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Clinton, Sanders Split Primary Wins; Fears Sanders Revolt Could Disrupt Dems Convention; Interview with Brian Fallon; Trump Open to Talks with North Korea; Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired May 18, 2016 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:00:01] CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: -- says he's proposed to change to the national constitution to make it happen. Same-sex marriage is already recognized in one quarter of Mexico's 32 states.

The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM starts now.

COSTELLO: Happening now in the NEWSROOM, Democratic split. Dividing the vote and Bernie Sanders digging in.

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We are in until the last ballot is cast.

COSTELLO: And now fears what happened at this Vegas Democratic convention won't stay in Vegas.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: People like you should be hung in a public execution.

ROBERT LANGE, CHAIRWOMAN, NEVADA STATE DEMOCRATIC PARTY: There were people sitting out in the crowd that heard people calling for my death that saw the chair thrown to the stage.

COSTELLO: Plus, Donald Trump drops a foreign policy bombshell when it comes to dealing with North Korea.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I would speak to him. I would have no problem speaking to him.

COSTELLO: Plus, Facebook face-to-face with conservatives after censorship claims. We've got the details on the meeting.

Let's talk. Live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: And good morning, I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

Hillary Clinton breaks Bernie Sanders' winning streak barely edging him out in Kentucky and essentially splitting delegates with him. In the meantime Sanders wins by a bigger margin in Oregon. So while he picks up more delegates, Clinton is now within 100 delegates of clinching the nomination. And Democratic fears of a Sanders rebellion still echo from over the weekend. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CROWD: No. No.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: That's the Nevada Democratic convention spiraling into chaos. Furious Sanders supporters say Democrats are stealing the election from Clinton. And now the party's national leaders fear that the same fury will burn at this summer's national Democratic convention in Philadelphia.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. DEBBIE WASSERMAN SCHULTZ, CHAIRWOMAN, DNC: Democratic leaders are working hard to make sure that we can prepare for the general election, that we can get through our primary nominating contest and it's incumbent upon everyone involved in the process to make sure when there is a concern over the process, that however legitimate you think your concern is, that you respond to that concern with civility and in an orderly way.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: The Sanders camp --

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: And that a -- excuse me. And that in no way is it ever acceptable to condone or to even -- or to ignore violence and intimidation against officials with whom you're frustrated.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Let's begin with senior Washington correspondent Joe Johns. Hi, Joe.

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. You got to wonder if the two sides are talking about this. So far no hint this morning from the Sanders or Clinton campaigns that there are any discussions under way to try to come together after a primary night that brought Hillary Clinton closer than ever to the number of delegates needed to clinch the Democratic nomination. She now needs just 89 as the focus turns to California and the primary on June 7th.

This morning Sanders is supposed to be at the fairgrounds in San Jose. Last night he held a huge rally in Los Angeles County giving every indication he plans to fight this out until the last vote is counted. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANDERS: Many of the pundits and politicians, they say, Bernie Sanders should drop out.

(CROWD BOOS)

SANDERS: The people of California should not have the right to determine who the next president will be.

(CROWD BOOS)

SANDERS: Well, let me be as clear as I can be. I agree with you, we are in until the last ballot is cast.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JOHNS: Last night Sanders said it would be a steep climb as he has before but he really did not lay out for his supporters how steep a climb it actually would be for him to get the nomination. It's mathematically very unlikely for him to get to the magic number for the nomination for president.

Now Hillary Clinton for her part has just about been focusing almost exclusively now on Donald Trump and the Republicans. And there's still no indication that these two sides are talking, Carol.

COSTELLO: All right. Joe Johns reporting live for us this morning. Thank you.

And this note, in a few minutes we'll have a live interview with Brian Fallon, the press secretary for the Clinton campaign. In fact he's sitting right beside me right now.

Democrats are worried that angry and alienated Sanders supporters could unleash chaos at the July convention much like Nevada's gathering this past weekend and their concerns are heightened by threats made against the state's party chairwoman.

Here are just a couple of the voicemail she received.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Roberta Lange. I'm pretty sure you're probably not going to get back to me because you don't care about the American people, but what you did today was corrupt, it was wrong and the Founding Fathers of our country would be ashamed of you.

[10:05:05] You deserve to be in prison. Not the chairman for the Democratic Party. Rot in hell.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That was pretty terrible. You probably just guaranteed fires in Philadelphia. I'm not a psycho-Bernie supporter but there are some out there. And you may have made bad decision by completely ignoring the Democratic process tonight. Thanks. Bye.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: All right, with more on this, let's head to Washington and our reporter, CNN correspondent Manu Raju joins us from Capitol Hill. Good morning.

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. Now this tension between the Sanders campaign and the party establishment really has been festering for months. The Sanders campaign and their supporters really believe that state after state, rules have been stacked against them. The party leadership is trying to maneuver to prevent their supporters from getting delegates at the national convention, really boiled over in that ugly scene in Nevada over the weekend.

Now the woman who is the chairwoman of that convention, Roberta Lange, says that she was subject to pretty harsh attacks while she was presiding over that convention. She had a little bit more about what happened on Saturday. Here's what she had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LANGE: There were people sitting out in the crowd that heard people calling for my death, that saw the chair thrown to the stage, that saw people being shoved and pushed. You know, that isn't the kind of examples that I'm looking for and we are moving to the Democratic convention in a few months where we as Democrats have to come together and put a Democrat in the White House. And so it's time we start talking about how we're going to bring everyone together instead of how we're going to tear everyone apart.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: And that's the fear of party leaders about disunity headed into Philadelphia. I had a chance a couple of times over the last few days to talk to the Nevada Democratic leader, the Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid. On Monday he said that this is Bernie Sanders' supporters fault, what happened in his state. And then on Tuesday he announced that he had a conversation with Bernie Sanders. He thought they were on the same page that Sanders is going to condemn very strongly what happened but instead Sanders wrote out a lengthy statement, while he did not condone the violence, they condemn the violence, he also was critical of party leaders.

And when I asked Harry Reid about that Sanders statement, he really let loose. He said that Bernie should say something, not have some silly statement. Bernie is better than that. Bernie should say something not have some statement someone else prepared for him. I'm surprised by his statement. I thought he was going to do something different.

Now, Carol, I should add I just talked to Tim Cain, the Virginia Democrat who is rumored actually to be on Hillary Clinton's short list to be vice president. He also took exception to Sanders' statement, said that he's very concerned. He said that Sanders should condemn them and condemn the actions by his supporters. It's a deflection of leadership. He said that is not real leadership what Sanders has done. So you're hearing a lot of concerns from the party establishment, part of that pension that's been growing over the recent weeks and months -- Carol.

COSTELLO: All right. Manu Raju reporting live from Capitol Hill.

While Sanders faces heat for not coming out strong enough after Nevada, as you heard Manu say, his campaign is certainly pushing back. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) JEFF WEAVER, SANDERS CAMPAIGN MANAGER: He categorically condemns any kind of threats that went on. Absolutely unacceptable. You know, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, we can have a long conversation just about Debbie Wasserman Schultz and how she's been throwing shade on the Sanders campaign since the very beginning.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Joining me now is Brian Fallon. He's the press secretary for Hillary for America.

Hi, Brian. Welcome.

BRIAN FALLON, PRESS SECRETARY, HILLARY FOR AMERICA: Thanks for having me.

COSTELLO: So you heard what Jeff Weaver said, he said Bernie Sanders condemns the violence, he doesn't approve of it. How much stronger can you be?

FALLON: We want everybody to take a step back and maintain proper perspective here. I think on the one hand, the Nevada senator, Harry Reid, the Democratic leader in the Senate, as Manu just talked about, I think is understandably upset because he's gone to great lengths to ensure a fair process. He remained neutral personally throughout the caucus process in February. And I think that what you saw from Roberta Lange and the other Democratic state party leaders was a fair and straightforward implementation of the rules.

The outcome of the convention was a simple of reflection of the delegates that were won at the caucus back in February. On the other hand, in terms of the unacceptable scenes you saw spill out, I do think that Bernie Sanders did the most important thing, which was condemn the violence there. And I don't think the people should over interpret what we saw in terms of the unacceptable scenes that played out in Nevada because there's been state party conventions happening quietly without much notice across the country. This is really the exception, not the rules so we don't think it's a harbinger for Philadelphia.

COSTELLO: So you're satisfied with Bernie Sanders' condemnation of what happened in Nevada?

FALLON: Well, I think that he did the most important thing, which was condemn these unacceptable voicemails and other threats that were made against the Nevada state Democratic chair. I think going forward we need to be vigilant in an ongoing way to ensure that supporters don't see conspiracy and what is really just a straightforward implementation of the rules.

But overall, I think the people are making too much of the idea that this is going to be a harbinger for Philadelphia. We don't think that.

[10:10:09] COSTELLO: The Nevada state chair, though, she wants an apology from Bernie Sanders. Does she deserve one? FALLON: Well, I'll leave that between the state party and the Sanders

campaign. For our part we're focused on the fact that we think that Democrats increasingly once we move out if the primary contests which will conclude on June 14th with the District of Columbia, coming out of that, we think that Democrats, whether you are a Sanders supporter or Clinton supporter will unite around the fact that the stakes are just too high.

COSTELLO: Have Clinton and Sanders talked?

FALLON: They've been in touch on an ongoing basis --

COSTELLO: Have they talked about --

FALLON: -- in recent months.

COSTELLO: What might happened at the convention in Philadelphia and --

FALLON: There'll be a time for that.

COSTELLO: -- the part that Bernie Sanders -- when might that time come?

FALLON: Well, I think the Sanders folks would be the first to tell you that they want to seriously contest the remaining states as we do. And as Senator Sanders said in that rally in California last night Californians want their ballots to count when they vote on June 7th alongside New Jersey and a few other states and we want those ballots to count and mean something, too. So Hillary Clinton is going to be returning to California very soon.

We're going to contest this primary all the way through. And then after that, at an appropriate point, we'll sit down and bring in the process of bringing the party together, including we want to ensure that we have a very open process with respect to, for instance, the platform that gets approved at the convention.

COSTELLO: But do you understand why Bernie Sanders supporters are so frustrated? And it just didn't start now, right? It started with the debate schedule long ago, right? With the debates, you know, happening on the weekend where nobody could really watch them in large numbers. This has been an ongoing frustration for Sanders supporters.

FALLON: Well, I think that the process has been fair. And I think that the --

COSTELLO: I think that's because Hillary Clinton is winning some might say.

FALLON: Well, but she's -- while the result in a state like Kentucky last night was very close, what's not close right now is the state of the race. Joe Johns just broke it down. The lead right now is three million people in terms of the popular vote, pledged delegate count is not close. We're getting very near the point where we will clinch the nomination outright. And so I think that there's always a tendency on the part of the side that comes up short to say what could have been or what might have been if something had broke differently.

But I think overall people would be hard pressed to suggest that Bernie Sanders didn't have every opportunity and it's been a remarkable achievement when you look at all the states that he's won and all the people that he's brought into the process. We tip our cap to him. This has been a tremendous service he's done to the Democratic Party and we take him at his word when he says that he's going to work his heart out seven days a week to prevent Donald Trump from becoming the next president of the United States.

COSTELLO: Brian Fallon, thanks so much.

FALLON: Thank you.

COSTELLO: Stick around, in just about 30 minutes, we will talk to Nevada's embattled Democratic chairwoman on the threats she's been receiving and why she feels that she needs that personal apology from Bernie Sanders.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, ahead of a meeting with Henry Kissinger, Donald Trump says he's ready to sit down with North Korea's leader. We'll talk about that next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:17:10] COSTELLO: Sometime today Donald Trump will meet with former Nixon secretary of state, Henry Kissinger. They'll presumably talk about foreign policy and perhaps about Mr. Trump's assertion that he would be willing to sit down with the North Korean leader, Kim Jong-un.

CNN's Phil Mattingly has more on that. Good morning.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. Certainly an interesting topic to broach with kind of the premiere GOP elder statesman when it comes to foreign policy. And Carol, this came up in Reuters interview yesterday and it would no doubt be a significant shift in U.S. policy towards North Korea. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I would speak to him. I would have no problem speaking to him. At the same time, I would put a lot of pressure on China because economically we have tremendous power over China. People don't realize that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But you say you would talk to Kim?

TRUMP: The one -- I would speak to him. I have no problem with speaking to him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Now no doubt about it the Clinton campaign quickly attacked on this, basically said this led into narrative that they are pushing that he is naive on foreign policy. You might recognize this a little bit because nine years ago President Barack Obama then Senator Barack Obama in a CNN debate said something very similar and was attacked for being naive. But it's worth noting Trump supporters may be willing to consider even though it's on the Republican side of the aisle. Take a listen to Jeff Sessions, the Alabama senator.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JEFF SESSIONS (R), ALABAMA: I believe there's nobody run for president in years who understands how to negotiate more effectively than Donald Trump. And I do believe he will not be disadvantaged by Kim Jong-il or anybody in North Korea. I think it's unlikely that a good result would come out of it but to attempt something like that may be worth the effort.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Just maybe. What Senator Sessions gets at there really, Carol, is the crux of the Trump kind of policy statement here. And that's that he believes he can negotiate with anybody and if he sits down at a table with them, he can end up winning the negotiation. It's worked for him during the course of his business career, it's been very attractive to voters throughout the course of his campaign. Why wouldn't it work in the White House as well?

Now people who are opposed to this type of thing would say what it does is it legitimizes a rogue dictatorship, it gives Kim Jong-un, somebody who's more or less desperate for public attention, exactly that. What will be interesting to see going forward is not just if there's any redoubt of what Henry Kissinger thinks about this perspective on the North Korea issue but also what Donald Trump said about China, not just in general over the course of his campaign but specifically ramping up pressure on China related to North Korea.

The White House currently, Carol, operates behind the scenes, trying to kind of push and cajole China to help them push Kim Jong-un. Obviously China pretty much the lone helper, the lone economic aid to North Korea. Henry Kissinger over the past couple of years has warned pushing too hard on China and what that would mean to border state, millions people if North Korea were destabilized would come over that border.

[10:20:03] So how Henry Kissinger would react not just to sitting down with Kim Jong-un but also Donald Trump's rather strong statements about China over the course of the campaign will be very interesting to note, Carol.

COSTELLO: All right, Phil Mattingly, thanks so much.

So let's talk more about this. With me now, Bill Richardson, he's a former U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, he's also a Hillary Clinton supporter, and CNN international diplomatic editor Nic Robertson also joins me live.

Welcome to you both.

Ambassador Richardson, I want to start with you because you're known for being a North Korea troubleshooter, that's how many times you've actually negotiated with North Korea for the release of American hostages. Would it be a good idea for Mr. Trump to sit down with Kim Jong-un if he becomes president?

BILL RICHARDSON, HILLARY CLINTON SUPPORTER: No, it wouldn't. Not at this time because it would give some legitimacy to a regime that doesn't want to negotiate, that is holding several Americans prisoner, that doesn't want to curb their nuclear appetite, that sends missiles raining on their allies.

You know, Trump is so inconsistent. On the one hand he's saying he wants to arm South Korea and Japan with nuclear weapons against North Korea, and then on the other hand he reaches out to the North Korean leader and insults David Cameron, the U.K. leader, the British leader who's probably America's best friend, Great Britain is the special relationship. So Henry Kissinger has a very tall order. It's like trying to tame a bucking bronco. But Kissinger is a very respected figure and I hope he knocks some sense into Donald Trump.

COSTELLO: Nic, how would America's allies feel if an American president would sit down with Kim Jong-un?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: That's -- Carol, if I hear you correctly, I'm having some trouble hearing you at the moment, sorry.

COSTELLO: Can you hear me now, Nic?

ROBERTSON: Yes, I can. Go ahead.

COSTELLO: OK. OK. I was just asking how would American allies feel if an American president sat down with Kim Jong-un?

ROBERTSON: It would give them cause for concern because it's not something that they've seen before. But I think in terms of the Chinese, they have said that they are an ally, particularly in this situation, where they have said that they are willing and they believe that it's better to have direct negotiations between the United States and the North Koreans, they believe that is a good thing. The Foreign Ministry spokesman said that recently.

For the South Koreans, this -- who would most -- be most keenly affected in all of this, this would be a departure but clearly they understand that the goal would be to reduce the tensions. The concern more broadly going forward would be that this would perhaps embolden Kim Jong-un to reach beyond his grasp yet further because he's getting the sort of attention that he's been seeking. So it would likely cause some concerns, yes.

COSTELLO: And Mr. Ambassador, I'd like you to listen to something that Donald Trump said about Kim Jong-un, the North Korean leader, back in January. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: You've got to give him credit. How many young guys, he was like 26 or 25 when his father died, take over these tough generals and all of a sudden, you know, it's pretty amazing when you think of it? How does he do that? Even though it is a culture, and it's a cultural thing. He goes in and he takes over, he's the boss. It's incredible. He wiped out the uncle, he wiped out this one, that one.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: So just to remind our viewers, Kim executed his uncle. He also executed his military chief and his vice premier.

Mr. Ambassador, how do you take Mr. Trump's comments?

RICHARDSON: Well, they are very irresponsible. Here he's taking -- giving credit to North Korean leader for executing people, for taking them out. You know, he's so naive about foreign policy. It's all rhetoric. He has no substance to what he's saying. He's also wrong about China. China has the leverage over North Korea because they give them food, fuel. We have to get China to get North Korea more responsible but China won't do it. So Trump has got his eggs mixed up because he is saying that we have leverage over China.

You know, this is a very competitive relationship, the U.S. and China. So again, my hope is that Henry Kissinger, who knows the region, who knows China, who knows Asia, you don't want to have a face to face with the North Korean leader unless there's a lot of preparatory diplomatic work by your deputies, by your special envoys. There has to be a basis for sitting down. You just don't sit down and talk. You have to have preparatory work. You have to have substance behind it.

North Korea should curtail their nuclear weapons development, their missiles. They should stop sending missiles that might get the South Korea and Japan our allies.

[10:25:04] You know, negotiating directly with North Korea right now without preparatory work, without some substance behind it, but -- would be I think catastrophic.

COSTELLO: On the other hand, Nic, President Obama met with Raul Castro and talked with phone by the Iranian president to negotiate a nuclear deal. Is it that outlandish of an idea to sit down and negotiate with Kim Jong-un?

ROBERTSON: I think what's to be expected in this course of conversation that we've heard and conversations going forward on foreign policy from Donald Trump and this is again, if we look at this interview that he gave where he speaks -- where he talks about speaking directly to Kim Jong-un, that he also talked about the British prime minister, David Cameron. I mean, remember, only days ago, he had said that the relationship between him and David Cameron wouldn't be very good. Yet now he's saying while David Cameron's comments were inappropriate but we can have a good relationship to a degree here if we analyze the sort of passage of what Donald Trump is saying over time.

He's also in the same interview moderated his tone on President Putin, not so -- not talking about him in quite such glowing terms, criticizing his role, President Putin's role in Ukraine. So I think we can imagine that when Donald Trump does go and talk with Henry Kissinger, that he is likely to take on board some of what he's said. But once you put yourself out there saying that you'll talk to someone like Kim Jong-un, you're putting yourself in a difficult position where you're only going to expose yourself to criticism once you begin walking back from that position, which seems at this stage of his foreign policy learnings, if you will, is an inevitable consequence of what he's going to hear from all those around him. And we've seen he does change his position.

COSTELLO: Yes. I want to ask the same question, Mr. Ambassador. So if President Obama reached out to Iran and -- you know, and to Raul Castro in Cuba, why is that so different from Kim Jong-un?

RICHARDSON: Well, because there was a lot of preparatory work with Cuba. With Iran there were serious negotiations. You know, Kim Jong- un has said he's not going to curtail his nuclear weapons. He imprisons Americans, he has missiles shooting all over our allies. He threatens the United States. You know, there's a difference.

Look, I've been one that have advocated a new approach to North Korea. I think the strategic patience policy needs to change. We need to get Russia, China, South Korea, Japan, the U.S. in a new approach. In other words some kind of concessions to North Korea in exchange for them behaving properly, stopping their bad behavior. But that doesn't mean that you just say OK, let's talk, Kim Jong-un, without a lot of advanced preparatory work.

I think President Obama deserves credit for China, for Iran. You know, Iran is still a little murky but I think in the long run it is reduced tensions. But I think with North Korea it has to be done very carefully. And I do disagree with, Nic, you can't be running for president and not have commander-in-chief credentials. You can't just shoot your mouth off and then change them. I think this is an advantage Hillary Clinton has. She was secretary of state. She can be commander-in-chief right away.

COSTELLO: All right, I have to leave it there. Bill Richardson and Nic Robertson, thanks to both of you.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, a Nigerian school girl reunited with her family more than two years after she and her classmates were kidnapped by Boko Haram terrorists.

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