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New Day

Life Inside a Taliban Stronghold; Dr. Anthony Fauci is Interviewed about the Johnson & Johnson Pause; New Information on Rep. Matt Gaetz; Minnesota Teams Honor Wright. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired April 14, 2021 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[06:30:00]

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Might not give a -- the sentence. But as the relations demanded, they may. For example, around four years back, three thieves were hanged to death from the electricity poll on the road out of town for people to see. They had been arrested a few times for robbery, but they did not stop.

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR (voice over): This footage from a drive around town heads out to the refugee camps by the river from where U.S. Marines used to get shot at and it's clear few women are allowed on the streets. They still don't go to school. Nobody even dares ask about that, we're told. But most men we asked said women had it good. This is what they meant.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They are not allowed to do business outside their house. When they go out, they need to dress according to Sharia law. So, for them, it's more important to take care of their homes than working outside.

WALSH: Women could also get a rough justice in this backward world.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One woman pleaded guilty for adultery, and she has been imprisoned for the last five years now. No one knows what will happen to her in the end. The man caught with her was killed by his in-laws for bringing shame to this marriage.

WALSH: Fighting is rare here now and the Americans must just watch from jets or drones above.

WALSH (on camera): In fact, we were told the Taliban only allowed some smartphones in Musacala (ph) because peace talks meant that U.S. air strikes there have slowed down. The Americans have been using smartphones to track Taliban fighters.

WALSH (voice over): Taliban rule in these streets means they set taxes from opium harvests or shops, we were told, or ask for bread or clothes for their fighters when in need. But some said feuds between Taliban groups mean people can pay more than once.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Many people have been taken to a Taliban room, locked up for a night or two or have been beaten up. They are different groups of Taliban. It would be better to have a single authority (ph) official giving (ph) tax, but every group tries to take tax for their own pockets. That's one problem for people now.

WALSH: Life then goes on, much as it did before the Taliban were removed from power after 9/11. There's just a lot of Americans and Afghans lost in the battle in between.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WALSH: So you might ask yourself if the Taliban have control like that in parts of rural Afghanistan, and it's a pretty common picture apart from major cities like this, Kabul, now millions strong, why would they want peace talks? Well, there are some who say actually there are Taliban who feel maybe being part of a transitional legitimate government will help one important thing keep coming, and that's international aid, because if you run the country, you have to make sure it's fed and the lights stay on. That's already a problem with all the international aid coming into the country now. That's one key thing that may influence the months ahead.

Poppy.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Nick, back 20 years ago, in 2001, then President Bush said in his remarks to the country that the U.S. condemns the Taliban. He said repeatedly, they're a regime committing murder. And just last month, 124 civilians died in Afghanistan.

I think the question, as the U.S. completely pulls out, you know, what has been accomplished?

WALSH: Yes, I mean, look, al Qaeda and the way that they existed in 2001 have been defeated symbolically, but, obviously, that defeat symbolically occurred in Pakistan, where Osama bin Laden was killed. Right now the U.S. Treasury Department, back on January the 4th, issued a statement saying that al Qaeda was growing in strength here growing with the Taliban. So there's an enormous question mark as to whether or not there will be a safe haven here when the U.S. troops finally withdraw.

We can see in the city around me here, Kabul, it used to be hundreds of thousands strong when the Americans first came here. Now there are millions living here. Billions have been sunk into this country. It's fueled corruption, it's fueled some advances too, but it's now left the country supercharged, frankly, with weapons and aggressions between different factions here. When America leaves, it's not the end of the war, it's the beginning of a new phase of a conflict that's, frankly, gone on for decades for many Afghans here.

Poppy.

HARLOW: Nick Paton Walsh live for us in Kabul this morning.

Thank you so much for that reporting.

Of the nearly 7 million Johnson & Johnson COVID vaccines that have been administered here in the United States, only six people have experienced the rare but severe blood clots. A question this morning, did the administration pull that vaccine too quickly? What will this mean for vaccine hesitancy? Dr. Anthony Fauci is here with us next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:38:41]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: The CDC's Vaccine Advisory Committee will hold an emergency meeting today to discuss whether and how use of Johnson & Johnson's coronavirus vaccine should continue in the United States. This after six women out of the nearly 7 million Americans who have received the shot reported a rare and severe type of blood clot.

Joining me now is Dr. Anthony Fauci. He's President Biden's chief medical adviser on the pandemic.

Dr. Fauci, as always, great to have you here.

Six cases out of 7 million doses. That is literally less than one in a million.

Why is that enough to justify a pause?

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, CHIEF MEDICAL ADVISER TO PRESIDENT BIDEN: Well, what the CDC and the FDA wanted to do is, they were accumulating a recognition of the cases, first one and two then three. When they got to six, they decided, let's just pause, very likely quote temporary, but just pause to take a good look and this and maybe get some more details and see if, in fact, that there are other, perhaps many others, and then we'll find out what we're going to do and then move on from there.

So one was a caution from regard to the safety itself. But there's also another issue involved. If there are women out there who have been vaccinated and who get this syndrome, this very serious syndrome, rare albeit, if they did, we wanted to make the doctors out there who know about this to make sure they treat the person correctly because the standard way, John, that you treat clots is by an anti-coagulant called heparin.

[06:40:15]

Heparin is contraindicated in this situation and might make matters worse.

So there's a two-fold reason. One, for an abundance of caution of safety, take a quick look, get more details, but also a heads-up to the physicians out there that if you see these kinds of cases, don't treat them with heparin. There are other modalities of treatment that can be used.

BERMAN: You said to look and see if there are more -- may be many more cases. Do you have reason to believe that there are many more cases?

FAUCI: No. No, I -- no, John, I don't. I'm just saying that, that that's one of the reasons. BERMAN: OK.

FAUCI: Because when you put a pause, you want to look around and say, maybe there are others that have been reported and we don't know about it. So let's take a quick look, get everybody to get a heads-up and alert to it and then see if there are any other cases.

BERMAN: Let me -- let me read to you what Governor Chris Sununu of New Hampshire said. He was one of the governors on this call getting the explanation yesterday morning. He said, it's very hard as governors to go out and explain that we're pausing based on something that is, as according to Dr. Fauci, a one in a million occurrence. What has to be appreciated is the ability for governors to reinstill confidence after something like this is 100 times harder than the pause is in the first place.

Your reaction?

FAUCI: John, you can take that on the other side of the coin because I know, when I go out there and talk to people about hesitancy, the overwhelming reason for that is a concern about safety. So if there is a concern about hesitancy out there, the fact that this was done would, in my mind, underscore and confirm how seriously we take safety, even though it's a very rare event.

So if anybody's got a doubt that they may not be taking safety very seriously, I think this is an affirmation that safety is a primary consideration when it comes to the FDA and the CDC. That's why it was done and that's why it's a pause. It isn't a cancellation. It's a pause.

BERMAN: Days, weeks, months?

FAUCI: You know, speaking to the CDC and the FDA, there very likely there may be more days to weeks than weeks to months. I doubt very seriously if we're talking about weeks to months.

BERMAN: You know that there is this issue of vaccine hesitancy out there, broadly speaking, not just about Johnson & Johnson, but vaccines in general. One of the reasons is, is some of the things people say. And last night -- I want to read you -- I don't want to play it because I'm not sure that helps the cause here of saving lives -- something that TV personality Tucker Carlson said on TV about vaccines in general. He said, if the vaccine -- if vaccines are effective, there's no reason for people who have received the vaccine to wear masks or avoid physical contact. So maybe it doesn't work and they're simply not telling you that.

Let me repeat that again. So maybe it doesn't work and they're simply not telling you that.

What do you have to say to Tucker Carlson?

FAUCI: Yes. That's just a typical crazy conspiracy theory. Why would we not tell people if it doesn't work. Look at the data. The data are overwhelming in the three vaccines that have been approved for use and in an Emergency Use Authorization, the J&J, the Pfizer, and the Moderna, you had 30,000, 44,000, and 40,000 people in the clinical trial with an overwhelming signal of efficacy. So I don't have any idea what he's talking about.

BERMAN: How dangerous is it for a TV personality like that who does have an audience of millions to speculate about something like that?

FAUCI: Well, it's certainly not helpful to the public health of this nation or even globally. You know, I don't want to get into arguments about Tucker Carlson, but it -- to me it's just -- you know, it's counter to what we were trying to accomplish to protect the safety and the health of the American public.

BERMAN: One of the things -- there's vax -- there's different levels of vaccine hesitancy, right? There are anti-vaxers and then there are people -- one out of two people have -- some people have as a wait and see approach. I want to wait and see what happens as more and more people get the vaccine.

What's your message overall and generally speaking to the wait and see people with the vaccine?

FAUCI: Well -- yes. You know, it's understandable why people do that. I mean you don't want to be pejorative against them. I mean that's a natural instinct of wanting to wait and see. But what you tell people, let's look at the data, OK? What we have right now, and we have over 120, close to 130 million people have already received at least one dose of this. I mean that's a lot of people. I mean how long do you want to wait and see? I mean you have almost half the country has received at least one dose.

[06:45:00]

So I think we've had enough wait and see, let's do it.

BERMAN: And 3.4 million people a day on average now, which is a remarkable number, an astounding number, which should be celebrated.

Just one last question, just on some of the data we're seeing, and this is an idea that Sanjay, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, put in my ear, we are seeing cases rise now, nearly 80,000 cases a day now, which I know you think is a number that's way too high. Hospitalizations are rising a little bit but flat to up a little bit, but that's continued to all in the United States.

And one of the things that Sanjay said is, one of the things we don't know, is it possible that, yes, cases may still rise a little bit, hospitalizations even too, but the number of deaths will continue to drop because the most vulnerable population has been vaccinated.

Is it possible we will continue to see a drop in deaths no matter what happens with cases?

FAUCI: Yes, I think, as usual, Sanjay is right on the money. I think that's exactly what's going to happen because, you know, if you look at the people who are most vulnerable to death, namely the elderly, we know that from experience now over greater than a year. There's more than 76 percent of people over 65 who have been vaccinated. So, I mean, there you have it, the most vulnerable to the extent of the relative proportion are protected. So even though you're seeing people infected because there's, as you know, a race, as I've said so many times, John, a race between getting as many people vaccinated as possible with the virus itself surging or trying to surge, you know, it's creeping up around 80,000. That's a very high number, 80,000 per day.

As we get more and more people, that 3 million to 4 million people per day vaccinated, the vaccine component of this race is going to get stronger and strong and then you're going to start to see the cases come down.

BERMAN: Dr. Anthony Fauci, thank you very much for being with us this morning.

FAUCI: Thank you, John. Good to -- thank you for having me.

BERMAN: All right, coming up, a major development in the investigation into embattled Congressman Matt Gaetz. Brand-new CNN reporting about late-night drug-fueled parties the congressman allegedly attended. Details, next.

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[06:51:08]

HARLOW: Well, new developments this morning could spell quite a bit of trouble for Republican Congressman Matt Gaetz. A source tells CNN that Gaetz's indicted friend, Joel Greenberg, has been cooperating with the fed since last year. Greenberg faces dozens of counts, including sex trafficking of a minor. "The New York Times" reports the information includes details about encounters he and Gaetz had with women who were given cash or gifts for sex. And, this morning, CNN has brand new reporting about late night house parties allegedly attended by these women and Gaetz and what happened there.

Our Paula Reid joins us more with these stunning details.

Paula, this is your reporting. What can you share?

PAULA REID, CNN SENIOR LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Poppy.

Well, CNN spoke directly with two women who attended these parties with Congressman Gaetz and other and the behavior of the congressman and other high-powered men, along with a pattern of digital payments, could be of interest to the Justice Department as part of its probe of Gaetz that includes allegations of sex trafficking and prostitution.

Now, we have learned these parties were held at a house in a gated community in suburban Orlando. The women we spoke with said when some of the women arrived, there were rules. For example, the first thing some of them were asked to do was put away their cellphones. Now, one of the women told us the attendees included a who's who of local Republican officials and often included Congressman Gaetz. And these men just did not want their activities as these parties being documented.

Now we're told people at these parties were often dressed up, coming directly from a political event, and we're told folks mingled and shared drugs, including cocaine and ecstasy. One of the women said that she saw Congressman Gaetz take a pill she believed was a recreational drug.

Now some of the people at these parties also had sex. According to receipts reviewed by CNN, Gaetz and his associate Joel Greenberg used digital payment apps to send hundreds of dollars to at least one woman who attended these parties. Now these receipts, viewed by CNN, record payments that took place between 2018 and 2019 and include at least one that indicated in its label that it was to compensate for travel.

Now, another woman we spoke with said she received money from Greenberg after some of these party, but she said she never received any payment directly from Gaetz.

Now it's also notable that both of the women we spoke with say they never saw anyone at any of these parties who appeared to be under age.

HARLOW: Yes, an important detail, but this is what makes the Greenberg plea so important, Paula, right? What is he going to say that his attorney indicated would make Congressman Gaetz so uncomfortable, what could this mean? Could that -- will that connect all those dots that you've laid out in your important reporting.

Before you go, I mean what -- what did Congressman Gaetz say when asked about his attendance at the party?

REID: Well, a spokesman for Gaetz declined to comment on the substance of our report and Gaetz has, of course, denied ever paying for sex. And over the past two weeks he's sought to frame this whole investigation, which began at the end of the Trump administration, as the result of political bias.

Now, Poppy, you make a great point about his associate, Greenberg. He is potentially such a key player here. He currently face 33 federal charges, including sex trafficking of a minor. Greenberg's attorney declined to comment for this story, but last week he told a judge he expects his client will enter a plea agreement in the coming weeks. And CNN has learned that Greenberg has been providing information to investigators. And according to people familiar with the investigation, authorities have spoken with some of the women also who have been involved with the congressman and Greenberg. But, interestingly, neither one of the women we spoke with has spoken with federal investigators.

HARLOW: I think investigators are going to be looking to talk to them after your reporting, Paula. Thank you for that.

Minnesota sports teams returning to action and paying tribute to the life of Daunte Wright. We'll have details in the "Bleacher Report" next. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:58:18]

BERMAN: Minnesota sports teams return to action on the court and the field with tributes to Daunte Wright.

Andy Scholes with more in the "Bleacher Report."

Good morning, Andy.

ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, good morning, John.

So the Minnesota Twins and Timberwolves both returning to action a day after postponing their games due to the shooting death of Daunte Wright. And the Timberwolves taking on the Nets. And both teams wearing custom t-shirts with the message, with liberty and justice for all on them during their pregame warmups. The Timberwolves president, Gersson Rosas, before the game said this has just been a deeply emotional time for the entire community.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GERSSON ROSAS, TIMBERWOLVES PRESIDENT OF OPERATIONS: We almost feel like a boxer in the 11th, 12th round with these things happening over and over again. And for our organization, at all levels, players, staff, coaches, front office, we live here. This is our community. To be experiencing this again, in the middle of a trial, is something that's very emotional and overwhelming.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHOLES: Now the Twins, meanwhile, taking the field against the Red Sox yesterday and they held a moment of silence in honor of Wright before their game.

All right, if you want to go to a Buffalo Bills or Sabers game this fall, you have to be vaccinated. An Erie County executive saying yesterday, unless you prove you're vaccinated, you won't be allowed into the stadium. It's their plan to have a 100 percent safe environment for up to 70,000 fans this fall. And, John, you know, this is the first time we've seen a local government come out and say the policy of no vaccination, no entry for their sports teams and their stadiums. We'll, you know, of course, wait and see if more local governments try to adopt that policy.

[07:00:00]

BERMAN: It's going to be a patchwork. It's going to be very interesting to see how different places handle this.

Andy Scholes, thanks so much for being with us.

SCHOLES: All right.

NEW DAY continues right now.