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Closing Arguments in Case of George Floyd's Death to Begin; GOP Lawmakers Scrap Caucus Pushing Anglo-Saxon Values; GOP, Big Biz Lobby Have Tense Confrontation over Democratic Endorsements. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired April 19, 2021 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN NEW DAY: Closing arguments that are beginning this morning in the trial of Derek Chauvin, the former police officer who knelt on George Floyd's neck and back for nine minutes and 29 seconds.

[07:00:09]

And downtown Minneapolis, where the jury will be sequestered during deliberations, crews are installing razor wire around police stations and thousands of National Guard troops are ready to deploy if needed.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN NEW DAY: The verdict in one of the most closely watched trials in years could be decided within days, cities including Chicago, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Philadelphia, all also bracing for unrest, Minneapolis among many cities now reeling from other police-involved deaths, including the fatal shooting of 20-year-old Daunte Wright just miles from the courthouse where Chauvin awaits his fate.

KEILAR: So what can we expect when closing arguments are getting underway?

Joining us now to talk about this, Elie Honig, who's our CNN Legal Analyst and also former federal and state prosecutor.

Let's start with the prosecution. They have to have proved what they said they were going to prove. Did they?

ELIE HONIG, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, Brianna, big, big day. This will be the culmination of this trial that the world has really been watching for the last three weeks. Now, the prosecution will close first. I think they're going to start by bringing the jury right back to the events of May 25th of 2020 outside of Cup Foods. The first way they're going to do that is by reminding the jury of the eyewitnesses, those who witnessed George Floyd's last moments as he was being held down by the knee of Derek Chauvin. Those eyewitnesses have delivered clear and compelling testimony.

After that, I think the main point, the exhibit A throughout this trial is going to be that video, the 9:29 that shows Derek Chauvin kneeling on George Floyd's neck. We've not really seen large chunks of that video throughout the trial. We've really only seen small snippets. I think the prosecution is going to show longer stretches today to the jury.

BERMAN: Sorry, go ahead.

HONIG: The second is going to be that the police used excessive force against George Floyd. We heard from a whole succession of prosecution witnesses. Former police officers, including the chief of the Minneapolis Police Department, Medaria Arrandondo, who testified that what Derek Chauvin did was excessive use of force, violated the training, practice and protocol of the Minneapolis Police Department.

And, finally, the prosecution is going to remind the jury of the whole series of medical experts who testified all from different specialties that the bottom line cause of George Floyd's death, the medical cause was lack of oxygen caused by Derek Chauvin's knee on George Floyd's neck.

BERMAN: You have me on the edge of my seat the whole time there, Elie. That's why I wanted to jump in so much. So, obviously, the defense goes second. They get to see what the prosecution does first when they present their closing argument. What are you expecting?

HONIG: Yes. So let's remember, really important, the defense does not have to outdo the prosecution. Al they have to do is punch enough of a hole to create reasonable doubt. I think the defense is going to make two main arguments here.

First of all, when it comes to medical causation, they're going to remind the jury of their expert, Dr. Fowler, who testified essentially that George Floyd died because of everything but Derek Chauvin's knee. They're going to blame the medical condition. They're going to blame his drug use. They're even going to blame this carbon monoxide theory.

The second main theory we're going to see from the defense is that Derek Chauvin's use force was not use excessive. They called one expert witness, his name is Barry Brodd. He told the jury that what Derek Chauvin did was acceptable, he said, because holding someone down in a prone position is not, according to that expert witness, a use of force. The jury is free to take that for whatever it's worth. They're free to believe it. They're free to disbelieve it.

When the defense is done, the prosecution will then get a chance to come back and present brief rebuttal testimony. At that point, the case will be handed over to the jury. The jury will deliberate in secret. We will not know what they were doing. All we will see is occasional notes that come out to the jury to the judge. We will try to decipher those notes to you. And then, eventually, at some point, we don't know when, they jury will come back and deliver its verdict.

KEILAR: Yes. Will the jury believe that or will they believe what the former police chief said, which was that this was not acceptable and also violated values as well as actual policy. Thank you so much, Elie.

The White House is also bracing for a potential verdict in the Chauvin trial. We have some new CNN reporting that President Biden is keeping a very close eye on these proceedings. He is concerned that the outcome could spark new racial tensions in a country that's already on edge.

CNN's Jeff Zeleny is live in Washington with more on this. Tell us about this, Jeff.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Brianna, good morning. We are told President Biden, for weeks, has been paying very careful attention to the trial in Minneapolis even before taking office. Some of his advisers were watching the trial unfold.

And I'm told in a conversation last week that leaders of the Congressional Black Caucus at the White House, the president was talking to them about this trial specifically, not talking about the verdict, but that, of course, is understating all of this. If there is a controversial verdict, what is going to happen to cities across the country, the president keeping a close eye on protests already under way.

So I had a conversation with Congressman Jim Clyburn who, of course, is very close to the president.

[07:05:01]

And he believes President Biden can be a unifying force in this. And take a look at what he told me. He said this. He said the bully pulpit is more than a bully pulpit. I think the president can help set a tone in the country that there's no question in my mind.

So, Congressman Clyburn, as well as other advisers to the president, are working with him on what he can say in the wake of a verdict here. Of course, the White House keeping an eye on this, not getting ahead of what is happening, but they, again, are concerned that this will, you know, certainly deepen the crisis and confidence of police and inflame racial tensions. But he wants, of course, to handle this much differently in every way than his predecessor did a year ago in the White House.

So, President Biden watching this just as the nation is, it certainly could have a huge impact on his presidency.

BERMAN: Jeff, I'm sure the White House is also watching what seems to be a never ending spree of mass shootings in the country. So, how is the White House balancing these priorities?

ZELENY: Well, John, this is a strange confluence of events, because they are, of course, happening at the same time, and one mass shooting after another after another after another. So, of course, the president has called on some form of gun legislation, but he's leaving it in the hands of Congress to really work up support for more background legislation. President Biden, of course, knows more than anyone how difficult this is to get through Congress, any type of gun safety legislation, but they are watching this really with trepidation.

The president has stopped essentially going to these cities of crisis because there are just too many of them, but the flag going up and down on top of the White House underscores how many mass shootings, indeed, there have been. So, all of this is coming together really creating a nation on edge. The president, of course, is aware of this, but a top adviser told me over the weekend this was already a tinderbox, it's becoming more volatile by the day. John?

BERMAN: As we keep saying, Jeff, it really seem as if there's an active shooter situation in America, period, all the time.

ZELENY: Indeed.

BERMAN: Thanks so much for your reporting on this.

ZELENY: Sure.

BERMAN: So, Johnson & Johnson claiming both Moderna and Pfizer's coronavirus vaccines are also linked to blood clots. It's not true. What Johnson & Johnson said is not true. The company said its study showed people developed blood clots with the other vaccines, but that's not what it shows.

The author of the study spoke with our Elizabeth Cohen, and she joins us now. Elizabeth?

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: John, I think there was a lot of surprise when Johnson & Johnson put out this statement because it's simply not true. Let's take a look at what their April 9th media statement said. It's citing studies, Johnson & Johnson claim that blood clots have been reported, quote, with all COVID-19, end quote, vaccines.

And they cited a study done at Cornell and other universities, and I talked to the lead author of that study, she said, we didn't find any with blood clots. We didn't find any of those scary things that are happening with Johnson & Johnson.

Now, these are extremely rare reports of blood clots with the Johnson & Johnson. Here is a statement from the company. We continue to work closely with medical experts and global health authorities to assess the data on these extremely rare events. Above all, we are committed to the safety and well being of the people who use our products.

Now, we know that Johnson & Johnson right now, that rollout is on pause. This week, a decision is expected to be made whether they should put a warning on the Johnson & Johnson vaccine or certain people they shouldn't to take it or perhaps both. Brianna, John?

KEILAR: How is the vaccination program overall progressing here? We're told that 50 percent of U.S. adults have gotten now at least their first dose.

COHEN: Yes, and that's actually quite amazing, Brianna, when you think back to the discussions that we were having in December, in January, things seemed to be going so slowly. Things are really picking up now. In fact, in many places, you have a choice between which type of vaccine that you want. People are having a much easier time getting vaccinated. The trick is going to be when the folks who want it are getting it. But what about the folks who are vaccine-hesitant, how will they be convinced to get it? That's the next step.

KEILAR: Yes, where does that number start to kind of bottom out? We will see. Elizabeth Cohen, thank you so much.

Just a short time ago, we reported on the numbers of mass shootings across America over just the past few days here, so many, it's head- spinning, tragic, and, frankly, it's difficult to keep up with. It has becoming so common that Americans aren't sure when they wake up whether they could be shot at one of following places where mass shootings have happened over the past couple of decades, a church, an elementary school, a high school, a restaurant, a military base, a navy yard, a post office, a movie theater, a synagogue, a grocery store, a concert, a college, a nightclub, a bar, a Walmart, a FedEx facility, a McDonald's, a hospital, a community center, a city center, a municipal center, a newsroom, your house, your office, massage parlors, a gas station, on the street, a festival, a hotel, the airport.

[07:10:03]

BERMAN: Wow. And the violence isn't exclusive to large cities or small. In the past month alone, these communities have seen a mass shooting in their neighborhoods defined by four or more people either kill order hurt by a shooter's gunfire, Kenosha, Columbus, Ohio, Detroit, twice, Indianapolis, Pensacola, Washington, D.C., twice, Baltimore, twice, Chicago, four times, Wichita, Seattle, Memphis, twice, Koshkonong, Missouri, Waterbury, Connecticut, Allendale, Michigan, Ft. Worth, Bryan, Texas, Rock Hill, South Carolina, Milwaukee, Monroe, Louisiana, Birmingham, Wilmington, Tuscaloosa, Beaumont, Texas, Dallas, twice, Quincy, Florida, Orange County, California, Cleveland, Essex, Maryland, Yazoo City, Mississippi, River Grove, Illinois, Virginia Beach, Virginia, Norfolk, Virginia, Philadelphia, twice, Aliceville, Alabama, Boulder, Houston, New Orleans, Gresham, Orgeon, Stockton, California, Atlanta.

KEILAR: It is stunning. It is a stunning list. I thought you were going to stop saying cities and it just keeps going and going and going.

BERMAN: I don't there's any stop to the cities at this point. The list, it's exhausting to read it, it's exhausting to live through it at this point.

KEILAR: And some of these don't even register. So I think for a lot of people as they're watching all of this, now they know.

Still ahead, Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene's short-lived plan to launch her own policy based, quote, Anglo-Saxon traditions. Why she suddenly decided to scrap that idea.

BERMAN: Republicans are supposed to be the parties of big business, right? New reporting on some trouble in paradise behind the scenes. KEILAR: And half of the adults in the United States have now received at least one dose of their coronavirus vaccine. What will it take to convince everybody else? The U.S. surgeon general joins us live coming up.

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[07:15:]

BERMAN: It's over before it began for conspiracy theorist and QAnon- loving Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene. She has apparently canceled her own plan focusing an America First caucus focusing on what they said was Anglo-Saxon values after blowback from leading House Republicans.

Let's discuss this with former Republican Congressman Denver Riggleman. He's now are strategist for the network, Contagion Research Institute, which studies the spread of disinformation in U.S. politics and ways to defeat it.

Congressman, look, sometimes we call things thinly veiled, right? This is the least thinly veiled thing I have ever seen. This was basically, you know, flashing America and showing America exactly what you think, Anglo-Saxon values. What did you think when you first heard this plan?

FMR. REP. DENVER RIGGLEMAN (R-VA): Well, it's sort of gob-smack. If you read the first seven pages of that America First caucus statement, and it sounds like what happened to me here in my district with the same kind of sort of vile language, almost like racism in a jar, right? You just sort of put it all in there in one specific sort of American First caucus ideology.

And, you know, I can see that other caucuses would get mad, like the freedom caucus, because I don't know if you know this, John, but the freedom caucus charge dues. And what Marjorie was looking for was a due-collecting-caucus that could be a competitor. And I think that's why you saw some of the ager from freedom caucus and other caucuses because they were going after their money too.

So, pretty interesting, the layers to this, but to see that and to see her calling the media vile and POSS and evil, I think when you have that kind of Christian love coming through the document, which was ridiculous, I think she did get her hand caught in the racist cookie jar and I think that's why you've seen that reaction.

BERMAN: One of the things you do talk about eloquently, Congressman, is it's not just a supply thing. It's a demand. What does it say that she believes, and Paul Gosar and other people who involved with this allegedly, that they believe there was an appetite for this among the Republican base?

RIGGLEMAN: Well, yes, it was the four Gs, wasn't it? I mean, it was Greene, Gosar, Gaetz and Gohmert. And when I was running here, if you weren't a member of the freedom caucus, you are automatically not a candidate. For some of these districts, you don't actually meet the threshold of conservatism. And I think that's what they were going for for America First caucus, was you had to meet this threshold in order to be a candidate in some of these districts.

And, look, again, committees around the country, you're saying to vote this way. This is not unique. And we've talked about this, John, before, I've been on this show so many times with you and we've had this discussion, is it is still there, it is still metastasizing, that kind of hate, that kind of trying to project policy into a hate full of a buck is what they're trying to do, and then trying to rationalize it as something that the Republican Party shouldn't stand for.

If the GOP doesn't stand up and identify these individuals for who they are, again, I think there's real trouble there. But to say the GOP is in trouble, they're not. In 2022, I think they're going take back the majority on some of this messaging. So this fight continues every day and that's why I'm here talking to you because I enjoy sort of scrum and the confrontation of this, but I also know that you need people to finally say, enough is enough, scrap that crappy document, right, stop being bigoted or racist or stop thinking that immigrants are somehow bad for this country, and let's push forward and have policies that we can reach across the aisle and do something good about this, and this ridiculousness we see every day.

BERMAN: You say she got her hand caught in the racist cookie jar. Why this time? What was it that bothered leadership so much this time they had to speak out?

RIGGLEMAN: I think it's the exact terminology. When you're talking about European progeny, when you're talking about Anglo-Saxon values, when you read the immigration portion of the document, when you're talking about immigrants who are smarter before 1965 were some kind tripe that they tried to summarized, where they said economists said this. What economist? Show me. What are the names. And if you want to come at me, let's do this.

And I think that's what you need. You don't need to call names and things like that, but you need to be confrontational when it comes to your ethics and values.

[07:20:03]

And I think that's what Republicans and I think where the radical portion of the Republican Party, John, I think where the facts-based pariahs, the people that sort of still want to see logic brought into the conversation. But if we don't have some aggression and confrontation when it comes to policy and ideology and say we can't have this, that's what we need.

But what we see right now going on is this sort of click bait ridiculousness where people are sort of wanting to be violent or trying to get clicks based on very provocative language where often, as like you saw in the America First document. I think part of it was leadership seeing some of the warning on the immigration portion on this and some of the warning, and that seven-page document was just nonsensical tripe.

BERMAN: I got to say, when you're talking about Anglo-Saxon values, it's really a single entendre. It means one thing. RIGGLEMAN: Yes, there's no double entendre there. They just said it. And for people to say, well, they didn't mean that, well, come on, I mean, when I fell off the turnip truck but didn't get a concussion, John, come on, it's ridiculous.

BERMAN: Radical Republican Denver Riggleman we appreciate you being with us this morning. Thanks so much for your time.

RIGGLEMAN: Thank, John. I appreciate it. Thank you.

KEILAR: CNN reporting a heated conversation broke out between Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell and big business over a Democratic string of endorsements. Members of the Chamber of Commerce realizing their longtime ally, the Republican Party, is growing more populous by the year, a strategy the Chamber of Commerce isn't eager to embrace.

CNN's Manu Raju is live for us on Capitol Hill with more. Tell us what's happening here, Manu.

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. The big business lobby and top Republicans have been in lockstep for so many years. They were one of the biggest players, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce was, in the 2014 midterms, helped deliver the Senate majority for Republicans. But that fallout has been intensifying for years, reflecting both the more populous tone of the Republican Party under Donald Trump, and the more progressive views of some of the corporate members of the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, and the fact the U.S. chamber played -- didn't play a significant role in helping Republicans in the last go-rounds in the last congressional elections.

And particularly what irked both Kevin McCarthy, the House Republican leader, and Senate Republican Leader Mitch McConnell, was the endorsements of the U.S. Chamber of Commerce gave to a number of House Democratic members, including 23 Democratic freshmen in some of the most difficult races in the last cycle. Kevin McCarthy was furious at them.

And still that fallout is being felt today. My colleagues, Mike Warren, Alex Rogers and I were told in a closed door meeting in the House Small Business Committee members and a top lobbyists in the U.S. chamber earlier this year that there was serious criticism that was leveled towards the top lobbyists who was at that meeting, including from one Republican who barely won her House seat, Claudia Tenney from New York, earlier -- last year.

During this meeting that happened in February, she raised questions, concerns about why they decided to endorse her opponent over her. The chamber lobbyist who was there, we are told, heard the concerns, decided to take it back to their members because the Republicans -- the chamber leadership is recognizing that they have to do more to be in line with their longtime allies. They're still frustrated at the fallout of this relationship, Brianna.

KEILAR: And business, of course, got involved when it came to Georgia's voting law. How has that affected things? RAJU: It's only intensified the rift. You saw Mitch McConnell, the Republican leader in the Senate, raised serious concerns, warned of severe consequences of companies threatening to boycott Georgia, especially in the aftermath of the Major League Baseball moving its all-star game out of Atlanta, warning of more to come from the Republican head.

One thing the Republicans have told me on the Hill was that they wished that the U.S. Chamber of Commerce played a more aggressive role in communicating to its members to be in line essentially with the Republican position or at least not join the Democratic effort here. What we did see in the last week was the U.S. Chamber did come out against the Democrats' expansive bill to overhaul the elections. They say, Democrats argue that would bolster voting rights. Republicans say that it would overtake the elections at the federal level.

The U.S. Chamber did come out and opposed that Democratic bill, which is a top Democratic priority. The Republicans also are in line with the chamber and some other key issues that are moving through Capitol Hill, including Joe Biden's push to raise the corporate tax to pay for his massive infrastructure plan.

But still, Brianna, this rift is real. The two sides are assessing it. The Republicans -- the group also recommends that there's very serious possibility that Republicans could take back the majority particularly in the House in the next cycle. So they're working to repair things behind the scenes.

KEILAR: Yes. We just heard that. A former Republican congressman just told John that as well. Manu Raju, thank you so much.

RAJU: Thank you.

BERMAN: So, this weekend California Democratic Maxine Waters was asked what would happen if the jury in the Derek Chauvin trial does not deliver a guilty verdict. Her response --

[07:25:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MAXINE WATERS (D-CA): We've got to stay on the streets. And we've got to get more active. We've got to get more confrontational. We've got to make sure that they know we mean business.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Now, she didn't say what type of confrontation. Still, this is not the language that business owners in Minneapolis want to hear or the people calling for calm, including president or the family of George Floyd. All public schools in Minneapolis are going remote this week out of concern. They don't want physical confrontation.

House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy called it incitement of action and said he will take action against Waters if Speaker Nancy Pelosi does not. But this is how Republican Senator Ted Cruz chose to respond in a tweet. Democrats actively encouraging riots and violence, they want to tear us apart. That's Ted Cruz of the not accepting the election results before or after the insurrection bruises (ph), which might lead one to wonder if this is a case of the pot calling the kettle violent. To jog your memory, Donald Trump pot.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: Our country has had enough. We will not take it anymore, and that's what this is all about.

You'll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength and you have to be strong.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Mo Brooks pot.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MO BROOKS (R-AL): Today is the day American patriots start taking down names and kicking ass.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Rudy Giuliani pot.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUDY GIULIANI, ATTORNEY: If we're right, a lot of them will go to jail. So let's have trial by combat.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: So I don't recall the Republicans encouraging violence tweet from Ted Cruz after that. There wasn't one, or after we heard on January 2nd from this pot.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX): Just like the patriots gathered at Bunker Hill, just like the patriots gathered at Valley Forge, just like the patriots who forged this nation, the men and women gathered here and across the state of Georgia are fighting for the United States of America.

Because we defend our Constitution as we defend our freedom, and we will not go quietly into the night.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: No, they are tearing us apart, tale of woe from Cruz on Cruz.

Also, it's not like this guy is some peaceful prophet of gentility. This is the man who wants to do unspeakable things to books that say mean things about him, asking his supporters to vote on, quote, whether we machine gun John Boehner's book, take a chainsaw to it or burn the book to light cigars. Where does that rank on the, they are tearing us apart, meter?

Look, Maxine Waters needs to answer to Maxine Waters. She has said incendiary things in the past and this is a week when the nation is very much on edge, but Ted Cruz needs to look in the mirror, which can be tough, especially for him because you know what they say, when the going gets tough, the pot goes to Cancun.

KEILAR: What happened in Cancun?

BERMAN: Exactly.

KEILAR: Maybe a memory wipe or something. I don't know.

BERMAN: It did stay in Cancun. That was a problem for Ted Cruz on that.

KEILAR: Developing this morning, Kremlin critic Alexei Navalny transferred to a general hospital as international concern and condemnation grows about his condition. A Russian dissident who is in communication with Navalny's family is going to join us next.

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