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Trump, Clinton Face Off on Tonight. Aired 3:30-4p ET, 9PM ET

Aired September 26, 2016 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00] DAVID GERGEN, SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: -- our CNN poll has her ten points higher than him --

ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: In terms of ---

GERGEN: In terms of who's going to win the debate.

BURNETT: Yes.

GERGEN: In terms of who is likely to win the debate. I think it's a legitimate concern where she's held to one standard and he held to another. Underdog wins that's a big upset. If the favorite wins, that's a decisive thing. But what if they tie? Traditionally the tie goes to the underdog.

BURNETT: Traditionally.

GERGEN: If he comes off as good as she is, as presidential as she is, that's going to help him. A lot of Clintonites will object to that standard.

BURNETT: Thank you both very much. David Gergen, Ari Fleischer. Both of whom have been there.

Coming up, 11th-hour preparations. Our report on what candidates are doing right now. Hillary Clinton in a hotel right near where I'm sitting at Hofstra University. We'll let the band take over at Hofstra University as our live coverage continues.

[15:35:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BURNETT: Welcome back to CNN. I'm Erin Burnett. This is our special coverage here on CNN as we get you ready for tonight's presidential debate. You can hear the Hofstra band getting ready. Some of the students out here very excited about the event their university is hosting tonight. The 11th hour, we're in the final moments before Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton will face off in what will be an epic at Hofstra University. Every second remaining really matters at this point, depending on how they're spending it to make sure they're at their peak performance tonight at 9:00 p.m.

Our Sunlen Serfaty joins me live. And Sunlen, right now they each have a plan. Hillary Clinton has obviously done this before, enough that he has a look in the last few hours before a debate, I like to do this. What are they doing right now?

SUNLEN SURFATY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's really interesting because what we're seeing from both candidates, even at this late hour they're both, in essence, still cramming. We know from aides for Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton, that each of them spent some part of the day in last-minute huddling with campaign aides. Hillary Clinton is preparing off-site for a bit of time and then she'll come over eventually for tonight's debate.

It definitely seems her debate prep has been more centered in recent days around these full-fledged mock debates. Her long-time aide playing the role of Donald Trump. Interestingly enough, he's been spending a lot more time playing, according to aides, this more presidential Donald Trump than the more combative Donald Trump. That's the direction the team Clinton believes Trump may go tonight.

Donald Trump has been leaning on people like Rudy Giuliani, Chris Christie, who were both at Trump Tower over the weekend really going over questions and answers. While he has, of course, been studying past debate reels of Hillary Clinton's past debate performances, he's not engaged in this full-fledged mock debate unlike Hillary Clinton, no one is standing in to play Hillary Clinton during his practice sessions. Erin?

BURNETT: Thank you very much. Look, they've all been through -- they've both been through some nasty debates over the past year. Clinton really had Sanders to contend with. Trump, obviously, knocked out 16 other people. Here's some of the highlights.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm a little skeptical about your governor actually caring enough about higher education to make any kind of commitment like that.

What really is behind that question, Republicans and Democrats, is whether I can stand up to Wall Street.

Well let's have some facts instead of rhetoric for a change.

JEB BUSH, EX GOVERNOR, FLORIDA: You got Hillary Clinton to go to your wedding. Because you gave her money. It doesn't work for --

DONALD TRUMP, REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Jeb, I'm a businessman. I got along with Clinton and everybody. That was my job, to get along with people.

Super PACs are a disaster, a scam. They cause dishonesty and you better get rid of them because they're causing a lot of bad decisions to be made by some very good people. I am not blaming these folks, but I guess I could.

MODERATOR: Are you seriously blaming Vermont and implicitly, Senator Sanders, for New York's gun violence?

CLINTON: Of course not. Of course not. This is a serious difference between us. And what I want to start by saying -- it's not a laughing matter. [15:40:00] TRUMP: I've hired tens of thousands of people over my job.

You've hired nobody. You have problems with your credit cards, et cetera.

CLINTON: I want white people to recognize that there is systemic racism. It's also in employment, it's in housing, but it is in the criminal justice system as well.

JEB BUSH: You're never going to be president of the United States by insulting your way to the presidency.

TRUMP: I'm at 42, you're at 3. So far I'm doing better.

JEB BUSH: Doesn't matter.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: Well, let's bring in our panel here as we count you down. Betsy McCaughey, former lieutenant governor of New York, Trump supporter, Bakari Sellers, CNN commentator, former South Carolina representative, Hillary Clinton supporter. Mark Preston, our executive politics director and Jackie Kucinich, CNN political analyst and Washington bureau chief for "The Daily Beast".

Mark you have been saying and you know it was interesting, James Fallows of "The Atlantic" was talking, if you want to see who wins or loses, watch without the sound but as a citizen, watch with the sound on. The point is you can -- and you know it is funny when you think back of course to the famous Nixon/JFK debate.

If you heard but didn't see, but in this case it is watch without the volume. You are going to be looking for that as well.

MARK PRESTON, CNN EXECUTIVE POLITICS EDITOR: It's all about body language. This is a television event. Upwards of 100 million people watching on television. The number will be so much wider globally. Then let's not take into account the fact who will watch it online. All of it being cut up and sent around very quickly. I just think that the body language and how they react to one another and if they're able to do it in a way that looks professional and it doesn't look like the opponent is getting under their skin is extremely important.

BURNETT: It's easy to say that. People say, OK, you control your reactions. That's fine if you're going to be on for six minutes and there are other people on stage. It's fine, if it's a shorter debate or you have commercial breaks. This is 90 straight minutes. Nobody can truly -- maybe John Brennan from the CIA, people like that can control their -- control their expressions.

JACKIE KUCINICH, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Just ask Al Gore with the sighs and the eye rolls and everything that he did during his first debate that sort of -- it really set the tone for the rest of that election. Those nonverbal things really do matter. One of the things Hillary Clinton is going to have to watch is that she maintains -- that Donald Trump should be on the stage with her. Not roll her eyes, not -- because there is this, why am I losing to this guy? Why am I tied with this guy? She has to put a lid on that tonight.

BURNETT: Do you agree?

BAKARI SELLERS, CNN COMMENTATOR: I think Hillary Clinton has to do something that is sometimes more difficult for Hillary Clinton, which is too inspire people. I don't think she's worried about being knocked off her perch by Donald Trump's policy chops. That's not going to happen. But she does have to explain to people why she's running for president of the United States. One of the things that can get her off her game tonight is if Donald Trump continues to do what he did in his campaign, which is lie. And Hillary Clinton's going to have to be able to deal with those lies day in and day out. Whether or not you're talking about Iraq, Syria, whether or not you are talking about the Trump foundation --

BETSY MCCAUGHEY, FORMER LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR OF NEW YORK, TRUMP SUPPORTER: She's the queen of lying.

SELLERS: Those lies are going to be something that will -- do have the ability to knock her off, especially if she has to fact-check as they go.

MCCAUGHEY: She's the queen of lying. What voters want to hear from her tonight is why she told her staff to erase thousands of work- related e-mails when she was secretary of state. They, in fact had to get immunity from the FBI to talk about what they did.

BURNETT: OK.

MCCAUGHEY: I can just tell you as former lieutenant governor, someone who's run a not-for-profit, when I left any of those positions, I did not erase my record in that job and that honest people don't do that.

BURNETT: That is going to be an issue tonight, the e-mails. We know that for sure. On the just pure issue of lying, at least the analysis that's been done in and out recently --

SELLERS: I didn't make that up.

BURNETT: -- There is no comparison, Donald Trump has said a lot more things untrue than Hillary Clinton. That is a reality.

MCCAUGHEY: Oh, come on, Hillary Clinton has made her career out of lying. No, it isn't. It's just what the liberal media reaches for. She lies from the moment she gets up in the morning to the moment she goes to bed.

SELLERS; You're doing well. You see what Lester Holt has to deal with.

[15:45:00] PRESTON: Can I help you here?

BURNETT: Yes.

PRESTON: Can I jump in? She has her own honesty and trustworthy issues. BURNETT: Yes, she does.

PRESTON: The facts are the facts. The facts are the facts. They just don't lie.

MCCAUGHEY: The facts are the facts. The fact is she turned the state department into a cash machine to benefit her family foundation.

PRESTON: Wait. That's different than --

MCCAUGHEY: Oh, I'm sorry. It's theft, it's theft.

BURNETT: First of all, OK, no such thing has ever been proven.

MCCAUGHEY: That's not true. That's not true. The FBI has pointed to these --

BURNETT: What hopefully will not happen is what happened right here. I don't think people to want see it devolve like that. Which it could. That wouldn't just be a disservice not just the viewers but also how would that play.

KUCINICH: That's the thing. These two people want to tell the voters why they should be president. Not why the other person is a mess. If this devolves into a food fight, your e-mails, you lie all the time, people might just turn off their TVs. Maybe they'll vote for Gary Johnson or Jill Stein. It's not good for either of them. They both need a positive message to tell people.

BURNETT: On that point, you mentioned Gary Johnson and Jill Stein, a majority of American people think they should be on that stage. And the reason the majority of the American people think that, I believe, is because a lot of people don't like Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump. They are not voting for one. They're voting against the other. They want to see the others on the stage.

PRESTON: I think the American people likes the idea of options. It's like going to the cafeteria. A little of this, a little of that. The problem with Gary Johnson and Jill Stein, clear rules were created and they were not able to meet the rules. So, while people will say that, they're not willing to offer their support to them to get them to the threshold in public polling, which is unfortunate for them but it's reality.

SELLERS: If I may, I want to get back to something we should look for tonight. I anticipate one, and I believe you actually said this earlier, but I believe Donald Trump is not going to be the Donald Trump that was just a part of this conversation we were having here.

He's going to be very, very, for lack of a better term, sedated and kind of -- not the same combative Donald Trump we've seen. What I believe Hillary Clinton is going to do is I believe Hillary Clinton is going to attack the core of his message, which is make America great again. She's going to have to show why America is great today. She's going to have to be able to take the audience from one place to another, which again we haven't seen much of. MCCAUGHEY: And that's going to be very tough to do when American are

earning less now than they did in 2007.

SELLERS: That's also not true because wages have grown -- we have had the highest wage growth since 1999.

MCCAUGHEY: It still hasn't gone back to 2007.

SELLERS: If Donald Trump keeps interrupting, like we're seeing here, it will be a long, long --

MCCAUGHEY: Because Donald Trump wants a fair shake. What Americans need to know is Hillary Clinton is predicting, under her economic plan, that the nation will grow at 2% per year. We can't afford that anymore. Donald Trump's plan will offer tax cuts to all Americans except the mega rich. Hillary Clinton's plan will produce tax hikes, a recession and very low growth.

SELLERS: I anticipate we'll have to explain that tonight.

BURNETT: We can have a field day with the economic conversation here.

SELLERS: Hopefully, he can explain that.

BURNETT: He says debt is an issue, look, there are issues here --

MCCAUGHEY: Americans need to make more money. He's going to ask Americans what's in your wallet?

BURNETT: Thank you, all.

Next, we'll discuss the role of the moderator tonight. Will he play the role of fact-checker? As I think Ari was explaining, it's incredibly difficult to do it in just the right way without influencing the voter. I'll talk with two journalists about the questions they would ask tonight. This is our special coverage. We'll be right back.

[15:50:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BURNETT: Tonight's presidential debate will be a moment of truth for the two candidates. It will also be a moment, high stakes moment, for the moderator, who is Lester Holt. He will be in the spotlight, and of course he'll be scrutinized. This country is incredibly polarized, half the country will hate half the things he asks, how well he fact checks, and how well he keeps the candidates honest.

Joining me now, CNN correspondent, host of "Reliable Sources". Also Brian Stelter, CNN reporter. Also with me Dylan Byers our senior media and politics reporter. Brian, let me start with you just on the issue of the questions and topics. It's very interesting, we all have been sitting here saying 90 minutes without bathroom breaks, without commercial breaks how difficult that is. And you came out here saying, wow, it's such a short period of time.

BRAIN STELTER, CNN HOST OF "RELIABLE SOURCES": I'm already wishing we could extend it to three hours. The pressure on Holt is enormous. It is in some ways a no win situation.

Even though I think he's very expertly prepared for what's about to happen in less than six hours. He's not going to be able to get to every single question that he and we want answered. He has to choose his spots and I think he will.

DYLAN BYERS, CNN SENIOR MEDIA AND POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: I think that is absolutely right, and I think 90 minutes is -- it seems like a long time. It's long time for these candidates to maintain discipline, but we've been watching this for 14, 15 months. We want more time. And at the end of the day, three 90-minute debates, I think we'll be left wanting more.

STELTER: Which is why it's important to see them interact. I have lots of interview questions I wish Holt would ask about birtherism. I have lots of interview questions I wish he could ask about the email scandal, however, he has got to ask the big questions. He needs to get them to talking with each other, and I think that's what he'll focus on.

BURNETT: Right, and that is what the skill is about. It is watching them interact in terms of what they have to say but also their body language, their eyes, whether there an eye roll or a sigh exasperation. His job is to get them to talk.

BYERS: I would just say there has been so many questions about the media, and the media's role and how are you supposed to interview these candidates? How do you handle these candidates? What sort of fact checking should you do? The two people running for president are Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton. I want to see what Hillary decides she needs to fact check Donald Trump on. I want to see what Donald Trump thinks he needs questions put to Hillary Clinton. They're the two running for president. At the end of the day, that's why we need more time with these people on stage.

[15:55:00] BURNETT: And in terms of where you think she'll go, Dylan. She doesn't want to look like a scold. She doesn't want to come in on every single thing and say, no this, no that. That won't play well for her, but she has to pick her spots. What will those spots be? Does she say, I'm going to do birther and the Iraq war? How does she make those decisions?

BYERS: I have to imagine the tax returns. And for me what sort of questions do the moderators want to ask, one big one is what do the American people have a right to know about you and your opponent before they go to the voting booth? And that to me that's an opening for Hillary Clinton to talk about tax returns, it's an opening for Donald Trump to talk about greater transparency about the e-mail issue. Frankly, I think the American people do have a right to know the answers.

BURNETT: Brian, one thing both campaigns have done very successfully is to demonize the press. You just heard Betsy McCaughey say, Donald Trump doesn't lie, it's just the liberal media. But a fact check is a check, that will be the Trump side. The Clinton campaign said, it's a double standard. No one is fact checking the Trump campaign and if it's not a 100% against them then it's biased.

They both have come out using the media as sort of the devil.

STELTER: And the Clinton campaign saying these two candidates should be judged equally. That normally wouldn't be a controversial thing to say, but Donald Trump, we've never had a candidate like him before. Reality TV star, billionaire businessman. We have never seen this before.

My advice? Put down the phone and watch the debate, just soak it up for 90 minutes and you decide at home who won, who lost without all the twitter and Facebook chatter.

BURNETT: Don't let anyone else influence what you actually think.

STELTER: That's my advice. Lester Holt is working for us, he's the one channeling the viewers at home.

BURNETT: We've both worked for him. He's a man with upstanding morality and a wonderful person.

STELTER: I think he might be the only winner tonight, we will see.

BURNETT: Don't go anywhere. We'll take you inside the spin room when CNN special live coverage of tonight's debate continues in just a moment.