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2024 U.S. Election; In Crucial Election States, CNN Poll Indicates Difficulties for Biden; Michigan's Third-Party Candidates Gaining Ground, According to CNN Poll; As Election Day Approaches, Trump Keeps Postponing His Trials; Blinken Meets with Netanyahu to Push for Ceasefire; Israel-Hamas War; Men's Tournament's Opening Round Saw Four Double-Digit Seeds Advance. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired March 22, 2024 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:30:00]

JIM ACOSTA, CNN NEWSROOM ANCHOR: ?Do we even know how this is going to break out? Break down?

KATE BEDINGFIELD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR AND FORMER WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: We don't. And I wouldn't say I'm not worried about polls. I would say the polls show that there's been --

ACOSTA: OK.

BEDINGFIELD: -- I would say the polls show, it's going to be an incredibly close race and that there's a lot of work to be done. On the Biden side, what I'm -- what I am -- what I'm less worried about is the fact that there's seven months to go. Biden and Trump both just formally clenched their nominations.

And for everybody who, you know, watches CNN and thinks about politics all the time, it seems nuts to think that for many, many months, it was going to be anybody but Joe Biden and Donald Trump. But for most voters, for most Americans who aren't paying attention to politics, they actually didn't think it was going to be Joe Biden and Donald Trump.

ACOSTA: Yes.

BEDINGFIELD: So, I think the fact that, you know, the contours of the race have now shaped up. You know, just over the last week, you've had Donald Trump out, you know, insulting Jewish Americans. You've had him reiterating some of his most divisive and hateful rhetoric. You've had him doubling down on a national abortion ban.

I mean, he is an incredibly flawed candidate, and it is the job of the Biden campaign to drive that contrast. And I think we will start to see these numbers move in these swing states as we get closer to the election. But there's no question, it's going to be a dogfight. And this issue with third-party candidates, is serious.

ACOSTA: Right.

BEDINGFIELD: We see time and again that there's the potential for third-party candidates to really sway the outcome of the election. So, I think there has to be a lot of education done to explain to voters that voting for a third-party candidate is, you know, in effect voting for Donald Trump. And that's something that the Biden campaign and others have to really make sure people under --

ACOSTA: Right. Yes. I mean -- Stuart, I mean, there was a conventional wisdom that RFK Jr. is going to hurt Joe Biden. And then some polling indicated, well, OK, maybe he's going to hurt Donald Trump. But I mean, this polling suggested it may be a problem for the president.

STUART STEVENS, FORMER ROMNEY PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN CHIEF STRATEGIST AND FORMER REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Yes -- you know, I'm skeptical of any of that third-party stuff. I think it's cleaner if it's a two-up match. Third-party is so unpredictable. You know, you, I, everybody on this show and everybody watching, we have one thing in common with Ross Perot, we've never won an electoral college vote.

ACOSTA: Right. Good point.

STEVENS: So, this third-party thing is just an indulgence at a time when, I think, it's safe to say the country is in great peril. You know, I think you have to kind of go back to the fundamentals of this race. What is this thing going to be about? So, if I just woke you up in the middle of the night, you know, five years ago and said, look, a guy who is from Queens who can't make bail is the Republican Party nominee, what do you think the chances are an incumbent Democrat president with stock market highs with record low employment might be able to squeak that out? You would think it was a joke.

ACOSTA: Yes.

STEVENS: So, I think that there's no reason to make a decision in this race now. There's no penalty in saying a pollster. Yes, I would like Donald Trump or some other alternative.

ACOSTA: Right.

BEDINGFIELD: Americans love alternative, you know. This is why Cheesecake Factory doesn't have a one-page menu. We always want something new and different. But I think this thing is going to shape up and I'm not convinced it's going to be particularly close. And I think Biden is going to win.

ACOSTA: Yes, it is kind of a Cheesecake Factory election. I mean, voters may have too many choices this time around, and it could wreak havoc.

But, you know, Kate, let me ask you this. And -- there's a story in "The New York Times" about Trump's legal problems in -- over his actions on January 6th. And it gets into some of the deliberations that were going on inside the Justice Department and the Attorney General and he -- what he was thinking in terms of, you know, moving this forward quickly. Where to go with the investigation and so on. And it says this, we'll put up on screen, Mr. Garland proceeded with characteristic by the book caution and trying to avoid even the smallest mistakes. Mr. Garland may -- might have made one big one, not recognizing that he could end up racing against the clock.

What do you think of all that? What were some of the feelings -- I don't want to get you to talk about everything that was going on in the White House when you were there. There had to have been -- I have to think there had to have been some frustration with how slowly things were moving when it came to the investigation into what Donald Trump did on January 6th and around January 6th.

BEDINGFIELD: Well, I can tell you, Jim. I mean, there was also appreciation and understanding of the fact that needing to do this by the book, needing to have, you know, any proceedings be bulletproof in terms of any suggestion that there was inappropriate or undue political influence from President Biden or from the White House was important.

I think it's, you know, it's very easy to look back now and second guess the timeline. I'm certainly not going to second guess the attorney general. I'm not a lawyer. Obviously, these things are complicated and many factors, you know, go into determining how and when to move forward and, you know, what the Justice Department believed the best course of action was.

[10:35:00]

And, you know, I think what gets lost a little bit in the conversation here, on the political side, is that there is benefit to this message that -- from Joe Biden that says, you know, I'm not putting my thumb on the scale at the Justice Department. You know, that's something Donald Trump did. I believe in, you know, governing through norms. I believe in established order. That was a message that was actually quite effective in the 2020 campaign.

And I think that most -- for most people, most Americans, they want to believe and know that their president, you know, is adhering to the rules and to the separation of powers and to ensuring that government functions the way it's supposed to. So, there is benefit in that message too and we shouldn't lose sight of that.

ACOSTA: Yes. I mean, Stuart, what do you think? I mean, what Kate is saying is all well and good, but at the end of the day, history might look back and say that Merrick Garland just -- he -- there was a blunder here inside the Justice Department. They went after the little fish and they ran out of time. They couldn't get the big fish.

STEVENS: You know, one of the results and one of the goals of the Trump administration and now the Trump movement, which is an autocratic movement is destroy faith in our institutions. I mean, I work at the Lincoln Project. Donald Trump tried to get the Department of Justice to come after the Lincoln Project.

ACOSTA: Right.

STEVENS: You know, call me crazy, I think we got bigger threats in America. So, what -- I think the burden on this president and attorney general is to rebuild faith in this institution, which is different than most new incoming administrations. You haven't had -- coming in after attack on the judicial system, the entire legal process on judges, on jurors, on the election system, on the FBI. I mean, all of the civil structures of America have been under attack by the Republican Party now. So, I -- should Merrick Garland have done this or that? I think the bigger question here is, are Americans beginning to have faith again in these institutions? And it's easy to store it down and it's slow to build up.

ACOSTA: Yes. Well, I mean, I wish we could go on and on and talk about this. We'll do it next time. But, I mean, I do think that there's a question to be asked. OK. Joe Biden played by the rules, wanted to reestablish faith in these institutions, but if the next guy comes in and wrecks all of that, I mean, there -- you know, there is that. But all right, Stuart Stevens, Kate Bedingfield, great to talk to both of you. Appreciate it so much, guys. Thanks so much.

STEVENS: Great seeing you.

BEDINGFIELD: Thanks, Jim.

ACOSTA: All right. Good to see you.

And in the meantime, America's top diplomat making an urgent push for a ceasefire and hostage deal in Gaza. What came out of the U.S. efforts to prevent an Israeli invasion of Rafah, that's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:40:00]

ACOSTA: Right now, Secretary of State Tony Blinken is wrapping up his sixth round of shuttle diplomacy in the Middle East since the October 7th Hamas attack on Israel. You're looking at some live pictures right now of Tony Blinken there with the protesters in Tel Aviv. It looks like he's greeting some of those protesters. Saying hello to some of them as he makes his way to other meetings there in Tel Aviv. We'll stay on top of that. Bring you any -- anything else that develops there.

But in the meantime, CNN Correspondent Jeremy Diamond joins me live from Jerusalem. Jeremy, very interesting there. We just saw from the secretary of state, and he's had these meetings with Israeli officials. Any results from those meetings that we can talk about?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jim, there are no clear deliverables from the Secretary of State's meetings today in Israel. But what we do know is that he is pushing, of course, on multiple fronts. On the one hand, of course, he is trying to see what pressure the U.S. can bring to bear and what accommodations the Israelis can agree to in order to get to a ceasefire agreement that would also see the release of dozens of hostages, some of whose family members may have been among the demonstrators that the Secretary State went to meet with just moments ago.

But of course, beyond that, we know that the CIA director is in Doha, Qatar, also pushing for a deal alongside his Israeli, Egyptian and Qatari counterparts as those negotiations continue. But of course, there is also this impending military operation in Rafah, where 1.5 million Palestinians are currently sheltering. And the Israelis are making quite clear that they are determined to go into Rafah, regardless of what the United States says.

The Israeli prime minister has indicated a willingness to listen to U.S. alternatives. Sending a delegation of some of his top advisors to Washington next week. But at the same time, he's also making clear that no matter what the U.S. says, it's not going to sway him from what he views as a military imperative to go into Rafah. And in fact, after his meeting with the secretary of state, Prime Minister Netanyahu said, in a video statement that there is, "No way for us to defeat Hamas without going into Rafah." And then he goes on to say that he told the secretary of state directly. I hope we will do it with the support of the USA. But if we have to, we will do it alone. Jim.

ACOSTA: All right. Jeremy diamond in Jerusalem for us. Thank you very much.

For some analysis, I want to bring in Aaron David Miller. He's a senior fellow at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace and a former Middle East negotiator. Aaron, great to see you as always. We're just looking at some pictures and we can rerack (ph) the video and show it to our viewers again. It looks like Tony Blinken was shaking hands with some of the protesters who were sort of aligned to his route as he was walking from meeting to meeting there in Tel Aviv.

And it appears that he's shaking hands and greeting some of these protesters who, I believe, are calling for the release of those hostages being held by Hamas. At least those are some of the folks who are there from what I can tell in these signs.

[10:45:00]

Your assessment as to how Blinken is handling this latest round of shuttle diplomacy.

I mean, this is number -- first of all, Jim, thanks for having me.

ACOSTA: Yes.

AARON DAVID MILLER, FORMER STATE DEPARTMENT MIDDLE EAST NEGOTIATOR AND SENIOR FELLOW, CARNEGIE ENDOWMENT: This is number six. Six -- and before this conflict is done, hopefully in the post conflict stage, maybe some diplomacy, secretary of state's going to -- should pack a few extra shirts in his bag because he's going to be going back and forth, hopefully, if we're lucky, quite a few times.

Look, I think the main action here, Jim, frankly, U.N. Security Council voted today, vetoed by the Russians, the Chinese, and the Algerians. But the main action, frankly, is not in Jerusalem. I think it's in Doha. Because the whole key administration effort to deescalate the situation in Gaza, surge humanitarian assistance, and somehow break the battlefield dynamic really depends, first and foremost, on an Israeli-Hamas exchange. ACOSTA: Right.

MILLER: If you can't get that, the administration has no lever, no mechanism. You could, more or less, hang a close for the season sign on any effort to do what the president really wants to do, which is to change the pictures in Gaza, get help into the Palestinians who need it, free the hostages, and maybe lay the basis for some further talks down the road. But we're a long way from that, it appears right now.

ACOSTA: Yes. I mean, it shows you what the stakes are right now. When you have the Secretary of State in Tel Aviv, the CIA director, and hostage negotiations in, in Doha. What happens though, Aaron, if the Israelis ignore these cautions from the U.S. against an offensive in Rafah? They do it anyway. One has to think that is going to do a lot of damage to any kind of negotiations for releasing these hostages. And it's going to result in more of those images that you were just talking about, which have been toxic for the president politically here in the U.S.

MILLER: I think that's right, which is reason to hope that, in fact, you can get a deal. But the Israelis, I suspect, are weeks away, perhaps even longer from actually implementing a major ground campaign in Rafah. And there's another thing we need to keep in mind, and I'm sure the administration is conscious of it.

This is not just a question of Benjamin Netanyahu's preferences. We seem to think that he's the lone actor here. The fact is you've got the majority of the Israeli public and most Israeli politicians, certainly Benny Gantz, Gadi Eisenkot, who sit in the war cabinet. I think they too probably believe that the Israelis need to mount some sort of significant operation in order to deal with the last remaining elements of Hamas's organized military structure. But it's going to create, perhaps, a moment that we haven't seen yet in relations between the Biden administration and this Israeli government.

ACOSTA: Which could get more complicated if the Israeli Prime Minister accepts that invitation to address Congress. Obviously, that may not go over well with some folks inside the Biden administration. We're just going to see that as just too political. Aaron David Miller, thanks as always. Really appreciate the time.

MILLER: Thanks, Jim, for having me.

ACOSTA: All right. In the meantime, lawmakers up on Capitol Hill, we're monitoring all of this because it could be happening within the next hour. They're in a familiar bind up there up on Capitol Hill, rushing to approve a huge spending package or let parts of the government shutdown this weekend without any funding.

Yes, the government is on the brink of yet another government shutdown. The roadblocks that remain on the road to passing that legislation. We'll talk about that in just a few moments. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:50:00]

ACOSTA: All right. Do you hear that? It's the sound of March Madness. Fans across the country tearing up their brackets this morning after the first day of the men's tournament saw four double digit seeds pulling off big upsets.

CNN's Andy Scholes joins us now. Andy, a lot of surprises, but that's why they call it March Madness.

ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Yes, and Jim, you know, yesterday I told you to pick those 11 seeds, and guess what? All three of them won in upset over the six seeds they were playing. You know, we're going to see if New Mexico can complete that sweep for the 11s later today.

But the biggest upset of day one, it belonged to 14 seed Oakland who took down three seed Kentucky. And, you know, every single year, we fall in love with some new heroes from small schools. And what a night this was for Jack Gohlke. The senior for the Golden Grizzlies made 10 threes. Gohlke scoring 32 points, which is the most points ever in the tournament for a player who did not make a two-point shot.

Oakland would pull off the upset over the Wildcats, 80 to 76. And Greg Kampe, he's been the head coach at Oakland for 40 years. Well, now he's into the round of 32 for the first time ever. Kentucky now one in four in their last five tournament games. And here was Gohlke after that big upset.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JACK GOHLKE, OAKLAND GUARD: I know they have draft picks and I know I'm not going to the NBA. But I know on any given night, I can compete with those type of guys and our team can compete with those type of guys. And that's why I was so confident going into it. And that's why I say we're not a Cinderella because when we play our A-game we're -- we can be the best team on the floor.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHOLES: All right. Dayton, meanwhile, look like they were just toast against Nevada. They were down 17 with 7:14 to go, but then they staged an epic comeback. The Flyers finishing the game on a 24 to four run. Nate Santos here, the big bucket to put Dayton up by one with 38 seconds left and then Nevada's last second three, no good. Dayton moves on after some incredible comeback winning 63 to 60.

[10:55:00]

LeBron James's high school coach Keith Dambrot and Duquesne, meanwhile, dancing into the second round. The Dukes taking down BYU, 71 to 67, and one of those 11 seed upsets. And this is Duquesne's first tournament win since 1969. And Dambrot already announced he's retiring after this run, but he's going to have to wait because now they have a date with Illinois in the second round.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) KEITH DAMBROT, DUQUESNE HEAD COACH: They just won't let me retire, man. I'm trying to retire, but if we keep winning games, they're going to make me an old man.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHOLES: And LeBron having some fun with his old coach winning, tweeting, hey, first tournament win in 55 years. Keep it going.

And finally, Samford fans. Well, they're really not happy today. Down one, 20 seconds to go. Jayhawks go long and A.J. Staton-McCray, he chased it down for the block. They called a foul though, and take another look. It was absolutely all ball. Kansas would make both free throws and hold on to win 93 to 89. Just a brutal call there for Samford. We got 16 more games coming your way today, and you can watch it across our sister networks, "TNT", "TBS" and "TruTV".

And hey, the women's tournament also tips off today. Undefeated South Carolina is going to play at 2:00 Eastern against Presbyterian. The Gamecocks are favored by 54 in that one. So, hey, potential for one of the biggest upsets in history today, Jim. Caitlin Clark, in case you're wondering, she does not play until tomorrow when Iowa hosts, Holy cross. I know a lot of people excited to watch Caitlin Clark this March in the tournament.

ACOSTA: Oh, yes. And I got my purple tie on. I'm rooting for my JMU Dukes tonight. So, it's a big game. I'm a little nervous. We'll see how it goes. We'll talk about it next week.

SCHOLES: Good luck.

ACOSTA: Andy Scholes, thanks a lot. I appreciate it.

SCHOLES: All right.

ACOSTA: in the meantime, we're closely watching the House floor as lawmakers race to pass a massive $1.2 trillion spending package and prevent another partial government shutdown in the process. We're live from Capitol Hill.

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[11:00:00]