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Trump Signs Executive Orders After Stimulus Talks Break Down; Memphis-Selby County Schools To Begin School Year Virtually; Outrage Expressed By Lebanese People; Women Behind The Camera; Health Experts Plea To The Public; Life Behind Bars. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired August 09, 2020 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:00]

DANA BASH, CNN HOST: There's now more than 162,000 and counting. Yet despite that and the economic toll wrought by the disease, Congress failed to find compromise on a new stimulus deal to help, leaving millions of Americans with unanswered questions about their unemployment benefits, food security and evictions.

Now President Trump is sidestepping Congress in a series of executive actions. The president said Saturday that he was acting unilaterally after his team and congressional Democrats reached an impasse. What he signed allows for up to $400 in enhanced unemployment benefit but -- a big but -- only if states ask for it and if states pay a quarter of it.

It also includes memorandum for payroll tax holiday and suggests assistance to renters and homeowners facing eviction. The president also issued a memorandum on deferring student loan payments. All in all, still pretty confusing for most Americans and pretty unclear whether the president's executive action is even legal.

This morning I asked the president's chief economic adviser how the new unemployment benefit would be implemented. Here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LARRY KUDLOW, WHITE HOUSE CHIEF ECONOMIC ADVISER: The state unemployment benefits continue. There's no effect on what they do. And yes, you are correct. For an extra $100 we will levered it up, we'll pay three quarters and the states will pay 25 percent. And I think the way this is going to work out, we have additional funds that we will repurpose for this.

This is an essential item. We've tried to get it through the Democratic House for, I don't know, two or three times, and it's going to be a form of economic assistance. Probably you'll get $800 total federal and state. And if we get it going September 1st, which is what the deadline looks like, that probably would give the workforce an increase in wages. Basically it's a wage increase after taxes.

BASH: What do you mean $800 total?

KUDLOW: $1200. Well, at a minimum we will put in 300 bucks and the states will continue with their 400 bucks. But I think all they have to do is put up an extra dollar and we'll be able to throw in the extra $100, so it should be a total -- it should be, may not be in every case.

BASH: That's not --

KUDLOW: Because, as you know, we're talking averages.

BASH: OK --

KUDLOW: Some states higher, some states lower.

BASH: But --

KUDLOW: But on average, Dana, it will run to about $800. That's about $1200 wage increase.

BASH: But the executive action says -- the executive action says $400 and that the state would pay 25 percent of this. You're talking about some other money that I don't know about.

KUDLOW: Well, you know, we will stand ready to repurpose if states put in a little bit more. It's all amounts to.

BASH: OK.

KUDLOW: I mean, right now that number is going to run around $700. I think they'll get to $800. Some states can get above $800 with our federal help. And again, the key point here is that it's a wage increase, Dana, of about $1200 for the last four months of the year. That's a big pay hike, and not only does that reward the heroes who have been working, I think it's an incentive to get more people --

BASH: But --

KUDLOW: -- who want to come into the workforce.

BASH: What makes you think that states have that $100 a week per person who is unemployed in their state to even put into this potential pot of money?

KUDLOW: Well, I think they'll be able to make room. Our estimates from the Treasury Department in terms of Cares Act 1 was that the states have not spent all the money that was allocated to them and that there's, you know, considerable overflow that they could make use of. We're going to operate on the same principle in the executive order. We will be repurposing funds from other areas.

BASH: Have you --

KUDLOW: So based on our estimates, the states will be able to provide the extra $100 and that will gross up the whole benefit to something on average of about $800.

BASH: Have you checked with the states? How many of the 50 states and D.C. and other territories say that they are going to be able to pony up $100 a week per unemployed --

KUDLOW: We'll probably --

BASH: Citizen?

KUDLOW: Yes. Good question. We'll probably find that out, you know, today and tomorrow as we make our canvass. We've been in touch with them. We have very good records coming out of the Treasury Department, but we will be in touch.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BASH: The president's executive actions are raising more questions than answers. For more on this, I want to bring in Kristen Holmes, who is in New Jersey where the president signed those actions at his golf club.

Kristen, the president's decision to try to bypass Congress is getting a lot of criticism from not only Democrats, but some Republicans. What are you hearing?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Dana, I want to get to that one second, because I think that we need to really point out that Larry Kudlow's interpretation of this unemployment benefit is completely different from many experts and lawyers that we have spoken to about what exactly this is going to look like.

We have talked to experts who say that it is likely that many people who are currently unemployed will never see this $400 and here's why. Those governors have to enter into a financial agreement with the White House in order for anyone in the state to get $300. So it's not as though tomorrow everyone starts getting that $300 a week the way that they were getting $600 a week.

Actually, this has to be an entire process has to happen here in order for them to even get this $300. The states have to enter into an agreement to say they'll pay the extra $100, so it'll be $400 but then they also have to agree to administer the money. Now this is not an actual unemployment program. So all that we saw happen for the last several months when people were getting this unemployment money from the state, from the federal government, that money was going through a system that the state put together.

Some states it took months for them to be able to figure out how to give out their own benefits and the federal benefit. Now the federal government is asking them to create an entirely new system for that $300 that they have to put in place, and then figure out how to administer, and on top of that, as we said, they have to contribute their own money.

Now Kudlow is saying that there's all this money left over from the Cares Act. But I specifically asked about this last night to several of these experts, who say you can't just take money from one thing and give it to another. This money was specifically allocated for unemployment programs. Guess what? This is not an unemployment program. This is under a lost wages program, which is why the state has to create an entirely new system.

So it's really important because people are sitting at home thinking that possibly next week they're going to start getting $400 again, money that they were relying on to pay rent, to help get their kids ready for school, to get those groceries that are much-needed. And that money is not coming, it's not coming any time soon. So that's something that we really need to hone in on here.

Now we're talking about different reactions. We did hear from Republicans. We talked about Senator Ben Sasse who actually said that this was unconstitutional slop. And he says this is really in reference to all kinds of executive actions. But of course, Democrats really jumping on that. Nancy Pelosi was talking to you this morning. And here's what she had to say about these executive actions.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: Everything is left out. Our assistance to the schools, feeding the hungry, helping people who are going to be evicted. The president didn't even do a moratorium. He just did a study or looked at a moratorium. So, again, something is wrong. I associate the remarks with Senator Sasse who says they're an unconstitutional slop.

I think that right now we want to address the needs of the American people as constitutional -- my constitutional advisers tell me they're absurdly unconstitutional.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: So in addition to what Nancy Pelosi said, which is true, these are very limited in scope. But in addition to those unemployment benefits which we just talked about at length, there were three other memoranda that were signed by President Trump. One was on eviction. I want to specifically touch on that one because you heard Pelosi say that there. It is true, this is not a straight eviction moratorium.

This will not relieve people who, if they are looking at being evicted, this is essentially as a constitutional lawyer just told me on the phone, asking different agencies to play nice when it comes to eviction. They're asking them to consider whether these evictions are necessary. So just something to keep in mind as people are trying to process what exactly happened with President Trump here and what exactly they're going to get in terms of benefits.

We really need to make sure that we're giving them the facts. But this is not something, in any of these cases except possibly student loan deferment, that's going to happen starting tomorrow.

BASH: So important that what they heard the president say he was going to do yesterday they should not hold their breath and wait for it. Really, really critical fact-checking there.

Kristen, thank you so much for that report.

And joining me now is the national co-chair for the Biden 2020 campaign and the former chairman of the Congressional Black Caucus, Louisiana Congressman Cedric Richmond.

Thank you so much for joining me today.

Congressman, I want to first ask you for your reaction to what the president said he was going to do yesterday with the enhanced unemployment benefits, saying that the states have to ask for it, or he didn't say, this is the reality. The states have to ask for it and add $100 for each unemployment benefit.

Is that even remotely realistic?

REP. CEDRIC RICHMOND (D-LA): No. It's not. And the sad part about it, it just continues to add chaos and confusion into an already chaotic and heartbreaking time for American families.

[16:10:03]

Over half of the families in this country have lost income because of this. And instead of leading, instead of guiding and showing the leadership necessary to bring people together and fix the problem, he just continues to distract and destruct everything. And so he knows and we know that most of the things he signed were unconstitutional.

Larry Kudlow today talking to you was speaking gibberish because he could not explain the president's actions. So it takes congressional action. And it's time for us to ask on the Senate side to come and meet us halfway.

BASH: So, OK, so that was my next question. The president, the White House acted not just for political reasons, but also tactical reasons, to try to get you guys to compromise a little bit more aggressively.

Do you see a compromise in the near future so that the people out there who are hungry, who are homeless, who are worried about real, real concerns financially at home will have some relief?

RICHMOND: Well, let me just, one go back, the president didn't act out of the necessity, he acted out of politics. And if he really wanted to do something he would have put more thought into it. But the House of Representatives, our leadership led by Speaker Nancy Pelosi, over 60 days ago we passed the Heroes Act which provided for $3 trillion worth of relief to American families, local and state governments, to public school systems, to those that are hungry.

We did what we needed to do for American families. The Senate on the other hand introduced some guiding principal somewhere around $1 trillion. They haven't passed anything. And they haven't come to the negotiating table.

BASH: Right. And you guys have been at an impasse. Well, you guys have been at an impasse -- or not you, but the House Democratic leadership with the White House for a couple of weeks. Just from what you hear, is there any sense of a deal in sight? People out there really want to know if this is possible or if this is just going to continue to be a stalemate. RICHMOND: I want to say this. This failure falls flat in the lap of

President Trump. First of all Mitch McConnell does anything that President Trump says, so President Trump told him to go get a deal done, he would do it, but at the same time, the Senate is doing nothing while we continue to say we're willing to lead.

We have a president of the United States that has not talked to the speaker of the House in months while we --

BASH: Since October.

RICHMOND: While we have five million people who have been infected with COVID-19 coronavirus. We have over 160,000 Americans that died from a pandemic, and he's having a temper tantrum and he doesn't want to speak to a strong woman because sometimes she beats him at his game? It's silly. And it's costing us lives.

BASH: I have to ask you about this new information that came out this morning, according to the president's National Security adviser Robert O'Brien, saying that there is evidence that China and Russia are trying to tamper with secretaries of State Web sites and the infrastructure across the country. Those, of course, are the places that dictate and work on voting rolls in states everywhere in this nation. Also that they're trying to collect data.

You, as I mentioned, are the co-chair of the Biden campaign. Has Joe Biden or anybody in his team been informed about this? Are they being consulted and briefed?

RICHMOND: I will tell you this. And also as the chair of the Subcommittee on Cybersecurity in the House Homeland Security Committee, I think that it's time for the administration to own up to the fact that his buddy Putin is trying to interfere in the election and trying to help him. And so some things -- and the reason why I'm not asking more directly because some things I learn through classified briefings, some things I don't, and I don't want to conflate the two but I will tell you --

BASH: Well, can you tell me if the National Security adviser is right? Is that the intelligence you're seeing? He said it publicly.

RICHMOND: I think we are very clear that Russia is trying to meddle in this election. I think it's clear that Russia is trying to help Donald Trump. I think it is also clear that this administration is not doing anything to fight back and make sure that we have safe and secure election. Moreover, Donald Trump's actions and leadership, questioning the validity of mail-in ballots, undermines the process.

And you heard the governor from Ohio say today that they always had mail-in ballots, and that they're safe and they're secure, and it's a great way to vote, but we can't let anybody undermine our democracy. China. Russia, nor a president who continues to mislead the American public.

[16:15:07] BASH: So before I let you go, as I mentioned several times, you are the co-chair of the Biden campaign. Joe Biden is spending his weekend deciding, maybe he's already decided, who his running mate is going to be. I'm not even going to waste your time or my time asking who it is, unless you want to offer it, I wouldn't stop you. But my question is specifically on whether or not it will be -- we know it will be a woman, a woman of color.

And there is a group of African-American women, 700 black women leaders, who joined in writing a letter to the former vice president, saying, "We are the highest propensity voters in this nation. We are a coalition of black women leaders who, in this inflection point of the black liberation movement where people around the world are galvanized to action know that the time for black women in the United States is now."

Do you agree with that?

RICHMOND: I think they have a very good point. I think that that letter was very strongly worded. I think that they are sincere about it. But I can tell you what black women and black families need the most right now and that is to make that Donald Trump is not president next year. His handling of COVID-19 disproportionately hurt the black community. So we have to win this election. And I think that given the space to Vice President Biden to make that decision is very important.

And I think that all of those letters, all of the calls, all of the statements are being considered, very heartfeltly. And I believe he's going to make the right decision, but I believe that for African- American women to assert themselves is proper also.

BASH: Congressman Cedric Richmond, thank you so much for your time today. I really appreciate it.

RICHMOND: Thank you.

BASH: And parents faced with a choice, stay home from work with the kids or send them to school. I'll talk to the superintendent of Memphis, Shelby County, schools about the best path forward. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:21:23]

BASH: Two school districts will open for in-person classes in Tennessee tomorrow. Some school officials are confident enough to move forward with the August 10th reopening date despite White House Coronavirus Task Force coordinator Dr. Deborah Birx raising concerns about increasing numbers in Tennessee just days ago.

The Memphis, Shelby County, school district, which serves over 100,000 students in more than 200 schools, will begin the school year online in August, at the end of this month. And all students will continue to learn virtually until further notice.

Joining me now to discuss is Joris M. Ray, who's the superintendent of Tennessee's -- Memphis, Tennessee's Shelby County school district.

Thank you so much for joining me. I want to start with some really troubling news that you have reported publicly, about a handful of threatening messages that you've gotten since you announced that there would be only online learning, no in-person classes. This is -- things that you got privately and then publicly we saw tweets saying that you deserve to be tortured over your decision. I mean, what is going on there?

JORIS M. RAY, SUPERINTENDENT, MEMPHIS SHELBY COUNTY SCHOOLS: You know, Dana, it's like this. Like many superintendents, I'm married to the work. And superintendents, we give up so much. We make major sacrifices to do this job. Sometimes we sacrifice our own friends and family. However, nothing prepared me for someone to threaten me and my family.

However, it's about, Dana, keeping my students and staff members here safe, and nothing will deter me not even an idle threat is going to deter me for doing what's best for our students and family this year.

BASH: And you think it is an idle threat? You're not concerned for your safety?

RAY: You know, Dana, it's like this, when you threaten me, you threaten my family, of course I'm concerned. However, I'm more concerned about my students. I'm more concerned about my single moms who must make a decision about where their child is going to be while we learn virtually. I'm more concerned about feeding the 100,000 kids. I'm more concerned that we passed out over 95,000 laptops to ensure we closed the digital divide. Yes, I'm concerned. But I'm more concerned about my students.

BASH: Well, I want to talk about all of that because you really are -- it sounds like you're working very hard to have the online experience be as meaningful as possible, which is not easy. I'm a parent. I can tell you, I know it's not easy.

RAY: No.

BASH: But on the question of your decision. As I mentioned coming into the segment, you are not following the lead of several other school districts in your state. You're following the lead of medical professionals and medical advisers, who are saying do not go back if the positivity rate is more than 5 percent, which it seems to be in your county. And is that right?

RAY: Dana, you're on point. We have over 22,000 cases of COVID in Tennessee. We had just last week 1,874 new cases and the positivity rate here is well over 15 percent.

[16:25:07]

When you have over 1500 children in your county, which their number leads the state that tested positive for COVID, you have to follow science. And you have to do what is best for your students and families right here. And I'm dedicated. And I'm going to do that. Again, I'm a lifelong Memphian, I'm a product of this school district. And these students are like my own, they are my own. All 113,000. And I'm going to keep them safe.

BASH: Real quick, you mentioned the digital divide, which you are trying to close. How are you doing that? How are you making sure that the students who are learning at home have internet access and access to devices to learn?

RAY: So, Dana, great question. I'm so honored to serve at the will and pleasure of my great school board, who voted in the month of June to approve 95,000 devices. That's every device, a device for every student pre-K through 12. And also, we are providing 24,000 hot spots. We've trained our teachers here. I have the best teachers in the nation. We've trained them all summer. We've trained parents on the devices and the curriculum.

So we put the hard work in because this is heart work. And we're going to do what is best for our children here.

BASH: It is so hard. And I cannot even imagine what it's like to be a school superintendent right now. Thank you for everything you're doing. I'm sorry you've been put in this position.

RAY: Thank you.

BASH: And you, like people who are doing your job all over this country, have the best interests of teachers and students at heart, and as a parent, I thank you for that.

RAY: So, Dana, just let me say this. I have to say this because every week I leave my school district with this. We're stronger together. Coronavirus will not defeat us because we are 901.

BASH: There you go. Very inspiring. Thank you so much.

RAY: Thank you. Thank you.

BASH: And we'll be right back.

[16:30:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BASH: Breaking news out of Beirut. Violent protests erupting for a second day there. This is in response to today's massive explosion that left nearly 100 people dead and thousands injured. People there are outrage and they're accusing the government of negligence. This morning protesters with met with tear gas as they approached the Lebanese parliament.

Our Sam Kiley was there on the scene when it happened. Here he is with more.

SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: About 30 or 40 yards down the street is barricaded there is the outer corner for the Lebanese parliament. The demonstrators are absolutely dead set, they told me, on getting into more and more government buildings to try and demonstrate that the government itself is really a chimera (Ph), it is hopeless, it is sort of joke.

So, they're obviously bombarding the police on the other side of this barrier. There's a whiff of tear gas in the air. The crowd is building more and more steadily. There had been a suggestion from some of the organizers -- there have been a suggestion from some of the organizers that there would be less of a demonstration here now.

So that clearly is no longer the case. That of course is a large new dose of tear gas fired by the police. They're trying to protect the government buildings.

Yesterday a number of government buildings were temporarily invaded by the demonstrators. That they have sworn that that is going to be their new tactic.

BASH: Thank you so much to Sam Kiely for that reporting.

Much more ahead in the Newsroom right after this.

[16:35:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BASH: A new CNN documentary called "On the Trail: Inside the 2020 Primaries" at the CNN film produced exclusively for HBO Max it gives you all -- an all-access pass to early 2020 presidential races. Yes, it was this year. It's kind of feels like 100 years ago, but it was this year, it's this election cycle.

And this film follows some of the CNN's female correspondents, reporters, and embeds, as they, as we cover the election. Here's part of it.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JASMINE WRIGHT, CNN VIDEO PRODUCER: We are CNN's eyes and ears on the ground. We know what you have to raise the roof about.

If we don't walk towards her and she goes over there, then we'll miss it. It's a grueling job that takes almost everything you have some days.

Senator, would you satisfied if Bernie Sanders answer on whether a woman could win this election?

SEN. ELIZABETH WARREN (D-MA): I have to see argument between them -- and I was not in the room.

WRIGHT: You're basically giving up a part for the next nearly two years, but afterwards you will have covered a presidential election.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How that feel?

WRIGHT: That's good. That is why I do this job. (END VIDEOTAPE)

BASH: And I'm joined now by CNN political embed producers Jasmine Wright and Daniella Diaz. Nice to see you, guys.

DANIELLA DIAZ, CNN POLITICAL EMBED PRODUCER: Nice to see you, Dana.

WRIGHT: Hello.

BASH: Jasmine, let's start with you because we just played that clip. Just for people who got a taste of it and don't understand what kind of commitment it takes for both of you, for anybody who is doing this kind of job, you, Jasmine, you gave up your apartment. You went to the road full time. Your whole life is the candidate that you are covering. You have to be an expert on that candidate.

And you know what, it was great to see you out there. If you can -- I wonder if you can describe the experience and how important it is for you to be out there not just as a young woman, not just as a young black but as a young black woman especially in this year.

WRIGHT: Thank you. So, you know, the experience is all consuming. You are working 14, 15, sometimes 16-hour days, you're going to several events a day where you have to shoot it, log it, report back.

[16:40:02]

You know, there is no shortage of things that you have to do during the day, as well as being available to the network and answering any questions. But this experience was absolutely so illuminating.

And talking about being a black woman in this media landscape when I was the Senator Harris' -- Senator Kamala Harris' embed for the network, there were so many times where she would talk about her experience as a black woman, talk about her experience as an Indian woman in this country and so many references would go over people's head.

And so, when we talk about being able to effectively represent this new class of women, this record number of women of color coming into the political landscape, running for office, we have to talk about how we are representing them. And we want that representation to look like the women who are now coming into the political landscape, and joining --

BASH: Yes.

WRIGHT: -- these throngs of, you know, white men.

BASH: Yes. There -- I've -- I've started doing this a few years before you guys, and there certainly there have been a lot of dudes. And it's great to have you out on the trail when there is a trail with us.

And Daniella, what I want -- well, first, let's play a little clip of your experience on the trail and we'll talk on the other side.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DIAZ: This is what we call hell week. My God, this feels so nice. On a normal day I do three events a day.

WARREN: Hello, Wallowa (Ph).

(CROWD CHEERING)

WARREN: So, I (Inaudible) with bad news.

DIAZ: This isn't going to work. I need to --

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why don't we go down?

DIAZ: I'm an embed by stalk presidential candidates for a living.

Let me just get in there.

I run around with a 20-pound camera, seven days a week, 24 hours a day, documenting everything that a presidential candidate is doing. Right now, I'm covering Senator Elizabeth Warren. I've been traveling the country with her for eight months, full time, nonstop, providing the base for coverage to our company.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BASH: I just love seeing that. Because people see me and other correspondents who were on camera talking about what's going on the campaign trail, but you guys are doing such hard work behind the scenes.

And Daniella, what really strikes me is how this film shows the human side of it, the human side of not just the candidates, but the people who bring them the news behind the scenes.

DIAZ: Yes, Dana. And I think it's beautiful for people to see all the work that goes into covering an election. It's historic to be a woman, a Latino woman -- I'm from McAllen, Texas -- being able to provide the help I can to bring the information to people and amazing women like you, Dana, and able to help you do your job when you're anchoring or when you're in the field.

That's what we do. We provide that base of coverage to women like you. And you know, you paved the way for us, but I think it's amazing to see us being like people can understand what -- all the work that goes in to covering this election. And you know, you don't even see all the work. And this film shows that.

BASH: I have one question for each of you. Because this is now streaming on HBO Max starting last week. You have been, you have been talking to people, you've been on CNN.

And Jas, I want to start with you. Representation matters. And I'm curious the kind of feedback you have gotten from people who are seeing you, a woman of color, talk about this experience that you have covering the campaign.

WRIGHT: Absolutely. You know, the feedback has been absolutely overwhelming. So many supportive messages have been flooding my e- mail, my DMs, just kind of thanking me, and saying that they resonate with me, both women older and younger, black women asking for a mentorship, really saying that they have related to my experience as a black woman on the campaign trail, and thanks me for being there.

And as well, you know, I'm really getting some heartwarming messages from dads, saying that they were awaking their daughter up to watch me on CNN or watch the movie, and that I am inspiring their young girls to become politically active --

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: I have goosebumps, Jas.

WRIGHT: -- and to become a part of process.

BASH: I have goosebumps.

WRIGHT: I mean, it's really crazy, you know.

BASH: It's great.

WRIGHT: I never really thought that.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: And what about you --

WRIGHT: Their reaction, it's great.

BASH: Yes. And you know, Daniella, what about you as a Latina, are you having the same experience?

DIAZ: The messages I've been getting, Dana, are so heartwarming. People have told that they've connected to the story about how my mom is my hero.

[16:45:00]

You as a mother, you know, all you want is your children to look up to you. And I look up to my parents every day and the fact that they came here and allowed me to have the life that I have.

A lot of people have reached out my rings, if you tune to the movie there, I talk about --

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: It's a good tease.

DIAZ: -- I wear my mom's engagement rings. Yes. And her wedding ring. And I'm just blown away by the amount of people that connected to our stories. And I hope that more people understand that anyone can -- if you work hard enough to do this job, and it's open to anyone no matter who you are.

BASH: You two are just amazing, you are rock stars. I'm so honored to be able to work with you. I'm sure you'll join me in giving a shoutout to Katie Hinman, whose brainchild this was --

DIAZ: Yes.

BASH: -- who came up with it from inception to executive and Toby Oppenheimer and so many other people who were behind this. Please, please watch this. It's called "On the Trail: Inside the 2020 Campaign Primaries." It is streaming right now on HBO Max. We'll be right back.

[16:50:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BASH: As the U.S. hits another grim milestone of five million coronavirus cases, and the nation's top health experts spent a lot of their time pleading with Americans to wear masks in public, not everybody is convinced still.

"The Washington Post" reports that the White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows has expressed skepticism about masks in private meeting to both Dr. Anthony Fauci and Dr. Deborah Birx. And that Meadows repeatedly questioned the scientific consensus on wearing masks.

Joining me now is CNN Medical Analyst, Dr. Seema Yasmin. Thank you so much for joining me.

I'm told by a told familiar with Mark Meadows thinking that he was pushing Birx and Fauci, because you remember when the pandemic first started, they were saying people don't need to wear masks, so they shouldn't wear masks, and that is true.

So, my question for you, as an expert is, has our understanding of what masks do or don't do change? Does Meadows have a right to be skeptical?

SEEMA YASMIN, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: So, Dana, our understanding about the science of masks has shifted enormously since those early months, but so has our understanding of this virus. So back then in those very early months of the pandemic, Dr. Fauci did kind of say you don't -- not everybody needs to wear a mask.

But what we've learned since then, is that actually about 40 percent of transmissions are happening from people who felt completely fine. Those kinds of data really shift our understanding.

And that's the thing about science. Just because you said something in March as a competent, ethical scientist, you don't go into summer and autumn saying well I said that earlier, I'm going to stick with that. What you say as a competent ethical scientist, someone like Dr. Fauci,

is I have new guidance, I have new evidence. And that shifts our understanding, so let's try something new.

And I think it's also really important to remember that very early on in the year there were concerns about PPE shortages and supply chain challenges. Those turned out to be very real. They are still a problem right now. Dr. Fauci has said he was worried that just telling all Americans to go and wear a mask would mean that we'd have --

BASH: Right.

YASMIN: -- a massive shortage of N95 respirators --

BASH: And there are already --

YASMIN: -- which are the best kind of masks.

BASH: Right. And there already was a shortage at the time. Still not great.

Yesterday, the president claimed that there will be a vaccine very soon. And that the government is ready to distribute it. Operation Warp Speed seems to be moving along pretty fast. Are you convinced that a vaccine is on horizon and it will be available to Americans very soon, like the president says?

YASMIN: So, I've actually written a piece to cnn.com about exactly this. And the piece is actually called, what good is a vaccine if many Americans don't get them? My concern is that we have now set one of the most ambitious vaccine goals in scientific history. Operation Warp Speed says 300 million doses of a safe and effective vaccine hope to be delivered by January 2021.

However, we don't even have a vaccine yet and the anti-vaccine movement is in full effect. You look at some of these surveys across the country, one in five Americans is flat-out refusing to get a vaccine if there were one available. Only about 50 percent are those surveyed said that they would roll their sleeves up for a potentially pandemic-ending vaccine.

So, my concern is, what good will a vaccine be if many people refuse to get it and then we just can't achieve --

BASH: Yes.

YASMIN: -- herd immunity with it? So, absent a cohesive, effective communication strategy, Operation Warp Speed could be set to be a failure.

BASH: Thank you so much, Dr. Seema Yasmin. I will check out that story on cnn.com.

And during the pandemic three CNN heroes are offering help and hope to people behind bars and those recently released from prison.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ELLEN STACKABLE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, POETIC JUSTICE: They closed down every jail and prison in Oklahoma. No visitors, no volunteers, no outside programs at all. For at least 30 days, women at one facility were on a bed lockdown. But we were able to bring to all 800 women coloring books, puzzle books, colored pencils, writing journals. And we now have 120 people writing to women on the inside every week, too.

RICHARD MILES, FOUNDER, MILES OF FREEDOM: Coming back home under the uncertainly of the pandemic increases the level of stress and anxiety. We are still working with people to get them assistance with employment, our lawn service is essential, so we are gaining more contracts.

[16:55:02]

It actually allows us to put people through temporary employment while they're in our program.

BECCA STEVENS, PRESIDENT, THISTLE FARMS: We are till welcoming women into our residential program. We have eight new women coming on board, but we've shifted. We've done that awful word that everybody is using now, pivoted. We've pivoted. We've done it. You don't abandon people in these times. You champion people and champion each other.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: For more information, visit cnnheroes.com.

Thank you so much for joining me today. Jim Acosta picks up after a quick break.

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