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Fauci Quotes "The Godfather" in Response to Trump's Attacks; Investors Hold on to Hope for Coronavirus Stimulus Deal; Miami Mayor Accuses Florida Governor of Using Herd Immunity to Combat Virus. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired October 20, 2020 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:30:00]

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Dr. Anthony Fauci responding to President Trump's repeated attacks by quoting from "The Godfather". The president called Fauci a disaster and an idiot for telling the truth about coronavirus. Here's Dr. Fauci's response.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY & INFECTIOUS DISEASES: It's like in the godfather, nothing personal, strictly business.

(LAUGHTER)

As far as I'm concerned, you know, I just want to do my job and take care of the people of this country. That's all I want to do.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: All right, joining us now, CNN's Political Director David Chalian and CNN political commentator and former Democratic presidential candidate, Andrew Yang. Great to see both of you. You know, David, there's a lot of question about what does President Trump get out of this?

What does he hope for in the last two weeks of this election? What's his strategy? Isn't it sort of just the politics of personal grievance and vendetta? He's angry that Fauci went on "60 Minutes", he's angry that Fauci has been saying something different than what President Trump wants to hear. Is it more complicated than that?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: Yes -- no, I don't think it is, Alisyn. And I think sometimes we look for strategy where there is none, and we think that there must be something larger at play. We know -- I mean, the president has talked about for years his admiration for that "60 Minutes" spotlight. That -- you know, remember, he talked about being stable mates at one point when he was on "60 Minutes", and I think Putin was on "60 Minutes" or somebody else was on "60 Minutes" with him --

CAMEROTA: Putin, yes.

CHALIAN: And I mean, this is a slot in American television which we know this president consumes like no other, that is meaningful. And so Fauci gets this prominent spot, it is a positive look at Dr. Fauci, and that drives President Trump crazy. It drives him crazy that Fauci gets better press than he does. And I really think it's as simple as that because if you try to apply strategy for it, there is no answer to it, right?

I mean, it just -- it's confounding because both the sort of personal insult angle of this to Dr. Fauci, and the complete dismissal of science, that's a one-two punch that has driven some voting blocs away from the president over this year during the course of this pandemic that he desperately needs for re-election.

So, you know, suburbanites or independents or women or seniors, key groups that he needs to win back some portion of to be successful. It is exactly this kind of behavior that pushes them farther away from the president.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: You know, Andrew Yang, when you were running for president, one of your slogans was math, right? And now you have the president explicitly running against science. The negative ads here are almost farcical. These are exact statements that the president said. You know, imagine a negative ad that the Trump campaign would run that would say, Joe Biden believes in science or, you know, 220,000 Americans have died in this pandemic, who is Joe Biden listening to? Dr. Anthony Fauci.

CAMEROTA: Is mister calling?

BERMAN: These are the worst negative ads -- those will be the worst negative ads in all time. It's like a farcical attack, Andrew. How do you make sense of it?

ANDREW YANG, FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You don't. And I agree with Dave where if you're trying to dig for a rationale where you just have President Trump venting his spleen to friendly crowds, you're going to be disappointed. I was just in Philadelphia this weekend, and there's a lot of energy on the Democratic side.

I think the numbers actually tell a story that will map to the reality of election night. I know that there are many Democrats who were traumatized by 2016, but all of the numbers look very positive, not just nationwide, but Joe has a steady lead in many of the battleground states that Trump won in 2016.

It's one reason why you're seeing Donald Trump travel to Georgia and states that you would think that would be safely in his camp. His campaign team knows that he's losing and they're grasping at straws at this point.

CAMEROTA: Not so fast, Andrew Yang. There are some data points on the other side, David, that maybe you could comment on. President Trump, for one, told his campaign staff that he's never felt better. That he would have said three weeks ago that he -- BERMAN: Is that a data point?

CAMEROTA: That -- yes, I'm using as a data point. I mean, it's what passes for data on -- it's what passes for data on the Trump side. That he has never felt -- he wouldn't have said this three weeks ago, but now he feels very confident, and here comes the data point. Three critical states, the Republicans are narrowing the voter registration gap in North Carolina, in Florida and Pennsylvania. And so why don't you just tell us where we really are at this point, David.

[07:35:00]

CHALIAN: Well, Alisyn, the last point there, as you noted, is an actual data point, and it's one that the Trump campaign points to over and over again. Their success at voter registration over the Democrats in some of these key states throughout the course of this year.

The Democrats largely, you know, pandemic hit just halted that ground operation of getting voters registered. Republicans continued to do that work and the Trump campaign -- in the words of the Campaign Manager Bill Stepien says that newly registered voter they believe is to be -- is the easiest kind of voter to convert into an actual voter.

They're brand new registered and they want to go and do -- go and vote. Now, I will say though, when you look at those voter registration statistics, there are also lots of people who for a long time in some of these places have called themselves Democrats but have been voting Republican and voted for Trump and voted for Romney, and they are now changing their voter registration to the Republican Party as well.

So a little -- you've got to be a little careful about where that's taking place, those voter registration statistics. But it is a metric that the Trump campaign points to, that they believe is on their side and shows that this may be closer than polls suggest.

But here's the reality of where we are. In the road to 270, Joe Biden has multiple paths and Donald Trump's path is almost singular and it's just incredibly narrow. And the key for Joe Biden is in that critical upper Midwest Rustbelt region, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin. Remember, Hillary Clinton lost those to Donald Trump by a very small margin.

Joe Biden is performing quite well in those states that prior to the '16 election were traditionally Democratic. And if he just is able to win those back, he's already where he needs to be in terms of winning the presidency. He doesn't even need to win all three of them back actually. So it is -- it is important to note what a defensive position Donald Trump is in two weeks out and where Joe Biden has opened multiple paths to the presidency.

BERMAN: It is worthy of note as Andrew Yang was saying, though there still is Democratic anxiety. Why? Well, because of 2016. It's understandable, and right now, the Biden campaign is trying to make sure the Democrats aren't complacent. Andrew, if I can, I want to ask about a different subject which is the relief package that is being discussed and still negotiated by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin.

You have pushed the house speaker to make a deal, any deal, because you have argued that people need this money, any money. So, what is your argument today? What message do you want to send the speaker as she has set a deadline for today in striking some kind of deal to get a vote before election day?

YANG: Millions of American families are struggling right now, John. To make basic ends meet, to keep a roof over their head. And if we don't get a relief package out the door before the election, lame duck Congress is not going to pass it.

We're going to have to wait until a new administration in February. So you're talking November, December, January, February, four months of increased deprivation and desperation among millions of American families. Mnuchin's last offer that we know of, $1.8 trillion was really not that far from where Nancy's $2 trillion threshold was.

There were some elements of the package they disagree on, but to the average American family that's hurting right now, we need this relief bill, every economist agrees, we have to say yes when you're in a position to do so, and put the pressure on Mitch McConnell and the Senate Republicans who are going to approve the stimulus deal because many of them are in very close races.

And the last thing we want to do is say to their people in their communities, hey, we've got a chance to help you, but we came up short. So, if Nancy says yes, Mitch will say yes and we still have a chance to keep this together for millions of American families through the Winter.

CAMEROTA: We'll see what happens today. Andrew Yang, David Chalian, thank you both very much.

CHALIAN: Thanks.

CAMEROTA: President Trump's projection play is changing. We have a must-see reality check next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:40:00]

BERMAN: You heard Andrew Yang talking about it moments ago. The clock is ticking for Democrats in the White House to reach a relief deal. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has set a deadline of today to make it happen before November 3rd. Chief business correspondent Christine Romans joins us now with the very latest. Romans.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, a lot of stimulus deadline drama. Can they get a deal today and, you know, will Senate Republicans even go along if they do? U.S. stock futures trying to bounce back here because stocks fell yesterday after the Treasury Secretary and the house speaker failed to strike a deal.

The two sides talking again today. John, there's almost universal agreement more stimulus is needed to help households and businesses, real people still battered by the pandemic. For months, they have quarreled over how much money to spend, how to spend it. Democrats passed 3.4 trillion in stimulus five long months ago.

The president has said he wants to go big, but Senate Republicans are not on board with the size. Now, Federal Reserve Chairman Jerome Powell has made it very clear, more stimulus is needed to secure this recovery. But, you know, lawmakers may not feel a sense of urgency here to spend more because of the uneven nature of the recession.

While hotels, airlines, restaurants and cruise lines are in absolute crisis, there are other parts of the economy that are recovering. The CEO of Best Western called Congress out of touch, quote, "there is so much pain and suffering, but they're numb to it because the stock market is doing well and unemployment is below 9 percent."

By the way, the unemployment rate might actually under-represent how fragile the labor market is. Americans discouraged by the lack of jobs, worried about the virus or who needs to stay home to be care- givers, they have dropped out of the labor force.

[07:45:00]

The unemployment rate doesn't factor them in. If you factor in those people and count them as unemployed, S&P Global says the unemployment rate would really be 10.3 percent last month. The jobless rate is not expected, Alisyn, to get back to pre-pandemic levels before the year 2024. The shock absorbers are gone in the form of stimulus. This is real tough news for a lot families. We'll see if they get a deal today.

CAMEROTA: That's such an important context, Christine, thank you very much. Well, it's one of President Trump's favorite political tricks, accusing his opponents of exactly what he's accused of. As the polls tighten and time runs out, the president is projecting more and more. CNN's John Avlon has our reality check. Hi, John.

JOHN AVLON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Hey, Ali. President Trump is all over the map in these final days of the campaign, and I don't just mean his helter-skelter travel schedule to states he won last time. In place of a closing argument, the president is venting his spleen, refusing to denounce QAnon. Re-tweeting conspiracy theories about Osama Bin Laden and attacking Michigan's governor, knowing that she was in a target of an alleged kidnapping plot. He's musing on a grab- bag of grievances that are frankly aren't hard to follow.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Could you imagine if I lose?

Suburban women, will you please like me?

I lost to the worst candidate in the history of politics. I'm not going to feel so good. He'll listen to the scientists.

Go buy a dishwasher. I said what's wrong with this thing? It doesn't clean the dishes, right?

Suburban women, please vote for me. I'm saving your house.

Maybe I'll have to leave the country, I don't know.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AVLON: But there's one clear consistency, Trump's irresistible impulse to project on his opponents what he's been credibly accused of. So buckle up for five premo projections from the last days of the Trump campaign. Number one, corruption.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

D. TRUMP: He's a criminal and he should be in jail. What he's done was a criminal enterprise.

Joe Biden is a corrupt politician and the Biden family is a criminal enterprise.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AVLON: It's not normal to have an American president say his opponent should be in jail, but then it's not normal to have a president facing a boat-load of legal problems when he leaves office. From his taxes to multiple sexual assault allegations to ongoing accusations that he corruptly profited off the presidency. Number two, national security threat.

Yes, that's what Trump tweeted Joe Biden is, but, of course, that's one of the many concerns about the reportedly $421 million Trump owes to we don't know who as well as why he refuses to confront Russian President Vladimir Putin about anything. But Trump keeps projecting on Biden and China.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

D. TRUMP: If he ever won, China will own the United States, OK?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AVLON: Of course, it's the Trump family who's gotten Chinese trademarks in office. Trump who initially praised China's COVID response, and Trump who, according to John Bolton, asked China's president for help winning in 2020, and gave the OK to Uyghur concentration camps. Now, number three is the boldest better projection, calling Joe Biden a liar in at least nine new Facebook campaign ads. This is, of course, from the man who's been caught in more than 20,000 false and misleading statements. Number four, is that desperate old chestnut, the war on Christmas.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

D. TRUMP: The Christmas season will be canceled.

(END VIDEO CLIP) AVLON: But when it comes to the war on Christmas, the call is coming

from within the White House.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

MELANIA TRUMP, FIRST LADY: I'm working like an ass --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I know --

M. TRUMP: My ass off on a Christmas stuff that, you know, who gives a -- about Christmas stuff and decorations? But --

(END AUDIO CLIP)

AVLON: And here's number five.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

D. TRUMP: People are tired of hearing Fauci and all these idiots, these people. These people that have gotten it wrong.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

AVLON: Well, people are tired of listening to idiots who have gotten it wrong. But a quick glance at the comparative credibility of President Trump and Dr. Fauci on COVID response shows that the idiot in question is not the good doctor. And that's your reality check.

CAMEROTA: I almost forgot about the war on Christmas. Thank you for reminding me, John.

AVLON: I mean, how can you forget?

CAMEROTA: Thank you for all of that reality. OK, a Florida mayor is accusing his governor of using a herd immunity strategy against coronavirus. Is that true? What's his evidence? He joins us next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:50:00]

BERMAN: The mayor of Miami Beach is accusing Florida Governor Ron DeSantis of adopting the controversial practice of herd immunity as a strategy to fight coronavirus. Joining me now is Dan Gelber, the mayor of Miami Beach. Mayor, thank you so much for being with us. Why do you think -- why are you accusing Governor DeSantis of adopting this idea of herd immunity?

MAYOR DAN GELBER, MIAMI BEACH, FLORIDA: Well, I don't think it's an accusation. I'm not sure he would deny it. You know, we haven't -- he hasn't had Dr. Fauci here. He has had Dr. Atlas. And in fact, he -- at the end of last month, the authors of what's called The Great Barrington Declaration, so-called Great Barrington Declarations, which makes the argument that we should allow herd immunity into -- not the vaccine type of herd immunity, but the herd immunity of letting it naturally go through the community. The day after he held other press conference with them, he essentially

went -- he eliminated almost every one of the mandates and protections we had in our community, including by the way, you know, all of the requirements for individual mask mandates.

We cannot do mask citations anymore because his order eliminated that. We can't -- we can't have any individual mask citations now for a person who is not wearing a mask. I think that's what he wants. I don't think it was an accusation. I think he probably would admit that.

BERMAN: So the idea of herd immunity is that you protect so-called vulnerable populations, but among younger people, you let the virus spread.

[07:55:00]

You go about your daily business, you don't wear masks, you go to school, you go to work, and people get it and so say these theorists, and you develop an immunity. The problem or the question I have for you, in a place like Florida, if you adopted this, how would you protect the so-called vulnerable populations? Vulnerable populations include older Americans which was as we know, there's a huge senior population in Florida. I don't even know how it would work there, mayor.

GELBER: I'm not sure where it would work, to be very honest with you. The idea of The Great Barrington Declaration is to let those with quote, "minimal risk" build it up naturally while trying to protect others. The problem is those others are about a third of the population.

And they don't just include the elderly, they include people with asthma, people who might have weight problems, they are people with diabetes, and those people aren't living in segregated communities, they're living in homes with younger people or older people.

That's what -- that's how our society exists. So the problem is, you can't protect them. And our doctors because we're relying on the main stream of, you know, of doctors, they say that you can't protect those people, and that the -- if you allow the virus to surge through the community and say that it's only going to be in those who have, minimal -- quote, "minimal risk", you end up giving it to everybody else or too many of those --

BERMAN: Right --

GELBER: Other people which will require an incredible amount of hospital visits and deaths.

BERMAN: I want to give people a sense of where things stand in Florida right now, for looking at the seven-day ruling average of new cases there. It is ticking up slightly, but it isn't going up at a startlingly fast rate yet, nowhere near where it was. And hospitalizations in Florida have also more or less leveled off. We're now seeing the rise yet in Florida that we're seeing around the rest of the country. As you say, I know you're concerned that this trend may reverse itself now that mandatory masks orders can no longer be in place in Miami Beach.

And I understand that the curfews that had been in place are also being lifted, which means what? Bars, night clubs, they can open up and stay open past midnight? Do I have that right? What's the impact going to be there?

GELBER: Yes, the county mayor had a curfew that we had been slowly loosening, it was at midnight. We also had social distancing requirements for restaurants and bars if they opened. And those now, at a certain level are gone. The governor, really what he did was he opened up everything and also stopped local government from trying to protect its own residents. And for me, remember, I get millions of people visiting my community. I'm not just protecting our residents. I'm -- you know, we're trying to protect people who are going back into the communities from which they came.

So, you know, it's really become a problem. We are trying to literally protect our residents from their government at this point because we can't even impose a requirement that people get citations for not wearing a mask. And that's become a real problem. Because I worry about the uptick becoming a surge. We've had that already.

BERMAN: You've been there once, let's hope you don't head there again. Mayor Dan Gelber, as always, thank you for being with us this morning.

GELBER: Thank you, thanks, John.

BERMAN: NEW DAY continues right now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're learning from the Supreme Court ruling that mail-in ballots can be accepted in the crucial battleground state of Pennsylvania up to three days after the election.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is not something the Trump campaign or the Republicans wanted to see.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everyone is going to need to be really patient on election night.

D. TRUMP: People are tired of COVID. People are saying just leave us alone.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Experts say the Fall surge of coronavirus has arrived and the numbers bear that out.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The hospitals are filling up, the number of dead is increasing. This is a very dangerous time.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: Good morning, everyone. Welcome to our viewers in the United States and all around the world, this is NEW DAY. We begin with two breaking stories on the election. The U.S. Supreme Court just allowed mail-in ballots to be counted in Pennsylvania for three days after election day.

This is a big deal particularly for Democrats in that crucial swing state where more Democrats vote by mail. This was a 4-4 Supreme Court decision, which means that a lower state court ruling stands. It also underscores the decisive role that Judge Amy Coney Barrett will play if and when she is confirmed.

Also, developing this morning, the Commission on Presidential Debates announced they will mute the candidates' microphones during part of Thursday's final presidential debate to limit interruptions. President Trump's campaign does not like that plan, but says he will still show up to debate Joe Biden.

BERMAN: This is happening as Dr. Peter Hotez told us a short time ago, we are entering what could be one of the darkest periods in U.S. history. More than 58,000 new cases of coronavirus were reported overnight, that's the highest number for a Monday since July. Mondays are normally lower, 58,000 is not low at all. Thirty one states are seeing a rise in cases this morning.