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Cuomo Prime Time
Twitter Flags President Trump's "Violence" Tweet On Election Eve; Biden Makes Final Push In Key Battleground Of Pennsylvania; Federal Judge Rejects GOP Attempt To Invalidate Nearly 127,000 Votes Cast In Houston Area. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired November 02, 2020 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00]
STACEY ABRAMS, FOUNDER, FAIR FIGHT: I think we can get it done.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: Stacey Abrams, appreciate your time. Thank you.
ABRAMS: Thank you.
COOPER: Reminder, after race like no other, join us for special coverage tomorrow, on the election, the way only CNN can bring it to you, from the critical count to a breakdown of what's happening in your state, and across the country, "Election Night in America," our live coverage starts tomorrow, 4:00 P.M. Eastern.
Our coverage continues right now. We'll return for a special edition of 360 at 11:00 P.M. Eastern tonight. The news continues. Let's hand it over to Chris for "CUOMO PRIME TIME."
Chris?
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TEXT: CUOMO PRIME TIME.
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CHRIS CUOMO, CNN HOST: OK, I'm Chris Cuomo and welcome to PRIME TIME.
We are three hours to history. We have never been where we are tonight. Never! What we know for sure, America is activated. Almost 100 million of you have already voted. We have never seen numbers like this.
And we're not going to know the actual accounting. We're not going to know the actual impact for some time. So please, if you listen to nothing else that I say, ignore the noise, focus on poise, and not just because it rhymes, but because that's all you will be able to control.
A lot is going to be coming at you, especially with the most controversial president in a generation, actively trying to seed suggestions of fraud about voting, and suggesting there may be violence in the streets, as a result. Some populist he turned out to be, trying to suppress votes, and rely on lawyers and judges to control an election.
But are you really surprised, as we look at live pictures of both candidates? You have the President, on the left, trying to convince this country that we are not in a crisis, despite the fact that we are all living in a painful pandemic.
On the other side, his challenger, Joe Biden, stubbornly committed to being the anti-Trump, determined to make the case that we can do so much better than we have, and that you don't have to divide to conquer.
But here is the good news. In just a few minutes, really, we'll be monitoring to see if Joe Biden says anything worth playing for you, during this show.
But one way or the other, the campaigns are over tonight. It is now "Go-time." We will learn, starting tonight, in our processing of the early vote, and certainly over the next few nights, how many voted, where and why.
But what we know right now, as a matter of law and fact, is that all votes that are made in time are legitimate, meaning legal, meaning they must all be counted. This current president suggesting otherwise is not just the height of hypocrisy.
Why hypocrisy? He knows there has never been and never will be a full vote count by election night. And remember, he won Arizona and Michigan in 2016, but only after days of counting. So, this is not just the high point of hypocrisy, but also the low point of his lies.
Listen.
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DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I think the Pennsylvania decision by the Supreme Court is a very dangerous decision. I think it's a decision that allows tremendous cheating to go on after the fact.
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CUOMO: Then, after he said that, just in case the message wasn't blunt enough, he tweeted. "It will also induce violence in the streets. Something must be done!"
How about trying to quell the violence? How about trying to say that would be wrong, that that would be bad? How about being a leader instead of somebody who is looking for the worst, why not try to inspire the best in the heat of the unknown?
Instead, Trump is doing, what he does best, doing what he thinks is his best interest, inciting violence because the court is allowing legal votes to be counted. And in just a horrible reflection of where we are, Twitter has just
flagged the President's tweet. Think about that! Our President flagged for trying to undermine democracy and our confidence in the same at a time that we need leadership most.
Again, though, ignore the noise as much as you can. It's my job to tell you about what I must. It is yours to decide what it should mean to you. Focus on your poise and what your true north is.
Trump is focused on the "Me," Biden on the power of "We," especially in all-important Pennsylvania. Listen.
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JOE BIDEN (D) PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: The power to change this country is in your hands. And I don't care how hard Donald Trump tries. There's nothing, nothing he can do to stop the people of this nation from voting.
When America is heard, the message is going to be out loud and clear. It's time for Donald Trump to pack his bags and go home.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CUOMO: A 100 million votes already are in the bank. Think about that. Why so many more?
[21:05:00]
Well yes sure, we're in the middle of a pandemic, and people wanted to avoid the lines, and the potential exposure. But it has to be something more than that. It has to be that there is a statement going to be made in this country. The only question is what, and what will it mean for us going forward.
Now, where was Biden just there? His final campaign stop in a long road is Pittsburgh, OK? Why? Well, there is very important absolute value in that state.
He got some music royalty helping him end on a high note. You're looking at Lady Gaga singing his praises. John Legend joined Kamala Harris in Philly tonight. So, he brought everybody there.
You want to listen a little bit? Can we hear?
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LADY GAGA, SINGER, SONGWRITER & ACTRESS: This is not Red or Blue. This is about people.
TRUMP: Just won Wisconsin. He's just won.
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CUOMO: Now, here's--
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GAGA: And I know people in Pennsylvania. I used to live here. Joe is from here. You've got a lot of heart.
(MUSIC)
GAGA: This is not a shallow people.
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CUOMO: Look, everybody is pulling out everything that they have. This could not matter anymore. And I know you hear it a lot, but it's not always true. It is on this.
We are in the middle of a pandemic, and we are a divided people. We will never get to a better place, if we're not together, and we'll never get to a better place, if things stay the way they are. Who can make it better?
The President says he can, and he is on a multistate battleground blitz on this follow night - final night.
He is now in Kenosha, Wisconsin, this is him live, a city where racism exploded during a pandemic, and he only fanned the flames. And do you know what he said about systematic inequality and a fight for justice tonight there in Kenosha? Nothing!
That's one of the reasons there is high anxiety all over the United States over the outcome. There is so many people in such desperation. This is a nation on edge, not because I say so but because you are living it.
And now they're even more worried about what this election could mean. Businesses are boarding up in anticipation of potential unrest. But you have to be better than what you oppose. That's what this election is coming down to. Who do we want to be, which will be reflected in how we decide to be.
Whatever happens tomorrow, I'll say it again. Things can't stay the way they are. We will never get to a better place, if things stay in the state of play that we are now mired in. So, how is it looking, and where should we be looking?
Dana Bash, David Gregory, good to have you both with me on such an important night. We're living history together, my brother and sister, one of the few benefits left in this job.
So Dana, tremendous amount of early votes, is it an equal distribution, as far as we understand, of pandemic exigency, and mood, or do you think that this is a nod more to one or the other?
DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, the answer is it's hard to know.
But the fact that the two have converged the way they have, that the pandemic has forced states to change the laws, to allow early voting, in a more aggressive way, and the fact that there is such enthusiasm, frankly, both for and against this President that they have taken advantage of the laws, thanks to the pandemic, it's hard to kind of separate the two, it seems.
And the fact that you are seeing Chris, almost three-quarters of the entire 2016 electorate already voting before Election Day gets here is nothing short of remarkable.
And when you - for those of us, who - all three of us, who have covered politics, for a while, you always wonder, you know, people complain, people are upset. Well, are they going to use the real tool that they have to change it, and that is voting, and right now, the answer is yes.
We'll see what happens when we get to election night, or whenever it is, when we see the real number of votes. But just the fact that, at this point, it is so high is something that is historic.
CUOMO: Absolutely. We have never seen this before.
Now, David, let's talk about the seesaw effect here and how that should affect people watching the returns tomorrow night.
What's your guidance about how you deal with the number "100 million," and as it starts to get broken down, but you won't really get who is winning in the 100 million. You'll just get who maybe ahead by registration, but you will be getting real-time returns from the exit polls, of who's voting tomorrow.
So, how do you keep it straight?
DAVID GREGORY, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes. You have to kind of separate things out, and, as viewers, and as Americans, as citizens, try to understand various scenarios that there is an Election Day event. Who comes out?
And we talk a lot about Republicans, who prefer to vote on Election Day. There is no question that Democrats want to try to eat into that total as well, and have a very strong showing on Election Day. So, we're going to see those returns.
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But you just have to know and remember what we have been talking about for weeks and months about this early voting, that some of those will come in tomorrow, and some will not.
I've been watching coverage, and talking to people all day long.
President Trump is the one who wants us to be talking so much about whether every vote is going to be counted. That's what he wants, because Republicans don't want the vote total to be too high because they know that's bad for them.
We have no idea if we're going to talk about Pennsylvania. We may barely talk about Pennsylvania. We don't know that it's going to be that tight. And I think that's what voters have to be prepared for.
There is a lot we don't know. What we know is that there is a lot of intensity, and there is a lot of grievance on both sides. And that's what's driving a lot of our coverage, a lot of what people see on social media.
So, I just think we have to be patient as journalists. And I think Americans have to be patient to understand there is various things that are going to play out at various times, and we got to watch and wait.
CUOMO: Ignore the noise, focus on your poise.
Joe Biden is at his final event. He's in Pittsburgh. He's fired up. Let's listen in, and see what he wants to end on.
BIDEN: --shift jobs overseas.
(CROWD CHEERS WITH CARS HONKING)
BIDEN: But companies who invest in American manufacturing, bring jobs back, we'll get them a 10 percent tax credit.
And, by the way, the President of the United States awards about say over $600 billion of contracts a year because of everything from building aircraft carriers and all that we do, all the government spends.
I promise you this, it violates no trade agreement. There will be no government contracts given out on my watch that don't make all the products here in America.
(CROWD CHEERS WITH CARS HONKING)
BIDEN: The future should be made right here in America, in Pennsylvania.
(CROWD CHEERS WITH CARS HONKING)
BIDEN: Folks, Trump sees the world from Park Avenue.
CUOMO: I'll tell you what, if there is no other reason that what we're living is history is you have never heard the final night of an election sound like the candidate was caught in a traffic jam.
But that's where we are, in the middle of a pandemic, especially on the Biden's side, because Biden has been very scrupulously adherent to the ideas of how to event - how to deal with the spread of COVID, so everybody is in their cars.
You see something very different, which means very normal when it comes to President Trump. He has done everything he can, basically, to flout the existence of the pandemic. If any work environment was structured the way his rallies were, everybody would be sued and would lose. Dana, the idea of violence after the outcome, why? Bush/Gore was ugly. Hell, Clinton/Trump was ugly, in terms of the outcome, right? You have a popular vote win that was the second highest in history. But the other guy wins the electoral vote in a surprise.
Why do we believe that there is a better chance of violence now other than the fact that the President keeps suggesting it?
BASH: I don't think there is another than the fact. I mean that's it. That and the fact that this country is a country on edge, and that comes from people who are on both sides of this polarized nation right now.
But it doesn't help, when the President of the United States talks about violence, the night before a presidential election, on which he is on the ballot. He should be - you said it so well, at the beginning of this show, Chris. You said "You don't have to divide to conquer."
I mean, David and I covered George W. Bush, and it's obviously very, very different. But all I keep thinking about was after 9/11. It wasn't his re-election, I get it. But it was a very, very tough moment, in this country, and he tried to bring the country together.
And that is what most presidents, historically, have done, when there is a concern about disruption, real disruption, not the kind that President Trump has brought, but disruption in the streets. And that is not what he's doing. He's doing the opposite.
And if I may, just as we're listening to--
GREGORY: Hey--
BASH: Go ahead.
GREGORY: No, no, go ahead, Dana.
CUOMO: Finish your point, please.
BASH: I was just going to say, as we were listening to Joe Biden, I was just thinking about the fact that, you know, President Trump's campaign tried so hard, for so many months, to make this a referendum on Joe Biden.
"Don't - OK, you don't like me? Contrast with the other guy. He's going to be worse," and it hasn't worked for so many reasons. This is a referendum on President Trump, and everything that goes along with it.
CUOMO: How do you see it?
GREGORY: I just think the violence piece, I just think we have to remember, I mean, it's deplorable that you have a president, who is trying to foment that or not coming out strongly to tamp it down. That's the important point.
[21:15:00] But yes, there is a lot of differences between now and 2000. One of them is the fact that we have a president, who is actually a symptom of, and a product of our course culture, where we have social media and political discourse that is toxic in this country. There is so much rage, and so much of that rage is what's covered.
And, yet, we know, the three of us know, we're perfectly capable, and we know lots of people with whom we can have very reasonable conversations about politics, and the direction of the country, even if people are really angry, frustrated that there is passion and grievance that's boiling over. That's still possible.
But there's so much grievance that tends to dominate. And I don't even think that's where most people are.
One of my big questions though, Chris, beyond this is, look where Biden has been today in Pennsylvania. He was in a county earlier that Trump won by 16 points in 2016.
I'm really watching to see the extent to which Republicans come home. We know that Trump has got to hold his territory from 2016.
One of the things that surprised me in 2016 was the extent to which Republicans fell in line behind Trump because they may have disagreed with him, may not have thought he was a conservative, but they liked that he would stand up to the Republican establishment, shake things up in Washington.
Now they've got a much better sense of what that looks like in practice. Some like it and are staying home. They like judges and so forth. Others do not. But that's what I think is going to be a key question.
Does he - does he lose a lot of that Republican support? And Biden thinks he will, which is why he's playing offense in Ohio and those parts of Pennsylvania.
BASH: He think--
CUOMO: Last word to you, Dana.
BASH: Yes. I think you're right. Biden thinks that the President will lose support. I mean we know that he's lost support among some key portions of the Trump Coalition that got him elected. But it's more than that.
What Joe Biden is trying to do is to learn the lessons, and make sure that he doesn't make mistakes that the Clinton campaign made, which is to not go to rural areas, where no, he's not going to win, but he needs to increase the share of his vote, and where there were, you know, majority Trump signs, there are more and more Biden signs to keep that narrative going in those areas, because the vote could be so close.
We don't know. As you said, we have no idea, but it could be and that's why the Biden campaign is approaching it that way. CUOMO: I appreciate you both. It's a very interesting dynamic.
Will Republicans come home, meaning, will they just go back to the team, or metaphorically, will they think about returning home, in too many homes that are ravaged by COVID, and people having lost people, and having had their livelihood lost, and it just feels, whether it's in polls, or just in your gut that we should be doing better than we are right now, no matter what this President says.
Our thanks to Dana and to David.
We're watching both candidates in the final events of the 2020 race.
President Trump is in Kenosha, Wisconsin, again, not speaking to the cries for systemic equality that blew up that town earlier this year.
Joe Biden in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, making an appeal that working families can do better, and animus doesn't have to be the only agent of change.
An outstanding 99-million-plus of you have already voted in this country. Congratulations to us, no matter what the outcome is.
Our big disappointment in this country is consistently that we don't give a damn at election time, that none of us vote the way we should vote, in a country where you should see turnouts of 60 percent, 70 percent or more. This year, it has been different so far. We'll see. We'll see what happens tomorrow.
But these two men and the mood in this country, for good or bad reason, have inspired an activism on the American citizens' part, the likes of which I have never seen before, so good for you for being in the game. It's the only way to have a right to complain about the outcome.
So, what do we read from these numbers? Well, it's a function of, what? Where are they coming in, who are they, and not just which Party, but which place? The Wizard of Odds will put it all in context, next.
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CUOMO: All right. Let's take a look at the final stops of this campaign.
Donald Trump, in Kenosha, Wisconsin, not talking about, the fight for systemic equality there. Instead of talking about that, he's been talking about Savannah Guthrie, the NBC morning show host, who was in the Town Hall with him, and why he drinks water with two hands.
Let's see what he's saying now.
TRUMP: And we were getting calls like, "Yes, maybe it's time we get together, you know," because success brings people together. Success brings people together. And you're going to see that happening.
Because we're having numbers the likes of which we have never had before. 33 - think of it, 33.1 percent. Nobody has ever had that. The highest was 1952, and it was less than half of that number. So, rioting, looting and arson will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. I'm just telling you that right now.
(CROWD CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
CUOMO: So, there he is, in a place that was ignited by the fight for systemic equality and the concerns about policing and, once again, he is dismissing all of it, as a function of the criminal acts of the few, and not the cries and pain of the many. Judge it the way you want, but that is the fact.
Now, your decision is that, or somebody who has been in the game for a long time in saying that that makes all the difference.
Joe Biden in Pennsylvania tonight making the case that working families can do better, that things can be better than this, even though you are angry and frustrated doesn't mean Trump was the right remedy. He's trying to win back places or people in places that he may lose. Why? He's trying to build a bigger coalition.
Let's listen in to Joe Biden.
[21:25:00]
BIDEN: --Vice President, so my daddy is going to change America. My daddy is going to change America. Guess what? We also know, we also know that the American people realize we got to change.
We also know that justice isn't just about - just about criminal justice. It's about knowing the true justice about jobs, building wealth for your families. No one should be working two jobs to stay in poverty. We need a minimum of $15 an hour minimum wage.
(CROWD CHEERS WITH CARS HONKING)
CUOMO: Hey, look, which message do you believe more, which resonates more? You say it with your vote.
And I got to tell you, no matter how much animus and division there is in this country, I hope that you are equally overwhelmed and enthusiastic about the turnout so far in this election. Nearly 100 million Americans have already voted nationwide. That's 47
percent of all registered voters, and we haven't even had the Election Day voting yet. 73 percent of the votes cast in 2016 have already been equaled by early voting.
You care. You dare to go out, to vote early, to put in the ballot, to take the chance, to take the chance that it won't go your way, to take the chance that you'll be hurt, but you're doing it anyway because you care. And that is what it is all about.
And, yes, if it seems that I'm shading the two final addresses, in the negative, and a positive light, I am, because you can't have the night before an election somebody saying, and not checked for saying it that there is likely going to be violence in the streets because Pennsylvania is suppressing votes.
That's what the President of the United States is saying. And it's not my opinion. Twitter just flagged his tweet about it, why, because in part it could be untrue and inciting violence.
Now, let's reward ourselves for the moment and, all of this, record- breaking turnout. What does it mean about tomorrow? And what can we glean from those numbers, where and who? What does it tell us about the state of the race?
The Wizard of Odds, Harry Enten, is here.
First thing, macro, I'm watching tomorrow night, and what do I expect in terms of how big the vote is tomorrow versus the early voting. Is it already over? Is it just getting started? How should people see it?
HARRY ENTEN, CNN POLITICS SENIOR WRITER & ANALYST: I think what the way they should see it is that we are going to have record turnout, I believe, at least since 18-year-olds got to vote before the 1972 election.
We can look at our CNN poll, the last one that we did in late October, among registered voters, and see the number of voters who've said they were certain to vote, look how much higher it is than it was in 2016.
So, I do believe that the enthusiasm that we have seen so far is going to carry through, through tomorrow. I think we could be looking at 150 million, perhaps upwards to a 160 million votes cast by the time this whole thing is done.
CUOMO: But now, how do we watch the returns? Because when we hear about early voting totals, in places, that margin could be erased, what they're calling a seesaw event, where the votes day of may not mirror the early voting turnout, and reflection in a particular state, right?
ENTEN: Right. That's exactly correct.
The people who are voting early are very different from the people who I think are going to vote on Election Day. And you can see this in this NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll. This is a national poll, but it's true in the swing states as well.
Look at those who voted early or absentee. Joe Biden has a 26-point margin amongst them. Among those who say they're going to vote on Election Day, it's actually Donald Trump who has a 29-point margin.
So, depending on which state you're looking at, whether they're counting the early votes first or second, you have to be very, very patient because those two pools of voters just differ significantly in their partisanship.
CUOMO: What can you tell me about - first of all, that 2016 2020 slide that we put up first, 83 percent of people in 2016 may have said they're definitely going to vote, but they didn't. There was like - there was a 20-point discount effect plus on that.
ENTEN: Sure.
CUOMO: So, let's see what it is this year.
ENTEN: Sure.
CUOMO: But from what do you see, in these early results, about who came out where?
ENTEN: Sure. And I should point out, right, these are just poll numbers.
CUOMO: Right.
ENTEN: And so that, obviously, there is some social desirability bias. But I don't think there is any more this year than there was four years ago.
But what I think is so important, in terms of viewing the results on election night, with the vote-by-mail, is when those votes are going to come in. And essentially, what we know is the mail-in ballots will be processed. And we are looking at the six closest states that Trump won in 2016.
In the Southern states, right, Arizona, Florida, North Carolina, most of those votes, mail votes, will be processed before Election Day. They're already being processed right now. But in parts of Michigan, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, those votes won't be tallied until Election Day.
[21:30:00]
So, in those Midwestern states, don't be surprised if Donald Trump jumps out to a large lead, in election night, and then it sort of gets chopped away as more or those mail-in votes get counted, even the days after the election, versus in the Southern part of the United States, states like Arizona, Florida, North Carolina, don't be surprised if Joe Biden jumps out to a large lead, and then, all of a sudden Donald Trump starts cutting into those margins as more and more votes get counted there. CUOMO: Right. And look, we'll be doing coverage. Harry and I will be together a lot, especially in the overnight hours. We will be qualifying our buttinskis off because context is everything, and you don't want to give a false impression.
Just quickly, Harry, what is Harry's average about what's going to happen in Arizona, Florida, and North Carolina?
ENTEN: What we should - what we should say here is that these are the three states I would watch on election night because they're the best shot that we'll actually know who has won, because those mail ballots will be counted so early.
And, right now, if Joe Biden can win any one of those three states, he's probably on his way to the presidency, Arizona, Florida or North Carolina. If Trump sweeps those, then we have to wait for the Midwest, and that could be a very, very close contest.
CUOMO: All right, Harry Enten, thank you very much.
ENTEN: Thank you.
CUOMO: Always a pleasure to have the reckoning of the Wizard of Odds.
Now look, why is everything so close? Why is everything so hot? Because we're at a crossroads, and the choice of president is going to make all the difference. Why? We are in the middle of a pandemic.
To help us lay out what is at stake, and what each course could mean, we have a scholar of the stakes, the man, Tom Friedman, next.
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CUOMO: Few people are more respected for how they think and how they communicate than our next guest. And he says something pretty scary that this could be the last week of America as we know it.
New York Times Columnist and Author of "Thank You for Being Late," Tom Friedman is here.
Brother Friedman, I paid a lot of money for this hair. You want to scare it off my head. What does that mean? TOM FRIEDMAN, FOREIGN AFFAIRS COLUMNIST, THE NEW YORK TIMES: Well, Chris, it is a real possibility that we will not be able to have a legitimate transfer of power that if the President does lose, does contest the vote, does create massive discrediting of the outcome, we could have a prolonged period where we don't have a legitimate transfer of power for the first time in our history.
And I believe the stress out of that, the economic dislocation, and the violence of that could be just terrible. So, I'm praying that doesn't happen. But I think that we have to realize that given the extreme nature of this President, given the fact that he has no bottom, it's very clear.
As I said the other night, Al Gore, when he lost in a very close, ultimately Supreme Court decided vote, he took a bullet for the country. Donald Trump will put a bullet into the country. And if you don't think that's true, then you haven't been paying attention in the last four years.
CUOMO: So, when you say America, as we know it that supposes that anything that he stirs up won't be quelled and isolated as just an episode. You think it could have a more long-lasting effect?
FRIEDMAN: Yes. What I learned, maybe, from my very first assignment, Chris, covering a Civil War in Lebanon, is when you break things, when institutions break, when norms break, in a fundamental way, they are very, very hard to put back together again. And I'm really afraid we could see some real breaking of norms.
Trusting the vote counters, just think of the two closing messages of Biden and Trump, which you have had on tonight. Biden's basic message is "Be together." Trump's basic message "Be afraid."
CUOMO: Now, you said "If Trump wins, a second term, the world won't see us as the America they once knew, but as Donald Trump's America." Do you think that's the case now or do you think there would be some added layer that would change America's preference?
FRIEDMAN: Yes. Chris, every country, through its history, as always - or many democracies have elected outliers, sometimes, you know, radical populists. But they usually course correct.
We've done that here in the United States. If we now re-elect him, if we affirm his presidency, then that's no longer an outlier event. That's who we are. That's who we will be seen as to the world.
And given the fact that Trump is such a transactional character, that's how he deals with the world, we would be seen much the way China and Russia are seen, just another transactional country, whose basic foreign policy is "Show me the money." And that will be a very different America, and that will be received in a very profoundly depressing way in the world.
CUOMO: In terms of what decides the transfer here, I don't really think it's on Trump. I don't think it's fair on one level to put it on him because we all know what his capabilities are. It's on his Party. And it was interesting for me to hear former Governor Kasich say "I
think the Party will step up." Where does that confidence come from? We have never seen Republicans--
FRIEDMAN: No.
CUOMO: --swallow the kind of manure that they have with a big smile on their face for the last few years.
FRIEDMAN: Sadly, Chris, the Republican Party under Trump has become a giant political brothel that basically rents itself out by the night to whoever will energize its base, whether it was Sarah Palin, or the Tea Party, or Trump.
And unfortunately, for the last four years, the red light has always been on. We have seen no one step out and surprise us, so we can't count on them now. The only thing we can count on, the only thing we can count on, are the American people.
This would not be my political wish, necessarily, Chris, but possibly the best outcome for the country would be that Biden win the presidency, and maybe the Republicans hold the Senate by one seat, so close that they would have to be much more willing to cooperate and collaborate with Biden, also chastened by the fact that they lost the presidency that building their politics around White grievance is no longer sustainable future for them.
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What I fear is if one side gets totally wiped out, in this outcome, people are so on edge, the country is so - there is so much anger out there. There is so much what you see in the Middle East, "Rule or die! Rule or die. Either I'm in power or I'm dead. Either I'm in power I got to move to Canada or to wherever."
Somehow, maybe the best thing for the country would be some kind of balanced outcome like that, in the near-term, just so we have a couple years, Chris, to bring the temperature down, to rediscover each other, to stop looking each other like we're enemies. Where did that come from? I don't think Republicans are enemies, you know?
CUOMO: What if the answer to your question is where it comes from is who we are. You think this country is more like Trump or more like Biden?
FRIEDMAN: I think this country, Chris, and that's what my book was about, is about, is gone through some really rapid changes really quickly.
I think a lot of Americans went into the grocery store in the last decade, and the women, at the checkout counter, wasn't wearing a baseball cap. Then they went into the men's room, and the person next to them was a women. Then they went to the office, and their boss just rolled up a robot that was studying their job. And their boss was a lady this time. I think there has been huge disrupting of people's sense of home, their sense of work, their sense of social norms, and along came a guy named Donald Trump, and he said, "I can stop the wind. I can stop all this change."
Of course, he couldn't, and he can't, especially the way he does, but that was his - that was his pitch. And that's why his image of the wall, Chris, actually it was brilliant. What was a wall? "I will stop the wind."
CUOMO: Keep it out.
FRIEDMAN: Exactly. And, so, the country has been roiled.
And the only way to deal with these massive changes in demographics, social change, economics, the only way to deal with them, Chris, is through coalitions, by working together, because these are big, hard things we need to adjust to, and big hard things can only be done together.
And if we don't have an outcome here that allows us to be together, in some way, with a gracious loss by Trump, or a gracious loss by Biden, or some kind of balanced outcome, then we really are in trouble. We can't go on like this as a country treating one another as enemies.
Where did that come from? I don't know. It came only as I can think of through this deep roiling of our society, our economics, our workplace, our social norms. But we need to - we need to find a way to come together because if this goes on like this, we really are just going to just fracture, as a country.
CUOMO: I think it's just as likely true as anything else is that it's always been there, Tom. And it's about what leaders speak to, what gets energized, what gets motivated.
It's not like bias everyone away (ph). It's that the media kind of put a cap on people talking about it. And when you talked about people in a certain way, you were kind of shouted down, because you have the right to say it.
FRIEDMAN: Right.
CUOMO: But in America, that right also creates a reciprocal right for someone like you or me to beat you down, for saying it, and beating you with a better idea. So, I think a lot of these things have always been there. Trump didn't start the fire. It's always been burning. But he's one hell of a turbocharger.
Tom Friedman, thank you very much for your perspective. Let's take a few days, see how it falls, and when we need perspective, you will be my first call.
Republicans just lost another attempt to suppress the vote. And, look, that's what it is. You can spin it, and say, "No, no, no. They just want to make sure all the counting is safe." That's not what the lawsuits are about. Take a look at what happened in part of the largest county in Texas, which is, in fact, a Democratic stronghold in a really Red state. But what's going on and why isn't the fight over, and why does this case deserve more national attention?
The controversy with the man caught in the middle, the Clerk of Harris County, next.
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CUOMO: 127,000 votes in a key county in a key state, a federal judge just ruled the same way the state's Supreme Court did. Votes cast at Harris County, Texas' drive-thru polling centers will be counted.
Given the fact that Harris County's population is more than 26 states, and it leans Democratic, it matters, and that's why you should expect more litigation. Republicans already filed an appeal late today.
My next guest is the Harris County Clerk, Chris Hollins.
Welcome to PRIME TIME. I know you're busy. Just one question.
Defend what you did in Harris County with the multiple drop boxes against the criticism, which is you've put more boxes in that county because it's Democratic, and you wanted to make it easier for people, and that's not a fair playing field, in all the other counties, and that makes it an uneven playing field, and therefore there should only be one box.
CHRIS HOLLINS, HARRIS COUNTY, TX CLERK: Well that's been the crux, Chris, of these arguments that we're making it too easy to vote here in Harris County, and thus that those votes should be illegal, and that's laughable.
But these despicable human beings have done something that very few other people can do, which is to unite Democrats and Republicans on a single issue. Tens of thousands of Democrats and tens of thousands of Republicans casted their ballots here in Harris County using drive- thru votings, and they all want their votes to count.
A Republican Texas Supreme Court unanimously threw out a challenge to drive-thru voting. And now, a conservative judge has done the same thing, and ruled that all of these votes should be counted. And so, we're going to keep doing our job to protect the right to vote here in Harris County, Chris.
CUOMO: Texas law says you are supposed to be inside a building. Texas law says curbside voting only for people with disabilities. You are not following either of those.
HOLLINS: Well, the drive-thru voting is not the same thing as curbside voting.
It does say that, on Election Day, you need to be inside a building. Our tents are buildings. It also says during early voting that you need to be inside a structure. Our tents are structures. And the judge sided with us on that today.
And so, we're confident, going into Election Day that we will be offering drive-thru voting to make sure that the 1 million voters who haven't cast their ballots yet have the same right to vote that the 1.4 million, who already have voted, were able to exercise.
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CUOMO: One other flip on strategy here. You know they're going to appeal. So, they lost at the Supreme Court level, in the state. They said there was a constitutional issue, so they went to the trial level of federal court, district court. They lost. But they can appeal and go to the circuit court.
Should you change strategy now, and instead of risking losing all these votes, if you lose, at the appellate level?
HOLLINS: Well we are not playing this game of "If we lose," and Democrats and Republicans, and how does that help Biden, or Trump. We're talking about protecting the right to vote for 25 million registered voters, and giving them unparalleled access to the ballot.
We are operating within the bounds of the law, and we always have been. And we're going to continue doing so, and we're going to fight to the end, to protect the rights of vote for everyone here in Harris County, Chris.
CUOMO: The only thing is I don't like that in the hearing, the Judge said he would have blocked drive-thru voting from being offered on Election Day. It shows that there is a way to look at this from different perspectives, every time you go to court, you could get a different reckoning.
So, I appreciate you talking to us, about what could be a very dangerous game. Chris Hollins, thank you, and good luck with the security of the entire process.
HOLLINS: Thanks so much. Have a great evening.
CUOMO: All right, Harris County is not alone. Litigation is always part of our electoral system. And it should be. But you have to recognize it for what it is. It's a chance for disputes to be argued on their merits.
See, that's not what the President wants though. He wants the system working as a call to "Violence in our streets" as he said tonight. "If I don't get my way, people should go nuts."
My next guest is a powerhouse of election law, Bob Bauer, former Co- Chair of the Presidential Election on - Presidential Commission on Election Administration, in 2013, now a Senior Adviser to the Biden campaign.
Counselor, welcome to PRIME TIME.
BOB BAUER, SENIOR ADVISER TO THE BIDEN CAMPAIGN: Thank you very much for having me.
CUOMO: I'll tell you, let's start with this Texas, and then I want to talk Pennsylvania.
But, in Texas, so the District Court Judge says he would have blocked drive-thru voting from being offered on Election Day. That is a little scary from the Harris County perspective, because they are going to have basically drive-thru voting tomorrow.
What do you see as the plus/minus on that litigation there in Harris County?
BAUER: Twice the Texas Supreme Court has rejected the effort to stop this curbside voting, and in particular, to throw out the ballots already cast.
And now, this judge, quite frankly, somebody not everybody was convinced would do it, simply refused to throw those 127,000 ballots out. So, there may have been some musing on his part in that opinion. Not quite sure where he wanted to take that thought.
But, at the end of the day, those 127,000 votes were protected and this voting will continue. So, I think that's really what matters here.
CUOMO: Yes. It's also I don't even think he issued an opinion. I think that was just dicta during the hearing, you know, just things he was saying.
Simply put, Counselor, why do you believe what Harris County is doing is OK.
BAUER: This was a state law decision, a decision that rather grounded in state law, and, I think, entirely defensible on that grounds, and beyond that.
We're now at a stage, and this is a critical point, where voters are acting on advice that they have received from election officials. They are told to vote a certain way that the rules are set up a certain way. They vote accordingly. That reliance, that voter reliance, on the rules, as explained to them, is fundamental. And we've seen an indication, even in some of the language of our
Supreme Court decisions in some of the cases that have been decided just in the last couple of months, language to the effect that this voter reliance has to be respected. And I think that's what we're seeing across the country.
These late-filed lawsuits that are intended to upset the voting system, and to defeat the voters' legitimate reliance on what they were told the rules were, simply will not stand. I don't think the courts will stand for it.
And the Republicans are now showing up, in the eleventh hour, attempting to change the rules on voters, who were told, and had every reason to believe the rules were as they were, and voted accordingly, those votes will be protected.
CUOMO: What about Pennsylvania, where the argument is, "Well, this wasn't what the legislature did with this absentee ballot law. This is what a court did in deciding to extend the deadline, and therefore, that's wrong, and that extension of days, after the Election Day, to count the ballots should be nullified."
BAUER: As Supreme Court Chief Justice John Roberts observed, later, in a subsequent case, what distinguishes Pennsylvania is that that ballot extension was approved by a Pennsylvania state Supreme Court, under the Pennsylvania Constitution.
And it's very clear that that affected votes on the United States' Supreme Court. And it's the reason why that Pennsylvania state Supreme Court decision still stands.
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A number of these cases are different in their procedural posture and on their facts. Pennsylvania is different for that reason. But I'm quite confident that those votes will be counted. I realize that the Republicans in Pennsylvania want to continue to re-litigate it. I think they will fail.
CUOMO: Bob Bauer, thank you very much for being with us on an all- important night. The next few days will be spoken about for decades to come. We will be right back.
BAUER: It's a pleasure, thank you.
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CUOMO: All right. Now is when it matters. I will be back midnight, Eastern as we kick off CNN's live non-stop coverage of "Election Day in America."
Now it is time for the big show, "CNN TONIGHT" with Captain Tweed, D. Lemon, right now.
DON LEMON, CNN HOST: I get to wear - I get to be in a real studio, I get to wear a real suit.
CUOMO: Wow! You should have a pith helmet on, and a pipe, and do some election deducing.
LEMON: You know when I get everybody, you know, how we say in the South, "You are as jumpy as a cat on a hot tin roof."
CUOMO: I remember that in a Musical.
LEMON: It was called "Cat on a Hot Tin Roof."
CUOMO: Oh?
LEMON: It was a Broadway play.
CUOMO: Thank you.
LEMON: And then the thing and then right.
CUOMO: I'll Google it.
LEMON: But everybody is so jumpy. Calm down people. It's going to be OK. We're going to be fine, don't you think?
CUOMO: Well we have the most powerful man in the universe telling you that there is going to be violence in the streets if things doesn't - don't go the way he wants.
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: It can make people feel a little extra caffeinated.
LEMON: Yes. Well I think people should ignore him.
CUOMO: Ignore the noise.
LEMON: Ignore the noise.
CUOMO: Focus on poise.
LEMON: Ignore the noise.
