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Coast Guard Finds Boat Linked to Missing Teens; Trump Leads Entire Republican Field; Interview with Representative Adam Schiff; Training for the Triathlon Blind; The Hunt for Paul Jackson. Aired 6- 7p ET
Aired July 26, 2015 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:00:44] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.
POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Six o'clock Eastern this Sunday evening. I'm Poppy Harlow joining you live from New York.
And we begin with very sad breaking news here on CNN. The desperate search for two teenage boys last seen on Friday going on a fishing trip off of the coast of Florida. Right now, the U.S. Coast Guard has confirmed that the boat that was found capsized nearly 70 miles offshore is indeed the boat those two boys were operating. So far, there has been no sign of the two 14-year-olds who were on the boat. You are looking at pictures of them right now.
Joining me on the phone, chief petty officer of the U.S. Coast Guard, Ryan Doss.
Thank you for being with me, chief.
Let me begin with this. This is a small boat, this is 19 feet long. The Coast Guard found it more than 100 miles from where the boys left shore. How did the Coast Guard find it? I'm wondering if it's offering any clues yet as to what may have happened.
CHIEF PETTY OFFICER RYAN DOSS, U.S. COAST GUARD (via telephone): About 11:00 this morning, we had a C-130 crew out of Clearwater spotted the boat. We were able to launch a helicopter crew also out of Clearwater who went out, lowered a rescue swimmer down and they were able to take a look at the registration numbers on the boat and verify it was the boat the two boys were believed to be aboard.
Right now, we have a C-144 airplane out of Miami out there searching. We have a helicopter out searching. We've got a small boat crew out of Cape Canaveral also out there looking for the two boys. Coming up with plans right now, how we're going to search throughout the night and into tomorrow as well.
So, right now, no idea how the boat may have capsized. We know that the seas have been one to three feet, 11 to 13-knot winds. There have been thunderstorms that have rolled through the area. Not uncommon this time of year. You know, right now, just hoping for the best and hoping for a happy ending in reuniting these boys with their families. HARLOW: You know, I know people may be looking and saying these are
two young boys but their parents are saying they were incredibly, incredibly well-versed on the water, highly experienced, a lot of experience fishing in the ocean there. People have survived things like this before, haven't they?
DOSS: We have seen people survive. Definitely this time of year especially we've seen people survive for multiple days at sea. You know, we're not -- we're still -- plans are right now are to continue searching so these conditions, the sea states and the water temperature is definitely a survivable situation. It really comes down to things we don't know at this point, whether or not the two boys were wearing life jackets, if they're able to float on anything that may have been aboard the boat.
So, holding out hope and exploring all these possibilities at this hour and just continue to search as best we can as diligent as we can throughout the night tonight.
HARLOW: We are all holding out hope. We wish the best to you and your team here doing this search. Thank you very much, Ryan Doss.
(MUSIC)
HARLOW: To politics now. There is no slowing down Donald Trump. Just a week after the billionaire candidate sparked controversy with his attack on Senator John McCain's war record, a brand new nationwide CNN/ORC poll shows that Trump is still leading the pack among Republicans seeking the nomination.
Trump coming on top at 18 percent. His closest competitor, Jeb Bush, has 15 percent, followed by Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker. The numbers represent a 6-point jump for Trump in support since the last CNN poll that was in June.
Trump called into CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION WITH JAKE TAPPER" this morning, and he talked to Jake about the latest numbers and also weighed in on everything from Hillary Clinton's e-mail scandal to illegal immigration and gun control.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE (via telephone): When you and I spoke three or four months ago, I wasn't even going to be in the contest according to various people. And now I'm leading easily in a lot of the races, because people are sick and tired. So with Hillary, I think I'll beat Hillary easily. I think I will beat Hillary, I don't think these other guys will.
JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST, "STATE OF THE UNION": So, just to clarify, what exactly are you charging that Hillary Clinton did is criminal? You're talking about this e-mail --
TRUMP: I'm talking about the whole e-mail scandal. It's a scandal. I mean, she's been protected. It's been amazing to me how she's been protected. Even the fact "The Times" changes -- I respect "The Times" for going
after her like that.
[18:05:01] But even the fact that they changed the story upon their request, I think they were more right the first time. But whether it was the first time or the second time, what Hillary did is criminal. And, you know --
TAPPER: I don't think it was a criminal --
TRUMP: And I don't know whether or not that takes her out of the race, but she shouldn't even be in the race.
Now, whether she is or whether it's a guy like Sanders, which is hard to believe, but whether she is in the race or not, I guess step by step, I'm not thinking too much about Hillary right now, I'm thinking about a man who's in favor of Common Core, a man who's weak on immigration, Jeb Bush, and a man like Walker who, frankly, his state is having tremendous difficulty.
I love Wisconsin, it's a great place. But he's putting debt up to the gills. The school system is a disaster because they don't have any money. I mean, you know, Walker's state, Wisconsin, is a catastrophe from an economic and a financial standpoint. I think he's number 36 or 38 overall in terms of the country for economic growth and the jobs -- his jobs projection was way, way off. I mean, beyond.
TAPPER: Right.
TRUMP: They have budget deficits. He was going to have a lot of -- a lot of big surplus. You've got a $2.2 billion deficit.
TAPPER: I hear you, Mr. Trump --
TRUMP: So, I think Walker is in big trouble.
TAPPER: Just as a point of fact, I believe that the referral by the inspectors general was a security referral not a criminal referral when it came to Hillary Clinton. But let's just leave that where it is.
I do want to talk about immigration and illegal immigration, an issue that you've talked about a lot. You were at the border the other day.
Assuming a President Trump is able to stop the flow of illegal immigration through building a wall or some parts of a wall, what do you think should be done with the estimated 11 million undocumented workers and their families already here? Would you open-minded about a path to citizenship? Is that a nonstarter with you?
TRUMP: OK.
TAPPER: Where are you on that issue?
TAPPER: Fine. First of all, you said it. You have to stop it, you have to stop it fast and we can do that. We can do that with combinations of walls and border patrol who are phenomenal people. I met many of them when I was in Laredo, when I was at the border. And we can stop that -- and fencing.
But we can stop it with both construction and with physical -- I mean, we can do a great job of that, OK? I'm totally convinced. And it won't cost the kind of money -- in fact, we'll save money because people that are coming in here that shouldn't be coming in here illegally, it will actually save money by doing it and doing it properly.
Once that's done, we have a situation that is going to be done immediately. Before that's done, we're going to get the bad ones out. We have some really bad dudes right here in this country, and we're getting them out and we're sending them back to where they came from.
And I don't mean Mexico, I mean they come from all over. They're not coming just from -- they're coming from all over. We have some real bad ones. They're in our prisons that we're paying for and they're walking the streets of San Francisco, what a horrible thing happened to Kate.
TAPPER: Right.
TRUMP: And what a horrible thing to happen to Jamiel, the young man who was going to maybe go to Stanford and football player and the apple of his father's eye. So, let me tell you something, we've got to get rid of -- the bad ones are going to get out. Then, from that point on, we're going to look very, very strongly at what we do, and I'm going to formulate a plan that I think people are going to be happy with. But we're going to look very, very strongly at what we do.
TAPPER: OK, but you're not going to rule in or rule out --
TRUMP: I'm going to get rid of the bad ones fast.
TAPPER: OK.
TRUMP: And I'm going to send them back. And we're not going to be putting them in prisons here, and pay for them for the next 40 years.
TAPPER: Right. But there are obviously --
TRUMP: We're going to send them back where they could from.
TAPPER: There obviously will be -- will remain, after you get rid of the bad ones, millions and millions of undocumented workers who are not bad ones. And there are women and there are children and there are men who are here who came here for a better life, and -- but you're not going to yet take a position on whether or not you would favor a path to citizenship?
TRUMP: We're going to see what -- we're going to see what we're going to see. I mean, it's a very hard thing. I will say, from a moral standpoint, from a physical standpoint, you're talking about at least 11 million people. I have heard the number is much higher than that, because that number has been bandied about for years.
TAPPER: Right.
TRUMP: Eleven million, I have been hearing for years. It could be much more. But we're going to take the high ground. We're going to do what's right. Some are going to have to go. And some, we're just going to see what happens. It's a very, very big subject, and a very complicated subject.
TAPPER: I want to ask --
TRUMP: But the wall is going to be built for security. We're going to have a great border. People can come in to the country legally, but not illegally. And the people that come in are going to be good people. They're going to be great people. And I want that. It's very important to me.
TAPPER: Of course, most of the horrific things that take place in this country are perpetrated by Americans. I want to ask you about this horrific shooting we just had in Lafayette, Louisiana. Here, we have another case of someone with well-established mental health problems somehow able to legally buy a gun. What do you think needs to be done to stop this?
[18:10:02] TRUMP: Well, these are sick people. I mean, these are very, very sick people. This has nothing to do with guns. This has to do with the mentality of these people.
And, you know, you're always going to have -- first of all, I'm a big Second Amendment person. I believe in it so strongly. You need protection. You need protection against the bad ones that have the guns.
TAPPER: But do you think the Second Amendment...
TRUMP: And you take the guns away from the good people, and the bad ones are going to have target practice. Like, for instance, the gun- free zone with the Marines that was disgraceful.
These are decorated people. These are people that know how to use guns better than anybody. And they're not allowed to carry guns, and this guy shot them. They were like sitting ducks, the way that happened. It was a disgrace. And if they would have had their guns, they probably would all be alive, or most of them would be alive right now.
TAPPER: Well, I think a lot of people - yes.
TRUMP: So, we have to protect our Second Amendment - Amendment. And we can't let -- we can't take little chunk, little chunks, little chunk here. They keep talking about these little - take these little chunks out. And you have to be very careful about that.
You know, we had prisoners escape up in Upstate New York, which you covered very well for a long period of time. And the people up in Upstate that didn't believe in guns, all of a sudden, they all had guns sitting on their tables because they were really afraid that these guys would break into their house.
(CROSSTALK)
TRUMP: And they felt much better having the gun. So, you need to protect the Second Amendment at all costs.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: Still ahead, Donald Trump says to CNN, as you just heard, that he can easily beat Hillary Clinton, but does the polling back him up on that? Our political minds weigh in next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:15:00] HARLOW: All right. We're talking this hour about Donald Trump's rise, rapid rise in the Republican Party. The new CNN/ORC poll that shows him solidifying his lead in the race right now.
Let's talk about it with Margaret Hoover, a CNN political analyst, Republican consultant and host of the Sirius XM radio show "Get It Right with Margaret Hoover", and John Avlon, CNN political analyst, editor in chief of "The Daily Beast."
Guys, thank you so much. I'm so happy you're here.
MARGARET HOOVER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Looking at these numbers, Trump at 18 percent, Jeb Bush at 15 percent, Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker at 10 percent, in a head-to-head matchup against registered voters, Trump trails Hillary Clinton 56 percent to 40 percent, but take a listen to what he said to Jake Tapper this morning.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: With Hillary, I think I'll beat Hillary easily. I think I will beat Hillary. I don't think these other guys will.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: Margaret, so he says he can. He sounds very confident. The polls don't show it. It goes a long way. I think it helps a lot with these numbers. Can he beat Hillary Clinton?
HOOVER: Can he get to the Republican nom -- can he get through Iowa, New Hampshire and South Carolina whereby the way he's not leading in any of those primary states.
Look, these national polls are very deceiving because we don't have a national Republican primary. We have regional primaries, state primaries, and Donald Trump is not leading in any one of those. In Iowa, Scott Walker is leading. In New Hampshire, Jeb Bush is leading. In South Carolina, it's a tie between three candidates.
This is totally overstated. And, frankly, so early in the game a measure of celebrity and name ID. That's why Jeb Bush is second and Scott Walker trails as a distant third.
HARLOW: Within the margin of error, Jeb Bush is.
John, Marc Lamont Hill said on our air last hour that we -- Donald Trump will not even be in the discussion in 90 days. Is that underestimating the power of Trump?
JOHN AVLON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, Donald Trump is surfing off a wave of kind of conservative populism and I think the reality check the Republican Party needs to deal with is that you reap what you sow. They have been sowing these seeds of kind of an angry conservative populism that rewards celebrity and brashness, that place the lowest common denominator and is rewarded. Now, a lot of those folks are kind of terrified that Donald is turning on its creator and that you know, significant portion in a fractured field is backing a guy who's basically a reality show star, who's basically a self-marketer and self-promoter --
HARLOW: Right.
AVLON: -- who doesn't live in a fact-based political world and he's being rewarded for it for the time being. So, I think it's a terrible mistake in the short run --
(CROSSTALK)
HARLOW: Don't count him out.
HOOVER: Can I just remind you about 2012, though? In 2012, we had a huge number of candidates, none of them nearly as qualified as this field. And we had people like Herman Cain leading the primary field for a time. Michele Bachmann leading the primary field.
AVLON: That's exactly right.
HOOVER: Ask where any of them are now.
AVLON: No, but that's --
HARLOW: But aren't we in different times now? This is a time when Bernie Sanders is a very big competitor. Aren't we in a bit of a different time now?
AVLON: I think the commonality there is that you're dealing with a populism in both parties that's expressed in different ways. You have sort of the birth of a left wing Tea Party which is backing Bernie Sanders. But I think they're fundamentally different phenomena except for the fact that while their supporters might feel good about them, they don't have a great chance of winning a general election.
HARLOW: There's nothing fundamentally different about the Republican GOP electorate in 2012 than there was in 2016. If you go to Iowa, you spend a lot of time there, Iowans want to get somebody. They're going to like Trump at first, but when they get to know him -- look, people care about who's going to be president. What are the substantive policy positions they are putting forward.
HARLOW: One thing people aren't talking about a lot is Donald Trump flip-flopping. And I want to read you this. This was 2011 an interview he did with Bill O'Reilly and he was asked about illegal immigrants.
He said, "You know, it's hard to generalize, but you're going to have to look at the individual people, see how they have done, see how productive they have been, see what their references are and then make a decision. You have some great, productive people that came in."
Do voters care that's what he said four years ago, listen to what he's saying now?
AVLON: I don't think you're dealing with rational appeals in the case of Donald Trump. But the fact that he sounds almost reasonable I think speaks to something pretty profound and it began in 2012.
All of a sudden, the calculus for when you're running for president in the Republican primary, it used to be that you would try to sound responsible because, you know, you're asking people to trust you with the oval office and your finger on the button, et cetera, et cetera. But all of a sudden, given the tide of populist conservatism it became a political asset to sound irresponsible. And you reap what you sow and that's what's happening with Donald Trump.
We saw the beginnings of it in 2012, with the flirtations of folks who are never going to win a general election, but made the base flame up with a ton of red meat and now you have this to a certain extent with Donald Trump. So, that is the phenomena.
And the fact is, if he sounded that reasonable, he wouldn't be getting the kind of inflamed irrational support he's getting now.
HARLOW: And is he impacting his other opponents in that given what Mike Huckabee said today?
I want you to stay with me. I've got to get a quick break in.
We're going to talk about Mike Huckabee next, what he said in an interview criticizing the nuclear deal with Iran. It is an analogy that is making a lot of people furious, calling him out.
[18:20:02] We'll talk about it next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARLOW: Former Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee trying to -- well, a lot of people are talking, he's turning heads with comments that he made today on "Breitbart News". Actually, the comments were made on Saturday, my apologies, on that Breitbart News Saturday radio program. It is about the international deal to prevent Iran from developing nuclear weapons.
In Huckabee's own words, quote, "This president's foreign policy is the most feckless in American history. It is so naive that he would trust the Iranians. By doing so, he will take the Israelis and march them to the door of the oven."
Let's talk about it. Back with me Margaret Hoover and John Avlon.
Margaret, to you first.
HOOVER: In a "Wall Street Journal" op-ed this week, a guest commentator said that 1930s Europe analogies are as overused as they are rarely applicable.
I think you have to be really, really careful when you use analogies. The Holocaust -- Bibi Netanyahu, the head of the state of Israel, doesn't even use analogies of the Holocaust when he talks about how bad --
HARLOW: Right.
HOOVER: -- he believes this Iran deal to be.
It minimizes both the Holocaust and the seriousness of the policy issue in front of us.
HARLOW: We were talking about sort of going for the red meat and throwing out jabs and barbs.
Look, we'll get to it in a minute, but even, you know, the head sort of strategist for the GOP talked about sort of let's stop name calling today in his interview with Brian Stelter.
[18:25:02] AVLON: Yes.
HARLOW: Is Huckabee being pushed to make comments that are so controversial that we've seen do quite well in polling?
AVLON: Yes, I think there are a couple of things going on here. First of all, candidates are watching a candidate like Donald Trump saying manifestly irresponsible things loudly and getting rewarded for it by a media attention and bump in the polls. So, there's going to be a tendency to say, look, if I'm not going to confront it and call it out, maybe I can drink some of that Kool-Aid too and get some benefit from it. So, that's one factor.
The second factor is what we're talking about just before the break, which is that there is a dynamic inside the current Republican primary that rewards irresponsible behavior. Instead of trying to act more responsible to convince people you'd be an effective commander-in- chief, you get a primary bump if you get irresponsible.
The final thing that I think is important is this. You know, Sean Spicer and those folks talking about Reagan's 11th command meant, don't talk ill of another Republican. What upsets them with Trump is that they're calling names of other Republicans. The larger issue is one of civility. When you use Godwin's law says when you compare your opponent to Adolf Hitler you automatically lost the debate. What should offending people is when a guy running for president who's likeable and relatable much of the time compares the president of the United States saying he's marching the state of Israel to an oven --
HARLOW: Right. AVLON: -- that should be called out too, not just when it's a fellow Republican.
HARLOW: So, let's listen to that sound. And, Margaret, I want your reaction. This coming from the RNC's communications director, Sean Spicer, on Brian Stelter's program, "RELIABLE SOURCES", this morning.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEAN SPICER, REPUBLICAN PARTY COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: I understand it's going to be the nature of any primary for folks to discuss the differences between themselves on policy issues, and I think that's fine. The name-calling, however, needs to stop. We've got to remember what Ronald Reagan taught us, his 11th commandment -- thou shall shot speak ill of another Republican.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: Margaret?
HOOVER: Yes, he's absolutely right. And, frankly, the problem is John is not a Republican, he's pretending this is far more ominous and more detrimental to the Republican Party in the long term than it actually is.
AVLON: It is.
HOOVER: This is short-term problematic. This is a car wreck. We're all rubber-necking to see how it ends. It's going to end.
And this is not -- I mean, Donald Trump is not going to win the Republican nomination. It's absurd that we give him as much oxygen as we do.
AVLON: He's leading in the polls right now.
HOOVER: A national poll which has absolutely no bearing on what happens in Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina, the southern state primaries or Nevada.
You -- you like to hear this (INAUDIBLE) --
AVLON: No, I don't. I actually care about the country more than I care about the Republican Party.
HOOVER: A flame thrower has yet to win a Republican nomination. It simply does not happen.
(CROSSTALK)
HARLOW: Mike Huckabee --
HOOVER: I don't see Republican candidates -- look, Mike Huckabee sometimes says sort of flame-throwing things and sometimes he's quite reasonable and quite nuanced in his speech.
HARLOW: This is really --
HOOVER: This is, and I agree with John, this should be called out. You should draw a line and frankly you don't see Jeb Bush or Scott Walker or Marco Rubio or Lindsey Graham or any of the really thoughtful, qualified and really leaders in the GOP saying anything like this.
AVLON: No.
HOOVER: This is not -- he is not shifting the center of gravity in terms of this rhetoric.
HARLOW: So let's talk about something else that happened. It's a little inside baseball, but it's very important. It's about what Ted Cruz did on the floor of the Senate at the end of this week on Friday.
He called Mitch McConnell a liar. Very senior senator, Utah's Orrin Hatch came out today and condemned that. He said you broke Senate rules, you broke Senate rule 19, et cetera.
What is the bigger picture, though, Republican to Republican, this infighting, what happened on the floor there? How big of a deal is that, Margaret?
HOOVER: Ted Cruz should -- and he invokes Ronald Reagan more than anybody else. He should be listening to the 11th commandment.
Ted Cruz, we have known since he's gotten to the Senate, has been running for president. Ted Cruz has been doing things that garner attention that have detrimental effects to the Republican Party largely and frankly bad policy effects. I mean, the government shutdown was a terrible idea. It looks back in hindsight too. He stands by it because he has to.
But I don't -- look, I don't think that Ted Cruz is the emblem. I mean, you have a field of candidates, 16 of which -- 12 of which are eminently qualified and really responsible.
AVLON: Right. No, not quite that number. But Ted Cruz -- the point is that he's fund-raising off that stuff. That's a calculated attack on Mitch McConnell on, a Tea Party issue, showing that he's got the, quote-unquote, "integrity" to call the Senate majority leader a liar. And that's a symptom of this larger problem.
The larger dynamic is that the folks fighting to get in this debate, some of the most responsible people this cycle who have eminent government experience, not just one term in the Senate, Lindsey Graham three terms, Governor Pataki three terms, Rick Perry, three terms, who are trying to take on Donald Trump, can't even make the debate.
HARLOW: Let's remember who was the first to call out Donald Trump was George Pataki.
AVLON: Right.
HARLOW: And for that, all right, guys, thank you very much. AVLON: Thanks, Poppy.
HARLOW: Always good to have you, Margaret and John.
Coming up next, part of Donald Trump's appeal for some is his tough- talking stance on immigration. It has got some of the GOP op base fired up and the poll numbers are showing it. Next, I will speak to this man, Democratic Congressman Adam Schiff. We will talk Trump. We will also talk about a development about some of those who were released from Guantanamo Bay and where he stands now on the Iran nuclear deal. All of that, next.
[18:30:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.
POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: We're following this breaking news here on CNN. A Florida community is in shock and in anguish, really waiting, waiting for answers, waiting for news about two teenage boys missing since Friday. A few hours ago the Coast Guard found the boys' boat where it was -- where they were last seen.
Perry Cohen and Austin Stephanos left Jupiter, Florida, on Friday, on a fishing trip. Since then there has been no contact with the two 14- year-old and today the Coast Guard found their boat capsized and drifting more than 100 miles from where they started on that journey on Friday afternoon. So far no sign of the boys.
What's going on right now in Jupiter is the community members are gathering to support one another. There is a vigil, a prayer service going on. The Coast Guard telling us just a few moments ago that the search for the two boys will continue through the night. We wish them all of the best.
A new CNN/ORC poll shows that most Republican voters want to see one particular candidate from their party on the debate stage more than any other, that candidate is Donald Trump. Part of the appeal that he has to some voters is his take-no-prisoner stance on immigration. Some analysts are asking, though, if that hard line, unmoving attitude can actually help him win the nomination.
Democratic Congressman Adam Schiff of California is with me.
Thank you for being here, sir. A number of things I want to get to including Iran and Guantanamo Bay, but first with immigration. Two high-profile cases in your state. In one, an illegal immigrant killing a woman in San Francisco just a few weeks ago after he had already been deported several times. In another more recent case an illegal immigrant sexually assaulting a 14-year-old, again after he was in custody, then released, but never deported.
What needs to change so that things like this don't keep happening?
REP. ADAM SCHIFF (D), CALIFORNIA: Poppy, that's a good question. And I think these two cases illustrate that a simple solution is really not in the cards. In the one case involving the sexual assault, this was somebody that was granted bail, and I think probably the predominant issue there is should he have been granted bail at all, should the bail have been much higher.
[18:35:12] HARLOW: Right.
SCHIFF: That's a very different question than the -- that involved in the second case where you had somebody who was repeatedly deported, who was sent to San Francisco after serving one sentence to be charged with another crime, ultimately not charged with that old drug case. And there were a lot of questions there about why he was even sent to San Francisco as opposed to being deported. So two very different issues. I think they do call up the fact that because they are such different circumstances and part of a larger immigration debate, we do really need a very comprehensive solution to this problem.
Part of it deals with the criminal justice system, part of it deals with the immigration system. But I think we ought to resist simplified calls like that you hear from some of the presidential candidates --
HARLOW: But there --
SCHIFF: -- that aren't going to solve the problem.
HARLOW: They're resonating. I mean, they're resonating. Donald Trump was asked by Jake Tapper this morning, you know, about the 11 million plus illegal immigrants in this country. Now what do you do with them, even if you stop more from coming in? And he said, look, it's hard and he didn't have a solution to that now. He said you've got to stop them from coming in. But those words that he's using are resonating with voters, as seen in the polls.
SCHIFF: Well, they do resonate with a small group. Now it's a sizeable group and a divided Republican presidential primary. But yes, that vein has always been out there. He's tapping into that vain. I don't think it's reflective of a majority of Americans who want a comprehensive solution to immigration. And I do think even Donald Trump understands that the millions of people that are here illegally are not going to be deported, that's simply not practical, feasible or even desirable.
So we have to find a pathway to citizenship that requires them to learn English, to pay back taxes, to abide by all of our laws. I think we all understand that's where we're headed. But unfortunately we've had a Senate bill that passed with strong bipartisan support, languished now for a couple of years and until the speaker decides he's willing to take on the Tea Party part of his own caucus, that issue is going to continue to languish.
HARLOW: I want to talk to you about Guantanamo Bay. It's something you and I have talked a lot about, but this sort of got lost in all the other headlines this week. But the fact that two former detainees at Guantanamo Bay late this week arrested by Belgium police in a counterterrorism operation targeting a recruiting network for al Qaeda in Syria. These were two being monitored by Belgian officials, sort of the rules that were set up when they were released.
What's your take on this? How concerned are you about that?
SCHIFF: Well, I'm always concerned about what happens with the detainees and former detainees because a certain percentage of them do return to the fight. At the same time, keeping Guantanamo open has served as a magnet for recruiting new jihadis and it's been a real black eye for the United States.
I think the president is ultimately right about this, we need to shut this down. I think Senator McCain is right this, we need to shut it down, we need to figure out an orderly way to do that. And for the first time I have some optimism because you have Senator McCain really stepping forward and expressing a willingness to work with the administration. The administration putting forward a plan it should release within I hope the next few days outlining a way that we can close this in a safe and responsible way. But yes, I'm always concerned with what happens with these former detainees.
HARLOW: Right. I want to talk about Iran. Earlier this week with my colleague Wolf Blitzer here on CNN you talked about the Iran deal and you did note that it will mean an improvement in Iran's economy, more money for Iran that could give a lot of strength to terror groups like Hezbollah. Let's roll that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SCHIFF: Absolutely they'll have greater resources. Now it may not be in excess of $100 billion, the real number may be closer to $56 billion when you consider funds that are already obligated. But nonetheless a big infusion of money. Certainly some of that they're going to have to plow into their economy. That's what Rouhani has been making the case for in Iran. But Iran has been very cost effective in their support of Hezbollah. They have been able to stretch a few dollars a long way. Now they'll have a lot more dollars.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: How concerned are you about the fact that some of this resulting deal, if it makes it through Congress, is going to be more funds for Iran to potentially support Hezbollah?
SCHIFF: Well, I'm very concerned about it. The two things about the agreement that I think are worth a lot of thought and do frankly raise troubling questions. One is the length of the agreement. I would like to have seen this agreement go on far longer. The other is what Iran is going to do with all these resources.
At the same time, Poppy, the most difficult question of all cuts the other direction, and that is what's the alternative to this deal. And I have yet to hear a very good answer to that question. So while there are problems raised, we're going to have to find if this agreement goes through a way to contain and confront Iran through its support of Hezbollah and Hamas, through whatever greater resources it has to plow into supporting the regime of Bashar al-Assad or the Houthi rebels.
[18:40:06] So those are going to be real problems to be confronted if this goes through. But, you know, one point I would emphasize, and that is, with or without this agreement, this is something we need to do. And I think we need to work more closely with Israel, with our Gulf allies to make sure that our partners in the region are spending their defense dollars in the most cost effective way because remember, the Saudis and other Gulf nations, they're spending eight to 10 times what Iran does on defense, but Iran is nonetheless using it in, I think, a far more cost effective way to make trouble in the region, to support terror in the region. We need to make sure those greater resources are more effectively used to contain and confront Iran.
HARLOW: We'll be watching Congress, your fellow congressmen and women, in the middle of this 60-day review period for the Iran deal. Kerry making his case on the Hill this week. We'll be watching.
Congressman Adam Schiff, thank you.
SCHIFF: Thanks, Poppy.
HARLOW: Still ahead, a very I inspiring story for you. Finishing a triathlon is epic. I've certainly never done it. But now imagine trying to do it all when you can't see. We're going to meet an inspiring blind athlete who just did exactly that.
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HARLOW: All right, this just into us here at CNN. Fiat Chrysler agreed to pay a $105 million fine. The Department of Transportation just making that announcement saying that the automaker will be under rigorous federal oversight.
[18:45:08] This fine is for the way that it handled repairing its cars with known defects, including Jeeps that were prone to catch on fire. Chrysler was criticized for the way it executed 23 vehicle safety recalls, covering more than 11 million different cars and trucks.
Well, imagine swimming nearly a mile in cold water, then biking 25 miles, then, you know, going for a 6.2 mile run. Sound tough, a triathlon? I've never done it. Now imagine doing it blind.
CNN's Dominique Dodley and Rod Grio captured this amazing feat on camera.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thousands of people line up to jump in the Hudson in the New York City triathlon every year and it's something that they post about and they take Instagram pictures about and it's something that they really wear as a medal. And it is a huge accomplishment. But to imagine doing that without even being able to see the water that you're jumping into, it kind of heightens the terror factor.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The main problem when you lose your sight is that you lose self-confidence. And so seeing yourself in a positive light as an athlete, as a champion, as a fighter, is essential. I started Achilles because when I moved to New York I didn't know anyone and that's pretty much when I started to lose my sight and use a cane. And I needed an outlet. A group of friends --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Achilles is a not for profit which enables people with all types of disabilities to participate in mainstream athletics, to promote physical health and increase self-esteem and basically just live a more fulfilling life.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When I was a child, I could, you know, play soccer and whatnot. But I always had trouble reading. It will be our first run together.
No rush.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The obstacles that are in their way every morning to train.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm good to go.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are amplified. It means getting all those runs in, all those swims in, all those bikes in, in a much more challenging way.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The swimming part is definitely the most challenging part of the triathlon. You have to imagine that there is this crowd around you. And in my case you can't see anything, obviously. And my sense that I usually use for localization is my hearing and I can't hear anything, I'm in the water. So I'm really confused. And that's when trusting my guide is so essential.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I really want him to just be confident and relax because he's not that comfortable in the water.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's why the guide relationship is so very important because you really need to trust your guide, and the guide needs to actually trust the athlete, too.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If I want to go for a run or to bike, I need someone.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's very committed to the training and while he's doing it, he really loves it. I'm very glad to be part of that.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is like a community that supports them and believes in them, and gives them a goal and isn't just like this is something you can do, but says this is something you will do and we will bring you there and we will actually help you every step of the way.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I wasn't accepting of who I was. I didn't see myself as a blind person just yet. So it was a tough transition. Achilles changed my life. It became a second family for me. It helped me transition from being sighted to being visually impaired.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: If that doesn't inspire you to run a triathlon, I don't know what else is going to.
Also this, six CNN viewers who were selected to be part of the 2015 Fit Nation triathlon team will run right alongside Dr. Sanjay Gupta in the Nautical Malibu Triathlon, that is on September 20th. You can follow their experiences as they have been training. Just go to facebook.com/CNNfitnation.
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[18:52:52] HARLOW: It has been a very sad day for us here at CNN. Our beloved, beloved show producer from Atlanta, Joe Conley, passed away last night. He was an extraordinary man, good to the core.
Our Fredricka Whitfield remembers him.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Joe Conley's consistency, dedication and rock solid preparedness and judgment are hugely responsibility for helping us bring you our best every weekend here the NEWSROOM. Joe is many things to so many of us. A dear friend, a fantastic, consistent, cool and calm under pressure, rock solid veteran newsman.
Joe joined CNN nearly 20 years ago after the University of Florida's graduate many years in local news from Gainesville and Palm Beach, Florida to Columbia, South Carolina. A teddy bear of a guy with a huge compassionate heart and without hesitation he was the show producer any show at this network could count on and did.
From the original "CROSSFIRE" to "INSIDE POLITICS" to "WORLD VIEW WITH BERNARD SHAW AND JUDY WOODRUFF," and of course here in the NEWSROOM the void in our hearts here is giant.
Joe's commitment to news coverage continues to be awe inspiring, eclipsed only by his commitment and love for his wife Lisa of at least two decades and their family.
We miss you, Joe.
Joe was 52.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
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[18:57:52] HARLOW: A man accused of kidnapping and torturing women has eluded cops for years. There's concern he may still be out there looking for new victims. And now John Walsh is on the case in this week's "THE HUNT."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN WALSH, HOST, "THE HUNT": I'm saddened, angry and very surprised that Paul Jackson has been able to stay out there 23 years, because he's still doing exactly what he did. Leopards don't change their spots, these type of guys.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The other victims still haven't been identified.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are a number of people who believe that some of these other women met with a worse and different fate than Andrea and Michelle.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: Criminologist Casey Jordan with us now.
Take me in to the mind here of someone who attacks prostitutes. These ones that they know of desperate, some of them hooked on drugs, desperate for money to feed that addiction.
CASEY JORDAN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: And the key word is vulnerability. With streetwalkers, sex workers, they're always vulnerable but these women particularly so because they needed money to support their drug habits. They admit it. They talk candidly about it. But the usual type of rapist that would prey on them would be a power control type of rapist.
You know, these three types, you got angry, and power and sadistic. Sadistic is only 5 percent of all our rapists and that's what this guy Paul Jackson is. He didn't just kidnap them. He put them in a truck, handcuffed them. Took them to a place with bars on the window, kept them for days an repeatedly raped them, along with his brother Van, holding them in a soundproof closet and making them believe they were going to be killed.
HARLOW: The fact is the brothers work together. Take us into that dynamic.
JORDAN: Relatively rare but it does happen. It usually happens, however, in sadistic rapists who become serial killers. A lot of people have heard of Henry Lee Lucas and Otis Tool, or Leonard Lake and Charles Ng, these guys were master-disciple who started out with sexual fantasies, went on a trajectory of actually abducting, stalking, and then raping and then killing, and holding people in torture chambers. So that's why they think that the photos they found of other women being tortured, those women could be dead and we just don't know it.
HARLOW: It is tragic. Casey Jordan, thank you very much.
The new episode of "THE HUNT" with John Walsh tonight, 9:00 pm Eastern. Other episodes of "THE HUNT" before that, straight up, next.
