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Giuliani Explains Comments on President Obama; Women of Hollywood Steal the Oscars; U.S. Trains Soldiers to Fight Extremists

Aired February 23, 2015 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

After he doubled down, Rudy Giuliani is clarifying comments he made about Barack Obama not loving his country. In an op-ed for the "Wall Street Journal" titled "My Bluntness Overshadowed My Message," Giuliani says that he wasn't trying to question Obama's patriotism, but instead make the argument that critiquing America only serves to embolden our enemies.

Giuliani writes, quote, "Any reluctance to hold up America and its ideals in contrast to the nation's enemies weaken our message."

So does that mean Senator John McCain is in the doghouse, too? McCain told the nation he's ashamed of America's response to the crisis in Ukraine.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: I'm ashamed of my country, I'm ashamed of my president, and I'm ashamed of myself that I haven't done more to help these people. It is really, really heartbreaking.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Perhaps the answer lies somewhere in the middle. Loving your country and acknowledging that sometimes it can be wrong.

In an op-ed published today, Charles Blow writes about American exceptionalism. In the "New York Times" Blow writes, quote, "You can simultaneously love and be disappointed in the object of your love, wanting it to be better than it is. In fact, that is a measure of love, honest critique is a pillar of patriotism."

So let's talk about that. I want to bring in CNN political commentator and author of the op-ed I just read, Charles Blow -- actually Charles will be with us in a second. But Reihan Salam is here. He's also a CNN political commentator and executive editor of the "National Review."

Thank you so much. And while we await Charles, let's just talk about American exceptionalism.

Is Charles right? Is maligning your country a pillar of patriotism? REIHAN SALAM, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, look, maligning your

country isn't necessarily a pillar of patriotism. But what we saw John McCain do just there a moment ago speaks to the fact that there is more than one tendency to patriotism, right? One tendency is what -- you know, John McCain wasn't just criticizing his country in the abstract, he was criticizing his government, his president and himself.

He was suggesting that the United States ought to have done more and in saying that he's also implicitly saying that America is in a very powerful country that has enormous responsibilities and as such ought to live up to them.

COSTELLO: So how is that different from what President Obama has been saying?

SALAM: Well, it depends. Right? I mean, I think that what you could also say is that, you know, Giuliani was talking about how we were raised in a different way, and I think what he was saying is that there are different sensibilities in terms of how we're raised to think about the country. So one tendency is to think America is a country that has fallen short a lot and the work of progress is a work of living up to ideals that we have failed to live up to.

Whereas another view is a more straightforward patriotism or nationalism that in fact we are uniquely great and that we ought to celebrate that greatness, and to not celebrate that greatness is to undermine our essence. So in that regard, it's not about right or left. John McCain is saying, hey, let's be constructive, let's criticize when necessary.

COSTELLO: Now wait a minute, you said --

SALAM: But that's coming from the right, rather than from the left.

COSTELLO: You said it -- I know, you said it's not right or left.

SALAM: Right.

COSTELLO: But in my mind, American exceptionalism has become a partisan thing and Democrats supposedly don't love their country but Republicans do. Hasn't it become that?

SALAM: I actually don't think that there are many conservatives even who would believe that. I think that some people want to, you know, create that narrative that the right is accusing the left of not being patriotic enough and vice-versa. But I think that in fact these are different senses of what our country is and ought to be.

In 1970, 4.7 percent of Americans were foreign born, now it's 13 percent. That's a pretty dramatic change. There are a lot of census in which people of an older generation really were living in a different country than the country we have now. So, you know, of course there's going to be nostalgia, of course there's going to be anxiety and concern about how the country has changed. And has it changed in every respect in a good way? Well, some people on the left will say that, you know, the economy of

the '50s was better than the economy of today. Some people on the right will say the culture of the '50s was better than the culture of today. See what I mean?

There are things that right and left are going to be questioning about the way the country has changed.

COSTELLO: OK. So Charles Blow is getting miked up.

And Charles, I'm glad that you made it because I loved your op-ed actually. And I also love what you just said, Reihan, I do.

(LAUGHTER)

Are you ready?

CHARLES BLOW, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: My god.

COSTELLO: OK. I'm going to run this by you, part of your op-ed.

BLOW: Yes.

COSTELLO: OK. Because I loved how you put it.

BLOW: Thank you.

COSTELLO: He says, "Conservatism is rooted in preservation. Progressivism advances alteration. These are different love languages. These languages turn on your view of change itself. When you think of America, do you see a country struggling to be maintained or one striving to be made better?"

So expound on that because I like that line of thinking.

BLOW: Well, I just think that there are different ways of loving the country depending on how you see this country. Right? If you see it -- if you see it as a living, breathing thing that is always changing and that it is not necessarily completely rooted in its founding documents but it's in -- it's part of who we are and we are remaking it and making it anew every day that we are part of this country, that is a different way of loving it.

And that -- and when you love it in that way, you can look at it and say, I love it completely. But it is not perfect. And I want to try to make it better. And the changes that I would like to see in the country, I believe, would make it better.

COSTELLO: Well, I think what Rudy Giuliani is saying, OK, he may or may not agree with that, but I think he's saying, just don't go to other countries and say that because they don't need to hear that.

BLOW: Well, I mean, well -- there are a lot of things that Rudy Giuliani has said since his first statement. Went on FOX and said a few more things, he wrote an op-ed, says something different than what he said on -- even on FOX. That's his own branding thing. However, I think that you can say what the president has been saying, which is that my story is only possible in this country, which he says all the time. That this is an amazing place to be.

And yet we are not perfect people but we can be better than we are today. And I don't think that's a bad -- I think when we start to say that, you know, kind of jinglistic blindness is the only way to be patriotic, that's an actually dangerous thing to say because you need realism, you need to be able to acknowledge your flaws in addition to lauding your accomplishments. And if you can't do both of those things, that's actually dangerous for us.

COSTELLO: So do you agree with that? And is that what Rudy Giuliani is doing?

SALAM: Well, just as, you know, I can't read Barack Obama's mind, I can't read Rudy Giuliani's mind either. I think that what Charles has just said largely echoes what I've said before which is that on the right and left there are tendencies that are, you know, both critical and also respectful of American traditions. And so I think that, you know, trying to make this a partisan matter is generally a mistake.

COSTELLO: Thanks. I appreciate it.

(LAUGHTER)

SALAM: My god, I was going to say.

COSTELLO: I know it's terrible. Reihan Salam, I appreciate it.

I'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: The Oscars, yes, a little seen movie about Hollywood wants so congrats "Birdman." But the women of Hollywood, they stole the show. It started on the red carpet thanks to the "Ask Her More" campaign as in ask these smart successful women what they're wearing but then ask of a meaning question, too.

Actors took to Twitter to force the issue. Lena Dunham on Twitter, tweeting, "Asked her about the cause that she supports, not her support garments." Shonda Rhines tweeted, stop asking questions about what they wear to cover the containers they carry their brains around him."

It worked. Listen to Laura Dern.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who's designed your dress tonight?

LAURA DERN, BEST SUPPORTING ACTRESS NOMINEE: Alberta Ferretti. And jewels by Bulgari. And I have the privilege of wearing this ring that they made in honor of Cheryl Strayed's mother, Bobbi, who I played in the film because she died of lung cancer and turquoise is the color of the American Lung Associations Initiative Lung force to raise awareness about women fighting lung cancer.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: On stage, Oscar winner Patricia Arquette pushed the envelope.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PATRICIA ARQUETTE, WINNER, BEST SUPPORTING ACTRESS, "BOYHOOD": We have fought for everybody else's equal rights. It's our time to have wage equality once and for all and equal rights for women in the United States of America.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(LAUGHTER)

COSTELLO: As you can see, Meryl Streep and Jennifer Lopez certainly approved. And why not? As so many proved, women in Hollywood are paid far less than men.

So let's talk about this with Nischelle Turner and Stephanie Elam.

Welcome to both of you.

NISCHELLE TURNER, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.

(CROSSTALK)

COSTELLO: Good morning.

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol.

COSTELLO: I know.

Stephanie, I want to start with you. Did you feel a little extra woman power in the room last night?

(LAUGHTER)

ELAM: There was a lot of talk about the woman power. You know, when you listen to Patricia Arquette, interviewed her before the Golden Globes, before she won that night, I did not talk to her last night but I got the impression that she's someone who speaks her mind. Was she feeling --

TURNER: Well, she's from a family of activists.

ELAM: That's true. She speaks her mind about what she's saying. And what she's saying about Hollywood is not something that is only a Hollywood problem. This is something that we see across all industries. And at the end of the day, Hollywood is an industry, it is a business. And this is the same sort of situation playing out here.

That's the one thing that you can take away from this is that, just because they're all beautiful and dolled up they're not removed from this conversation.

TURNER: And I would also have to say, Carol, you know, you mentioned #askhermore. I think I would add the #wealreadydo. Because yes, that is an issue, don't just ask women about what they're wearing. But I -- you know, I think we, a lot of times on the red carpets, do have thoughtful conversations. So I appreciate the effort. But I really think that we should give ourselves a little bit of credit here, too, because we don't just ask about the fashion, although if we're being honest, what do we watch for -- Carol?

COSTELLO: I know.

TURNER: Watch for who's wearing what. Come on.

COSTELLO: I know. I'm guilty of it, too, I am. I am.

TURNER: Exactly. I am, too.

COSTELLO: But what (INAUDIBLE), he went too far for me, though, right?

TURNER: Yes.

ELAM: Yes.

COSTELLO: That was stupid.

TURNER: You and me both. I'm with you on that one.

COSTELLO: So, Nischelle, let me ask you about this because Arquette's comments from the stage are getting rave reviews, right? But her comments backstage are somewhat under fire. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARQUETTE: So the truth is, even though we sort of feel like we have equal rights in America, right under the surface, there are huge issues that are at play that really do affect women and it's time for all the women in America and all the men that love women and all the gay people and all the people of color that we've all fought for to fight for us now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: So some thought those comments were not inclusive. One woman pointed out fighting against one injustice does not exclude blindness to others.

So, Nischelle, did Arquette's message about wage equality get muddied by comments backstage?

TURNER: You know, sometimes, yes. But let me just say this. Patricia Arquette is one of the most inclusive people in Hollywood that you can meet. I mean, like you I was just talking about, she comes from a family of activists. She has a transgender sister. She's been fighting for different types of equality her whole life. Her father did it, her mother did it, her sisters, her brothers do it, she does it.

So I don't think that painting her as trying to exclude one group over another is the right way to go. She may have fumbled her words a little bit but that lady's heart is always in the right place and has always been in the right place. So I don't really subscribe to the backlash she's getting from that. Because I don't think she meant to say, hey, we've been doing this for you, now do this for us because you haven't been fighting for us. I think that her words got a little bit lost in translation.

COSTELLO: Yes. You know, she's in the heat of the moment. Right?

(CROSSTALK)

TURNER: Yes.

ELAM: I do -- I do think it's not one of those discussions that's as clear cut and dry as it has been portrayed.

TURNER: Right. Exactly.

COSTELLO: OK, so, Stephanie, do you think that this will invoke change in Hollywood? I mean, are studio bosses listening when it comes to wages?

ELAM: I think it's one of those things where someone has to start talking about it out loud before those -- anything that happens. But it's like the Titanic, all right? I mean, that's a bad example, but it's like a big ship in the ocean that changing direction takes a long time but you at least have to acknowledge it.

TURNER: But you mentioned it as a business. And, Carol, remember what we heard Amy Pascal say just last week when we heard her make these comments for the first time since leaving Sony. She said, this is a business. I pay people what they demand. So women need to stop taking less money and start demanding more money.

(CROSSTALK)

ELAM: That's all history.

TURNER: And so I think -- I think is, but I think it's going to be a gradual change. But yes, you know, maybe we can take a little more onus on ourselves and say because a lot of times we don't like to talk about money or we think maybe we're being too pushy and start standing up saying, you know what, we do deserve the same, you know, amount of money as you, we're not going to do this until we're paid the same amount.

ELAM: And men do that. They do that across the board in other industries to go back to my business correspondence days when I was at CNN before. Men do that across the board, women don't, we will doubt ourselves and therefore we undersell ourselves even though we may be just as capable or better talented for that position. So it's about I own it.

(CROSSTALK)

COSTELLO: I think -- I think --

TURNER: But I love --

COSTELLO: I think one of the reasons women -- I do, too. One of the reasons I think women do that is because, you know, we feel this incredible responsibility to support our families, right? We're not really willing to walk away because we don't want to risk that. And I think that's always a factor in women's lives that has to be recognized.

TURNER: Yes. We're the caretakers definitely in all aspects and we feel like we need to take care of this situation, mother this situation, hold this other situation down and do all of it while still working to do it and everything. So you're right about that.

ELAM: Nurturing and all that.

TURNER: But I think your point of, will this resonate? I mean, we have just spent the last few minutes really talking about and debating this. And I think that's one of the things that we saw last night. I thought it was an Academy Awards with a message, Carol, in many different ways.

ELAM: Several ways.

TURNER: And I thought that was really neat to see because we haven't seen something like that in a while, and the morning after instead of talking solely about fashion we're talking about issues.

(CROSSTALK)

ELAM: And those were also some of the best moments from the show were those that had meaning and heart and feeling about something that mean something to the people who we're speaking.

TURNER: Hallelujah, grant more.

COSTELLO: Amen, my sisters. That's right. Exactly.

We're going to get into that in the next hour of NEWSROOM.

(LAUGHTER)

Nischelle Turner, Stephanie Elam, always a pleasure. I'll be right back.

TURNER: All right, Carol.

ELAM: Thank you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Checking on other top stories for you at 51 minutes past. Weather doing a number on travelers across the United States today.

Look at this video from Las Vegas. Snowflakes in sin city. FlightAware.com reports more than 1500 flights have been canceled today mostly because of the storm. People at the Dallas-Ft. Worth Airport have it the worst where already more than 500 flights have been grounded.

Let's head to the weather center and check in with Chad Myers.

Chad, only one more month until what? I don't know, kind of spring?

(LAUGHTER)

CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: I'm done. I'm really --

COSTELLO: I am, too.

MYERS: Key West -- the National Weather Service out of Key West today followed me on Twitter. And I'm thinking like, that's just piling on. You know? Just rub it in that it's going to be 78 degrees down there. Even an ice storm possible for Atlanta. Small one tonight. More snow possible on Wednesday night and this is very cold air. It's not too bad in New York today. But it gets much colder, 20 to 30 degrees below normal. Windchill factors 25 degrees below normal. Windchill advisories everywhere.

When I saw this map this morning, all I said was wow. I mean, Chicago, it feels like 19 below. And it doesn't feel that cold in the northeast. It feels like seven in New York. But that's going to be a gift compared to tomorrow because it's going to feel like five below. The cold air that's here goes to the east. It's going to be cold, and just connected in Albany and all the way down to D.C. Windchills below zero. The pets don't like it, make sure they're not out very long and the kids probably want to go play in it but please make sure that they warm up a little bit, too.

COSTELLO: yes.

MYERS: It is very cold.

COSTELLO: You know, the worst of it. I was -- I was in Boston over the weekend and there was these huge giant icicles on buildings and it was warmer yesterday. It was above freezing. So everything was melting. Huge puddles of water in the street and now it's going to be frigidly cold so there's going to be literally lake -- iced over lakes on the streets.

MYERS: Yes.

COSTELLO: It's just terrible.

MYERS: And that's going to happen until that snow goes away. That snow is going to melt during the day in the sunshine and then refreeze at night. Every single night.

COSTELLO: Yes. So be very careful. Chad Myers, thank you, I think.

MYERS: You bet.

(LAUGHTER)

COSTELLO: The hearing for the Las Vegas teenager accused of killing a mother in the so-called road rage case is headed to court next hour. The 19-year-old faces a growing number of charges including murder. A manhunt continues for another suspect tied to the deadly shootout.

A Georgia sheriff and deputy were shot and injured in a deadly domestic violence call over the weekend. According to officials, the two found a woman dead in the garage of a residents and were, quote, "ambushed" when they went inside to find the suspect. The shooter, a former cop himself, allegedly fled and was later found dead along with another man. Police gave no details about that second man.

Frightening surveillance footage from South Korea captures two people falling into a sinkhole. Watch this. The sidewalk just suddenly collapsed right under their feet. They fell nearly 10 feet but only suffered minor injuries. Wow.

U.S. special forces are building relationships in Boko Haram's backyard. In a remote camp in the country of Chad, elite forces are training African soldiers to fight Boko Haram and other violent extremists groups. This as attacks expand near their borders.

Arwa Damon has more for you.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Off a remote air strip in the middle of Chad's austere landscape, some of the world's most elite soldiers have come together. We're with America's secretive special forces. The ground rules, no identification, no on-camera interviews and no combat technique specifics.

Here the Chadians drill on how to respond to a vehicle ambush. Their commander, Captain Zakaria Mada (ph) tells us, "If you have this kind of training, you can defend yourself from death."

This is exercise (INAUDIBLE). 28 nations in all. American and Europeans training with African elite units to respond to a growing threat from terrorist groups.

Nigerian Navy special forces who have lost men to the fight against Boko Haram instructed by the Brits on how to extract a wounded soldier while under fire.

(On camera): The countries that make up the Lake Chad Basin have been heavily criticized for their slow response to the threat posed by Boko Haram. As one U.S. special forces operator out it, Boko Haram was allowed to fester. So as important as the tactics learned here are, what is equally if not more significant is that this exercise will strengthen the newly formed coalition.

(Voice-over): A regional coalition at war with Boko Haram to the west surrounded by even more threats. From here, al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb operates in the northwest. ISIS to the east.

Dangers Europe already faces among Flintlock's training partners, Belgium. A country that recently had its own sense of security shattered by extremist violence.

PIERRE, BELGIUM SPECIAL FORCES OPERATOR: And everyone is trying to do their part because there's no -- there's not really a sense of national security anymore where it's more of a risk society in a sense where what happens far away is eventually our concern.

DAMON: It is all of Europe and America's concern. A U.S. special forces operator telling us, quote, "We need to build relationships in Africa and you can't do that if you aren't on the ground."

Arwa Damon, CNN, Mao, Chad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: The United States has a list of 59 designated terror groups. Five of them making headlines this month so far. Al-Shabaab, al Qaeda, Boko Haram, ISIS and the Taliban.

The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM after a break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

A new threat against western shopping malls. The group behind an attack at a Kenyan mall calling for similar attacks at malls across the west.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEH JOHNSON, HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY: I would say that if anyone is planning to go to the Mall of America today, they've got to be particularly careful.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: The nation's largest mall is ramping up security in the wake of Homeland Security secretary's warning -- in light of the secretary's warning. Law enforcement is scrambling to downplay his comments. Still Jeh Johnson isn't backing off.