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Jihadi John Identified; Feds: 3 NYC Men Plotted to Help ISIS; Interview with U.S. Senator John Barrasso of Wyoming; D.C. Legalizes Pot

Aired February 26, 2015 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: COSTELLO: NEWSROOM, starts now.

And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

The face of ISIS now has a name. As friends help identify the identity of the man accused of beheading American journalist James Foley and Steven Sotloff. According to Reuters citing the "Washington Post," the man known as Jihadi John is Mohammed Emwazi.

A close friend tells the "Washington Post" Emwazi is a British man from a well-off family in West London. Born in Kuwait, he's reportedly been in Syria since 2012.

Emwazi's covered face and British accent became a symbol of the terror group just months earlier. By taunting authorities in the videotaped murders.

We're covering the story from all angles. We begin with CNN senior international correspondent Nic Robertson at New Scotland Yard.

Good morning, Nic. Tell us more.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol.

Well, the police here, the Metropolitan Police who are in charge of counter terrorism in London, and would in theory have had Emwazi on their radar, say that they are not going to comment on the name. They say that they ask media to avoid speculation about who Jihadi John might be because life is at stake, they say.

We're also hoping the British Foreign Office, they also say that they won't be commenting on this. The police say that they have an ongoing active terror investigation and it is common practice, therefore, that they wouldn't be commenting on this.

But Emwazi has been seen as -- in the nom de guerre, if you will, as Jihadi John, executing James Foley, August last summer, Steven Sotloff, Peter Hemming, Alan Haynes, Peter Kessig and most recently the Japanese journalist Kenji Goto. He has a long track record of brutal murder. That's what the police

here are investigating and this name now certainly brings to light some of the details of his past and why potentially he might have been radicalized -- Carol.

COSTELLO: All right. Nic Robertson reporting live from Scotland Yard.

Now let's head to the West London neighborhood where Jihadi John grew up.

Atika Shubert is there following that part of the story for us.

The neighbors couldn't be surprised, right?

ATIKA SHUBERT, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right.

COSTELLO: Because for -- we've known for a long time that it might be this guy.

SHUBERT: Well, the neighbors are certainly shocked. This is a family that kept to themselves. They didn't really interact too much with too many neighbors. I did speak to one man who said he knew Mohammed Emwazi but he said he was absolutely shocked to hear that he may be the man known here as Jihadi John. This is -- he said that he saw him last a few years ago around the neighborhood. Pretty much a quiet but otherwise very nice young man is how he described him.

What we also know from Cage, which is a group, a rights group that represents a number of terror suspects, they say that Mohammed Emwazi was flagged up to MI-5 Security Services here when he tried to travel to Tanzania. And he actually went to Cage complaining of MI-5 harassment, saying that they prevented him from traveling, even from vacations and he couldn't seem to leave the country at any point because he kept being flagged by security services.

We do know, however, that at some point in 2013, according to Cage, Mohammed Emwazi left the U.K. And that is when we are estimating perhaps he went to Syria. But why exactly he went, who he was traveling with, this we still don't know. And of course, I have to emphasize what Nic just said, both British security services and American government officials have not confirmed that Mohammed Emwazi is in fact that person we know in those videos as Jihadi John.

COSTELLO: Tell us a little bit more about Mohammed Emwazi's background. He grew up in a middle class family. He went to college. He doesn't fit the profile that we've been hearing about.

SHUBERT: Well, he does, actually, fit the profile of a number of terror suspects in the sense that many of them are well-educated, from well-off families, you know, this is -- and Mohammed Emwazi went to college at Westminster University, for example. Got a computing degree.

The question is, what radicalizes a lot of these young men. And it's not clear. There's no one profile for somebody who goes to travel to Syria and joins a group like ISIS. This is a young man who kept to himself for the most part. Was described by people as being quite devout. And again, we see from that group Cage that he was harassed by security services or that's what he claimed, and this may have been one factor in him certainly deciding to leave the U.K. at any rate and start somewhere else. It now appears he decided to go straight to Syria.

COSTELLO: Yes. I guess I asked you about that profile because United States officials say poverty often drives young men to terrorist organizations but certainly not in this case, correct?

SHUBERT: No. And I think what does -- what we do find as a common thread in all of these cases is that they feel marginalized. They feel that somehow they're being targeted and that they're in a minority that is being treated with suspicion. And that is something we do see in this case very much so. So it could be something that security services are now looking at this moment.

COSTELLO: All right. Atika Shubert, reporting live from London this morning. Thank you.

Let's dig a bit deeper into the hunt for a Jihadi John. I want to bring in Jonathan Gilliam. He's a former Navy SEAL and former FBI special agent. We also have with us Peter Bergen, CNN national security analyst, and author of "Manhunt: The Search for Osama bin Laden."

Welcome to both of you.

JONATHAN GILLIAM, FORMER NAVY SEAL: Thank you.

COSTELLO: Thanks for being here.

Jonathan, I'd like to start with you. Does publicly naming Jihadi John complicate the search for him?

GILLIAM: I don't really think it does. I mean, I think this is a name that everybody knew about already and, you know, this is a much bigger picture than just one guy. I think a lot of the times things are released for political reasons or even not but, you know, more than anything this just gives a face to this particular person and it gives a face to somebody that we -- that actually is an enemy, I think.

COSTELLO: So, Peter, why aren't U.S. authorities or British authorities releasing the name? Is it because they're not sure or it would complicate the search?

PETER BERGEN, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: I talked to both British and U.S. officials this morning and they aren't commenting officially. The British tend to be very tight-lipped about this kind of thing. It is their investigation. It is their citizen and they're not going to comment unfortunately.

That said, I have a very high degree of confidence in this story because of the two reporters who reported it, Souad Mekhenne and Adam Goldman for the "Washington Post" who are two of the best reporters I think in the -- you know, working anywhere in the English speaking world and this was a very careful investigation that didn't come, you know, from somebody leaking it. It was a -- you know, it was a very good piece of reporting.

COSTELLO: So, Peter, when you are talking to authorities, were they upset that the name was released or they wouldn't comment at all?

BERGEN: No, I don't think they were upset. I mean, look, it's inevitable this was going to come out. This is the world's most wanted man in a lot of senses. And we've known for -- you know, I reported for CNN some time ago that British officials had identified them. Then we had FBI director Jim Comey saying that American officials had identified him. So his identity was known to quite a lot of people and, you know, inevitably these things can get out.

COSTELLO: Jonathan, that's why I was, like, amazed when Atika said his neighbors were surprised.

GILLIAM: Right.

COSTELLO: Don't they read the news? But you said before that in identifying this guy maybe some others will come forward and provide valuable information?

GILLIAM: Sure. I think that's a critical thing here because as we've seen now we had the three girls about a week ago that departed 15, 16 years old, to go over and recruit -- were recruited. You know, this is where I think this -- this forum that they had in Washington that had 60 world leaders there, you know, that is one place that they got it right is identifying and focusing on ways that they recruit so they could stop that. But I think they're missing a mark on one of these things that we all need to look at this, especially the neighbors who don't even realize what's going on is that we are actually in a world war.

This is a world war. They have declared war on the world and if 60 countries are showing up in Washington, D.C., to talk about it, the rest of the world needs to realize how widespread this actually is.

COSTELLO: OK. But as far as looking specifically for this one man, Peter, you know, it took us years to find Osama bin Laden. And it took good intelligence to find him. Do we have good intelligence on the ground to track down Jihadi John?

BERGEN: Look, we've launched an operation with some of Mr. Gilliam's former colleagues, a U.S. Navy SEAL operation on July 4 of last year as the president himself has said, the information was perhaps a few days old so at that time we had quite good information. Obviously we don't have a lot of assets in Syria. We do have some. But, you know, it could take a long time to find this guy.

Look, we've looked -- think about Whitey Bolger who killed 20 people in Boston. You know, h was the subject of an intense FBI manhunt for almost two decades. And that -- he was found in California, so you know multiply that by about, you know, 10 times magnitude of difficulty. And you get, you know, how difficult it will be to find this guy. Eventually I'm sure he will be found, but it will take a long time.

COSTELLO: And, Peter, before you go, I want to ask you one last question about Jihadi John. He has a degree in computer programming.

BERGEN: That, by the way, Carol, is very, very routine. I mean, your discussion with Atika was interesting.

The profile for these guys is exactly this person. University graduate, often with a sort of technical degree in computing or engineering. That's overwhelmingly the kind of profile that we've seen in terrorist organizations. You know, think about Mohamed Atta, the leader of the 9/11 attacks, he had a doctorate or he's studying for a doctorate from a Germany university in all things urban preservation.

So this is quite typical for the leader of these sorts of organizations. It would be well-educated, middle class -- it would be astonishing if he was from a different kind of background.

COSTELLO: I was just intrigued by the computer programming degree because of this social media presence that ISIS had.

BERGEN: Yes. Yes. That's a very point, Carol. I mean, this is -- you know, we don't know who's putting out this. They're English language communications but they're being put out for somebody who's -- who appears to be British. If you look at their magazines, it's sort of written in a British Poise and it's very well done unfortunately for the rest of the world.

COSTELLO: Jonathan Gilliam, Peter Bergen, thank you so much for your insight. Appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, the shadow of ISIS in a New York courtroom. Three Brooklyn men accused of plotting to help the terror group. Justice correspondent Evan Perez is working his sources this morning.

EVAN PEREZ, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. The FBI says three ISIS sympathizers from Brooklyn posed a real threat here in this country. We'll talk about what -- how far along they had gone with their plans when NEWSROOM returns.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: In New York, police say three new terror suspects were hell-bent on helping ISIS. Two allegedly planned to join ISIS on the battlefield, or at least launch the war here at home, killing police and maybe even President Obama. Federal investigators say the longstanding fears of homegrown terror are now growing more real.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES COMEY, FBI DIRECTOR: We have investigations of people in various stages of radicalizing in all 50 states. ISIL, in particular, is putting out a siren song through their slick propaganda, through social media that goes like this -- troubled soul, come to the caliphate. You will live a life of glory. These are the apocalyptic end times. You will find a life of meaning here fighting for our so- called caliphate. If you can't come, kill somebody where you are.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: CNN justice correspondent Evan Perez joins me to talk about the three men that are arrested in New York City.

So, is that sort of how it went with these men?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: It very much is, Carol.

You know, this begins in August of 2014, last summer, when the Secret Service I'm told by sources notices a Web site, an Uzbek language Web site where people discuss ISIS support and ideology. And they notice this guy talking about perhaps carrying out an attack of President Obama.

So, of course, they pass this along to the FBI and the FBI comes for a visit about a week later, on August 15th of last year, and they visit one of these suspects and they talk to him and he admits that he's made these comments.

And then, you know, they leave him alone. Later the same month, he's on another Web site and he's posting comments again and he e-mails an ISIS web administrator, again, asking about, you know, how to get to Syria, how to join ISIS.

And this is when the FBI decides that they need to find out more. They introduce him to an informant, an undercover paid informant. And they start discussing perhaps plans to go to Syria, other things that they could possibly carry out here.

Fast forward a few months. The FBI's been recording conversations. They've been monitoring their e-mail and their telephones.

This month, we see the plans accelerate. They buy plane tickets. One of them buys a plane ticket. Another one has to go out and go get a passport because his mother had taken away his passport fearing that he would do exactly this and so, look, the criticism that the FBI is going to get on this case is you have an informant.

COSTELLO: Paid informant.

PEREZ: A paid informant. And, you know, it doesn't look like these plans were very well developed.

COSTELLO: And these guys, frankly, don't look very smart. You put on your Facebook page I'm going to go kill President Obama?

PEREZ: One of them even shows up at the airport two nights ago and doesn't have a Turkish visa which is a problem for him to get on his plane. And so, you know, this is a criticism. This is what's said in criticism of the government's case. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ADAM PERLMUTTER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: They are very hand-fisted tactics. There is no attempt to intervene, to speak, to explore, to understand. There's just the rush to prosecution, to arrest, and to conviction. And I just remind everybody today that the presumption of innocence is still the law of the land in America, and we have every intention of fighting this case vigorously and protecting the rights of these individuals.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PEREZ: The FBI says, Carol, that they let this go as long as they could and they really had to take action because you never know when this could go from aspirational to operational.

COSTELLO: Evan Perez, thank you so much. I appreciate it.

The arrest of those three New York suspects putting renewed focus on the funding fight for the Homeland Security Department. That funding set to run out tomorrow. Even if the Senate has agreed to move forward on a bill that would keep the agency running but omit language that would reverse President Obama's actions on immigration, still, as the Senate looks ahead, the House of Representatives could be a major stumbling block to the bill's passage.

Joining me now to talk about this from Washington, Senator John Barrasso of Wyoming. He's the chairman of the Senate Republican Policy Committee.

Welcome, sir.

SEN. JOHN BARRASSO (R), WYOMING: Thanks, Carol. Thanks for having me back.

COSTELLO: Oh, thanks for being here. I appreciate it. You voted yes for a clean bill to fund DHS. Some House Republicans will probably say you're a sellout. Are you?

BARRASSO: Well, Republicans are united on needing to do two things. One is to fund the Department of Homeland Security. Look at that story you just showed. We can see the threat of terrorist overseas, as well as right here at home.

And the other thing that we're committed to doing is actually stopping the president's overreach, his executive amnesty relating to illegal immigration. Now, realize, the president has 22 times said he doesn't even have the north to do what he has done.

Now, the courts have stepped in Texas and said the president's actions are illegal.

COSTELLO: No, no, I realized that, but I want to go back to the DHS funding, because the Senate has sort of figured it out. So, Republicans in the Senate can say, we don't like what the president has done on immigration. But we're going to pass a clean bill on DHS because we think it's important.

The House of Representatives does not see it that way. We certainly heard that from John Boehner. That is a problem and it is a rift among Republicans, isn't it?

BARRASSO: Well, we are going to pass a bill in the United States Senate to fund the Department of Homeland Security and working on the other bill that actually tells the president he doesn't have the authority to do what he has done. The courts have said it is a function of Congress --

(CROSSTALK)

COSTELLO: But do you think the House of Representatives will pass a clean bill? Will they introduce a clean bill and pass it in the House of Representatives?

BARRASSO: Well, the Senate is going to pass a bill. It's going to send it to fund the Department --

COSTELLO: I know the Senate is.

BARRASSO: It's going to send it to the House and the House members, I think they've been meeting in caucuses to discuss that. They'll make a decision.

But I would hope that they would, in fact, go ahead and fund the Department of Homeland Security. I think it's important for our nation, especially in these perilous times, to make sure that the Department of Homeland Security continues to function in a seamless way.

COSTELLO: What would you say to your colleagues -- not your colleagues, but your brethren in the House of Representatives, those Republicans who say we will absolutely not vote for any clean bill in regards to DHS? What would you say to them?

BARRASSO: I'd say that the courts have acted. Accept the victory that the courts have given us, which is that the president does not have the authority to do what he has done and vote to continue to fund the Department of Homeland Security.

I think that is the right decision. It's the way that I'm going to vote and I would encourage other members to vote that way of both parties, because we need to make sure that the homeland remains secure, at the same time, we want to take action against what the president's done, which I believe is illegal. The courts have done that.

And this only funds the Department of Homeland Security through the end of the fiscal year. So, it's basically just until October.

COSTELLO: I understand.

So, you're set to speak at CPAC today. Will you share your -- will you share your thoughts that you just shared with me with them? Because if you do, I'm thinking you could be booed.

BARRASSO: Well, my topic at CPAC today has to do with additional presidential overreach which is with the health care law. I'm a doctor, practiced medicine in Wyoming for 25 years. And I know that what the president has done with the health care law goes beyond what the law itself says, and the Supreme Court is going to have hearings next week, a ruling in June, which I believe they're going to find that the president has acted illegally -- actually, in violation of the law.

And the discussion topic for me today at CPAC is once again presidential overreach beyond his own authority, and then what we're going to do to respond once the Supreme Court rules in June that the president's actions were illegal.

COSTELLO: And then will you add it won't be to defund the DHS? That's not how you fight the president's plans on immigration?

BARRASSO: Well, I believe that the president's plans on immigration are illegal and the courts have said that. The president himself said 22 times he doesn't have the authority to do what he has done. Democrat members of the Senate have questioned the president's authority --

COSTELLO: do understand that, sir.

BARRASSO: -- to do what he has done.

COSTELLO: I do understand that, sir. I just meant that immigration shouldn't be tied to DHS. You just said that. I just wondered if you would share that with CPAC today.

BARRASSO: Well, the topic that I'm there to talk today at CPAC is as a doctor on the replacement and repeal of the president's health care law. As a doctor I'm going to talk about ways that we can help patients which was the goal of this in the first place.

But this health care law continues to be unworkable, really still very unpopular across the country and unaffordable for us as a nation.

COSTELLO: Thank you, sir. Republican Senator John Barrasso of Wyoming, thank you, sir, for joining me this morning. I appreciate it.

BARRASSO: Thanks, Carol.

COSTELLO: You're welcome.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM: D.C. going to pot literally. Marijuana now legal in Washington. So, why are there threats to place the mayor under arrest? We'll talk about that next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Marijuana is now legal in our nation's capital, with some restrictions a voter approved law took effect about nine hours ago, but some in Congress want people to just say no, even threatening legal action against D.C.'s mayor.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR MURIEL BOWSER (D), DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA: I have a lot of things to do here in the District of Columbia, me being in jail wouldn't be a good thing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Hmm.

Miguel Marquez has more for you.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This strain is a strain called Mrs. Butterworth.

MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Carlos, who does not want to be identified because what he's doing now in a cramped apartment with a view of the U.S. capitol is illegal. In a few hours, that will change.

(on camera): It is illegal what you're doing right now?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Very much.

MARQUEZ: It won't be illegal tomorrow, correct?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That is correct.

MARQUEZ: What is that like to come out of the shadows, as it were?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's literally, for me, literally coming out of the closet. I can literally take my tent out of this closet.

MARQUEZ (voice-over): Legal marijuana here, nothing like the recreational gold rush in Colorado.

Users here in Washington, D.C. can grow up to 6 plants, carry up to 2 ounces, give up to 1 ounce to anyone over 21 years old. But neither money, goods nor services can exchange hands. It's a share or gift economy, but still --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's literally a freedom for something that I'm so passionate about, knowing that it's legal, it's decriminalized, all of the above. I'm free.

MARQUEZ: In a letter to D.C.'s mayor, the chairman of a powerful U.S. congressional committee which has ultimate authority over the District of Columbia issued a stern warning, writing, "If you decide to move forward tomorrow with the legalization of marijuana in the district, you will be doing so in knowing and willful violation of the law."

BOWSER: We would encourage the Congress to not be so concerned about overturning what seven out of ten voters said should be the law in the District of Columbia. MARQUEZ: Adam Eldinger organized the legalization effort.

MARQUEZ (on camera): Do you think there will be a backlash to any of this?

ADAM ELDINGER, CHAIRMAN OF THE DC CANNABIS CAMPAIGN: There will be a huge backlash if Congress manages to overturn the initiative. There will be protests in the streets. You know, our city council will be performing acts of civil disobedience.

MARQUEZ (voice-over): He says despite protests from some powerful members of Congress, legalization in the nation's capital is just another sign of growing public acceptance nationwide.

ELDINGER: We cannot wait for politicians to get on the ball here. We - people are going to jail for this. You know, thousands of people a year.

MARQUEZ: Miguel Marquez, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)