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Top Covid Caseloads: US & Brazil Still Lead The World; US Military Base Outbreak Alarms Okinawa Residents; China Locks Down And Locks Out US Diplomats In Chengdu; Republican Stimulus Plan; U.K. Tourists Surprised by Quarantine Order; Island-Hopping Cruise Resumes in Taiwan; How One California Family Fought the Virus Together; Official: U.S. Has Enough Tests for Anyone Who Needs One. Aired 1-2a ET

Aired July 27, 2020 - 01:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[01:00:00]

MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR: Hotspots in America, a record day in Australia and a surge in Brazil. Your coronavirus headlines from across the globe coming up.

Also, Hawaii bracing for impact as Hurricane Douglas makes its way there. An update for you from the weather center.

And imagine getting coronavirus then discovering that most of your family got it as well. Hear how they beat COVID together.

And welcome to our viewers joining us from all around the world. I'm Michael Holmes. Appreciate your company.

Let's start with the two leading countries in the coronavirus caseload. The U.S. and Brazil.

They have a few big things in common. First of all, they have many more cases than other countries.

Just have a look at the graph there. And their governments are very willing to open things up, even when medical experts urge otherwise.

And now Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro being accused of crimes against humanity.

A union against health care workers says he puts lives at risk by holding gatherings, approaching people without a mask and promoting the medicine like hydroxychloroquine with no proof that it works to stop the virus and some evidence to the contrary.

The president's office did not directly respond to all of this.

Meanwhile, the U.S. state of Florida where cases are surging and hospitals are strained and the governor opened up early is now looking at ways to open up even more. Open bars up as things are looking dire.

CNN is covering the pandemic from both of those regions.

CNN's Nick Paton Walsh is in Brazil's capital, but first let's hear from Randi Kaye in Florida.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Here in the state of Florida, another 9,259 new cases and 77 deaths bringing the total number of deaths for Floridians to more than 5,800 now.

And Florida now has the second highest numbers of COVID deaths in the country.

Meanwhile, statewide, still about 9,000 people are hospitalized and there's about 18 percent of adult ICU beds left in the state.

Meanwhile, in Miami Dade, one of the hardest-hit counties here in Southern Florida, they're looking at a daily positivity rate there of 18 percent. And the ICU beds also running low, they're at 146 percent capacity.

So now they're converting regular beds to -- regular hospital beds to those ICU beds so they can help treat those patients with what they need.

Meanwhile, people in Miami Dade still not paying attention to that mask mandate and social distancing. They're supposed to wear a mask when they can't safely social distance inside and outside.

Miami Dade police department telling me that they've issued 150 citations for businesses, that's a $500 fine, and also another 174 citations to individuals, that's a $100 fine.

Meanwhile, bars and breweries could soon reopen in the state. Here in Palm Beach County, restaurants are already open, they're open to about 50 percent capacity. But the bars and the breweries were closed at the end of last month.

So now the chief business regulator is saying that they could open soon. He's looking for a safe and smart way to do so.

Meanwhile, the Florida Brewers Guild certainly on board with that. They say that they represent about 300 breweries. They wrote a letter to the governor and the business regulation chief saying that 100 of those will close if they don't reopen soon.

And they also say that that the industry gives about 10,000 jobs to the state and a third of those jobs could be lost.

I'm Randi Kaye, reporting on Singer Island, Florida. Back to you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR: A slight respite, perhaps, in the numbers. Brazil recorded in the 24 hours ended on Sunday only 24,000 new cases.

I say only because in the three days previously every 24 hours have seen over 50,000 new cases.

Terrifying numbers, frankly, for a country whose president tested positive for two weeks, despite playing down the severity of the disease and emerged on Saturday morning on Twitter to say that he had, in fact, tested negative.

Essentially, giving himself a clear bill of health. But brandishing, like he has done over the past months particularly during his illness, the medication hydroxychloroquine.

Now that's, according to doctors and scientists globally, useless if you have coronavirus and possibly even dangerous. Yet still, he continues to tout it particularly here in the seat of government, the capital, Brasilia.

[01:05:00]

In the day, Saturday, in which he declared himself negative, he went to a motorcycle shop, talked about how he wouldn't even have known that he had the coronavirus had he not tested positive -- a stark contradiction to his earlier statements that, in fact, he had felt had a slight fever.

And has seem more focused on an ongoing battle over freedom speech in social media in the country than necessarily fighting the virus that's sweeping across the country.

Stark criticism leveled against him though by medical professionals who have put together a 64-page document that they're sending to the Hague, to the international courts. There to essentially accuse President Jair Bolsonaro of crimes against humanity.

Suggesting that his rhetoric playing down the disease, the failure of his government to act decisively may well have contributed to so many of the deaths still surging here in Brazil.

A slight respite to those numbers on Sunday, only 24,000.

But that's over a horrifying week, frankly, where most days saw 50,000 new cases. The surge still continuing here.

Nick Paton Walsh, CNN. Brasilia, Brazil.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: Now the Australian state of Victoria has reported its highest daily count of new infections since the pandemic began.

On Sunday, the state's premiere announcing more than 530 cases despite Melbourne being in the middle of a six-week lockdown order.

Victoria's chief health officer says he is disturbed that the virus has made its way into aged care facilities too. CNN's Anna Coren is with me now from Hong Kong.

Yes. This lockdown was instituted and then bam, you get this worrying number. But more strong action being taken?

ANNA COREN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Michael, this is a grim milestone today in the state of Victoria. 532 deaths.

The highest number of daily infections recorded since the pandemic broke out in Australia.

And the premier obviously very concerned about these numbers which are continuing to rise week after week, even though this lockdown is into week three. It's meant to last for six weeks.

Well, the Prime Minister Scott Morrison said that all options are on the table and that if this lockdown needs to be extended, it will be. Perhaps it will be even stricter.

Clearly, they are not getting the situation under control.

There were six more deaths in Victoria overnight, taking the national death toll to 161.

And, Michael, they think that the reason for these high numbers -- the people that are continuing to go out to work, even though they might be feeling a bit sick.

As the premier said, if you are sick, you must stay home.

It would seem that it's the younger working population, obviously concerned about their finances. worried about not turning up to work, missing a shift. How long it is going to go for?

But they are going to work and they are spreading this virus. Many of them, as you say, in aged care facilities.

Take a listen to what the premier, Daniel Andrews, had to say a bit earlier.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DANIEL ANDREWS, PREMIER, VICTORIA, AUSTRALIA: The ultimate consequence, if people are going to work sick, is that people will become infected. And therefore, people will die.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COREN: And obviously, Michael, at the aged care facilities, there are more than half a dozen outbreaks at these facilities, scattered around Melbourne.

And listening to the chief health officer he said that, according to their modeling, they should have reached the peak by now, but due to the outbreaks in these aged care facilities where people are in their seventies, their eighties, their nineties, they are very, very vulnerable.

So it's quite likely that the death toll will rise.

Now, over the weekend, there was a bit of a scandal regarding people not wearing face masks in Victoria. It is mandatory to wear face masks in public.

And there were a number of shoppers who went out, one in particular in a department store who went on about her human rights and how she shouldn't have to put on a face mask. Well, that went viral.

The premier said that this behavior was disgusting.

The police have come out today saying that it is selfish and childish. That this is not about human rights, this is about saving lives. Michael.

HOLMES: Yes, that video made it into my Twitter feed. Yes, the lady in Bunnings.

Before I let you go, what are of the concerns of neighboring states, very quickly, New South Wales and Sydney just to the north? Only a few cases, I think just over a dozen in Sydney, but they must be worried about what's happening to their south.

[01:10:00]

COREN: Yes, absolutely. And the prime minister said that all states and territories need to be on alert, considering what is taking place in Victoria.

As you mention, more than a dozen cases in New South Wales. But we have seen clusters over the last couple of weeks.

And it's all about contact tracing, trying to find those cases and who they have then come into contact with.

But obviously, very alarming.

Australia, Michael, was one of the few countries that seemed to have this pandemic under control. It shut its national borders, it shut both state borders with Victoria, Victorians cannot leave the state.

But as we know, this is highly contagious. And can easily spread.

HOLMES: Anna Coren in Hong Kong. Appreciate it. Good to see you, my friend. Thanks.

Well, 64 new infections reported across multiple U.S. military bases in Okinawa, Japan, over the weekend.

In a CNN exclusive, Koair Enjoyi and her team were given access to one of those military bases to see how personnel are responding.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KAORI ENJOYI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hundreds lined up at this community center in Okinawa to be tested for the coronavirus.

All of them work inside the two U.S. Marine Corps bases hit hardest by COVID-19.

Mune Akazamame (ph) mans the food court at Camp Hansen. He tells me he's scared that so many servicemen are testing positive.

By the time he hands over his saliva sample, the parking lot is full of worried people just like him.

There are more cases inside the ranks of the U.S. military in Okinawa then there have been on the whole island during the course of the pandemic.

Local residents say they want the bases locked down. They fear servicemen arriving from the mainland where the virus is raging could spread the virus further.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COL. RAY GERBER, MARINE CORPS BASE, CAMP HANSEN, OKINAWA: The rotation of personnel is a tremendous concern for us here at Camp

Hansen and for the Marine Corps on Okinawa at large (ph).

It's why we have some very stringent measures in place. Anytime someone lands on Okinawa via military chartered aircraft, they are taken directly to a residence where they then spend two weeks essentially in isolation.

Their symptoms are monitored, they're checked up on and they're also completely isolated to prevent the transmission of potential COVID from the United States.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ENJOYI: Still, the possibility of contagion permeates through Chatan town, a popular hangout for off-duty servicemen and their families before the pandemic hit.

It's also a short drive from Futenma airbase, the site of another cluster outbreak among the marines.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR MASAHARU NOGUMI, CHATAN, OKINAWA: From experience, we feel the U.S. servicemen are in the end always protected by the status of forces agreement.

They do not follow Japanese laws, nor do they work within our system.

That is the biggest reason we do not fully trust each other.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ENJOYI: This hotel symbolizes the latest mistrust. The military has rented it out to find space for personnel rotating out en masse at this time of year.

With more than half of Chatan's land already taken up by U.S. bases, many resent having to give away more. And risk being exposed to a virus they had under control until July.

Japan has depended on the U.S. for its security ever since it lost World War II, and half of all of the U.S. military bases in Japan are located on the island of Okinawa.

Futenma airbase is one of them. It has long, long been controversial with plans to relocate it over decades. And residents say they bear an outsized burden and want some of these bases relocated somewhere else.

The Okinawans want more information than just the number of cases.

With infections among servicemen rising in the U.S. and around the world, their pleas, this time, may resonate far beyond its shores.

Kaori Enjoyi for CNN. Okinawa, Japan.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: A rare look there.

Now U.S. officials are forced to leave their consulate in China after Beijing orders the building to close.

We'll have the very latest on this diplomatic tit-for-tat. And an end of an era as well.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[01:15:00]

HOLMES: Hurricane Hanna has left more than 250,000 customers without power in Southern Texas.

The storm made landfall on Padre Island on Saturday, sustained winds at the time of around 145 kilometers an hour.

Texas also one of the hardest hit states with coronavirus, of course, making it difficult for some to go to storm shelters.

Flood warnings are in place all along the Gulf Coast.

And Hawaii too is bracing for Hurricane Douglas as it barrels towards the islands. It's also a category one storm, top sustained winds near 140 kilometers an hour.

And you've got hurricane warnings, not surprisingly, in Maui and Oahu. And the governor there is urging people to stay home.

If Douglas does make landfall in Hawaii, it will be only the third hurricane to hit the state since 1959.

Let's bring in meteorologist, Pedram Javaheri, for all the latest on this very active map for you, keeping you busy.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PEDRAM JAVAHERI, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Absolutely. And this is a serious storm too, as you noted. It is pretty rare for the Hawaiian Islands to get this close a proximity to a hurricane.

I looked into this, and you mentioned this -- since 1959.

And you look at five-plus decades worth of data.

About 60 hurricanes have developed across this particular region of the Central Pacific. As you noted, only two of them making landfall.

And this particular storm, just about 100 kilometers north of Honolulu at this hour.

And you notice the two that did make landfall. We had Hurricanes Dot and Iniki, 1959 and Iniki in 1992. So, again, very rare night here when it comes to the Hawaiian Islands to get within this close a proximity to a hurricane.

And landfall certainly still a possibility. If it happens, it would happen within the next six to eight hours or so somewhere near the island of Kauai we think.

And you'll notice the storm is gradually weakening. It is kind of skirting a little closer towards Kauai there, within the last couple of hours.

But it is a relatively respectful -- a category one, 140 kilometer per hour winds. But you'll notice the bulk, the strongest winds right along the eye wall there.

So at around some of the populated areas, Honolulu in particular, very calm winds, about 7 kilometers per hour at the most.

[01:20:00]

We do have hurricane warnings widespread across this region. It is the storm surge, it is the rip current threat.

And we know there's, of course, a lot of surfers across this region of the world. And officials always advise them to stay away from the beaches.

Hawaii still seeing the long days this time of the year. We do have a couple of hours left here before sunset kicks in.

So we know the dangers, again, to being along the beaches here are going to be prevalent over the next couple of hours.

But the heaviest rainfall from the initial forecast do stay off shore. But it is a very mountainous set of islands here so anything that happens here with a little bit of a shift in the trajectory of the storm system could certainly increase the rainfall. The mountains do a fantastic job of squeezing all of that rainfall out of these clouds. And you get significant threat for flooding. Could see a much as 150 to 200 millimeters of rainfall with this particular storm system.

But, again, it is the storm surge threat that is always the most concerning with these storms.

But, as Michael noted, you notice there's a lot going on on the map.

We've got remnants of Hanna, we've got remnants of Gonzalo and a red indication there for a high probability of a tropical system to form within the next few days.

Here's what's happening with tropical depression Hanna, made landfall on Saturday afternoon.

Produced upwards of 300 millimeters of rainfall, brought down a few tornadoes in South Texas. And now raining itself out across the Mexican state of Nuevo Leon.

City of Monterey they're getting the significant rainfall out of this.

And again, the mountains across this region -- much of this area, of course, is a desert. So you get this amount of rainfall in a short duration, it becomes a flooding concern.

And the populations across these areas are going to be seeing the brunt of it going into Monday across that region. Michael.

HOLMES: All right. Good to see you, my friend.

JAVAHERI: Thanks, (inaudible).

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: Thanks for that. Pedram Javaheri there.

Now in the Chinese city of Chengdu, the U.S. consulate general has officially been shut down. Not long ago, the American flag outside the building lowered as U.S. diplomats prepare to leave.

China ordered them to close the site after Washington made the first move last week. It forced the Chinese consulate in Houston to shut down, both sides accusing each other of endangering national security.

CNN's David Culver is in Chengdu.

Good to see you there, David.

What have you been able to see? And i ask you that because you have told it's been tough to see anything.

DAVID CULVER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's been incredibly difficult, Michael. And it's not normal that we're doing a live cross talk with you here from a vehicle. But this is the only way that we're able to broadcast. Because every

time we try to step out -- and we can show you some video from earlier -- to go through the police barrier because there was a significant police presence here, quite heavy -- they wouldn't let us in.

They were only letting certain residents to go in and select media. For sure, they allowed state media to go through. But we however, were kept outside.

And so we've been making the rounds outside the perimeter. Behind me here if you keep going farther back you hit where the U.S. consulate was. Where it was. It no longer is here as of 10:00 o'clock this morning.

The ministry of foreign affairs saying it has officially closed.

And, as you mentioned, this was their reciprocal retaliation for what the U.S. officials did in Houston.

Everything from the timing that they gave the U.S. diplomats to get out equated to what the U.S. officials gave to the Chinese diplomats in Houston. It was 72 hours altogether.

It is very different here today versus what we're able to experience being right in front of the consulate yesterday and Saturday.

And that is very telling in and of itself, Michael.

Because at that time they wanted us to see what was happening, they allowed us to be broadcasting up close. But as of today they wanted to make sure it was only state media that was doing the broadcasting, showing the images.

And, seemingly, being able to put out the narrative as China wanted it to be distributed, Michael.

HOLMES: Yes. Interesting change there. What's been the reaction among the Chinese people? Because, apparently on social media, like Weibo, there's been a lot of anti-American sentiment going on.

CULVER: And I tell you here, it's not so much anti-American that I've seen in person. I've had a few folks who would shout at us as foreigners, "Go home."

Beyond that, though, it's mostly pro-China that we've seen. We've seen a few people chanting, some people holding signs. But they were quickly taken down by police.

In fact, police seemingly more focused on those who were even protesting in support of China, because they just didn't want a commotion. And that's part of the reason they've kept people so far away.

But I'll tell you, the people that I've been speaking with, they seem to be supportive of China having done this reciprocal move, this retaliation. They said it had to be done after what the U.S. did in their mind.

However, they're sad to see it coming to this between the U.S. and China. That was echoed to me several times.

HOLMES: I've got to ask you. Is there a sense among Chinese officials that the U.S. posture is at least part of the election campaign?

Not just the consulate closure, but a whole raft of things that have been happening over recent months.

[01:25:00]

Do the Chinese sort of factor in that is an election year, and China is -- it's a convenient bogeyman?

CULVER: There's no question. They factor that in, it's campaign rhetoric, it comes with the election year. They know that.

However, where they draw the line is action that they see as irreversible and damaging to the relationship between the U.S. and China.

So even though it may just be campaign rhetoric and action in the U.S. to shut down the Chinese consulate there, they felt like they had to retaliate.

If anything, to maintain some sort of, I would say, approval in the domestic row.

I mean, the Chinese state media was pushing for China to respond. So no longer could they simply just put out harsh words. With this instance they had to respond with action.

HOLMES: David Culver in a moving live shot in Chengdu. Thanks to the Chinese security.

Very well done that you made it happen, David. Good to see you. David Culver there.

CULVER: Thanks, Michael.

HOLMES: We'll take a quick break.

A key U.S. employment benefit ends this week. Coming up, what Republicans are proposing instead in their stimulus plan.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[01:29:43]

MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back to our viewers joining us from all around the world. I'm Michael Holmes.

You're watching CNN NEWSROOM. I appreciate the company. Now in the coming hours, U.S. Senate Republicans will present their latest stimulus plan. The $1 trillion proposal would not extend the $600 weekly boost to unemployment benefits which is due to expire. Pretty much everyone's got their last check.

Instead, it would offer 70 percent of the workers' wages as opposed to a flat rate, which Democrats want. The plan also includes $1,200 checks to many Americans, $105 billion for schools, and another targeted round of forgivable small business loans.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE MNUCHIN, U.S. TREASURY SECRETARY: The bill will be introduced Monday. And we're prepared to act quickly. This is all about kids and jobs. This is our focus. And we want to make sure something gets passed quickly so that we deal with the unemployment and all the other issues, paycheck protection plans, tax credits to rehire people and money for schools.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Eleni Giokos is in Johannesburg with more on this. I mean I've been talking about this for a while. What is notable is that unemployment is pretty much -- well, they are done now, this sort of enhanced benefit check. The last one is going out. Eviction protections are going away, too.

What is the holdup here?

ELENI GIOKOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I mean it's really interesting hearing that this needs to be passed quickly and that is kind of the sentiment. But remember, until now we've only seen intraparty negotiations and discussions. We were hoping to have clarity at the end of last week, so perhaps we would be able to catch the expiration of that enhanced benefit.

Now we still have to face bipartisan discussions and debates and negotiations. This is still on the table. And in the meantime, you have million of vulnerable Americans that really do not have any clarity about what will happen to the $600 extra a week that they've been receiving since the start of the pandemic. And instead, Republicans are saying look, it is a disincentive for people to get back to work.

You are also hearing that they would rather do a percentage of wages. Now that brings a lot of issues to the table. How do you calculate it on a case by case basis for millions of people?

I want you to listen in on what Larry Kudlow, the White House economic adviser said yesterday in the middle of negotiations.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LARRY KUDLOW, WHITE HOUSE ECONOMIC ADVISER: It won't stop the assistance. It's going to cap the assistance at a level that is consistent with people going back to work. That's what we have said from day one.

First of all, state unemployment benefits stay in place. Second of all, we will try to cap the benefits at about 70 percent of wages.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GIOKOS: So I mean working these numbers out, our calculations that need to be conducted and, of course, we've already seen, Michael, issues in terms of getting the money into people's pockets even when it was a flat rate.

The Democrats are saying the reason that they picked one number was because it was easy and it was simple. We know that Nancy Pelosi has been saying that they want to continue the enhanced benefit program until the end of the year.

You've got coronavirus cases increasing. You've got a weak economic recovery that is currently in plan (ph). And of course, major concern of the pandemic and economic impact of the pandemic is still very much a play. We've got second quarter GDP numbers that will be released later on this week. That's also going to be a vital signal.

But the point here is -- and I want you to take a look at the proposals. We know that there's a $1,200 stimulus check that is at play here. You've got tax payment cuts. And you are talking about the evictions protections that are also coming to an end. There is so much fear rising about people losing their homes right now, that we're hearing states are coming up with shelter programs where lawyers will be able to meet with tenants to find a way forward.

We also are hearing that perhaps we might see a watered-down proposal initially, so that they can get benefits in place to protect the vulnerable in the U.S. The Democrats in the past have said look, they don't want to take a piecemeal approach, but I think this week is going to be absolutely vital in terms of figuring out for around 15 millions Americans which, of course, filed for continuing claims just last week are going to be doing in the next few weeks, Michael.

HOLMES: Yes. Important times.

Eleni Giokos, thanks so much. Good to see you.

Well even as Congress plans for another direct payment to Americans, millions of people still haven't received their first stimulus checks. Yes, going back to March, April. According to calculations by the House Ways and Means Committee, 30 to 35 million payments are yet to be issued.

Kind of defeats the purpose doesn't it? And that includes payments to 13 to 18 million taxpayers who filed returns that are below the program's income threshold. And nearly five million tax returns have not been processed. They could include first-time filers who would qualify for the payment.

With me now from Boston is global economist, Megan Greene. She is a senior fellow at Harvard University. Always a pleasure to have you back on.

[01:34:50]

HOLMES: I mean, let's talk about the suggestions. They are all well and good but they're not in play -- and unemployment enhancement, renter eviction protections literally ending. I mean how do you see this sort of unfolding for people caught in the middle of that timing?

MEGAN GREENE, SENIOR FELLOW, HARVARD UNIVERSITY: Yes. So if we can't find a way to extend some sort of eased-up unemployment insurance in the next couple of weeks, we will absolutely go into another recession. A lot of people will face a cash cliff.

Larry Kudlow -- in terms of the evictions have come out and said that, you know, eviction protections will be extended. The question is how long that will take although real estate markets have softened so much that some landlords might not actually kick people out just because then their places will (INAUDIBLE) have no chance of getting an income. But I do think that will be expected.

HOLMES: Yes. I mean one issue has been that the whole system has not been reliable, has it. I mean people who filled out -- filed in March and April still haven't received their checks, and even with this, they might not get their checks until October.

Evictions are starting to begin tomorrow for some people. I mean it really seems a mess, especially if you've lost your job and, you know, and can't pay the rent.

GREENE: Yes. It's absolutely how it will end up in a double dip recession if that happens. If we can't get this together in the next couple of weeks, like I said, there really is a cash clip for a lot of people.

And our unemployment insurance benefits system is really held together by bubble gum and duct tape pretty much. It's archaic logistically and so trying to do anything really complicated with beefing unemployment insurance as the Republicans are suggesting, could delay things much further.

It could be that people don't get those additional checks for a couple of months and that is unacceptable, Spending will fall off the cliff, so will demand.

HOLMES: Wow. Job losses continue to exceed the 2008 figures. You mentioned Larry Kudlow earlier. He was sort of saying that a v- shaped recovery is happening.

I mean let's face it, he's not been right very much lately. There isn't a v-shaped recovery, is there?

GREENE: No, there is no real chance of a v-shaped recovery. It might look like one initially because it's pretty easy to get a bunch of people back into the workforce the first 20 percent. But the last 20 percent is much harder. And if you look at actually -- where spending is picked up it's in things like white (ph) goods, swimming pool installations, landscaping. If you look at the micro data.

And that's not where we lost all the jobs. We lost jobs in things like, you know, waitresses, or dry cleaners. So there is a huge disconnect in the economy that suggests that even without another spike in new cases that we are seeing and even without a second wave a v-shaped recovery just isn't in the cards.

HOLMES: A lot of criticism that the aid from the start has been precious little to the worker and billions of corporations and others. That is certainly a perception out there.

But I wanted to ask you, what is not in any, you know, significant amount is childcare assistance. You would imagine that that would help people work and have their kids taken care of, especially if schools don't reopen. I mean that's got to be more important than bailing out billionaires?

GREENE: Yes. You get at a crucial point. And I say we've done a little bit better than we did after the global financial crisis in getting money to individuals and not just big companies. But that being said, there's a statistic out there that the government gave more money to Delta Airline than it did to the entire childcare system.

So to your point, if schools don't reopen, there is no way people can be productive. And a lot of people will have to draft out of the workforce to take care of their kids, you know, if they cannot go back to school. And so that would be a huge drag on demand in the U.S. as well.

HOLMES: Right. I wanted to get this last one in. Are we paying a worse economic cost for early reopening before the virus was under control than we would have otherwise if we had waited a while?

GREENE: Absolutely. And for evidence of that, just look to Europe, right. Europe did a great job in terms of virus management. They've had a delayed response in terms of economic stimulus, whereas the U.S. really went big and hard with economic stimulus, but we have been the poster child for poor virus management. And as a result we are seeing our recovery is much more tepid than what they're seeing in Europe.

So a lot of people have set this up as a dichotomy. Either you have to choose between, you know, reopening the economy or you have to choose people's health. And actually, there is no recovery until we get the virus under control. There's no question about that.

HOLMES: Yes, exactly. They are linked.

Megan Greene, a pleasure. Good to see you.

GREENE: Thanks a lot.

HOLMES: Now travelers making their way from Spain to the U.K. have to self-quarantine for 14 days and if they are going from Spain to Norway, 10 days. That is due to Spain's recent surge in coronavirus cases.

Many British tourists in Spain say they're baffled over the decision which left them with no way to avoid a quarantine since they were already there on holiday. Many of them also say they feel safe in Spain.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If the spike here is quite big, I kind of get it. But if it's only minor then I don't see the point, really. There is more (INAUDIBLE) here than there is the U.K. at the moment anyway.

[01:39:53]

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I've been here for almost a week now. Everybody wears masks everywhere. And this is really helpful. I feel really safe.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm very disappointed in our own government. (INAUDIBLE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: The Spanish government meanwhile says it is negotiating with the U.K. to try to revise the quarantine orders so it won't apply to some of the country's popular beaches.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARANCHA GONZALEZ LAYA, SPANISH FORIENG MINISTER: In particular, our dialogue efforts at the moment are focused around excluding from the quarantine measures the Balearic and the Canary Islands for two reasons.

Number one, these are islands that are very safe.

Number two, their epidemiological data is extremely positive.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

The U.K. has the third highest virus death toll of any country and has more cases than fatalities in Spain.

Well, an island-hopping tour in Taiwan is among the first cruisers in the world to be back in business. Some 900 passengers, all screened before boarding the Explorer Dream which is offering trips of up to five days around Taiwan's outlying islands.

The ship is carrying only a third of its normal capacity and has COVID 19 wards on board should anyone gets sick. Some other notice more differences. There are no buffets. And the casinos and spas are closed. But some people say it is still good to be back on the water.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CAI JIARU, CRUISE PASSENGER (through translator): Due to the coronavirus, we can't go abroad, but I still feel like going out. So I signed up for the island hopping cruise. I don't worry about the epidemic too much because I think it's pretty safe in Taiwan right now. As long as everyone has their temperature measured before boarding the ship.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Taiwan has a very low number of coronavirus cases. Fewer than 500 since this all began. It has also reported no local transmission for more than three months. They are doing well.

We've got to take a quick break. When we come back we'll speak to a man whose family fought coronavirus together. And their battle not quite over yet.

We will be right back.

[01:42:07]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: Every single one of the 16 million global coronavirus cases, of course, has a name behind it. Too many families around the world dealing with the deaths of loved ones and the lingering effects of this sickness. Recovering doesn't always mean things return to normal right away.

Now, Erik Hoyo (ph) knows this all too well. He and his family live in California and nearly every single member of his household caught the virus and they are still feeling it.

Erik Hoyo joins me now from Chula Vista in California. Thanks for doing so.

I mean just start with yourself. How bad was the virus in your case? I know initially you weren't too worried, but then it sort of took a turn for the worse.

ERIK HOYO, CORONAVIRUS SURVIVOR: Michael, thanks for having us. Me and my wife both had it the worst. Each one of our children had it a little differently. It wasn't as serious for their case but individually, everybody had different symptoms. Everybody started a little bit differently.

So at first, I mean, me personally, I thought I didn't have it. I thought it was just a mild fever because my fever was not breaking 101.

My wife was the one that actually -- she was the one that got it the worse right off the top. The kids started with losing their sense of smell, sense of taste. My 21-year-old still hasn't recovered the taste -- the sense of smell and taste.

So we're are still recovering. We are probably at about 90 percent, but we have noticed additional other factors that we've encountered through our recovery process. HOLMES: I can't imagine. What was going through your mind as you saw,

you know, your loved ones run by one test positive for this thing and be laid low by it? I mean what are you thinking at that point?

HOYO: Well, the worst thing for me was when I had to go to the hospital because I was the one being taken away. I was initially the one caring for everyone, making food for everyone. I was the one trying to be the stronger one.

But at that time, that was probably the scariest point in time, because at that point I didn't know if I was going to see them again, if they were going to keep me in the hospital or if they're going to isolate me because of all the cases I've been hearing how, you know, family members don't get to see their loved ones in their final moments. That's what was going through my mind as I was getting taken away in the ambulance.

The hardest part and really for us, was our toddler. Our toddler, we had to actually ship him off right in the beginning of everything. He is the only one that didn't contract any symptoms or anything. So we sent him away with family for two weeks.

And he is three years old, so it was kind of difficult for us, but it was the best decision, but it was kind of traumatizing for him being that young, not knowing exactly why he was being taking away from his family at that point in time.

So I mean it was -- it's difficult to see like my wife, a very strong woman, it was difficult to see her in bed, you know, just helpless.

(CROSSTALK)

HOLMES: We just showed the image of you being taken away. Yes, we just saw the photo of you being taken away from the home. That just must have been so hard for everyone else to see.

You touched on this and we sort of have been reporting on this over the last few weeks as well. You mentioned that there are lingering effects from this.

I mean how is everyone doing now. The long term impacts -- a lot of other people are reporting this as well.

HOYO: Well, the main thing for me was getting my breath back. I always felt like I was not getting the full amount of oxygen into my lungs as I was normal or used to.

So, you know, little by little, walking five minutes outside. Going up the steps. Things like that were a lot harder for me. Anxiety -- anxiety was one of the worst things that I'm still going through.

With my wife and some of my kids, they've experienced excessive hair loss when they were taking showers. Abnormal. I mean usually people lose a little bit of hair, but this is a lot at the time. You know me, I lost all my hair.

HOLMES: You are the lucky one.

HOYO: No barber. So, you know.

[01:49:52]

(CROSSTALK)

HOLMES: Yes. This is worrying for a lot of people. We've done a few segments on this, too. These lingering effects, how long they will last. Nobody knows.

I mean the spread in your own state of California is obviously pretty concerning. And I was reading about your case. You are super careful with handwashing. I mean think I read you used to wiped down your pens.

I mean what is the message to people who still don't take the virus seriously, who think the risks are overstated or that it's, you know, all hype.

HOYO: You know, it's -- everybody's just got to be -- I mean you've got to be considerate about everybody else. You just never know. You know, we don't know too much about this virus.

We all wear face masks, you know. A lot of people don't believe in face masks. It helps, you know. I like to tell people, it's kind of like drinking and driving. If the person is sober, you know, they shouldn't worry about if their seatbelts and their airbags work.

You know, I kind of compare that to the face mask, you know. It works, you know. Be considerate of other people.

We all -- everybody thought that it was mostly for our elders, but you know, we've had people close to us from high school with no other health conditions that didn't make it through the battle, you know. It's sad.

You know, families have to go through this and it's hit us close to home. By us getting it and actually knowing people who were not as fortunate as us, you know.

So I just want to let everybody know that. I mean you don't want to wait and see until it actually happens to you. It is better to just, you know, take that extra precaution and just protect yourself. Protect your neighbors, you know. Protect everybody.

Go to the store when you are walking, you know, just be considerate of everybody else because you don't know once they go home if they have somebody at home that has, you know, health conditions and things like that.

Like my mother (AUDIO GAP) -- it's going to be hard for her if she has to go back to work because we have -- I have a brother that lives with my mother who is bedridden. And he's got, you know, if she was to get sick, you know, they would not survive.

HOLMES: Yes, exactly.

(CROSSTALK)

HOYO: And then with my kids going to school --

HOLMES: Right.

HOYO: -- it's a thing to worry -- now we're like, you know, honestly, I don't want to send my kids to school, but it's just not the kids. What about the teachers? Because a lot of the teachers are a little bit older. So, I mean, who knows?

(CROSSTALK)

HOLMES: There is so much -- right. There is so much we don't know and you've been through so much. I am so glad that you are all ok.

Erik Hoyo, thanks so much for sharing your story with us. I do appreciate it. Thank you.

HOYO: Thank you, Michael. It's a pleasure.

HOLMES: And we will be right back.

[01:52:36]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: Welcome back.

Now, members of the White House coronavirus task force insist that the U.S. has enough tests for anyone who needs one. Not wants one but needs.

Admiral Brett Giroir admits that the U.S. can improve its testing and he compared the amount of work and focus being put into the matter to the Manhattan Project which led to the creation of the atomic bomb during World War II.

Giroir spoke with CNN's Jake Tapper.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Are you happy we are testing this right now?

ADMIRAL BRETT GIROIR, ASSISTANT SECRETARY, U.S. HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES DEPARTMENT: I'm never going to be happy until we have this under control. And we're going to continue to push every single day to improve the testing.

TAPPER: In March, President Trump said falsely, anyone who wants a test can get a test. At what point will it be true, sir? That anybody who wants a test will be able to get one with a quick turnaround so as to be effective? When will that be true?

GIROIR: What is true now is that anyone who needs a test can get a test. We are not in a situation and I want to be really clear, whether it is Mick Mulvaney or anyone else, I feel like going somewhere so I need a test. That is not where we are.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Well, thanks for spending part of your day with us. I'm Michael Holmes.

Don't go anywhere. Kim Brunhuber picks things up after a short break. Don't go anywhere. You won't be disappointed. He's very good.

[01:57:53]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

END