Return to Transcripts main page
Joy Behar Page
Missing in Aruba; Vieira`s View; Interview With Perez Hilton; Was Russell Armstrong Murdered?
Aired September 07, 2011 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANNOUNCER: Coming up on THE JOY BEHAR SHOW, as cops in Aruba search for missing American Robyn Gardner, her travel companion Gary Giordano remains in jail. Though he`s the prime suspect Arubans have yet to charge him. Joy wants to know why they`re dragging their feet.
Then the family of Russell Armstrong, the reality husband who committed suicide is reportedly hiring a PI because they think he was actually murdered. We`ll have an update.
Plus Joy`s pal Meredith Vieira talks about life after the "Today" show and Regis Philbin`s replacement.
That and more starting right now.
JOY BEHAR, HOST: I want to start out with a story in Aruba that we`ve been following the last few weeks. It involves missing American woman Robyn Gardner and her traveling companion, Gary Giordano. Now, this guy Giordano is also the prime suspect in her disappearance.
Today Giordano lost his appeal and will stay behind bars for another 60 days while prosecutors there continue to build a case against him.
Joining me now from Aruba with the latest in the case is Martin Savidge, CNN correspondent. Ok. Now Giordano has not yet been charged with a crime but the court decided to hold him another 60 days. Why and can they really do that if they have nothing on him?
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it`s typical of the Aruban justice system down here, Joy, that they can hold a person even without charging him. In fact, they usually don`t charge a person until right before their trial. So we don`t even know if Gary Giordano will ever even make it to the point of charges.
But here`s what the prosecution is contending, something happened to Robyn Gardner. They`ve heard the story that Gary Giordano has put forward, that this was an accident while they were snorkeling, but they don`t necessarily buy it. They say this is a serious case, there are real questions here, and it still needs to be investigated further. So as a result of that, Gary Giordano`s got to remain in custody while they do that.
BEHAR: Ok. So how did he react to the news that he`s remaining in custody?
SAVIDGE: We weren`t allowed inside the courtroom. It`s a closed proceeding. But according to his attorney, he wasn`t happy about it. You can bet he would not happy about it, 60 days in a prison in Aruba is not something to anticipate to like.
His attorney was clearly very frustrated, and it was the first time that he actually began speaking to us in more than a month, talking about how dissatisfied he was. He believes his client is not guilty of any crime. He was just a witness to a horrible accident.
BEHAR: Right. He`s also saying, the lawyer, is also saying he`s being treated unfairly because of the Natalee Holloway case, which also took place in Aruba. So is this a case of Aruban officials covering their butts?
SAVIDGE: There are a lot of people who believe that`s the case. Certainly his defense attorney believes that`s what`s going on here. That the shadow of the Natalee Holloway case, so many Americans were upset with Aruban authorities, didn`t feel that they prosecuted that case strongly enough.
Now you`ve got another missing American woman down here. And so they believe that ok, this time the Arubans are really going to show they`re going to be tough. And as a result, Gary Giordano suffers the consequences. That`s what his attorney is saying. Of course, the authorities here would dispute that greatly.
BEHAR: Well, there are so many things about this Giordano that look suspicious. Like for instance, he took out a $1.5 million travel insurance policy on Robyn. And he tried to cash in the policy within 48 hours of her disappearance. So it looks a little fishy. What do you know about that?
SAVIDGE: Exactly. Any time that you take out an insurance policy of $1.5 million on a person and then just a couple of days later you call in and say that person has vanished, naturally that raises suspicions.
It did for the American Express Insurance Company. They were so suspicious that they notified Aruban authorities and the FBI. They also say that it sounded like Gary Giordano, when he called in to inquire about the payout for that, that his voice sounded excited. Almost as if he was winning some sort of contest. That, too, doesn`t bode well for Gary Giordano.
However, I did have a conversation with his attorney. It`s his attorney who says that he told Gary to call the insurance company even though it wasn`t clear that time what had happened to Robyn Gardner. So was it really so suspicious? Maybe you report an accident just like you would your car. You report it as soon as you hear about it.
BEHAR: Ok. Thanks Martin, very much. Joining me now to talk about more on the case are John Q. Kelly, civil litigator and former prosecutor, he`s also the former attorney for Natalee Holloway`s parents; and Pat Brown, CEO of the Pat Brown Criminal Profiling Agency. Welcome, you guys.
So he`s not been charged with a crime, this guy, Giordano.
JOHN Q. KELLY, CIVIL LITIGATOR AND FORMER PROSECUTOR: Right.
BEHAR: And the court must want to keep him behind bars for something. What have they got on him?
KELLY: Well, if nothing else, they want to buy the 60 days to see if Robyn Gardner`s body turns us. And it`s also -- you know, there`s motive, the life insurance policy. There`s opportunity, he was the last person who was with her alive in a very unlikely place, this choppy water where he claims they were snorkeling which is totally implausible.
BEHAR: But she disappeared while she was snorkeling?
KELLY: Yes and he didn`t bother to keep an eye on her. And it was only when he got to shore that, "Oops, my partner`s gone." And the consciousness of guilt issue of the calling for the life insurance proceeds. He wanted to go to bed rather than continue to search that evening for her. He was sweating profusely when he was going through the airport to leave. They`ve got his cell phone --
BEHAR: He looks bad.
KELLY: His camera, his laptop that all have horrible scenes of he and Robyn on them. He`s not -- not your run of the mill guy.
BEHAR: Would you consider that circumstantial evidence, really? There`s no body. I don`t understand. If she disappeared while she was snorkeling, wouldn`t a body wash up? Wouldn`t there be blood in the water or something?
KELLY: Well, no, that`s very rough water. It`s off the very tip of Aruba. It`s about a seven or eight-mile channel between that and Venezuela. And you want to snorkel there. But if you want to see someone disappear, you might ask them to go swimming with you there.
BEHAR: So, you know, Pat, the authorities are trying to buy some time to gather more evidence on Giordano. But isn`t that a -- I said this before, isn`t that a violation of his rights? Is that just American court system? How long can they hold him without charging him with a crime?
PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: They can hold him for quite a long time. And that`s -- I personally kind of like that with the Aruban system because sometimes we can`t do anything in this country, we have our hands tied.
But they have got so much suspicious stuff on this guy. They`re not holding some poor, innocent fellow who, you know, absolutely nothing points to him. Everything points to him. And his story is -- is fishy as all get out.
And his lawyer`s full of crap, too. I mean the lawyer believes the only reason they`re doing it was because of Natalee Holloway. No, it`s because they`re suspicious. Do we really believe that you told your client to call up about insurance and make him look more suspicious? I doubt that. That just sounds like a lie to me.
I think they`ve got so much. They`re probably looking at a lot of other evidence, too, like where is her dress? Has anybody ever discussed that -- you know, the dress she was wearing coming out of the restaurant? Because if that dress is in his possession, well, she could have taken it off or he could have taken it off, but if that dress isn`t in his possession at all, where is it? And that would be a huge, huge clue. If that`s true, then the police -- another good reason to keep him.
BEHAR: Right. John, where is the dress?
KELLY: I was just going to comment. I was just thinking, he had a lawyer two days after the incident. He hadn`t even been charged yet. Why had he retained a lawyer that was advising him on steps to take when there were no charges pending --
BEHAR: Right. Why would he call the insurance company in a gleeful mood? That`s kind of dumb.
KELLY: He`s probably excited, you know. He`s probably deciding what he was going do with the money. He couldn`t contain himself, Joy.
BROWN: There wasn`t even any proof she was dead so it was kind of interesting that he even jumped the gun on that. I think that`s just one of his crazy things that he does. He doesn`t think things through very well. I think that`s just another example. So I doubt the lawyer told him to do that. I just don`t buy that.
BEHAR: What about the body? There`s no body. Can you actually charge someone without a habeas corpus, right? Isn`t that habeas corpus?
KELLY: Yes, it`s really helpful if you can find some indication of violence or crime scene or something like it. If they could find like bloody clothing or Robyn`s blood somewhere.
BEHAR: Wasn`t there blood on the beach? There was some blood.
KELLY: Well, yes, but we don`t know what the results are. We don`t if it was his, if it was hers or if it was someone else`s. But if they would --
BEHAR: Can`t they test that?
KELLY: Presumably they are. They sent it over probably, I presume, to the Dutch Forensic Institute. They`ll get the results back in and hopefully it`s something that will establish enough to hold him beyond the 60 days.
BEHAR: Yes. Pat, how big a stumbling block is it if they don`t have the body, do you think?
BROWN: I think it`s huge because -- I say everything points to this guy. But there is no evidence of a crime at this point outside the fact she`s missing. That`s not a crime to be missing. They need something, a proof of some kind of violent act. And they don`t have it.
I think that`s one of the reasons they`re holding him. I think they keep hoping somebody`s going to trip over a body somewhere on that island. Somehow they`re going find her, and then they`re going to have what they need.
BEHAR: Well, they`ve never found Natalee Holloway.
KELLY: I know. But there`s a difference between the two. And no one is more critical of the Aruban authorities than I was and for a long period of time. But in this particular case, I mean, they acted -- recognized the urgency right away. They conducted their searches by land, sea, and air right away. They had surveillance videos taken right away.
BEHAR: They`re on it.
KELLY: Their witnesses, the FBI --
BEHAR: They leaned maybe.
KELLY: They did. And they`ve done what they had to do this time. Whether you learn by mistake or not, you learn. And I think they`ve taken the appropriate action this time. Sometimes you just can`t solve a well- planned crime in those circumstances.
BROWN: Right. I want to point out something about the time frame, too. Giordano only had probably less than an hour to work with to get rid of her body in some place that he committed this crime. He didn`t have help like Joran Van Der Sloot. He didn`t have all those hours. He had -- there`s only so far he could go. So I think that`s why they think it`s still possible to find her body, especially if it`s on land. And if it`s on land, well then they`ve got him nailed. Obviously that`s not a location (ph) going to find her if she had a snorkeling accident.
BEHAR: Right.
Now Giordano`s father told the "Today" show that his son is being mistreated in prison. Let`s watch the clip.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GARY GIORDANO`S FATHER: And he said the place is miserable. And he said the temperature there at night time in the cell was over 100 degrees. So he wasn`t getting very much sleep, and then in addition to that, they had parked a police car right outside his cell on the grounds. And they blew the horn like every hour. And that kept him awake.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: So is this some form of -- some weird form of torture, where a police car`s constantly tooting a horn?
KELLY: No. First of all, he went there for the climate.
BEHAR: Yes.
KELLY: Secondly, he shouldn`t complain about the accommodations. And thirdly, he`s in a cell with three other guys. So if they`re honking the horn, it`s not going to bother just him but the other three guys and presumably everybody in the prison.
KELLY: I think that`s probably just nonsense. And I don`t think Giordano should be whining about his -- his -- his room and board right now.
BEHAR: Ok. Thank you guys very much.
KELLY: Thanks Joy.
BEHAR: We`ll be right back with my old pal, Meredith Vieira.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: For nine years, every morning my next guest sat right next to me on "The View". And then one day the skinny bitch left me for Matt Lauer. And now she`s left him. Good.
Please welcome to my show, my dear friend, Miss Meredith Vieira.
MEREDITH VIEIRA, FORMER HOST, "TODAY": I miss you. Thank you.
BEHAR: I know.
VIEIRA: Thousands gathered in the studio for me.
BEHAR: Ok, so you`ve come running back --
VIEIRA: To be you.
BEHAR: -- to me. Come back to me. So --
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: You never leave that love.
BEHAR: No the love --
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: You never.
BEHAR: I was telling you in the break that "AARP" magazine called me today. They asked me about you. They`re doing a piece on you.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: It`s nude.
And they said, what is this the rumor about the two of you being lesbian lovers? And I did not -- you know, I didn`t -- I didn`t kill the rumor.
VIEIRA: Never. Never.
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: We started that rumor on "The View", didn`t we?
BEHAR: Yes when we kiss.
VIEIRA: When we did a kiss.
BEHAR: When we kissed on the lips.
VIEIRA: And it lingered.
BEHAR: It lingered.
VIEIRA: Like a bad odor in the room. No, it was special.
BEHAR: It was so special.
VIEIRA: Then we did it several times because it drove Barbara nuts.
BEHAR: And now she wants me to kiss her constantly.
VIEIRA: Of course she does -- wannabe, wannabe. She has -- probably very soft -- you have very soft lips.
BEHAR: Barbara has soft lips, too.
VIEIRA: I think she does.
BEHAR: Yes, she does.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: So now the "Today" show, you know, everyone -- I know you`re supposed to call it "Today," don`t start with that again --
VIEIRA: Right.
BEHAR: And --
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: Start with what? That`s its name.
BEHAR: It never caught on.
VIEIRA: I know it didn`t.
BEHAR: It`s on "Today".
VIEIRA: I know.
BEHAR: It sounds like the date.
VIEIRA: Well, that was the idea. But it didn`t quite work.
BEHAR: No.
So you decided to leave. And we were wondering if it was Al Roker`s relentless cheerfulness that drove -- that drove you away.
VIEIRA: I know, he`s -- every morning that guy would come up the stairs whistling.
BEHAR: Whistling.
VIEIRA: Every morning.
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: Do you know what that`s like?
BEHAR: It`s so annoying.
VIEIRA: Oh, my God.
BEHAR: Oh my God.
VIEIRA: No, I love him. But he`s so happy.
BEHAR: He`s so happy.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: That you wonder, what`s he on? What is wrong with him?
VIEIRA: No. No, he`s just genuinely, I think he`s just happy to be alive. I really --
BEHAR: What? Did he die or have a near-death --
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: No, but I mean, no but you know what, he -- I think he`s just -- he just loves life.
BEHAR: He does.
VIEIRA: And he looks great.
BEHAR: He does.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: He lost all that weight with the operation.
VIEIRA: No, no. No, no, no. Well, that was a long time ago.
BEHAR: Oh. Oh.
VIEIRA: Then he -- when he worked with a nutritionist. And now he`s really -- I mean, he`s very serious about what he eats.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Right.
VIEIRA: And he exercises. And he`s just -- you know, he looks great.
BEHAR: Well, I understand when you get the gastric bypass, it doesn`t do anything unless you do Pilates also.
So --
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: Ok, I`m out of here now.
BEHAR: Now, the thing that I keep reading --
VIEIRA: You`re just like a dog with a bone.
BEHAR: So here`s my question --
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: No, the problem with that --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: Can we just finish it? That when you do that --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: The Pilates?
VIEIRA: No, not the Pilates. But when you do that stapling, whatever it is --
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: Very often you gain all the weight back. That`s the issue. You have to really be serious about your food regimen afterwards and stuff.
BEHAR: Right.
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: It will come right back.
BEHAR: Right. If you want to eat -- if you want to eat you`ll find a way.
VIEIRA: Exactly.
BEHAR: I -- I heard of a woman who had her jaws wired shut, and then she would suck the spaghetti through the thing. Until she --
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: And she wouldn`t choke?
BEHAR: -- until it was a whole bowl of spaghetti that she had consumed.
VIEIRA: Oh my gosh.
BEHAR: So where there`s a will there`s a way is my point.
VIEIRA: Yes. Why did she have the jaw done? To not eat?
BEHAR: Because to stop her from eating.
VIEIRA: Oh.
BEHAR: Yes.
But a lot of things I read about your leaving had to do with sleep deprivation. I think that -- everyone who`s watching can relate. And you would get up at 2:30 in the morning, which was crazy -- why couldn`t you get up at 4:00?
VIEIRA: Because, Joy, I`m a neurotic. And I got up at 2:30 because a lot of the work changed overnight.
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: And I would go to my Blackberry and look at all my e-mails just to see if I had the same stories. And very often I didn`t. And I just hated going to work not being prepared.
BEHAR: Right.
VIEIRA: So I`d rather -- I preferred to get up early, check all of that, and then I was feeding the animals. I had a routine.
BEHAR: So are you saying the others were not prepared since they got up --
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: Did you watch them? I carried that show. I carried that show for five long years. No.
I didn`t -- you know, it`s just that we work different ways. Like Matt would go in --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: -- and always -- I mean, he`s so punctual. He would get there at like 5:05 every morning. And that -- that hour and a half he would work. That`s when he would -- I mean, he worked, obviously, the day before.
But that was his focus time. I got in at 5:00, and I went right in to hair and make-up.
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: It took me a while.
BEHAR: And that`s relaxing. You don`t want to sort of -- you don`t want to --
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: Well, you can`t. You can`t focus on your work then.
BEHAR: Yes. So you get up at 2:30. And what time did you go to bed?
VIEIRA: Well, that was the problem. I`m a night person. I`m kind of like you`re a night person, aren`t you?
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Yes, I don`t know.
VIEIRA: And so I would go to bed like 11:00, 11 -- to I don`t know.
BEHAR: Three and a half hours? Is that three and a half?
VIEIRA: Well --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: One, 12 --
VIEIRA: Who has sleep deprivation?
BEHAR: Three and a half hours of sleep every night?
VIEIRA: Well, 11:30, 12:30, 1:30, 2:30, 3 -- and so I work at three and a half, yes.
BEHAR: Oh my God.
VIEIRA: I know so by Friday.
BEHAR: How about a nap? Did you take a nap?
VIEIRA: I`m not a napper.
BEHAR: Oh my God. No wonder you had to leave.
VIEIRA: I know and Matt`s a power-napper. He knows how to nap. I could just -- if I napped, I felt worse. So it just -- it was -- for me it was very exhausting. It was a great job, incredible people. I love the people. Well, you know you`ve been over there.
BEHAR: Yes, they`re lovely.
VIEIRA: They are great. But I just found that it was becoming my entire life. And I don`t think that`s a good thing ultimately.
BEHAR: So you have no regrets. Do you miss anything?
VIEIRA: I miss them.
BEHAR: You miss the people.
VIEIRA: I miss the people. I miss the salary. I miss -- no. I -- I -- I miss -- I miss the adrenaline rush every day. I love doing live television. It`s a lot of fun.
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: But you know, you`ve got to know when it`s your time. And I felt it was time, and I didn`t want to go out on the bottom. You know you want to go out on top.
BEHAR: Well, you look so great.
VIEIRA: Thanks.
BEHAR: You looked so rested. You look ten years younger.
VIEIRA: Really?
BEHAR: Yes, you looked very rested. And I think you made the right choice.
VIEIRA: I think I did, too. You know there are days when you have those doubts.
Because it`s weird to be going "on", quote-unquote, to off.
BEHAR: Right.
VIEIRA: And you wonder how, at what point you will become obsolete and people just won`t, you know, acknowledge you anymore, how much they identify you because of your job instead of who you are.
And I always thought that I didn`t think that way. But then when you leave something, you start to question who am I, what is my real value? And if you`ve been in TV for so long, you do get tied up in all of that baloney.
BEHAR: So then, you`re not addicted to that red light that goes on.
VIEIRA: Is it on?
BEHAR: But I am. I am.
Next, Meredith`s take on marriage and the guy she says has it all figured out. Not her husband, either. Somebody else.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Meredith Vieira and I are back. And we are joined by James Braly, the talented performer and writer of "Life in a Marital Institution", which Meredith`s production company is producing. Very good, you`re in the producing business.
VIEIRA: I`m lucky that I have him.
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: I am very lucky. Yes.
BEHAR: James, you wrote a one-man show. Tell us about it.
JAMES BRALY, AUTHOR, "LIFE IN A MARITAL INSTITUTION": It`s called "Life in a Marital Institution, 20 years of monogamy and One Terrifying Hour". That`s pretty much the show.
The basic show is a guy falls in love with a woman, marries her after he finds out that she`s very unusual. She becomes increasingly unusual. Weird even. And perhaps a normal guy might leave her. But --
BEHAR: But the setting is a hospice?
BRALY: Yes. Not the normal setting for --
BEHAR: How hilarious is that? Wait, let me --
VIEIRA: Dark comedy.
BEHAR: Ok. I believe you could do that kind of thing --
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: His sister is dying at the same time.
BRALY: That`s right. That`s right. And I tell her that I love her, and she says, "Well, how much? You want to trade places with me?" And I say, "Well then that would mean you`d have to trade places with me. You`d have to be in my marriage." And she says, "I`d rather die" -- which says something about the chemistry of the man and the woman.
BEHAR: Is this based on your real marriage? Are you married?
BRALY: It is based on my real marriage. And I used that as the starting point. So --
BEHAR: I see. And you wrote this show yourself?
BRALY: I did. I wrote it and developed it over --
BEHAR: Well, how did you find each other?
VIEIRA: Amy Rap who works with me and my production company, called and said there`s this fantastic monologist, James Braly. I think you would love him. Sent me a tape of him going his show and he`d been off Broadway. He`s very successful.
And I just loved his sensibility. I loved -- it`s very dark but it`s very funny, as well. And it`s -- there`s something very touching about it and endearing. And I trusted Amy`s instinct. I said I`d love to "get into bed", quote/unquote, with this man.
BEHAR: Down girl.
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: And his marriage -- his marriage made mine look really good. So --
BRALY: That`s one of the thoughts about the show.
VIEIRA: Exactly.
BRALY: The director, Hal Brooks, said the goal of the show is when the lights go out, people look at each other and say, you know, I thought it was bad, but we have it so good.
BEHAR: That`s really good. I was going to ask for some marital tips because you know I just got married. Now it sounds like it was worse than anything that I --
VIEIRA: You can learn from it.
BRALY: No, you do learn from it. And some people`s beat is happy marriage, and that`s great. You know, I happened to be in a high-conflict, challenging marriage. And decided to report on it honestly.
BEHAR: Uh-huh. So you have no tips? Do you have any tips for me?
VIEIRA: Well, you have it already. Humor, I think, is my number-one tip. In a marriage --
BEHAR: I think it`s absence makes the heart grow fonder.
VIEIRA: Absence?
BEHAR: I`m never there --
VIEIRA: Or abstinence.
BEHAR: I`m never home.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: I do two shows a day, I never see him. That`s the secret.
VIEIRA: He`s not here? He used to come and sit here when --
BEHAR: No, no more. No.
BRALY: He`s gone. That`s why I`m here. I`m on the road touring the show about the marriage.
BEHAR: My friend says that she and her boyfriend, husband, whatever he is, they spend quality time apart. That is the key to the city.
Thank you, James, very much -- and for doing this.
BRALY: Thank you so much.
BEHAR: And good luck with your show.
We`ll have more with Meredith Vieira on the way. So sit tight. She`s not going away.
VIEIRA: Of course.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Still ahead, Perez Hilton talks about going from celebrity bully to anti-bullying children`s author.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with my former "View" co-host and friend, Meredith Vieira. You know, Mere ...
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: It`s going to be ten years this Sunday since the 9/11 attacks on the World Trade Center.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: And, you know, people are talking about where they were. It`s sort of like the Kennedy assassination.
VIEIRA: Yeah, absolutely.
BEHAR: Where were you that day -- and you always remember exactly where you were when something like that happens. And you and I were together.
VIEIRA: Yeah, we were in hair and make-up ...
BEHAR: We were wearing makeup.
VIEIRA: Preparing for the "View." And I remember that when the first plane hit we said to Bill Getty, executive producer, should we be talking about this on the show? At that point, people thought it was a little plane that hit the trade center.
BEHAR: Right.
VIEIRA: Nobody really knew. And he said, I think this may be to local. You know, we were all trying to piece things together. And then I -- I remember that second we saw the second plane hit, and it was just -- it didn`t even sink in. Did you have that feeling like it was ...
BEHAR: It was like what is this?
VIEIRA: What is this, exactly. And we were told everybody to go. To leave. And we were going to be preempted and just to go home, be with your family, whatever. And I remember getting in the car. And I live outside of the city, and they -- my kids were outside of the city. And I called my husband who was in the city working, and I said, you`re leaving with me -- he said, I don`t want to leave. I said, please, I want to get -- I want to get the kids from school.
BEHAR: Oh, he didn`t want to go?
VIEIRA: No, he didn`t want to go. And then they were closing all the bridges and the tunnels.
BEHAR: Right.
VIEIRA: And the guy who would drive me in to the "View" every day, Carlos, he said, I will get you to your kids` school. And he knew every back road and he got me to the Bronx where the kids were in` school. And I`ll never forget going upstairs and in the principal`s office, there was a boy, high school age -- my kids were, I think, Ben was seventh grade, at that point, I think Gabby was fifth, and Lily was third, and he was crying. His parents were in that building. And he had no idea whether they were alive or not. And just that image just stayed with me.
BEHAR: Do you know if they made it?
VIEIRA: I do not believe they did.
BEHAR: Oh, that`s terrible.
VIEIRA: Yes. So I think a couple of kids lost parents that day.
BEHAR: Oh my god. You know, we were talking -- You talk to people who survived it, and they have -- they`re burned and they`re -- it`s been - - people who jump ...
VIEIRA: What did you do?
BEHAR: Well, I got on the phone and I called my daughter who was on a plane.
VIEIRA: That`s right.
BEHAR: You immediately think of your children. Because ...
VIEIRA: Yes, of course.
BEHAR: As you said, I thought, the bridges are going to be closed. She won`t be able too get home.
VIEIRA: Right.
BEHAR: If the planes are still taking off, I don`t want her in a plane. So it was just a horror. It was a nightmare. A -- total nightmare. And I -- I think that it just kept reverberating for weeks and weeks. I was saying, I`ve been saying on the air in various places how scared everyone was.
VIEIRA: Very scared. Scared that something else was going to happen. Why should it stop after this? You know ...
BEHAR: Yeah.
VIEIRA: ... because who would have thought that that would happen in this country. I don`t think we ever thought of ourselves as being as vulnerable as we were.
BEHAR: No. We were in fool`s paradise, I think.
VIEIRA: Right. Right.
BEHAR: And then for weeks and months you were hearing about how, you know, they only learned these terrorists only learned to take off in a plane, they never learned to land. And nobody picked that up.
VIEIRA: I think - why wouldn`t they learn that?
BEHAR: And they got through security so easily. So you knew that there were holes in the security system in the country. So it kept you scared and on your toes and worried about getting on a plane or getting -- going through a tunnel. You know, for years I didn`t go through the tunnels to Jersey.
VIEIRA: Really?
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: ... because you were scared of being trapped in there if something happened.
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: And then there were a lot of pieces being done where reporters who were going through security with things in bags to show how easy it was to get something through.
BEHAR: Through.
VIEIRA: Through. You know, so that made you even more anxious.
BEHAR: Do you feel that - you feel safe now, do you feel secure?
VIEIRA: I don`t think I`ll ever feel totally secure again. I think that just did a number on so many of us. But -- and I think that when we had all the color code, it got confusing to people.
BEHAR: Oh, remember that?
VIEIRA: Yes. So, I think that -- that was like a false sense of security. But you know, you can`t live your life in fear every day. You won`t -- you won`t walk out of your house. So to that extent, I -- I try to be vigilant in terms of looking around me. I really believe if you see something it is important to report it.
BEHAR: Say it.
VIEIRA: To say it. But I don`t want to run scared. I just don`t want to. In fact, that night it was interesting, the night of 9/11, my middle guy, Gabe, he had these two girls -- and he`s a baker, and he loved baking cakes. And he was making a pizza, like a dessert pizza. And two of these little girls were coming over. And at first I thought, I don`t think I want to do that tonight. And then I thought, no, because kids didn`t understand the magnitude of it. And he had these girls out, and they were outside, we were watching the coverage. And they were laughing, and in an odd way, it was important to me to understand that life was going on.
BEHAR: Right.
VIEIRA: And that that was -- you had to -- you know, to hold on to that or you would just fall into such a sense of despair.
BEHAR: Uh-huh.
VIEIRA: As we did anyway. But I needed that. I needed that ....
BEHAR: Yeah, the children.
VIEIRA: ... a little bit of joy, yes, from those kids. The innocence.
BEHAR: Well, Sherri Shepherd was telling me that she did a comedy night, and the place was packed and al the comedy rooms were packed. I don`t know about New York, she wasn`t in New York. People wanted to laugh that night and have some kind of semblance of sanity.
VIEIRA: Exactly. And remember when we came back, not knowing -- we were tiptoeing through the "View" in the beginning. Because you want to have fun with your audience, they need it. But you didn`t know when it would be appropriate ...
BEHAR: Right.
VIEIRA: ... to reintroduce that kind of levity.
BEHAR: Right. I know but then David Letterman, he did something.
VIEIRA: Did he break the ice?
BEHAR: He broke the ice. Yes.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: But you know, a lot of people we were talking also about how - - you know, I said something about how -- I started eating. I must have put on like eight pounds or something in the next couple of years, few years. Luckily Jenny Craig saved the day. But I must have ...
VIEIRA: It was nervous ...
BEHAR: I just kept - I just was eating. And a lot of people put on weight ...
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: ... because it was like you had in the back of your mind we`re going to die, might as well enjoy the lasagna.
VIEIRA: Right, exactly.
BEHAR: You know what I mean?
VIEIRA: Exactly.
BEHAR: And there was a lot of that.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: And then other people felt -- decided to get married or have children or decided not to have children. Major decisions were being made based on that incident.
VIEIRA: Yeah, I don`t think I made any major decisions. I think I was fairly overprotective of my kids for a while ...
BEHAR: Of course.
VIEIRA: I didn`t want them out of my sight. I wanted to know where they were.
BEHAR: But you know, my daughter then went to school in Canada. And I was glad to send her to Canada.
VIEIRA: Thought she`d be safer there.
BEHAR: Normally I would be like, oh, my God -- yeah. Now, go to Canada.
VIEIRA: Yeah.
BEHAR: They don`t seem to be interested in Canada.
VIEIRA: Well, the logic`s a little weird, but I get it - I get it. Yes.
BEHAR: So what about Obama? Do you think that -- first of all, he caught Osama bin Laden -- which -- and killed him. I think it`s phenomenal.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: And you know, he`s in trouble right now with the economy. But people have to remember that particular thing. Do you feel more secure with that?
VIEIRA: Do I feel more secure with him? I don`t really attach security to a person like that.
BEHAR: No?
VIEIRA: No.
BEHAR: Even though he caught the guy.
VIEIRA: Yes, but that -- yeah, he did. But those people that had been training to do that are -- I mean I think we need to focus on them, as well. I think it`s great that it happened on Obama`s watch. Because I think a lot of people thought he would not be as on top of terror and terrorism as Bush had been. That this guy was not going to be tough. And I think that he`s demonstrated that he is tough.
BEHAR: Right.
VIEIRA: And he made it a point from the beginning that he wanted to get that guy.
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: So they did, and I think that`s great.
BEHAR: And he basically has disrupted the al-Qaeda, you know, network. Now they`re worried about lone killers like the thing that happened in Norway, and just crazy suicide bombers in the middle of Times Square and like that.
VIEIRA: That`s exactly right. Individuals here and there doing their own little self-destruction, wherever it is. And I think that`s what they think the next thing will be in the states. It`s not going to be the big attacks like 9/11, it`s going to be a lot of little ones.
BEHAR: Well, the thing about a suicide bomber is, what are you supposed to do with something like that? They have, you know -- this is what Israel`s constantly dealing with, I think.
VIEIRA: Right.
BEHAR: And now you are willing to die for your cause? Well, there`s nothing we can-- how can we stop that?
VIEIRA: Exactly, if somebody wants to do it, they`ll find a way to do it.
BEHAR: But I don`t - I don`t feel scared lately.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: I don`t feel as scared. I mean, you know, I just don`t. I don`t know, maybe I`m in denial.
VIEIRA: Getting married?
BEHAR: What has that got to do with it?
VIEIRA: I don`t know. I was just wondering.
BEHAR: Do you think that -- well, I know that part of my getting married had to do with death.
VIEIRA: Which part?
BEHAR: The part like, you know, if I need someone to step on the air hose, then I want to know that he`s my husband and he can do it because if he`s just my boyfriend they`ll say, sorry, you can`t step on the air hose.
VIEIRA: There`s a line of people that would do it.
BEHAR: That`s true. There`s a line. There`s a line.
VIEIRA: Yes.
Come on, that`s what my husband says about me. There`s a line of people who are ready to pull your plug.
BEHAR: But you know, I was talking to somebody that I know. And she said, he won`t do it. He won`t do. And I said, yes, he will.
VIEIRA: Steve will?
BEHAR: Yes, Steve.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: I mean he will do it.
VIEIRA: He promised he would do it?
BEHAR: He said he would step on the air hose, even if I`m not in a coma. That`s the weird part.
VIEIRA: He`s so accommodating.
Would you do it for him?
BEHAR: No, no.
I wouldn`t do it more my husband so I`m not the one.
VIEIRA: I`m not the one. I can`t do it.
BEHAR: Yeah, to get someone else.
VIEIRA: I was raised catholic. I think murder is a sin. And so is suicide. It`s all a sin.
BEHAR: Yeah, but if someone else could commit it. Not me.
VIEIRA: But if he - if there`s no coming back for him and you know that that`s what he wants, you still can`t do it?
BEHAR: Yep.
VIEIRA: I`m the same way.
BEHAR: I can`t do it.
VIEIRA: I know.
BEHAR: Oh, God. We`re in trouble.
VIEIRA: Poor Steve and Richard are going to be lying somewhere.
BEHAR: This is where you need a Dr. Kevorkian.
VIEIRA: Well, we`ve got somebody else. Somebody`s going to handle Richard. Who`s handling Steve?
BEHAR: Barbara Walters.
VIEIRA: She`s doing Richard. This has taken such a turn. Weird dark. Dark.
BEHAR: All right, anyway, I think we`re done. It was so great to see you.
VIEIRA: It`s great to see you. Cut that part out about Steve and Richard.
BEHAR: You know I love you.
VIEIRA: I love you too.
BEHAR: And I miss you and I ...
VIEIRA: I know, nobody invites me back to that show, the "View." Everybody else comes back.
BEHAR: I don`t put the show. I have nothing to do with it.
VIEIRA: OK.
BEHAR: Talk to the producers.
VIEIRA: All right. Carl?
BEHAR: See what you can do. OK. We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Perez Hilton may be a notorious celebrity blogger, but apparently he has a soft spot, too. His new children`s book, "The Boy With Pink Hair," is about a little boy who`s different from the other kids and learns to love it. I`m happy to welcome back to my show, the always colorful Perez Hilton. So Perez, first of all, the book, "The Boy With the Pink Hair," very cute.
PEREZ HILTON, AUTHOR, "THE BOY WITH PINK HAIR": Thank you.
BEHAR: It sort of sounds like -- you write he was born this way. Lady Gaga. I hear it.
HILTON: I was definitely inspired by Gaga and by a lot going on in my life and in the world. And she was kind enough to give me a quote for the book. She read it, she loved it. I say I`m amazed at the variety and awesomeness of all people that gave me quote. I have Gaga, Cher, Dolly Parton, Ricky Martin, Selena Gomez, and Gloria Estefan.
BEHAR: That`s good.
HILTON: Nice.
BEHAR: That`s very good. I mean is pink hair euphemism for being gay?
HILTON: No.
BEHAR: No.
HILTON: It`s just for being different. But it`s a very visual way to see it. You know you can sometimes hide the fact that you`re gay, but you can`t hide the fact that you have pink hair. And to me, we`re all outsiders. Everybody feels at one point in their life like they don`t belong. And there`s a great message in the book for kids, for adults, for parents.
BEHAR: Yes. Good. But you say that it seems like an unlikely thing for you to do.
HILTON: Very.
BEHAR: Yeah, considering your reputation ...
HILTON: Yes.
BEHAR: ...which precedes you.
HILTON: Yes.
BEHAR: So then ...
HILTON: Why?
BEHAR: Yes, why do you say -- I read that you said you`re the perfect person for the job.
HILTON: I think I am because I`m somebody who acknowledged that I was making a mistake and mistakes and the way that I was doing my business and how I was doing things in the past. And I -- just even that acknowledgment is a big thing. But to take steps not be that same person anymore, to not be mean, to not draw inappropriate things on photos, to not out celebrities, I think is a great message to young kids that, you know, you can always change your life. You have the power to be and do whatever you want. And then I`m somebody who loves kids, who wants to have children myself. I dedicated it to my future children ...
BEHAR: That`s a little scary.
HILTON: Why? I`m going to be a great dad. I would be an awesome parent.
BEHAR: I`m teasing you. But you know, there are all people who are saying that you know, that you are being a little hypocritical since you were a bully, you know, cyber bully. And now you`re writing kind of an anti-bully book. How do you respond to those people? That you`ve changed?
HILTON: That I am no longer that person. That was actually a big wake-up call for me. Because I never viewed myself as a bully. I would always justify my behavior saying, oh, I`m -- you know, satire, comedy, I`m only making fun of celebrities.
BEHAR: Yes.
HILTON: I`m not doing this to normal folks. But after hearing it from enough people last fall when I was talking about all those gay teenagers that were committing suicide, I looked in the mirror and I was like I can`t continue to operate like this because I`m not a bully. In my heart that`s not who I am.
BEHAR: No, I think -- well, a lot of times when you`re the victim of bullying, which maybe you were, you become a bully yourself. Like the abused become the abuser.
HILTON: I don`t think I was abused more than anyone else in high school. And actually, I was probably abused just as much for being fat as I was for being gay and clearly in the closet.
BEHAR: Well, those are the things, you know.
HILTON: Yes.
BEHAR: But you know, just the other day -- I have to take you on for something.
HILTON: OK.
BEHAR: You posted a photo of you pretending to poop in the mouth of Justin Bieber cardboard cutout. Now that`s kind of a mean-girl thing to do.
HILTON: No, I think it`s silly. It`s sophomoric. Poop jokes are always in style. It`s one of the basics - like comedy 101, Joy
BEHAR: Really? For third graders.
HILTON: Maybe. I`m not saying I`m extremely mature.
BEHAR: Or sophisticated --
HILTON: Or sophisticated. I`m just saying I`m not calling Justin Bieber unpleasant names or ../
BEHAR: When you`re just pooping in his mouth. Well ...
HILTON: That`s funny. His manager messaged me saying, we thought that was really funny.
BEHAR: The manager`s an idiot. Has to be to say that. Whoever he is.
HILTON: I think that`s really funny.
BEHAR: Oh, yes. But you -- so you were mentioning before that at one point you thought it was OK to out gays. Now you`re off of that track.
HILTON: Yes, no more.
BEHAR: And so what -- you`re not ...
HILTON: I can talk about it privately with my friends, but it`s a different thing when you have, you know, this public vehicle to broadcast to millions of people every day.
BEHAR: Right. And people are harmed by things like that.
HILTON: They could be.
BEHAR: Yes. So, what are you doing then? You`re not outing gays.
HILTON: My new approach ...
BEHAR: You`re not bullying. You`re not making nasty remarks ...
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: You`re still pooping in the cardboard thing, though. Yes.
HILTON: My new word is sassy. I can be sassy without being nasty.
BEHAR: OK. That`s your motto?
HILTON: Yes.
BEHAR: I`m sassy without being nasty?
HILTON: I`m very sassy.
BEHAR: All right. So you`re a new person.
HILTON: I -- I`m the same person, but now it`s more about integrating the real me and hiding less behind this character that I had created.
BEHAR: OK. Well, it`s a very cute book.
HILTON: Thank you.
BEHAR: "The Boy With Pink Hair" by Perez Hilton. Pick it up at your local bookstore. We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: A new twist tonight in the "Real Housewives" suicide tragedy. According to TMZ, the family of Russell Armstrong doesn`t believe he hanged himself. They say he was murdered. Yes, right. Here now with more on this is Jerry Penacoli. He is a correspondent from Extra.
Jerry, why does the family think Russell was murdered and who do they think did it?
JERRY PENACOLI, EXTRA: Well, as you know, Russell Armstrong was a venture capitalist. He had a lot of money problems before he died. Word is according to the sources that spoke to TMZ is that one of these companies that he had an interest in owed money to another company, and then basically he was sued for about a million dollars. And so this was all happening as his life was crumbling. He was, you know, married to a trainwreck of a woman who was living way beyond her means, and therefore the family was living way beyond their means. So this guy was up to his you know what in financial debt.
And so their thinking is that perhaps he got involved with the wrong people because of his kind of immediate need for cash. So that`s what this whole murder theory is based on.
I think it`s a flimsy theory at this point, to be honest.
BEHAR: It`s hard to--
PENACOLI: I think they`re reaching for straws.
BEHAR: Isn`t it hard to kill someone by hanging them unless they poison you first? Did the toxicology report say that there was poison in his system or anything?
PENACOLI: No drugs. No, no, no. The coroner`s report has deemed no foul play, no drugs, that the 47-year-old just completely and utterly killed himself. It`s been ruled a suicide.
Now I spoke to Taylor Armstrong`s divorce attorney a couple of days ago, and he gave me some really interesting information. He said that despite it all and despite all of their problems, they were supposed to have dinner the night that he hanged himself, and they were trying to put some of these abuse allegations behind them and maybe try to reconcile. So that`s kind of a really sad postscript to the whole story.
BEHAR: But you know, another associate, a business associate was also found dead recently apparently of suicide. So maybe they just both were unhappy with their situations? Do they think that he`s been murdered also?
PENACOLI: Well, no. I don`t know what the family thinks about the associate who also was found dead, another victim of suicide. But I think that what they`re thinking is that these two men, they were partners, they were part of a millionaire`s club, and so perhaps they were involved in the same kind of scheme that went bad and were part of the same lawsuit where they needed to come up with this million dollars. So you know, when you`re up against the wall like that, God only knows what you`re going to do.
But in terms of Russell Armstrong, I mean, you know, this is a guy who just had so many other issues to deal with and was living his life under the microscope as a result of that show.
BEHAR: Yes, I see. But you can`t blame it on television. There`s too much stuff around it in my opinion, but that`s just me.
PENACOLI: Absolutely.
BEHAR: OK. Thanks, Jerry, very much. And thank you for watching. Good night, everybody.
END
