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Trump's Erratic Behavior Escalates During COVID Infection; Trump Spurs Stimulus Chaos as Americans Fight to Survive; Ex-Cop Derek Chauvin Posts $1 Million Bail, to be Released. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired October 07, 2020 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

SEN. MARTHA MCSALLY (R-AZ): Stop doing that.

[13:00:01]

JOHN KING, CNN INSIDE POLITICS: Kelly leading at the moment, one of the big Senate races we'll keep an eye on.

Thanks for joining us today. I hope to see you back here this time tomorrow. A bus news day, Brianna Keilar picks up right now.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN RIGHTNOW: Hello there. I'm Brianna Keilar, and welcome to our viewers here in the United States and around the world.

Even in the midst of a battle against the coronavirus, President Trump making time for a tweetstorm. These are just some of the 48 tweets and re-tweets from the president in the span of a few hours this morning, one everything from the stimulus talks that he upended Tuesday to his often repeated but never supported by evidence claims that the Obama administration spied on his last bid for the White House.

And while a Twitter rant is nothing new for this president, it is adding to growing concerns that his behavior since becoming infected has become increasingly erratic and it is taking the focus off a pandemic that is showing renewed signs of spread. 25 states now reporting increasing number of cases compared to last week. And for the first time in a month-and-a-half, the U.S. is seeing an average of more than 44,000 new cases per day.

And several of these cases can be traced to people who are close to President Trump. A CNN count shows at least 20 people, including the president, are now confirmed to have tested positive. The most recent addition to that list is Stephen Miller, the architect of many of the president's anti-immigrant policies. And Miller, we should point out, had a series of negative tests before learning that he was actually positive for coronavirus.

Putting this cluster here into perspective, all of the countries on your screen right now reported fewer cases last week than the White House has had in the last few days.

CNN's Kaitlan Collins is reporting for us near the White House. And, Kaitlan, we know the president has been pushing to get back into the Oval Office. Tell us the latest is on that and how they are even preparing the space for his eventual return.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, they are expecting for that to happen as soon as today, Brianna. And the chief of staff said that they have made the necessary health precautions for that to happen.

Sources have told us there is this thing that they're calling an isolation cart outside the Oval Office that has yellow hospital gowns, respirators, goggles to go over your eyes, things of that nature for people to be going into the Oval, if they do go into the Oval to meet with the president.

And we should note, there are very few people working out of the west wing. It's quite a difference from just a week ago when nobody in the west wing was even wearing just basic a mask and now they've got all these PPE set up to go and to meet with the president.

But I do want to let you know that we just got an update from the president's doctor. We have not heard from Dr. Conley in person to take our questions since Monday when the president left the hospital but the press secretary did just tweet out a statement from him. Pretty sure, but at the beginning, it does quote the president saying, I feel great.

And then he goes on to say that the president's vital signs, his oxygen saturation, his respiratory rate remain stable and they're in a normal range, according to Dr. Conley. He also that he's been fever- free for more than four days and symptom-free for over 24 hours and says he has not gotten any supplemental oxygen since he was initially hospitalized on Friday. So that's the update on oxygen. That was a big question that we had.

He also says, Brianna, that they have gone through his labs and he now has detectable levels of antibodies. Dr. Conley said that is not something that the president had on Thursday when the White House says they first found out that the president has coronavirus. And so that is a notable development.

But, Brianna, there are still a lot of things that are left unsaid in this statement. One of those has been the main question we've asked, which is when did the president last test negative. We still don't know what the president's lung scans have showed.

And also a big question that could be timely right now given the president's eagerness to get back in the Oval and back on the debate stage next week is whether or not they still believe the president is contagious. And they don't say any of that in this pretty brief statement. They didn't say it in a brief statement that we got yesterday.

And this shows why it's so critically important that we actually get a chance to hear from the president's doctor in person or he takes questions from reporters, which didn't always yield sufficient answers but at least he is taking questions. And it's not clear why they have stopped those briefings with the president's physician.

And so, hopefully, they will restart them because, of course, a written statement from the doctor just likely is not going to be sufficient to answer the medical questions that people have about the president's condition given that he is very much still in the middle of this coronavirus diagnosis.

KEILAR: Yes. And he seems to want to move on from it, just like he wants to move on from the pandemic, even though it's not his timeline to determine. Kaitlan, thank you so much for that important update on the president's condition.

I want to bring Dr. Robert Wachter. He is chair of the Department of Medicine at the University of California San Francisco.

And I wonder, Doctor, we can sort of go through different parts of this statement but what is perhaps the thing that sticks out to you the most?

DR. ROBERT WACHTER, CHAIR, DEPARTMENT OF MEDICINE AT UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA SAN FRANCISCO: Well, if it's to be believed, and there have been times where we haven't gotten the full truth, but if it's to be believed, he sounds like he's pretty stable.

[13:05:02]

It sounds like his vital signs are stable. He is not requiring oxygen. He has no symptoms. That's good.

The absence of fever and the absence of symptoms when someone is on steroids is a little bit dicey to hang your hat on because the steroids can make fever go away and make people feel better even though they are still kind of sick. That was my observation of the helicopter trip and the step -- taking the steps up the White House the other day, was that the -- patients often feel invincible on steroids, but then they get to the top and then there's that reckoning and he was clearly short of breath.

It sounds like he's doing well. That's great. He is not out of the woods. It won't really be until next week that he would be getting to the end of the period during which we worry about a significant deterioration and compromise of his breathing.

KEILAR: Detectable levels of antibodies, they're saying, that he has. What does that mean?

WACHTER: Well, in everybody who has COVID and survives, at some point, you begin to develop antibodies against the virus. So it's expected. The timing varies a little bit but it's expected that that would happen. It doesn't say very much about what his course is likely to be, because the antibodies themselves don't necessarily guarantee that he will have a benign course of COVID.

In fact, many patients do find for the first several days and then have a deterioration at the end of week one or the beginning of week two. And we think that much of that actually is your immune system going into overdrive. So it's the immune system trying hard to attack the virus as an external invader but also then attacking your own body. That's rationale for giving him the steroids. It's designed to tamp it down.

So it's expected and it's -- I think it's a fairly neutral piece of information. The most important piece of information is that he is clinically stable. Every day he goes on and doesn't deteriorate, his probability of a bad outcome goes down.

But at this point, you would still say, if you took the overall numbers of patients with COVID, as severe as he had, with the risk factors he had, he still has a significant chance, probably more than one in ten of dying of this episode. So it's nothing to be taken lightly.

KEILAR: Okay. I mean, that's a considerable number, right? That now if you would -- the reverse of that would be nine in ten have not. But, obviously, I guess the reason I'm focused on that is he is talking about going back into the Oval Office, right? So he's not convalescing and relaxing. Although, I guess, to each person, what is relaxing is different. But certainly it takes physical effort to do this.

Is that a good idea? And do you expect that he is still contagious especially considering they have a setup outside the Oval to protect anyone who goes in with PPE?

WACHTER: Two different questions. One is, is it okay for him to be working? And I suspect that for the president sitting in bed doing nothing is probably more stressful than doing other things. And so if he feels up for it, there's really nothing that would say he has to be in strict bed rest. It's perfectly fine for him to do whatever he feels like he can do, as long as he doesn't overtax himself.

The separate but very important issue is, is he contagious. And as far as we know, his first positive test was on Thursday, so he's six days into it. He is almost certainly still contagious and will be, on average, until about ten days after his symptoms have gone away.

So he's still in the contagious period. He's not at the peak of his contagiousness, which is probably on Wednesday or Thursday. But that's the riskiest thing right now. Not so much to him but the riskiest thing is if he's wandering around the building, particularly if he's not wearing a mask, that he is putting people who come in contact with him at risk.

The fact that the people are going to be using PPE, that is terrific. But we generally recommend that not only do people use PPE but they really minimize contacts with an infected and contagious person to just the amount that's necessary.

For patients who are in the hospital, for example, with COVID, we'll send one doctor and one nurse in, but we normally -- if a whole team would have gone into the room, we tell the rest of the team to stay outside. So he should be minimizing the number of contacts because you can't make the risk down to zero. KEILAR: But you can reduce it and that's important. Dr. Wachter, thank you so much for being with us.

WACHTER: Thank you.

KEILAR: Just in to CNN, administration officials tell CNN that Vice President Mike Pence has tested negative for coronavirus ahead of tonight's vice presidential debate. There are several new coronavirus safety precautions that are going to be in place tonight, and that includes what you see right there.

[13:10:00]

These are Plexiglass screens around Pence as well as the Democratic vice presidential candidate, Senator Kamala Harris.

CNN's Jason Carroll is there. He's at the site of tonight's debate in Salt Lake City. And, I mean, the stakes are high. This is their one shot. They don't get three chances. They get one and this it. So, what are we expecting to see and hear tonight, Jason?

JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, already, coronavirus has taken center stage. You look at what happened with the debate over the Plexiglass walls that you saw there just a short while ago, some of the vice president's critics are already questioning, asking why was this something that needed to be debated at all given the fact Stephen Miller tested positive for coronavirus, his wife, Katie Miller, works as the press secretary to the vice president. She tested negative and went home yesterday.

But the optics of this, Brianna, are perfectly clear. A little earlier today, Senator Harris' team was asked about whether or not the senator feels safe even being on a stage with the vice president. They sort of dodged that question. But this is an issue that will not be dodged tonight.

Senator Harris, what she will try to do, is put the president and the vice president in the same box, if you will, in terms of their failed response t the coronavirus. Pence, for his part, will try to portray the senator as being too liberal, too progressive for the country.

In terms of the debate itself and the format, a couple of things we want to point out, no opening or closing statements. Both candidates will be about 12 feet, three inches apart from each other. It will be 90 minutes long broken down to 10-minute segments. The moderator will be Susan Page from USA Today. Masks will be required by all those attendees inside the hall.

Also some questions about the tone given what we saw during the presidential debate. Look, both Harris and both Pence, skilled debaters. They are known as the types of people who can argue an issue without raising their voices, without name-calling. And so one political operative told me, he said, look, perhaps tonight, we'll finally get a debate of the real issues. Brianna?

KEILAR: Yes, it might be a refreshing change. Jason Carroll, thank you so much, live for us from Salt Lake City.

The president's economic adviser says the U.S. is on the verge of economic calamity after the president abruptly ends stimulus talks as new outbreaks hit America.

Plus, former head of pandemic preparation inside the administration has just quit, saying, he can't take it anymore.

And a second New England Patriot testing positive after Cam Newton's infection and the team played on Monday night. What does that mean?

This is CNN's special live coverage.

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[13:15:00]

KEILAR: Right now, around the world, global markets are trying to make sense of President Trump, but it's not his health that's in question, it's his latest move on the economy. Walking away from stimulus talks at a time when he is falling further and further behind in the polls and then hours later attempting to walk it back, placing the blame on Democrats and House Speaker Nancy Pelosi.

And while a bitter fight once again grips Washington and casts doubt on the faith of U.S. economy, millions of Americans are left staring down their own personal, financial catastrophe, like Israel Rodriguez, who, like so many, has been evicted from his home.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ISRAEL RODRIGUEZ, LOST HIS JOB DUE TO THE PANDEMIC: There was a lot going on during the corona. When it hit, I lost my job. So it took me like a month to get another job.

This is my check but I ain't making it with $300.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Like the restaurant owners who are getting by just by the skin of their teeth.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We went from being about to franchise to basically running a to-go business. I'm worried about having a heart attack, to be perfectly honest with you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Like the tens of thousands of pilots and airline workers whose jobs are on the line.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: So, Congress getting a new deal together could save 1,900 pilot jobs at Delta?

ED BASTIAN, CEO, DELTA AIR LINES: Absolutely.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Like the mothers and fathers who are standing in line for hours at food banks across the country just trying to put food on the table.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I live check by check, but now, it's not a check, it's a box, a box that I have to stretch out for seven days.

The food, that's where we struggle more. Sometimes we eat, sometimes we don't.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: These are the real faces of this crisis. These are the people who shoulder the burden.

And as we watch inaction at the White House, the president's own circle is sounding the alarm. Just last night, Trump's former economic senior adviser, Kevin Hassett, warned, we remain close to the edge of an economic calamity.

That sobering prediction came hours after Fed Chair Jay Powell echoed that sentiment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEROME POWELL, FEDERAL RESERVE CHAIRMAN: Too little support would lead to weak recovery, creating unnecessary hardship for households and businesses. Overtime, household insolvencies and business bankruptcies would rise harming the productive capacity of the economy and holding back wage growth.

By contrast, the risks of overdoing it seem for now to be smaller.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Joining me now is Larry Summers. He is the former treasury secretary under President Clinton, he is former director of National Economic Council under President Obama. Larry, thanks for being with us.

LARRY SUMMERS, FORMER TREASURY SECRETARY UNDER PRESIDENT CLINTON: Good to be with you.

KEILAR: What's the effect of punting -- I mean, they weren't coming to an agreement on anything in Congress, but what's the effect of just getting rid of any possibility of an agreement on stimulus until after the election?

[13:20:00] SUMMERS: Less confidence, more unemployment, and with more unemployment, lower output and incomes and throwing away the best insurance policy we could have had against another recession. This is like living in California in the midst of a dry season and canceling your fire insurance. It's hard to understand as a rational act.

KEILAR: So it doesn't make any rational sense to you. And this would follow -- the idea is that this stimulus package would follow on the initial one, which was designed to ensure that businesses could weather a short-term recession, that they would not sustain permanent damage. But it wasn't going to cut it for the whole pandemic. What happens if a second round is not approved?

SUMMERS: We're taking a big chance, bigger chance on having another recession. We're going to have more people out of work. We're going to have more people in poverty. We're going to have more people probably dying because there's not going to be safety on the streets and adequate health care in municipal hospitals.

Look, you can debate just what the right level of unemployment insurance is. You can debate -- I actually think the airline bailout is foolishness. But you can't debate whether we need to support this economy both immediately and as insurance against a downturn into a recession. This is an extraordinarily irresponsible act.

KEILAR: If you look at it through a political lens, is there any reason to do this? We know the president, unlike Republicans when they go back to their roots, he's never really cared much about spending, about the deficit. He's four weeks out from an election now. There's this idea that a stimulus deal could be really good for him. He could look like a hero, right?

Politically, does this make any sense not to do this?

SUMMERS: You know, I don't think it's for me to judge the best political strategy for people who are basically my political opponents. Maybe he thinks that having the whole place dysfunctional will cause it to be more attractive to put him more strongly in charge of everything. I can't really imagine.

The main thing though is that this is a failure for Americans. This is a failure for the American example. The more dysfunctional we look -- we ultimately won the cold war because of the power of our example. When we look as a dysfunctional society, that is costing us a great deal in terms of our national security at a moment when we've got some very important threats from Russia, from the possibility of what could happen in China. I find this inexplicable abdication of responsibility.

KEILAR: Secretary, thank you so much for being with us.

SUMMERS: Thank you.

KEILAR: We have some breaking news that's just in now. Derek Chauvin, the former Minneapolis police officer who was charged in the death of George Floyd, is being released from prison. I want to go now to CNN's Omar Jimenez, who has been following this story since the very beginning and he's joining us now. What are you learning about this?

OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brianna, we're just hearing from Chauvin's attorney, Eric Nelson, who says that Chauvin posted a million dollar bond and is in the process of being released from the Hennepin County Correctional Facility there. And we also heard from someone at the Minnesota Department of Corrections who confirmed that he is no longer in their custody.

Now, of course, this is significant because he's one of the four officers charged in the death of George Floyd. He has been facing the most serious charges in this, charges that range from second degree murder to second degree manslaughter as well.

And when you look at the other officers in this, all of the four, all of them had already been released at previous points in this year. But then people were then turning to Derek Chauvin to see what would happen here.

Now, it does come with conditions as for him being released. His next court date isn't scheduled until March 8th. So, as part of this, he is required by law to come back and appear for that court date. But at the end of the day, he does join other officers as being out of correctional facility custody. He is in the process of that now.

One of the main messages that it sent to people who were angry about the previous releases of the other officers is that while these officers can go home and hang with their families and enjoy life with their families, we are still dealing with the death of a man that came under horrible circumstances that we saw unfold in that cell phone video.

[13:25:18]

So, we're going to continue to monitor the reaction to this and to see if there are any further developments. But as we do understand, again, Derek Chauvin, the officer facing the most serious charges in the death of George Floyd, is in the process of release posting in a million dollar bond. His attorney confirms to us and the Department of Corrections says, again, he's no longer in their custody.

KEILAR: All right. Omar, thank you for that update. I really appreciate it.

My next guest says the president's coronavirus infection shows his masculinity image is just a facade.

Plus, a disturbing new warning from Dr. Anthony Fauci about the number of Americans who may lose their lives by January.

And new concerns about another event the president hosted at the White House last week with gold star families while he could have been infected.

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[13:30:00]