Return to Transcripts main page

New Day

Coronavirus Rages Out of Control as Americans Celebrate Thanksgiving; Biden Calls for Unity on Thanksgiving as Trump Stokes Division; Mom Battling Coronavirus Finally Home after Five Months in Hospital. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired November 26, 2020 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:00:00]

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN NEW DAY: We want to welcome our viewers in the United States and all around the world. This is a special edition of New Day.

John Berman is off. Erica Hill joins me. And I just want to point out, you are the mashed potatoes to my candied yam.

ERICA HILL, CNN NEW DAY: Indeed, we are. As you pointed earlier, we're the carbo couples.

CAMEROTA: Yes, we're carbo loading for the show and for what else is in store today. Happy Thanksgiving, everyone.

Of course, this holiday is very different than past years. Millions of Americans are facing health and economic crises as the coronavirus pandemic surges. Nearly more than 90,000 Americans are waking up on this Thanksgiving in the hospital.

The U.S. is breaking hospitalization records for the 16th consecutive day. More than 262,000 Americans have died, which leaves so many families with the agony of an empty seat at the table today. Also, 50 million Americans are food insecure.

President-elect Biden wants all Americans to come together, he says, to defeat the virus.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, U.S. PRESIDENT-ELECT: I know we can and we will beat this virus. America is not going to lose this war. We'll get our lives back. Life is going to return to normal, I promise you. This will happen. This will not last forever.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: We're also following breaking news from overnight. A divided U.S. Supreme Court siding with religious groups who sued New York Governor Andrew Cuomo over his coronavirus restrictions. Cuomo tried to limit the number of people who could attend religious services, the justices, however, found that violated the Constitution. That 5-4 decision, also highlighting the impact of the newest member of the court, Justice Amy Coney Barrett.

CAMEROTA: Okay. So we'll get to all of that. But, first, joining us, Dr. Carlos del Rio. He is the Executive Associate dean of Emory University School of Medicine at Grady Health System. He's also contributing to the NIH/Moderna vaccine trial. Also with us, Dr. Chris Pernell, she's a public health physician leader and a volunteer for the Moderna vaccine trial. She also lost her father to coronavirus earlier this year.

And we are thinking of you, Dr. Pernell, on this Thanksgiving. I know it's been a hard year for you. Do you want to just share with us what your Thanksgiving would look like this year?

DR. CHRIS PERNELL, PUBLIC HEALTH PHYSICIAN LEADER: You know, I sigh because it will be different. It will be a Zoom Thanksgiving. My family and I, we had this conversation a couple of weeks ago that we wouldn't mix households. We wouldn't get together in person because it's not safe.

And I did my phone call night to friends who I heard were going to travel, and I pleaded with them, please, stay home and be safe so that you can enjoy your loved ones in the future. I don't want to experience anyone to experience what my family has gone through and what my sister is still going through in her fight to recover.

CAMEROTA: And do you think you changed any minds with those phone calls?

PERNELL: I think I changed one or two. I do know that there are still millions of people traveling. But if you can impact one or two persons, I think that's good. And the more that we can do to hold the line, the more that we can do to beat back the fatigue, because we're actually fighting a fatigue pandemic, as well. The more that we can do to beat that back by putting a face to the agony, by putting a face to this pandemic, I think it's better for the nation.

HILL: As Dr. Pernell points out, putting that face to it, Dr. del Rio, just reminding people that this is not just about staggering numbers, that is part of it, but it is about families forever changed. It is about even people who battle this and survive it successfully may have lasting effects that we don't know about. And so bringing that into your decision on this holiday can go a long way in terms of helping those around you, because I know, Dr. del Rio, you're concerned about what Thanksgiving could bring in the weeks leading up to Christmas and beyond.

DR. CARLOS DEL RIO, PROFESSOR OF MEDICINE, GLOBAL HEALTH AND EPIDEMIOLOGY: Yes, absolutely. Let me just, first of all, express my condolences to Dr. Pernell. You know, her father is one of the more than 250,000 people who have died and that number is just staggering. And yesterday alone, we've had over 2,000 deaths from this coronavirus.

So, this is not trivial. This is something very serious and we need to take it seriously. We need to really be careful.

[07:05:00]

I encourage everybody to wear masks. I encourage everybody to socially distance. I encourage everybody to avoid going to bars, to restaurant, to places where there's a lot of people, because the chances of getting this infection increased as we increase the number of people across to you, close to you and in close proximity.

And it's not that you're going to be knowing or not knowing, it's simply just happens. So please be careful. Take care of yourself, because, you know, hope is coming. There will be a vaccine. Science is going to deliver us a vaccine. They will be available in the next few weeks, it will start rolling out. And I think we want to be alive and we want to be safe for when the vaccine arrives.

CAMEROTA: Dr. Pernell, we've discussed who you have experienced every angle of this coronavirus. You've lost a loved one, you had a sick sister who is now, thankfully, on the mend, you are a doctor, and you are a volunteer for the vaccine trial. I mean, you have really covered the gamut of ways to see this virus.

So let's take -- let's put on your doctor hat. What have you -- what's happening in New Jersey? What are you seeing this week?

PERNELL: So, locally, where I work and lots of where my family live in Newark, New Jersey, we see an urgent advisory in place. Newark is seeing a trend in spike in cases, in some neighborhoods in Newark, the infection rate is four times higher than it is in other parts of the state. So, our mayor has asked for non-essential businesses to closed early, has asked people to voluntarily please stay at home.

And because we expected to see this in the fall and winter months, we've just got to hunker down and continue to do those public health measures that we know works. And that's what you're seeing in New Jersey, as you see this uptick around the state, but in particular in some of our harder hits area like Newark, New Jersey.

HILL: Dr. del Rio, as we look at this and we talk about what can be done, there's still a lot of concern for hospitals across the country. I know there's a major focus right now on the Midwest. And a lot of that revolves around staffing. How -- do you think that message is getting through to people, that it's not just about them, right, it's about, if they need that care, they may not be able to get it?

DEL RIO: Well, I think, hospitals are struggling and staffing is a major challenge, because, first of all, some staff are getting infected. They're getting infected in the community. They're unable come to work. So you have doctors, you have nurses, you have our best practice providers, respiratory therapists who have to be on isolation, who have to be in quarantine and therefore cannot come to work. But then even if you have a hospital fully staffed, as more patients come in, at some point in time, you simply don't have enough staff.

And let me just say, health care providers right now are tired, are really exhausted. And my recommendation, you know, the beginning of the pandemic, we would have cheers for health care workers. Today, if you want to cheer your health care worker, put a mask and stay home.

CAMEROTA: That is great advice this morning. Dr. Pernell, Dr. del Rio, thank you very much both very much and happy Thanksgiving to you. We really appreciate you spending some time with us.

DEL RIO: Happy and safe Thanksgiving to everybody.

CAMEROTA: We also have breaking news. The unemployment crisis in this country just suffered another big blow. The Walt Disney company confirming they are planning to shed 32,000 employees by the end of March, this as the coronavirus pandemic hammers its theme parks and resorts. That's about 15 percent of their total workforce.

The layoffs were disclosed in a filing with the SEC. The company already announced plans to cut about 28,000 jobs in September.

HILL: Also breaking overnight, the U.S. Supreme Court ruling New York cannot enforce coronavirus limits on attendance at houses of worship. That 5-4 decision highlighting the impact of Justice Amy Coney Barrett on the court. CNN's Polo Sandoval joining us now live with those details. Polo, good morning.

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Erica. We have reached out to New York Governor Andrew Cuomo, a key player in this. Because what the Supreme Court is doing here is essentially now preventing the state of New York from restricting attendance limits at houses of worship due to the coronavirus pandemic.

Governor Andrew Cuomo actually first was the one who imposed these restrictions in early October. And since then, the Catholic Diocese of Brooklyn, as well as several synagogues have been launching a very fierce fight against the state of New York.

What's interesting here is that there won't necessary be any immediate impact here as the churches and synagogues that took this all the way to the highest court in the land, they're not actually currently subject to the restrictions, that's because they were recently lifted due to what the state describes as an improvement in COVID stats, in parts of Queens and in parts of Brooklyn. But as we well know in this ever-evolving and sometimes worsening COVID saga, those numbers can change and those infections are on the rise.

And that is what much of this is about. The houses of worship have argued that the restrictions violated the religious freedoms into the First Amendment. They also felt that they were unfairly facing stricter limits than that of its other essential businesses.

[07:10:00]

In fact, Chief Justice Roberts was in dissent and also noted that the religious groups could have the opportunity to return to the court if those restrictions were re-implemented.

The chief justice writing that it may well be that such restrictions violate the free exercise clause. It is not necessary, however, for us to rule on that serious and difficult question at this time. And it is a significant matter to override determinations made by public health officials concerning what is necessary for public safety in the midst of a deadly pandemic.

Ultimately, though, it was actually newly sworn Justice Amy Coney Barrett's vote that eventually swung the justices to this 5-4 ruling. So that's another important aspect of this case here, or this story. It certainly underscores or at least punctuates the impact that this newly sworn justice has on future cases, Erica.

And then, of course, we're left with that question. Does this now lay the groundwork for other religious groups across the country to try to launch this legal fight against cities or states, as they try to fill their pews amidst this pandemic?

HILL: Yes, it will be interesting to see, Polo, thank you.

SANDOVAL: Thank you.

HILL: President-elect Biden urging unity this Thanksgiving as President Trump hints that the next pardon he issues may have his own name on it. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:15:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: I know the country has grown weary of the fight, but we need to remember, we're at war with the virus, not with one another, not with each other. This is the moment where we need to steel our spines, redouble our efforts and recommit ourselves to the fight. Let's remember, we're all in this together.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: President-elect Joe Biden calling on Americans to come together to beat the coronavirus pandemic, this as President Trump is again attempting to overturn the results of the election and also appearing to signal he's considering pardoning himself before leaving office.

Joining us now, CNN Political Analyst, Astead Herndon, he is a National Political Reporter for The New York Times, and CNN Legal Analyst Elie Honig, former Assistant Attorney for the Southern District of New York. Good to see you both this morning. Happy Thanksgiving on this very strange Thanksgiving.

Astead, as we look at this, it's not really surprising what we're seeing and hearing from other either camp, but what is interesting, I think, is as we hear from Joe Biden, the way in which he is acknowledging what he is about to face once he takes that oath of office in January, because he's noting very clearly, I think, in both his op-ed for cnn.com and in what we heard from him yesterday that we've all got to hunker down, because this is not getting better anytime soon. ASTEAD HERNDON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYS: Yes. I think it's a game of expectations here, and he is trying to set a kind reality back after a president that has not acknowledged the reality of the virus, that has not made any attempt to recognize its seriousness, and has not really governed in a manner that that reflected that.

And so you have vice president -- I mean, you have the president-elect saying that this is what is going to be the number one issue for him when he takes office, and, obviously, he has coupled that with the economic relief message from the impact of the virus.

But you have those kind of parallel tracks that we have seen all throughout this year. Joe Biden preaching unity, saying the country needs come together, and kind of a pragmatism that's reminiscent of presidents of the past, while you have President Trump beating the drum around, in this case, trying to overturn the election, but before that, just wishing away the virus through his more cultural concerns and the other. And I think that that is going to be something that continues.

Can even in a Biden administration, will Republicans come around to the point where that kind of pragmatism, that kind of realism is something that actually is a governing strategy? He needs Republicans to buy into that, otherwise, we'll be gridlocked again.

CAMEROTA: Such a great point, Astead. I mean, realism, Elie. It's -- honestly, I was saying in the last hour, you almost have to reprogram your brain to hear the reality, to hear somebody, a leader, level with the American public, and say, we need to redouble our efforts. We need to recommit to the fight. We need to steel our spine, as opposed to, it's going to magically go away or we should inject bleach. I mean, when you look at the contrast, it's jaw-dropping.

And one more thing. The president, President Trump, issued this Thanksgiving day proclamation. And I just need your help understanding why. I encourage all Americans to gather in homes and places of worship to offer a prayer of thanks to god for our many blessings. I mean, it's so counter to all medical advice. It's so counter to conventional wisdom. I know he prides himself on being, I guess, a contrarian, but it's -- I mean, legally, I know that's your wheelhouse, it's -- he's telling people to risk their lives.

ELIE HONIG, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, Alisyn, it is baffling. I can go beyond legal. It is baffling as a normal human being, I can say that. But even within the context of the Supreme Court opinion we just saw, you used the exact right word, which is realism. That is sort of the key, the heart of the dispute here. On the one side, you have the majority, which said, well, religious liberty has to prevail.

But the dissent, if you look at the dissent, they are saying, yes, but let's be realistic here. We have a public health crisis. We have a serious threat to our entire country. And they cite statistics in the dissent. They talk about the seven-day rolling average. They talk about the fact that we're in the midst of a second surge. So you see this battle between realism and sort of, I guess, theory playing out in the Supreme Court, where one side is saying, well, doctrine and all of these sort of vague ideas, the other side, the dissent, the losing side in this case is saying, yes, but look at reality. Look at the staff, look at what's happening right now in our country.

HILL: And as we look at that, Elie, just to stick with that for one moment, what struck me too is the fact that the comparisons are being made, so by Justice Gorsuch, for example, talking about, well, what can liquor stores do and what can bike shops do.

[07:20:06]

They're very different. I mean, you don't go into typically a bike shop and take your mask off and perhaps sing with the choir. And you're not in there for an hour. And it's interesting, the apples-to- oranges comparisons made at that level.

HONIG: Exactly. So, Erica, the fundamental idea here is, religious institutions are entitled to special protections, they're entitled to a little bit more protection or a bit more protection under the First Amendment, free exercise of religion. But we have to be, again, realistic about, is it really accurate? Is it really reasonable to compare a church or a synagogue or a mosque to a bike shop or a liquor store? I mean, think about how different the activities are. Think about how differently people array themselves. Think about people singing versus not singing.

So, again, the fault line here in the Supreme Court is sort of theory versus reality. And I think anyone who lives in the real world, and we all do, understands that going to church, going to synagogue, going to a mosque, going to whatever your place of worship is a very different proposition than going to get your bike repaired. So that is a fault line in the Supreme Court. And I think they're sending signals about where they stand for the future as well.

CAMEROTA: Astead, it looks like we are in the pardoning phase of President Trump's administration. And he re-tweeted a suggestion from Congressman Matt Gaetz last night that he pardon himself. It seems clear this is going to happen, Astead. And we'll get to Elie in a second for the legality of it. But I take it, this is a prophylactic pardon for anything that might come up in the future.

HERNDON: That's how it would seem. I mean, this has been an idea that's been floated around in the conservative universe for a while, that he could kind of politically spin it as he is insulating himself from unfair and democratic attacks. We know that President Trump himself has very real and serious legal problems that could be facing him after he leaves the White House, that are not of the partisan nature, but kind of a base line problems of his own creation.

But at the same time, we also know that this is a president that has not made any deference and at every turn flouted the kind of presidential norms around pardons and just basically around the office, in general. So I don't think that that's something that is going to sway him, the idea that that is not something presidents have done before and that is not something that has usually been seen as their role. But we are in a stage now where as a kind of a, you know, Trump unchained in this last couple of months. He can do the pardons. He's kind of free from even caring about the virus in any specific way, even as he refuses to acknowledge the results of the election.

Now, that could seem like the last gasp of an incumbent on his way out, and certainly that could be part of it. That also could be the foreground of what could be almost an immediate denouncing of running for president, again, which could leave him in the American psyche and controlling that portion of the base, even as we go forward.

HILL: Well, I think we know that he wants to do that, right? He wants to hold on to as much of that base and as much of the psyche, hold on to the strings essentially as he can.

Elie, if we look really quickly at the potential for the president pardoning himself, we know this wouldn't apply to any state issues. But, realistically, what would he be pardoning himself for? Like what would that actually cover?

HONIG: Yes, so, ASTEAD talked about this. One of the questions about the Michael Flynn pardon is how broad is it? I mean, remember, this pardon was done initially by tweet. And it just says, a total pardon. You theoretically can issue a blanket pardon, but only looking backwards. In other words, you cannot say this person or I am pardoned for anything I might do in the future.

But the president could try to issue himself a pardon saying, I'm covered for anything I've ever done up until this moment. If he does that, it would be a historic moment in the bad sense, it will be a permanent mark on him and it will be very legally debatable about whether it's even constitutionally valid to pardon yourself. I think the stronger argument actually is that that would be invalid, but if anyone is ever going to try it, this is the president.

CAMEROTA: All right. On that note, Astead, Elie, Happy Thanksgiving, thank you both very much.

HONIG: Happy Thanksgiving. Thanks.

CAMEROTA: We have a quick programming note. Be sure to watch later today as CNN brings you the story of Joe Biden's life, his ambition and the tragedy on his path to becoming president-elect. Fight for the White House, Joe Biden's Long Journey today at 4:00 P.M. eastern on CNN.

And we have a remarkable story for you of survival. A pregnant mom sick with coronavirus, she gave birth days before having to be put on a ventilator. She was just released from the hospital after being there for five months. She joins us, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:25:00]

CAMEROTA: Crystal Gutierrez is home for the holidays after spending five months in the hospital battling coronavirus. She was just 36 years old and she was 36 weeks pregnant when she was admitted in June. Her condition quickly took a turn for the worse, forcing doctors to perform an emergency C-section before she had to be put on a ventilator.

And joining us now is Crystal Gutierrez and her husband, Rafael.

Oh, my gosh, you guys, we can't believe the ordeal that you two have been through. How are you doing today, Crystal?

CRYSTAL GUTIERREZ, HOSPITALIZED FOR FIVE MONTHS WITH CORONAVIRUS: It's pretty early here, so actually I'm a little tired. But other than that, I'm feeling much better.

CAMEROTA: Oh, my God. Yes, you don't have to have been had coronavirus to be tired.

GUTIERREZ: -- especially on a day to give thanks.

[07:30:00]

CAMEROTA: Oh, my gosh, your story is just so remarkable. So, you were so young, Crystal. I mean, you're 36 years old, or you were when you were admitted.