Return to Transcripts main page


Outrage Spills across America; U.S. Leads the World in Coronavirus Deaths. Aired 5-6a ET

Aired May 30, 2020 - 05:00   ET




UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): This is CNN breaking news.

CHRISTI PAUL, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. We are so grateful to have you with us here, I'm Christi Paul.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Victor Blackwell. This morning, there is pain and anger across America. There is now a fourth night of protests.

Of course, this started after the death of George Floyd. And it's happening now in at least 20 states. Floyd, a black man who was killed in police custody in Minneapolis this week, a white officer knelt on his neck for almost nine minutes as he was being arrested.

PAUL: And fierce frustrate with the U.S. justice system has led to protests across America. Floyd's death was just the tipping point. Anger has been simmering, including after the deaths of Ahmaud Arbery and Breonna Taylor. And those are of just late.

BLACKWELL: Derek Chauvin is now facing charges of third-degree murder, manslaughter as well. But the folks out there, they demanded that the other officers out there who were involved, that they face charges as well.

PAUL: In Minneapolis, where Floyd was killed, police fired tear gas and flash bangs at crowds. Seven people were arrested after many ignored the curfew. Shots were fired at officers. No officers were injured, though.

BLACKWELL: There was really strong condemnation from Atlanta mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms. She said, if you care about the city, go home.

Calls for peace after a police car was burned, they vandalized buildings, including a CNN Center downtown. There's a police precinct there as well. Georgia governor Brian Kemp has declared a state of emergency for Fulton County.

PAUL: We want to take you to New York. A number of standoffs with protesters and police there. Several were arrested as well. Mayor Bill de Blasio encouraged peaceful protests. BLACKWELL: The LAPD declared an unlawful assembly, with two officers

at least being injured here. Police telling protesters they would be arrested if they disobeyed orders.

PAUL: And the Secret Service has lifted a lockdown at the White House after protesters gathered on Pennsylvania Avenue. Take a look at what they were dealing with, protesters are seen clashing with Secret Service.

And President Trump called protesters "thugs," and said that "Looting leads to shooting." that was in a tweet.

We want to begin with Josh Campbell in Minneapolis this morning.

Josh, please help us understand what it is like for you there.

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Yes, Christi. After pleas from local officials for calm and tranquility here in Minneapolis, we saw quite the opposite. I want to walk you through what we're seeing.

We're seeing behind me a smoldering building that has been left in rubble after looters and protesters that turned violent opted to conduct attacks on the buildings. We saw different projectiles that were thrown overnight.

The dramatic images are similar to what we've seen across the country. This is about a block from the original scene here in Minneapolis, that is, of course, where we saw dramatic images of protesters setting fire to the police station.

This is also not far from where George Floyd originally had his incursion with police officers that led to his death.

We heard from elected officials, calling for community to come together, to stay home. There was a curfew that was set for last night. Many people did not adhere to that. We heard from the governor, discussing the situation. Let's listen to what he said.


GOV. TIM WALZ (D-MN): The situation is incredibly dangerous. The situation is fluid. It is dynamic. The wanton destruction and specifically of ethnic businesses that took generations to build are being torn down.

The disenfranchisement that went with what we witnessed with George's death is one thing. But the absolute chaos, this is not grieving. And this is not making a statement that we fully acknowledge needs to be fixed. This is life-threatening.



CAMPBELL: Now that was the call from the elected officials there, the governor, asking for peace. That's not obviously what we saw. And the point that he made was one that we heard so much from people

in the community. That is, these buildings, so many of these businesses behind us, are owned by people of color. Yet we saw protesters destroy these buildings.

One thing to point out, we know the reason why this started. It was that incursion between police officers and a black man here in Minneapolis. But so many peaceful protesters have pointed out to us that the destruction does not represent their cause.

This was a segment, a faction, obviously, outraged. People are calling for police accountability. And it's not representative of the cause that they're trying to put forward and that is, again, accountability for those who carry firearms on behalf of the government, the police officers in this community -- Victor and Christi.

BLACKWELL: Josh, let me ask you this, the governor suggested in a news conference yesterday that the response, the reaction would be different Friday night from what we saw on Thursday night, which was for hours, no police presence there. You were there both nights.

Was there any dramatic difference in the response from law enforcement?

CAMPBELL: Yes, you know, that was the key issue. And what we wondered yesterday, after we heard about the arrest of the police officer, was whether or not that charge would allay concerns of the community here. They were calling for justice, they were calling for it swiftly.

We wondered if that charge would help people to stay home. Obviously, not the case. In fact, we saw that situation inflamed across the country from coast to coast.

Yet to be seen what happens next. But we're hearing from folks who are outraged, who want to see the additional three officers, remember, there were four, they want to see the other three charged as well -- Victor and Christi.

PAUL: Josh Campbell, so glad you're safe as you covered this. Thank you so much.

BLACKWELL: The National Guard has been activated in Georgia. The governor declared a state of emergency.

PAUL: Mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms, this was such an emotional plea from her. She said, if you care about the city, then go home. CNN's Nick Valencia is right here in Atlanta.


NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: What started as a peaceful demonstration didn't take long to turn violent. CNN Center was one of the targets of the frustration of the demonstrators.

They showed up here in solidarity with the demonstrations that have been happening in Minneapolis. Hours after arriving here, though, at CNN Center, they began breaking windows, throwing rocks. Just look at some of the items that were being tossed towards the police line.

In fact, our crew here, along with my photographer, William Walker, and producer Kevin Conlon, were here as police had a standoff with demonstrators. That video you're witnessing, looking at now, it was intense, to say the least.

This scene was chaotic. It was -- we saw officers -- at least two officers injured in clashes with demonstrators. Look at these windows busted open by an individual who is using a skateboard to smash open the windows.

And there was a point and a moment where it appeared as though the demonstrators might actually gain entrance into the CNN Center. Eventually, that crowd was dispersed by the police using teargas canisters. They were eventually able to pull the demonstration -- demonstrators back.

But it did take hours before the unrest that we saw unfold in downtown Atlanta was finally clear from the streets -- reporting at CNN Center, I'm Nick Valencia.


PAUL: Victor, I don't know about you but I was watching last night. The reporters that were out in the middle of it. I was afraid for them. The destruction, the fires, the rock throwing, I mean, this is -- I know that this is where we come to work. So we feel it maybe on a different level because we're protective of the people here.

And not just the people here at CNN but the people in Atlanta, the good people. And I watched this and I didn't understand how the destruction has anything to do with the cause.

BLACKWELL: Well, I think that it is important on several levels, that we not get lost exclusively in the pictures of that sign, of that glass, of the flames because it is a much larger conversation.


BLACKWELL: And if we focus even primarily, not exclusively but even primarily, on the damage, then we're missing the whole point of what people are trying to show or to hear. But also, we need to remember, that this damage, this destruction, doesn't get to the next step of what most people, not at all, who are causing it want: fairness.

PAUL: Right.

BLACKWELL: A better life. equality, large themes that we need to make sure are extended to all people in society. And this doesn't get there. But I don't want us to focus on too much on our three letters in our sign because this is really a larger conversation.

PAUL: Exactly, just like Josh said, people said this destruction does not represent the cause for why they're out there. This is about equality. And this is about -- this is about police officers not targeting black men. And I know that's a big part of this conversation.

That is the core of this conversation which we're going to be having throughout the morning.

BLACKWELL: We certainly will.

We heard from Bernice King, obviously the daughter of the late Martin Luther King Jr., who is a leader of the country and lives here, saying the nation has to deal with systemic racism and white supremacy once and for all. This is part of what she said.


BERNICE KING, MLK'S DAUGHTER: But the only pathway I know to do this is through nonviolent means. It is a proven method. It did not fail my father. As many people it failed them, it did not fail them.

One thing about it, when you really understand it and really practice it, it brings about the results. So right now it's about, what is the end goal?

The end goal is we want change. And we want it now.


PAUL: She also warned that there are people trying to incite a race war and that protesters shouldn't fall into their trap.

BLACKWELL: Let's bring in Cedric Alexander. He is a former police executive and the past president of the National Organization of Black Law Executives.

Cedric, before we talk specifically what happened in Minneapolis and across the country, you've worked in law enforcement for 40 years, during the L.A. riots, what we saw in Ferguson, what we saw in Baltimore. And you've written about that perspective. And the perspective of watching it as a black man in America.

Contextualize what we've seen the last few nights and the reaction across the country.

CEDRIC ALEXANDER, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, let me say this first, Victor, there is never an excuse for violence and destruction of property in any community anywhere. Let me say that first.

We have across this country, in the beginning of it, the etiology of where all of this started, there in Minneapolis this time, people are angry, people are hurt. People feel they have nowhere to go, their voice cannot be heard. And they feel they need to go to these extreme measures in order to get attention.

The unfortunate part of this is we're now focusing on the damage, the destruction of property. And that allows for the real conversation, as you know, around Mr. Floyd, to be misplaced. And we can't afford for that conversation to be misplaced. We have to focus on how we got here, what's creating part of this. But

we also have to be smart enough to know there are folks out there who are embedded into these crowds, whose whole goal is to do harm.

And all that does, it reaches -- it may have helped them with their goal but the real goal here is around the loss of life, of black men by police in this country.

But in addition to that, the most heinous thing we have seen in recent time is what we saw with Mr. Floyd who suffered and died right in front of us, in our own eyes. And that is terrifying.

But people are hurt. People are angry. People are recognizing. They see that image in their mind every day. And that was a huge tipping point in this country, in this present time, during COVID, during an economic downturn to and everything else.


PAUL: Mayor Bottoms brought it home when she said so strong, I am coming to you as a mom, essentially. As we all stopped and looked at that picture of Floyd and said, what if that was my kid, what if that was my brother?

When we recognize we're human beings at the end of the day. With that said, a lot of people are looking to see what's going to happen with Chauvin, who was arrested. The other three is what other people want to know about, the other three officers involved there.

And Christy Lopez is a professor of Georgetown Law School.

And "The Washington Post" wrote this, one of the most important preventive steps we can take to protect needless police killings is to create a culture in which police officers themselves step in to prevent abuse and are supported when they do so.

She's essentially speaking to those three officers.

Based on your expertise and your experience in police departments, are police officers -- is there a culture of discouraging them from pulling some officers back if they seem to be out of line?

Help us understand why maybe those three would not have done more.

ALEXANDER: We do have some cultures across this country in police departments in this country, cultures that are quiet. You take Minneapolis, they're a big example what you're talking about here, Christi.

You have a man who can choke a man out in broad daylight on camera, very cavalier about his actions, and three others stand there and do nothing. That is suggestive, to me, one, as a former administrator and, two, as a psychologist, something is inherently wrong within that Minneapolis Police Department.

Because you would think that at least one person would have had enough conscience of moral character to tap that officer out and say, the guy can't breathe, get off of him. We need to render first aid.

We didn't see that happen. So something is very, very wrong because, if it had existed in that police department with the behavior we saw demonstrated on Monday, then that mayor, that chief would take a deep dive within that department and look at culture.

I would encourage, have always encouraged chiefs around this country, friends of mine who I'm talking to every day, is that we've got to go inside of our organizations. We have to look at our culture. We have to make it clear, from the top to the last person hired, that type of behavior, those type of attitudes will not be tolerated.

If you're going to be in public service, you have to be compassionate. You have to have a sense of humanity. And you have to have a moral compass. That cannot be taught in any academy in the world. You come with it.

If you don't come with it, then you need to go drive buses or something. But you cannot serve as a public official, particularly, specifically, as a sworn officer if you don't have compassion.

You got to have a moral compass. You got to have the ability to say the man can't breathe. That did not happen. This country is angry. And it's angry even in neighborhoods that are quiet tonight.

BLACKWELL: Yes. It's important not to think that the outrage and the pain is only seen in flames, only seen in signs and protests. Because there are a lot of people who will not be on the streets, who are feeling the anxiety and are feeling the anger and are feeling the frustration but are not on those streets with people we watch from night to night.

There's a piece that Cedric has on right now and talking about this. I wrote down this line, displayed with Eric Garner in 2014, "a catastrophic failure of training and an unconscionable failure of culture."

Cedric, thank you for being with us. We'll talk more throughout the morning.

ALEXANDER: Thanks, bye-bye.

PAUL: A black person dies at the hands of police.

Why does it keep happening?

How do we stop it?

Join CNN's Don Lemon for an important conversation. "I Can't Breathe: Black Men Living and Dying in America," tomorrow at 8:00 pm.

BLACKWELL: Of course, we continue to cover the protests and demonstrations across the country, the nation's capital. We see tense moments with demonstrators and police, this is in front of the White House. In Atlanta, we heard from the mayor. Let's hear from her condemning the city. [05:20:00]


MAYOR KEISHA LANCE BOTTOMS (D-GA), ATLANTA: I wear this each and every day and I pray over my children each and every day. So what I see happening on the streets of Atlanta is not Atlanta. This is not a protest. This is not in the spirit of Martin Luther King Jr. This is chaos.





BLACKWELL: This is a national moment. The catalyst for the responses and the protests and demonstrations, those are in Minneapolis, it started there. But we're seeing the response in 20 states across the country.

In Georgia, let's go to the city of Atlanta. Fires overnight in the city, the result of protests against police violence at large. This morning there is a state of emergency. And as many as 500 National Guard troops have been mobilized.

PAUL: Last night, Atlanta's mayor, Keisha Lance Bottoms, was speaking out, speaking as a mother saying, very simply, go home.



BOTTOMS: When I saw the murder of George Floyd, I hurt like a mother would hurt. And yesterday when I heard there were rumors about violent protest protests in Atlanta, I did what a mother would do.

I called my son and I said, "Where are you?"

I said, "I cannot protect you and black boys shouldn't be out today."

So you are not going to outconcern me and outcare about where we are in America. I wear this each and every day and I pray over my children each and every day. So what I see happening on the streets of Atlanta is not Atlanta. This is not a protest. This is not in the spirit of Martin Luther King Jr.

This is chaos.

You are disgracing our city. You are disgracing the life of George Floyd and every other person who has been killed in this country. We are better than this. We're better than this as a city. We are better than this as a country. Go home. Go home.


PAUL: Somber moment. In Washington there were protests and that caused the White House to lock down.

BLACKWELL: Yes. We see the Secret Service here, the police officer, clashing with protesters, wrestling over barricades. You'll see this here with Brian Todd, his report.


BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A day of tense confrontations here in front of the White House. This is about the third one throughout of the course of today, this evening. Protesters are still struggling for control of the steel barricades with Secret Service police.

This has been going on all day long. Protesters pelting police with water and other objects. This has been intense throughout the city of Washington all day long.

We've been walking with protesters since about 5 o'clock in the afternoon. This is one of the more intense scenes. There have been three of those in front of the White House today. One of them involved trying to lead a protester away.

We also witnessed a crowd surrounding a police car, menacing a car, putting hands on the car and screaming at police. Ultimately, one protester got them to back off and the police backed the car away.

More pushing and pulling with police, Secret Service police in front of the White House. They're being hit with objects, water and other things. Tactical gear on, deflecting objects with their shields. Very intense confrontations, most of the day and evening here in front of the White House -- Brian Todd, CNN, Washington.


PAUL: Todd, thank you so much.

Listen, still to come, there are parts of U.S. cities across the country that are burning, as protesters clash with police. They're demanding justice for the death of George Floyd. We're talking to a journalist who was there nearly 30 years ago during the L.A. riots. His take on what he's seeing happening right now.





PAUL: So for every scene of chaotic protests that we have seen, we need to point out, there are also images of people demonstrating in nonviolent ways because that is, after all, the purpose of the protests. BLACKWELL: Let's go to Minneapolis. And here the protesters here

saying no justice, no peace. Prosecute the police. The video was shot -- aerial video, earlier in the day, gives a better sense of how big the crowd was there. This is them walking along the highway.

PAUL: In St. Louis, Missouri, there was a crowd that took over an intersection. They were playing music at the rally then held up traffic.

And in Bakersfield, California, protesters were demonstrating peacefully, when someone broke through the crowd. We do not have word of any injuries there.

The killing of George Floyd, this is just the most recent case on the minds of protesters. There are at least two others that happened already this year.

In the early hours of March 13th, Breonna Taylor was shot and killed after police officers forced their way into her home in Kentucky. The ENT was shot at least eight times by officers. Police say they were there to serve a no-knock search warrant in a narcotics raid. No drugs were found, by the way, in the home, Victor.

BLACKWELL: Her boyfriend was arrested for attempted murder for firing back at officers. Those charges have since been dismissed.

A month earlier, Ahmaud Arbery was shot and killing while jogging. He was followed by two men with guns who said he looked like a suspect in burglaries. Police say no string of break-ins was reported for seven weeks prior to his death.

PAUL: The shooting taped by a third person who immediately didn't call 9-1-1 for help, it took three months for arrests to be made in Arbery's death.

BLACKWELL: All three have been arrested.

There was a curfew; one of the officers in Minneapolis was arrested. Derek Chauvin in the death of George Floyd. But it wasn't enough to stop the protests in Minneapolis. Officials say they made about 50 arrests. Law enforcement resources, we know, are stretched thin.

PAUL: Yes. CNN's Sara Sidner was there. And she shows us what was happening.


SARA SIDNER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hundreds of officers coming forward, for the first time tonight. We are seeing a large contingent of police pushing people back from that 5th Precinct and into the neighborhood.

What is happening, where you are seeing that fire there, is the protesters have made their own kind of barricade, trying to put something between them and the officers who are trying to advance, street by street. And from those vantage points, where you see that fire, they will

throw rocks. They will fight back. And they have kept saying, we are going to fight back this time. Nothing is going to stop us from fighting back.

The police are responding with teargas, with rubber bullets and we're seeing that play out. And when they start, you will see people start running.


SIDNER: Because those rubber bullets leave some serious, serious bruises.

And you will also notice that we are in this neighborhood that's got tree-lined streets, there are folks that live here, looking down from their property, worrying about their property. But so far, the protesters here have not gone and dealt with any of these homes, not done anything to the homes.

But they have -- they have broken into things, like the bank that is up the street. That is on fire. We have seen a convenience store looted.

But here, they said they are sick and tired of what is happening between black folks and the police. And they are going to continue to fight for as long as they can so that they can get justice. Those -- those are their words and they are staying out here in these streets -- Sara Sidner, CNN, Minneapolis.


PAUL: In Dallas, Texas overnight, anger of those deaths of George Floyd and Breonna Taylor spilled over into their streets.

BLACKWELL: Obviously, you're seeing tense moments, largely peaceful demonstrations. CNN's Ed Lavandera was there.


ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Thousands of protesters took to the streets of Dallas on Friday night and much of the evening the protests were peaceful. Thousands gathered here in front the police department and started marching their way through city points and into downtown and that is where things escalated on Friday night.

There were a couple of intersections where protesters became in close contact with officers. Dallas police say that's when objects and rocks were thrown at officers and SWAT teams moved in.

Dozens of rounds of teargas were fired into the crowd to disperse the crowd on the streets of downturn Dallas. That has lasted for several hours into this evening.

Much of the crowd has been dispersed into small groups and splintered up around downtown Dallas. Another small group ended up here late in the evening, once again in front of Dallas police headquarters.

We know that there have been a number of arrests made here throughout the evening. We witnessed two or three different arrests and people loaded up into the back of Dallas police vans. We don't know the exact number of how much people were arrested as the crowd dispersed in many locations.

But it was another tense night, one of the many cities across the United States, where these tense protests have unfolded on this Friday night -- Ed Lavandera, CNN, Dallas.


BLACKWELL: Ed, thank you.

And all of this is happening while there's still this pandemic. And we know that more people are dying from coronavirus, Christi.

PAUL: Yes. The new reason they're saying we need to be concerned now regarding -- you saw this -- those huge crowds. This is the Memorial Day weekend after a partygoer tested positive and was possibly infectious at that time. We have more for you in a moment.





BLACKWELL: This morning, more than 102,000 people across this country have died from coronavirus. That's at least that number, a devastating number, as more states enter these various phases of reopening.

PAUL: Yes, restrictions are being lifted in many cities across the country, some of them most heavily hit. Officials are eyeing ways to open parts of the economy because there are people there suffering there as well.

BLACKWELL: As restrictions are being lifted, the case numbers, in a lot of those states are moving in the wrong direction. Here's CNN's Polo Sandoval.


POLO SANDOVAL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: New concern over coronavirus outbreaks, as states move forward with reopening; 15 states showing an increase in new cases in the last weeks, many of them in the South.

Arkansas reporting the largest increase in number of cases in the last 24 hours. Georgia renewing its public health state of emergency. A spike also in Mississippi. But that's not stopping the governor from lifting the stay-at-home order.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are still health and safety guidelines for people to follow. But we cannot have an endless shutdown.

SANDOVAL (voice-over): California facing the largest single day of patients since the start of the pandemic. Wisconsin reporting its highest number of COVID deaths in a single day, just two weeks after the state Supreme Court overturned the governor's stay-at-home order.

The Wisconsin State Fair in August cancelled for the first time in 75 years. Another historic first, the Boston marathon will not happen for the first time in the event's 124-year history.

It all comes as the CDC forecasts an additional 22,000 coronavirus deaths by June 20th.

In New York City, the former epicenter of the American pandemic, Mayor Bill de Blasio announcing a gradual reopening could start in a matter of weeks.


MAYOR BILL DE BLASIO (D-NY), NEW YORK CITY: We are getting to the point very, very soon. But we can take the first step to restart in phase one.


SANDOVAL (voice-over): The governor, Andrew Cuomo, signing an executive order allowing store owners to ban a customer without a mask.

GOV. ANDREW CUOMO (D-NY): That store owner has a right to protect themselves.

SANDOVAL (voice-over): In the nation's capital, stay-at-home orders are being lifted, allowing restaurants to welcome diners back.

Still without hopes for a vaccine, the World Health Organization delivered a word of caution for any hope of a vaccine by the end of the year.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There are no shortcuts in the development of a vaccine. Safety is not compromised.

SANDOVAL (voice-over): Polo Sandoval, New York.


PAUL: This is one of those images that caught so many people's attention. We now know that somebody among that massive crowd partying at the Lake of the Ozarks over the weekend, yes, has tested positive for the virus.

This is a person who visited the Backwater Jack's Bar and Grill. That's where you see these partygoers. The resident felt sick Sunday and was infectious, of course, before then. And the person also visited several other bars over the holiday weekend. BLACKWELL: A Supreme Court has rejected a request from a church in

California to block limitations on the number of people who can attend religious services. States across the country have been gradually reopening. And some churches have argued that they are being treated differently than businesses right now.

California's policy for reopening churches limits services to 25 percent of capacity or 100 people.


BLACKWELL: Siding with the four liberal members of the court, Chief Justice John Roberts pointed out that nonreligious gatherings have similar restrictions as churches.

PAUL: We're monitoring the breaking news of demonstrations and protests, some of them violent across the country overnight. A legal expert is with us, taking a look at the death of George Floyd and where the case against the police officer accused of killing him stands now.




PAUL: 49 minutes past the hour right now.

"If you love Atlanta, please go home." Those were the words of Atlanta mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms. Rapper and activist Killer Mike was with her.

BLACKWELL: At times, he wiped away tears as he talked about what this city means to him.



MICHAEL RENDER, "KILLER MIKE," RECORDING ARTIST: I'm the son of an Atlanta city police officer. I've got a lot of love and respect for police officers. I watched a watch officer assassinate a black man. And I know that tore your heart out. I woke up wanting to see the world burn down yesterday.


RENDER: I'm tired of seeing black men die. We don't want to see targets burn. We want to see the system that is set up with systemic racism burnt to the ground.

So I'm duty bound here, to simply say it is your duty not to burn your own house down for anger with an enemy. It is your duty to fortify your own house so that you may be a house of refuge in times of organization. (END VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL: And, Victor, you just hope that what he's saying is resonating with those people who were acting up yesterday because the majority -- like I said earlier, the majority of the people, like any city, in Atlanta, are good people. And they were out there with good intentions until all of the burning and rock throwing happened.

And sadly, we saw that in other parts of the country as well. And you don't want it to taint what the real conversation is.

BLACKWELL: Yes, I think -- I listened to the public safety commissioner in Minnesota talking about getting to healing. And I was thinking about, healing, having covered Ferguson there, being in Baltimore, people are quick to put a bandage on.

But you just don't put a bandage on a dirty wound. There are phases. First, you have to stop the bleeding. I think that's what we're seeing. Before you put a bandage on, you need an antiseptic, what cleans it out.

We've got to decide what is the antiseptic for this phase, for this period. We got to figure out what cleans it out and we need to have a broader conversation. That's going to make a lot of people uncomfortable. But you can't rush from dirty wounds and put a bandage on it. You need an antiseptic.

Hopefully we get to that this morning and the next couple of weeks because this conversation is not going to be wrapped up in a couple hours by adding troops of law enforcement or putting in a curfew. We're going to continue this, obviously, throughout the morning.

PAUL: And we need empathy from everybody, that maybe that can come into play here. That's the hope of everyone. So of course, this all happening because of the death of George Floyd.

It was the tipping point, though, for a lot of people: 46 years old, died in police custody in Minneapolis earlier this week. The anger has been simmering after several incidents. There was the deaths of Ahmaud Arbery and Breonna Taylor. Those were just the most recent.

BLACKWELL: In Floyd's case, a white police officer knelt on his neck for almost nine minutes. Former officer Derek Chauvin is facing charges of third-degree murder, manslaughter as well.

Protesters feel that the other men should face charges as well. Let's bring in CNN legal analyst and attorney Joey Jackson.

Joey, good morning, I expect that you'll offer some broader response to what we're seeing. But tell me about, as you get to that, the third degree and manslaughter charge. There are some who say those aren't significant enough for Chauvin, much less the other officers, the distinction of that third degree versus other potential charges.

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Sure. I'd love to do that. Victor, good morning to you. Good morning to Christi. Before I do, though, I think your analysis is spot-on. I think there

does need to be an antiseptic. I think this does speak to a broader issue.

How many times have I had occasion to join you and to join Christi, speaking about the very same thing, speaking about the distrust between police and the community, speaking about the need and nature of police departments throughout the country to clean themselves up, speaking about patterns and practices that are discriminatory against various communities, namely communities of color?

So there needs to be, as you say, Victor, I am in accord, a broader conversation of what it looks like to clean it up.

Do police departments have the look that their communities they serve?

Do police incentivize to members of the African American communities?

It's sad and it's a shame that we have to talk about this over and over. On the issue, the limited issue that you asked me about, the third-degree murder.

Prosecutors have said with third degree murder, listen, everyone thinks about murder you that need intent, lying in wait. We should be clear. There's another murder. It's called when you act with depravity.


JACKSON: When you act with inhumanity, when you do something that you know could cause someone harm but you don't care. You do it anyway. That's what we call the third-degree murder. As a result of that, you can get 25 years in jail.

Finally, manslaughter is when you're criminally negligent. You're careless. You don't have to establish that you're a depraved heart. You simply establish that you were so careless and reckless in what you were doing, you could have known or should have known, someone would have died, that's 10 years in jail. That's the distinction.

That's what we're going to see moving forward if it goes to trial and if it goes that way.

PAUL: All right, Joey Jackson, always appreciate your perspective, your thoughts and your heart. Thank you, sir.

JACKSON: Thank you, Christi.

PAUL: So look, the country is plunging into a crisis, violent protests and riots breaking out across the country over the death of George Floyd. We're going to tell you where they are, what happened overnight as you were sleeping. Stay close.