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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Grandfather of One of Schoolboys Shot in Washington Talks About the Tragedy; Upcoming Election; Does ISIS Have Anti-Aircraft Missiles?

Aired October 27, 2014 - 16:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Welcome back to THE LEAD.

In national news, a follow to our story from last Friday, a community already numb with shock and sadness was hit with even more devastating news in the last few hours. The news that another victim wounded in that school shooting in Washington state has died. She was Gia Soriano, a 14-year-old freshman at Marysville-Pilchuck High School. This would bring the number of dead in this tragedy to three, including student Zoe Galasso who died at the scene and the shooter who opened fire in the cafeteria Friday before taking his own life.

Now, there are still three other victims working hard in the hospital, 14-year-old Shaylee Chuckulnaskit, 15-year-old Andrew Fryberg, and 14- year-old Nate Hatch.

Right now, we'd like to welcome Don Hatch, Jr., Nate's grandfather.

First, sir, our thoughts and prayers are with you and your family. Can you tell us anything about Nate's condition? How is he doing? Did you see him today?

DON HATCH, JR., GRANDFATHER OF SHOOTING VICTIM NATE HATCH: I'd seen him this morning. I had a chance. And one thing what I try to do is go down and visit him before I left. And I start walking down the hallway and then, here he come around the corner walking with his nurse holding onto his arm.

It's really surprising the progress he had in the last few days. You know, just talking yesterday and then coming in there and walking down the hallway in the hospital. I couldn't believe it. There was just a lot of prayers and a lot of things that helped.

TAPPER: That's fantastic news that he's both walking and talking. So, he's communicating with you and your family. Is it writing largely or is it also talking?

HATCH: Well, it started out writing up until yesterday. Then he started talking. It's very important because he just wants to let people know that, you know, he's OK. He's getting better. But this idea that he's still wondering a lot of things.

TAPPER: What is he wondering? He's just wondering what motivated his cousin to do this? HATCH: Yes. That's one of the big things he's wondering, why, you

know? You know, why my brother? He don't call him cousin. He said, why my brother did something like this? He can't figure out it either. But those things that are coming more and more to life for him now and my grandson, he went down with me today and he went in the room and was talking to him -- to Nate. And he was telling him some things that happened.

But one of the things that I want to say, though, is he told my grandson who drove me down there today that the teacher was really a hero more than I think is being said. She did a lot -- intervened a lot at the end, towards the end.

TAPPER: Which teacher was that?

HATCH: He's really trying to do things in a -- the teacher that was there -- I don't know what her name is. I'd seen it many times on TV. But I can't remember. And she's really -- when they call her a hero, she's a heroes' hero.

TAPPER: Nate is tweeting from the hospital.

HATCH: I guess (INAUDIBLE)

TAPPER: And yesterday he wrote, I love you and I forgive you, Jaylen, rest in peace. I know that the shooter, Jaylen, his grandfather and you are cousins. You were all family. How is Jaylen's family doing?

HATCH: Well, they're struggling. There's a lot of questions and why. The biggest one is that there's a lot of accusations out there about the different things that happened, whether it was football, whether it was a girlfriend, whether it was a fight. And my feeling is right now -- because there are so many things happening, and I think - my feeling is that God knows what happened and I think we all ought to leave it alone and leave it there because I don't think we're really going to find out really totally what happened. So I wish that we'd all do the people in our community, as well as the media -- because sometimes we can create problems for our families and each other when we do this.

TAPPER: What is your grandson's long-term prognosis? It sounds like he's doing remarkably well. Do doctors think he'll be able to go back to school anytime soon?

HATCH: Well, that's one of the things that he's still out in a distance because he's going through an operation, going to have an operation this coming Thursday. But one thing the doctor told him, football is out now. You know, he can't play football anymore because all he has to do is get hit in the face and it could smash it all back up again after the repair that they're working on doing. So he can't do football anymore. I don't know if he can do wrestling. Because, you know, there is some tough things in wrestling, how they flop each other. So, we're praying that wrestling is OK. We don't know, though.

TAPPER: Don Hatch, we thank you for your time. We send prayers for your grandson's full recovery. Please stay in touch. We want to keep the American people appraised of how he's doing.

HATCH: Thank you.

TAPPER: We're going now to turn to our politics lead and the question on every Democrat's mind, will they get enough votes to hold onto the Senate. We have a brand new CNN/ORC poll just released this hour giving us a clue on how Election Day will go and that's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome back to "THE LEAD." I'm Jake Tapper. The politics "LEAD" now, you can tell that from the cool graphics and the jazzy music. Sweet sound of elections pulsing around the country. With midterms a scant eight days away, candidates looking for anything - everything that might give them even just a little bit of an advantage. Polls across the country show key race after key race within the margin of error. Races that will decide control of the U.S. Senate. In Colorado, Iowa, Kansas, Arkansas, North Carolina, all tightening. New CNN polls breaking right now reveal what is driving voters across the nation. Guess what? It's anger about the direction of the country, and the one man not up for reelection, President Obama. CNN chief national correspondent John King is standing by at the magic wall to give us a closer look at these numbers. John, what are these brand-new CNN polls saying about the mood as we head into the midterms?

JOHN KING, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Jake, let's dig deep and let's start with a number that will make some Democrats happy, but it's a bit misleading. In the generic ballot, we asked people, who are you planning to vote for when you vote for Congress - Democrat or Republican? It's a statistical tie. Democrats with a slight - that'll make Democrats happy, because everyone has been saying, right, there's a big Republican year but don't be misled by that. That's not a horrible number for the Democrats. But as we wait for the 2014 map to fill in, let me show you a 2012 map. These is the house districts across America. See all that red? That's where Republicans have a majority in the House, and so that's a national number. That doesn't necessarily mean Democrats will do so well here in red America, where you have a lot of these big Senate races, too: Montana, South Dakota, Colorado, et cetera. So, the terrain is still in Republican favor even though that's a relatively close number for the Democrat. Suggest there won't be a big swing, maybe on the House side.

One more number, you mentioned the anger. Look at this heading into election. The election is a week from tomorrow, right? 68 percent of the American people say they're very or somewhat angry. What is that? Some are happy with the economy, a lot of them are angry at the dysfunction in Washington. Congress doesn't get high approval ratings either here.

And here's another interesting number. 53 percent, Jake, saying they are very or somewhat scared. No question, we spent the last month talking about what - the ISIS terrorist threat, Americans beheaded overseas, now Ebola. So, Americans are scared, angry, a bit anxious heading into an election day. That's usually not good for the president's party. And incumbent in any party. That would make me a little nervous.

TAPPER: And John, again, just like in 20010, CNN polling shows there's a fairly large enthusiasm gap between Democratic voters and Republican voters.

KING: And that matters. Remember, Democrats are saying they are going to outhustle Republicans on the ground. They have an advantage with the ground operation flipped over from the Obama campaigns. But this is a lot to make up. We have in our brand new poll a ten-point intensity gap. 36 percent of Republicans say they are extremely or very enthusiastic about voting. Only 26 percent of Democrats. So, it takes a lot of hustle, Jake, to overcome a ten point gap. One historical footnote, though, this is not a 2010 Tea Party wave. Look how excited Republicans were then. They had a 20 point gap over the Democrats. So, a Republican advantage but not as much as we saw in that big 2010 midterm.

TAPPER: John, I never know how seriously to take the enthusiasm thing. A Republican pollster Neil Newhouse just wrote a whole thing about how his polls were wrong pulling for Mitt Romney in 2012, because he had thought Democratic unenthusiastic voters weren't going to turn out and they did turn out. They just weren't enthusiastic about it. What do you think that that's going to factor into this at all or because it's a midterm and they're not voting for Obama, they really won't turn out this time?

KING: That's a very key point you made right there. A presidential election at the top of the ballot generates interest and turnout even if people aren't necessarily that enthusiastic about it. So, the Democrats lose a bit there. I will tell you this, Jake. I saw this when I was traveling a week or so ago in Colorado and Kansas and Iowa. Democrats can see because of that intensity gap they're having to work even harder. When they go to knock on the door to try to turn people out, they say only one in ten people is answering the door. You can hear them inside, when you go - the TV is run, the cars are in the driveway. People are just discouraged. They don't want to vote. So, Democrats can see it's harder, they say they'll keep working and they say they can overcome it with all the technology and their lists. That we'll see. A week from tomorrow.

TAPPER: All right, John King, thank you so much. Before voters head to the polls, we'll have to endure one more week of nasty TV ads. And it's the candidates promising to fix things in Washington who are taking some of the most heat.

Plus, they've left a trail of carnage across the Middle East. Now what could be the gravest threat yet from ISIS? The terrorists just steal the weapons they need to blast a plane out of the sky?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome back to THE LEAD. Time now for our World Lead, the ongoing battle against the terrorists of ISIS, that battle hits a milestone today. The still young fight against the terrorists trying to enslave Iraq and Syria has now cost U.S. taxpayers more than $1 billion, according to the National Priorities Project, a watchdog group.

All that money has produced middling results, ISIS again today sending shrapnel slicing through Iraqi city streets, killing 15 Shia militia members just south of Baghdad. Now U.S. intelligence officials worrying one of their greatest fears may have already been realized.

ISIS in a video blasting an Iraqi helicopter out of the sky with anti- aircraft missiles. The group even published a murder by numbers guide on jihadist message boards to quote/unquote, "educate" its members in the science of killing coalition pilots.

CNN chief national security correspondent, Jim Sciutto, has more details. Jim, is it clear how ISIS got its hands on this heat-seeking anti-aircraft missiles?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, to be fair, U.S. officials won't publicly confirm that they have these missiles, but there are strong suspicions that they do and the suspicion is that they captured them from Iraqi forces or bought or captured them from other Syrian rebel groups or perhaps both.

Remember this is the reason that the administration cited for not arming Syrian rebels earlier. The fear is that advance weapons could get into the wrong hands. The fact is some U.S. allies did not share that hesitation.

And of course, the administration did not foresee the collapse of the Iraqi military as well, which allowed a whole arsenal of advanced weapons to get into ISIS hands and now the fear that advanced missiles in their hands as well.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO (voice-over): It's long been a security nightmare, terrorists capable of shooting down aircraft. New images posted by ISIS show it may already be a reality. Here an ISIS militant is shown firing at an Iraqi helicopter with a shoulder-fired missile identified by experts as a Chinese-made FN-6.

The next frame shows what ISIS claims was the result, the twisted wreckage of the downed chopper. With U.S. aircraft including Apache helicopters and AC-130 gunships now in action over Iraq, so-called man PADS or man portable air defense systems are a grave and growing concern.

JEN PSAKI, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESPERSON: There's clearly significant potential threat to aviation operating in Iraqi and Syrian airspace due to ongoing fighting, and of particular concern is our advanced conventional weapons like man PADS.

SCIUTTO: U.S. officials have not confirmed that ISIS has obtained the weapons, but there are fears they've captured from retreating Iraqi forces or bought them from other Syrian rebel groups.

Man PADS like the FN-6 can strike aircraft flying at altitudes up to 12,500 feet, making both Apaches and AC-130s vulnerable though not higher flying combat aircraft such as FA-18s or B1Bs or commercial aircraft at cruising altitude.

Man PADS are a threat however to civilian or military aircraft on takeoff and landing, a threat that has grown as ISIS forces have moved within several miles of Baghdad International Airport.

LT. GEN. MARK HERTLING, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: You've got to be within a couple of miles to take a good shot. So far, they haven't encroached that closely to the western side of the airport.

SCIUTTO: ISIS militants are now sharing missile know-how far and wide, even posting a manual on the internet on the best ways to down an Apache, including recommended techniques such as firing from elevated positions.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: U.S. commanders have been dealing with this threat going back virtually to the start of the insurgency in Iraq. There are steps that U.S. and allied pilots can take to reduce the risk including alternating their flight path.

There is also the new long bow Apache helicopter has the capability to follow -- it's called standoff, fire behind buildings or behind mountains further away from the threat, which reduces the threat to the pilots.

But you know, when I talked to the military, I've talked to intelligence officials this is clearly a concern for them because they are making clear that the pilots take these steps to reduce the threat.

TAPPER: Sure. And Jim, we have a new video today from ISIS showing one of the hostages, a British hostage.

SCIUTTO: That's right. Inside almost shooting a television piece, it looks like -- you know how strong their propaganda operation is. But standing inside Kobani saying that the allies say that ISIS is out of Kobani, in fact, here we are. We're still fighting and we're not going to give up here.

We've looked at the tape and it looks like it was shot about ten days ago. So allied forces and the Kurds have made advances since then. But you know, when you talk to the Pentagon, no one is under the impression that that fight is over. They are going to have to keep the pressure on to keep that ground away from ISIS.

TAPPER: All right, Jim Sciutto, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

When we come back, it's like 2010 all over again, at least at the pumps. Gas prices at a four-year low. Will they dip below $3 a gallon? That's our Money Lead. It's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome back to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper. The Money Lead now, it's not throwback Thursday yet. Those prices you're seeing at the pump, they're real. Gas prices plunging to a four-year low and in many places, they're under the $3 a gallon mark. So are they here to stay for a while?

CNN Money's Cristina Alesci joins us now. Cristina, what's causing this plunge in gas prices?

CRISTINA ALESCI, CNN MONEY CORRESPONDENT: Jake, it's incredible. As you alluded to, some areas, 17 states to be exact have oil -- actually gasoline at less than $3 a gallon. All of this is tied to the price of crude oil, which has been dropping.

Of course, that is a major component in the price of gasoline. Crude oil at $81 a barrel, that's the lowest level since 2011. And that is because there is an oversupply of crude oil. The U.S. keeps production up and typically when that happens, Saudi Arabia cuts back.

But we haven't seen Saudi Arabia cut back on oil production, hence, the oversupply. Also demand has been weak because global growth hasn't been as strong as it should be. So with those two simple supply-and-demand factors, the price at the pump has dropped significantly.

TAPPER: And Cristina, quickly if you could, could this have any unwanted side effects?

ALESCI: Well, the energy industry has been a good source of job growth here in the U.S. So from that standpoint, if the price falls below the cost of production, you could see some smaller producers cut back or close down altogether. That wouldn't be great for job growth domestically, but probably from an oil supply-and-demand standpoint, a little bit of a healthy correction.

TAPPER: All right, Cristina Alesci, thank you so much.

The most difficult problems our nation faces require some difficult decisions and political courage. Political courage often seems a quality in short supply here in Washington, D.C.

But next week's election is a chance to bring in potentially a new batch of folks willing to compromise, get things done, right? Well, not if the political ad makers have anything to do with it.

They're going after anyone who seems to work on bipartisan attempts to find common ground like the $17 trillion national debt or the annual deficit. Which brings us to our latest installment of our series, Why Won't Washington Work?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER (voice-over): More than $1 million is being spent right now in North Carolina to run this attack ad going after Democratic Senator Kay Hagan in one of the tightest races in the country.

ANNOUNCER: And Hagan is a big believer in a controversial plan that raises the retirement age -- TAPPER: The attack ad, one of many, is referring to a plan to balance

the budget put forward by a bipartisan group of politicians called Simpson/Bowles for its co-chairs, former Republican Senator Alan Simpson --

ALAN K. SIMPSON, CO-CHAIR, NATIONAL COMMISSION ON FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY AND REFORM: I come from cattle country. We're going to slay every sacred cow in the field.

TAPPER: And Democrat Erskine Bowles.

ERSKINE BOWLES: We have to tell the truth.

TAPPER: The commission made many tough recommendations to better balance the budget. There was something in it for everyone to hate. But that was kind of the idea.

SIMPSON: We will be accused of selling out, of tax stalking horses. It just goes with the territory.

TAPPER: The group was formed by President Obama, but he did not embrace its 2010 findings and former Bush White House operative and Fox News contributor, Karl Rove called him out on it.

KARL ROVE, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Could you imagine what we would look like today if after having appointing the Simpson/Bowles Commission that he had adopted its recommendations in 2010 and spent 2011 and 2012 putting our fiscal house in order, he would have had an easy reelection and his popularity would be sky high today.

TAPPER: So at least Rove thinks we need send folks to Washington to make the tough choices needed to balance the budget, right?

ROVE: The failure of the president to confront the skyrocketing debt and deficit is a big issue.

TAPPER: Well, actually you might find it surprising who's behind these ads running from North Carolina --

ANNOUNCER: We need real fiscal responsibility.

TAPPER: To Arkansas.

ANNOUNCER: Arkansas seniors depend on their benefits.

TAPPER: To California.

ANNOUNCER: Pass a sensible balanced budget.

TAPPER: That's right, Karl Rove and his group, Crossroads GPS.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For years, the Republicans have been arguing, we need to reform entitlement program and yet they are attacking Democrats who dare to talk about entitlement reform as though they're going to take away your goodies. That gets people angry. TAPPER: Asked about the contradiction, Rove declined comments. But a Crossroads GPS spokesman told CNN, quote, "It's laughable that Democrats who have demagogued entitlement reform for decades are now taking such great interest when they are held accountable on the issue.

In other words, Rove is going after Democrats for showing courage on balancing the budget after going after Obama for not showing courage. Another entry in our files of, "Why Won't Washington Work."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's going to get better when we get new, fresh faces in the politics, the younger generation won't put up with this nonsense.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: Incidentally, while Hagan once said that she is a big believer in the Simpson/Bowles Commission, she never endorsed raising the retirement age. When "Politico" asked Republican Senator Alan Simpson about Rove's attack ad, he said, this is why nothing gets done.

That's it for THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper. I turn you over to Wolf Blitzer. He is right next door in "THE SITUATION ROOM" -- Wolf.