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Dr. Drew
Bill Cosby In His Own Words On Cheating, Drugging, And Sex; New Insult From The Billionaire Who Wants To Be President; Bill Cosby Claims Women Consented To Drugs And Sex Without Saying A Word; Donald Trump Goes Higher In The Polls; A Reality Star Arrested For Allegedly Stealing Sun Glasses; Millions Of People Are Worried, Tonight A Hacker Is Threatening To Release Names From An Adultery Website; Ben Shapiro Has Filed A Report With Los Angeles Police Department Alleging Battery Against Zoey Tur
Aired July 20, 2015 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
(21:00:14) DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN HOST: Tonight, Bill Cosby in his own words on cheating, drugging, and sex. Plus, Donald Trump. New insult from the
billionaire who wants to be president. We will hear from him. And, the latest on what happened on our own set last week that is making headlines.
It all starts right now with the "Top of the Feed." Bill Cosby claims women consented to drugs and sex without saying a word. A former Cosby
show co-star is here and will join us in just a second. But, first, I want you to watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: In the deposition, Cosby says both the sex and the pills were consensual.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER: He admitted giving drugs. He admitted giving Quaaludes in regards to women and sex. He also said that he got a feeling
when it was consensual. He would know with a woman when it was consensual.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARBARA BOWMAN, COSBY ACCUSER: Consent is not the absence of a no.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER: I do not hear her say anything, he said. And I do not feel her say anything. And, so I continue and I go into the area
that is somewhere between permission and rejection. I am not stopped.
Cosby says he had sexual fun with women and steered away from intercourse to prevent women from falling in love with him. The act of a penile
entrance is something that I feel the woman will succumb to more of a romance and more of a feeling, not love. But it is deeper than a playful
situation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BOWMAN: When you are stuffing drugs or alcohol into a woman and then calling it sex, it is diabolical. It is disgusting. It is unacceptable
and it is rape.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Joining me, Judy Ho, Clinical Psychologist, professor at Pepperdine University; Vanessa Barnett from HipHollywood.com; Michael
Catherwood, my "Love Line" and KABC radio co-host. He is also the new host of chain reaction on GSN. In our audience, Lisa Bloom, trial attorney at
the Bloom Firm and legal analyst for Avvo.com. Judy, is this the first time you are hear this stuff and what do you think?
JUDY HO, PH.D., CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, I think the woman is right. You know, when you think about alcohol and drugs, getting into the mix, and
all of the things --
PINSKY: But Judy, Judy --
HO: Yes?
PINSKY: Judy, Judy, Judy.
HO: Yes?
(LAUGHING)
PINSKY: Judy, the penis is the magic purveyor of love. Did you get that quote in there?
HO: I did -- yes. So, that is the first time I have ever heard that one.
PINSKY: You never --
MICHAEL CATHERWOOD, CO-HOST OF "LOVE LINE" AND KABC RADIO: What?
PINSKY: Not heard of that concept? --
HO: No. Yes. I blacked out there. I am so sorry. Yes. That is absolutely first time for me. I cannot even speak right now, because I
cannot imagine this type of mind that would actually believe that kind of sentence. Like there is something off about it. Like there is something
psychotic to that process, do you know I am saying, Dr. Drew?
PINSKY: I do. What do you think, Vanessa, no?
VANESSA BARNETT, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: No. I do not -- hold on. I do not understand him, but I unfortunately can kind of understand his thinking in
this. Because I think he does not see anything wrong with it. He did not hear the no. He already assumes that these women want something from him,
want to be in his presence, want to be connected to him in some way, and -- and maybe his penis.
And, I think that he -- at that point in his career, at that point in his life, I think he felt like these women want me anyway, so if we dabble in
drugs or dabble alcohol or dabble in whatever, I do not think he even thought this was remotely close to rape, at all.
PINSKY: Mike?
CATHERWOOD: I agree that if you read the language and the parts of the deposition that we have been given, it does not seem like he really is --
even in the same ballpark as rape. Like he feels like he is just doing what Bill Cosby does. And, I am just blown away by-- honestly, by both the
-- I restrict from penetration because I do not want them to fall in love with me.
PINSKY: Well, that is the craziness.
CATHERWOOD: And, then also -- then he told the girl -- he said, "Make sure you tell your mom about your orgasm."
PINSKY: Do you have that? Can we show that part? Do you guys have that? Do we have a quote on that or do I have a graphic for it? They are going
to pull it out in a second.
BARNETT: Right.
PINSKY: Lisa is knowingly shaking her head like this on this guy`s thought. But I think -- I think the Quaaludes and the drugs were all to do
the ladies a favor, so they did not fall in love.
(LAUGHING)
LISA BLOOM, TRIAL ATTORNEY: Yes. Can we stop giving Bill Cosby the benefit of the doubt? Can we stop taking him at face value? Of course, he
knew it was rape after woman after woman after woman over decades came to him and said, you raped me, you know.
We might be able to say back in 1968, the first time he did not understand, there was some confusion, about if you drug somebody and have sex with them
when they are unconscious, maybe that is OK. But, according to a number of witnesses, he has been paying women off for years. Women who have been
making claims against him for sexual assault.
PINSKY: Well, he said in his deposition, that was to protect Mrs. Cosby.
BLOOM: Right.
PINSKY: Because she is another woman, he had to protect, you know?
BLOOM: Yes.
PINSKY: These women need protection, right?
BLOOM: So, that is also called -- You know, he is admitting to deception against his wife. He is admitting that he lied to doctors to get the
Quaaludes for back pain, and he admitted he never used it for himself. He only used it for women.
[21:05:02] PINSKY: No. No, he said he used them to get high. He said he used them the way people used it --
BLOOM: Well, in different part of the deposition, he said he never used it himself --
BARNETT: Yes, because it made him sleepy.
HO: Right.
BARNETT: It made him sleepy, so he did not like to take it.
CATHERWOOD: I did not want to get laid --
(LAUGHING)
BARNETT: There is irony in that.
PINSKY: There is another part where I saw he was using them -- come on. He was using them, because people use them to get intoxicated like alcohol.
And, that to me is -- There is got to be some law against that. Note, the physicians would freak out if they knew that is how -- He had seven
Quaalude prescriptions.
The attorney asked him. Here it is. "Why do you take the Quaaludes?" He says, quote, "Because I use them." The attorney asked, "For what? He
says, "The same as a person would say have a drink."
BARNETT: What?
BLOOM: I used them -- But then for the woman, is the context --
PINSKY: Later -- but the same -- but same as having a drink. It is like, "Oh, just get high." But the physicians give seven prescriptions to a guy
to get high? I mean that is -- Those doctors have a liability for this.
HO: And, again it is Cosby, right?
PINSKY: Yes.
HO: I mean it is Cosby, so maybe there was something there. We do not know, right? We do not know all of these different doctors. If they,
actually, checked his history.
PINSKY: Well, back then.
HO: Right. And, so where else was he getting this prescriptions?
CATHERWOOD: We do -- I can understand, of course, I am not endorsing this for making it OK, but when certain people are at a level of fame and
respect in their industry, they get away with a lot of stuff. I mean it is no different than people we know, Dr. Drew, who are professional athletes.
BARNETT: Right.
CATHERWOOD: If you were to asked them, where did you get the steroids and why are you taking them?
PINSKY: Right.
CATHERWOOD: You will be like, "What do you mean?"
PINSKY: Yes.
CATHERWOOD: "I am taking them so I could be buff."
PINSKY: So, we had a question from the audience. Go ahead.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: Yes. I absolutely just do not go for it at all. I mean, listen, I am absolutely am not in agreement with Bill Cosby
going to jail at this time, right now, for something that happened so long ago. And, frankly, I mean --
PINSKY: He is not. He is not --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: I mean --
PINSKY: Is he, Lisa? No?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: This should not even be a conversation, you know? Leave Bill Cosby alone. That is all I have to say. Leave Bill
Cosby alone.
PINSKY: Why?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: Because something that happened so long ago. I mean, so long ago and what I want to know is, if these women -- why did
not they turn in the police report on just being drugged?
BLOOM: They did. Some of them did. So in 2005, Andrea Constand went to the D.A. in Pennsylvania and he said, there is not any evidence, of course.
He did not even look at this very transcript that we now have.
And, shame on him for not looking at that. And, by the way, a woman`s testimony is evidence. And, Chloe Goins has an active LAPD open file right
now. She alleges she was raped by him in 2008. That is not that long ago.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: You know what I think? I do not think Bill Cosby did it. I think that it was with consent. I think when you do have
-- think about it today -- any of you ladies, if you go to a hotel room or you go anywhere, and if there are drugs and sex involved, I really believe
that, you know -- that is what happens. That is what happens.
BLOOM: OK. My client was in a restaurant --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: Listen. Listen --
BLOOM: -- when he gave her a pill. He said for menstrual cramps.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: No.
BLOOM: She wakes up in a hotel room --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: She took the pill!
BLOOM: -- having been raped, she alleged.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: She is an adult. If somebody give me a pill, I am not taking it.
PINSKY: OK. Hold on.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: I am not taking it. I got your point.
(LAUGHING)
PINSKY: I got your point. I got your point. And, again, this brings up this whole issue of consent --
HO: Right.
PINSKY: -- which in this state, when you take the pill, you no longer can render consent and it is our job as adult men not to take advantage of
people who cannot render consent.
BARNETT: But that is now, that was not 20, 30, 40 years ago.
PINSKY: Right. Judging them through that prism is an issue. An interesting question.
BARNETT: Right.
PINSKY: I want to bring in -- you know, our audience member is talking years ago. Let us bring in Dondre Whitfield, who had a recurring role in
"The Cosby Show." He played Vanessa`s boyfriend, Robert. And, you were there back then, at least, you know, part of the way back there. How has
your relationship been with Mr. Cosby? What do you think about all these?
DONDRE WHITFIELD, ACTOR, "THE COSBY SHOW": You know, honestly, you know, I just want to say, Dr. Drew, I am not here to defend him. I am here to look
at a situation, realistically. During those times, you know, people were using some drugs in some strange ways for some very strange things and
sexual escapades was not the least of which.
PINSKY: So, it is the cultural -- which by the way, I think -- I know, Lisa --
BLOOM: Rape is not a sexual escapade.
(LAUGHING)
WHITFIELD: We are not -- I never said -- I never said that.
BLOOM: But, that is what -- that is somewhat 47 women are alleging.
HO: Right.
BLOOM: I get tired of this talk of like, "Oh, everybody was doing drugs and having sex.
HO: Yes.
BLOOM: That is completely different.
HO: And, Dr. Drew, there was deception involved for most of these women. It was not that -- it was not that they said, "Yes, giving them Quaaludes."
It was, "I have pain," and he said, "This is an Advil," and they took it.
PINSKY: Listen, I am not justifying or saying that it did not happen or even addressing that. I am saying that there is something affirmative what
Dondre is saying, which is culturally and historically, how we have treat women in particularly in a sexual context is abominable, and at that time
we took a good look at that.
WHIFIELD: Not only that -
PINSKY: And, a lot of awful things came out of it. People, whose behavior was unacceptable was supported in that. I got to take a break. This
conversation continues. Later on, an adultery website is hacked, so someone who is hacked is now threatening to expose all of its 37 million
customers. Back after this.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
[21:09:56] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[21:14:00] UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER: The attorney says to Bill Cosby, "I think you are making light of a very serious situation," to which Bill
Cosby responds, "That may very well be."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARBARA BOWMAN, COSBY ACCUSER: It is classic narcissistic, psychopathic behavior.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FIELD: The star saying he looked for women`s nonverbal cues in response to his sexual advances.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BOWMAN: I never asked for drugs, and I never asked for sex, and I never asked to be put in that volatile and violating positions.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FIELD: These revelations, sickening to the women who have publicly accused Cosby.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JANICE DICKENSON, COSBY ACCUSER: I keep reliving the same sick feeling, you know, in my soul.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BOWMAN: Control, dominance, and fear put terror and fear in many people. Not just the victims that he sexually violated, but everyone around him.
There were cover ups.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Now, did these -- this inner circle of Mr. Cosby has covered up his bad behavior. Back with Judy, Vanessa, Mike, Lisa, also actor, Dondre
Whitfield.
[21:15:02] Dondre, I am sorry, still boiling on like everybody did. Dondre, got it. He, of course, had a recurring role on "The Cosby Show."
Was anyone aware of Shenanigans going on?
[WHITFIELD: You know, we were not aware of any of those things. And, let me just say, as a husband and as a father of a 10-year-old daughter, I
think we need to begin the conversation of making women feel safe enough to come forward.
PINSKY: Oh, yes!
WHITFIELD: And when women take payoffs for situations that they say happened, what it does is it unfairly puts under scrutiny those women that
do come forward. So, we need to begin to talk about how we make our women feel safe to come forward.
PINSKY: Well, I will say -- I have said it a million times, which is you must, must, must, if you had anything, you think was a sexual assault, any
sort of assault, go to the emergency room, collect the data, get the kit done.
People are very -- they are very caring, though. They understand how to handle these things. And, at least you have that done if you ever decide
you need to press charges. I mean you and I deal with this all the time.
HO: That is right. And, unfortunately, Dondre is right. There is so much stigma still about coming forward, even in the questioning of what
happened. There is always some type of assumption or insinuation that somehow a behavior that they did led to that happened to them.
PINSKY: Yes, I know.
HO: Whether it is the way they dress or whatever.
PINSKY: Even women blame themselves. They blame themselves.
HO: Yes.
PINSKY: And they take responsibility for everything that happens to them.
HO: And, then they will take it back and they will change the story.
PINSKY: It is a weird thing. Can you imagine, he is sort of telling you it did not happen. He is a very powerful man. You admired it. It was get
confusing for a woman. But the other thing when I was reading these depositions today, with female colleagues. The men were like, "Oh, my God,
what an idiot," you know? But, the women were having a visceral physical reaction like, "Oh, this is like creepy."
BARNETT: It is violating. You cannot even -- unless you have been through it, you cannot imagine someone taking your body and you are just rendered
helpless. I do not want to think about what I would feel like.
CATHERWOOD: I also think that the air of invincibility, that at least his remarks kind of gave off.
HO: Yes.
CATHERWOOD: He was indignant to the fact that he was being charged because of this.
BARNETT: Because he still does not feel like he did anything wrong. And, unfortunately, that is a thought that still carries on today. You hear it
in music where there is -- where men are casually talking about slipping things in girl`s drinks. We need to talk about the definition of rape, as
well.
PINSKY: Audience. Yes, sir?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: That is a good point. That is my point is that, I do not really think it was rape in the sense where each of these
women -- I read each of the 42 statements. They willfully went to his hotel room.
And, I am just thinking, in a hotel, there is a bedroom and there is a bathroom. You are going to use one or the other or both. Why would you
willfully go to somebody`s hotel room thinking that you are going to get an audition and all this stuff. You know what I mean?
BLOOM: That is just not true. That is not true.
HO: Dr. Drew, that is the kind of --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: What is not true?
BLOOM: That they all went to his hotel room.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: That he has drugged them right there?
BLOOM: Many of them went to his dressing room because they were told they were going to get a job. They begged him in a restaurant.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: How are you getting a job in a dressing room? How are you getting a job in a dressing room? That does not make sense.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
BLOOM: Because --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: No. You do not get a job in somebody`s dressing room.
BLOOM: OK.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: You do not get a job in somebody`s hotel room.
BLOOM: It is a public --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: I am not saying that -- I am not saying that they are not innocent.
BLOOM: You can yell over me or you can actually listen to the facts, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: I am saying that there is complicity. I read the facts, OK?
BLOOM: OK. You really read all 47? --
PINSKY: One at a time. One at a time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: I read.
PINSKY: OK. Listen.
BLOOM: OK. You have not read all 47, because, you are missing the facts right --
PINSKY: One at a time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: No, I do not think it is rape. I think they willfully went to the hotel room and something happened.
HO: OK. You can buy for that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: And, if he is guilty, he deserves to go down, but I think they are not --
PINSKY: OK. Sir, thank you. Lisa, respond.
BLOOM: OK. You know, I just get really tired day after day of being told that when you have sex with a woman who is unconscious, it is not rape. Or
it is shenanigans or it is sexual escapades. We live in a rape culture, and everybody who says that is contributing to the rape culture. Rape is
rape. We have to call it what it is. Otherwise, we disrespect the 47 women who had the guts to come forward.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: Judy?
HO: Dr. Drew, he just actually prove my point on what I was talking about earlier. Just because a woman willingly goes to a hotel room, does that
mean they absolutely consented to sex? Cannot they change their mind if they have thought something may happen? Cannot they say, " you know what,
I do not want that anymore?" And, then when you bring alcohol and drugs into the mix, they can no longer consent.
CATHERWOOD: I mean I cannot help but mention the fact that a lot of the moral lines get blurred when we are fans of certain celebrities.
HO: Yes,
CATHERWOOD: Like, has anybody just not mentioned the fact that during this entire time, he was a married man. And, if I am a young actress in
Hollywood and a known married actor says, "Oh, no. I would love to help you work on your lines." I do not think that every girl thinks themselves,
"I am definitely going to get some sex." They may be thinking themselves, "Oh, maybe Bill Cosby is going to help me with my lines."
PINSKY: By the way, his public persona is, this is a straight America`s dad. Dondre.
[21:20:00] WHITFIELD: I think, Dr. Drew, some of the pushback that we are getting from our audience and even people across our country is that
sometimes, you know, we are getting a feeling like some of the women have used some of this as an opportunity for them to forward whatever their
position is. And, there is room for that.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: Yes, ma`am?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: I mean, I just believe 1968, 2008, when it is 2018, there will still be gold diggers and opportunists. I mean we have
start stop taking -- I mean women, we are very smart and we know what we are doing.
We know sometimes we use what we have to get what we want. And sometimes we leave that door open for opportunity. And, just like all these women
who are just now coming out, the same women that went into those rooms, in hotel rooms, whether they were dragged there or whatever, those are the
same women that are coming out now, because they see another opportunity to get money.
PINSKY: All right. Well --
CATHEWOOD: How are they in any way getting what they want? I mean I highly doubt that any of these 48 women, like what they really dreamed of
is Bill Cosby roofing out limp dick.
(LAUGHING)
PINSKY: Be that as it may. There is no money involved here.
BLOOM: Yes. And, you know, I am sorry, but the facts, actually, matter. And, the facts are that 95 percent of the 47 women who have come forward
have not asked for a dime. They have come forward and been suggested to all of these attacks about being gold diggers, even though they have not
asked for a dime, even though they have to pay their own money to travel and to speak out in many cases, and their reputations are damaged, but we
are so invested in attacking women.
When there is a famous guy accused of doing something wrong, it has to be the woman`s fault. No woman can ever accuse a celebrity of rape without
being subjected to this.
PINSKY: Dondre.
WHITFIELD: Dr. Drew, I certainly am not attacking any women. My mother raised me single in Brooklyn, New York. I am a husband and a father of a
daughter. I have a goddaughter, who is living with me here now for a few days on internship. I am definitely not doing that.
What we are saying is, is that the pushback that we are seeing is, is that some of the -- we have no idea whether there were any arrangements with
some of these women. And, yes, like he said, of course, we understand that he cheated on his wife, but that is between him and Camille.
PINSKY: All right. Here is the bottom line. One thing we do know is how we can conduct ourselves, right?
HO: Yes.
PINSKY: We can conduct to ourselves. Here is the deal, everybody. When you make a commitment to somebody and make some marital vows, they are vows
in front of God, the community, the government, everybody. The church, whoever you feel is important, you make those vows. Stick with them.
Relationships do not get more healthy when you bring complexity to other people into the relationship. Just ask the people about to have their
identities released on Ashley Madison. It is unhealthy. Please, stay with your -- We can raise healthy children, have stable families, going forward,
we can do that.
If you are with a woman, you are a young man or not even a young man and you are with a woman who has had more than two glasses of wine, my
recommendation to you is there needs to be some sort of active consent, even though they cannot render consent, right? So, is not that --
BLOOM: If you cannot consent if you have sex with that person, it is rape.
PINSKY: So, they potentially -- if they give active consent, and reasonably at somebody who had been -- I mean if there are reasonable minds
prevail, but if it is somebody you do not know, and they have intoxication at the level that would prevent them from driving a car, do not have sex
with that person. Do not do it. And, certainly do not give them something that renders them to that degree of intoxication. That is all. Let us
learn from it. We will figure out what is going on here. Lisa is going to keep on it. She will figure it out for us.
Next up, more on Donald Trump. He talks again. He goes higher in the polls. You will hear from him after the break. Be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[21:27:40] DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: John McCain, I disagree with him that these people are crazy. And, very importantly, and I speak
the truth, he graduated last in his class at Annapolis.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: He obviously called into question John McCain`s hero status.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER: And turning it against John McCain, saying "Look, he started it. I mean this is a sand box."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: He is not war hero.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER: He is a war hero.
TRUMP: He is a war hero, because he was captured. Somebody should run against John McCain who has been, you know, in my opinion, not to hot and I
supported him. I supported him for president. I raised $1 million for him. That is a lot of money. He lost. He let us down. But, you know, he
lost. So, I never liked him as much after that because I do not like losers.
(LAUGHING)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Senator John McCain says Donald Trump, quote, stirred up the crazies," unquote. Some fired back, calling McCain a dummy on Twitter,
undoubted his, quote, "Hero," unquote status. Tonight, Trump is doubling down on McCain and the media. Back with Judy, Vanessa, Mike, Lisa. Trump
surged in the polls, Mike. He is at 24 percent, well ahead of the pack. What is that all about?
CATHERWOOD: Yes. He is at 24 percent of the votes from republicans and independents who lean republican. Most of the calls that were made when
these polls were taken had been completed before this all went viral. But the highest percentage and biggest lead so far. Scott Walker is in second
place.
PINSKY: Before all this went viral, judging by if the past is any representation of the future, he should be more alienated.
CATHERWOOD: Yes. That only gave him a jump. And, I still stand by the fact that the only reason that we are seeing the popularity and this
meteoric rise in Donald Trump`s popularity as a presidential candidate is because people recognize his name.
HO: Yes.
PINSKY: You know what?
CATHERWOOD: We live in a world where fame is its own virtue and he is by far in a way, the most famous person running for president.
PINSKY: But, Judy, I think also there is a weird frustration going on. He has been able to focus our frustration and aggression, either get
scapegoats going and sort of marginalized the people that says, "It is not bad. We are all together. They are bad." But I think the other thing,
pretty more pervasively, people are so tired of the language police.
HO: Yes.
PINSKY: And, he is saying whatever he wants to say. And, people are like OK, maybe I can speak my mind too. The first amendment exists.
HO: He is catching us at a time where we are very tired as a group of political correctness. And, so, having somebody who is on the sub-front
even if you do not agree with what he says, you know you are going to get what he is showing. And that is profession, right?
[21:30:00] BARNETT: This come back he has is dummies, like that what we have to look forward as well.
HO: No. Nobody said he is well spoken, Vanessa. It should be keep in mind. His mind is a little bit nutty right now.
PINSKY: Well, let me get a comment from an audience member. Yes, ma`am. Go ahead.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: Hi, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: Hey there.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: Thank you for having me. Just real quick. I just really think that he is just a little too mouthy. He needs to
humble himself, hire a publicist. This is not your own company. This is not a beauty pageant. This is the presidency.
BLOOM: Yes.
(LAUGHING)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: I am sorry. He got wonderful ideas, but he is just feeding into this garbage culture right now.
PINSKY: All right.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: You know? And I just --
PINSKY: Wonderful ideas.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: -- and as far as the scapegoats, if you are going to shut the gates off, cut them off to everybody, not just certain
people --
PINSKY: Lisa.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: Everybody.
BLOOM: Yes.
PINSKY: What do you mean, Lisa.
BLOOM: Well said. Listen, I think we are all tired of listening to politicians who sound like politicians.
PINSKY: Yes. You are correct.
HO: Right.
BLOOM: And that is why Trump seems cool to some people. And, he would be cool if he was not arrogant and insulting.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
(LAUGHING)
PINSKY: Well, let me bring in Ryan Sorba. Ryan is the Chairman of the "Young Conservatives of California." Ryan, calls him a racist.
RYAN SORBA, YOUNG CONSERVATIVE OF CALIFORNIA: You are calling Donald Trump a racist?
BLOOM: Because he said Mexicans --
SORBA: No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Donald Trump said there are individuals in this country that are criminals, that are not here legally,
and that is true.
BLOOM: That is not what he said.
SORBA: That does not make you a racist.
BLOOM: That is not what he said.
HO: That is not what he said.
SORBA: And, the reason -- the reason why Donald Trump is coming up in the polls is because people are sick and tired of being called racist simply
because they hold the idea that the border needs to be secured and that there are criminals in this country that are not legally here. You know,
the situation that happened last week in San Francisco is evidence of that. It is prime example.
BLOOM: So you cannot generalize from one to a group --
SORBA: No, no, no, no, no. That is not what I am doing. That is what they are accusing him of doing.
BLOOM: And if he had simply said the boarders need to be secured, of course, he would not be a racist. But what he actually said on tape was,
"Mexicans are criminals and rapists except --
SORBA: El Chapo`s wife lives in Los Angeles. He sent her over here to be anchor babies. OK? He was referring to people like El Chapo. He was not
referring all Hispanics in any way shape or form.
BLOOM: No. He was referring to Mexicans.
SORBA: No. He was not.
BLOOM: That is actually the word he used.
PINSKY: All right. Hold on. Listen, by spinning around like this, we are not going to get anywhere necessarily. To me, I want to show you -- I want
to talk about what he said about McCain. This morning on NBC, Matt Lauer asked Trump about saying he liked people who had not been captured. He
suffers -- people that lose are bad. Again, that is scapegoating again. So, let us see what he says here.
(LAUGHING)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MATT LAUER, NBC HOST: If you are elected president, you will be Commander- in-Chief of this country. Do you think you have sent the wrong message to those people that if they are captured, somehow Donald Trump, the
Commander-in-Chief, is not in favor of them?
TRUMP: I do not think so. I think this, I do also respect greatly people that are not captured. Nobody talks about them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: He is very smart, Ryan. He is taking aim at the media and the media is not very popular right now. Yes, your comment, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: Thank you for having me, Dr. Drew. I was commenting as a Latino in California who we are now the majority.
PINSKY: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: Like Donald Trump just is doing this for shock value. He does not know what he is talking about. El Chapo is a
billionaire, but he is doing business with America because American demand the product that the Mexican supply. So, we cannot fix that until we
address us being the number one consumer of his product.
CATHERWOOD: By far.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: By far.
CATHERWOOD: By far.
PINSKY: Yes. I am listening.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: Obviously, they need the American weapons in Mexico. So, to lambaste my people and say that they are the problem when
it is 50-50, is like consent, which we were talking about.
(LAUGHING)
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: But, I do not think -- Again, we are starting to get very blurry when people talking about undocumented immigrants versus Latinos generally.
He is talking about undocumented immigrants, which has been a problem in this city for 35 years and he focused and scapegoated some problem that has
been around for a long time. It is not, not a problem. It is a problem.
BARNETT: But then he said, "I assume there is some good ones out there." And, that was his direct quote, "I assume there is some good ones out
there."
(CROSSTALKS)
PINSKY: To be fair, Vanessa. Some of those people --
(LAUGHING)
BARNETT: But then he does not -- I mean there are legal criminals here, too. Are we going to do something about that? He is just telling the
facts.
CATHERWOOD: How many presidential candidates on both sides of the political parties have been talking openly about the problem of illegal
immigration, especially in the southwest?
PINSKY: Yes.
CATHERWOOD: It is the fact that he chose to speak about it in a very poor manner.
PINSKY: Yes.
CATHERWOOD: I mean he did not articulate himself at all.
PINSKY: I think even Ryan, would agree with that. But, Ryan, I am going to hold you. I will get the question from here and we will get back to you
after the break. Go ahead. Yes?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: Thank you, Dr. Drew for having me.
PINSKY: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: You know, I might not agree with all of Donald Trump`s methods of what he is speaking, but I am for Donald Trump
and I am going to tell you why. You know, behind the scenes in politics there is a lot we do not see as the people.
[21:35:00] And, so, he is man that is capable of actually reforming our economy. Not only that, he is supported a lot of candidates behind the
scenes, so he does know a lot about politics.
PINSKY: And, can I read between the line what you are saying here? You are also saying that he is also, from your perspective, more honest than
you are used to seeing politicians?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: Yes, he is more honest and he is the everyday person. He is like when we look at Donald Trump -- no, no, let me
finish. I understand there is going to be some grunts.
PINSKY: Go ahead.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: But, he is like you and I. Just because he has money does not mean that he does not have feelings. And, there is a
big problem with immigration reform. He is just coming out and saying it.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: All right. We got to keep it going across the break, though. We will continue it.
And, later, a reality star arrested for allegedly stealing sun glasses, boldly, in front of -- there it is. OK. They see him. He walked out with
sunglasses. Back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: John McCain goes, "Oh, boy! Trump makes my life difficult. He had 15,000 crazies to show up." He call them all crazies.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEGUN ODUOLOWU, HOST OF "WIRED IN WITH SEGUN" PODCAST: He is cutting the grass so low that the biggest and the crazies that are coming up, even
McCain is saying that he is stirring up the crazies.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROLONDA WATTS, HOST OF "SUNDAYS WITH ROLONDA" PODCAST: I do not think he is a racist. He think he is a strategist. And, I do not think he is a
buffoon. I think he is a joker.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(APPLAUDING AND CHEERING)
TRUMP: A friend of mine comes up, he said, "I want to give you a rich guy. I want to give you a lot of money." I said, "You know, honestly, I do not
need it."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANAHITA SEDAGHATFAR, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: This is going to translate into dollars and cents for Donald Trump.
PINSKY: Right.
SEDAGHATFAR: And he is going to laugh his way to the bank.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(LAUGHING)
PINSKY: And he may be stirring up crazies, but he is also getting a ton of support from republicans and independents. He is now way out in a poll.
And, the recent poll was taken, he was at 24 percent now. I am back with Judy, Vanessa, Mike, Ryan, and Lisa. All right, Vanessa, do you think
Trump could become the nominee?
BARNETT: The nominee, maybe.
PINSKY: Really?
BARNETT: Actually, I think he could. I think people will jump on the bandwagon, jump on the crazy -- he will --
PINSKY: They are excited.
BARNETT: They will see the difference so much that people just go in his direction. I do not think he can win.
PINSKY: Why?
BARNETT: I think the country will rally around him.
PINSKY: Ryan, any concern as political strategist, A. That he will somehow sort of fumble the ball or split off as an independent?
SORBA: I think that he can do it. I think people are so sick and tired of examples like Barack Obama failing to lower the flag to half staff after
the troop shooting. I mean that is awful. Other examples, you know, John Kerry called, and he basically said, "If you go to college, you will do
well. If you do not, you will end up in Iraq."
And, Barack Obama appoints John Kerry as secretary of state. And, people are sick and tired of feeling like they need to be politically correct,
feeling like they need to watch every little word that they say or they are going to offend everybody, the thought police that we were talking about
earlier.
PINSKY: But, let me bring you somebody that Donald Trump did attempt, I think to take on, which was John McCain. He responded to Trump on MSNBC.
Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN MCCAIN, (R) ARIZONA, SENIOR U.S. SENATOR: It just is totally inappropriate for Mr. Trump to say he does not like to deal with people who
were captured. You know, my state is a very dynamic and divisive state and we got lots of arguments and lots of debates going on. I have hundreds of
town hall meetings all over Arizona and I am called crazy by the people that come there. I thought it was a term of endearment.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(LAUGHING)
PINSKY: Yes, ma`am?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: Hi, Dr. Drew. I am a pro-soldier, I love all the soldiers. But, Senator from South Carolina, Lindsey Graham, has
served 30 years in Air Force, and I never heard of anybody calling him a war hero. I have a question for you, I do not know why that is.
PINSKY: Why was he not called a war hero?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: Yes, you know, John McCain and a lot of people called him a war hero.
PINSKY: Well, I think it is because of what he endured at the Hanoi Hilton.
BARNETT: Five years of torture.
BLOOM: I have actually been to the Hanoi Prison where John McCain served. It is horrendous. I cannot imagine having to be there for one day. And,
John McCain could have left early, but he did not. He wanted to stay with his comrades.
PINSKY: That is the heroic part.
BARNETT: That deferments for what? Four years?
SORBA: John McCain is a true war hero.
BARNETT: And, Trump was not in a war --
SORBA: And, Donald Trump is -- he is essentially -- he has called John McCain a hero four times.
PINSKY: Let me --
SORBA: But, he has failed to report --
BARNETT: But he is so full of crap, because if he cared about the vets. If he really cared about the vets, he has been rich for a very long time,
he could --
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: One at a time.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE: But somebody like Lindsey Graham has been overshadowed by P.O.W. like you know John McCain.
PINSKY: Let me --
CATHERWOOD: He was not stuffed in a box in Saigon. That is the difference.
PINSKY: But, let us hear -- Mike, let us hear what Trump said about McCain and war veterans. Here is Trump`s own words on NBC.
TRUMP: And, he is doing a horrible job for the vets. Matt, I see the vets. They come to me. These are powerful, wonderful, people and they are
crying. They do not know what to do. They are lost because of what we are doing. Frankly, illegal immigrants get treated better than many of our
vets. It is a disgrace what is happening to this country. And, John McCain has done nothing about it but talk.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: We have another audience question. Yes, sir, go right ahead.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: Hi. Yes, I understand that, you know, everyone calls him a racist or buffoon. But he is honestly just like a
normal person. He is just very real.
PINSKY: He is honest.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE: You know, I think everyone wants to hear from a real person and everyone is losing the real focus. America, we are in
debt. You know, we need to build everything back up. Like it is so hard to find a job nowadays, even like a fast food or anything.
CATHERWOOD: You think the guy who climbs around on a private jet with his own name on it is the guy, who is going to be concerned about your well-
being, the lower middle class? Honestly?
And, by the way, Donald Trump does not have a glittering record of being able to handle his own finances. This is a man who was absolutely
destitute. And, if it was not for tax money that we all pitched in, if you are old enough to be around in 1990, he would not have anything going for
him and there would not be Trump industries. He is not a self-made financial wizard. He is an excellent entertainer.
PINSKY: Ryan.
SORBA: The United States of America did not hand Trump $10 billion. And the reason he is flying around on a private jet is because he has created
jobs that has built wealth for himself and we should not condemn that in the United States of America.
[21:45:00] CATHERWOOD: No one is condemning Donald Trump for being successful. I certainly am not. I think he is an excellent entertainer,
and that is exactly what he is. But to make him out to be an everyman is so far from normal. This is insane. He truly could care less about
anyone.
BLOOM: And, here is the other thing. Judgment matters. As much as we all love a blunt talker, and I love it, too. The president of the United
States needs to have judgment, because one false word can set off the economic markets, can cause violence abroad.
PINSKY: Yes.
BLOOM: That is why we need a president who actually thinks.
PINSKY: Yes. However, what I see is people are craving for somebody to speak to them directly and honestly. That is why they are experiencing him
like a regular guy, because he speaks to them like a regular guy.
They usually want honest. They do not want to language police all over them. And, they want somebody to lead them in a way that makes them feel
like they are being cared for, like, "I am going to lead you out of mess. I am going to lead you out of this." And, by the way, unemployment is
doing pretty well right now. It is coming down kind of nicely.
SORBA: I would like to say one more thing about McCain. You know, this whole situation with veterans affairs in Arizona, where these veterans are
literally dying, waiting to get seen by their doctors is pathetic. And, I think John McCain needs to address that and apologize.
PINSKY: I agree.
BARNETT: If they are coming to Trump and crying on his shoulder, and he is so concerned, use these billions of dollars you have and start foundations
and help these people that are crying on your arms. Do not just ignore them.
PINSKY: And, Judy, I got I got to wrap it up. Real fast.
HO: You know what? To all Trump has done is point the finger at everybody else and that is my worry if he takes on the presidency, that he is going
to externalize the blame and not solve any problems.
PINSKY: On the other hand, you cannot say he has not been effective as a businessman. He has been effective as a leader. Next up, millions of
people are worried tonight, a hacker is threatening to release names from an adultery website. Back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: Last week on this very set, two of our guests, Zoey Tur and Ben Shapiro, exchanged words during a discussion of Caitlin Jenner and the
transgender phenomena. The incident made headlines. Let me show you what happened. Have a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ZOEY TUR, TRANSGENDER REPORTER: You do not know what you are talking about. You are not educated on genetics.
SHAPIRO: We will discuss the genetics --
PINSKY: No. No.
TUR: What are your genetics?
PINSKY: So, let us stay away from the genetics and let us go back to the brain scans.
TUR: You cut that out now or you will go home in an ambulance.
SHAPIRO: Yes. That seems mildly inappropriate for a political discussion.
ODUOLOWU: No. I know, but to be fair --
(CROSSTALK)
ODUOLOWU: That is not fair.
SHAPIRO: I am sorry. It is not rude to say that someone who is biologically a male is a male.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Ben Shapiro has filed a report with Los Angeles Police department alleging battery. An investigation is underway. We asked Zoey and Ben for
comments. Zoey declined and Ben says he has been advised not to.
All right, we are going to turn to our "Click Fix" where my guests tell me what is trending on their social media pages. Mike, you are first.
CATHERWOOD: All right. This is all over my Facebook feed. Ashley Madison, the dating website for cheaters. It got hacked and the hackers
are threatening to release their customers` personal info if the website is not shut down immediately.
PINSKY: Is it shut down or is that it was return their money for this sort of thing they processed?
CATHERWOOD: No. No. No. That is just one little wrinkle. Here is the kind of personal info that could be exposed, secret sexual fantasies,
credit card info, real names, real addresses. 37 million users may have been affected. The hackers have been --
PINSKY: That is like 1 in 10 people in this country. I mean --
CATEHRWOOD: That is a lot.
PINSKY: Or is it international website. Must be international.
CATHERWOOD: I do not know. I do not know to be honest. We have had Noel on the show a couple of times, yes. If you pay a fee, you will supposed to
have your entire profile deleted. If they are full delete service, but the hackers say that is a lie, and the site does not actually delete any info.
PINSKY: Vanessa, what do you got?
BARNETT: Good. I want every cheater to be exposed. Every 37 million person. All right.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: What do you got?
BARNETT: My Click Fix. All over twitter, I saw this like 100 times on Twitter. And, it is that guy from "Vandervamp Rules," Jax Taylor.
PINSKY: He has been on this show.
BARNETT: Yes. He has been here. I was in here. He really wanted some sunglasses. Like he was amped about these sun glasses. So, he goes --
allegedly he was in Hawaii -- well, no, he really was in Hawaii.
PINSKY: There he is.
BARNETT: He is in the sun glass store. Picks up a pair of shades, right there. You can see him and allegedly just kind of walks out with them.
PINSKY: He forgets to pay?
BARNETT: Oh, sure, sure. Maybe he forgot to pay.
PINSKY: He is looking around, though.
HO: He is trying to pay.
BARNETT: Yes. Then he like kind of leaves. Later, he was arrested at his hotel and charged with second-degree theft, because they are thinking these
glasses were over $300, so it is a big deal. And, a few hours ago, he posted on Perescope and he told his followers, "Do not believe everything
you read in the tabloids."
PINSKY: OK.
BARNETT: But you can see, so I do not know if I should believe that.
HO: To be fair, it looks like he was looking for something. Maybe, he was looking for a register and when he did not find it, he thought they were
free.
(LAUGHING)
PINSKY: Or looking for a salesman.
BARNETT: Yes. Maybe.
PINSKY: Listen, it is very bizarre. What is the matter, Mike?
CATHERWOOD: Come on. Like someone who is peripherally involved with Vanderpump Rules, they should be able to commit heinous crimes that we
should not reported.
PINSKY: All right, we are going to come back with Judy`s "Click Fix" after our break. Be right back.
[21:55:00] (AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: Back with Judy, Vanessa, Mike. Judy, it is your "Click Fix."
HO: All right, ladies. Get ready to liberate your breasts from those booby cages, because apparently bras are bad for you. There is a study by
a scientist, and he studied 130 women over 15 years, all different bust sizes and ages and realized that actually wearing a bra constantly is going
to speed the process of sagging and aging. And, this is the part I did not believe. I could not confirm this.
PINSKY: How is that possible?
HO: I know. Women who would experience about a 7 milimeter lift in the nipples for each year they did not get a bra -- I mean this is not a
Benjamin Button for boobs.
(LAUGHING)
PINSKY: Watch it.
BARNETT: I take mine off.
(LAUGHING)
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: All right. Do not forget to follow us on Snap Chat. We are there. You can see what is going on during the show. Also, you can DVR
us, so you can watch this any time. I want to thank you for watching. We will see you next time.
END
