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New Day
Trump and Biden Face-off At Their First Presidential Debate. Aired 7:30-8a ET
Aired September 30, 2020 - 07:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[07:30:00]
ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: One of the more emotional moments from last night's debate came when President Trump attacked Joe Biden's family. Here it is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE FOR 2020: Speaking of my son, the way you talk about the military, the way you talk about them being losers and being -- and just being suckers, my son was in Iraq. He spent a year there. He got the -- he got the bronze star. He got the conspicuous service medal. He was not a loser. He was a patriot, and the people left behind there --
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Oh, really?
BIDEN: Were heroes.
TRUMP: Really?
BIDEN: And I resent --
TRUMP: Are you talking about Hunter?
BIDEN: White kill --
TRUMP: Are you talking about Hunter?
BIDEN: I'm talking about my son Beau Biden, you're talking about Beau --
TRUMP: I don't know -- I don't know, Beau. I know Hunter --
BIDEN: Yes, you know, Beau --
TRUMP: Hunter got thrown -- Hunter got thrown out of the military, he was thrown out, dishonorably discharged --
BIDEN: That's not true, he wasn't dishonorably --
TRUMP: For cocaine use, and he didn't have a job until you became vice president. Once you became vice president -- BIDEN: None of that is true. My son --
TRUMP: And he didn't have a job --
BIDEN: My son, like a lot of people, like a lot of people you know at home, had a drug problem. He's overtaken it. He's fixed it. He's worked on it. And I'm proud of him. I'm proud of my son --
[07:35:00]
TRUMP: But why was he given --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CAMEROTA: OK, back with us, Terry McAuliffe, David Urban and Ana Navarro. Governor, would it have been more effective, do you think, for Joe Biden to turn the tables and say, you want to talk about children? You want to talk about children? How many of your kids have served in the military? Should he have gone like that or should he have just defended his own family as he did?
TERRY MCAULIFFE, FORMER VIRGINIA GOVERNOR: I think Joe did the right thing there. I think any parent -- I have a son who's a Marine captain, served over in Iraq, and I think for anyone who's had a child serve, this is a very sensitive issue. And we were all highly offended when he referred to the 1,500 Marines killed at Belleau Wood that they were losers and people in the military are suckers. So, I think he did the right thing --
DAVID URBAN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Terry, stop it. Stop --
CAMEROTA: What? David, I mean --
URBAN: Stop Terry --
CAMEROTA: David, why? That's been quoted more than --
URBAN: Alisyn --
CAMEROTA: David, it's been quoted more than once --
URBAN: Alisyn hold on, Alisyn, hold on, Alisyn, stop! Alisyn, stop, it's not true. I was at Belleau Wood. I stood in Belleau Wood with General Kelly, General Dunford. I was on the trip --
CAMEROTA: Yes --
URBAN: I'm a West Point veteran and a combat veteran.
CAMEROTA: Yes?
URBAN: OK, I -- so just stop!
CAMEROTA: Why, David?
URBAN: You could not -- I will -- CAMEROTA: It's possible that he said it out of your earshot --
URBAN: Listen, criticize the president --
CAMEROTA: Sometimes things are said out of your earshot and it was reported across the board --
URBAN: Not out of earshot, Alisyn, this is one --
CAMEROTA: From "The New York Times" to "Fox News" --
URBAN: "The Atlantic" -- listen, "The Atlantic" story --
ANA NAVARRO, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: OK, but can we stop deflecting! This is about last night's debate --
URBAN: I'm not deflecting --
NAVARRO: And the fact that he did not take the opportunity --
URBAN: Ana, stop --
MCAULIFFE: Even "Fox News" --
NAVARRO: And David, I --
URBAN: Stop --
MCAULIFFE: Confirmed that --
NAVARRO: Thank you for your service as we're going there --
URBAN: We can talk -- listen --
MCAULIFFE: I mean, when "Fox News" --
URBAN: Stop, we can talk about -- listen --
MCAULIFFE: Listen, I tell you, that tells you something when "Fox News" --
CAMEROTA: It does --
MCAULIFFE: Even says it's true --
CAMEROTA: It does, David. And then obviously, people around him --
URBAN: They confirmed what?
CAMEROTA: Heard something you didn't hear --
URBAN: They confirmed what?
CAMEROTA: They confirmed that he said it --
URBAN: Confirmed what? MCAULIFFE: "Fox News", number one political report came out and confirmed the --
(CROSSTALK)
CAMEROTA: That users -- that he speaks poorly of them --
MCAULIFFE: To the story. So, you know, it is what it is --
CAMEROTA: I think -- but David -- OK --
URBAN: They confirmed what story? What story, Terry?
MCAULIFFE: He's called John McCain --
(CROSSTALK)
CAMEROTA: That he denigrates the media -- I mean, he denigrates the military --
(CROSSTALK)
Guys, stop.
NAVARRO: Let me tell you what's undeniable.
CAMEROTA: Guys, stop --
NAVARRO: What is undeniable is that the president of the United --
URBAN: Yes --
NAVARRO: States yesterday showed zero empathy to the death of Bo Biden.
URBAN: Stop.
NAVARRO: He lost the opportunity to --
URBAN: Stop --
NAVARRO: Tell Joe Biden, you know what? --
URBAN: So, listen, let's talk about the debate --
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Hang on, hang on, everybody, come on --
NAVARRO: No, don't tell me to stop! What you say, you can use that with others, I'm not Joe Biden and --
BERMAN: Everybody --
NAVARRO: You're not Donald Trump.
BERMAN: This is what I'm going to do --
NAVARRO: I'm not going to stop.
BERMAN: This is what I'm going to do --
NAVARRO: Yesterday, he showed his lack of empathy and his lack of humanity --
CAMEROTA: Now we know why Chris has had a pretty hard time --
NAVARRO: And his lack of respect for Joe Biden's dead son. He --
(CROSSTALK)
MCAULIFFE: I thought John McCain was a hero --
(CROSSTALK)
BERMAN: That's what -- excuse me, excuse me! Excuse me!
NAVARRO: Lost your son and thank you for his service --
BERMAN: Excuse me. That's -- I would like to actually --
NAVARRO: And what he's doing is deflecting because it was a horrible moment --
BERMAN: That's what I'm going to do --
NAVARRO: That showed his lack of humanity!
BERMAN: I want to --
NAVARRO: That's what you're doing --
BERMAN: I want to focus on two moments that were there -- not "The Atlantic" story anymore, that's chewed over. But there were two -- what I think really telling moments in that exchange that we just played last night that are much more forward-looking and telling.
Number one, where after Joe Biden was talking about his son, Beau, who has passed away, Donald Trump just dismissed Joe Biden's dead son, I don't know, Beau, but I do know Hunter. So, that moment, Ana, is I think what you were talking about --
NAVARRO: Yes --
BERMAN: And you could talk more about in a second. And then also, what Joe Biden did, which was show a moment of vulnerability, frankly, and talk about Hunter's struggle with drugs. That, to me -- that to me were the two major takeaways from that very emotional moment. Now that I've all got you paying attention, Ana, you speak first.
NAVARRO: Look, I think Donald -- what you -- what was undeniable was that last night, Donald Trump showed total lack of empathy and humanity as Joe Biden spoke about his dead son. It would not have been a hard lift for him to say -- even Chacha(ph), my dog agrees. It would not have been a hard lift for him to say, you know what? I thank your son for his service, I am sorry that you've lost your son, and I recognize his service. He was humanly incapable of showing that level of emotion and empathy.
CAMEROTA: OK, David, your turn.
URBAN: Yes -- no, listen, I agree with Ana. Rare -- this is a rare moment, right? Ana and I agree, and I think the president should have done that. Look, we should salute everybody's service. You know, Beau Biden is a great guy, and the president should acknowledge that.
CAMEROTA: OK, Terry?
MCAULIFFE: Yes, I agree. But I think the biggest thing we haven't talked about right today, which I think is very important from the debate, was the issue that's on everyone's mind today, COVID. And I thought Joe Biden laid out, talked about a comprehensive plan about how to reopen schools, about what to do about sanitation, how we get small businesses and restaurants open.
I thought that was a very concise, I thought for many Americans, they want to hear about COVID, and President Trump was all over the map on COVID, was putting false statements out there, kept talking about closing China -- but we didn't enforce the ban well on China.
[07:40:00]
As you know, many folks came from Europe and all over the globe to America. He consistently misses the bigger point that he failed in leadership early on in COVID, and I thought that was one of Joe Biden's strongest moments last night when he talked about the number one issue affecting Americans' COVID and how we rebuild and get America back to work again and keep us safe.
BERMAN: I do think that coronavirus, the pandemic is absolutely the number one issue. And I frankly was a little bit surprised it didn't play a larger role in the debate from all three people on that stage last night, Ana. What broke through in the discussions about coronavirus, Ana, what do you think broke through to the voters?
NAVARRO: I think -- I honestly think very little broke through last night, because I think we were all so taken in by the general behavior and by just this, you know, shocking display that we were all watching, that it was hard to focus on the issues.
Look, they spoke about climate change, they spoke about the coronavirus, they spoke about, you know, racial unrest. They spoke about what's going on in the cities. They spoke about so many different things, but it's very hard to remember what they said because you were just -- you know, I think most Americans were in a state of shock watching this president behave in that way.
CAMEROTA: Guys, thank you, we know that these are very intense topics and that -- David, do you have one last thing you want to say?
URBAN: Yes, I just want to say real quickly, two data points to take away here. In 2016, the first debate, you know, CNN, others reported Hillary Clinton drubbing Donald Trump, right, in the first debate. So in September 2016 -- so, there's still a long way to go on the story here. And then also, yesterday, "NBC"-"Wall Street Journal" poll out saying 70 percent of Americans say the debates will have zero impact on who they vote for. So, you know, two data points to remember when this is all done.
BERMAN: Yes, you know, I won't look as much at the poll four years ago as I look at David Urban at the beginning of the segment who says he didn't think the president helped himself last night. Our thanks to you, David, Ana, Terry --
MCAULIFFE: OK, I would just say, John, I would not want to be a Republican Senate candidate. This was not only about the presidential, it did not help Republican Senate candidates last night. This was a bad moment, and they're going to pay a price because they're going to have to go out and try and defend Trump's --
CAMEROTA: I think -- oh, Terry is gone --
BERMAN: Someone shut Terry down --
CAMEROTA: No, Terry just walked right away, he's gone --
BERMAN: Susan Collins, there's some Republican candidate pulled the switch right there on Terry McAuliffe. Our thanks to Terry, David and Ana for that. All right, you heard some of the talk about coronavirus last night, Joe Biden slammed the president for holding an indoor campaign rally during the pandemic. What does doctors say about this, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[07:45:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIDEN: He's not worried about you. He's not worried about the people out there breathing --
TRUMP: We got no negative effect.
BIDEN: No negative effect --
TRUMP: We have had no negative effect, and we've had 35,000, 40,000 --
BIDEN: All right, you want to --
TRUMP: People at these rallies --
BIDEN: He's been totally irresponsible the way in which he has handled the social distancing and people wearing masks, basically encouraging them not to.
CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS: All right.
BIDEN: And he's a fool on this.
TRUMP: If you could get the crowds, you would have done the same thing, but you can't. Nobody cares --
WALLACE: Gentlemen, can we move on --
TRUMP: Nobody cares.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: All right, that was an exchange last night over the president's rallies. Alisyn, did something jump at you?
CAMEROTA: Well, because at some point, I think it was later in that exact moment, the president said and they've all been outdoors. No, they haven't. No, they haven't. He has not only held outdoor rallies, the majority has been, but he's also held indoor rallies --
BERMAN: Yes, in Nevada, he absolutely did.
CAMEROTA: And so, he -- that was wrong. And for some reason, I thought -- and I'm going to get the transcript, that Chris Wallace sort of agreed with him or confirmed what he was saying, but that's not true.
BERMAN: Right -- no, it isn't. The president absolutely held an indoor rally in Nevada, and that was after he did it in June obviously. In Tulsa, and we know Herman Cain died --
CAMEROTA: Weeks after --
BERMAN: Well, we know he went to that rally and then died after --
CAMEROTA: Well, rally, and did not have a temperature and was not sick and then died all of a sudden --
BERMAN: Well, you can see -- you can see the rise in cases in Oklahoma there. You can see where the rally was and how the cases kept on going up after. All right, joining us now, CNN chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta. Sanjay, I know you watched this with probably a different eye, a more critical eye than all of us, a medical eye. What did you hear there?
SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, I heard a very different narrative about what has unfolded with this coronavirus pandemic. You know, this idea that the travel restrictions from China were sort of the panacea. President Trump pointed to that and said, you know, we've done a good job.
He suggested that have somebody else, including Biden had been president, that 2 million people would have been dead by now here in the United States despite the fact that a million people have died around the entire world by this point.
What really became clear to me, and maybe it's been clear for some time is that the only strategy really that the president has been talking about has been the vaccine. That is it. He's talked about other things here and there, but it's really been about this vaccine. They're hinging everything on the vaccine. They want to announce it as quickly as possible, even if it doesn't go through certain safety safeguards.
And it's not going to be the panacea that he believes, as a result, he's tossed out basic public health guidance that would have saved hundreds of thousands, save another 100,000 lives by the end of the year. As you know, just mask wearing alone. So, it's -- there were so many different takeaways directly contradicting people like Anthony Fauci, like Robert Redfield, like Moncef Slaoui who he brought in to run, you know, to advise Operation Warp Speed.
So, it was all over the place, I took furious notes, you know, the entire time. But that was part of the thing that became clear, it's always been about the vaccine and, hey, we did the China restriction, that was all that was necessary.
CAMEROTA: Yes, how about -- let's just listen to a moment where President Trump is talking about masks.
[07:50:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Dr. Fauci -- Dr. Fauci said --
BIDEN: He did not say that --
TRUMP: He said very strongly --
WALLACE: I want to ask you, we've got a little bit of a minute left in this segment --
TRUMP: Masks are not good. Then he changed his mind, he said Mister --
WALLACE: I want to ask --
TRUMP: I'm OK with masks, I'm not fighting masks --
WALLACE: I want to ask you both about one last --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CAMEROTA: Yes, what did your notes say about that, Sanjay?
GUPTA: I mean, you know, months now, we've been talking about this, and it is -- it is true that there was, you know, evidence that sort of emerged on the usefulness of masks. I don't think Dr. Fauci ever said masks weren't good, is a question of how effective would they be. Look, you know, he's talked about this many times, I asked him about it at our citizens event last week. Here's how he put it. Dr. Fauci.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY & INFECTIOUS
DISEASES: Back then, we were not aware that 40 percent to 45 percent of people were asymptomatic, nor where we aware that a substantial proportion of people who get infected get infected from people who are without symptoms.
That makes it overwhelmingly important for everyone to wear a mask. So, we need to put that nonsense behind us about, well, they keep changing their minds. Masks work. Physical distancing works. Avoiding crowds work.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUPTA: The thing about masks, and I think -- I think most people understand this by now that something became clear, sort of, you know, march sort of time frame, early March, mid March, and that is that this virus, unlike a lot of other viruses can spread and spread significantly while people have no symptoms. Typically, I think of a respiratory virus, you're coughing, you're sneezing, hopefully, you stay home, you don't feel well.
But the idea that you might not have any idea because we weren't really testing very adequately in this country, you may have no idea you're harboring the virus inside your body, that became the real impetus for recommending widespread masking, that's how you could curb the spread of the virus. You may not know you have it, wear a mask. That was the point that science did change, and we should do it. But we're still sort of tossing out this basic thing, even though it could save a 100,000 lives.
CAMEROTA: Right, it's very strange, Sanjay, because President Trump's clock got stuck somewhere mid to early March --
GUPTA: Yes --
CAMEROTA: And he hasn't --
GUPTA: Right --
CAMEROTA: Moved on. It also got stuck at the beginning of February with the travel restriction on China, which was, you know, the leakiest travel restriction ever. And so he thinks, well, that's it. I did my job, you know, I did that travel restriction from China. Then, I guess that's as good as it gets, and then he doesn't realize that things have moved on from March. We have more information now than we did as Dr. Fauci and you have been trying to --
BERMAN: You know what else we have?
CAMEROTA: Tell us, what?
BERMAN: Two hundred and six thousand Americans dead. We just crossed 206,000 Americans during the course of this show. So, that happens.
CAMEROTA: Sanjay, thank you,
GUPTA: You got it, thank you.
CAMEROTA: It's five weeks from election day, and President Trump keep trying to inject the issue of election fraud into the race. Why?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[07:55:00]
CAMEROTA: President Trump appears to think the only way he can win is to cast doubt on the legitimacy of the U.S. election and stoke division among American voters. John Avlon has more in your reality check. Hi, John?
JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Hey, Ali, you know, Donald Trump's debate performance almost seemed designed to undermine confidence in the democratic process.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: This going to be a fraud like you've never seen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
AVLON: All right. That was Trump on mail-in voting which has a 0.0025 percent fraud rate over the last two elections according to a study of three vote by mail states.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Take a look at West Virginia, mail-man selling the ballots. They're being sold. They're being dumped in rivers.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
AVLON: All right. A West Virginia mail man did get caught changing five democratic primary ballots to Republican. But there's just no record of ballots hitting rivers. Look, Trump is trying to gin up anxiety about a free and fair election. And when moderator Chris Wallace asked him to clearly condemn white supremacist, militia violence, he just couldn't.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Boys, stand back and stand by, but I'll tell you what? I'll tell you what? Somebody's got to do something about Antifa and the left.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: All right, that ignores his own FBI director saying that white nationalist violence is a persistent, pervasive threat, and Antifa is more of an -- is more of an ideology than an organization. So, just what is Trump asking his supporters to be ready for?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: Will you urge your supporters to stay calm during this extended period --
TRUMP: I'm urging my --
WALLACE: You go first --
TRUMP: Supporters to go into the polls and watch very carefully because that's what has to happen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
AVLON: You got that? That certainly sounds like a potential call for voter intimidation. Look, folks, votes are already being cast in this election, and this president seems to decide without evidence that it's already fraudulent. But don't let Trump's disrespect for the democratic process deter you from your vote. And that's your reality check. JB and Ali?
CAMEROTA: Thank you for that reminder, John, and it is great to have you here on this morning, help us get through all of this. All right, NEW DAY continues right now.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just going to say it like it is, that was a shit show.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He took the presidency and the office of the presidency to a new low.
WALLACE: Are you willing to condemn white supremacists?
TRUMP: Almost everything I see is from the left wing, not from the right wing.
BIDEN: So this is a president who has used everything as a dog whistle to try to generate racist hatred.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's the wrong answer. It's always been the wrong answer. The fact that he can't look into the camera and say it is a problem.
TRUMP: You've got to open your states up. It's not fair. It's like being in prison.
BIDEN: He has no intention of doing anything about making it better in terms of your health and your safety.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: All right, good morning everyone, welcome to our viewers in the United States and all around the world. This is NEW DAY, and the president of the United States refused to condemn violence by white supremacist groups.
