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Alan Gross Freed And Back On U.S. Soil; Friends Of Alleged Rape Victim From "Rolling Stone" Article Believe She May Not Have Told True Story

Aired December 17, 2014 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Half past the hour. You are watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Big, big news today. Freed American Alan Gross thrilled to be back on U.S. soil looking forward to apparently a good scotch after spending five years in a Cuban prison. This is what we're hearing from folks who are close to him, a good scotch and a cigar. Gross' release is part of this landmark deal that will forever change Cuban/American relations. But of course, you have multiple politicians now slamming President Obama's landmark shift on Cuban relations saying it vindicates Cuba's human rights offenses. Here is Senator bob Menendez of New Jersey.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. ROBERT MENENDEZ (D), NEW JERSEY: I think the president's actions have created a challenge for us globally. There is no equivalence between an international aid worker and convicted spies who were found guilty of conspiracy to commit espionage against the United States. Trading Mr. Gross for three convicted criminals sets an extremely dangerous precedent.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: My next guest has personally appealed for Alan Gross' release for years and years. He has called U.S. sanctions on Cuba a "historic embarrassment." In fact, back in 1984, Reverend Jesse Jackson flew to Cuba, spent some time with Fidel Castro and returned to the U.S. with more than 20 Americans freed from Cuban prisons, and he joins me now.

Reverend Jackson, nice to see you. Welcome.

REV. JESSE JACKSON, CIVIL RIGHTS ACTIVIST: It's a big day, Brooke. It's a big day.

BALDWIN: It is a big day. I mean, I don't know if you have personally been able to have a minute to be in touch with Alan Gross or anyone in the family, but do we know how are they doing?

JACKSON: I've not talked to him yet. But you know, he is back on American soil, look found in state department debriefings now and Cubans are back home. But the bigger deal for us it seems to me is a family reunification. That's a big deal. Second, Cuba is just 90 miles from Florida. Peace and stability in

our hemisphere is a big deal. It means expansion of trade. Some of the communications and all baseball plays, if you will, baseball players, hotels, it has a lot of positive mutual beneficial economic arrangements.

And the reason way Mandela what this Cuba so quick is that as our ally in Angola, they stopped South African expansionism. But Cuban has more doctors in Liberia fighting Ebola than any other nation in the world today. There are some of the positive things that can happen from this relationship. We should seize upon them and what needs to be changed, let's change it.

BALDWIN: You know, President Obama himself mentioned the role in the fight against Ebola in Africa. But just pushing back on that, we just played the sound bite from senator Menendez saying that this sets a dangerous precedent and he's not the only one, you know, he sort of raising, you know, ringing these alarm bells. How do you respond to that?

JACKSON: You know, Mr. Reagan said we should have constructive engagement with South Africa. It was the most brutally human rights abusing in the world at that time. We kept pushing that for a new South Africa. The risk fears were never realized. We're allies with China in so many ways. They have a greater number of people in that same predicament, Brooke. But we find that isolation has not worked and a lot of improvement, it has made political leadership there stronger and choked the people. Now the people where they acts with agriculture goods and travel with family and education and athletics, they bring Cuban to the bigger world. It also expands our tentacles in our own universe.

BALDWIN: You know, in terms of this even the discussion, you have Cuba and U.S. who been talking apparently since, you know, for 17 or 18 months. The Canadians helped. The Pope apparently played a huge role. I mean, can you lift the curtain for me as best as you can, Reverend, and tell me how aware were you of these top secret talks?

JACKSON: Very much aware. We were in Cuba last year trying to get -- to see Alan Gross at that time, before out minister. You can tell something big was happening, but I didn't quite know what it was. While there, we negotiated three of (INAUDIBLE) hey, an American held in Colombia in the woods, in the forest at that time. And we got Kevin (INAUDIBLE) out. We didn't get Alan Gross out but we certainly tried. But there were many people trying to break the side (ph) to get Alan Gross free in the swap.

But if that is the breakthrough, Alan Gross deserves a medal for surviving and being home today. But now, 20 million of Cubans 90 miles from Florida, what it means in terms of family unification and trade and access and health care, why is Cuba the most influential country in South and Latin America? It exports the most doctors and teachers. It could be a great asset for America.

BALDWIN: You know we were, of course, watching the president. We took him live when he was speaking on this historic deal today at noon. At the same time, his equivalent in Cuba, Raul Castro, was talking and I thought it was interesting, he said "Obama deserves respect for this deal." I mean, did you think you would see a leader of Cuba use a word respect in describing a leader of this country.

JACKSON: Well, many years ago, maybe the mutual respect required a person which is to break the cycle of fear and go forward. But I am hoping that sacrifice him. When was to meet with Castro in 1984, I asked him on time why didn't he go to church? He said well, because we were fighting for the revolution. He said, well, and I grew up in the church trying to be a priest.

And I took feed the hungry and take care of the people seriously. Cuba is kind of outland for gangs such in Mafia and the likes. He got back in to the church who is defending the status quo. That was a big fight. He didn't bring him down, he said, but he didn't like it. So he asked me to go to the university with him. I did. And I said will you go to church with me? And he did. He went to church for the first time in 27 years. And he put a religion in his secretary at that time.

It was clear even then that breakthroughs were possible. But now, you're going to have more other than just being in there. You will have other networks are going into Cuba. To bring Cuba into our fold would be a big deal toward stability. I hope that Venezuela is next. We must secure freedom and peace in our hemisphere.

BALDWIN: You are the third person to come on this show and bring up Venezuela. We'll wait and see, Reverend Jackson. We'll wait and see. Thank you so much for joining me.

JACKSON: Well, Brooke --

BALDWIN: Yes. Go ahead.

JACKSON: Thank you.

No, my point is that Venezuela -- more oil than Saudi Arabia. It takes forward to get the tanker from Saudi Arabia and for the used in Venezuela. I mean, it's in our hemisphere. We have the diplomatic strength to bring peace in our own hemisphere. It's a good start for world peace.

BALDWIN: Thank you, sir.

JACKSON: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Now to this, another December and another day I sit in front of these cameras telling you about children taking their last breaths inside what is supposed to be the safest place in the world, their schools.

Last night parents went home without their children, 132 children. All those left, their empty pillows, holding the scents of sons and daughters. Their toys, their pajamas left behind. Because just hours before they put on their uniforms to go to school in the morning, just as they did each and every day, but this time will be the last time their parents gave them a kiss on the cheek, said good-bye because these monsters, these killers, decided to take their war to the most innocent among us, the ones who cannot nor should not ever have to fight back.

The gunman, Taliban militants ambushed the school armed with guns, armed with explosives and no intention of leaving anyone alive. All of this as children took math tests and others hid underneath benches until killers found them.

Students watched their teachers die before the terrorists pointed guns at them, shooting them pointblank. Outside of the school walls, you had the scene of horrified parents standing, waiting, listening to those gunshots from within, watching this terror unfold, wondering if their son or their daughter had hopefully survived. Parents and relatives running through those hospitals, and in some cases racing through the morgue looking for their children.

One father told the Associated Press, my son was in a uniform this morning. He's in a casket now. My son was my dream. My dream has been killed.

Another man tweeted this saying, the smallest coffins are the heaviest.

But in this, all of this pure evil, they are the survivors, the ones who found those hiding places, the ones who played dead and they join another survivor, Malala Yousafzai who took bullets from the same Taliban just for wanting to learn. She and the others prove that they will never, ever let terror win and that some dreams refuse to die.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MALALA YOUSAFZAI, ACTIVIST: We stand with those family and all those children who are injured right now and who are suffering through this big trauma. And now it is time that we unite and I call upon the international community, leaders in Pakistan, all political parties and everyone that we should stand up together and fight against terrorism. And we should make sure that every child gets safe and quality education.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: President Barack Obama and Raul Castro may not have been able to come to this political flash point without a little divine intervention. It appears that is what happened. The first Latin American Pope, Pope Francis, is credited with helping broker talks between these two countries.

CNN Vatican correspondent Delia Gallagher joins me now live and she is joined by the Vatican senior communication adviser Greg Burke.

Delia, take it away.

DELIA GALLAGHER, CNN VATICAN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Brooke. The Vatican is confirming tonight the Pope's role in helping to broker this agreement saying in particular that Pope Francis wrote letters to the two presidents and that the Vatican held high level talks here in October with delegations from the two countries.

As you mentioned, we have here Greg Burke who is the Vatican's senior communications adviser kind of agreeing to help shed some light on Vatican diplomacy and what went on behind the scenes. What was Pope Francis' role in this, Greg?

GREG BURKE, VATICAN SENIOR COMMUNICATIONS ADVISER: Well, Delia, Pope Francis essentially got the ball rolling. The Vatican has a long standing diplomatic core used to some very delicate negotiations. But Pope Francis, with that letter, and with the spirit I'd say, got it going. And Pope Francis is all about building bridges. It's what he calls the culture of encounter. I'm sure not everyone in the U.S. is happy with what's happened here. There's no doubt about that. We've already seen that. And yet he says it's always better to be talking than not talking and that's really what this was about.

GALLAGHER: And part of what's interesting about Pope Francis, I think, Greg, is that he surrounds himself with men who are very capable and hopefully women as well. He said himself.

But in particular, in this instance, perhaps the secretary of state (INAUDIBLE), we should mention, he might be one of the unsung (ph) heroes in this.

BURKE: Yes. It is interesting. And the Vatican state of his name, he is not even in there. But he is the main foreign minister actor for the pope, the secretary of state. And with ample experience in delicate diplomatic things both with China and with Vietnam in the past as deputy foreign minister and just the previous job he had before secretary of state was in Venezuela. Obviously, another very complicated place for the church, a very quiet worker but very typical of the Vatican diplomatic core, not out there looking for his name to be there but doing quiet work.

GALLAGHER: So we have a secretary of state who has experience in Latin America and we have a Latin American Pope. Do we expect in the future to see political emphasis in Latin America somewhat in the same way as John Paul II had it with the former soviet law?

BURKE: Eastern Europe. I don't think that's a done deal. Obviously, there's an affinity in terms of language. There is an affinity and that the Pope knows Latin America well. Cardinal Carolino is Latin American as well.

But -- so to a certain degree, yes, and to another degree, no. I mean, it's interesting here in this case relations between the church and Cuba have not always been great. But we always kept relations. Under Castro, things were really tough and even up until now they're very delicate. But we always kept the diplomatic relations going. And that has been a help that that dialogue has been there.

GALLAGHER: Thank you. Thanks very much. Brooke, I'll hand that back to you. With just this note that today is

Pope Francis' birthday. And so, one can imagine that perhaps seeing his efforts come to fruition in this way is a nice gift for him today. Back to you.

BALDWIN: Well, there you go. Happy birthday to the Pope. And as Ala Gross mentioned, it's also the first day of Hanukkah and he says it is the best first day of Hanukkah he's ever had.

Delia Gallagher in Rome tonight. Thank you so much.

Now to this story I know you know all about this, the big "Rolling Stone" piece on this alleged gang rape at the University of Virginia and how it really has been falling apart at the seams. Well now CNN has spoken to three friends of this alleged victim, Jackie, in this piece and what they told us was a stunning tale. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Absolutely stunning new details about the woman who made explosive charges of gang rape regarding a fraternity at the University of Virginia. CNN was on grounds, talked to three friends of this alleged victim from this "Rolling Stone" piece and they believe this young woman may not have told a true story. Here's Sarah Ganim.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SARAH GANIM, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The night that a brutal gang rape allegedly happened here at the UVA campus, the victim of the attack known as Jackie told her story in vivid detail to two friends, Ryan Duffin and Alex Stock.

RYAN DUFFIN, STUDENT, UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA: Her lips were quivering and she looked really frightened and looked like somebody who had just been through some really traumatic experience. I've never seen anybody look like that before. I really hope I never have to see anybody look like that again.

GANIM: The two friends who identified themselves from the "Rolling Stone" article say Jackie described the attack as they sat at a picnic table outside of a dorm. But they say the story she told that night was much different than the rape that "Rolling Stone" published.

ALEX STOCK, STUDENT, UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA: There are definitely some major holes in the story and I think that was pretty clear in the "Rolling Stone" piece, but you know, that it was almost too perfect of a story.

GANIM: To understand all the differences, you have to go back to the fall of 2012 to details that Ryan and Alex told CNN, details that never made it into "Rolling Stone".

Alex stock, Ryan Duffin and another freshman, Katherine Henley were all friends together with Jackie and all of them say that Jackie had a crush on Ryan. DUFFIN: I think it was really clear from the get go that she was much

more interested in me than I was in her.

GANIM: So Ryan was happy for Jackie when a few weeks into the semester she announced that a third year in her chemistry class asked her out on a date.

STOCK: Here's Jackie who is, you know, girl who -- and historically didn't get a whole lot of attention from guys, and you know, you've got, you know, this third year and she was very excited about that, obviously.

DUFFIN: She seemed really hesitant about it, so I don't remember whose idea it was to kind of, you know, just scope out this guy and see if he was OK.

GANIM: Jackie gave Ryan and Alex a phone number supposedly of that third year and they began texting the number. Jackie said his name was Haven Monahan. That name would come up again later.

DUFFIN: We texted him pretending to be some other girl who was interested in him in his chemistry class. Not saying it was the best plan, but it's what happened.

GANIM: These are the text messages purportedly from Haven. He says I really like her, describing Jackie as super smart, hot, into the same music as him.

Did you suspect at that time that this guy maybe didn't exist?

DUFFIN: No. At the time it all seemed very real.

GANIM: Jackie said she had a date with Haven on September 28, 2012. The night that "Rolling Stone" says Jackie was gang raped. Late that night Jackie called Ryan.

DUFFIN: She just said something bad had happened and could I come meet her in front of the dorm.

GANIM: Ryan and Alex met Jackie at the picnic table outside the first year dorms.

DUFFIN: It looked like she has been crying. She was shaking, really obviously just scared about something. She said that she was on the date and her date parked in front of his fraternity house. She said that her date said he was going to go up to his room to get something and asked her if she wanted to go in. And she said yes. She then said that when she went into the house and went up the stairs her date locked the door of the room once she got in there and she said that there were five other men in the room who then she was forced to perform oral sex on.

GANIM: But details from the "Rolling Stone" story don't match with the details from friends. In the article Jackie graphically described a brutal gang rape involving seven men instead of five and she doesn't mention oral sex. The article also describes her date as a man named Drew who she met

while working lifeguard shifts together at the university pool. But remember, back in 2012 her friends said she told them his name was Haven and they met in chemistry class.

The article also has other inconsistencies according to the two friends.

The article says that she was beaten, hit in the face, that she was barefoot, that she was bloodied and that her face was obviously beaten. Is that true?

DUFFIN: No. I didn't notice any sort of physical injuries. I didn't notice a lack of shoes. I didn't really notice anything that was consistent with the physical description that was in the article.

GANIM: Perhaps the biggest discrepancy of all was the reaction of the friends that Jackie portrayed for "Rolling Stone."

The article says the three friends launched into a heated discussion about the social price of reporting Jackie's rape, the article quote 'Cindy whose real name is Katherine Henley saying her reputation will be shot for the next four years and she's going to be the girl who cried rape and will never be allowed into any frat party again."

Katherine wasn't even part of this conversation.

STOCK: No.

GANIM: Katherine didn't want to appear on camera, but confirmed to CNN that she was not part of that conversation. Both Ryan and Alex told us they tried desperately to convince Jackie to call police, but she made the decision not to report what happened. The two friends say they slept on the floor of Jackie's room the next two nights to make sure she was OK. Five days later in one of the strangest twists to the story, Ryan received an email from Haven Monahan; the date who Jackie said orchestrated her gang rape.

DUFFIN: The email was called about you, it was from Haven Monahan, haven.monahan@yahoo.com and it looked like Haven had written, you should read this. I've really never read anything nicer in my life with a page-worth of, you know, just an essay that Jackie had written about me which seemed really weird to me even at the time because here's somebody who allegedly just, you know, led this brutal, sexual assault on a friend of mine and now he's just going to email me this thing about me?

GANIM: Jackie told her friends that Haven Monahan dropped out of school after her rape, but we've checked and no Haven Monahan ever attended the University of Virginia. In fact, we couldn't find a single Haven Monahan in the entire United States. The pictures of Haven that he texted Ryan we found photos matched a man with a different name who went to high school with Jackie in Stafford, Virginia.

STOCK: So there is a very good chance whoever I was texting was Jackie. There is a definite possibility.

GANIM: You heard that right. Jackie's freshman friends now believe there may never have been a man named Haven who took her on that date and who supposedly set up the brutal gang rape. Despite all of this, all three say they still believe it's possible that something very bad did happen to Jackie.

DUFFIN: I think it's very possible. Yes. I still think that it's extremely, extremely possible if only because the reaction that she had on that night seemed so strong and seemed so genuine that I still think it's difficult to believe that she would have been acting.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Quick eye check of this screen behind me. A lot of greens which is the great sign rebounding after a couple of nasty days, up 285 points here. Just in time for the bell to ring, 4:00 eastern.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thanks for being with me. "THE LEAD" with Jake Tapper starts now.