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President Trump Comments about Moving Back to Oval Office to Work in White House; White House Adviser Stephen Miller Tests Positive for Coronavirus; Vice President Mike Pence and Vice Presidential Nominee Sen. Kamala Harris Prepare for Their Debate; FDA Delays Vaccine Approval Until After Election. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired October 07, 2020 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[08:00:00]

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Coronavirus hotspot this morning. Dr. Anthony Fauci says that the outbreak did not have to happen, and he is warning that if the negligence that we saw at the White House continues, we could be in for a long, deadly winter across the country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, NATIONAL INSTITUTES OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: The models tell us that if we do not do the kinds of things that we're talking about in the cold of the fall and the winter, we could have from 300,000 to 400,000 deaths. That would be just so tragic if that happens.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: The president's senior advisor and speech writer Stephen Miller is the latest White House aide to test positive. He is the 21st person in President Trump's orbit to become infected. "The New York Times" reports that even though the White House created the impression that President Trump was being tested every day, he was not.

Tonight, the vice presidential debate will go on with plexiglass. Senator Kamala Harris going head to head with Vice President Mike Pence, and we have some new details about what the debate will look like.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Also this morning, millions of Americans are in desperate need of economic relief, but President Trump ended negotiations unilaterally and abruptly in a single tweet, and he did this after the Federal Reserve chair warned that without relief the economy and the recovery are in danger. But then overnight the president appeared to backtrack. No one really knows where he stands. He is negotiating with himself and losing.

CAMEROTA: Joining us now, we have CNN chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta and Olivia Troye. She served as Vice President Pence's lead staffer with the Coronavirus Task Force. She has now endorsed Joe Biden. Great to have both of you. Olivia, I just want to check in with you about what you're thinking as we watch this hot spot in the White House grow. So now Stephen Miller, OK, so Katie Miller, his wife who is on Vice President Pence's staff, obviously, she had had it, now her husband, chief aide and speechwriter for President Trump has it. It's not going away. It seems to be getting worse.

OLIVIA TROYE, FORMER HOMELAND SECURITY ADVISER TO VICE PRESIDENT MIKE PENCE: I remain concerned watching what is happening before our very eyes. I was concerned working during my tenure in the White House because I saw how cavalier and negligent people were behaving. And Dr. Fauci is right, we could have prevented this. We didn't socially distance. People were not wearing masks. And as you're seeing it play out, when you have these gatherings with the staff and other interactions, such as a Rose Garden and fundraisers, and they're traveling everywhere because they insist on traveling everywhere, and they insist on not wearing masks, this is what happens. And now you have -- I'm sure that we are going to see more people that are positive that probably are carrying the virus or probably asymptomatic and just haven't tested positive quite yet.

BERMAN: Sanjay, I want to read you one bit of new reporting that we're getting from CNN's Kevin Liptak here. It has to do with what the president wants to do now. He's been in the residence in the medical area inside the residence, but apparently he's itching to get out, and might. He said, quote -- or reporting is, he could make his way back to the West Wing as early as Wednesday, that's today, if he has his way. He has raised the possibility of working from the Oval Office instead of the rooms that have been arranged for him on the lower level of the executive mansion, saying he feels ready to go back.

So the president wants to go back to the Oval Office as soon as today. How much of a departure is that from what you think the correct medical protocol will be? And Sanjay, you were a White House fellow. You know how many people are moving about the White House structure. Who does this put at risk?

SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: It puts a lot of people at risk, John. He should be in isolation. He is carrying a contagious, potentially deadly virus in his body, and it's very contagious. So he could be expelling virus into the air. Hopefully he is wearing a mask, but still, that's obviously a terrible idea. And he should be in isolation in the hospital given his overall hospital course. So every single step of the way this is becoming increasingly absurd.

One other thing it's worth pointing out about Stephen Miller and Katie Miller. So Katie Miller had the virus, if they were living together and Stephen Miller did not become infected at that point sounds like, it shows that if someone is in isolation, even within their own home, they could go a long way towards protecting the people that they live with. He then goes to the White House and becomes infected there.

So living with someone who has the virus, it is possible to protect yourself if you are careful, and yet he still becomes infected by going to another house, the White House. So it gives you the nature of both how contagious this is, but also how effective these public health policies can be. Wearing a mask, isolating, that really goes a long way to protect other people.

[08:05:09]

CAMEROTA: Olivia, I just want to read a little bit more of our new CNN reporting, because it sounds like the set of a sci-fi movie inside the White House. Here is the new reporting. Already preparations have been made for the president's eventual return to the Oval Office, including positioning a so-called isolation cart stocked with yellow medical gowns, respirator masks, and plastic goggles required for visitors just outside of the office doors near where Trump's assistants sit. They would rather these optics than just having worn a mask inside and outside when they travel? This is the surreal point that we're now at in the White House.

TROYE: It is surreal, and quite honestly, this is what happens when you have people at the very highest levels in the White House who, I think, still today think this virus -- the focus on the virus is overblown. They don't take it seriously. My concern today honestly is about the vice president. I know the exposure on that staff. Katie Miller, she is everywhere in that West Wing. She is everywhere in the small quarters of outside the vice president's office. I hope that he has been isolated and is home and away from a lot of the staff and some of these people who just, frankly, don't care. I've lived it. I've seen it. I've seen the behavior. It's terrible, and it's terrible leadership exhibited by people in the White House who should be setting the example for all Americans on how to protect ourselves and protect each other from getting this virus. It's tragic.

BERMAN: I will say as a metaphor and more with everything right now, the Joint Chiefs are in quarantine this morning because an admiral in the Coast Guard who was at the White House has now tested positive. So that is another one of these major effects this morning.

Sanjay, the vice presidential debate is tonight. Kamala Harris and the Vice President Mike Pence will be on the stage together behind plexiglass. The Pence campaign finally relented and said, OK, the vice president will allow plexiglass to go up in front of him. But what's your assessment overall of the safety protocols in place, or the fact this is even happening?

SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I think that's the most important question here. They're trying to do whatever they can to try and hold this event in the middle of a pandemic where there's very clearly significant viral spread. So it strikes me that they're going to try these various strategies, but they all are -- who knows how effective they're going to be in the context of what we now know about this virus.

Safest would obviously be to do this virtually. Everybody knows that. Next safest would probably be to do it outside where you have significant air exchange. The plexiglass is good for respiratory droplets, but we know and have known for some time this virus can be aerosolized. So that means the plexiglass isn't really going to prevent that. The virus can linger into the air, it can travel further than six feet. There shouldn't be an audience there. That could just potentially add to the amount of virus into the air. Probably, again, this is just trying to come up with the best strategy

in a tough, bad situation, but the candidates probably should be wearing masks, at least when they are not talking, although that doesn't make a lot of sense. So all of these -- they sound like you're just trying to do the best you can with a really tough situation. There's no guarantees even with the testing. The Cleveland Clinic protocols are that you have to have -- you have to show that you've had a negative test within 72 hours prior to the debate. You can test positive the day before the debate if it's just 72 hours. It doesn't make a lot of sense. So I have a lot of concerns. I'm sure people who have been thinking about these debates have a lot of concerns. But we are in the middle of a pandemic. That's just the truth of the matter.

CAMEROTA: Olivia, we've seen this movie before. We saw what happened with President Trump's debate with Joe Biden. His family marched in, proudly doffed their masks right away, sat down. We have all the video of it. They make a statement of not wearing masks, and a lot of those folks over the past week have gotten sick. And so the idea that Katie Miller would mock Senator Kamala Harris for wanting some more protection when having to deal with the vice president's folks, she's seen what's happened. How could she not be nervous about putting herself in that situation tonight? And I know that you in particular -- I know you have had your own experience with watching some of the recklessness near you.

[08:10:01]

TROYE: Right. For Katie Miller to mock the Biden and Harris campaign, and Kamala Harris for having and calling -- she wants to build a fortress around her, go ahead, have right at it, or whatever she said, I just think it's completely disrespectful. There is an outbreak in the White House. Quite honestly, it's the vice president's traveling party that are the danger and the contagion coming into this debate.

And I hope as the head of the White House Coronavirus Task Force, the vice president will show leadership tonight, will tell his staff I don't care how you feel about this personally, you must protect each other, protect me, and protect the others who are in the audience and the other campaign. This is a virus, it kills me. This isn't some sort of game. This is -- the debate is critical, it's part of our election process. I totally respect that. But I hope tonight when I'm looking at the audience from home that everyone is wearing a mask, that people are behaving in a way that is respectful towards each other, and that the naysayers that I know who are the closest circle of advisers to the vice president have taken a step back and have thought to themselves I was wrong, I need to take it seriously, and it's time to protect each other and show America some leadership on this thing.

BERMAN: Just look at where we are this morning. Every time my phone buzzes I think it's going to be a news alert telling me yet another White House employee has tested positive. That's where we are, because it seems to be happening every hour almost on the hour. Olivia Troye, thank you very much for being with us this morning. Sanjay, don't go far. We have much more for you coming up.

CAMEROTA: The FDA standing up to political pressure when it comes to approving a coronavirus vaccine. What we now know about the new timeline next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:15:25]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: The FDA has released new rules requiring two months of data from the coronavirus vaccine trials under way. Two months of data from the patients from the point when they receive their second dose of the vaccine. This all but eliminates the possibility of emergency use approval before Election Day.

And this does come as coronavirus infections continue to increase in half the country, all the states you're seeing there in red and the ones in beige, it just means that it's level, it's level and right now, we're leveled off at a pretty dangerous place.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta is back with us. Also with us now is Dr. Ashish Jha, dean of the Brown University School of Public Health.

And, Dr. Jha, first on this FDA point, there was a political battle here which the FDA appears to have won in order to add this extra period of caution, a waiting period before they're convinced that the vaccine trials are safe.

Politics aside, what's the significance of having this period? How important is this?

DR. ASHISH JHA, DEAN, BROWN UNIVERSITY SCHOOL OF PUBLIC HEALTH: Good morning, and thanks for having me on.

This is really a no-brainer. This is the guidance created by the great FDA scientists and it basically says that after we vaccinate people in the trials, you need to have at least a two-month follow-up to make sure that there are no major safety events.

That strikes me as sort of a basic bottom -- you know, kind of a minimum bar and the White House obviously did try to overrule that. I was thrilled to see the FDA stick to their guns and win this day. It is going to bring I think a lot more confidence to the vaccine for the American people.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Well, there you go, Sanjay. I mean, I think that this is a really significant moment precisely because of the politics of it. Science won over the politics. We haven't seen a lot of that over these past few months. And so, this is so important, you've been calling for the FDA to do this and they won.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: They did, and, you know, as Ashish said, it's kind of a no-brainer. I mean, no side effects occur within two months, that's where that two month sort of number came from and this vaccine project has still moved along at a really, really rapid pace and that's worth celebrating and that scenes is really working on all cylinders as well.

But, you know, it's interesting, we've soon this now with the FDA despite the fact that the president said he may not approve these guidelines, the FDA stuck to their guns. The CDC recently sort of sticking to their guns putting back the idea, the known fact that this virus can spread via aerosols, they had that on their website, it was taken off their website, it is now back on their website.

So, you know, we are seeing some examples now from these big scientific organizations that have been sort of marginalized in all of this where they're coming back and sticking to their guns on this and I think it's important, hopefully we will continue to see more of that.

BERMAN: I have to say, when you overlay that CDC guidance on coronavirus being aerosolized over the events we saw at the White House, the indoor events at the White House, including the events for gold star families, when you overlay it over the debates it really does start to make your hair hurt, it really does make you realize how dangerous the activities have been there.

Dr. Jha, for the rest of the country, too, it is in a precarious place. We've heard Dr. Fauci issue the warnings. There is a graphic that I don't like to look at it scares the hell out of me.

You look at Wisconsin, the hospital rate in Wisconsin is just going through the roof. Look how steep that curve is in hospitalizations where people are so sick that they need this care.

So what is going on around the country and which direction do you see this headed in?

JHA: Yeah, so I think we've just started taking our eye off the ball on the fact that the pandemic continues, right? That it hasn't gone away. The cases across the country are rising.

Hospitalizations are always a late finding. You have a lot of infections sort of built into the population by the time hospitalizations start rising and we are seeing a majority of states with increasing hospitalizations.

So we've got to get aggressive about this, especially as we get further into fall and winter where the cold temperatures will drive people indoors. I just don't feel like we can get distracted by all the other things that are going on and not pay attention to the virus.

CAMEROTA: Sanjay, you know I'm always a little Northeast-centric, we are in New York, of course, and when I look at that map and I see the Northeast back in the orange and red, are these isolated incidents or is something happening here that we should become increasingly alarmed about?

[08:20:02]

GUPTA: Well, you know, Alisyn, I remember talking to you a couple of months ago and saying, you know, there's probably no place in the country that is not vulnerable still, and I think we're seeing, you know?

I mean, they -- I don't know that this is isolated. I think we're going into a very concerning season. You know, I've been spending a lot of time just looking at data, sort of following these trends, comparing them to outbreaks.

And this is a -- this is a concerning time. So, I think that the idea that you could potentially quickly identify people who become nearly infected, isolate them and trying to quarantine their contacts is still the same strategy. And if you can do that, you can prevent these growths, which they're going to happen I think just about everywhere in the country. You're going to have more cases. But you can prevent them from turning into exponential sort of outbreaks in these various communities.

It's going to be -- it's going to be a challenge. I hate to say it. I get no joy in seeing it, but it's going to be a challenge, especially given how much virus is still circulating.

And I have to say as well, I spent a the lot of time last night talking to folks about this idea that, look, maybe we just protect the vulnerable and not everyone else go out there. You heard the strategy that's being discussed more and more lately.

Well, as Dr. Jha was just mentioning, we're seeing in places like Wisconsin what that strategy leads to. More and more people going out, young people, schools opening and death rates start to go up a few weeks later, and who's dying?

It's vulnerable populations that are dying. So, they are becoming infected as a result of increased mobility of societies overall. Put them in a bubble as much as you want, we're still seeing the death rates go up in Wisconsin, but another places a around the country as well.

BERMAN: Dr. Jha, I want to talk about one hot zone, the one at 1600 Pennsylvania, where the number of cases keeps on rising by the minute. The White House sent around an e-mail finally last night to people saying that the contact tracing they were doing was done. They were done somehow with contact tracing. They only did it for the two days prior to when the president started showing symptoms, which was last Thursday.

That excludes debate prep. That excludes the Supreme Court event at the White House the previous Saturday. It excludes the Gold Star family event.

So what's misting in this alleged effort that they're claiming exists.

JHA: Yeah. So, this is baffling. Look, the contact tracing is not something you do because it's nice to know, because it would be really helpful. No, you did it because that's how you break chains of transmission.

So they absolutely need to go back to the 26th, that White House event, the Rose Garden event. They need to look at every day, everybody who has come in contact with anybody who tested positive. People need to quarantine. You need to isolate anyone infected and you need to do broad scale testing of all these individuals, et cetera. And that's how you're going to prevent the next generation of

infections. If they don't do this, and it sounds like they're not doing this, over the next week, we're going to see more infections from people who were uninfected at those events. So, that's second and third generation infections are coming. This is irresponsible.

You can't just decide you're not going to do contact tracing, like this is infection control 101. And I'm baffled by what the White House is doing.

BERMAN: Dr. Jha, Sanjay, thank you both very much for being with us this morning.

JHA: Thank you.

BERMAN: Less than four weeks now from Election Day. Although I will note, it's Election Day in so many places around the country already.

CAMEROTA: People are already voting.

BERMAN: So many people are voting.

So, the day when a lot of people will physically go to the polls is less than a month away, so mark your calendar for that. But we're going to check in on the campaign, on the campaign messages we're hearing on plans, and on plans for tonight's vice presidential debate.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:27:42]

CAMEROTA: We're less than a month away from the election and former Vice President Joe Biden is leaning into a message of unity.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: It's in a dangerous place. Our trust in each other is ebbing. Hope seems elusive.

Too many Americans seek not to overcome our divisions but to deepen them.

We must seek not to build walls but bridges. We must seek not to have our fists clenched, but our arms open. We have to seek not to tear each other apart, but seek to come together.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: All right. This comes as President Trump calls off negotiations with Democrats in Congress for another economic relief package for the millions of Americans who are struggling.

Let's discuss where we are with our CNN political commentators Bakari Sellers and Scott Jennings.

Great to see both of you, guys. Okay, we just got this tweet, Scott, from Senator Marco Rubio in response to what happened yesterday. Yesterday, President Trump basically told his negotiators to stop negotiating with Congress until after Election Day. That was at 2:48 p.m.

Marco Rubio this morning says don't wait until after the election to pass another round of PP. Small business needs it immediately.

Do you understand, Scott, what President Trump is doing?

SCOTT JENNINGS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, what president Trump is doing, I think, is signaling that what we've known all along is that Nancy Pelosi doesn't want to negotiate with the Republicans in good faith. It's not been any -- two things can be true, one, Trump has never been the best at messaging around legislative battles, but also number two, he's taking Nancy Pelosi at her word. I have an amazing research tool called the Internet.

CAMEROTA: Uh-oh.

JENNINGS: On September 18th posted on her own website, is something better than nothing. No. October 1st Jake Sherman tweets, Pelosi reiterates she does not believe something is better than nothing.

CAMEROTA: She wants more money. I mean, she wants more money.

(CROSSTALK)

JENNINGS: Donald Trump is just coming around to what Nancy Pelosi been telling us. They don't want a deal.

CAMEROTA: They want a bigger deal.

JENNINGS: They're just now figuring that out, but they don't want one.

CAMEROTA: They want a bigger deal, Scott.

(LAUGHTER)

JENNINGS: Yes, they want a deal that can't pass the Congress. They want a deal that cannot pass the Congress. What kind of a deal is that? For people who need help.