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Pandemic Rages Ahead of Election Day; Battle for the Upper Midwest; Bob Woodward is Interviewed about President Trump. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired November 02, 2020 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


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[08:32:04]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: New overnight, the United States reporting more than 81,000 new coronavirus cases. That is the highest number ever for a Sunday, which are normally slow days. Eleven states are seeing record hospitalizations. Twenty states have positivity rates at or above 10 percent, meaning that the virus is spreading rapidly.

Joining us now, CNN medical analyst Dr. Leana Wen. She's an emergency room physician and former Baltimore city health commissioner.

And, Doctor Wen, I know of all the statistics, and they're all deeply troubling this morning, that you look at and concern you the most, it's the hospitalization trends, which are also steadily on the rise, rising so much over the last month or so.

Why is that of concern to you?

DR. LEANA WEN, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: So, John, we are breaking records all over the place here. The rate of acceleration of this virus is just increasing. I mean we added a million cases in 14 days. We're going to add the next million in less than 14 days. And we are already seeing our hospitals at breaking point in some parts of the country. And that means it doesn't just affect patients with coronavirus, it also means that elective surgeries are being put off for things like hip replacements, for cancer surgery or heart surgery in some cases. It also means that rural hospitals are now already unable to transfer patients to higher levels of care and may even be transferring their patients with heart attacks or strokes hundreds of miles away.

This -- when we get to breaking point here, we might have no other choice but to implement these measures that no one wants, like shutdowns. And that's why we all have to take action right now with targeted measures like wearing masks, like restricting indoor gatherings, things that we can do now to prevent that really horrible outcome because cases are raging out of control across the U.S.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: I mean you're an emergency room physician. You know about this. You've seen this. And we all remember the videos from our reporters who went in to some of these overwhelmed hospitals of the stretchers, you know, the gurneys lining the hallways, the doctors, you know, hearing one after another of, you know, whatever that code is for -- for somebody going into distress over and over and the speakers. I mean I just shudder to think what's happening in some of these hospitals in the Midwest and upper Midwest now.

WEN: Right. And the difference between what's happening now versus what happened before is that the virus is everywhere now. Before there were just a few hot spots across the country. Their health care workers that could volunteer and go between different states. You could also have enough medications because medications, ventilators, PPE, they could be shipped from one area to another.

But when the virus is so widespread, we could very well run out of PPE. We are already running short of many critical medications and we're also going to run out of health care workers, which means that patient care is going to suffer and we will be at breaking point in our hospitals.

[08:35:00]

BERMAN: So we are where we are in this pandemic. And as Dr. Fauci has made clear, he thinks it's a very bad place to be and we're in for a lot of pain. There's a lot of focus, Dr. Wen, and I don't have to tell you, on the election. Polls close tomorrow night. They start to close at 6:00 p.m. tomorrow night.

I think one thing people need to realize and take into account is no matter what happens in this election Donald Trump will be president until at least January 20th. So my question is, if there's no change in policy, if there's no change in the federal attitude toward this pandemic, what is likely to happen in those months?

WEN: Yes, it's a really good question. There is already so much mixed messaging, misleading messaging that's coming out from this administration. I mean I've been watching coverage over the weekend and watching these rallies occur at a time when we're asking people to hunker down. We're asking people to maybe forego Thanksgiving and seeing their loved ones. And, at the same time, they're watching TV, seeing thousands of people out there gathered shoulder to shoulder. It's a really big issue. And I think we need to be doing our best to spread the correct information and also any new president coming in, if it's a Biden administration, they're going to be facing the same problems as well of that kind of messaging.

And so I would encourage the -- if the -- there is a new Biden administration, they should start daily briefings with public health experts now. They should be galvanizing and energizing the American people now and also spreading the message that we can make a difference, that the actions of the American people have taken to date, they are not wasted because we have saved many lives and we can save many more to come.

CAMEROTA: And if President Trump wins re-election, then I assume we will hear more about Dr. Scott Atlas, who seems to be the person who has President's Trump's ear the most. Scott Atlas is not an epidemiologist, as you know. He's not an expert

in infectious diseases. But he went on RT, which is Russian Television, which is known to be a foreign agent and propaganda arm of Russia and he had to apologize for it. I'll just read you a portion of his apology. He said, I regret doing the interview and apologize for allowing myself to be taken advantage of. I mean rookie mistake here. And, you know, I just wonder what you think, as a doctor, that this is the person who is leading apparently the strategy?

WEN: Yes, so there's the problem of where Dr. Atlas or Scott Atlas made these comments. But I think the bigger problem is what he said, because what he said to RT is the same thing that's he's been spreading to other media outlets in the last several months and it's full of lies and false information. I mean no one wants a shutdown. The public health community very much understands why a shutdown is so harmful. But the reason we may be close to another shutdown now is actually because of failure by the Trump administration to take this virus seriously. And by Scott Atlas continuing to downplay the severity of this virus, it actually is causing so much harm to the American people.

CAMEROTA: Dr. Wen, thank you very much. We'll speak to you again very soon.

BERMAN: So one of the final campaign event of the 2020 race takes place in the battleground state of Wisconsin. A live report from there next.

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[08:42:20]

CAMEROTA: President Trump heads back to the upper Midwest today in hopes of chipping away again at the Democrats' blue wall.

CNN's Ryan Young is live in Milwaukee with more.

What are you seeing on the ground, Ryan?

RYAN YOUNG, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, absolutely.

Alisyn, we know that President Trump will be in Kenosha again today. And, of course, that's where that police-involved shooting where there was so much unrest happened earlier this year. But you could tell the president's definitely circled the state. He was here Friday, the first lady was here Saturday, his daughter Ivanka Trump was here Sunday, and he's back again Monday.

Of course, President Trump surprisingly won this state back in 2016 by less than 1 percent. And I can tell you, after being here for a few days, you can't turn the TV or the radio on without hearing some sort of ad.

Now, if you look at this video that we shot from over the weekend, there were long lines all throughout the state as people were showing up to vote. More than 1.9 million people so far have cast their ballots already.

Well, one of the things that we have to think about is the coronavirus. It's a big part of the story here. The surges have been unbelievable. Five thousand new cases on Friday. There were 3,000 cases -- more than 3,000 cases just yesterday. And Monday is a big testing day in this state. So we're at a testing center where there will be dozens of people who will obviously be coming to get tested. That was the big conversation yesterday. People were worried about their economic futures when it came time to the coronavirus.

But when we talked to one mom yesterday who was actually a teacher, she talked about the loss of all the things that have happened, not only from family members being sick or just the idea that she didn't even get to see her own son graduate from high school. So these personal stories that people are talking about, they're tired of the political ads. They want to see some sort of action happen, especially when it comes to the coronavirus.

Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: You're so right, Ryan. Every one of those numbers that we report every morning is a human life. And, obviously, the impact that all of this has had on families when people get sick is immeasurable.

So, Ryan, thank you very much for all of that reporting.

We are one day away from the most consequential election of our lifetime. Legendary journalist Bob Woodward here to talk about the high stakes and what this all means for the country.

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[08:48:36]

CAMEROTA: We are in the final hours of the 2020 race and an unprecedented chapter in the history of presidential politics. What will happen next?

Joining us now, Pulitzer Prize winning journalist Bob Woodward. He's an associate editor at "The Washington Post" and author of "Rage," the second of two books he wrote about the Trump presidency.

Bob, great to have you here.

BOB WOODWARD, AUTHOR, "RAGE": Thank you.

CAMEROTA: Let's talk about that. You -- you've written these two bestselling books during the Trump presidency. You've spent countless hours interviewing him in-depth, one on one. Can you give us a general summing up of what you've learned about Donald Trump?

WOODWARD: Well, first of all, even Republicans acknowledge that it is the coronavirus election that is the central event in people's lives. And it turns out on January 28th, that's nine months ago, the prospect, the inevitability of this pandemic coming was laid before Trump with all the details. He acknowledged it privately in a top secret meeting. Ten days later, he told me that the virus was actually one that could be transmitted by people who didn't show symptoms, was airborne.

[08:50:00]

He was horrified at what was coming. And then he did not tell the truth to the American people. And he still has not told the truth to the American people about this. And it is one of the most serious, negligent acts by a sitting president I have ever seen as a reporter for 50 years, or, in fact, in history.

BERMAN: Again, he's out campaigning on the campaign trail as we hit record numbers of new cases, saying the country has turned a corner. It is absolutely antithetical to reality. It is just not the truth. The country is in a worsening situation in terms of the pandemic.

So, Bob, how then do you reconcile what you see as the reality, what you see the truth of the pandemic being with the fact that the polls show that Donald Trump is trailing in this campaign. I don't think anyone disputes that. But he's still got a chance. How can it be that he still has a chance?

WOODWARD: Well, anything can happen. I think one of the important things going on right now in these days is that the Trump voter is going to have to stare down the truth that the president, even though they support him and like him, is not factually working in their interest. In my discussions with Trump, I asked him, what's the job of the president? He said to protect the people. He is not protecting the people.

There is a national interest that is very clear to attack and deal with the pandemic. And he does not organize. He does not plan. He makes decisions on impulse. And so we are now in this reality where, you know, the future is lying right before us and the future is going to be, listen to your doctor, all the doctors to Dr. Fauci, all saying, you know, people believe in their doctors, and Trump has pitted himself against the medical establishment in such an irresponsible, alarming way. And the truth lying out there is worse pandemic. The racial crisis has not really been addressed or solved. And we have economic catastrophe visited on tens of millions of people in this country.

CAMEROTA: And so if the polls are not accurate, and if President Trump does win re-election, what does that tell you, Bob, about this country?

WOODWARD: Well, first of all, the polls are broken. I don't believe in the polls at all. Karl Rove, who was George W. Bush's political guru, wrote a column saying, the -- the -- this -- and this is a man who lived by polls, that the system is broken. It is completely broken. So -- so anything can happen.

What people need to think about, what is in their interest. And the reality of this pandemic is 9 million people having this, getting the coronavirus, almost a quarter of a million people in this country dying. It's defined part of the life for most people in this country. And you reasonably want to ask, what's being done about it?

I was listening to Trump last night in Georgia, on television, and he's saying, as you point out, turning the corner, vaccines are two weeks -- several weeks away. That just is not true. And then he said, look at me, I had the virus and I'm fine. And, of course, he had the best medical treatment in the world to get him through this. This -- this is not the -- we are not -- he is not dealing with reality. An absolute American tragedy.

BERMAN: We've got about a minute left, Bob.

I know you haven't heard today what his advisers are saying, but generally speaking, given the truth that you're laying out here, what is he hearing from the people surrounding him in these waning hours of the election?

WOODWARD: Well, see the -- there are people around him, but they are cheerleaders. And he, you know, he's -- he dismisses the truth. I showed, through, you know, five years almost of reporting on him, he is in a permanent state of denial when he is presented with information that does not correspond with what he perceives to be his political interests, and what actually is the impulse of the moment.

[08:55:23]

He is impulse driven. And January 28th, nine months ago, should have been the day the Trump presidency changed and he organized the country for what was coming. Now we have it and there's no plan, no strategy, no coherent effort to tell the public what's going on and what the next steps are.

CAMEROTA: Bob Woodward, you are the author of "Rage," of course, as well as so many other books. We really appreciate getting your take on all of this.

WOODWARD: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: Thanks for being with us.

And CNN's election coverage continues next. And John and I will be back at 5:00 a.m. Eastern tomorrow. Set your alarm clocks. We look forward to joining you.

See you tomorrow.

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