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New Polls Give Biden Electoral Advantage; Former Military Leaders Condemn Trump's Protest Response; NY Governor Cuomo Gives Update on Coronavirus Response, Talks George Floyd Protests, Buffalo Police Officers Shoving 75-Year-Old Man. Aired 11:30a-12p ET

Aired June 05, 2020 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:30:00]

AMY WALTER, NATIONAL EDITOR, "COOK POLITICAL REPORT": So the challenge for this president today is the same challenge that the president has always had, which is, can you win reelection when you don't expand your base, when it is really still about getting that core group of people encouraged, engaged to turn out.

And hope that by going after your Democratic opponent, making that person seem unable to do the job, you can depress enough of the opposition to win a narrow reelection. It's what he's been banking on all along.

And what we've seen is when the focus is on the challenges in front of him, when it's directly on his role as a decision maker and an executive, his own numbers start to drop.

He wants to put that onus back on Joe Biden. And that's hard to do when you go from crisis to crisis.

JOHN KING, CNN ANCHOR: It's incredibly hard to do, especially when you look at the crises before us at the moment. Again, the Trump team hoping these economic numbers continue. If they do, then we will have a different political dynamic in the country.

If you look right now, one of the biggest issues in the country, the coronavirus and race relations in the wake of the George Floyd killing.

Dana, on those issues, Joe Biden outpolls the president and usually by a pretty significant margin.

If those are the issues before the country come election day -- and you can take the names out of it if you don't like what you have, right? If you don't like you're in the middle of a pandemic, you don't like the social unrest, you want to change things. And Donald Trump is the incumbent president.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Right, it's historically what we've all based on who will win or who won't win on, which is right track, wrong track. Are you happy with who you are? It goes back to Ronald Reagan: Are you better off now than you were

four years ago? That's the question for the incumbent president.

You're right. If you think about it, up until the coronavirus, all the crises that kept this president out of the ceiling, about 80 percent, as Amy said, were of his own making. It was because the churning and chaos in the White House, his tweets and staff turnover and a million other things.

These are real crises and they are coming to a head all together. So it is a question of whether or not people are just ready for change, which is a big leap.

Incumbents tend to do well because that's just the kind of nature of the electoral system, right? We all know, we've all watched incumbents looking like things are really bad and the American people are going to kick them out and then they don't end up doing that.

It is a very open question. And we don't know what it's going to look like in five months when people are on the ballot.

But I can tell you, in this meeting he had at the White House yesterday with his campaign team, it was a regular meeting, but they delivered some honest news about the polling, much of which you just showed.

They were telling him this can be turned around if the economy goes up, which is why we heard a very rambling speech, saw a rambling speech at the White House today talking up the economy like his political life depended on it.

KING: We live in a very different world than the last time the American people kicked out a president. That was 1992. We have had three successive two-term presidents, which is an anomaly in our history if you go back.

Amy, what strikes me, I remember the 1992 campaign. I remember going to Los Angeles with then-Governor Bill Clinton after the Rodney King riots. So you had racial unrest before the country.

And you also had a very mild recession but a recession, nonetheless. And I always remember writing things like people's legs were tired. People got tired because they felt like they were treading water in this recession. And even though the economy started to improve in 1992 as it got closer to the election, President Bush could not convince people it was improving.

The dynamics are quite similar but the times are so different. That's why I'm afraid to apply the lessons of 1992 where we are now. But in that situation, the American people, despite the best efforts of President Bush and his campaign, they just wanted something different.

WALTER: Yes, and I think the point you made, John, about being tired is still relevant today. And that's what Joe Biden is counting on.

Look, Donald Trump won as a disrupter. He made a big bet that Americans wanted a disruptor in office and that paid off in 2016.

But it doesn't seem like that's where Americans want to be now. In this time of incredible chaos, do they really want disruption, or do they want to get back to a safer, calmer place.

That's the message Joe Biden has to put forward. That's the message he's trying to address by, every time he gets in front of the camera, usually from his basement in Wilmington, is to make the case he's going to come and steady the ship and steady the plays. We'll see how well he does that.

The other thing, John, is that -- and for Dana, too -- look, all of his advisers, every Republican knows exactly what this president needs to do. The economy comes back to make that the centerpiece of his campaign.

[11:34:59]

But we all know he doesn't like doing that. He didn't do that in 2018 when economists running for reelection were desperate for him to turn the attention on the economy. Instead, he wanted to talk about immigration and the caravan headed to the Mexican border.

So keeping his focused on that is add challenging as trying to bring the economy back to a good place before reelection.

(CROSSTALK)

KING: We had another example of that 20 minutes ago when the president walked into the Rose Gardena and talked about great economic news today and he was all over the place.

He has another problem. He has another problem with the four stars. Jim Mattis was his defense secretary, now questions the president's character and his leadership.

Listen here, John Kelly, another retired general who was the president's chief of staff, they ended on a sour note, just moments ago, talking to -- this is a bizarre thing -- but talking to Anthony Scaramucci, who, for about 10 minutes, was the White House communications director, another person pushed out of the Trump administration.

But listen to General Kelly here, the president's former chief of staff, urging the American people to be careful in November.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEN. JOHN KELLY, FORMER WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF: He's quite a man, General Jim Mattis. And for him to do that tells you where he is relative to the concern he has for our country.

ANTHONY SCARAMUCCI, FORMER WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Do you agree with him, John?

KELLY: I agree with him. I think we need to step back from the politics. I think we need to

look harder at who we elect. I think we should start, all of us, regardless of what our views are in politics, I think we should look at people that are running for office and put them through the filter. What is their character like? What are their ethics?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: What is their character like, what are their ethics? Wow.

BASH: Wow is right. Listen, this is a big deal. It really is. We know that the president has run through chiefs of staff. We know that, you know, he's had several of them. We know that John Kelly, as you said, did not leave on the best of terms.

But he is still a good soldier, and he is still somebody who, you know, respects authority. And he is careful.

And the fact that he said this and wanted to do it, ironically, with Scaramucci, who obviously has done a complete 180 on the president, who he supported wholeheartedly and now he wants to throw out, is very, very telling. It's incredibly telling.

The word he chose -- I pick on this, too -- character. This is a man who knows the president from the inside of the building out, who was his top aide, chief of staff. And the fact that he is questioning Donald Trump's character and using that in the same sentence as, be careful who you elect in November, is really remarkable.

KING: And the question, Amy, is who listens to whom, if you will. The president's advisers, to your earlier point, will say, Mr. President, don't respond. Don't respond to Lisa Murkowski. Don't respond to John Kelly. It's a one-hour or one-day story. Focus on what you want to talk about.

But we know this president can't do that. The question is: What about around the country? What about the president's base? He counts on the support of people who respect -- I'm sorry, I need to go to the governor of New York, Andrew Cuomo.

Ladies, thank you.

GOV. ANDREW CUOMO (D-NY): Melissa DeRosa, secretary to the governor. To her left, Robert Mujica, budget director.

It was another long and ugly night in the United States of America last night. As it was in New York State.

Day 97 of the coronavirus crisis, day 12 of the civil unrest dealing with the aftermath of Mr. Floyd's murder. And this, my friends, is a dangerous combination, colliding crises compounding each other.

But our job is to address what is presented. And this is the reality that is presented, and this is what we will deal with.

On the coronavirus situation, there's a lot to learn from what we just went through, and I believe it's a transformative situation in society and something we can learn from going forward.

Coronavirus was a medical issue. It was a public issue. It was an economic issue. But more than anything it was a social issue. It was about how people behave, right? To address coronavirus, what we really had to do was change society.

It was not a government operation. It was not something I could do governmentally. People had to do it. Government could provide leadership, and we had an operational component, but it was about people making the changes that had to be made.

They had to accept it. They had to understand it. They had to change their behavior. That is a monumental undertaking. Always.

[11:40:05]

Social change? When does social change happen? Social change happens when people are presented with the facts, they understand the facts, they believe the facts, there's a plan forward based on the facts, and people care enough to make a difference.

With coronavirus, I sat up here every day and I said, here are the facts. Here are the number of deaths. Here are the hospitalizations. This is what we're looking for. Here is a plan that I think can take us forward.

Based on those facts, people were motivated because it was about life and death and their life and death and about their family's life and death, and we went forward.

Compare the coronavirus situation to the situation we're in with the social unrest we see. People have seen Mr. Floyd's murder. They're watching what's going on, on the streets, every day. And they're saying enough is enough. And it's what they are seeing and what they know that is disturbing.

And we're going to show you again, for those of you who haven't seen, a scene from Buffalo and a scene from New York City, because this is a story all across the state.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(SIRENS)

(SHOUTING)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's bleeding from the ear!

(SHOUTING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: This is Buffalo, New York yesterday. I just spoke with Mr. Gugino (ph) on the phone, who is that gentleman, who, thankfully, is alive. But you see that video, and it disturbs your basic sense of decency

and humanity. Why? Why? Why was that necessary? Where was the threat? An older gentleman, where was the threat? Then you just walk by the person when you see blood coming from his head. And police officers walked by.

It's just fundamentally offensive and frightening. It's just frightening. You say: Who are we? How did we get to this place? Incidents of pushing the press. You have incidents of police getting hit with bricks in the head. You say: Where are we? Who are we? And these are undeniable situations.

Buffalo's situation, I want to applaud Mayor Byron Brown. The mayor of Buffalo suspended the police officers yesterday immediately. And I believe the district attorney is looking into it from a possible criminal liability point of view. And I applaud the district attorney for moving quickly. But people see this. They see the facts.

Now, when you have all this emotion, you have to focus on the facts and the intelligence of the matter, right? It can't be about emotion. Of course, police must protect the public safety and police must protect themselves. That's a fact. Of course, there are also cases of police abuse and the abuse of power. That's a fact. You can have two coincident facts.

Mr. Floyd's murder was the breaking point of a long list of deaths that were unnecessary and which were abusive. That is a fact. And people are saying enough is enough. That is a fact. What people are saying is we must change and we must stop the abuse. And that is a fact.

And New York should be at the forefront of that. That's always been New York' legacy as the progressive capital. We are the ones who hold the standard of what is the right progressive reform. And New York should pass next week what we call the Say Their Name Reform Agenda.

[11:45:01]

Say Their Name Reform Agenda comes from the long list of names of people we have seen who have been abused by police officers, by the criminal justice system. And Mr. Floyd is just the last name on a very long list. Fine. Enough is enough. Change the law, take the moment, reform.

There are four cornerstones for our Say Their Name Agenda. One, the disciplinary records of a police officer. If they're being charged and investigated for abuse, their prior disciplinary record is relevant. And, by the way, it's relevant one way or the other.

If there were no other disciplinary proceedings, that can exonerate the person who was charged. If there are prior disciplinary proceedings for this type of behavior, then, yes, it is evidentiary. But people should know.

Chokeholds. We went through this with Eric Garner. Again, you saw it with Mr. Floyd's death. But we learned it first with Eric Garner and many, many other cases, by the way.

Why? We've seen 9/11 calls, which are fake based. A false 911 call based on race should be classified as a hate crime in the state of New York. We know that it's wrong for the local district attorney to investigate the police force from that county.

By executive order, I did the attorney general as an independent prosecutor. That should be codified in law. I did it five years ago. But these are the cornerstones of a real reform agenda that can address what is going on, on the street.

Reform works for everyone's interest here. Stopping police abuse vindicates the overwhelming majority, 99.9 percent, of police who are there to do the right thing and do the right thing every day.

It restores the confidence, the respect and the trust that you need to make this relationship work. You have to heal the police community relationship. That has to happen for the sake of the police and for the sake of the community.

You look at this looting that's been going on in New York City, this hurts poor communities and distressed communities. You saw many businesses destroyed that are relied upon by that community. You can't have the relationship that works one way or the other.

And even in this politically partisan, racially charged environment, there's still truth and there's still facts, and that's what we have to focus on.

That was the truth with the coronavirus. Even though it was all political and everything was partisan and Democrat/Republican and red and blue, it was never they offer us false choices.

COVID, coronavirus, well, do you want to save people's lives or reopen the economy? And you should reopen the economy and forget public health. Or you should take care of people's health but not reopen the economy. It was never either/or. It can't be either/or.

I know from a hyperbolic, rhetorical partisan, it's one or the other. Liberate New York. Worry about health. Close New York. It was never one or the other. That was unintelligent. It was always both.

It's the same situation here. It's not a question of public safety or civil rights. Whose side are you on, public safety or civil rights? It can't be either/or. It can't be police safety or prosecutor safety. Pick a side. Which are you on? Red or blue? Democrat or Republican? Who are you with? You have to be with both.

Yes, you need public safety. And, yes, you need civil rights. Yes, you need police to be safe. And, yes, you need the protestors to be safe. These are false choices. We need both. Even in this hysterical moment, you need to be able to hold two truths in your hands at the same time.

[11:50:04]

How do we change society to make these reforms happen? How do you have a new societal awareness? Can you do that? Can you change behavior to respect one another?

You're darned right you can. We know we can because we know we can because we did it through this coronavirus. In a very fundamental way, you changed people's behavior. Whether or not they leave the house, whether or not they go to school, whether or not they go to work. They changed themselves, remarkably fast and remarkably effective.

We have the lowest number of deaths from coronavirus that we have had since this started, 42 deaths. The lowest number since we started. Eight weeks ago, we had 800. Eight weeks, 800 people died to 42 people died. Amazing.

How did you do that? I did nothing. The people of the state radically changed how they behave. Look at that progress. Lowest number of hospitalizations to date in a matter of weeks. We know we can change and we know we can change dramatically.

People are focused, we have a plan and that's when social reform happens when people are motivated and focused. That was the Civil Rights Act nationally. That was the Triangle Shirtwaist factory fire, which changed labor rights in this nation. That was the environmental movement after the storm came. That was the revolution of the LGBTQ rights after Stonewall.

That's what we just saw in coronavirus, which will go down in history as one of the great transformational moments of society.

And this is a moment to lead in terms of social change. We'll do it because we are New York tough, smart, united and disciplined and loving. And that is what the moment requires.

Thank you.

Questions?

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Governor, yesterday, we saw medics and lawyers peaceful observers, delivery drivers, all be arrested and be assaulted by police officers. At this point in time, do we think the curfew serves its initial purpose of protecting the public and should be lifted at this point?

KING: Listening to Andrew Cuomo, his daily briefings. These began as daily coronavirus briefings but the governor is using his opportunity to - he knows he has a national platform.

He called it day 97 of the COVID crisis and day 12 of the social unrest crisis in the United States. That, of course, after the brutal killing of George Floyd at the hands of Minneapolis police.

The governor of New York making the case that the country needs to come together. That police need to stop abusing. He specifically condemned an action we saw in Buffalo, New York, a city in his state.

The governor clearly understanding he has a national profile because of the corona coverage, presenting himself as a national voice on the issue of police reform, saying he wants New York State to lead.

I want to bring in CNN's Alexandra Field into the conversation.

It is interesting, Alexandra, he's so often, during coronavirus, contrasts what he was doing and what he wanted to do with national action, specifically President Trump in my cases.

Here, the president of the United States has said bringing the economy back is the best help for the African-American community. He has talked about a tougher approach from police, law enforcement and the military.

Governor Cuomo says, I want the legislation to quickly pass police reforms that essentially tell police, step back, try to deescalate, not escalate.

ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right, laying out a four-point plan he says needs to stop and address what's happening on the streets and address the abuse of police powers. Talking of the need for people to come together to push for and force this kind of social change that he's really talking about. Society needs to demand it and looking at his legislative plan to do it.

This comes after you have these jarring images out of New York State from just last night in Buffalo, this 75-year-old man who's knocked to the ground by police. The governor addressed this head on. He talked about it on Twitter saying it was unjustified and utterly disgraceful. And he talked about it today again in this press conference.

He said he actually spoke to the man who was knocked over. John, that's good news, because at least this man is able to speak to him. We were not certain of his condition, only knew that he was stable.

John, this man was pushed to the ground and bleeding from his ears. Governor Cuomo expressing outrage saying this protester was clearly not a threat to the police.

The governor also expressing his outrage at the fact that the police did not respond by helping the man out after he was knocked to the ground. So many of them, as you saw in the video, just continued to walk by. It is stunning.

[11:55:12]

KING: It is stunning. The governor applauding the mayor for suspending those officers, suggesting there could be a criminal investigation.

Alexandra Field, thank you.

When we come back at the top of the hour, the president is touting new jobs numbers. The president about to hit the road. The president is getting some stiff criticism from his former chief of staff.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)