Return to Transcripts main page

The Lead with Jake Tapper

Interview With Indiana Congressman Andre Carson; New England Patriots Caught Cheating?; Terror Hunt; Yemen on the Brink of Collapse; Deflate-Gate: Did Pats Cheat to Win?

Aired January 21, 2015 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Some disturbing, possibly even frightening new video in to CNN right now from al Qaeda in Yemen.

I'm Jake Tapper. This is THE LEAD.

Breaking news in our world lead: al Qaeda's branch in Yemen telling jihadis in the West, the U.S., France, Britain, Canada, don't waste your time coming to fight for us in Syria. Stay at home. Attack there.

Plus, the politics lead, Speaker John Boehner defiant. Last night, President Obama was all swagger, warning Congress he would veto any action meddling with the Iran nuclear talks. So, this morning, the speaker asks Israel's Benjamin Netanyahu to come talk to Congress, tell them what he thinks the U.S. should do.

Plus, the sports lead. They have already won Super Bowls, but now there is proof that the Patriots might have cheated again to get back to Super Sunday. Does this take the air out of the big game?

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

TAPPER: Good afternoon, everyone. Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.

We are going to begin with some breaking news in our world lead, al Qaeda in Yemen, known as AQAP, is telling its army of would-be terrorists, don't come to Syria, stay where you are, in the U.S., Britain, France, Canada and elsewhere, and plan attacks there.

In this new video, the al Qaeda terror branch that claimed responsibility for the Paris attacks says jihadists should follow the example of the Kouachi brothers and Amedy Coulibaly, who turned Paris inside out and killed 17 innocent people.

They say it is -- quote -- "better" to join in the -- quote -- "crusader campaign" in the West than to make the deadly pilgrimage to Syria and fight there, this as French officials warn CNN associates of the three terrorists are still out there.

These would-be terrorists have gone dark, they say. They could be in Syria, they could be scheming about when to return to Europe and strike again. Also today, the Paris prosecutor revealed four suspects have been charged, all of them allegedly connected to Amedy Coulibaly. That's the ISIS-aligned gunman who killed four innocents at that kosher grocery store.

Let's go right to CNN justice correspondent Pamela Brown, who is live in Paris.

Pamela, there has been progress in the investigation into the terrorist who attacked the kosher supermarket, less so in the probe into the Kouachi brothers who attacked the "Charlie Hebdo" offices. But now intelligence officials are telling you that some suspects disappeared off the grid, maybe even slipping into Syria. Tell us more.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: That's absolutely right, Jake.

Sources are telling us that it's believed several associates of the Kouachi brothers as well as Amedy Coulibaly are in hiding and out of reach of French authorities, possibly in Syria, this as we're learning more about the four suspects in custody here in Paris. According to the French prosecutor here, it's believed that one of the suspects sent nearly 400 text messages to Coulibaly in the days leading up to the attacks.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN (voice-over): Today, for the first time, the Paris prosecutor is identifying four suspects charged in connection with the Paris attacks whose DNA was allegedly found on Amedy Coulibaly's car, gun and glove found at the crime scene.

But the prosecutor says authorities are still investigating whether the four suspects were actually complicit in the attacks. He says, "We think that there's a group of individuals who contributed as part of an agreement and that this has effectively served the terrorists who commit the attack."

But it's the others who are still on the run, suspected cohorts of Amedy Coulibaly and the Kouachi brothers, that have authorities on edge. Sources tell CNN it's believed that terrorists urged around half-a-dozen of their associates to leave France just before the attacks, including Coulibaly's wife, Hayat Boumeddiene. A law enforcement source tells CNN the concern is they could all be hiding in the terrorist safe haven of Syria and soon try to attack the West.

Meanwhile, two weeks after the attacks, Paris remains under heightened security with soldiers and police guarding landmarks and Jewish sites.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seeing on CNN all the security, the Eiffel Tower and around the city, I never once felt threatened.

BROWN: Today, the French prime minister announced new details of suspected jihadis living in France. He says 3,000 people with jihadist ties need to be under surveillance. And the number of people linked to terror networks in Iraq and Syria has jumped 130 percent in just one year.

TOM FUENTES, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, they're talking they have 3,000 people they need to cover and you have the massive amount of resources it takes, people, vehicles, equipment, photography equipment, radio equipment, and extensive training, this is no small chore on their part.

BROWN: Another jihadi hotbed, Belgium. Tuesday night, Belgium police evacuated a neighborhood as they raided a home at the request of French authorities, part of the wider anti-terrorism operation, this as the manhunt continues for suspected Belgian ISIS operative Abdelhamid Abaaoud.

Authorities believe he was directing a plot from Greece that may have included attempts to murder Belgian police officers.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: And back here in France, the French prime minister announcing today almost half-a-billion dollars in emergency spending to track those thousands of jihadis believed to be living here in France -- Jake.

TAPPER: Pamela Brown live in Paris, thank you so much.

ISIS, of course, has been linked to two of those attacks in France and now two hostages being held captive by ISIS may have fewer than 33 hours left to live. The terrorist group says that Japan has until Friday to pay the ransom for the two hostages who were shown in a video posted online, or the hostages will be executed by the masked terrorist nicknamed Jihadi John or perhaps others like him.

Now, these developments as critics wonder if the U.S.-led aerial campaign against ISIS is working or if a new strategy may be needed.

CNN chief national security correspondent Jim Sciutto joins us now.

Jim, President Obama devoted much of what time he did spend talking about foreign policy, which was a minority of his speech, talking about ISIS. What did he have to say?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: He had a mixed messages, really, multiple messages.

One, he said, it is going to be a long war, but it's a war that the U.S. is going to win, but it's not going to be the same as the last Iraq war. He says we won't be dragged, in his words, into another ground war, that this one will be a true coalition. And he also asked Congress for new authorization, not the old authorization going back to 9/11 days, but a new congressional authorization to fight ISIS specifically.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO (voice-over): Three years after ending the Iraq war and five months after restarting military action there, President Obama used his State of the Union address to call on Congress for new authority to fight ISIS. BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Now, this effort will

take time. It will require focus. But we will succeed. And tonight, I call on this Congress to show the world that we are united in this mission by passing a resolution to authorize the use of force against ISIL.

SCIUTTO: Still, since the start of military action against ISIS in August, the president has already authorized a deployment of some 3,000 troops to Iraq, and U.S. warplanes have conducted more than 1,900 airstrikes.

The president's new call continues a delicate constitutional balancing act for the White House, simultaneously arguing the U.S. needs new authorization, while continuing to expand the war under the old one, dating back to the 9/11 attacks. Even Democrats in Congress are demanding quicker legislative action.

SEN. TIM KAINE (D), VIRGINIA: American servicemen have already lost their lives as part of Operation Inherent Resolve, this war against ISIL. If we are asking people to go out and risk their lives, it would seem that we could approach with seriousness and speed. So why everybody is slow-walking this thing is a mystery.

SCIUTTO: The call for new action comes even as administration officials are making great efforts not to overplay the immediate threat from ISIS to the U.S.

JOSEPH BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: There is no existential threat to the United States because of what is going on there, but there is a threat in the region. We are making progress.

SCIUTTO: Still, the ISIS threat is now engulfing another nation and ally, with the group demanding $200 million from Japan to spare the lives of two of its citizens. The deadline ISIS set expires Friday.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: To the prime minister of Japan, although you are more than 8,500 kilometers away from the Islamic State, you willingly have volunteered to take part in this crusade.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: One open question in any new authorization is how it will answer the question of ground troops. The Senate Foreign Relations Committee sent a draft a number of months ago. It had specific language saying no ground troops.

The White House said it wasn't quite happy with that language. That is going to be a real challenge for them. How do you allow some wiggle room, because as you and I have talked many times, U.S. troops there are in some form of combat, even if they are not officially ground troops.

TAPPER: Yes. Jim Sciutto, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

Let's bring in Democratic Congressman from Indiana Andre Carson. He was just named to the House Intelligence Committee. He also happens to be the first Muslim to sit on that committee.

Sir, thanks so much for being here. Congratulations on your new assignment.

You were briefed today by the intelligence community. What's the latest you can tell us on the European crackdown and this breaking al Qaeda video calling for people in the West to attack targets at home?

REP. ANDRE CARSON (D), INDIANA: Well, thank you for having me on your show.

As you know, I'm not allowed to discuss the details of that meeting. What I will say is that this latest threat adds another piece to the puzzle in terms of what we prioritize in our counterterrorism efforts. I worked in an intelligence fusion center a few years ago. I was a police officer.

And what is very clear is that we need an investment from our intelligence agencies and from our citizens to report information, report suspicious activities, so we can work together collectively in targeting and isolating these growing threats.

TAPPER: The president said last night -- quote -- "In Iraq and Syria, American leadership, including our military power, is stopping the advance of is."

Is that true? It looks like ISIS in recent weeks and months has amassed new territory, they have new hostages. They definitely seem to be confounding the West in their ability to attract recruits. How is the U.S. succeeding?

CARSON: Well, I think we are effective. I think the president is right on the mark.

The interesting thing about ISIS is -- or ISIL -- is that it's a hybrid organization. You have traditionally trained military personnel with textbook terrorists, if you will. And so our military -- what better military than U.S. military and our intelligence services to deal with this threat?

Were we not present in dealing with this threat from its inception, we wouldn't have had the success that we have, even though it's a growing threat, which calls for us to have greater participation from our friends in the Arab League and from some of our European countries?

TAPPER: Does the U.S. have enough good intelligence to effectively target ISIS leadership in Syria or Iraq, especially now that there are boots on the ground, so to speak?

CARSON: What I will say is this. And what I'm allowed to say is this. I think that the intelligence community is coming together in an effective way to eliminate this threat.

TAPPER: Former British Prime Minister Tony Blair told me last week that radical Islam needs to be confronted more head on, while some in the West want to blame people for being poor and for being alienated and not being assimilated, that it's the ideology of radical Islam that needs to be confronted more head on.

Do you agree?

CARSON: Well, I think it's evident that many of these groups, and particularly the groups' leadership, they are capitalizing on communities that are in poverty. They are capitalizing on disillusionment and discontent.

And so we have to push back and not let this have an Islamic face. There is a cancerous element within the Islamic community that has to be dealt with quite effectively.

TAPPER: Congressman Andre Carson, thank you so much for your time. We hope you will come back.

CARSON: Thank you, sir.

TAPPER: Another terror hotbed exploding in violence after Shiite rebels take over Yemen's presidential palace -- now new concerns that al Qaeda terrorists, the same ones who just told would-be terrorists to plot new attacks at home in the U.S. and U.K., could benefit from this political turmoil. And that's coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome back to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.

We have some more breaking news in our world lead. A breakthrough today in the tense standoff between government forces in Yemen and those Iran-backed Shiite rebels currently in control of the presidential palace and much of the surrounding area. U.S. officials are prepared to evacuate the U.S. embassy if the situation deteriorates further.

This is a critical situation for the U.S. because Yemen, a key U.S. ally in the region, is also a breeding ground for al Qaeda, the local affiliate, AQAP just released a new video calling for jihadists to wage war in the West, in the U.S. and France and Canada.

Al Qaeda in Yemen was behind the failed attempt to blow up a Delta Airlines flight headed for Detroit on Christmas Day 2009. They are also the ones who sent those printer cartridges packed with plastic explosives aboard two cargo planes bound for the U.S. in 2010 and, of course, they claimed responsibility for the massacre at "Charlie Hebdo" magazine that left 12 dead two weeks ago.

So, let's go right to CNN senior international correspondent Nick Paton Walsh. He's the only Western journalist in Yemen's capital Sana'a.

Nick, at this point, what do we know about this tentative agreement between the two sides?

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, both sides, we are hearing from some Houthi officials and the presidential administration, too, both sides seem to think it's going to work out but there's a lot of hurdles they still have to cross and a lengthy timetable here.

In essence, the deal says that the Houthis will remove themselves and their militia from the presidential palace, around the presidential residence, the hills overlooking them, and let normal life get back going here on a daily basis, and in exchange, the constitution, the new draft of it, will be edited and changed to give Houthis more representation, more power. They will most likely get key officials in key ministries too and they also will release the presidential chief of staff who they kidnapped over three days ago.

The question, Jake, really, we haven't got the answer to here, is does this leave President Hadi in power in some way or is he really a figurehead in a much more watered-down job where the Houthis really call the shots? And, effectively, this is a coup, except they have managed to quite nicely massage it so Hadi doesn't actually have to accept he's left power but the Houthis don't actually have to accept a quite complicated title of being president themselves in this complicated country, Jake.

TAPPER: So, the plan at least on the surface is for the Houthi rebels and Yemen's president to run the country together?

WALSH: Ostensibly, yes. Hadi will remain in that job but key parts of ministries, key jobs would have Houthi appointees in that. We would also see them able to rewrite the constitution under the supervision of the council and the government here as well. That could be very far-ranging. We don't know how far that will extend. As the minister of information pointed out on her Twitter account, this is a worrying precedent because frankly, what we have seen on the streets here are the Houthis exercising force, the power of the gun, taking over buildings, then getting their way politically.

So, it's always been the case to some degree in Yemen and other parts of this region, too, but I think the troubling thing here is this is dressed up like a political compromise and a great deal, but really is force has made the president give a lot of concessions. We just don't know if he still has the reins on power or just stole the job title -- Jake.

TAPPER: And, of course, the U.S. government has been working closely with Yemen's government to go after al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula which just ordered this video, just issued this video not long ago. Has all this chaos impacted that cooperative effort?

WALSH: Well, I think we can really clearly say that the Yemen institutions have suffered enormously. We don't quite know what the impact of the Houthis having more control in government will be, on their intelligence sharing with the West. Obviously, the administration shackled as it often is by lack of resources and the chaos inflicting the country in the past few months has been doing what it can, say many Western officials, to help them gather information, assist the drone targeting.

Yes, it's true many say that the Houthis are backed by Iran, so that explains how they have suddenly got themselves together in the past few months. Will that change their posture in the government here in helping the West? We're going to have to wait and see -- a key question for Washington, though -- Jake.

TAPPER: Nick Paton Walsh, reporting live from Yemen -- thanks and stay safe.

Terror unfolded aboard a Tel Aviv bus this morning when a Palestinian man from the West Bank began stabbing passengers and the driver. The suspect then got off the bus and was caught on surveillance cameras.

We want to warn you that the video we are about to show may be disturbing. You can see the attacker here running up behind a woman and savagely stabbing her in the back as people fled in terror. Nine people were injured in the attack, four seriously, we are told.

Police shot the assailant in the leg, they took him into custody. He is currently being interrogated at an Israeli hospital, officials say. Hamas officials praised the attack, calling it a daring and heroic act.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu fired back, saying quote, it is the direct result of the poisonous incitement being disseminated by the Palestinian Authority against the Jews and their state.

Coming up next, it's being called deflategate. Did the Patriots cheat their way to an AFC championship title? Quarterback Tom Brady once said he likes deflated footballs. Will those comments come back to haunt him?

Plus, the sounds heard on AirAsia's black boxes. Do they finally tell us what the pilots were up against in the last moments of Flight 8501?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome back to THE LEAD.

A weird story in our sports lead. One week before the biggest sporting event of the year in the United States, the New England Patriots are yet again defending themselves from charges of cheating. This time the team is being accused of using partially deflated footballs which may be easier to throw and to catch, to gain an edge in their blowout against the Colts last Sunday night.

ESPN reports that the NFL has determined that the Patriots did use footballs that simply did not have enough air in them.

So what now? With just over a week to go until the super bowl, is the NFL going to take any steps that will disrupt the biggest money-making game of the year?

Joining me now is CNN's sports analyst, Christine Brennan.

Christine, thanks so much for joining us.

Now, you'll hear that the argument -- you'll hear the argument out there that the Colts also benefited from these deflated footballs but that's probably not the case, you say. Why not? CHRISTINE BRENNAN, CNN SPORTS ANALYST: Well, what we don't -- there

is so much we don't know, Jake. There's way more we don't know than we do at this point. So, I don't know whether to kind of laugh out loud about this or to take it extremely seriously. And I think a lot of us are in that position.

But if the footballs were deflated slightly, and we are not talking about you and I running outside and throwing a football around in January in D.C. We are talking about millimeters that only a professional would know and understand. Did the Colts get the benefit of those footballs or as I believe it is, the footballs are changed and then the Colts get their own footballs and they get to use their own.

So, there are so many questions as you have alluded to. This is an ongoing story. My sense is we are not going to have a resolution to this story before the Super Bowl, which means it will stay with us until the Super Bowl.

TAPPER: But if this is true, 11 of 12 footballs that the Patriots provided for the game were deflated, then there's only one word for it, right? Cheating.

BRENNAN: Unless it's not cheating. And I'm not saying it is or it isn't. I have been doing some reporting, I think a lot of us have, because I'm trying to figure out what to make of this. I talked to two players I used to cover in Washington, Doug Williams and Darrell Green.

Darrell Green, a Hall of Famer, cornerback, spoke with him a couple hours ago. He kind of laughed it off. He said it would be like the tires in your car, when it gets cold, it deflates a little bit. He said that and he kind of said that this should not be a big deal. Same with Doug Williams.

Frankly, Jake, I'm having trouble finding anyone who has played the game at this level to take this seriously. I'm not saying they're not out there. But if you look on twitter, Matt Leinart saying forget about this, everyone does this, all quarterbacks doctor their footballs to the way they want them.

So, I think this is an ongoing story. As I said, I'm not laughing it off, but I don't know that I'm taking this seriously as other things because every player I have heard from or talked to is not taking it seriously.

TAPPER: Now, of course, the patriots do have a history. They have a record here. They have been in hot water before, accused of cheating before. That must have some sort of impact on how seriously the league is taking this.

BRENNAN: Absolutely. That is I think the key question. Spy-gate of course, 2007, a big fine for the Patriots, $250,000 fine, a first round draft pick, and for Bill Belichick, actually, a $500,000 fine.

So I do believe there could be fines here eventually in this, and because of Belichick's history, because of that, everyone kind of looks at this, has a knowing wink and a nod and here he goes again, that kind of idea.

So, I also think there is the big issue of the integrity of the league. Earlier this season as the season began, of course, we were met with one of the biggest stories we have ever covered, the Ray Rice incident, the elevator video -- everyone knows what happened from that point on.