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Johnson & Johnson Releases Clinical Trial Results; President Biden Visits Walter Reed; FBI Finds D.C. Pipe Bombs Were Premeditated. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired January 29, 2021 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: The clinical trial results released this morning show that Johnson & Johnson, their candidate works but that it's not as effective as other vaccines that are currently available. The phase three trial results found that it was 66 percent effective in preventing moderate and severe COVID disease, and that it was 85 percent effective against severe disease.

The Pfizer and Moderna vaccines, which each require double doses, are 95 percent effective against moderate and severe illness.

More troubling are Johnson & Johnson's results when it comes to the South African variant, which is a more infectious strain that was just found in South Carolina. The vaccinee was found to be 57 percent effective on this variant, where nearly all of the trial cases involved this variant -- I should say effective in South Africa, where nearly all of those cases involved that variant.

Also, Dr. Anthony Fauci, predicting today that the coronavirus variant that was first discovered in the U.K. may become the dominant strain here in the U.S. by the end of March. All of these mutations, Fauci emphasized, can be stopped or slowed by an increase in vaccinations.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE FOR ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: Viruses cannot mutate if they don't replicate. The fundamental principle of getting people vaccinated as quickly and as efficiently as you possibly can will always be the best way to prevent the further evolution of any mutant. Because when you do that, you prevent replication, and replication is essential for mutation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Joining me now to talk about this is primary care doctor Saju Mathew, who is also a public health specialist.

I'm curious what you think about these trial results from Johnson & Johnson, 66 percent effective against moderate and severe illness.

SAJU MATHEW, PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIAN AND PUBLIC HEALTH SPECIALIST: Hi, Brianna. I'm actually excited. I mean, I know that we're been spoiled with the results from Pfizer and Moderna, which is 95 percent effective, as you just mentioned, but listen, this is still 85 percent effective in preventing severe disease, and 100 percent effective in preventing deaths.

And the more vaccines, Brianna, that we have on the market, the quicker that we can vaccinate as many people. And as I always tell a lot of my patients, it's not necessarily just the number of vaccinations, it's the pace at which we vaccinate as many people as possible quickly.

And one more thing about Johnson & Johnson, which I think will be a huge game-changer, is that it's just one shot. So if we purchase 100 million doses, that's 100 million people that can be fully vaccinated and it doesn't require a cold chain supply.

KEILAR: And so what do you make about the effectiveness when it comes to this South African variant? It's not quite as effective. I mean it's still 57 percent. What do you think about that?

MATHEW: You know, ultimately we're going to find out that unfortunately these strains, the Brazilian strain, the South African strain, the U.K. strain, all these variants unfortunately are more transmissible, and as a result of that they get into our bodies quicker.

And we have found out that pretty much for all the vaccines, the efficacy on these strains will go down. But it's still effective, it's still effective in the sense that it will work, it is not going to be like 95 percent effective, but it will definitely do the job of making sure that we break viral transmission. And if you break viral transmission, you can prevent these mutations from rising left and right.

KEILAR: And then the fact that this is just one shot, it's not two shots? How important is that, is that something that makes it a more attractive vaccine?

MATHEW: Absolutely. You know, ultimately, a lot of my friends and patients say, Dr. Mathew, which vaccine would you get? Obviously if I had a choice, it would still be Moderna and Pfizer because of how effective it is, and the fact that the genetic code can be changed to create a booster if we find out that we need a booster shot.

But remember, the Johnson & Johnson is an effective vaccine. We're still comparing it to Moderna and Pfizer, but 50, 60 percent I think will be effective. But even most importantly, Brianna, we don't have enough of the Moderna and Pfizer, so by getting Johnson & Johnson into the mix, we're going to be vaccinating millions of people not only in the U.S. but really all over the world. So I'm still optimistic and I'm looking at the glass half full.

KEILAR: Yes, it is certainly better than not being vaccinated. I mean, when you look -- like you said, we're spoiled with this 95 percent effective rate of the other vaccines.

I want to ask you, while I have you, about double masking. There's no specific CDC guidance on this right now, but let's listen to what the leader of the Institute for Health Metrics, which puts out these forecasting models that the White House uses. He says that there is substantial lab evidence that shows how well certain kinds of masks can protect the user.

[14:05:02]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTOPHER MURRAY, DIRECTOR, INSTITUTE FOR HEALTH METRICS AND EVALUATION: Three-ply, with one of the layers being propylene, does seem to much more effective, for example, than -- you know, quite substantially more effective than a single-ply mask. So if double masking is a way towards that higher quality, with a good seal around the nose and three ply, that's a good thing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: OK, how do we double mask then, and how much would you recommend it?

MATHEW: Especially now with these strains that are so transmissible and contagious, I've actually also changed my personal habits. I mean, obviously, I wear an N95 and a face shield when I'm at work, but now even casual activities like going to the grocery store can be more dangerous because of how contagious these strains are. So yes, I will wear a cloth mask, and on top of that, I'll wear a KN95 mask.

I think ultimately, Brianna -- so that we don't panic, the most important thing is that there is a tight fit, that the mask fits you in a fashion where, if you turn your head to the left and right and up and down, that it's still a tight fit. You still can be able to breathe through it.

I think double-masking is something that I would recommend, moving forward. I'm not necessarily advocating that everybody go out there and get an N95, I don't think we're going to have enough of that just yet. But a KN95 is available on Amazon, and I think it is important that if you're wearing a cloth mask, that it's actually at least three layers to offer you that protection.

So it's important that we wear a mask and we wear a mask consistently, but the type of mask and the fit is what's going to be most important.

KEILAR: Thank you. So important to hear you walk us through that, Dr. Mathew, great to see you.

MATHEW: Thank you, Brianna.

KEILAR: Regardless of the vaccine, there are still real concerns about the racial and ethnic disparities that were brought to light by this pandemic. Daily headlines show how devastating it has been to black and Latino communities.

The lack of vaccine access and availability are also growing issues. Some lawmakers are demanding a racial breakdown of who is getting the vaccine. They say that their constituents just aren't receiving the information that they need to protect themselves. Today, a White House COVID-19 adviser said the U.S. has to do everything possible to close the gap.

I am joined now by Enrique Neblett, he is a professor of health behavior and health education at the University of Michigan School of Public Health, and he's also the associate faculty lead for -- actually, sir, I'm going to have you pause just for a moment while we take a look at Joe Biden from moments ago, departing the South Lawn at the White House.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: -- visit some of the soldiers and sailors that are wounded, and look at the vaccination procedure. I've been at Walter Reed a lot, I spent almost six months there myself as a patient, and in addition to that as vice president, every single Christmas, we spent all of Christmas Day at Walter Reed.

These kids are amazing, and thank God there's not as many people to visit, so all the people I'm seeing today who are being treated -- four (ph) of them amputees -- are people who in fact are retired, but there have been -- they're real heroes.

And then we're going to go see the vaccination distribution, so they're -- I -- I spent a lot of time at Walter Reed, they're great Americans, they're great people. Nice to see you all.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Any progress on your COVID bill?

(CROSSTALK)

BIDEN: I'm sorry?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you support passing COVID relief through budget reconciliation?

BIDEN: I support passing COVID relief with support from Republicans if we can get it, but the COVID relief has to pass. There's no ifs, ands or buts. Thank you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KEILAR: All right, so this is actually tape that we've gotten, as I bring Arlette Saenz in here to talk about this. I should say that President Biden has actually arrived now at Walter Reed.

There is -- here we are, day nine, Arlette, and there's some significance to why he's visiting Walter Reed today.

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Brianna, there certainly is. You've heard President Biden and the first lady, Jill Biden, talking about the importance that the military and troops will play in their administration, but it also holds some very personal significance for Biden as well. You heard him talk about how he was actually treated at Walter Reed

back in the 1980s, after an aneurism. But also, his late son Beau Biden was treated there in the waning days of his life. He spent about the final 10 days of his life, before passing from brain cancer, over at Walter Reed. Biden, when he was vice president, often sneaking up there to see his son in those final moments.

So there is a very personal connection for him as he is traveling up to Walter Reed today, and as he has made clear and his wife has made clear that military families and helping the troops is going to be a top priority for them.

[14:10:04]

KEILAR: Yes, no, it certainly is, sort of a re-entry into this agenda, this White House. Arlette, thank you so much for being with us.

I do want to bring back in now the conversation that was interrupted there by the president. Not bad, you know, to be interrupted by the president, Dr. Neblett. Just to introduce you again, Dr. Enrique Neblett, who is a professor of health behavior and health education at the University of Michigan School of Public Health.

And I -- you know, I've been really looking forward to this conversation to talk about what is so important, and that is the racial disparities that we're seeing in so many levels when it comes to coronavirus: transmission, treatment, vaccination, access. There's actually a study that shows black people ages 35 to 44 -- so very young -- are dying at nine times the rate of white people the same age.

So, you know, what is the best way to close this gap?

ENRIQUE NEBLETT, PROFESSOR, HEALTH BEHAVIOR AND HEALTH EDUCATION, UNIVERSITY OF MICHIGAN: Well, thank you, Brianna, for having me this afternoon, it's a pleasure to be on the show.

We've got a lot of work to do. The estimates of one in 800 black Americans that have been killed by COVID-19 is really disturbing. We started out one in 10,000 or even higher than that, and the number has just been getting smaller and smaller.

So I think what we have to do to be able to address that has to do with addressing structural inequities in health in our society. We know that there's differential access to opportunities that promote health in terms of having access to food and housing, financial security, the types of jobs that people are working. All of these things are root causes of some of the disparities that we see between African-Americans and whites that need to be addressed.

I wonder how you're thinking about the vaccines, now that we know Johnson & Johnson's is likely going to be coming online. And look, 66 percent effective? That's pretty effective, but it's not 95 percent effective like Moderna and Pfizer. Should this be prioritized where the -- you know, the more effective vaccines are going to higher risk communities like black and Latino Americans?

NEBLETT: Well, I think it's important that we think about that question. We want black Americans and other people of color to enjoy the same levels of health as white Americans and other groups, but I think there are a number of important issues that have been mentioned by Dr. Fauci recently and others, that have to do with, you know, trust and belief, and whether it's safe to take the vaccine.

People have reasons to mistrust or have doubts about the vaccine, and so I think even before we can address the issue of, you know, which one to take, we've got to think about what are the reasons that people are having hesitancy or doubts about taking the vaccine, and address those head-on.

So having conversations with folks and thinking about the policies and practices that have, you know, sort of got us into this situation in the first place such that there's differential access to the vaccines and how people feel about taking it.

KEILAR: Yes, no, it's so important. I hope to continue this conversation with you, Dr. Neblett. This is going to be something that takes us all the way through this pandemic, no doubt. Sir, thanks for being with us.

NEBLETT: Absolutely. Thank you, Brianna.

KEILAR: We're following some breaking news on the Capitol riot. The FBI now says the pipe bombs that were found on January 6th were actually placed the night before, outside of the RNC and DNC. We'll have details on the hunt for the suspect, next.

[14:13:57]

Plus, U.S. airlines are now pushing back on COVID testing for domestic travel, and the mayor of Tampa joins me live as tens of thousands of people are set to come to her city for the Super Bowl. She has just ordered that masks will be mandatory outside.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KEILAR: Let's listen in now to the president at Walter Reed.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BIDEN: So great to see you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you. You as well, you as well. Welcome.

BIDEN: I don't know how many trips we took together.

ANDREW BARR, DIRECTOR, WALTER REED NATIONAL MILITARY MEDICAL CENTER: Mr. President, welcome to Walter Reed National Military Medical Center. Colonel Andrew Barr, the director of the hospital. It's my distinct honor and privilege to welcome you back to the president's hospital, the flagship of military medicine, so --

(CROSSTALK)

BARR: -- honored (ph) to see you today.

BIDEN: Well, you guys have been, as (INAUDIBLE) would tell, you have done a great deal for my family. My son Beau, after a year in Iraq, came back with stage four glioblastoma. You took care of him in his final days --

BARR: Yes, sir.

BIDEN: -- with great grace and dignity. And the old Walter Reed, I spent six months with a couple cranial aneurysms and a major embolism, (INAUDIBLE).

(LAUGHTER)

The docs are all right, but the nurses are better, male and female, you know what I mean?

BARR: Yes, sir. Yes, sir, absolutely.

BIDEN: Anyway. Saved my life here, so.

BARR: Appreciate that.

Sir, this is Command Master Chief Randy Swanson --

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KEILAR: That is the tape, brief tape there from the White House press pool of President Biden at Walter Reed. And then just a note, you did hear him say he was thanking them for helping his son Beau Biden, which he tied his glioblastoma sort of subtly there -- he's done it more directly in the past -- to his service in Iraq, to some of the toxic exposure that he had there.

[14:20:00]

We are following breaking news. CNN has learned the pipe bombs that were found near the Capitol on January 6th were actually placed there the night before. This is what the FBI is saying.

Two pipe bombs were discovered near Democratic and Republican headquarters on the day of the Capitol insurrection. The FBI is releasing photos of this person, an unidentified suspect, who was wearing a grey hooded sweatshirt, a face mask and carrying a backpack. They believe likely that this is the person who planted the pipe bombs.

Peter Licata is a CNN law enforcement analyst, he's a former lead bomb tech for the FBI in New York City.

Peter, you are the person to talk to about this. Thank you so much for being with us. These bombs that were planted --

PETER LICATA, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: My pleasure. KEILAR: -- the night before the Capitol riot, you know, what does

that tell you, that it was done the night before? Anything?

LICATA: Well yes, it obviously tells you that there was pre-planning involved in this. This just wasn't a whim, this just wasn't a rioter that showed up to the Capitol that morning and just seeded the two primary party headquarters with these devices, this was pre-planned, this was intentional and deliberate.

KEILAR: They weren't decoys, right? These were real bombs, they were functional but they didn't go off. What does that tell you?

LICATA: Well, they were there -- it's being assessed that they were real. So obviously there's an intent by this criminal, this terrorist, this bomber, whatever terminology we want to use, to actually have these devices function.

Why they didn't function? To be determined, the laboratory analysts from the FBI, subject matter experts, are you know, have (ph) those reports ready to determine why it didn't function, or maybe the timer wasn't necessarily set for that specific time. But they were viable devices, and that should cause concern for all involved.

KEILAR: So they were discovered, and then they were disarmed. If, say, they had exploded, how dangerous would they have been?

LICATA: it's kind of all relative. It's dangerous because it's a destructive device by law. So it's something that explodes, which causes shock, which causes what we call shock blast (ph) pressure. It causes heat and thermal effect.

And most deadly, especially in a pipe bomb, there's fragmentation, which is those little metal fragments of that pipe as it explodes, are flying through the air. Anyone in the vicinity of that pipe is going to be affected by that, with pieces of fragmentation from that device lodging into their skin, into their body and their flesh.

KEILAR: Indeed. Peter, thank you so much for talking to us about this. Peter Licata.

LICATA: My pleasure, thank you.

KEILAR: Next, President Trump directs his energy to taking down Liz Cheney, the powerful House Republican who voted to impeach him. And several Republicans seem to be getting on board.

Plus, President Biden says it's time to act now on a COVID relief bill, but will pushing it through Congress ruin his chances of bipartisan cooperation in the future?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:27:15]

KEILAR: The state of Georgia, dramatically shaking up national politics this month and showing the vast political spectrum of the American divide. On one side, conspiracy theories and lies. Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene, Democrats and moderate Republicans are outraged by her support of QAnon and deeply offensive ideas that the Parkland or Sandy Hook school shootings were hoaxes. But we shouldn't forget that she won an election with nearly 75 percent of the vote in her rural district in northwest Georgia.

Contrast that with the more urban areas of the state, whose voters catapulted two Democratic candidates to the Senate, altering the balance of power in Washington. And not just any two Democratic candidates: the first black and the first Jewish senators ever elected in Georgia.

They got there with the help of Stacey Abrams, a former candidate for Georgia governor who has led a grassroots campaign to register and turn out hundreds of thousands of minority and Democratic voters. If you're on the left, she's a hero. If you're on the right, she's a villain.

But also on display in Georgia is the nationwide split in the Republican Party. Because when Donald Trump was trying to attack the results of a free and fair election there, it was GOP officials, including many who voted for Trump, who stood up to him.

Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger refused to find 11,000 votes despite getting a direct phone call from the president to pressure him to do so. In return, he was attacked mercilessly by the Trump wing of the party for keeping his backbone and his integrity intact.

CNN's senior political correspondent Abby Phillip joins me now.

I mean, Georgia might be the most fascinating political story for political watchers, Abby. What lessons should we be taking from what played out there this year?

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it is such a microcosm of so many broader trends happening in the political landscape, and I think you laid it out there very well. There is a surge of participation in urban centers in a state that is actually diversifying because younger people of color are coming back into the state. And that is benefiting Democrats.

But then you have, in Marjorie Taylor Greene and her district, the representation of the kind of increasing isolation of certain parts of the Republican Party: more rural, more white, and more -- much further to the right than perhaps the mainstream of the Republican Party or the mainstream of American politics.

I do think, though, that this is where the battle is going to play out. There are going to be battles of the future of voting in Georgia because Republicans want to crack down on the trends that led to those two Senate seats flipping to Democrats.

[14:29:50]

And then on top of that, I think you're going to see even more so these more conspiratorial ideas gaining purchase in the parts of the state that are pushing back against the diversifying elements of the state that are more populous, that are more black.