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Police Reform Deal Nearing?; Merrick Garland on Capitol Hill; President Biden Begins First Foreign Trip. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired June 09, 2021 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:00]

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: But now it just must be a very different feeling.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: No question, arriving on Air Force One.

Air Force Two isn't bad, but I can tell you, Air Force One, it is the symbol of power that is recognizable worldwide, and for the first time, President Biden arriving on foreign soil with that, and really carrying a lot of advisers with him and a very important policy agenda.

But that is the biggest difference. He's been everywhere on this planet, never arrived as he did today, never in the position that he has. So, even for someone like Joe Biden, there are still firsts, and this certainly is an important one.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: All right, everybody, stay with us. We will continue our breaking news now at the top of a brand-new hour.

CAMEROTA: All right, everybody, welcome.

You are looking at President Biden there on the world stage for his first trip as president. He is at Royal Air Base Mildenhall in the U.K., and he's about to address troops very shortly. Of course, we will bring that to you live when it happens.

The president and the first lady had just arrived moments ago. And, again, this is his first international trip since taking office.

BLACKWELL: So, the next eight days will be packed with meetings with U.S. allies, many of them eager to move past the turmoil of the last administration and cooperate on some of the most pressing problems.

Of course, we know the global vaccination efforts, climate change, cybersecurity, terrorism. He will also meet with Russian President Vladimir Putin, as we said.

He will -- we will have a team of reporters and analysts to put this trip into perspective, bringing back CNN's Jeff Zeleny there in the U.K. CNN's Clarissa Ward is also in London, CNN's chief political analyst, Gloria Borger. And also with us this hour, CNN global affairs analyst Aaron David Miller.

So, Jeff, before touching down, the president made the news -- and you broke it here -- of vaccines, a half-billion doses around the world. Talk more about -- the timing is obvious. But we know that this was something that many countries were calling for the U.S. to do.

ZELENY: Indeed.

And this is somebody the world has been waiting for. So President Biden is going to make that really his opening gambit tomorrow here at the Group of Seven summit when he sits down and he says the United States will purchase 500 million doses of the COVID-19 vaccination from Pfizer and give them to a COVAX.

That is the international agency that really distributes vaccinations across the globe. And these are going to be targeted at lower-income countries that really are in desperate need of these vaccines. So for all the talk back in the United States about how state and local and federal governments are trying to encourage people through lotteries and other gimmicks, if you will, to take the vaccine, it is desperately needed around the world.

So the White House has been criticized for that. So President Biden is going to open his time on the world stage over the next week by saying, look, the U.S. is going to buy these doses. So that will certainly earn some goodwill.

But there are many, many other challenges on this topic, and many others awaiting him.

CAMEROTA: Let's talk about those challenges, Aaron David Miller. Great to have you.

We in the last hour talked about all of his domestic agenda items that seem to be stalled. Does that weaken him on the world stage?

AARON DAVID MILLER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: You know, it's one of the paradoxes of the presidency. When domestic agendas seem to sputter, the president can always fall back on the fact that, unlike Congress or Supreme Court that goes in and out of session, he's the 24/7 Energizer Bunny when it comes -- certainly when it comes to foreign policy.

And in this sense, I think there's a lot of low-hanging fruit to be picked. But I come back to your central point. I do not believe there's a single foreign policy issue out there that is more damaging or dangerous, not only to Joe Biden's presidency, but to the future of this republic, than the three or four interlocked crises that we face at home.

And governing is about choosing. Biden is here to station identify, to demonstrate that America's back, to strengthen relations with allies. The two most interesting meetings he is going to have, though, with adversaries, Erdogan of Turkey and, of course, Putin with -- Putin with Russia.

So that, I think, is the key. And I think he will emerge from his trip looking better, looking stronger. Again, though, the question is, when he returns, he's going to return to those transformational legislative initiatives that could, if, in fact, he can find a way to get them through, mark him as a transformational president at home.

BLACKWELL: Gloria, this is -- I'm looking at these pictures here from a few moments ago as the first couple is greeting Americans there on the ground in the U.K.

There's something to be said for the return to face-to-face meetings.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes.

BLACKWELL: I mean, it's been almost two years since there's been an in-person G7, since these leaders have been in a room together.

[15:05:00]

And there is a variable that cannot be duplicated through Zoom meetings.

BORGER: Right, especially for a politician like Joe Biden, because that's the way he has spent his life.

He is somebody who prefers face-to-face meetings. I mean, he often picks up the phone and calls people. But you will see, as we have been reporting, he keeps inviting people down to the White House all the time, because he wants to meet with them face to face.

He's a creature of the Senate. That's what they did. They met face to face. And I think that's what he likes to do. So, I think you're absolutely right. I think that will add something to these sessions, because people off the record, leaders off the record will be able to speak with each other freely and seriously, and not on some kind of a Zoom call, where other people are watching or listening.

And those meetings, if you want to call them meetings, that chatter, I guess I would call it, is very important, is very important for world leaders, when they need to get to know each other and where they are coming from. I mean, will some of the leaders, for example, talk to him about what was happening the last four years? Will some of these leaders talk to him about the electoral challenges that he faces in states like Arizona or how are you doing?

We don't -- we really don't know. But you can't have those conversations unless you have them privately face to face.

CAMEROTA: Will they, Clarissa? I mean, will they bring up those things with President Biden? What's first on their agenda?

What do European leaders and Erdogan and Putin want to get out of this?

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I think they want to get out a really strong sense of commitment that the U.S. is back, and not just back for four years, but back for good, that international alliances mean something.

Europe has been in a state of shock, frankly, after four years of President Trump, who was vocally pro-Brexit, who was denigrating NATO, who called the G7 outdated, who appeared to court autocrats, who didn't really take any interest in taking a robust stance in concert with his traditional European and Western allies.

So, Europe very much wants to take away from this, and not just Europe, I should add Japan also attending, as well as Australia, India, South Korea -- all of these countries want to feel again that the U.S. is taking a central leadership role here, because they see this as being a really pivotal existential moment for the West and for liberal democracies.

According to one study, for the first time since 2001, there are more autocracies than democracies in the world. Autocracies are on the rise. And so this is a pivotal moment for democracies to come together and release more than just sound bites.

And this is what's so important. There has to be substantive delivery of results as a result of this trip, of this meeting. We have to see real action, whether it's in the form of tackling coronavirus, climate change, a lot of really tricky, thorny issues that require a huge amount of will from many different countries to come together in an era where people are really calling into question the very reality and realisticness of international cooperation.

BLACKWELL: Now, Aaron, we watched over the last five years, in certain areas where the U.S. stepped off the stage, other countries, namely, China, stepped on.

When the U.S. backed away from the Trans-Pacific Partnership, China led its own major Asian trading bloc. How much of the leadership space is irretrievable, like, if Biden comes back, that space is now not available for the U.S. to take over again?

MILLER: That's a critically important question.

And I'm a great believer in American power, leadership and diplomacy, but we really have to wake up and smell the proverbial coffee. COVID was the most world-altering event since the end of the Second World War. And it's intensified competition between great powers. It's reinforced nationalism, rather than multinationalism or multilateralism as a force.

We're dealing with a changed world, where, in fact, great powers, China, middle-sized powers, Putin -- in Putin's mind, great powers, Russia, and even smaller powers, like Iran, for example, are determined to oppose, if they can, the notion of Pax Americana, of American leadership.

I think much can be done. But I think, if Biden wants to put America back at the head of the table, the first order of business -- and I think Jake Sullivan, Tony Blinken and the president understand this -- the table has been alternately -- unalterably, in my judgment, changed.

And we need to be extremely careful about the rhetoric we use and also our own internal contradictions and flaws when it comes to the promotion of good governance and democracy.

[15:10:07]

CAMEROTA: Gloria, what are the deliverables from this trip? What should we -- what are the benchmarks of success that we should be looking for a week from now?

BORGER: I really can't say at this point, other than to say that, as president, the United States, Joe Biden has to show that America is part of a world community that respects the United States and believes in the United States.

And I think one of the things you're going to hear from Joe Biden -- and this kind of goes back to his domestic policy -- is that democracies cannot survive, he believes, democracies cannot survive unless the government can deliver for the people. That's what he is talking about when he talks about his Rescue Plan and his Jobs Plan and his Families Plan, et cetera, et cetera.

Democracies have to deliver, because autocracies very often do deliver, right? And so you have to prove, when you're in this race between democracies and autocracies, that democracy can serve the people well. That is the message, I have been told by a senior adviser, that he is going to deliver.

And I think that is the message that he's going to take to this group, as well as to Vladimir Putin, who will no doubt go on about whataboutism, this goes on, corruption goes on in your country, yes, it goes on in mine. And Biden will say, no, we are a democracy.

And I think that's how all of these leaders are going to distinguish themselves and join together. And they have all spoken about it publicly. And I think this is a moment to sort of reassure the members that, yes, America is a democracy that will survive and thrive.

BLACKWELL: Jeff, we are waiting to hear from the president there at Mildenhall, we heard from the vice president. As one trip starts, another one is wrapping up.

What's the assessment inside the White House -- we have heard the criticism outside -- of what the -- some of the remarks, some of the responses to questions, especially about visiting the border, from Vice President Kamala Harris?

ZELENY: Look, we have seen Vice President Kamala Harris being assigned some very difficult tasks.

And the flow of migrants from -- excuse me -- from Central America, certainly is part of that. But, look, there are people inside the White House who think that she did not perform as well or conduct yourself as well as perhaps she should have with the simple questions of, are you going to visit the border? This is something that the White House has really been grappling with, everyone in the White House, not just her, over the last several months. Is immigration a crisis? The White House has really declined to use that word. Same as visiting the border. They do not believe that they have wanted it to overtake the agenda.

Well, because of all of that, because of all the reluctance to do that, we saw Vice President Harris, really, she was flip at one point. She's like, I have not visited a Europe as well, I have not visited the border. Then she said she would.

Look, inside the White House, there is very much a -- it's a two- person shop. This is not one unit, necessarily. The White House -- the West Wing has been really planning and preparing for President Biden's trip here. And a separate group of people have been working on Vice President Harris' trip to Guatemala and Mexico City.

And there's not been much overlap. So now there has been some harsh assessments, quite frankly, of her performance on the world stage. But vice presidents grow in office. Presidents grow in office. And certainly this is something that she, well, tried to do, people on the Biden side of the White House want her to do.

I'm not sure it's the disaster that some groups and outside forces are saying that it was. We have some short memories here of things. But, certainly, this is one of the interesting ongoing storylines. The marriage between any vice president and president comes with some stumbles and some rifts. And this certainly is a bit of a rocky one at this moment.

But back to President Biden for just one second, if I could add to what to Gloria and Clarissa were saying. His entire agenda is framed about the competitiveness of America in the world. So, he believes -- he has a tough road on his legislative agenda at home, no doubt. He's coming here when many of his priorities are in peril.

But he believes and he says repeatedly that, for America to be more competitive with the rest of the world, they must spend more on infrastructure and improve really dilapidated structures of the economy.

So, look for a blending of both of those messages here as he spends the next week abroad.

CAMEROTA: OK, friends, stick with us, if you would.

BLACKWELL: Yes, any moment now, again, we are expecting to hear from President Biden.

[15:15:00]

He will speak to U.S. Air Force personnel stationed there in the U.K. This is the beginning of his first foreign trip since taking office. We will bring you his remarks live.

Also, the attorney general testifying right now in the Senate. He has just publicly explained for the first time why his Justice Department plans to continue representing Donald Trump in a defamation lawsuit.

That's next.

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[15:20:04]

CAMEROTA: OK, we are looking right now at live pictures from Capitol Hill, where Attorney General Merrick Garland is answering questions right now before the Senate Appropriations Subcommittee.

BLACKWELL: Yes, he's on Capitol Hill to discuss the Justice Department's $35 billion 2022 budget request.

He was also just asked to defend the department's decision to continue representing former President Trump in the defamation lawsuit filed against him by columnist E. Jean Carroll.

CNN's Evan Perez joins us now.

Evan, so what was the explanation?

All right, we will try to get back to Evan Perez with that.

Let's go to Manu Raju, who is also on Capitol Hill.

Manu, we just learned a bit ago about some progress potentially on the policing reforms. That is CNN's reporting, that there is some movement behind the scenes. Are they close to a deal?

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it sounds like, from multiple sources that I have spoken with who are directly familiar with these private negotiations. They are moving close to a deal.

There's actually some hope that something could be announced as early as next week. Now, they had set June as an ultimate deadline to get a deal. And they have been struggling for weeks to try to come up with a way to resolve some key sticking points, namely, on the issue of qualified immunity.

Now, that currently gives law enforcement officers, police officers, law enforcement, that gives them protections against civil lawsuits. Now, Democrats had sought to do away with those protections altogether. But there is a compromise in the works in which it would allow cities and police departments, those who employ the officers, to be subject to the lawsuit.

Now, we will have to see the details about how exactly they structure that. But that's a signal of where they're going. But even with those changes, it is still facing some skepticism among Republicans who say that they want to defend this and Democrats -- defend this standard altogether, and some Democrats who say they want to look at this closer.

BLACKWELL: All right, Manu Raju for us there on Capitol Hill. Manu, thanks so much.

CAMEROTA: OK, let's go back to look at the live pictures from Capitol Hill.

Again, this is Attorney General Merrick Garland. He's answering questions right now before the Senate Appropriations Committee. And this is interesting, Victor, because this is about the E. Jean Carroll case. Or at least he was just asked about that.

And just to remind people, E. Jean Carroll, as you say, a columnist, she accused Donald Trump before he was president of rape.

BLACKWELL: Yes.

CAMEROTA: And -- in, I think, 1995, or late '95, early 96.

And then President Trump responded by saying that he had never met her. She then produced photographic evidence that he had, in fact, met her. He then said she wasn't his type.

BLACKWELL: Yes.

CAMEROTA: And so Bill Barr had said that the Justice Department would defend President Trump. And now they're asking if Merrick Garland is going to continue that defense.

BLACKWELL: Let's go to Evan Perez.

Evan, what did the attorney general say to justify this decision to stay as the defendant in this lawsuit?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, you're right, Victor and Alisyn. This is one of those very controversial decisions that the department has announced recently. They have made these court filings.

And, according to Garland, he and the officials now leading the department are trying to essentially go back to normal. They're trying to restore the department to the functions that it did well before the sort of politicized years of the Trump era.

And he's explaining in some of his testimony this afternoon that his rule is simply that we're going to take it straight down the middle, that it doesn't matter if it's a Republican or if it's a Democrat; we're going to try to stick to the law.

Here's him -- here he is explaining their decision-making on this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MERRICK GARLAND, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: The essence of the rule of law is what I said when I accepted the nomination for attorney general. It is that like cases be treated alike, that there not be one rule for Democrats and another for Republicans, that there not be one rule for friends and another for foes. Now, it is not always easy to apply that rule. Sometimes, it means

that we have to make a decision about the law that we would never have made and that we strongly disagree with as a matter of policy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PEREZ: And there are a number of other decisions recently that the department has made and is putting the White House certainly in an uncomfortable position.

And what you're hearing from Garland is, this is the way he is going to be doing it, because he believes the credibility of the apartment is at stake.

He also was asked a question real quick about vaccinations at the federal prisons. According to him, 95 percent of prisoners have accepted the opportunity to be to be vaccinated.

There's, however, the problem of hesitancy among prison staff. Here's what he's talking about here.

[15:25:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GARLAND: With respect to the Bureau of Prisons staff, 100 percent have been offered vaccines; 51 percent are fully vaccinated, and another 661 have received -- in addition to that, have received their first vaccine dose.

So, we're in the right direction here, but there is the same problem that there is in the community at large, some resistance to this, which, frankly, I do not understand. I rushed out to get my vaccine as soon as it was available.

But, right now, we have enough vaccines for everybody who is willing to take it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PEREZ: And, as he said, this is a problem, obviously, that we're having across the society, not just in the Bureau of Prisons work force, and they're trying to figure out how to persuade those people to take those vaccines -- Victor, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Evan Perez, thank you very much for all the reporting.

BLACKWELL: Up next: The CDC is producing data that shows that most states have administered less than half of the doses of the Johnson & Johnson vaccine that they have received.

We have got details on how many of those shots could just be wasted.

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