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Joy Behar Page
Meredith and Her Man; NBC Apology Disappoints Michele Bachmann; Consumerism Gone Wild
Aired November 28, 2011 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up on THE JOY BEHAR SHOW, Joy`s buddy and former "View" co-host Meredith Vieira tells Joy about getting more sleep after leaving NBC`s "Today". And she`ll give her take on the GOP`s presidential hopefuls.
Then after a spate of fights, thefts and trampled shoppers, Joy wants to know how we let Black Friday evolve into such a chaotic nightmare.
Plus a look back at Joy`s interview with the legendary Carol Burnett.
That and more starting right now.
JOY BEHAR, HLN HOST: We`re going to start the show tonight with someone I love and adore even though she left me high and dry at "The View". No, I`m not bitter.
Since leaving the "Today" show, Meredith Vieira -- she`s always leaving something -- is enjoying spending time with her kids and her husband Richard Cohen who is battling multiple sclerosis.
Joining me now, the hottest couple ever to grace the cover of AARP if you don`t count Siegfried and Roy, Meredith Vieira and Ricky Cohen. Applause, applause, applause for the happy couple
MEREDITH VIEIRA, FORMER NBC CO-HOST, "TODAY": Are you still on the air or are we just doing this to humor you?
BEHAR: Well, we`re still --
VIEIRA: How do you know if this was part of like a therapy.
BEHAR: Wouldn`t that be funny, like no one`s watching?
VIEIRA: We`re here for you. We`re here for you.
BEHAR: We`re here until the end of the year. Then I don`t know what they`re putting on.
VIEIRA: Really?
BEHAR: Yes, I know.
VIEIRA: They`ll put on schlock (ph). I`m angry. Can I be angry?
BEHAR: Go ahead be angry.
VIEIRA: I`m angry.
BEHAR: I know.
Vieira: This show does so well, it has all the buzz. People always talk about it. Love you, ridiculous.
BEHAR: I know. What can I tell you.
VIEIRA: Who makes these decisions?
BEHAR: People. All right. So let`s get back -- let`s do a thing --
RICHARD COHEN, HUSBAND OF MEREDITH VIEIRA: Why is she sucking up to you?
BEHAR: She`s not.
VIEIRA: When I leave her, I`m going to suck up to the executives. Joy wanted me to do that. I didn`t want to.
BEHAR: Well, she`s been sleeping with the whole network.
VIEIRA: What did it get me? Nothing.
BEHAR: Absolutely nothing.
VIEIRA: Absolutely nothing.
BEHAR: But I mean, you know what; you are now a free woman, Meredith. You have been released.
VIEIRA: What does that mean, a free woman?
BEHAR: The fact you don`t have to get up in the middle of the night anymore.
VIEIRA: I know.
BEHAR: Is the greatest gift that you could give your husband, am I right?
VIEIRA: It`s true.
COHEN: No question about it. Every morning -- see, she got up at 2:30 in the morning.
VIEIRA: Yes, I did.
BEHAR: Why?
COHEN: It was never clear what was going on upstairs.
BEHAR: What is it, and the show didn`t start until 7:00. Why does everybody have to get up at 2:30?
VIEIRA: I had to get up. I had a whole thing, I went into my bathroom, I lay on the cool tile.
COHEN: I don`t think you should tell her anymore.
BEHAR: You were laying on the cool tile. What did you have, malaria?
VIEIRA: I`d prop my legs up -- this is getting sexual. I would look at my Blackberry and I`d go through -- inevitably the stories would change, a new show. Then I would get ready for the morning, I feed the animal, do all those things.
BEHAR: But you would be getting up.
VIEIRA: In all seriousness --
COHEN: It was hard not to keep the same schedule.
BEHAR: Couldn`t you sleep in another room, not for nothing, it`s only four days a week.
VIEIRA: Would you do that? You would never do that.
BEHAR: I would. I would.
VIEIRA: You would not.
BEHAR: I would. Steve would not allow it because he`s a horny dog, but I would do it. I would do it.
COHEN: I felt some responsibility to make sure she was up.
VIEIRA: And he would help me with --
COHEN: I brought in the explosives. I brought in the workmen. I brought in the crane.
BEHAR: Do the words alarm clock ring a bell? You could have just used that --
VIEIRA: We have an alarm clock. It`s a rough schedule and sleep deprivation is not a good thing for anybody. And I think it got to me, quite seriously. And I realize I was -- it had become most of my life. It`s a great job and I loved it. You know when it`s your time.
BEHAR: Yes. So to speak.
VIEIRA: Which brings us to AARP -- you know, it`s your time --
BEHAR: AARP.
VIEIRA: I`m teasing.
BEHAR: I know. I mean you`re on so many covers. As I pointed out to you this morning, this is the only cover I have a chance of getting on. I`m so happy to see the two of you looking very gorgeous. I mean I think you`re the youngest people who have ever been on the cover.
VIEIRA: No, no, it is now a very hot cover. What is the subscription? It is massive.
COHEN: 38 million.
VIEIRA: 38 million.
BEHAR: 38 million seniors read this.
COHEN: Yes. But see demographics are changing. Hollywood stars are aging and they see their audiences out there reading this magazine.
VIEIRA: You know who was on the cover before us. Who do you think?
BEHAR: Who?
VIEIRA: Just guess.
BEHAR: It wasn`t George Clooney?
VIEIRA: Antonio Banderas.
BEHAR: Antonio Banderas is on the cover?
COHEN: Jack Nicholson has been on the cover.
VIEIRA: Sure.
BEHAR: Jack Nicholson`s old?
VIEIRA: Robert Redford.
BEHAR: Well, he`s old.
VIEIRA: Well, I`m just saying but stars. I mean the movie stars want to be because you have that number of people who are looking at your face.
BEHAR: It`s pretty impressive.
VIEIRA: That`s not why we did it though. We didn`t do it because --
BEHAR: Why did you do it?
COHEN: We did it to talk about chronic illness.
BEHAR: Right, which you`ve been living with
COHEN: Right.
And I write a column, it`s called "Chronically Upbeat", which is a lie. I`m not upbeat at all. But it was the only way I could sell it to them. So everyday --
VIEIRA: It`s true.
COHEN: I meet with them and I smile and am upbeat.
BEHAR: And then you go home --
COHEN: If you read the column, it`s death and destruction.
VIEIRA: It really is depressing. No, you`ve done good, though.
BEHAR: It`s not that you`re not upbeat. It`s just that you`re in reality. That`s what I think about you, Richard. You`re just in reality. You`re dealing with something that hard to do. You were diagnosed with this at 25 years old.
COHEN: That`s right.
BEHAR: That had to be a hard day for you to hear this.
COHEN: Yes. It was. To me, it was a mystery. It`s almost a blur because I didn`t know what it meant.
BEHAR: Well, didn`t your father have it, too?
COHEN: Yes. But my father never really talked about it and really never dealt with it in the context of the family.
BEHAR: I see.
VIEIRA: And developed it later in life. He was in his 40s when he was diagnosed.
BEHAR: Oh.
COHEN: I didn`t know enough about the disease, really, to react. I thought to myself, I`m just going to stay calm. I tried to hang myself. I`d just stay calm --
BEHAR: Did you know what was coming down the road? No, you really didn`t.
VIEIRA: That first doctor`s appointment, they sort of --
COHEN: They weren`t -- they weren`t very gentle about it.
BEHAR: Really? Probably, that`s a long time ago, you`re in your 50s now so it`s like over 25 years ago.
VIEIRA: Back then, there was nothing you could do.
COHEN: There was an old expression, "Diagnose and adios."
BEHAR: "Diagnose and adios."
COHEN: Yes, which is like sorry, we can`t help you.
BEHAR: Oh, I hate that.
COHEN: Yes. Well, that what the joke was.
BEHAR: So Meredith, he told you on the second date he had this illness.
VIEIRA: He did.
BEHAR: It didn`t scare you.
VIEIRA: You know what Joy, I`m not even sure why it didn`t. Part I think is that my father`s a doctor, and so not that that really matters. The illness didn`t freak me out the way it might somebody else. And, you know, I liked the guy.
The way I looked at it the next day, you can get hit by a bus. So I wasn`t going to let it freak me out.
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: And then you took me on an appointment with you to your doctor in the Bronx at that point. And we saw people in the waiting room - - I saw people in the waiting room younger than Richard already in wheelchairs. And instead of getting upset, I looked at it the other way and thought, we`re very lucky. We`re lucky that Richard`s -- the illness is progressing at the rate that it is even though you don`t know what`s going to happen the next day. But I chose to, maybe in my own way, to be in a little bit of denial too.
BEHAR: Denial is a great thing, isn`t it? You used denial, I`m sure.
COHEN: Denial, I wrote about this in my book "Blind-Sided", which is a memoir. Denial is a wonderful coping device. Not if there`s a train coming toward you and you`re on the tracks and you deny the train is going to hit you? No.
BEHAR: And screaming ahh.
COHEN: Because that sometimes has an unhappy ending. But to deny the certainty of possible outcomes --
BEHAR: Is good.
COHEN: -- is good.
BEHAR: You have to live every day. You have to get up, enjoy life.
(CROSSTALK)
COHEN: That`s the only way, you have to get up and go have a life.
BEHAR: But you know, I think everybody has to live in a certain denial, the fact that we`re all going to die some day. I`m in total denial about that. I don`t approve of dying or anything or even acknowledge that it`s ever going to happen to me.
VIEIRA: Are you afraid of it?
BEHAR: I`m petrified I think of it.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: I mean my non-existence? That`s unheard of.
VIEIRA: I bring you to the end of the month.
COHEN: I was going to say you do that here every night.
VIEIRA: And then we`re talking a little. It`s a dry run.
BEHAR: The idea that you could be extinct is just ridiculous.
VIEIRA: I know. But you`re not, if you believe in the afterlife, you`re a Catholic girl.
BEHAR: Yes. I don`t believe in it. I don`t believe in the afterlife.
VIEIRA: Ok. Then you`re screwed.
BEHAR: I only believe in videotape in the afterlife. Everybody can watch me on tape, that`s it.
So, let`s see, you know the other thing about you, Richard, I don`t know if you want me to say this on the air, but weren`t you on Richard Nixon`s enemy`s list?
COHEN: Actually I was sort of.
BEHAR: I love that about you. I tell you it`s so hot.
VIEIRA: We`re in the hospital with an MS --
COHEN: When I was in the hospital, I lost eyesight in one eye and I was pretty sick and I was on steroids and everything, the Watergate committee sent people to take -- I was subpoenaed and to take an affidavit from me. I felt like (INAUDIBLE) the old IT&T person who is hiding in a hospital.
BEHAR: I never heard of her.
(CROSSTALK)
VIEIRA: That was intellectual. Wow.
BEHAR: We have no idea who you`re talking about. Go ahead.
COHEN: Anyway, it was quite an experience and you know, in an open hearing that read to the Watergate committee, they read the affidavit and - -
BEHAR: Yes, I mean, just think it`s sexy to be on anybody`s enemy`s list. I`m on a few. They hate me on the extreme right-wing list, they don`t like me. They think that I`m the most annoying liberal. I think I`m number two.
VIEIRA: Really? Who is number one?
BEHAR: Yes, Bill Maher I think.
VIEIRA: Wow. Good for you.
BEHAR: Isn`t that great. Oh I love that.
VIEIRA: Wow.
BEHAR: So it`s just something like that. Now, the kids grew up on "The View" your children, which we can show a picture. Do we have a picture? It`s in the book, we`ll show it. The kids, I feel as though I know your kids.
VIEIRA: You do know our kids.
BEHAR: You know because little -- there they are and they`re all grown up now. Look at that there`s Lily on the right. She`s an actress. Is she still an actress?
VIEIRA: Well, she`s -- she went -- she started college this year as freshman, went in as theater major but she decided when she get in there but that that was a bit limiting. So although she`s going to continue with theater, she wanted to open up new doors and just experiment with a lot of different classes.
BEHAR: She`s a creative child.
VIEIRA: She is very creative.
BEHAR: And you know a shrink once told me creative people take a long time to decide what to land on.
VIEIRA: Which is good.
BEHAR: Yes it is hard.
VIEIRA: And now so she can see a lot of possibilities. And Gabe is at the same school, he`s a junior studying journalism.
BEHAR: Good for him.
VIEIRA: And Ben graduated from college in June and he lives in China.
BEHAR: Ben is fluent in Mandarin?
VIEIRA: Yes.
COHEN: Correct.
BEHAR: How did they -- how did he learn Chinese?
COHEN: He came to us in ninth grade and he said, I want to drop French and take Chinese.
BEHAR: I want to drop French. There`s no future in French.
COHEN: Yes and I said to him. Well I said to him, one condition, stick with it.
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: Yes.
COHEN: He agreed. And he did very well and he went off to school.
BEHAR: And now, he`s working in China.
VIEIRA: Yes.
COHEN: He is in Shanghai.
BEHAR: He was a smart boy. Always a smart boy.
VIEIRA: Yes.
COHEN: He`s fluent.
BEHAR: Fluent in Chinese. I mean, didn`t he go to Stanford this kid?
VIEIRA: He did.
BEHAR: He`s a smart kid.
VIEIRA: No he`s a smart kid. He`s also a hard worker and he is the first to admit that being in China he feels like he`s in over his head. It`s -- no matter how much well you know another language, its different when you have to speak only that language in that country.
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: And communicate on a daily basis. So he`s working his way through all of that and enjoying it.
COHEN: But our kids -- our kids are all smarter than we are.
VIEIRA: Yes.
COHEN: And I`m not being sarcastic.
VIEIRA: Most kids are smarter their parents.
COHEN: Well, wouldn`t you want it to be that way?
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: Supposedly yes. Yes but they never -- that somehow they`re not going to be richer than their parents anymore. That`s the problem.
VIEIRA: No, well, he`s lucky he has a job.
BEHAR: Yes.
VIEIRA: He was very lucky to have a job so.
BEHAR: All right well, this is the end of the interview.
VIEIRA: This is it?
BEHAR: Well, unless we do another segment.
VIEIRA: Well, I`m keeping the mug.
BEHAR: Let`s -- we can`t do another segment because I`m already booked.
VIEIRA: Oh ok.
BEHAR: I`m sorry. You have to come back though for my last show.
VIEIRA: If you bring everybody back, I will be here.
BEHAR: I`ll bring everybody back.
VIEIRA: I will bring signs.
BEHAR: You will?
VIEIRA: Yes.
BEHAR: Saying what?
VIEIRA: I will just picket the network.
BEHAR: To say so what? Who cares.
COHEN: Just let her go home.
VIEIRA: Yes exactly.
BEHAR: Thank you guys very much.
VIEIRA: We love you Joy.
BEHAR: I love to see you. You know we love you, too.
Check out Meredith and Richard on the cover of the new issue of AARP. It`s their nude inside the magazine out now. Back in a minute. There`s a centerfold Meredith, completely naked.
VIEIRA: So what? Who cares?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Jimmy Fallon and a senior VP at NBC have apologized to Michele Bachmann for playing the song "Lying` Ass Bitch" during her recent late night appearance but she was disappointed in their apology. Has the network done enough or should they try to pray the song away?
With me now to talk about this and other pop culture stories in the news are Joe Levy pop culture commentator; Nancy Travis, actress of the "Last Man Standing"; and comedian Rich Vos. Ok guys. You know she wants an apology from the President of NBC.
JOE LEVY, POP CULTURE COMMENTATOR: Right.
BEHAR: It`s not enough the VP. Should she get it?
LEVY: I don`t see why. She`s gotten an official apology from NBC brass. Who cares how high up the chain it goes. She`s right to ask for an apology from someone other than Jimmy Fallon, who tweeted his apology --
BEHAR: Right.
LEVY: -- which isn`t quite enough. You know I think if you know the writing out something on stationary still counts.
BEHAR: Yes.
LEVY: Still counts and picking up the phone still counts.
BEHAR: Well, tweeting though, but tweeting is public so everybody knows.
LEVY: Tweeting is public but his apology was a little underplayed. He`s Questlove is totally grounded is how his apology ended. See it would suggest he sees the humor in the whole thing and it is humorous. This is an obscure fishbone song that no one would have recognize if Questlove himself hadn`t tweet that they were playing a sneaky song.
BEHAR: What do you think?
RICH VOS, COMEDIAN: Well, first of all nobody uses stationary. Why doesn`t he just send a telegraph, ok? Have Kevin Costner ride it over on a pony.
Here is the thing, first of all, the band, they`re real rabble rousers, real Jim Morrison and the Doors. Big deal, they played a dumb song. I didn`t even know Jimmy Fallon was still on the air.
BEHAR: Yes he is. He`s a hit.
VOS: I know he`s a hit. He`s likable. That`s why I could say it because he`s a hit.
BEHAR: Right that`s right.
VOS: That I think she should get an apology from Obama that why I think.
NANCY TRAVIS, ACTRESS: I think she has an apology.
BEHAR: Ok Nancy, she`s -- yes.
TRAVIS: I mean, just to put an end to it.
BEHAR: Yes, she`s claiming it`s sexism. But this is a woman who votes against health care, day care and the right to choose your rights as a woman to choose abortion if you choose it.
TRAVIS: Right.
BEHAR: She votes against all female issues, as far as I can see and yet she`s saying its sexist. There`s a little bit of conundrum, what have you.
TRAVIS: Double standard, yes. Yes.
BEHAR: What do you think about that?
VOS: That`s the type of girl I want to marry.
TRAVIS: Well, I don`t think it`s sexist. I -- I think it`s a -- it`s -- it`s just rude.
VOS: Yes.
TRAVIS: I mean, she`s a celebrity, she comes on.
BEHAR: I mean, and yes.
LEVY: This is typical right-wing stuff, which is I stand for one thing, I say one thing but if you attack me, now I`m going to flip the position.
BEHAR: Right.
LEVY: So I`m Herman Cain, there is no more racism in America and unless you attack me in which case it`s a high-tech lynching.
BEHAR: That`s right.
LEVY: So Michele Bachmann there is no more sexism unless you attack me in which case it`s sexism and elitism and it`s the liberal media.
BEHAR: Well said. Let`s move on.
VOS: Ok, good.
BEHAR: Last Friday erupted violence this weekend as customers all across the country got mugged, pepper sprayed and even shot at. I haven`t seen crowds this hostile since the last GOP debate, have you. I mean, what do you think about what`s going on?
VOS: I`ll tell you I think it`s -- I think it`s good advertisement for pepper spray.
BEHAR: Yes.
VOS: You know protests, assaults, Black Friday, pepper spray, we`re there for you. You know what I mean?
LEVY: I did my turkey in Thanksgiving with pepper spray. And it turned out great. It`s a very spicy turkey.
TRAVIS: I`m just bombed that that woman got caught, I sent her in to get that X-Box.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Did you go shopping on Friday?
TRAVIS: I did not. I don`t leave the house.
BEHAR: I mean, I think it`s insane.
TRAVIS: No, no, it`s crazy.
BEHAR: They made a record breaking $52.4 billion.
LEVY: So the economy is safe.
BEHAR: Wow.
LEVY: The economy is safe and Obama will be re-elected. This is great news? That`s worth a little fighting isn`t it.
TRAVIS: It`s a brilliant marketing tool. You go out and don`t even need anything. And it`s a frenzy, whatever that person has, you have to have it.
LEVY: Yes, they`re advertising Black Friday deals for a week leading up to Black Friday. Are they surprised that people are in a frenzy?
BEHAR: No. I know.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Ok. We`re going to take a break, we`ll come back. I have a story about Angelina Jolie that`s kind of interesting.
Stay there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Still to come, a look back at one of Joy`s favorite interviews from the past two years, with TV legend, Carol Burnett.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with my panel. Angelina Jolie said in a "60 Minutes" interview, if she weren`t an actor, she`d have been a funeral director and even took classes to prepare. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANGELINA JOLIE, ACTRESS: It sounds like this very strange eccentric dark thing to do. But in fact, I lost my grandfather and I was very upset with his funeral. How somebody passes and how a family deals with his passing and what death is should be addressed in a different way. If this acting thing didn`t work out, that that was going to be my backup.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: She`s a real people person, isn`t she? Joe, Angelina seems to have a dark side to her.
LEVY: She does. She seems to have a dark side. This is a woman who used to wear her boyfriend`s dried blood in a vial around her neck, Billy Bob Thornton.
I think this is a whole cry. This is her reaching out, she misses Billy Bob. She`s putting this funeral director story out hoping he`ll get in touch.
BEHAR: But I mean let`s think about it. Billy Bob Thornton, Brad Pitt, who would you pick Nancy?
TRAVIS: well, you know, if I was going to be a makeup artist for dead bodies, I don`t know. It depends upon who`s laying on the slab. Really I mean -- that`s a different kind of romance. Just saying.
BEHAR: Oh, a little necrophilia slipping into the conversation, Nancy. Ok.
VOS: I think her last movie "The Tourist" needed a funeral director, ok.
BEHAR: I know. I should have sent flowers.
Let`s do another story before we go.
BEHAR: An honor elementary student in Cleveland was yanked from his home and placed in foster care because the third grader ballooned to more 200 pounds. Should the kid be removed from the house or just the Twinkies and the ring dings? That`s my quest. What do you think? They took the child away.
LEVY: Well, the average third grader is what about 50, 60 pounds. Seriously..
VOS: Ok, Mr. Penn state. He should have known the weight of a third grader. Here`s the thing.
TRAVIS: My God. That is so --
VOS: Is that creepy? Is that creepy?
BEHAR: That was creepy what you just said. You`re demented?
VOS: One creepy thing out of 14 shows ok. Big deal.
TRAVIS: How does a kid reach 200 pounds overnight? I mean ballooned over 200 pounds?
BEHAR: Not overnight, no, no. He has been getting heavier over the year.
LEVY: You know you get there Twinkie by Twinkie, it`s training, people.
VOS: And this is really how I feel because I have kids. I think it`s child abuse. You wouldn`t force-feed your kid alcohol or drugs. I don`t know if you take the kid away. I don`t know the solution but it is.
TRAVIS: Maybe you have to find out what it is. Is it a thyroid problem?
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: First of all, the kid is an honor student. So it`s not like he`s being neglected.
VOS: Well, not nutrition.
BEHAR: No he`s not being neglected --
TRAVIS: Maybe he`s getting good grades to rebel.
BEHAR: I don`t know. Why not bring in a nutritionist first before you remove the child?
LEVY: Well, apparently his mom bought him a bike. Apparently she did buy him a bike, a very sturdy heavy duty bike. But apparently she bought him a bike, so she does care.
BEHAR: The mother only visits him once a week, the mother`s only allowed to visit. That`s not right.
VOS: Well, she`s cooking the other six days for him.
BEHAR: You are so bad tonight. This poor child.
VOS: I feel bad. Listen, it`s child abuse. I don`t know what you do. I see kids like that. I don`t even let my kids play with fat kids because I think it will wear off or rub off on them. You know what I mean?
BEHAR: That is so ridiculous a statement.
Thank you guys very much. You can count -- Nancy, you can count.
TRAVIS: I want to change my seat.
BEHAR: You can catch Nancy Travis in Last Man Standing Tuesdays at 8:00 p.m. on ABC.
And Rich Vos`s new podcast, "My Wife Hates Me" and for good reason -- on iTunes. We`ll be right back.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A look back at one of our favorite interviews ever with the legendary Carol Burnett.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CAROL BURNETT: You wrote a poem about me that you would like to read? All right. Why don`t you stand up and read it? What`s your name?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Danny Krueger.
BURNETT: Hi, Danny.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hi. I`m in love with a wonderful girl, but there`s a catch, oh, brother. The girl I love this glorious girl is old enough to be my mother.
BURNETT: Sit down, Danny.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Well that, of course, was Carol Burnett doing what she does best -- getting laughs. On stage, in films, and for 11 years on the legendary "Carol Burnett Show," she put smiles on faces all across America. And I`m smiling just having her here for sure.
Welcome so much.
Her new book is called "This Time Together, Laughter and Reflection". Carol?
CAROL BURNETT, ACTRESS/COMEDIAN: Hi, honey.
BEHAR: You know, I just think you`re the greatest. Everyone clapped when you walked in because -- no one else got that so far.
BURNETT: Really?
BEHAR: They clap after they`re done, but not when they walk in. Like when the queen of England would walk.
BURNETT: Hello. Hello, everyone, hello. Where`s my pocketbook?
BEHAR: She can`t dress for nothing.
BURNETT: Oh true.
BEHAR: Poor thing. So, you know, the adlibbing that you do there, the Q&A part you did on your show, that was not easy to do, was it? In those days nobody did that really.
BURNETT: Well you know what? I got the idea from Garry Moore when I was on his show as a regular back in the covered wagon days. Garry would go out and warm up the audience, instead of having a comedian tell jokes.
BEHAR: Yes.
BURNETT: So he would go out, bump up the lights and take questions from --
BEHAR: Right.
BURNETT: But they never taped it, he just never did that. So when my own show was going to be done, my executive producer, Bob Banner said, "You know, Carol, they should -- you should come out and let the audience get to know you as a person before you start putting on the fright wigs and blacking out the teeth and wearing the fat suits."
BEHAR: Uh huh.
BURNETT: You know? And I said, oh, I couldn`t do that. I couldn`t - - he said, like Garry used to do. I said, oh, no, I wouldn`t be that smart or quick, you know. He said, we`ll do like two or three weeks. We`ll try it. When we were just going to go on the air --
BEHAR: Uh huh.
BURNETT: -- see how you feel. You know?
And I`ll never forget the first time that we were taping our first show and I kind of walked out and I was, hi -- I was scared that nobody would raise their hands and then I was terrified that somebody would.
BEHAR: Uh-huh.
BURNETT: And I was just -- I was awful. You know, but then finally somebody said, who`s on tonight? You know, I told them who our guest was. Then the following week I did it. I felt a little bit better. Then by the third week people in the audience had seen the show and they were kind of aware that we were going to do this. So then a lot of hands started shooting up and I don`t know, I just kind of took to it --
BEHAR: Yes.
BURNETT: And I didn`t want any plants in the audience or anything because that would be too phony.
BEHAR: Yes, that would ruin it.
BURNETT: No. So then it became one of my favorite things in the show.
BEHAR: Everybody loved it.
BURNETT: I loved doing it.
BEHAR: You know, you`re a natural. You were so naturally funny that no matter what you would say would have worked, I think.
BURNETT: The audience, too, some of those -- those were doozies.
BEHAR: Yes, that`s right.
BURNETT: Some of them were really good.
BEHAR: Let me talk about some of your co-stars who are wonderful. You won 25 -- the show won 25 Emmys.
BURNETT: Yes.
BEHAR: It was really a tremendous hit. Which I think was the precursor to "Saturday Night Live" in many ways.
BURNETT: Well, it was on when we were on.
BEHAR: It was?
BURNETT: Yes "Saturday Night Live," yes.
BEHAR: Oh.
BURNETT: It`s been on forever.
BEHAR: That went on in 1975.
BURNETT: It was on forever. Yes.
BEHAR: And you`ve made -- you have wonderful stars, there were wonderfully funny people. I mean the late wonderfully funny Harvey Korman -- he just died last year. I miss him. I didn`t know him but I miss him.
BURNETT: I miss him, too.
BEHAR: And Tim Conway. You used to crack up over Tim all the time. What was it about Tim Conway that made you laugh so hard? All of you?
BURNETT: He`s the funniest man I know. That`s what made me laugh. No but we would tape two shows on Friday.
BEHAR: Yes.
BURNETT: The 5:00 show, we`d call it the dress rehearsal. And we would tape that as a backup. And Tim would always do that show the way we`d rehearsed it. Then he would go to our director before the second show and the second new audience was coming in and he would say, Dave, did you get all the shots? And Dave did. And he`d say, well, for instance, in the hotel sketch when I go over to the window this time instead of being on a head to waist shot be on a head to toe shot. That`s all he would say.
BEHAR: That`s all the director knew?
BURNETT: That`s all the director knew. The crew -- everybody -- we didn`t know what he was going to do. You know, but he had thought up some bit of business that he was going to do on the air show that would crack everybody up. So we were helpless, especially poor Harvey.
BEHAR: Poor Harvey.
BURNETT: Yes. Tim got him -- I think Tim`s goal in life was to destroy Harvey. I really think it was -- and it got to the point where there was going to be -- we called them the Tim and Harvey sketches. And Harvey was just terrified. He was a consummate actor, such a professional. And he hated himself for letting Tim get to him.
It would come to a point where just before they were going to say a word -- OK, cameras on and here we`re going to do the sketch. And Tim would just say, do this to Harvey.
BEHAR: That`s it?
BURNETT: Just look at him. Harvey was gone. It was just the expectation of what Tim was going to do --
BEHAR: Cracked him up.
BURNETT: Sent Harvey around the bend.
BEHAR: The other person that was interesting in those days was Lucille Ball who was on your show a lot.
BURNETT: Yes.
BEHAR: When you think of comedic female icons, Lucy and Carol, you know, Phyllis Diller, Joan Rivers, these are the ladies that really cracked everybody up. And yet people always tell me Lucy was never funny off the air.
BURNETT: She was very serious.
BEHAR: Very serious.
BURNETT: She was funny. She had a great sense of humor but she was never on.
BEHAR: No.
BURNETT: Not at all.
BEHAR: But she had to run the studio, didn`t she, when she broke up with Desi Arnaz?
BURNETT: Yes. I have a story about that.
BEHAR: Tell me.
BURNETT: I guess I can tell it on television.
BEHAR: Why not? We`ll bleep it if it`s -- don`t worry.
BURNETT: It`s in the book, but OK -- well, she was on our show and so my husband, Joe Hamilton, who had produced "The Garry Moore Show" was producing our show. And I was never confrontational. I -- if -- you know, if Jackie Gleason or Sid Cesar didn`t like a sketch they would go to the writers and they`d say, you know, this stinks, write something else.
BEHAR: Right.
BURNETT: This isn`t working. Give me something funnier.
BEHAR: Well, Sid Cesar notoriously almost threw Mel Brooks out the window because he didn`t like the material.
BURNETT: He held him upside down. Maybe that`s what`s wrong with Mel now. I don`t know. I couldn`t do that.
If something wasn`t working I would be, oh gosh, guys, you know, I may not be saying this right what you wrote. And I`m so sorry. Could you maybe help me out here? That`s what I would do.
BEHAR: Yes.
BURNETT: Now, whereas -- Joe would say, this stinks, make it better.
I was having dinner with Lucy at the farmer`s market. We were between rehearsals. We were waiting to do the band rehearsal on Thursday night. We were having some Chinese food and everything, and she said -- she called me kid. She said, you know, kid, you`re really lucky to have Joe be the bad cop, you know, because you can come in and be just -- I said, well, I couldn`t -- I couldn`t confront anybody anyway, Lucy.
She said, well, I was that way. She said, you know when I was married to the Cuban, he was -- he did everything. He made it right. He did -- the scripts were terrific. He knew what he wanted and the lighting and all of these --
BEHAR: Yes.
BURNETT: And all I had to do was come in and be Lucy on Monday mornings and read the show and go do it and we`d be fine. Then they got a divorce. And then she got another show, I think it was, like, "The Lucy Show" --
BEHAR: Yes.
BURNETT: She had a couple others -- you know with Gale Gordon --
BEHAR: Yes and Vivian Vance. Right.
BURNETT: And Vivian. And so she came in that Monday morning and she read the script. And it was terrible. And she thought, oh my God, what am I going to do? I just -- you know, Desi`s not here to -- she said, OK, everybody, let`s break for lunch.
You know, and so she went into her office and she thought about it. She said, I`ve got to be strong. I`ve got to be strong. And she said, I went back out and I told everybody just exactly what I thought and, kid, that`s when they put the "S" on the end of my last name.
BEHAR: Lucille Ball, plural, is a great name.
BURNETT: Isn`t that great?
BEHAR: Yes.
BURNETT: Oh, she cracked me up.
BEHAR: But it was hard. It`s hard for women to really be assertive like that.
BURNETT: It was then. I don`t know if it`s that hard now. But back then --
BEHAR: Well, what do you guys think?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re fine.
BEHAR: All right. And but, you know, who makes you laugh anyway? Who makes you laugh?
BURNETT: Well, Conway still.
BEHAR: He still makes you laugh?
BURNETT: You go out to dinner with him, you have got to know the Heimlich maneuver.
BEHAR: Really?
BURNETT: Yes, because you`ll just choke.
BEHAR: He starts up wherever he is?
BURNETT: He just has a funny take on everything. You know, and well, who makes me -- you make me laugh.
BEHAR: Oh, that`s sweet.
BURNETT: You do.
BEHAR: You don`t have to say that.
BURNETT: OK. I`ll take it back.
BEHAR: All right. I`m going to stop you there because we have to take a break.
BURNETT: OK.
BEHAR: But just get comfortable and we`ll be back with the wonderful Carol Burnett in just a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: What brings you to --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You, you vixen, you. Scarlett, I love you. That gown is gorgeous.
BURNETT: Thank you. I saw it in the window and I just couldn`t resist it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Oh that dress is legendary. And that was one of the funniest moments on "The Carol Burnett Show".
And I`m happy to have the one and only Carol Burnett here with me now. She`s also the author of the new book "This Time Together".
So you were raised by your grandma.
BURNETT: Yes.
BEHAR: Who I read that she was married six times.
BURNETT: Well, yes. I didn`t know it at first. She told me only three. And then --
BEHAR: She was a hot number, your grandmother.
BURNETT: Yes, she was. She really was. In fact, when she died, she was 81, she had a 40-year-old boyfriend who was a jazz musician from Redondo Beach.
BEHAR: Really? Wow.
BURNETT: I remember I came out to see her in Hollywood. I had put her in an apartment and everything, so I went in to show her some photographs or something. We were visiting and I was showing her some pictures and I`d been living in New York. And she had this kind of green Japanese lantern over her couch. I said, nanny, let me just take this Japanese lantern off here so you can see better. She said, don`t you touch that, that`s my love light.
BEHAR: Oh, well, excuse me. And the -- you used to tug on your ear.
BURNETT: That was for her.
BEHAR: So sweet, every week. That was a thing about you that everybody knows about.
BURNETT: Well, thanks.
BEHAR: Such a great thing. And the other thing is, you know, I know that you -- in your book you talk about how your parents struggled with alcoholism and everything. I`m more interested in the fact you sued "The National Enquirer" and won the lawsuit. I don`t know if you`ve ever told anybody that story on television. I`d love to hear that.
BURNETT: Well what happened was I was back there. I was going to perform at the White House and I was with the -- our conductor. We were going to do something -- it was when the Fords were in.
And so we all went to a restaurant one night, my conductor and the writers and so forth. And we were in this Washington, D.C. restaurant and kind of -- it was kind of empty. Then across the way was Dr. Kissinger with a couple of people whom I knew and all, but -- and as we finished dinner and we were leaving, I was introduced to him. He said, it`s very nice to meet you and I`ll be looking forward to you at the White House tomorrow and all that. So that was it.
BEHAR: Yes.
BURNETT: Next thing I know, in a couple weeks or whatever, said Carol Burnett was running around in such and such restaurant in D.C. spilling wine on people and forcing Henry Kissinger to drink wine and spilling wine all over his tie. I mean, it was just bizarre.
BEHAR: And the idea that anybody could force Kissinger to do anything.
BURNETT: You know, I tried.
BEHAR: A lot of people have tried.
BURNETT: And so I thought, that`s not right. You know, especially when I came from that background. I just -- really -
BEHAR: Made you mad.
BURNETT: So I sued them. And I -- it went for five years, you know, the lawsuit.
BEHAR: You were relentless.
BURNETT: I was. I was. I just decided that they`re not going to do that. So it went to a jury trial. Then they did prove -- not malice aforethought, you can`t prove that -- but you can prove reckless disregard for the truth. And they even found a memo that they presented at court that said Carol Burnett and Henry Kissinger were in such and such a restaurant last night. What can we make of this?
BEHAR: Wow, wow.
BURNETT: Yes. So that really nailed it, you know. And so -- before the trial was over, and I was still, you know, worried about it and it was in the newspapers every day and everything, and I went -- before I was going to go to court that day I dropped in on my doctor to get a vitamin shot. You know it was really stressful. And I walked into the doctor`s office and there was Barbara Stanwyck.
BEHAR: Oh.
BURNETT: Wonderful Barbara Stanwyck.
BEHAR: Brilliant.
BURNETT: She was in her 70s. And she has beautiful gray hair. She had on pearls and lovely suit. I didn`t know she was a patient of my doctor, you know. But she smiled at me and I smiled back, you know? Barbara Stanwyck, wow. One of the great movie stars -- I grew up watching her.
And she said, "You`re going to win this case." I said, "Oh thank you, thank you, Ms. Stanwyck; from your lips to God`s ears. Thank you." She said, "No, I mean, I know you`re going to win this case." Well, you don`t argue with Barbara Stanwyck.
BEHAR: No. She`s from Brooklyn.
BURNETT: She said, "Well, I know you are." I said, "Well, great." She said, "My leprechaun told me."
BEHAR: Oh, her leprechaun. OK.
BURNETT: I said, excuse me? And she said, my leprechaun told -- they exist all right. And he said that you`re going to whip their ass.
BEHAR: Her leprechaun. This is like beyond --
BURNETT: Is that unbelievable? And she said, now, you just get some rest and you know you`re going to --
BEHAR: But it`s beyond Shirley MacLaine.
BURNETT: Yes.
BEHAR: You know what I mean -- it`s like, a leprechaun. Oh, wow.
BURNETT: Isn`t that wild?
BEHAR: Yes. It`s so cute that you were star struck.
BURNETT: Oh, sure.
BEHAR: We`ll be right back in a minute with more with Carol Burnett. You`re star struck.
BURNETT: Yes.
BEHAR: You are.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with Carol Burnett. OK, we`re going to have some Facebook and Twitter questions now.
Let`s see -- where does Carol keep her Emmys?
BURNETT: At home.
BEHAR: Just in the house, any specific place?
BURNETT: There`s a couple of shelves I put them on.
BEHAR: Yes.
BURNETT: It`s kind of the media room where we watch television.
BEHAR: Yes, do you dust them?
BURNETT: I go and I hold them and do my thank you speeches quite often.
BEHAR: OK.
BEHAR: OK, do you like doing comedy or drama? People don`t know, I don`t think they are really aware what a good dramatic actress you are -- also.
BURNETT: Thank you.
BEHAR: So which do you prefer?
BURNETT: Comedy.
BEHAR: Comedy. Why?
BURNETT: Because it makes me feel happy when I hear people laughing.
BEHAR: That`s the best.
BURNETT: That`s it.
BEHAR: And you can`t really control it?
BURNETT: No, it`s wonderful.
BEHAR: You can`t manipulate it the way you can with drama sometimes.
BURNETT: Yes, exactly.
BEHAR: Do you consider your life a success -- you just answered that, I think.
OK, let`s see, are you willing to do "Saturday Night Live"? We would love to see you do that.
BURNETT: Sure. Yes. Sure.
BEHAR: You hear that, Lorne Michaels?
Would you return to TV if the right project became available?
BURNETT: Not weekly.
BEHAR: No, that`s a grind.
BURNETT: No, I wouldn`t want to do that. Well, ours wasn`t a grind. It was so easy that I know --
BEHAR: And fun.
BURNETT: -- that I know you can`t do that again. You know so --
BEHAR: Yes.
BURNETT: I did some guest shots on some sitcoms a few years ago. And there`s 22 minutes of show, right, because of commercials and stuff like that.
BEHAR: That`s right.
BURNETT: They would go for five hours or six hours.
BEHAR: Oh it`s so annoying, yes.
BURNETT: Like we`re making a movie. You know I was like, get me out of here. Our show, we would take sometimes an hour and 15 minutes, with all those costume changes, everything -- we`d be out in two hours.
BEHAR: Wow, wow.
BURNETT: Yes.
BEHAR: Because you were on -- didn`t you play -- whose mother did you play in a sitcom recently?
BURNETT: Helen Hunt. "Mad About You".
BEHAR: "Mad About You", that`s right. What do you think about today`s TV programming? They want to know. Do you think your show would have made it on TV now?
BURNETT: I think funny is funny.
BEHAR: Yes, but would they even book a variety show?
BURNETT: Yes. You can`t -- today, you couldn`t do what we did or what Flip Wilson did or the Smother Brothers, Sonny and Cher; we were all on at the same time, and because of money.
BEHAR: It`s so expensive?
BURNETT: It`s very expensive, I mean we had a 28-piece live orchestra, we had 12 dancers --
BEHAR: Wow.
BURNETT: We had two major guest stars a week, our rep company, and 55 whole costumes by Bob Mackey every week.
BEHAR: Wow.
BURNETT: So that`s prohibitive today. It would -- the prices would be --
BEHAR: Even though they paid the people from "Friends" a million dollar an episode, it still would have been more expensive to have a variety show?
BURNETT: I think so. Well, I don`t know.
BEHAR: See, this is why reality shows are popular because they are --
BURNETT: Well they`re $1.98.
BEHAR: $1.98.
BURNETT: Yes.
BEHAR: Carol, I can`t tell you what a pleasure it is to have you here and to see you.
BURNETT: Oh darling.
BEHAR: Everyone is so loving you.
BURNETT: Thank you.
BEHAR: Her book is called "This Time Together, Laughter and Reflection".
Good night, everybody.
END
