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At This Hour

Obama Travels Overseas; U.S. Drones Attack al-Shabaab in Somalia; What Does North Korea Want From U.S.?; White Hot Rhetoric Between Russia and Ukraine

Aired September 02, 2014 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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JOHN BERMAN, CNN CO-ANCHOR: So many crises, so little time, @THIS HOUR, President Obama prepares for a crucial trip overseas. Can he reassure U.S. allies that the United States is ready, willing, and able to deal with Russia, not to mention ISIS?

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN CO-ANCHOR: Meanwhile, Washington wasting no time dealing with a different threat, U.S. drones are believed to have attacked al-Qaeda-linked terrorists in Somalia.

BERMAN: Then the FBI and Apple are investigating how celebrities' private, naked photos were hacked. Could you also end up a victim? We're going to look at how you can protect yourself.

Hello, everyone. Great to see you today. I'm John Berman.

PEREIRA: As opposed to yesterday? I always get you on that one.

Hi, I'm Michaela Pereira. Those stories and so much more ahead @THIS HOUR.

We begin with this. President Obama is getting set to head across the Atlantic and face a world of turmoil on the other side, from Russia's aggression in the Ukraine to the ISIS threat that could spill out beyond the borders of Syria and Iraq.

BERMAN: The president departs for Estonia this afternoon. He's going there to assure Russia's Baltic neighbors that they will not share Ukraine's fate.

This stop is coming ahead of a NATO summit in Wales, where the Ukraine crisis will likely top the agenda. NATO plans to create a new force designed to respond to threats in Europe within 48 hours.

Lots to talk about with our White House correspondent Michelle Kosinski. What message does the president want to send, and what actions do you think he wants to leave Europe having accomplished?

MICHELLE KOSINSKI, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Protection and reassurance, it's all about that, and it's strange. Less than a year ago, we were all talking about how NATO had sort of an identity crisis. There was a NATO summit in 2012 in Chicago, but do any of us really remember that or what was talked about?

How things have change with these two big threats looming, Russia and ISIS. So this added-on trip to Estonia, this is one of Russia's smaller neighbors, and one of those that is, you know, very worried for good reason.

The president is also going to meet with the leaders of Latvia and Lithuania at the same time.

So, as the White House put it, we want to reinforce the ironclad commitment to what is at the heart of the NATO treaty and that is defense, community defense, and boosting that.

We've been talking about this for months now, ever since the crisis in Russia and Ukraine started, but more than ever, it's taken on this added significance, especially since now there's talk creating this rapid-response military force.

PEREIRA: And it's not just that region that is pulling the attention of the president, also of NATO. I'm curious what the summit -- what the thought is of how the summit is going to address the ongoing threat of ISIS.

We recently heard from Prime Minister Cameron of Britain about what they are planning to do there. What about the NATO -- other NATO countries?

KOSINSKI: Yeah, it's also going to be a big topic. We know that there are going to be meetings about this. and both President Obama and the U.K.'s prime minister, David Cameron, expressed just in the last few days how this NATO summit will be important to kind of assess the effectiveness of the international response and look at what more can be done.

BERMAN: Michelle Kosinski at the White House for us, I really do think this trip is going to be one of those where every statement that the president makes, every word that he utters will be watched here and abroad as well.

Our thanks to you, Michelle.

So while NATO hammers out its response to the crisis in Ukraine, the United States military appears to have taken some decisive action against a totally different threat, this one in Africa.

In southern Somalia, U.S. drone strikes are believed to have targeted senior leaders of the Islamist group, al-Shabaab.

PEREIRA: Yeah, that terrorist organization is linked, affiliated to, al-Qaeda. It has launched attacks outside of Somalia.

We're going to bring in our global affairs correspondent, Elise Labott. She joins us from Washington.

And maybe you can us a little primer here on why Somalia, why now? ELISE LABOTT, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: It sounds a little bit

off, doesn't it, Michaela? If you look at some of the crises that Michelle was talking about, you have ISIS, you have President Putin. Why is the president focusing on Somalia?

And officials are kind of sensitive to that, saying that they can walk and chew gum at the same time. Al-Shabaab in Somalia poses a growing threat to U.S. interests in the entire region, and basically they had a target of opportunity and they went for it.

Let's take a listen to State Department spokesman Jen Psaki on "NEW DAY" this morning.

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JEN PSAKI, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESWOMAN: We need to take on threats where they are coming, and so, without confirming any details, I can assure you that we have multiple pots on the burner at the same time, in terms of protecting the American people and doing what's necessary to do that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LABOTT: Now that target of opportunity was a meeting of the leader of al-Shabaab, Ahmed Godane, and his top commanders. And so what officials are saying is, listen, we saw these types of targets of opportunity. They don't present themselves that often, and so we have to go for it.

And this something that they're looking at around the world. Listen, it wasn't so long ago that the U.S. was having drone strikes in Yemen, for instance, and that could be happening at any time too, Michaela.

BERMAN: Do we know at this time, Elise, if they hit what they were shooting at?

LABOTT: They don't know. They haven't even said really officially that this leader of al-Shabaab, Godane, was the target. And that's because we've been here before.

In January, the U.S. launched a series of drone strikes in Somalia. A leader of al-Shabaab's intelligence unit was killed, but Godane was not, and so officials at the Pentagon are saying they want to assess the results of the operations before they talk about any details.

But that's basically because they want to be sure, they want DNA evidence and such, that Godane might have been killed since he was clearly one of ones targeted.

PEREIRA: I think what you said is going to stick with me. They can walk and chew gum at the same time, multiple operations going on around the globe certainly needing their attention. Elise Labott, thanks so much.

And we'll obviously find out more about this. There will be a Pentagon briefing at 2:00 p.m. Eastern. You can watch it right here on CNN. We are just getting word from Saudi Arabia that 88 terror suspects

have been arrested. Authorities say those men were plotting attacks inside the country and abroad.

BERMAN: Yeah. The details coming out of this operation so far are chilling. According to the Saudi interior ministry, the suspects were on the verge of implementing their plot. They belong to 10 terror cells. They were mostly Saudi citizens, but they also included three Yemenis and one person who is still to be identified.

Now the Saudis say most of the men had been arrested in the past and that this nationwide security sweep was a result of months of surveillance.

We're going to get much more on this and stay on it. We'll bring the information when it comes in.

Ahead for us @THIS HOUR, North Korea sends a message to the United States, but what exactly is it? The pleas from Americans held there and the State Department's response, is the United States ready to negotiate with North Korea?

PEREIRA: It has happened again. Does it seem like we're always reporting on these stories, John? Another fight over leg room on a crowded plane. Why all the rage over the recline?

BERMAN: Who do you think is right in these instances?

PEREIRA: I have an answer.

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PEREIRA: Here's a question to ponder, what does North Korea want from the U.S.? That's what a lot of people are asking today after they saw CNN's interview with the three Americans that are detained there.

BERMAN: CNN's Will Ripley got five minutes to talk to each of the men in interviews that were arranged and really carefully managed by the North Korean regime. Some might suggest stage managed, based on some of the statements they made, the similar statements.

All three men did make remarkably similar statements saying they need help from the U.S. government and they need it now.

Listen to this.

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WILL RIPLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: What's the bottom line about your situation here and your message that you want to put out?

MATTHEW TODD MILLER, AMERICAN HELD IN NORTH KOREA: That my situation is very urgent, that very soon I'm going to trial, and I would directly be sent to prison.

I think this is -- this interview is my final chance to push the American government into helping me.

RIPLEY: So the bottom line, your message about your conditions here and your situation?

JEFFREY FOWLE, AMERICAN HELD IN NORTH KOREA: I'm good for the time being, but I need to let people know that I'm getting desperate. I'm getting desperate for help.

RIPLEY: What's the most important thing you to say in our final seconds?

KENNETH BAE, AMERICAN HELD IN NORTH KOREA: Well, I do need help from the U.S. government, and my health is failing, and that I've been sentenced -- since the last time that I transferred back to the hospital from the camp, I've lost over 15 pounds or more. And it's been very difficult to stay in camp right now.

So I do ask the U.S. government and people out there to really put effort to send somebody.

RIPLEY: OK.

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PEREIRA: The Obama administration says it is working to get these three men out. However, they're not sharing details or many details about what exactly that entails.

BERMAN: Earlier today, we heard from the State Department about the efforts they say they have made and the roadblocks they say they have hit. Listen.

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PSAKI: I'm not going to rule out options here, but I think it's important for people to understand that there have been a range of steps that we've taken. We've had an offer on the table to send Ambassador King to negotiate and discuss the release of these individuals. That trip has been canceled in the past.

We're going to do everything we can, but I think it's also important for people to understand we're not going to outline all of that publicly because our objective is to bring them home.

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PEREIRA: Joining us right now to talk about this all is Han Park. He is a professor of public and international affairs at the University of Georgia. Thank you for joining us.

I want to play for you a little more from the interview. This is the detained men, Professor, pleading for help from the U.S.

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BAE: I do believe that a special envoy need to come in order to resolve the situation that I am in right now.

MILLER: I've been requesting help for a long time, and there's been no movement from my government.

FOWLE: This is an opportunity for maybe Bill Clinton to come back and -- he secured the release of a couple of journalists a few years back. Maybe George Bush --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PEREIRA: Professor, what does it say to you that Pyongyang was even willing to allow access to these men for interviews, albeit controlled interviews?

HAN PARK, DIRECTOR, UGA CENTER FOR STUDY OF GLOBAL ISSUES: The message you saw, loud and clear. The United States is not responding to North Korean demands or wishes, and that is simply to have a dialogue and negotiations on the nuclear matter, and they like to have some talks with the United States. They are reaching out to the United States.

This is tangible evidence that they'd like to establish some sort of context and official relationship with the United States.

The curious problem there is South Korea. South and North Korea have always been what I call legitimacy war, and competition. We are on the side of South Korea; we simply cannot condone the North Korean political system the way it is. So it's up to Washington. If we cannot tolerate North Korea to maintain its form of government and governance, then the future of the relationship is quite bleak because North Korea doesn't have any room to maneuver. It has to survive and its economy is devastated and it would like to reach out to the west in addition to China and Russia. It has been doing that quite effectively in recent years.

So this is a very particularly difficult time for Washington to think broadly in terms of global strategy in American foreign policy and foreign policy objectives.

BERMAN: Professor, it seemed to me, we heard from the State Department -- Jen Psaki, a State Department spokesperson, she was saying we're not going to tell you everything that's going on right now between the United States and North Korea. The United States has reached out to North Korea specifically to deal with this issue of prisoners over there. What type of discussions do you think have been going on?

PARK: You know, as a private citizen, I don't know. But I have been working with North Korea for a number of years. I know the way they are thinking. Their mind is set, they like to see us, the United States, to take that -- take them as a legitimate state. Not just the South Korea, but North Korea as well, different but legitimate state. So that's what they want, and right now, what's going on, no one knows for sure.

But low-level contacts in New York, for example, is very much likely to be occurring, and there are some issues of U.S. government, denial of issuing visas to North Koreans. I think that issue is very easy to resolve. North Koreans are accepting American tourists and other forums, even CNN crew was accepted into North Korea. But we have not been able to reciprocate that because our attitude is so hostile toward North Korea. That's what North Korea wants us to think.

PEREIRA: Can I ask one quick final question for you? The U.S. government strongly discourages travel by U.S. citizens to this area of the world, and isolated nation to begin with. One might question the wisdom of going there in the first place?

PARK: I think going there is ill advised unless you know what you are running into. If you have any intention of propagating Christianity or trying to force them or invite them to change their system and leadership and challenge their political style and so forth, then it's out. Christianity is very -- they are wary about Christianity. Looking at Middle East and so forth, so all these three men are detained there on the suspicion that they have tried to propagate Christianity, to run over, so to speak, their system centered on the chin family.

BERMAN: Professor Han Park, thank you so much for being with us. We really appreciate your time and your expertise here.

Now if you out there want to learn more about Americans being held in North Korea, visit our Facebook page @THISHOUR. You can also check out CNN.com.

PEREIRA: Ahead @THISHOUR, the Ebola epidemic. It is worse than we thought. It is spiraling out of control. That's the warning from the man in charge of the centers for disease control and prevention. You are going to hear from him, Dr. Thomas Frieden and our own Dr. Sanjay Gupta.

BERMAN: Then celebrities hacked. Naked pictures plastered all over the internet. The FBI is investigating, so is Apple, looking into reports that iCloud was compromised.

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BERMAN: The rhetoric this morning white hot between Russia and Ukraine with both sides evoking language from World War II. Now President Obama faces new questions about how much the United States should get involved and how much the United States could achieve even with more involvement. Later this week, NATO leaders, including President Obama meet in Wales to discuss setting up a rapid response fighting force that could perhaps blunt this type of conflict in the future.

PEREIRA: Certainly things have been tough in Ukraine. A lot of territory this week has been lost to pro-Russian rebels, including this air field in Luhansk. Russian President Vladimir Putin continues to deny though sending troops and tanks over the border to help the rebels. Even though NATO says satellite images show them there.

Joining us, William Pomeranz; he is deputy director for the Kennan Institute for Advanced Russian Studies at the Woodrow Wilson Center. Thank you so much for joining us today.

WILLIAM POMERANZ, DEPUTY DIRECTOR, KENNAN INSTITUTE FOR ADVANCED RUSSIAN STUDIES: My pleasure.

PEREIRA: So how do you feel about this idea of an international coalition, a NATO fighting force? Do you think countries are going to be willing to commit their troops to this effort?

POMERANZ: Well I think they are talking about creating a rapid response force, but I think that's really being directed to the concerns of the Baltic states who also have large ethnic populations and are very concerned about how things are developing in Ukraine. So I think that the formation of this rapid response NATO force is really to address the concerns of the Baltic states and eastern Europe.

BERMAN: The Baltic statements want some kind of statement that says this not to happen here. Understandable why they might be so concerned given the geography of where they are located and their populations. What about the idea from the chairman of the Senate foreign relations committee, Bob Menendez, who now wants to provide offensive weapons to the Ukraine military? Do you think that would change the situation on the ground?

POMERANZ: I don't think that would change the situation on the ground. I think as soon as NATO or the United States makes an open statement of offensive weapons, then Russia will simply increase its involvement in Ukraine and will say it was provoked and forced to do so in light of the actions by the United States. So unless we want to really escalate this crisis rapidly to an all-out war between the United States and potentially Russia, I don't think we're about to go that step that quickly.

PEREIRA: We know the rebel leaders said this week they would support a sovereign Ukraine as long as they have autonomy for those who feel more culturally connected with Russia in eastern Ukraine. I'm curious what you make of that, and would Ukraine or Russia even stand for that? Would they be satisfied with such a solution?

POMERANZ: Well, I think both sides are trying to find a way by which certain elements of autonomy are transferred to eastern Ukraine, the question is how much autonomy. Ukraine is viable only if it remains a unified state. If it becomes decentralized and power is transferred to Luhansk and Donetsk, that allows them, for example, to make their own trade agreement and so forth, then it will cease being a viable independent country. So there's a real small crucial step in terms of how much sovereignty gets transferred to the regions and on what level of government it gets transferred.

BERMAN: I am curious sir, do you think the president has any latitude now to force action one way or the other in Ukraine or is he just a spectator along with the rest of Europe right now?

POMERANZ: I don't think the U.S. or the E.U. are spectators. They have introduced severe sanctions on Russia that are beginning to bite. Obviously sanctions by themselves are not the same as the military action. It's not military deterrence, but they are having an effect on Russia and I think Putin has to take that into account as he formulates his strategy. It won't stop him. It will make him consider, what are the consequences of his actions.

PEREIRA: So to circle back around then, the combination of these tougher sanctions, the combination of, as you said, this support for these Baltic states, do you think that could be enough?

POMERANZ: The decision will be made by Vladimir Putin and it will be made in terms of how he perceives Russia's strategic interests. The United States and the E.U. can show the consequences of those actions. It can continue to essentially say that the strategic relationship between the United States and Russia is over as was announced -- basically announced this weekend. But it cannot ultimately tell President Putin not to enter into eastern Ukraine. That is a decision that President Putin will make by himself.

BERMAN: Ball is in his court, but that might be a scary court for the rest of the world.

William Pomerantz, thanks so much for being with us. Appreciate your time.

POMERANZ: My pleasure

BERMAN: Ahead for us @THISHOUR, from Ukraine to ISIS to the Middle East, President Obama's foreign policy being tested over, and over, and over, and over. So is he passing or failing? Or is it at this point incomplete? We'll have that conversation next.

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