hard and they're trying their best.

But I wouldn't feel that in New York. I've found -- I've found our governor, our mayor, Sen. Schumer to be very attentive and very sensitive. They've been especially eager to have us in compliance with the guidelines and have been kind enough to say that the religious communities have come through in being very safe and very conscious of health.

And they've been very sensitive, as well, in saying we want to -- we want to work hard to get you back. Gov. Cuomo, on Thursday, named a religious advisory panel to kind of

help him decide when we can get back -- to help us decide when we can begin to get back, just as he's doing with business and sports and recreation and all.

So, they're not leaving -- they're not leaving religion out -- no. I've -- so far, I don't have any complaints. CAMEROTA: Good to know.

Well, Cardinal Dolan, always great to see you. Thank you for giving us a status report --

DOLAN: Thanks, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: -- and enjoy your holiday weekend.

DOLAN: Let's move from antipasto to pasta, OK?

CAMEROTA: Next time, I look forward to that and somehow sharing a meal. Thank you very much.

DOLAN: You're welcome.

CAMEROTA: So, hospitals in Brazil are overwhelmed with coronavirus cases. Doctors now fear for their own safety. So we have a live report for you on how Brazil is losing this battle against the virus, at the moment.



CAMEROTA: Developing this morning, the Georgia man who recorded video of the fatal shooting of Ahmaud Arbery is now under arrest. William Bryan Jr. is charged with murder and is being held in the same jail as the father and son accused of gunning down Arbery.

CNN's Martin Savidge is live in Decatur, Georgia where authorities plan to release more information, we're told, in the coming hours. And that will be good, Marty, because it's been a mystery, this guy's role in all of this.

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It has, and good morning to you, Alisyn.

Yes, William "Roddie" Bryan Jr. was arrested by GBI. That's Georgia Bureau of Investigation agents. We don't know exactly where the arrest took place and the reason there's some question is because the attorney for Bryan has said that his client had gone into hiding due to death threats that had been made against him.

But his arrest came exactly two weeks to the day after the arrest of father and son, Gregory and Travis McMichael.

And you'll remember they were arrested 36 hours after GBI got on the case as a result of the outrage that came from the leaked cell phone video. And it was Bryan who took that video. It's a 36-second clip that depicts the pursuit and then the death of Ahmaud Arbery on February 23rd.


Now, usually in these kinds of cases, when someone captures some key video they're often looked upon as a kind of hero. But in the case of William "Roddie" Bryan there was a cloud of suspicion over him. The reason being that Gregory McMichael, one of the other suspects, had initially said in the police report that Roddie -- only using one name -- had attempted to stop Arbery's run by using his vehicle.

And then later, there was George Barnhill, the second D.A., who had said in the letter that all three men had been in hot pursuit of Arbery on that tragic day.

So we now know that he's been arrested and charged with felony murder and criminal intent -- or intent -- the intent to commit false imprisonment. In other words, there was no justification for the chase and the apparent effort to try to apprehend Arbery. He has had the book thrown at him, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: It sounds like it.

OK, Martin Savidge. Thank you very much. Bring us updates as needed. Thank you -- John.

BERMAN: All right, a former White House butler who served 11 years -- sorry, who served under 11 presidents for decades has died from coronavirus.

Wilson Roosevelt Jerman started in the White House as a cleaner for Dwight Eisenhower. He was promoted to butler by first lady Jackie Kennedy. He initially retired in 1997 but returned to the White House in 2003. Jerman served President Obama as a maitre di and finally retired for good in 2012 after suffering a stroke.

Michelle Obama praised Jerman in a statement to CNN, saying she and President Obama were lucky to have known him. Hillary Clinton remembered Jerman for making generations of first families feel at home, including ours. And, Jenna Bush Hager paid tribute, saying Jerman was one of the reasons the White House felt like home.

Wilson Roosevelt Jerman was 91 years old.

We'll be right back.



CAMEROTA: For the first time, more coronavirus cases were reported in Latin America than in either the U.S. or Europe. The pandemic is most devastating in Brazil where they've seen an explosion of new cases. Doctors say they now fear for their lives.

CNN's Nick Paton Walsh is live in Sao Paulo for us. So what's happening there, Nick?

NICK PATON WALSH, INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR: Yes, and it's over the global hotspot continues to move around the continent here and it seems like it's settling over Latin America. This, though, the biggest city in Brazil, which is responsible for half of those new cases that you referred to in Latin America.

It isn't even the peak here yet. And as you can see, in Sao Paulo, its biggest city, people are wearing masks. There's a lot of lockdown behavior but some people dealing with the complicated advice from Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro -- often, frankly, flying in the face of the science here. None of that impacts how deadly this is on the front line.


WALSH (voice-over): Sao Paulo, the biggest city and hottest spot for the coronavirus in Brazil, but deathly quiet. Outside Emilio Ribas hospital, no new patients arriving on ambulances. It's not a good sign. In fact, it spells the worst because this huge ICU has run out of beds.

WALSH (on camera): Most startling here is the peak is possibly well over a week away from hitting Brazil and already, this enormous ICU is full. And in between the beds there is a growing sense of anxiety -- fear, really, about what lies ahead.

WALSH (voice-over): Doctors here have heard President Jair Bolsonaro dismiss the disease as a little flu, but presidential platitudes haven't protected them.

And one of their nurses died two days ago. Inside this room is one of the team's doctors on a ventilator and another who's tested positive this day.

JAQUES SZTAJNBOK, EMILIO RIBAS INFECTIOUS DISEASE INSTITUTE: Never before it touches us -- touches us like this, this time because we have never lost a colleague in this intensive care before. Yes, definitely, it's not a flu. It's the worst thing we have ever faced in our professional lives.

WALSH (on camera): Are you worried for your life here?

SZTAJNBOK: Yes, yes.

WALSH (voice-over): It's a virus that stifles and silences but suddenly, here, there is commotion. One patient, a woman in her forties, has had cardiorespiratory failure. The doctors' heavy press (ph) is the only thing keeping her alive.

But after about 40 minutes it's clear she can't survive. The body is cleaned, the tubes that kept her alive disconnected, and she's wheeled out, and the space will be needed. It all happened so fast but leaves a long scar.

A scene so distant from presidential rallies, masks now common much of the time, but wealth put before health.

JAIR BOLSONARO, BRAZILIAN PRESIDENT: (Speaking foreign language).

WALSH (voice-over): We have to be brave, he says, to face this virus. Are people dying? Yes, they are and I regret that. But many more are going to die if the economy continues to be destroyed because of these lockdown measures.

The holes here in the hills above Sao Paulo are not dug ready for a recession, though. Endless fresh graves for the dead who also seem to never stop arriving.

WALSH (on camera): In Brazil, the numbers are already staggering and it's clear it's not the entire picture because testing simply isn't as widespread as they would like. But everywhere you go you see the people understand this is just the beginning.


CAMEROTA: Nick, those shots -- those aerial shots of graves are just chilling.

And, you know, back here in the U.S. there is so much controversy around the use of the drug hydroxychloroquine. It's unproven. President Trump had been using it.

I understand that in Brazil they're suggesting using it?

WALSH: It's actually plainly advocated in government medical advice.

Now, it's been the subject of intense dispute even with the government, contributing to the resignation of one of the health ministers. Quite a lot of cabinet seats changing over the past weeks because you saw there Jair Bolsonaro -- the president's desire to often play down the virus. It's increasingly hard, I think, for him to do that, but focus on the need for the economy to get better.

Hydroxychloroquine here is something they advocate you taking if, in fact, you don't even have a severe case of coronavirus. For more moderate or mild cases, too.


Now, that graveyard that you saw there -- we, in fact, met a woman who was burying her mother and talked about how her mother had, in fact, taken hydroxychloroquine. And there wasn't a doctor on hand to discuss what had really happened but certainly, the daughter blamed hydroxychloroquine for contributing to her mother's death.

And I say that's not scientific in itself but it shows the emotions running high here around that drug. It was given to her on a clinical decision.

And as we know ourselves here, the U.S. FDA has not approved this use of coronavirus. There are some studies suggesting it may even, in fact, be harmful for individuals, too. So that is one of the measures being used here by the government.

As you see, I'm wearing a mask. That's pretty much universal on the streets here of Sao Paulo. And there's a lot of lockdown in the commercial areas here, too.

But the sense of kind of a deathly silence here, frankly, is already upon the biggest city. You saw the extent of the graves being dug here and we're not even at the peak yet. That's still two weeks away. So imagine where we could be a fortnight from now -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Nick Paton Walsh, thank you very much for the scene from the ground for us -- John.

BERMAN: All right, new developments for U.S. cities. Washington, D.C. is targeting May 29th as the date to begin reopening.

A D.C. pub owner has seen his business suffer but despite the setbacks, he's going beyond the call to help those working to keep us safe.

CNN's Kristen Holmes with more.


KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The taps are dry and Kirwan's Irish pub is silent --


HOLMES (voice-over): -- but the kitchen is still bustling.

KIRWAN: Today's menu is a fireman's favorite.

HOLMES (voice-over): Every day, owner Mark Kirwan and his skeleton staff he wasn't forced to lay off spend hours preparing meals for a different set of customers, first responders.

KIRWAN: Helping those out who really need it and those who are in the trenches on the front line who don't have time to eat.

HOLMES (voice-over): And, Kirwan knows a thing or two about being on the front lines. Kirwan joined the Washington, D.C. police department 20 years ago.

KIRWAN: It's first responder to first responder, so you know -- I know a lot of the guys who are working, whether it be fire, police, hospital. We've dealt with them over the years of being on the department. So, for me, it's important that a friend is helping them give back.

HOLMES (voice-over): He's now a reserve officer assigned to harbor patrol, enforcing D.C.'s social distancing guidelines during the pandemic.

KIRWAN: That's everything, Fred?

HOLMES (voice-over): Kirwan tried to keep his full staff on after closing due to the virus, but despite draining his long-term savings to keep up with payroll, between his two restaurants he was forced to lay off 138 employees. The debt around him continues to grow but Kirwan says that won't stop

him from serving those on the front lines. Both restaurants deliver free food to police stations, firehouses, and hospitals across the Washington, D.C. area.

KIRWAN: We've hit every hospital in D.C. several times now. And you just see the nurses and the doctors come out and their faces are bruised and they just look so weary and worn down, and it would break our heart to see. Like, they're giving it all.

HOLMES (voice-over): The Irishman keeps the program afloat by matching donations he receives from others trying to help.

KIRWAN: And there's a lot of positive people out there. There's a lot of people who they don't have a lot of money but they're giving what they can. So that, to me, is massive and it's what makes us want to do what we're doing.

We're at Engine Company No. 13 and this is their lunchtime drop-off.

HOLMES (voice-over): The arduous (ph) plan is to continue throughout the pandemic --

KIRWAN: And I suppose I think of it like -- I look at the people who are dying out there. I have my health. My staff have their health. That's the most important thing.

HOLMES (voice-over): -- serving others in and out of uniform.

KIRWAN: Perfect, got you.

HOLMES (voice-over): Kristen Holmes, CNN, Washington.


BERMAN: You know, something we can all do to help is try to go to these bars and restaurants to help out heroes like that -- people making a difference.

All right, we have breaking news. Many new details on a passenger plane crash in Pakistan. NEW DAY continues right now.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

CAMEROTA: Good morning, everyone. Welcome to our viewers in the United States and all around the world. This is NEW DAY.

And we do begin with breaking news for you because a commercial plane has crashed in Karachi, Pakistan. Aviation officials say the Pakistan International Airlines flight had more than 100 people on board. It was headed from Lahore to Karachi and the plane dropped off radar just before landing, John.

BERMAN: New video shows thick, black smoke in the distance. Pakistan's army has dispatched helicopters while urban search and rescue teams are at the crash site. CNN's Sophia Saifi is live in Islamabad with the breaking details. What's the latest you're hearing?

SOPHIA SAIFI, CNN PRODUCER: Well, John, what we know so far is that the latest information that we have.