Return to Transcripts main page

At This Hour

Debris Could be from MH370; Is Trump Preparing for GOP Debates? Aired 11:30a-12p ET

Aired July 30, 2015 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

[11:33:00] CNN ANCHOR: Breaking news, just a few minutes ago, a major lead in one of history's biggest aviation mysteries. We just learned Boeing investigators believe, with a high degree of confidence, that a piece of debris found on an island comes from a Boeing 777. 777 is the model of the aircraft used on MH370, the flight that vanished without a trace in March of last year with 239 people on board.

CNN ANCHOR: Australian officials had said this morning that we could know within the next 24 to 48 hours if this debris actually belongs to MH370.

On Reunion Island, police there are urging locals to scour the shorelines for more debris. Obviously, everyone looking at this moment.

Our Rene Marsh is in Washington talking to your sources, Rene, who brought this information about this component number. What does this mean, this high level of confidence?

RENE MARSH, CNN AVIATION & GOVERNMENT REGULATION CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kate and John, you definitely get the sense that investigators' confidence is rising.

I want to just kind of set the full picture here. Yesterday a source close to the investigation told me that based on the photos that Boeing engineers had been looking at, based on the appearance and their knowledge of the unique elements and design of a Boeing 777's wing and components of the wing, their initial assess am was this appeared to be a part of a Boeing 777 wing. Fast forward today and the language is stronger. A source close to the investigation telling me, quote, that "Boeing engineers are now saying a component number corresponds to a 777 part." So that's much stronger language than we heard yesterday, but, of course, they want to be able to get up close and personal to this piece to see it with their own eyes. Of course, at this point they're just relying on photos.

Now, separately a parts broker who is familiar with 777 aircraft tells our CNN producer, Aaron Cooper, that markings on the debris in these photos appears to match markings for the right wing flaperon of a Boeing 777. So layman's terms, a flaperon essentially is a portion of the wing that helps the pilot control the aircraft, slow it down or speed it up. We do know based on this source speaking to our CNN producer, Aaron Cooper, that Boeing often stencils component numbers on this particular piece of the wing.

So we have two separate sources pretty much jiving together here, saying that that critical find today, this number that's appeared on this portion of the wing, is really providing even more tangible evidence that perhaps, perhaps this is, indeed, a piece of that Boeing 777.

[11:35:57] BERMAN: Rene Marsh for us.

It is passing the eye test, passing the photos. It has a number which corresponds to a component number on a Boeing 777, and also markings showing it could be a flaperon from one of the aircraft, the same aircraft that MH370 used. There's no other Boeing 777 that went down in the Indian Ocean so --

BOLDUAN: An important point right there.

BERMAN: -- connect the dots right there.

Rene, thank you so much.

Our continuing coverage of this breaking news coming up. We will speak to a pilot who has flown a 777, flies them right now, can tell us about a flaperon and tell us about this component number. This breaking news, Boeing officials very confident that piece of debris you're looking at comes from a 777.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BOLDUAN: Following breaking news AT THIS HOUR. We've just learned that Boeing officials are confident the plane debris found off of Reunion Island is from a Boeing 777. That is according to a source close to the investigation. They made this discovery by looking at a component number on the debris.

[11:40:03] BERMAN: Let's talk to CNN aviation analyst and Boeing 777 captain, Les Abend.

Les, thanks so much for being with us.

Explain to us exactly what a component number is, what it's for, and how they can be sure just by looking at that number that this is from a Boeing 777.

LES ABEND, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Well, my understanding of what a component number, it corresponds to that particular part of the airplane. Every part down to seat cushions to the visor in my cockpit has a part number. Boeing if they have assembled that particular part will associate that with the assembly folks and they will say, yes, that's good to go and this comes from a Boeing source, and they will say, all right, that part is going to go assemble it as such and such. This very part seems to have to be an indication that it is not only a part that was assembled, but a part that's part of a Boeing wing and, in this particular case, it's a flaperon.

BOLDUAN: Talk to us about that. We're all backing experts on a flaperon.

(LAUGHTER)

The word itself is kind of funny. What does it do? Take us there. What does it do and what could it mean here that it kind -- it look as if it appears largely intact in how it was found.

ABEND: Sure. Without getting too far into the weeds, it's a combination of two things. We've talked about that a little bit. Flaps is one part of the component which we use during the approach phase and landing phase, part of slowing the aircraft down. Alerons bank the airplane, which gives us the opportunity to turn the airplane. Combine those two together, you have the flaperon. It functions both as a flap and an aleron. We don't have any control over a flaperon. When we put down the flap, we set it to deploy at a certain angle. The flaperon will also deploy corresponding to the rest of the other flaps on the airplane to that particular angle. The flaperon is also used exclusively as an aleron in flight. If we want to bank the airplane, especially at high speed, that's the only component that banks the airplane. There is another aleron on the airplane which is longer than the flaperon that also banks the airplane but that's not used. It's locked out at high speed because it's much too sensitive.

BERMAN: If a plane, 777, had a catastrophic impact with the water, or it exploded in the sky, would you see this piece intact or does this indicate to you some kind of more controlled descent? By that, I mean perhaps a loss of fuel that people have been speculating where it sort of glides down like that?

ABEND: My gut feel -- we're preliminary, we're speculative at this point, but the fact that we have this large chunk would indicate to me that it did not fall apart in flight, OK? There was not an exPLOsion --

(CROSSTALK)

BOLDUAN: Do you think this needed to be deployed for it to be --

(CROSSTALK)

ABEND: No, it's a vulnerable part of the wing. It's a good question but it's a vulnerable part of the wing. It's attached by various rods and so on and so forth. It's exposed more than the rest of the wing itself. What it might have indicated, you know, and Dave Soucie has given some indication on it. If the airplane impacted on its own, it's possible that it impacted while it was in a turn process. So in this particular case it was on the right wing. If that was down, impacted and fell off, that would mean the airplane may have been banking to the left because that provides the lift.

BERMAN: This is information that we'll try to piece together once they confirm for sure it's from a 777 and for sure it's from MH370. Sources tell us Boeing investigators are very confident it's from a 77.

Les Abend, thank you for being with us.

BOLDUAN: Thanks, Les.

ABEND: Thank you.

BERMAN: We'll have more of our breaking news, including reactions from families of the people on board that flight. It is a very emotional time for some of these who have been holding onto hope. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:47:55] BOLDUAN: Continuing our breaking news coverage on the search for Malaysia Airlines flight 370. A source close to the investigation tells Rene Marsh that Boeing investigators have a high level of confidence that the debris, the piece found off the shore of Reunion Island, is from a Boeing 777. That's because of a component number found on that piece of a plane. Obviously, means a lot.

This is very emotional day then for the families of Malaysia flight 370.

Our Will Ripley is in Beijing.

Will, you have for a long time been speaking to the families and following kind of their journey for 16 months now. What do they say in light of this news?

WILL RIPLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kate, I remember when you and I were together in Kuala Lumpur and the emotional outbursts we saw at the press briefings because families felt they weren't getting enough information. They were desperate for information. As we followed those families from Kuala Lumpur here to Beijing where more than 150 passengers were on the plane, they continue to feel that desperation to this day. And in some ways, Kate, today is even harder for them. We're hearing this new news that the likelihood that the part is from Boeing 777 but people are hearing it on the ground here from the news, from the media. They're not getting any official information from the government. They're not getting any official information from Malaysia Airlines. Their support center that had been set up here has long been shut down. The hotline is no longer functional. Everything they're learning, they're learning essentially from us, the media, and they simply feel that's not acceptable and they're having to deal with this without the support, without the psychologists on stand by. So that desperation and that pain is just as raw as it was when we were in Kuala Lumpur -- Kate?

BERMAN: Tragically, consistent from what we have seen in the last 500 days in some cases. The frustration of families.

Will, stand by.

I want to bring Mary Schiavo, CNN aviation analyst and former NSTSB inspector general. Mary, we have a component part now. Sources tell CNN Boeing officials

believe a component part on the piece of debris absolutely does correspond to a Boeing 777. Is this progressing the way you would expect and how significant is that?

[11:50:12] MARY SCHIAVO, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: It is. Sadly, I have worked where the first thing you find is a piece that washes up. The significance of the part number, it's almost impossible to overstate it. It's part of the regulatory steam. The way we regulate what goes on with aircraft is the parts numbers. It's against the law for someone without Boeing approval or company approval, this company was a division of triumph. You can't use the part number unless you have approval, its inspected. In fact, it would be criminal. This is highly significant they have the part number and have identified it. There just aren't 777 flaperons on the black market. Not on this part. I checked the parts index to see if there is anything for sale out there, there is not. Boeing can confidently say it is their part.

BOLDUAN: Mary Schiavo for us.

Mary, thank you so much.

Will Ripley, thank you so much for coming to us from Beijing.

Much more on the breaking news we're following, on the search, the renewed search now for flight MH370. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BOLDUAN: Donald Trump has now hired the former political adviser for Sarah Palin to be his national political director. Michael Glassner is going to try to help his new boss build his lead in the current polls.

Take a look at the latest coming out. The latest from Quinnipiac shows that Trump has 20 percent support among Republican voters. That's the biggest percentage for a GOP candidate in any poll so far.

BERMAN: Trump is leading Scott Walker, Jeb Bush. A similar look in CNN's poll of polls, comes in at 19 percent. Bush and Walker really battling it out for second.

In a hypothetical match up with some Democrats, Trump trails Hillary Clinton by about a dozen. Bernie Sanders ahead of Donald Trump as well.

There's this issue for Donald Trump. He leads in negatives as well. 30 percent of Republicans say there is no way held support Donald Trump. Despite this, Trump will easily make the cut for the first debate.

BOLDUAN: The top-10 vote getters in a poll will face-off a week from today in Cleveland. Right now, this looks like the lineup, if it's based off this. You see Ohio Governor John Kasich could qualify, even though he didn't announce until last week. How should the GOP candidates be preparing for this big first debate?

One candidate's advisor tweeted, one of Kasich's advisor, "Imagine a NASCAR driver mentally preparing for the race, knowing that one of the drivers will be drunk. That's what preparing for this will be like."

I wonder who he is talking about. Don't you?

[11:55:24] Let's talk about this debate strategy and, if there is a debate strategy for some of these candidates, with Brett O'Donnell is a veteran debate coach who's worked with several presidential candidates over the years.

It's great to see you, Brett.

Right now, he is working with Senator Lindsey Graham, we should point out.

Great to see you.

Obviously, you are the man qualified to talk about this. What is the strategy going in when you have a 10-person debate? Is it to win or just not to lose?

BRETT O'DONNELL, POLITICAL DEBATE COACH: I think it's a little bit of both. The strategy, overall, is to make sure that your message cuts through and also to make sure that you have a moment in the debate where you capture the presses imagination so your message gets written about in a favorable way and at the top of the articles. You don't want to lose the election in the debate, that's for sure, but make sure your message does cut through.

BERMAN: The sound of music, they like to say, how do you solve a problem like Maria. If you are a candidate, how do you solve a problem like Donald Trump? Do you proactively go after him?

O'DONNELL: I don't think so. That's one of the interesting things about the actual two debates that will take place next week. I think the forum that takes place before may be the more substantive of the debates because you won't have Trump in that debate, so there can be a focus on issues. Candidates in that other debate need to make sure they don't spend time talking about Donald Trump, but their message.

The real people getting a pass in all of this are Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama. Candidates are, some of them, are forgetting who the main competition is. Voters are looking for their champion. They want to know who is best suited to take on Hillary Clinton, should she be the nominee.

BOLDUAN: Even though you may not want to take on Trump directly, you want the message to get out, do they need a Trump zinger or strong Trump one liner to ensure that, if Trump makes the headlines, you are part of it the next day?

O'DONNELL: I don't think you want to -- Trump is probably the king of zingers. I don't think you want to play on that ground. I think you would to be an effective counter-puncher with him. You want to make sure people see you as a serious candidate for president, that you are competent for the job. That's one of the reasons why people vote for a nominee or for their president. So, you know, I think it's important that you have affective counter punches, but demonstrate that you are prepared to be the president of the United States.

BERMAN: What about Donald Trump? What strategy should he take? In an interview with Dana Bash, he said, "I'm not really preparing." Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I'm sure you are brushing up on policy.

DONALD TRUMP, (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & CEO, TRUMP GROUP: I am, but I brush up all the time. I'm reading constantly I watch your show and others. I'm constantly brushing up. I mean, every time I turn on the television --

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: So no formal debate prep?

TRUMP: Well, I watched Mitt Romney where he locked himself into a cabinet for a week, and he came into that second and third debate, he couldn't speak. Something happened to him. It wasn't a good picture.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: A, Brett, do you believe him that he's not doing formal debate prep and, B, do you think he should be?

O'DONNELL: He's got a big ego, so that may be the case. He should be though. These aren't contestants on "The Apprentice." He doesn't get to fire them off a stage if he disagrees with them. So he's got to be prepared to handle them as an equal rather than a superior where he feels like he's in power over them.

BOLDUAN: He's in Scotland right now. Speaking to the media, he said, "I have no idea how I'm going to do. Maybe I'll do terribly, maybe I'll do great." Is that a pre-debate strategy in itself, trying to lower expectations?

O'DONNELL: Some candidates do try to lower expectations. Unfortunately, for him, he's raised all the expectations for the debate. He's made himself the center of attention. I think his attempts to say I'm not going to be very good are going to fall on deaf ears.

BERMAN: He said he's really smart, and really rich and really likable. Now he has to prove it on the stage.

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: Brett O'Donnell, always great to have your expertise here. You know this stuff really, really well. Thank you, sir. BOLDUAN: Thanks, Brett.

O'DONNELL: Thank you.

BOLDUAN: Thank you all for joining us AT THIS HOUR. A very busy day.

BERMAN: Again, breaking news on MH370, Boeing sources say officials believe the component number on the debris matches a 777.

"LEGAL VIEW" with Randi Kaye picks that up right now.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

[12:00:12] RANDI KAYE, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Randi Kaye, in for Ashleigh Banfield.