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The Lead with Jake Tapper

New Film "Totally Under Control" Explores Botched White House COVID Response; Florida Latinos Swamped with Disinformation and Conspiracy Theories; Barrett Won't Say If She Thinks Trump Could Pardon Himself; Trump to Hold Rally in Iowa As State Reports 100,000 Plus Virus Cases. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired October 14, 2020 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

ALEX GIBNEY, DIRECTOR, "TOTALLY UNDER CONTROL": I learned that weirdly we were extremely well prepared to take on this virus. We had done a study and an exercise into 2019. The Trump administration had a written report on it called "Crimson Contagion," which contained all the mistakes made and all the solutions to those mistakes so that we wouldn't repeat them again.

So we had a complete playbook, in addition to the playbook left by the Obama administration. But the mystery is why that playbook was never taken off the bookshelf at the time when the real pandemic hit?

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Talk to us a little bit about some of the officials and experts you spoke to. Rick Bright is one of them, we interviewed him last week. He and others putting it all on the line here telling this story. What were their breaking points that convinced them to go on the record with you?

GIBNEY: I think their breaking points were that they saw science and truth corrupted by political opportunism. And that was just crushing for them. They dedicated their lives to public service, to public health. And were warning the administration very early on, we've got to prepare, we've got to buy PPE, we've got to get testing up and running. This was back in January, even before the first COVID patient tested positive in this country.

So I think their crushing disappointment and ultimately what propelled them to come forward and become whistleblowers in Rick Bright's case was the fact that they felt that science and public health was being corrupted by politics.

TAPPER: Your documentary premiered yesterday but it's clear this pandemic is nowhere near being over. What do you hope viewers take away from the film?

GIBNEY: Look, the film was really done as an examination of competence. How well did the federal government, the Trump administration handle this? And for that reason, we focused very much on the early days at a time when things could have been very different. What I hope people take away from it is, we have to listen to scientists, and also that they're willing to hold this administration to account for utterly failing us in a time of need, but it was a failure that was an enforced error.

They had all the tools to be able to do it right and purposely didn't. They didn't test, I believe, because they didn't want to know how many people were positive, which might make them look bad, but that's what allowed disease to spread uncontrollably.

TAPER: And as you note, your documentary takes us back to the early days of the pandemic, but here we are in October experiencing another surge in cases. From what you saw then, is the administration doing anything differently now?

GIBNEY: No. The administration has no national plan, has no sense or purpose of how to move forward. It's an embarrassment, really. We could be doing better. You know, over time we've learned a lot about how to treat this disease. We have a drug Remdesivir which does have an impact. We also know, you know, if we get patients early that their survival rate is going to be much improved. So there's a lot we've learned, which is good, but we don't have any national plan for testing, for tracing.

And even the issue of masks has become so deeply politicized in this administration that it continues to cause, you know, incredible number of infections and deaths. You know, until recently, we were running at a rate of a thousand people a day dying.

TAPPER: Yes. It's still about 700, and it looks like that might go up. What kind of response have you gotten from the Trump administration, if any?

GIBNEY: None. But then we didn't get any response when we tried to speak to them, either, and we try to speak to them often. The one response we did get was from people inside the organizations like the CDC who really did want to speak to us but were afraid of retaliation by the Trump administration.

And also public health officials who wanted to tell us how badly things were run back in the day but were afraid of saying anything lest the Trump administration retaliate against that state and possibly cause more deaths.

TAPPER: All right, Alex Gibney, congratulations on the documentary and thank you for being here today. Appreciate it.

GIBNEY: Thank you, Jake.

TAPPER: President Trump called it the greatest political crime in the history of our country, it of course was not. And now it looks as though his own Justice Department just essentially called it a nothing burger. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:35:00] TAPPER: We're back with our POLITICS LEAD. The Justice Department, again, undermining a Donald Trump conspiracy theory. Hopes for last- minute revelations that could help him politically dashed.

In the era of Trump and Trump allied media we're all getting used to what some call "non-troversies," and this one is, according to "The Washington Post," which says Attorney General Bill Barr will not bring any charges in an investigation into Obama administration officials unmasking individuals mentioned in intelligence reports for contacts with Russia.

CNN's Alex Marquardt joins me live to break all this down. Alex, this entire investigation was based on this idea of unmasking which is a fairly common procedure. Explain to us how that works and what the conclusions were.

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jake, unmasking is a very traditional part of intelligence gathering. It's a practice that has actually gone up during President Trump's first term and is not in the least bit scandalous.

So when the National Security Agency monitors foreign individuals or eavesdrops on them, if that person is speaking with a U.S. citizen, that American's name is redacted in the report or masked.

[15:40:00]

But there are certain U.S. government officials who can request that the names be unmasked to understand the intelligence reports better. And that's what happened with General Michael Flynn who, before the election, was speaking with the Russian Ambassador who was being listened to by U.S. intelligence. Flynn's name was unmasked, and Trump accused the Obama administration of spying on his campaign.

But this investigation, which was ordered by Bill Barr and then led by a senior U.S. attorney, found that everything was done legally and that there was no wrongdoing, according to "The Washington Post." There has been no announcement from the Justice Department, no public report, just silence. And that U.S. attorney quietly left his post last week -- Jake.

TAPPER: Well, I'm sure all of those in the White House and the Trump allied media will issue apologies and corrections soon. President Trump just responded to "The Washington Post" report. What's he saying?

MARQUARDT: Well, that he's not happy. He was asked by the right-wing outlet "NEWSMAX" whether Attorney General Bill Barr would be back next term, if there is a second term. He said that there was no comment. He called the lack of findings from the Department of Justice ridiculous and a disgrace of the Obama camp. He said they are guilty as hell. He is clearly not going to accept that he wasn't illegally spied on -- Jake.

TAPPER: Facts be damned. Alex Marquardt, thanks so much. With Trump and his allies pushing these fake controversies and

conspiracy theories, we should note there are actual scandals going on, including a disinformation campaign against Joe Biden and other Democrats that is running rampant and swamping media, targeting Florida's Latino community. Flat-out lies. Wild conspiracy theories saturating Spanish-speaking radio stations and social media.

And CNN's Leyla Santiago reports the flood of false information has left many voters unsure who or what to believe.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LEYLA SANTIAGO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Coffee is a part of daily life for Susy Calderon and her daughter Amore. But what's really brewing, something you rarely see inside a conservative Cuban American home. You see, Amore is for Biden. The rest of the family, Trump.

SUSY CALDERON, TRUMP SUPPORTER: It has been difficult for us, for my mom, and for me to see her defending something that is completely wrong for us, because we came from a communist country 36 years ago.

AMORE RODRIGUEZ, BIDEN SUPPORTER: What's very worrisome is how I see the Republican Party or Republican propaganda almost manipulating the trauma of my people and using it as a fear tactic.

SANTIAGO: The strong opposing views have caused tension for the family and some in their community. Much of it experts say fueled by rampant misinformation aimed at Latino voters especially in Florida where they make up about 20 percent of the electorate according to Pew Research. Many of them, Cubans and Venezuelans who fled the socialist and communist regimes in Venezuela and Cuba.

Jacobo Licona, a researcher at Epus Labs is tracking disinformation on social media targeting the Latino community.

(on camera): Where is this coming from?

JACOBO LICONA, RESEARCHER, EPUS LABS: A lot of times it's difficult to find out who is spreading this information. We know that there's a network of Facebook pages that tend to work together and they tend to coordinate a lot of these attacks.

SANTIAGO (voice-over): Licona says he isn't sharing the post his team is tracking in order to help stop the spread. But he confirms false claims have been shared thousands of times, taking aim at candidates on the left, and social movements like Black Lives Matter.

LICONA: We also see specifically within the Latino community, a lot of them trying to build racial tension between communities.

SANTIAGO: Some of the conspiracy theories he mentioned have ended up on Spanish-language radio and popular messaging apps.

LICONA: WhatsApp has always been commonly used by Latinos. There is not much accountability there. It's very hard to know what's happening on WhatsApp because they're closed platforms. SANTIAGO: WhatsApp says it is taking steps to combat misinformation.

Users can send claims to special accounts that can verify information. The twisted accusations are being echoed at official Trump campaign events for Latinos.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you don't have law and order, you have anarchy, which is obviously what Soros and that entire what I call "regressives" like AOC and stuff like that, just embrace.

SANTIAGO: The Trump campaign argues voters should fear the influence of Democratic socialists like Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and Senator Bernie Sanders over the Democratic Party and Joe Biden.

JOE BIDEN, DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: I beat the socialists. That's how I got elected. That's how I got the nomination. Do I look like a socialist? Look at my career, my whole career. I am not a socialist.

SANTIAGO: The latest poll shows Latinos in Florida are leaning toward Biden.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We're taking care of you and I'm never letting you down.

SANTIAGO: Leaving Latino voters like Susy and Amore divided on who to vote for. And what information to trust?

[15:45:00]

But agreeing too much is at stake for the country.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANTIAGO: And Jake, one of the other things that makes this unique is that a lot of the misinformation is coming from nonpartisan platforms. So, we're talking about false claims made by social media influencers. Your friends, your family, and that can carry a lot of weight when it comes to what voter's trust.

So the concern is that if the level of distrust and confusion becomes so overwhelming for those voters in Florida that that could lead to some of those registered voters just staying home.

TAPPER: Yes, Leyla Santiago, thank you so much. An important report.

Can President Trump legally pardon President Trump? His Supreme Court pick was asked that question today. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:50:00]

TAPPER: In our POLITICS LEAD today, Judge Amy Coney Barrett is facing some questions from U.S. Senators right now in the second day of her confirmation hearings for the nomination to the Supreme Court. Judge Barrett reputedly has refused to answer whether the President had the right to delay an election or whether she believes President Trump could legally pardon himself.

CNN's Phil Mattingly is on Capitol Hill for us. Phil, Judge Barrett has also refused to be pinned down on how she might rule in major upcoming cases.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, major upcoming cases that Democrats obviously in the minority and expecting at this point that Amy Coney Barrett will be seated on the court would like some insight into her thinking on whether it's the Affordable Care Act, voting rights, immigration, all issues Democrats have asked and continue to ask the nominee about and continued to get non-answers.

Now there is precedent to this. Most Supreme Court nominees don't answer from Ruth Bader Ginsburg on about the specifics of any cases that could come before them. But there were some specific non-answers that definitely raised some eyebrows and those were related to presidential power. And those questions came from Senator Patrick Leahy including one about whether or not President Trump could pardon himself. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

AMY CONEY BARRETT, SUPREME COURT NOMINEE: Senator Leahy, so far as I know, that question has never been litigated, that question has never risen. That question may or may not arise but it's one that calls for a legal analysis of what the scope of the pardon power is. So because it would be opining on an open question when I haven't gone through the judicial process to decide it, it's not one on which I can offer a view.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Now, Jake, I should note, Senator Leahy also asked Justice Brett Kavanaugh that question during his nomination hearing and Kavanaugh also declined to answer, some formulation of that answer has been repeated over and over again.

I think the bottom line right now is Amy Coney Barrett has survived these hearings mostly unscathed. Just a couple of more hours to go. And every Republican I've spoken to says the plan is still on track for her confirmation before election. And some Republicans have pointed out the way Democrats have referred to Amy Coney Barrett during this hearing, many of them talking as if she's already on the Supreme Court -- Jake.

TAPPER: All right, Phil Mattingly, thanks so much.

We are 20 days out from election day. Nearly 13 million Americans have already cast their ballots so far in 42 states. In Georgia, some brought out lawn chairs and snacks as others waited upwards of eight hours to vote. Georgia election officials in part blame the pandemic for the long lines.

More people socially distancing, machines have to be wiped down creating longer wait times. Other election experts say the state's inadequate voting mechanisms are a form of voter suppression in themselves.

In Ft. Bend County, Texas, just outside Houston, voters told CNN affiliate KTRK that they are willing to wait.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My flight was at 12:15. And I didn't think it was going to take this long to vote, so I had to change my flight to 3:30.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is my fourth location in Missouri City.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm willing to wait as long as it takes and anything worth a reward is worth waiting for.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: In nearby Harris County, Texas the county clerk says a record 127,000 people participated in its first day of early voting which nearly matched early voting in the entire state of Georgia.

President Trump embracing herd immunity to get rid of coronavirus as a leading health expert says herd immunity is another term for mass murder. Stay with us.

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[15:55:00]

TAPPER: Welcome to the LEAD I'm Jake Tapper.

With just 20 days until election day it's this map that is most concerning for these candidates in the country. 36 states showing an upward trend. Not one state currently headed in the right direction. Wisconsin's new cases are up 138 percent from last month. New Mexico up 324 percent.

Across the United States, the U.S. seeing its highest average of new coronavirus cases for the first time in two months now, more than 50,000 people are getting infected every day.

Dr. Anthony Fauci has a clear warning. If the percent positivity rate continues to rise, he says there will be a resurgence of COVID and ultimately more deaths.

Among the states seeing the highest positivity rates? Iowa where President Trump is headed right now and where he will host another reckless rally on his campaign comeback tour.

If the past two nights are any indication, we can expect packed crowds, few masks, and almost no social distancing. Potentially exposing his own supporters and their loves ones and those with whom they come in contact to the deadly virus.

And as CNN's Kaitlan Collins reports for us now. The President will continue to tout his handling of the virus despite the evidence and the facts, and the fact that virtually every poll tells us the vast majority of Americans think otherwise.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Tonight President Trump will hold his third rally in three days, this time in Iowa. A state he won comfortably four years ago but is now locked in a dead heat with Joe Biden.

TRUMP: You damn well better vote for me!

COLLINS: Trump and Biden won't meet on the debate stage as scheduled tomorrow night but will instead go head-to-head in dueling town halls on different networks.

Biden will take questions in Philadelphia while Trump's town hall in Miami was contingent on him testing negative for coronavirus using an independent test done by the National Institutes of Health.