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Macron in U.K. for WWII Commemorations; U.K. Struggles to Address Racial Issues and Police Practices; Premier League Makes Emotional Return; Iceland Begins Re-opening to International Travellers. Aired 10-11a ET
Aired June 18, 2020 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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[10:00:20]
HALA GORANI, CNNI ANCHOR: Welcome everybody to our continuing coverage. I'm Hala Gorani, this hour the threat is still very real and rising across many
parts of the world. The latest on the coronavirus pandemic and how it is taking hold particularly in Latin America. We will be live in Mexico.
Also criminal charges are brought against two officers in the killing of a black man. In Atlanta prosecutors are getting some very disturbing details
of how he was treated by police even after he was shot.
And Donald Trump says allegations against him in a new book by his former National Security Adviser are pure fiction. We'll look closer at what he
allegedly said about China's Uighur detention camps.
Around the world officials are talking about how to avoid a second wave of COVID-19. But many places have not escaped the first way, there's still
very much in it. In the United States cases are on the rise in nearly two dozen states. And there is concerned that Florida could become a new
epicenter. Yet Donald Trump is holding a political rally with thousands of people Saturday in Oklahoma another state with rising cases. And Trump
supporters in Tulsa already are lining up outside of the arena for tickets. Remember, this is taking place on Saturday. It will be the nation's largest
indoor gathering in three months. Public health experts fear the rally could become a coronavirus super spreader event.
On the other side of the globe, a hundreds of flights to and from Beijing have been canceled now, authorities they're trying to rein in a sudden
outbreak. They have placed the Chinese capital on a so-called soft lockdown. China is reporting 24 new locally transmitted cases, two of them
linked to an outbreak at a Beijing market that has been tied to about 130 other infections.
Now, as we mentioned, cases are surging in many parts of Latin America. The president of Honduras is being treated in hospital for pneumonia, after
announcing that he and his wife had contracted COVID-19. His wife was asymptomatic by the way.
Meanwhile, Brazil reported another 32,000 cases in just one day. Brazil as a country is now edging close, very close to a million total cases. Peru
surpassed Italy and its number of confirmed cases smaller population remember, and Mexico is nearing 20,000 deaths from COVID-19.
That's where we find our Matt Rivers. He joins us now live from Mexico City with more. So talk to us more Matt about why in so many parts of Latin
America was so much warning. I mean, these countries knew that the pandemic was coming their way were still seeing so many cases.
MATT RIVERS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I mean, Hala there are a litany of reasons ranging from everything from structural issues in the healthcare
systems here to a lack of political leadership. In some countries, especially in places like Brazil, there's a long list of reasons to how we
got here in Latin America, despite many countries actually taking quarantine measures going back all the way to March. But let me let me show
you what we look like right now in Latin America and the Caribbean in terms of a seven day moving average of the death toll. We're above 2,000 right
now and the World Health Organization in a briefing on Tuesday said that that number could go up, that this outbreak in this part of the world is
still accelerating in their words and a huge reason for that is Brazil. We can show you the seven day moving average of new cases there. And that
continues to go up.
And I would point out that five of the last nine days Hala, Brazil has seen more than 30,000 confirmed cases recorded in a single day. We're expecting
a very similar number today, which would put us on pace to see 1 million cases in Brazil on Friday. A University of Washington model predicts that
Brazil will overtake the United States death toll by as soon as August 1st.
And finally here in Mexico, you can also see the seven day moving average is going up? We have seen an increase in newly confirmed cases since June
1st of more than 70%. The death toll has gone up by nearly 90% in that time frame. And yet what is the similarity between Mexico and Brazil? They are
opening up their economies in certain ways.
Now, yes, both countries Hala taken massive economic hits. There's many people who work in the so called informal economy in this part of the
world. These are people who have to go out and work every day to make a living. They can't just take sick leave. They can't work from home, but the
reality is, is if you're opening up economies right now, while the peaks, they're not flattening, they're not going down, they are still going up.
There's going to be drastic consequences in Latin America and the Caribbean
[10:05:12]
GORANI: Yes, it seems as though they're making that calculation, some countries that they cannot allow their economies to just be completely
decimated anymore, that they're going to make the calculation, as it seems they are, that they can take the certain number of deaths. But the question
is, of course, can people who are sick at the care that they need our hospitals being overwhelmed here?
RIVERS: Yes, I mean, that you know, country to country, obviously, things are different, for example, Uruguay is in a much better place, let's say
than Brazil has, been in the hardest hit countries, Peru, Brazil, Mexico, we are seeing hospitals that are being stretched to capacity. And the fear
is, is that there's not much more room for error. So of course, everyone understands that the economic impact from this has been massive and that
these governments are walking a very fine line between trying to jumpstart economic activity, but also keeping people safe. The fear is if you start
to open back up and I'm seeing it on the streets here in Mexico City, traffic is up, public transportation ridership is up. And if that happens,
do hospitals that are already stretched are they able to take another surgeon patients and what happens that this peak doesn't go down, doesn't
flatten if it keeps going up? And we're not even into the fall yet.
So there's a lot of different aspects at play here. But, you know, these countries are opening back up at a time where you see Europe for example,
some places they're opening back up, but generally the case total has been going down. The exact opposite is happening in Latin America. And that's
why so many public health experts are nervous.
GORANI: All right, Matt Rivers. Thanks very much.
Matt discussed and talk to us about Peru, despite being one of the first countries in Latin America to shut down at the start of the outbreak. Peru
now has the seventh highest number of cases worldwide, topping 240,000 and more than 7,000 deaths. And people some of them are fleeing Lima the
capital as the virus is tearing through the country. Guillermo Galdos followed one family as they made the long journey back home.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GUILLERMO GALDOS, JOURNALIST (voice-over): This bus terminal is overwhelmed with people desperate to get out of Lima. About 70% of Peruvians work in
the informal economy and live hand to mouth.
When President Martin Vizcarra imposed a strict lockdown for coronavirus. It sparked an economic crisis. Maria and her three daughters move to Lima
for the sake of her oldest child's education. But now she's desperate to get back home, back to her husband, back to safety. With no planes, trains
or buses, she's starting the 350 mile journey on foot.
MARIA (through translation): I know the risk I am putting my children in, but I don't have a choice. Either I die trying to get out or starve to
death in my room.
GALDOS (voice-over): It's hot and food and water scares. A passing truck driver throws the family something to eat.
MARIA (through translation): I am thinking, because I am almost home.
GALDOS (voice-over): After three days on the road Maria is struggling to carry on. She's 4,500 meters high and beyond this. The air is thin, the
journey relentless.
MARIA (through translation): It's a bit hard to breathe. He's stopping. I have walked a lot. I can imagine.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translation): There is a little food. If you want, you can eat this.
MARIA (through translation): Thank you. God bless you.
GALDOS (voice-over): The truck driver takes them to the next town. From there, the family must continue on foot.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translation): You can't pass this checkpoint with minors.
MARIA (through translation): I have no one to leave them with. Where would I leave them? I am going to my farm.
GALDOS (voice-over): That night, Maria and her daughter set up camp in a clear in the rain forest.
MARIA (through translation): I want to apologize for putting you at risk. But we couldn't stay there any longer. Thankfully God has protected us. But
I have put you at risk.
GALDOS (voice-over): After seven days in 300 miles traveled, Maria and her family have made it to their home province. The lands of the indigenous
Ashaninka people. There are only about 50 miles from home, but there is a problem.
(on-camera): Maria and daughter's just heard that the local indigenous communities have shut down completely the area and they're not allowing
anybody in. The indigenous people are right to be worried.
[10:10:00]
(voice-over): (INAUDIBLE) region is one of the most badly affected areas in the country for coronavirus. After delicate negotiations she's allowed to
pass, on the agreement that she self isolate on her farm once she gets there.
MARIA (through translation): Just a little left before I see my animals, my husband. Thank you dear Lord. Thank you. Thank you God for bringing me
home.
GALDOS (voice-over): After all the pain and suffering the final torment, the family cannot hold one another in case someone transmits the virus.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translation): How was the travel?
MARIA (through translation): It was so difficult. We talked alit. We have all suffered so much. I never want to go to Lima again. I thought I was
going to die there with my girls.
GALDOS (voice-over): Not everyone leaving Lima will return home safely. For some dangerous found on the road will be greater than the poverty and
disease they're fleeing from. But Maria and her family are some of the lucky ones who united.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: All right, a report from Peru there.
To the United States now and just today is after Rayshard Brooks was killed by police in Georgia. Charges have now been filed against the two officers.
Brooks' encounter with police at a fast food drive through last week turned into a scuffle before Brooks was shot twice in the back. Both officers
involved are facing multiple charges and warrants have been issued for their arrest.
Correspondent Dianne Gallagher, who has been now live from Atlanta on this very, very quick decision. And this very quick process that led to these
charges being filed, Dianne?
DIANNE GALLAGHER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Hala that's a good way to describe it, quick decision, quick process. And we are waiting because
those officers have until 6:00 p.m. today to turn themselves in. Now, both of the officers were charged but the officer who shot Rayshard Brooks is
facing a felony murder charge, which carries a penalty that could reach up to the death penalty if convicted.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GALLAGHER (voice-over): Some Atlanta police refused to respond to calls and at least three of the department fix zones last night, sources within the
department tell CNN. They say it's in response to charges against the two officers involved in the fatal shooting of Rayshard Brooks. But the Atlanta
Police Department disputed there had been a widespread walkout tweeting, earlier suggestions were inaccurate. The department is experiencing a
higher than usual number of call outs with the incoming shift.
KEISHA LANCE BOTTOMS (D) MAYOR ATLANTA: Across the country, morale is down with police departments and I think ours is down tenfold. We expect that
our officers will keep their commitment to our communities.
GALLAGHER (voice-over): Just hours earlier, the Fulton County District Attorney announced 11 charges against former officer Garrett Rolfe who shot
Brooks twice in the back. Rolfe's charges in include five counts of aggravated assault and felony murder.
PAUL HOWARD, DISTRICT ATTORNEY, FULTON COUNTY: The possible sentences for a felony murder conviction would be life, life without parole or the death
penalty.
GALLAGHER (voice-over): Officer Devin Brosnan, who's now on administrative duty is facing three charges, aggravated assault and two violations of oath
of office.
HOWARD: Officer Brosnan however has admitted that he was in fact standing on Mr. Brooks' body immediately after the shooting.
GALLAGHER (voice-over): The district attorney also telling reporters Brosnan is now a state witness.
HOWARD: He has decided to testify on behalf of the State in this case.
GALLAGHER (voice-over): But according to his attorney.
AMANDA CLARK PALMER, ATTORNEY FOR DEVIN BROSNAN: There's no agreement that our client is going to testify at any hearing. In my view, he doesn't need
a deal, he shouldn't have been charged with the crime in the first place.
GALLAGHER (voice-over): The district attorney also providing this image allegedly showing Rolfe kicking Brooks after the shooting, that's something
his legal team denies and Rolfe's lawyers additionally claimed that Brooks was not running away from the former officer.
LANCE LORUSSO, ATTORNEY FOR GARRETT ROLFE: Mr. Brooks turned and offered extreme violence towards a uniformed law enforcement officer. If he was
able to deploy the taser, it would incapacitate Officer Rolfe through his body armor.
GALLAGHER (voice-over): Brooks' lawyer calling the charges against the two officers a good first step.
JUSTIN MILLER, ATTORNEY FOR RAYSHARD BROOKS' FAMILY: But as you know, you know, that doesn't always result in convictions. I'm glad the DA's office
really looked into this. And hopefully, we can get some justice out of this one.
GALLAGHER (voice-over): And for Brooks' widow to Tomika Miller, Wednesday's news was another painful reminder of moving forward without her husband.
TOMIKA MILLER, WIDOW OF RAYSHARD BROOKS: I don't know would have done the same for myself. But I felt everything that he felt just by hearing what he
went through and it hurt really bad.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[10:14:59]
GALLAGHER: You can just hear the pain in her voice there Hala, she actually left the courtroom and the district attorney was talking about what
happened to her husband in his final moments. They're laying on the ground outside of that Wendy's.
Now, we mentioned that officer Devin Brosnan stood on the shoulders of Rayshard Brooks while he was on the ground still fighting for his life. His
attorney say that that's a mischaracterization of what happened. They say that he sustained a concussion during that scuffle and that he was
disoriented and did not realize at that time that Mr. Brooks had been shot, Hala. And, you know, we talked about the fact that some of the police
officers here in Atlanta are not responding to calls. I spoke with the representative from their union who said that this was not an organized
strike or anything like that, that these were officers who felt like they were being supported by their city, by the leaders in their city and that
we're doing it in response to those charges against the officers. He said that they're still working receiving reports that the union of more call
outs today.
And so this may be an ongoing issue in Atlanta in response to these charges. Again, those two officers have until 6:00 p.m. Eastern time today
to turn themselves in.
GORANI: All right, we'll keep our eye on this story. Dianne Gallagher, live in Atlanta, Georgia. Thanks very much.
And a little later this hour, we'll hear about policing problems in the United Kingdom. As we've been reporting over the last several weeks, these
BLM protests and this movement has expanded beyond the borders of the United States. We'll talk about the similarities and differences compared
to the U.S., plus what can be done to ensure justice and fair treatment for both the public and police in a country like the UK.
I want to talk to you about a breaking news story from Washington D.C., the U.S. Supreme Court has blocked the Trump administration's efforts to end
the DACA program that protects thousands of immigrants who were brought to the United States as children. DACA has been one of the most contentious
aspects of the President's hardline on immigration.
The Trump administration tried to end this program called the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals, which was an Obama-era program. But the
Supreme Court and a five to four decision has ruled against the Trump administration in a decision to essentially save DACA, DACA, which allows
about 700,000 people who are who were born kids of undocumented immigrants during a certain period of time. These 700,000 people will now continue to
be able to stay in the United States and to work and study in the United States.
And by the way, this is the second rebuke to the Trump administration after the Supreme Court ruled that federal law protects LGBTQ Americans as well
as minorities in the U.S. So again, reiterating our Breaking news. The U.S. Supreme Court has blocked the Trump administration's attempt to end DACA
which was a 2012 program that allows 700,000 people or so, were the children of undocumented immigrants to remain in the United States. We'll
have more on this story a bit later in the program.
And up next, some stunning revelations are coming out of tell-all book from President Trump's former national security adviser. We'll dive into the
details of what he said particularly about the Uighur camps in China.
And a little later in sports, the Premier League is back and players are bringing a powerful new message with them to the pitch. We'll have that as
well.
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[10:20:51]
GORANI: Welcome back. The Trump administration is trying to stop the publication of a book by former National Security Adviser John Bolton. It's
a damning tell all about Donald Trump's presidency. One accusation contained in it that Mr. Trump asked China's president to help him win the
2020 election. Sara Murray reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SARA MURRAY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Bolton's forthcoming book, The Room Where It Happened, a copy of which was obtained by CNN offers this
scathing summary of a Trump presidency. I am hard-pressed to identify any significant Trump decision during my tenure that wasn't driven by
reelection calculations. Trump press Chinese President Xi Jinping to help him out with farmers by buying more U.S. crops, pleading with Xi to ensure
he'd win Bolton writes, I would print Trump's exact words but the government's prepublication review process has decided otherwise.
Bolton also confirms the case house impeachment managers laid out earlier this year. Writing the Trump said he would withhold security aid to Ukraine
until all the Russia investigation materials related to Clinton and Biden had been turned over. And he says Trump was prone to doling out personal
favors to dictators he liked. At one point telling the Turkish president he would replace Southern District of New York prosecutors to make an
investigation into a Turkish firm go away.
Bolton says the pattern looks like obstruction of justice as a way of life, which we couldn't accept, and claims he raised some of his concerns with
Attorney General Bill Barr. A longtime Republican who served in the Trump White House for 17 months. Bolton says deliberations there were like
college food fights and calls Trump stunningly uninformed, unsure that Britain was a nuclear power and unaware that Finland was not part of
Russia.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: Would be -- well, that was Sara Murray reporting John Bolton's tell-all book of true sheds light on the relationship between U.S.
President Trump and Chinese President Xi. And what he says are the motives behind Mr. Trump's foreign policy.
Joining me now is Kevin Rudd, former Prime Minister of Australia and current president of the Asia Society Policy Institute. Thanks for being
with us.
I want to first get your reaction to one of the other allegations in the book that Donald Trump agreed with Xi Jinping on the idea of building
detainment camps for minority Uighur Muslims. What did you make of that?
KEVIN RUDD, FMR AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER: Well, ultimately, none of us know what transpired between John Bolton, the National Security Advisor and
President Trump. But the bottom line is we got to ask ourselves, what would be Mr. Bolton's motivation and telling abject lies, given that once the
documents are eventually released from the U.S. administration, then he'll be proven to be either truthful or not.
So the international community I think, is fairly stunned by this. But we've also known that President Trump throughout his presidency has shown
scant regard for international human rights diplomacy. He also has a particular attitude that we've seen in relation to Muslims around the
world. And for those reasons, therefore, it is shocking but not necessarily surprising that President Trump would say something like this.
GORANI: Well, and the notion also that Trump would have asked China for help in winning reelection in 2020, he publicly asked Russia to hack
Democratic e-mails in 2016. And he admitted to essentially the content of the conversation with the Ukrainian president that led to his impeachment.
So it's not a -- it's rather easy to believe, when Bolton writes that Trump asked for China's help in winning the 2020 election.
But I want to ask you about some of these other aspects of the book China got -- I should say CNN got an advanced copy. On his way to the Helsinki
meeting, Trump stopped to see then British Prime Minister Theresa May in the UK and during that meeting, May's national security advisors speaking
about the script ball poisoning in Salisbury a few years ago, referred to the attack as one on a nuclear power. Trump asked, oh, are you a nuclear
power, which I knew was not intended as a joke, Bolton wrote.
[10:25:13]
So assuming that this is true, have you in your time as prime minister encountered world leaders that were so ignorant about international
affairs, and yet were put in such a position of authority?
RUDD: I think we have to really go back a bit. I think Ronald Reagan, as we recall, was sometimes sketchy on aspects of international relations, and
which country was which and Latin America when he was visiting there. But to be ignorant of Britain's nuclear power status, given us been a fact by
and large since the Second World War, and underpins the reality of Britain being a permanent member of the Security Council, the United Nations. And
for me, it's passing strange that three and a half years into the presidency or however long it was when he went and had this meeting with
Theresa May.
It basically is pretty jaw dropping. But if I could just retreat to the China question briefly, you see the China revelations for me are stunning
if they are, in fact true. We've discussed the Xinjiang account from Mr. Bolton. You've made reference to the account concerning President Trump's
interest in Xi Jinping helping him out with agricultural sales from the United States in the lead up to the presidential election. The other
account according to Mr. Bolton's book, is about the President's admiration for Xi Jinping, having removed a two term limit and looking quizzically as
the possibility of extending a two term limit the United States.
Here's the bottom line, in China which I spend a fair bit of time in, there is a general view amongst the Chinese think tank community that the best
thing that could happen for China would still be for President Trump to be reelected. And there are two reasons for that. One is he has consistently
through his own interventions derailed the rest of the U.S. administration's hardline anti China's strategy. And we can point to one
example after another of that. But secondly, the other big interest from China's perspective is this, that President Trump does such damage
globally, to American Alliance solidarity around the world, both in Europe and in Asia. But this is a net strategic win for China, having him continue
in office.
And furthermore, him undertaking a wholesale assault on the multilateral system which America set up in the first place, but withdrawing America
from multiple bodies, such as the world trade, organization, et cetera, as China then just marches into filled in the vacuum. So what's China want? In
my judgment what China wants despite all these sound and noise and all the pyrotechnics we hear from the Trump White House, is that probably
unbalanced prefer to see Trump reelected.
GORANI: All right, that's, that's actually interesting. Because Wednesday, Donald Trump signed a bill to punish China for Uighur persecution, perhaps
a reaction to some of these allegations in the Bolton book and also this trade dispute is really hurting China. But you think despite that, if Joe
Biden were elected, China would probably think it won't -- it wouldn't be as easy strategically for it to assert itself on the global stage.
RUDD: But if you look, for example, at the Xinjiang Human Rights Policy Act, which has just gone through the United States Congress, and as you
just said, President Trump has now signed into law. It would be very difficult for him not to do, so given it has bipartisan support of such an
extraordinary level of votes in the U.S. Congress both in the House and in the Senate.
But I think overall, when the Chinese look at that, they'll say, well, you see a hardening of American positions against China in general, both
Republicans and Democrats. But here's the difference. Their deep level assessment is that under the Democrats and under Biden administration, they
would be put together a foreign policy and national security policy team and international economic policy team, which is much more likely to give
effect to a strategy for dealing with China than they have experienced with President Trump.
In other words, you would have a president marching in step with the other arms of a bad administration. That is something which would cause the
Chinese, frankly, deep concerns. But what we've got now still is this several months between where we are at the moment and the presidential
election and those of us have been watching carefully the meeting between Secretary of State Pompeo and Yang Jiechi on the Chinese government have
been particularly concerned about what might still happen by way of deep and disturbing crisis escalation particularly over Taiwan and Hong Kong in
the remaining several months.
GORANI: Kevin Rudd, thank you so much for joining us. The former Australian Prime Minister there with more reaction to these allegations in the
upcoming John Bolton book, thank you so much for joining us.
Coming up, Emmanuel Macron is in the United Kingdom for World War II commemorations with Britain's Prime Minister more on the French president's
first overseas trip since the pandemic began. We haven't seen visiting dignitaries in months and we're getting one today. There's our Nic
Robertson waiting. These are live images coming to us from 10 Downing. We'll be right back.
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GORANI: Welcome back, happening now, the French President Emmanuel Macron is meeting with Britain's Prime Minister at 10 Downing Street. And as we
were discussing with our producers, this is the first time we see a head of state meeting since March. They're greeting each other there at 10 Downing,
no handshake, or keeping a safe distance. I'm not exactly sure if you could call that two meters. But there are no handshakes, no hugs, no face to face
chat.
Mr. Macron and Boris Johnson will be commemorating key events from World War II today and they're expected to discuss important matters like the
COVID-19 pandemic and Brexit. That topic is back in the forefront. This is the first major meeting between European leaders since this outbreak began.
And so Nic Robertson is there at 10 Downing Street. It is strange as I was saying to see two world leaders meet up in person and not over zoom call or
WebEx call. Talk to us about what the two leaders are going to talk about at a safe distance?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yeah, it was kind of strange, wasn't it? And that juxtaposition, the no handshake. We were all
expecting that. And as you said there, was it really two meters. That may be part of the conversation because of course, it's a two meter social
distancing regulation in the U.K., and it's only a meter in France. So in their conversations about the pandemic, very lightly to sort of do a
compare and contrast France a couple of weeks ahead of the U.K. But France getting ready to open schools next week.
Boris Johnson doesn't appear to be able to get schools open in the U.K. until September, the social distancing distance and the air corridors is an
issue, you know, Britain desperately sort of wants to be have that access to the European Union, but it has put a 14 day quarantine on anyone coming
into the U.K. and currently, Brits traveling to France would face the same thing. So this issue of air corridors, that if you citizens from one
country visit another don't have to go through this quarantine process that may come up for discussion, but it is really a day about commemorating that
moment, 80 years ago today, when General Charles de Gaulle came fled France during the Nazi occupation, came to Britain and issued that call to arms
for the French resistance and that's what's being honored.
[10:35:36]
In an hour or so the, the British Red Arrows for the RAF sort of display team or fly over here with their French counterparts in a display. So it's
about that commemoration. And as you say, Brexit yes, certainly Boris Johnson's going to want something to get across his points to Emmanuel
Macron, the French on for their part, though, may want to leave it up to Brussels to do the negotiations. That's been the continuing message
certainly their attentions there over Brexit, certainly the European Union feeling frustrated with some of the positions the British government is
still taking.
GORANI: All right, Nic Robertson, thanks very much live at 10 Downing Street.
Now to the issue of police brutality and racial injustice that has sparked protests around the globe. Critics say U.K. police forces have similar
issues like a chronic lack of diversity. And in some cases, excessive use of force though it has to be said the U.K. and U.S. policing tactics and
techniques are very different.
Joining me now in London is Michael Fuller, Britain's First Black Police Chief Constable, the former Chief Constable of Kent Police, he wrote the
memoir, A Search for Belonging. It's a reflection on the treatment of ethnic minority officers and the lack of progress in public service and
inclusion.
Thank you very much for being with us. What would be the U.S. equivalent of police constable? Would it be chief of police? Would that be the equivalent
rank in the U.S.?
MICHAEL FULLER, FORMER CHIEF CONSTABLE OF KENT POLICE: Yeah, the rank is called Chief Constable. So I was chief of police and in charge of some 5000
staff and had a 300 million pound budget.
GORANI: But this is what -- this hasn't happened since you left the police force. So there really is a lack of representation at the highest ranks
here in the U.K.
FULLER: Yeah, I mean, my story is basically that I joined the police at 16 and a half. I'd been in care. I joined as a cadet, lots of people told me
not to join the police. There was lots of discrimination in the police at the time. People said don't do it. Friend said, don't do it. I wasn't
brought up by my parents. I was brought up in a care home by an amazing woman called Auntie Margaret. She was white, but she was the only person
who supported my decision to join the police. And I rose through the ranks of the police, some 11 ranks in in London. And ultimately I was then
selected by the county of Kent by the people there. And it's predominantly white people who live in the county. And they selected me to be their chief
of police.
I had a wonderful support, both before I started in Kent, and whilst I was there, absolutely brilliant time. But what I didn't like joining the police
is the racism. And I discussed that in my book. I talked about the racism that I experienced from some officers. I experienced racism from members of
the public, but I also had support from members of the public who wanted to see a more representative police force.
GORANI: And what -- do you, I mean, we obviously policing tactics are very different in the U.K. and in the U.S. for one thing, many police officers
in the U.K. are unarmed, we see instances of police brutality in the U.S. that almost always involve a firearm, we thought in the case of Rayshard
Brooks in Atlanta for instance. But there are similarities, the under representation of ethnic minorities, the fact that black and ethnic
minorities here in the U.K. are much more likely to be arrested, to be stopped, to be searched, to be find. What needs to be done here in the
U.K.?
FULLER: Well, in the U.K., I mean, we still have some serious problems as you do in America. So there are 43 police forces that we still have --
we've had our disasters in terms of people who've died in the hands of the police, and there needs to be closer scrutiny and accountability. At a
strategic level with tackling racial injustice and the need for social equality. There needs to be individual accountability of officers. So the
latest thing that I'm very keen on is officers wearing body worn video. These officers wearing their own videos like you have dash cams in cars,
the officers will have body worn video. And I think that will bring greater individual accountability and hopefully reduce the chances of another
instance like that awful, brutal incident we saw involving George Floyd, where he sadly died and my heart goes out to his family.
[10:40:18]
GORANI: Yeah. Dominic Raab, a top cabinet minister here in the U.K. was asked about taking a knee. Some police officers have taken a knee in the
U.K. to express solidarity with the protesters and the demonstrators were demanding more social and racial justice. He was asked about that, this was
his reply today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DOMINIC RAAB, U.K. FOREIGN SECRETARY: I understand this sense of frustration and restlessness which is driving the Black Lives Matters
movement. I've got so on this taking the knee thing which I don't know maybe it's got a broader history but seems to be taken from the Game of
Thrones feels to me like a symbol of subjugation subordination perhaps one of liberation and emancipation. But I understand people feel differently
about it. So it's a matter of personal choice.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Right. He also said he only takes the need for the queen and when he asked his wife to marry him. Do you think U.K. leaders are just out of
touch when you have the Foreign Secretary of the United Kingdom answer a question about taking the knee in that way?
FULLER: Well, I'm slightly embarrassed for the Secretary said something like that. I mean, at the end of the day, very much a personal decision.
We've seen one police chief take the knee. It is an expression of empathy. It is an expression of solidarity with all those people who believe there's
a need for racial equality and social justice in our society. And some people believe in that and some people don't. It's very much a personal
choice. But the thing is, we want a public service. We want a police service that actually serves the people that works for the people, but it
protects the people and believe since social justice and racial equality, you know, he wants to do service that's delivered equitably.
GORANI: Right. Thank you so much, Michael Fuller for joining us. Very interesting conversation. I'm glad we were able to get you back after some
technical issues yesterday. We had small ones today, but we still managed to get through the interview. Thank you so much.
Still ahead, the English Premier League players are speaking of taking any sending a clear message and supportive racial equality as they return to
the pitch. We are live in Manchester coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: There was a powerful message of unity of solidarity as well on Wednesday, as the English Premier League players took a knee in support of
the Black Lives Movement and to honor also COVID-19 victims.
World Sports Don Riddell joins me now. So it's quite a way for the league to make its return, Don. Although, I think it would have been more
surprising if they hadn't done it because really this movement has touched many people and this taking the knee gesture seems to not really be
accepted as a way to both protest inequality but also honor those who've lost their lives.
[10:45:16]
DON RIDDELL, CNN WORLD SPORT: Yeah, you're right, Hala. I think we were expecting something. Honestly though I don't think we were expecting
something quite so coordinated. And those images were beamed immediately all over the world. It really was extraordinary. And especially when you
think of the way in which the NFL in the United States made it so difficult for American football players to protest social injustice back in 2016.
This was quite something players and referees kneeling at the start of both games with the full support and endorsement of the Premier League.
Afterwards, it was clear that Manchester City's manager Pep Guardiola had been really humbled by the moment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PEP GUARDIOLA, MANCHESTER CITY MANAGER: We should say that what people is apologizes for the way we treat the black people in the last 400 years, of
four centuries, so I feel a shame. What we have done for this marvellous black people around the world is not a problem by the USA and that sense of
America would have been for Mr. Floyd things follow racism isn't everywhere.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
RIDDELL: World sports Alex Thomas was covering that game for us in Manchester. Alex, that game was really dominated by the unified protests
from the players. What kind of message do you think their action is sent?
ALEX THOMAS, CNN WORLD SPORT: It's a hugely powerful and symbolic moment, Don, really interesting how Hala just handed over to you. Because I don't
blame her for the way she phrased that question. Do you think there'll be many people that are maybe casual sports fans who don't follow the game
that said, yeah, we expect to see this. We've been seeing a lot of kneeling. We've been seeing the global coverage of the Black Lives Matter
movements. But you and I know that in football, despite the fact they've been lots of complaints about racism in the sport for many years and lots
of fine words spoken, there's been very little action to combat it.
Week in week out on our world sports shows, we've had to talk about how some racist incidents have been poorly punished by football authorities.
Individual players have spoken out about that. And at one stage, there seemed to be a real momentum within FIFA, the world governing body to
tackle it properly. But one of the people leading that Jeffrey Webb was one of those actually caught up in the corruption scandal back in 2015. And to
me, it felt like that global impetus to try and tackle racism and football stalled, so to see 22 players in each game all taken along with the
referees and some of the coaches in the dugout was just a massive moment absolutely unprecedented in what is unprecedented times, Don.
RIDDELL: Yeah. And we'll see how other leagues and other sports particularly here in the United States can follow a moment like that. Man
City won the game three nil against Arsenal, and I guess it was fitting. The Raheem Sterling scored the opening goal because he has been one of the
league's most outspoken players on this subject racial inequality.
THOMAS: Yeah, when we talk about individuals Sterling is definitely one of them. Obviously here in the U.K., someone who plays for cities rivals
across town here. Marcus Rashford for the Manchester United in England player has also been getting a lot of credit, quite rightly for some of his
social justice work particularly around free school meals for poor children during the upcoming summer holidays here and also has been, you know, a
vocal critic of racism in football. But it's really been Sterling that has kind of taken on his shoulders, really, some of the critics in the far
right sections of the U.K. press, and those that like Sterling support greater racial inequality have already championed him and said, how well
he's done to progress as a footballer on the pitch and then away from the field do so much in terms of combating racism in the sport. And we know
that it's not just confined to football. The racism in football is a symptom of wider society. And he's done a lot more than most having
experienced it both for club and for country, particularly when abroad on England duty. He knows the problems that some other countries have maybe
more than others, although certainly England can't say that it's completely clean. Got a completely clean record when it comes to racism and football.
But I think seeing so many Premier League players take a knee is a massive wake up call for governing bodies throughout the sport and many countries
across the globe.
RIDDELL: Yeah, quite right. Alex Thomas, we will continue this conversation in the next hour. Hala, it wasn't just the football, it wasn't just the
kneeling, there was also controversy, there was a goal in the other game that should have been allowed that wasn't because the ball cross the line.
I guess that's how we know the Premier League is back. There's some good and there's some bad too.
GORANI: Right. Interesting, your discussion with Alex about how taking the knee was for these players to do that wasn't necessarily what was expected
when people who don't follow football closely, like me assume that it would happen. So it's interesting, it is a significant cultural and social
moment. Thanks very much, Don.
[10:50:10]
Coming up, countries struggling with their coronavirus outbreak may want to look at Iceland.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KARI STEFANSSON, CEO OF DECODE GENETICS: I insist that what has happened in the United States, what has happened in Great Britain is that because of
lack of screening, because of lack or an attempt to understand what's really going on, it has been really difficult to contain the infection.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: We're live in Iceland as the country reopens after virtually beating the disease. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: Iceland is welcoming international travelers once again as it nears a full recovery from the pandemic. Incoming airline passengers will be
tested for COVID-19 upon arrival. Our Max Foster is joining us live from Gullfoss, Iceland with more about the country's success in beating the
virus. They have a small population so they can test virtually everybody. You were tested as well. Talk to us about your experience?
MAX FOSTER, CNN LONDON CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, so obviously this is one of the most famous tourist sites in Iceland. You can see a rainbow four forming
there. There are some tourists here but not very many at all. And that's because they've only just reopened the borders. They've been able to reopen
the borders, Hala, because they've effectively wiped out the virus of the country and they started with quite a high infection rate.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
FOSTER: Iceland's latest visitor experience. A virus testing station for incoming air passengers.
Well, not the most comfortable welcome I've had at an airport but it was either that or go into quarantine for 14 days here.
It may be a remote and sparsely populated volcanic islands. But Iceland had a high virus infection rate. That didn't translate into a high death rate
though. In fact, it had one of the lowest in the world.
The country didn't go into a full lockdown. The restaurants stayed open, faces uncovered. When someone tested positive, a rigorous contact tracing
system kicked in.
KRISTIN YR GUNNARSDOTTIR, RECOVERED FROM COVID-19: I got a call and I was told that I had been around person tested positive for COVID, and it was a
waiter at the place where I have lunch with my co-workers, the trading team told me that I needed to go to self-isolation.
FOSTER: This is the lab where all the test samples are sent. I got my result by text a few hours after landing. Here it is.
You have not been diagnosed with COVID-19. They don't just test for the virus here, but also its mutations that allows them to map which countries
the latest infections came from, and how they spread through Iceland.
STEFANSSON: Since we sequence the virus everyone infected in Iceland, we can first of all determine where the mutation came from. And then we can
follow it as it is spreading in society.
Kari Stefansson who runs the lab is baffled that other countries aren't using the same system.
STEFANSSON: Now I insist that what has happened to the United States, what has happened in Great Britain, is that because of lack of screening because
of our lack of an attempt to understand what is really going on it has been really difficult to contain the infection.
FOSTER: But scientists had a big advantage here. Politicians, including the Prime Minister stood back and allowed them to lead on the pandemic and
front the public response.
KATRIN JAKOBSDOTTIR, PRIME MINISTER OF ICELAND: This crisis is not a problem to me, and it was very important not to politicize this crisis.
FOSTER: Now they've pretty much beaten the virus, the government is pushing to reopen the country for business.
JAKOBSDOTTIR: In Iceland, we are faced with very high unemployment rates right now. We are not very used to high unemployment rates. So the main
factor, you know, our guideline now in the government will be how to lower that number and have more people working again.
FOSTER: So as the government's reopens tourist sites like the blue lagoon visitors will return and refill these pools. Inevitably there will be
risks. But the government feels now is the right time to restart the economy.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
Hala, this was a bit colder so I won't be going in there. But I think a couple of things we can take away from this is the tracking system. They
weren't just tracking and testing for the virus they were going for all the mutations, which allowed them to work out how it was moving around the
country. But also the way it wasn't politicized. The scientists took the lead and on the politicians step back so everyone could get behind the same
strategy.
GORANI: All right, Max Foster thanks very much. Definitely this background of the day for max and I even think there's a rainbow behind him. It's all
coming together for Max, thanks very much.
Vera Lynn's voice brought hope and comfort to millions during the bleakest days of World War II. The British singer and philanthropist has died at age
103. Her song, Will Meet Again debuted at the start of the war in 1939. And too many her words still inspire memories of courage and confidence.
(MUSIC)
GORANI: Much became Dame Vera Lynn in 1975, honored for her decades of work with children's charities. Vera Lynn passed away today at 103. Thanks for
joining me this hour. I'm Hala Gorani. I'll see you next hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
END
