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Tim Murtaugh is Interviewed about the Debate; Wisconsin Voters on Presidential Debate; Fact Checking the Debate. Aired 8:30-9a ET
Aired October 23, 2020 - 08:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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[08:31:37]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It will go away and, as I say, we're rounding the turn. We're rounding the corner. It's going away.
I take full responsibility. It's not my fault that it came here, it's China's fault.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: President Trump talking about the coronavirus pandemic which has now killed 223,000 Americans.
Joining us now is Tim Murtaugh, he is the communications director for President Trump's campaign.
Tim, thank you so much for being with us this morning. I know you were up late. I heard you on the post-debate conference call saying you think that President Trump won the debate. I know you thought he won the first debate as well. You wouldn't be good at your job if you didn't put that out and I don't doubt that you actually think it.
I want to talk about the substance of this debate, if I can. We talked about 223,000 deaths, 71,000 new coronavirus cases reported overnight, 41,000 new hospitalizations.
Can you explain this morning how that, as the president said again last night, is rounding the corner?
TIM MURTAUGH, COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, TRUMP CAMPAIGN: Well, I think it's pretty obvious that the president has done an admirable job of marshaling both the federal government and the private sector in what is really an unprecedented assault on the coronavirus. And as the president made clear last night, had Joe Biden been president in January, he would not have shut down travel from China, as the president did, and all medical experts have credited that with saving thousands of American lives. So instead of the 220,000 people that you're talking about, we'd have far more. So if Joe Biden had been president at the beginning of this, we know that we, as a nation, would be in far worse shape.
BERMAN: So --
MURTAUGH: And then last night, Joe Biden incredibly said that the president was too late to do that, when he spent months criticizing the president for doing it at all. And so it's Joe Biden who has to get his story straight and he has been unburdened with the responsibility of leadership during this crisis --
BERMAN: Let me --
MURTAUGH: When it is President Trump who has been leading the country. And the nation can see that.
BERMAN: Well, the nation can see where we are in the pandemic. There's no question about that.
MURTAUGH: Sure. And remember the initial projections, John, of 2.2 million people dying.
BERMAN: And on the ban with China, it is worthy of note the 40 -- the 40,000 -- 40,000 people did come in -- the initial projections of 2 million dead were from one study if nothing at all -- nothing at all was done. Are you suggesting to me --
MURTAUGH: CNN trumpeted those numbers a lot, John.
BERMAN: Can I ask you something --
MURTAUGH: Sure.
BERMAN: Did the president ever consider doing nothing at all? Did someone propose to the White House doing nothing at all?
MURTAUGH: The president took it very seriously from the very beginning. In the first week of January -- it's --
BERMAN: Doing nothing at all? Because you bring up these 2 million number. I just want to know where the 2 million is --
MURTAUGH: No. No. Don't -- no. No, no.
BERMAN: OK.
MURTAUGH: The president took this situation very seriously from the beginning.
BERMAN: OK.
MURTAUGH: You remember, in the very first week of January, the CDC started issuing travel warnings for China and also conducting screenings at major American airports. That's just a fact. And now for Joe Biden, after the fact -- and let's remember what happened in the H1N1 thing. Had that been a more deadly virus, there would have been mass casualties.
BERMAN: Well --
MURTAUGH: Ron Klain (ph), Joe Biden's chief of staff, admitted at the time --
BERMAN: Right.
MURTAUGH: They did everything wrong.
BERMAN: Let me --
MURTAUGH: Now Joe Biden's going to cast himself as some sort of expert and where he's been sitting here watching this from his basement in Delaware? I don't think so.
BERMAN: Let's talk about coronavirus, which as the CDC said, for hospitalizations is five times deadlier than the flu. So keeping those two things different I think is very important.
I do want to talk about the now again. As the president says rounding the corner. And where we are today is the highest number of new cases in months, since July, the fourth highest number of new cases ever. And the hospitalization rate, again, at 41,000 and rising.
[08:35:01]
So where does the president see the pandemic today? What direction does he see this heading in the next few weeks, Tim?
MURTAUGH: Well, we're going to defeat the coronavirus. That's absolutely certain. And that's why the president has been on Operation Warp Speed.
BERMAN: But is it going to get worse before it gets better?
MURTAUGH: And there's a vaccine coming very shortly.
And now, you know, Joe Biden has been spending all of his time trying to convince people not to take the vaccine. And the president -- look, the president is the -- is the candidate who represents defeating the coronavirus and continuing to reopen America. We have to be able to move forward as a society and still function. He is the candidate of reopening the country. Joe Biden made it clear again last night, he's the candidate for lockdowns. And every medical expert will tell you, if you go back into a lockdown, that comes with even more health problems unassociated with the coronavirus itself. Physical problems, mental health problems, people won't get their health screenings if we go into another lockdown, never mind with the impact that it will have on children if schools stay closed indefinitely.
In Virginia, where I live, the Fairfax County Public School Teachers Union, they want the schools to stay closed until August of 2021. And you know that Joe Biden is unable to oppose what the teachers unions do and he'll go along with that.
BERMAN: Does -- MURTAUGH: And now you're talking about parents having their kids not in school for two entire school years, John. That's just not acceptable. And that's the Biden way. The president wants to reopen the country and that's his affirmative, positive message.
BERMAN: Does -- well, Joe Biden -- Joe Biden said -- Joe Biden said -- and he can present his own views here. Joe Biden said that he's in favor of schools being open if it can be done safely and if more resources were given to the schools to do so.
On the subject of hospitalizations, though, I --
MURTAUGH: Well, in the U.S. -- in the -- in the coronavirus bill that's before Congress right now --
BERMAN: Tim -- Tim --
MURTAUGH: The president has offered more money for schools than Nancy Pelosi requested and she still rejected that package.
BERMAN: Well, the House and Senate bill on the table since June (ph) --
MURTAUGH: So I -- I find those kind of comments in a debate setting hollow.
BERMAN: OK, Tim, on the 41,000, what's the president's immediate --
MURTAUGH: She's asking (INAUDIBLE). The president has beat her offer and she won't take it.
BERMAN: What's the president's immediate plan to reduce the number of hospitalizations now at 41,000?
MURTAUGH: The president is moving forward with therapeutics. He mentioned it again last night. There are remarkable treatments now. Listen, the case fatality rate in the United States is absolutely among the lowest in the world. The fact is that if you contract the coronavirus, the United States is where you want to be for treatment. Our mortality rate is very, very low compared to the rest of the world. That is absolutely good news. The therapeutics that are available now and with a vaccine that is quickly on the way. And, again, I will remind you, the reckless rhetoric that Joe Biden and Kamala Harris use to purposefully frighten people away from taking the lifesaving vaccine when it is ready --
BERMAN: Well --
MURTAUGH: It's reckless and it's, once again, all they have done this whole time --
BERMAN: Look, Joe Biden -- Joe Biden made clear --
MURTAUGH: Is take the coronavirus and now the vaccine and make it into a political weapon. BERMAN: Joe Biden -- Joe Biden made clear, Tim, Joe Biden made clear that he will take the vaccine if the scientists say it's safe to do so. Joe Biden has praised Dr. Anthony Fauci.
MURTAUGH: (INAUDIBLE) he always -- he always tries to -- he always tries to use it as a weapon against President Trump.
BERMAN: Joe Biden has praised Dr. Anthony Fauci. The fact is, is that you know that Donald Trump, the president of the United States, has been very critical of Dr. Anthony Fauci over the last several days.
I want to a few other things about the debate.
The subject of the 545 children who have been separated from their parents and now the administration can't even find their parents, Tim.
Does the president regret that this situation exists this morning?
MURTAUGH: Well, it's a regrettable situation, certainly. And it's a very dangerous journey that people undertake to cross, in many cases, coming all the way through Mexico. And it's why we should not lay out the welcome mat and encourage people to do that.
The fact is, it's not as simple as you make it sound or as Joe Biden made it sound on the stage last night, to locate the parents who are in other countries. And when they do locate them, it has been DHS's experience that in many cases the parents do not want the children returned.
And so -- and, remember, and Joe Biden makes a big deal out of this, but the cages that were built, the cages that are in question, were built under the Obama-Biden administration. This was a policy that began under them. If he was so morally outraged by it at the time, why didn't he say something then?
BERMAN: Well, look, no the cages -- the cages, as you call them -- the cages, as you call them, some of them existed during the Obama administration. The policy of separation as a mass policy categorically began during the Trump administration as a choice. That is on the record, a choice that was supported and proposed and promoted by the attorney general at the time, Jeff Sessions. We have Rod Rosenstein on the record. That is a Trump policy. The policy of separation is a Trump policy. I do think it's notable you call it now a regrettable situation. And is the president involved in reuniting these children with their parents?
MURTAUGH: Well, certainly that's under the purview of the Department of Homeland Security and ICE and all of the other associated agencies. And it's -- and, again, it's not as easy as you make it sound or as Joe Biden makes it sound. You have to locate the parents. And when they do -- are located in these other countries, in many cases, John, the parents do not want the children sent back to them in their home countries.
And, once again, you cannot just have this open borders policy, as Joe Biden advocates, and say, come on in. [08:40:03}
And we you get here, we'll give you taxpayer funded health care and amnesty and work permits to compete against American citizens. Well -- and Joe Biden also supports sanctuary cities, which is a further magnet to encourage people to make the dangerous journey. The policies that Joe Biden is laying out on immigration openly invite people to come and try to enter this country illegally because he's promising that he won't do anything to enforce our laws when they get here.
BERMAN: Tim --
MURTAUGH: It is a basic misunderstanding of the encouragement that people see when you say we're not going to enforce our laws. And that's exactly what Joe Biden is doing.
And, again, that -- that in itself puts people's lives at risk because it encourages them to make the dangerous journey through Mexico, coming from other countries, through Mexico, to our southern border. It will create further problems. And Joe Biden knows that, but he's pandering, once again --
BERMAN: Well --
MURTAUGH: Talking about amnesty for 11 million illegal aliens which would be a flood on our hospital systems --
BERMAN: He's talk about a path to citizenship.
Tim -- we've got -- unfortunately --
MURTAUGH: No, that's amnesty, John.
BERMAN: We're -- we're -- we're out of time here. You were up super late last night. I do appreciate you getting up for us this morning. Nice to talk to you. Eleven days left. Get whatever rest you can. Thank you (INAUDIBLE).
MURTAUGH: Yes, maybe in 12 days we'll get some rest. Thanks, John.
BERMAN: Appreciate it.
So what are voters saying about the debate? CNN speaking to voters in line right now in Wisconsin about to cast their votes. That's next.
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[08:45:54]
ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: More than 46 million Americans have already cast their ballots. This is 11 days ahead of the election. So how are voters who are standing in line at this very moment feeling after last night's debate?
CNN's Omar Jimenez is live in Milwaukee with more.
What are you learning, Omar?
OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Alisyn, for starters here in Milwaukee, there are already so many people among those in the country that have already cast their ballots. But of course, there are those still adding to that total, like the people that you see here in line, as they have been every day since early in-person voting started this week.
And people like Felicia Sharp who -- Felicia, you told me you watched the debate. How did you feel watching that debate last night?
FELICIA SHARP, MILWAUKEE RESIDENT: I kind of felt discouraged due to the fact that every time Donald Trump was asked a question, he deterred from the answers and he kind of placed blame on the Democratic Party instead of taking blame himself.
JIMENEZ: Well, and one of the things that, you know, many people look for in a debate is whether it changed the minds of anyone who was actually watching this. Did this change your mind in any way on who you're going to vote for today?
SHARP: No, it didn't. No.
JIMENEZ: And why is that?
SHARP: I kind of made up my mind a while ago, so just -- it just affirmed my vote.
JIMENEZ: And when you looked at each of the candidates, you say, obviously, you gave your position on President Trump. What did you see in Joe Biden that reinforced your belief on how you were going to vote?
SHARP: Some of the programs that he said that he started and he's willing to keep doing geared towards the black people, that just reaffirmed my vote for Joe Biden.
JIMENEZ: And, of course, when you look at some of the debates and how they've played out, the first one, a lot of people, of course, were concerned, because everyone was yelling over each other, right?
SHARP: Yes.
JIMENEZ: In this one, did you get a sense that you had a clearer picture from both of these -- from both of the candidates here?
SHARP: Yes, I did. Yes, I did.
JIMENEZ: And why is that?
SHARP: It's just that I really can't give, you know, a definite answer. It's just -- it reaffirmed, you know, my vote and my opinion on who I should and who I should not vote for.
JIMENEZ: Of course.
Well, Well, Felicia, thank you so much. I appreciate your time.
SHARP: Thank you.
JIMENEZ: And, again, she's getting ready to add to the what is now close to 150,000 people just this week who have come in person to cast their votes as a part of this election.
And I mentioned the more than a million people here in the state that have returned absentee ballots, again, in just this season so far. In the 2016 presidential election, a little over 800,000 people had returned absentee ballots for that entire election cycle, to give you an idea, of course, of the enthusiasm within the context of the coronavirus pandemic.
Alisyn.
CAMEROTA: I mean bad weather, long lines, nothing seems to be deterring people this time around.
Omar, thank you very much with sharing what you're finding there on the line.
So last night's debate kept fact checkers up all night. John Avlon is one of them. He joins us for another "Reality Check," next.
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[08:53:04]
BERMAN: I can barely remember the debate last night at this point, but what I do know is there was a lot to fact check in it. And John Avlon back here with a "Reality Check."
John.
JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: That's right, guys, look, debate "Reality Check" round two.
Let's start with health care.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I'd like to terminate Obamacare, come up with a brand-new, beautiful health care.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: About what's happening on Capitol Hill.
TRUMP: When he says public option, he's talking about socialized medicine.
When he talks about a public option, he's talking about destroying your Medicare --
JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Wrong.
TRUMP: Totally destroy it and destroying your Social Security. And this whole country will come down.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
AVLON: OK, fear mongering is usually a sign that the facts aren't on your side. Now, Trump is trying to kill Obamacare and he has no plan to replace it. Biden is campaigning on a public option, which is not socialized medicine. This was one of the biggest fights between Biden and Bernie Sanders in the primaries.
The public option would expand Medicare, not destroy it. It would also have no impact on Social Security, while Trump's proposed payroll tax cut, for example, could deplete Social Security within three years.
All right, did you notice this surreal exchange?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I just gave $28 billion to our farmers.
JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Taxpayers' money.
TRUMP: It was China -- it's what?
BIDEN: Taxpayers' money. It didn't come from China.
TRUMP: No, no, yes, you know who the taxpayers is, it's called China.
BIDEN: He has caused the deficit with China to go up, not down.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
AVLON: All right, so the Trump White House will actually give $46 billion to farmers to blunt the pain of his trade war, but Biden was right, that isn't China's money, it's yours, taxpayers.
Now, as for the trade deficit with China, Biden was wrong here, it's actually down 6.7 percent, basically flat from where it was in 2016. But the overall trade deficit, a frequent Trump talking point, is actually up to a 14-year high.
Now, things got really heated on immigration. And while the Obama administration did occasionally separate families when parents were smuggling drugs, for example, the Trump administration dramatically expanded the policies. First, Attorney General Jeff Sessions saying, we need to take away children.
[08:55:03]
And now 545 children have been effectively orphaned by the policy.
So when Trump railed on Obama-Biden for not passing immigration reform, that's because Republicans opposed it.
All right, lightening round.
Trump said Biden's climate change jobs plan would cost $100 trillion. Not even close. He was off by a factor of 50.
Trump said Biden wants to ban fracking. He doesn't. But he has been really inexact about that in the past. And he does support moving to a carbon neutral economy by 2050.
But I want to end on this claim.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I'm the least racist person in this room.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
AVLON: Really? Do you think anyone in the room believed that?
And that's your "Reality Check."
CAMEROTA: John, we really -- I don't know when you sleep. We really appreciate you fact checking --
AVLON: Sleep is for the weak.
CAMEROTA: I know you think that. But, yes, I mean I think it's really interested to hear that both sides obviously fudged, but as Daniel Dale said, on the Trump side, trying to fact check his misleading statements, he said it was like "I Love Lucy" at the chocolate factory. It was coming down the conveyor belt that furiously and he was trying to gobble them up.
BERMAN: But not as much of a sugar high, (INAUDIBLE).
John, thank you very much.
AVLON: Thanks.
BERMAN: A lot going on today. Our debate coverage continues, next.
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