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Joy Behar Page
Suze Orman`s Smart Money; Baldwin Goes Berserk
Aired December 07, 2011 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up on THE JOY BEHAR SHOW, financial guru, Suze Orman stops by for some tips for not going broke over the holidays. And she`ll give Joy her predictions for 2012 on the state of real estate and Occupy Wall Street.
Then Alec Baldwin is kicked off a flight for playing "Words with Friends". Joy will have the details.
Plus a look back at Joy`s interview with fashion icon, Donatella Versace
That and more starting right now.
JOY BEHAR, HLN HOST: My pal, Suze Orman is best known for telling people where to stick it, I mean their money, of course. But she`s also the best-selling author of "The Money Class" and she`s the host of a new show "America`s Money Class" which is debuting on OWN on January 9th. Welcome the Florence Nightingale of finance, Suze Orman.
So Suze, I hear that you canceled or changed a flight to be on this show.
SUZE ORMAN, FINANCIAL GURU: I did. Well, here`s the school. We were here yesterday to tape "30 Rock". Can you believe it, I was "30 Rock"?
BEHAR: How was he? Alec -- was he there?
ORMAN: He was on some plane getting kicked off because he was playing some game. I personally think that that is an endorsement deal. They had planned that all before that happened and that`s the best advertisement. Watch. Watch him become a spokesperson for this game and then we`ll know. That`s beside the point.
And so -- but I was here just to do that and then we were going to fly back last night or this morning. And it was like, you`re going, don`t go.
All right. Everybody, listen, great financial advice, keep Joy on the air. Let every network know. Are they all crazy, HLN, CNN, what are you thinking. You are denied. I mean really. What are they thinking?
BEHAR: I to have say we did not put her up to that. This is coming from her own head and her own mouth.
ORMAN: Yes. Because I love watching you.
And I just have to say this. You know earlier before -- right before we started, you said, Suze, people tune in to see topics. I go "Joy, they tune in to see you."
BEHAR: Well, I think that it`s a combination. They like the show.
ORMAN: I don`t know. I tune in just to see you.
BEHAR: Well, that`s you. And you --
ORMAN: I matter. I`m Suze Orman.
BEHAR: It`s you and my Aunt Julie.
ORMAN: Now you know why you`re not going to be -- I`m so sad you`re not going to be here.
BEHAR: Ok. Thank you. We`ll talk a little bit about it. For instance, people are going to be losing their jobs. What should people be doing now when they lose their jobs in this country? What`s the first thing -- advice -- the biggest piece of advice you would give them?
ORMAN: it`s to think that you`re not going to get a job for at least two years.
BEHAR: Really?
ORMAN: I`m serious about that and I`ll tell you why. A lot of people have put some money away in case they lose their jobs. And then let`s say -- just say they have six months or three months or eight months any amount of money away. They lose their job and they don`t change how they live. They still go out to eat. They still go to the movie. They still spend money as if they had a job and then they don`t -- because they think they`re going to get another job right away.
Now they go through their savings because they didn`t change their spending habits and before you know it they`ve used up their retirement account, they`re selling everything and now they`re in trouble. If they really thought that they weren`t going to get another job for two years, they would cut back on their expenses. They would live like paupers. They would do whatever it took to make the money they had to stretch.
BEHAR: What if they didn`t have enough in the bank to begin with, they have a mortgage payment, they`ve got kids to feed and they were living hand-to-mouth all along because that`s the way it went and they weren`t extravagant.
And then what you have to do is you have to start to think entrepreneurial. I hate that I`m saying this because I`m an optimist. I love America but I don`t think the jobs are coming back. And I don`t think they`re coming back for a long time. The reason I think that is because of a little word called "productivity". Everybody has learned how to be as productive without you as they were with you, including Suze Orman.
I had an assistant for years. Booked the shows (ph) -- then she went to another job. We don`t have an assistant now because I can do it equally as good without her. That computer has replaced her.
So if you could be entrepreneurial, do your own business, whether that`s be a manicurist, walk a dog -- I don`t know what it is, but you can think to do something to get money to come in.
BEHAR: Well, President Clinton was on "The View" today. And he was saying that until the deficit is -- the debt is under control, the jobs will not come back.
ORMAN: That is right.
BEHAR: So I mean they have to deal with that.
He also said something that was interesting. He said that any time with in the country or the world has been in a situation like we are in now, and that goes back 500 years, he`s saying, it takes five years to recuperate, not three years.
So Obama has to be re-elected in my opinion to keep whatever he`s doing going. And President Clinton said that President Obama is on the right track. Do you agree with that?
ORMAN: I do agree with that. We have a Congress that is in opposition to one another. It`s almost as if nobody cares about the 99 percenters that out there. They have a legitimate gripe. But if we could just give President Obama a little bit of breathing room. If we could let him --
BEHAR: And help him.
ORMAN: -- and help him and understand he`s not out there for his own cause; he`s out there to solve the problems that the United States are in. Those problems started far before he ever entered office.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: That`s true. That was also something the President said today.
ORMAN: And if you think that the Republican Party on any level in my opinion has a viable candidate --
BEHAR: They do not.
ORMAN: -- are you kidding me, they don`t. So I hope everybody backs President Obama.
BEHAR: And you`re saying that from your point of view, which is a wealthy person --
ORMAN: Yes.
BEHAR: -- someone who lives very well --
ORMAN: Yes.
BEHAR: -- and makes a lot of money. And you`re saying that.
ORMAN: Yes. And so do you think my lifestyle is going to change if I pay $50 or $100 or $200,000 more a year in taxes, it is not. But if that extra tax money helps some people be able to keep their homes, keep their cars, send their kids to school, so be it. Tax us if that`s what you need to do.
BEHAR: Right.
Well, you know, this is all third conversation maybe but Andrew Cuomo, who is the governor of New York State is now instituting, he`s raising taxes on the wealthy in New York State and getting a lot of flak for it from the right. But you know, if that works and New York becomes solvent because of that, that will be a good lesson for the rest of the country, don`t you think?
ORMAN: I think it will. Again, will it not. When bills have to be paid, the people with the money need to pay them. Because if the people with the money do not pay them eventually, it affects them. It affects them in terms of their own portfolios, the value of their homes. They`re losing money whether they know it or not because of what`s happening to middle America.
You know, it was 2008 that I sat, whether it was on "The View" or wherever it was, and I said it will be until 2015 until all of this will turn around. I wrote a little book called the 2009 Action Plan, which was written in 2008 that says on Page 6, it will be until 2015 until we feel hopeful again.
It was bad. It was bad out there. It was bad, not because of the people. It was bad because people wanted to make money off of America middle class and so forth. It was the deceit --
BEHAR: Greed.
ORMAN: Greed. Deceit, lies and greed.
BEHAR: A lot of lies.
ORMAN: Of the banks, they institution, are you kidding me? They should help us.
BEHAR: Ok. So let`s talk a little bit practical for people who are out there. First of all, there`s something called occupy foreclosures or something.
ORMAN: Oh, occupy foreclosures.
BEHAR: Yes.
ORMAN: Moving to foreclosures.
BEHAR: What do you think about that? People are going to occupy the homes that are in foreclosure. Can they get arrested for that?
ORMAN: They could probably get arrested for that.
BEHAR: Occupy Our Homes, the movement it`s called.
ORMAN: Well, I do think that if you have a home and you haven`t been paying on it, until they literally come and padlock you out --
BEHAR: Stay there.
ORMAN: -- that you should stay there for as long as you possibly can. Number one, you will save money. Number two, it will keep your home from being ransacked by other people that know that it`s empty. The banks probably are even loving that you`re staying there because if you move out, there goes the homes.
I had somebody had two homes in Florida, moved out. There isn`t even walls left. They came in and they took everything out. So now, what`s the bank going do with these homes if they have to come in and rebuild them?
BEHAR: Right. That`s interesting.
ORMAN: Stay in there for as long as you possibly can. It actually helps the banks. It`s not hurting them. They`re not getting money on it anyway. But it keeps the house safe and sound.
BEHAR: So all these people who are in foreclosure, just stay in the house.
ORMAN: I`m serious. Until they force you out because if you leave -- here`s something you need to know -- if you leave and that house is empty and somebody occupies that house and moves in or hurts themselves --
BEHAR: You`re liable.
ORMAN: And it hasn`t been foreclosed on yet, you`re liable.
BEHAR: Oh, That`s interesting.
ORMAN: So you better keep your house insurance in force even if you moved out until that house is no longer in your name.
BEHAR: Ok. So let`s say a person or family can`t pay their mortgage, should they just stay there anyway?
ORMAN: If you legitimately can`t pay the mortgage, you have no money and the banks or the financial institutions will not work with you, of course you should stay there. And you should stay there because number one, where else are you going to go?
BEHAR: so the police are not going to come and take you out of that house.
ORMAN: No. The real truth of the matter is, they`re going to let you stay there in many cases not a long time because they don`t want to take these houses back. If they take these houses back, they appear on their inventory. If they`re on their inventory, there are more homes in inventory than they want. So now the housing situation looks better because of all that we`re calling shadow foreclosures. People that should have had their homes taken away from them and haven`t yet. So yes, just stay there until they take it away from you.
BEHAR: Suzy Orman is telling you to stay there, just saying.
ORMAN: Well, were are you going to go? It doesn`t hurt the bank if you stay there; it`s helping the bank keeping the property up to date.
BEHAR: Ok. We`re going to have more with Suze Orman in just a minute. So you don`t want to miss this. It`s brilliant.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Still to come, Christmas carol madness, why one elementary school decided to take the word "gay" out of "Don we now our gay apparel"?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with Suze Orman. You know where is a person supposed to -- if they had a little money to save, where do they put it? CDs don`t offer much interest, savings account are baloney. Where do you put the money?
SUZE ORMAN, HOST, "THE SUZE ORMAN SHOW": You put it in a savings account or money market account even though it`s not making interest. Making a little bit of interest is a whole lot better than putting it in something you do not understand. So should it be in the stock market? Can you take it going up? Can you take it going down?
So if you need this money, it needs to stay liquid, just leave it alone and forget it that it`s not making interest right now until something else happens here.
BEHAR: Ok, ok good now what about the holidays are coming up? People tend to overspend. I remember when I was married and we were totally broke, I would have -- you know I used to do the credit card and then I`d get the bill and I already spent the money.
So I stopped doing that. I learned very quickly, do not do that. So I don`t have any debt. But a lot of people get into big trouble at Christmas. What should they do?
ORMAN: They should do this. They should go to everybody that they gave a gift to one year ago that they put on their credit card paying the minimum payment so they`re still paying for this gift.
BEHAR: That`s true.
ORAMN: And ask the people, what did I give you one year ago for the holidays? And then when that person is not able to answer that question because they will not be able to answer that question, what did you get one year ago from a best friend.
BEHAR: Yes.
ORMAN: You don`t know.
BEHAR: Yes you don`t.
ORMAN: Think about it everybody. But anyway then that shows you why am I in debt to give a gift that nobody can even remember just one year ago? And it`s not just adults. Ask a kid. I went out with my cameras and I asked every little kid that I could see. Not one. Not one -- and we`re talking about 20 or 30 kids could remember.
So if you --
BEHAR: What they got last year.
ORMAN: That`s right.
BEHAR: That`s true.
ORMAN: Yes so if you don`t have money, you`re in debt, can you just give yourself the gift of freedom to be able to tell people, I`m broke, let`s not exchange gifts this year.
BEHAR: Right, right.
ORMAN: Don`t give me something because I don`t want to feel guilty.
BEHAR: Or do a grab bag or one of those secret Santa things --
ORMAN: Or empty your closet of things that you haven`t worn in the past year and give it away to somebody else and you`ll probably give it back to the person who gave you because you didn`t like it and there it is back to the person who gave it to you. That would be funny.
BEHAR: It`s a little bit harder when you have children, though, because other kids are getting it and they feel -- the parent feels bad that the child is not getting as much as the other kids.
ORMAN: Well, then we have to deal with that parent and screw their head right. So K.T., as you know my life partner -- did you know we got married two years ago, in South Africa.
BEHAR: Oh congratulations.
ORMAN: So we`re going on two years now. But her sister --
BEHAR: Are you getting -- having a wedding in New York so I can come to it?
ORMAN: No. Because -- I`m sorry to say this. In -- in the United States even though the states have passed it, love that, some states.
BEHAR: Yes some.
ORMAN: It means nothing on the federal level. Do you know in South Africa, there is absolutely no difference in marriage whether you`re gay or straight, it`s a legal international marriage license?
BEHAR: Isn`t that true in Canada also?
ORMAN: I don`t know Canada.
BEHAR: I think.
ORMAN: But -- but the point is that so K.T.`s sister --
BEHAR: Yes.
ORMAN: Has two kids.
BEHAR: Right.
ORMAN: I`ve been in the picture now for almost 11 years. We have never exchanged gifts we always make gifts, so we exchange things that we make.
BEHAR: Awesome.
ORMAN: These kids can`t wait to figure out what they`re going to make for this year.
BEHAR: Oh that`s nice.
ORMAN: So you don`t have to buy a gift. And if you feel bad about it, change how you`re feeling because that`s just nuts.
BEHAR: Yes.
ORMAN: Nuts.
BEHAR: I know it`s hard though. It`s true what you`re saying is absolute true but it`s very difficult for people to not give their kids gift. Every time the kid turns on that TV, there`s a commercial for another gift and it`s everywhere. The catalogues are pouring in and it`s hard.
ORMAN: It`s hard. You know kids --
BEHAR: And you feel bad. I feel bad.
ORMAN: Kids call into the "Suze Orman Show" that are 8 years old asking me if they can afford to buy this little yes, yes and I ask them about their money and everything.
BEHAR: Yes.
ORMAN: And then I go, denied. I go, "Play with your friends` kids. They`ve got it. Go over to their house and play with it."
BEHAR: Go play with pots and pans.
ORMAN: That`s right. Or something like that.
BEHAR: Well, you know as I`ve gotten older, this is like a cliche now, but I do enjoy giving rather than getting at this point.
ORMAN: Yes.
BEHAR: I really do.
ORMAN: Yes, yes.
BEHAR: And I think that people -- kids should learn that particular thing, how much fun it is to give someone a gift rather than to get it.
ORMAN: And if you really don`t have money and you feel bad about it, on the holiday season, on the holiday itself, go down and serve people who really have nothing.
BEHAR: That`s true.
ORMAN: And then your kids will see how much they have in comparison to those who have.
BEHAR: Oh my Uncle Ralph used to drive his kids through Manhattan to show them -- there are people in certain parts of Manhattan -- how people who are poor lived because they lived in the New Jersey suburb. And the kids -- every year, he would drag them through those neighborhoods.
ORMAN: You know what I used to do with K.T.`s little niece and nephew, so they had all these little objects that would take them out and go here. All of these little things that are here that were in your room.
BEHAR: Yes.
ORMAN: These are worth $50. Would you rather have this money or these things? And they say I`d rather have the money.
BEHAR: Of course.
ORMAN: I go too bad, you`ve got this junk.
BEHAR: I rather have the money. Ok now let`s talk about your show on OWN.
ORMAN: Yes.
BEHAR: It`s starting January --
ORMAN: January 9th at 9:00 p.m.
BEHAR: And what -- what are you going to do there that you don`t do on the other show?
ORMAN: So this is called "America`s Money Class" and we`re actually teaching people with a live audience so you don`t normally see me except for PBS with a live audience. And ask -- so we`re teaching them what they need to know about money. But here is the scoop. You watch for all six weeks. At the end of the sixth week, I`m going to give you an exam online. You have 24 hours to fill out the exam. If you at least pass it, then your name is entered into a sweepstakes, where you can win one person can win $50,000 and five people can win $5,000 each.
BEHAR: What`s the exam about?
ORMAN: What the classes are about. So what I`m teaching you for these six weeks.
BEHAR: Oh so you have to pay attention.
ORMAN: Pay attention.
BEHAR: Oh this is school.
ORMAN: This is school.
BEHAR: You`re back in school.
ORMAN: You`re back in school. I`m going to teach you what you need to know. What debt should you pay off first? If you`re in this situation, what do you do? I mean -- and but you`ll see it with real life families online -- it`s probably the best work I`ve ever done.
BEHAR: Ok, I`m looking forward to that.
ORMAN: Me, too.
BEHAR: One more question before we go, because I`m out of time now. People -- the -- the housing market is still very soft.
ORMAN: Yes.
BEHAR: I mean it`s a buyer`s market. If you can, should you buy a house now?
ORMAN: Depends where you are. In the metropolitan areas, real estate has pretty much bottomed and if you have 20 percent to put down you can get a steal of a deal.
BEHAR: Like in New York City or Chicago or in Los Angeles?
ORMAN: New York, yes pretty much I think bottom. But what they`re called the sand states, you have Arizona, Florida --
BEHAR: Yes, don`t buy there.
ORMAN: Don`t buy yet. You -- we could easily go down another 10 percent or 20 percent.
BEHAR: I see, that`s very good information.
ORMAN: You know year 2023 until all real estate has recovered.
BEHAR: 2023?
ORMAN: 2023.
BEHAR: Oh, my God.
ORMAN: Aren`t I just filled with great news.
BEHAR: That`s too many years to wait. I`m sorry, I can`t. Go to Arizona and buy something cheap. The "Suze Orman Show" airs Saturday night at 9:00 p.m. on CNBC and her best-selling book, "The Money Class" is out in paperback on January 10th.
We`ll be right back.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Still to come, what exactly did Alec Baldwin do to get himself kicked off an American airlines flight? Next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: the talented Alec Baldwin was kicked off an American Airlines plane at LAX yesterday. He says it was because he was playing games on his iPad and American Airlines say he was rude and offensive after they asked him to stop. With me now to talk about this and other pop culture stores of the news are Victoria Jackson, former SNL cast member -- and star of the new family on DVD, "Marriage Retreat". Howard Bragman, celebrity publicist and vice chairman of reputation.com. Oh yes, save it, my reputation. And Sarah Bernard, host of "The Thread" on Yahoo! Welcome to the show.
So do you think Alec Baldwin has anger issues? I mean this is not the first time that he`s exploded
HOWARD BRAGMAN, CELEBRITY PUBLICIST: It reinforces every bad thing about Alex Baldwin and celebrities, the sense of entitlement, the anger. And recently he went after a barrista at Starbucks. And you know some kid making $7 an hour, whatever the minimum wage is. And I would tell you my aunt (INAUDIBLE) to say how many years as a slight attendant for American.
BEHAR: Your aunt Monya (ph)?
BRAGMAN: My aunt Monya. And she`s a lovely lady. She`s a widow, if there`s any nice Jewish guys in Chicago. But you know, seriously, she`s been flying many years. She`s had pay cuts, the indignity of the business change, worried about her pension, the company`s bankrupt. Have some respect for these people. They work hard and they`re there to save your ass.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: he has trouble with service people, it looks like.
SARAH BERNARD, COLUMNIST, "THE THREAD": But as a celebrity publicist, I mean don`t you think it`s the Twitter aspect of this that`s hilarious. I mean he`s in real-time twitting his angry thoughts. That`s really the problem. It`s hard for people to move on and say, you didn`t -- I didn`t say it, I didn`t really mean it when you`re typing it.
BRAGMAN: Well, no question. But the tweet, it`s about transparency not Twitters. There`s lots of ways to do it. Somebody could have take a picture or video linked the phone. Alec wasn`t the first guy to tweet it.
BERNARD: No but he should -- he actually did end up canceling the Twitter account.
BEHAR: Yes, he did. He ended up canceling the Twitter account because American Airlines went after him.
BRAGMAN: Is that his (INAUDIBLE) of an apology.
BEHAR: Well, I don`t know what that is. Victoria, you worked with Alec right on SNL.
VICTORIA JACKSON, FORMER SNL CAST: I did.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: So can I say about Alec because I know he`s obnoxious in this case maybe. But he is so talented and funny and I always found him very charming. I don`t find him to be nasty in any shape or form, not to me.
JACKSON: Well, my only experience with him was when I had to kiss him all day on the show and the only thing I remember was he asked me why my breasts were so big?
BEHAR: And what did you say?
JACKSON: I went into a 38 minute explanation of the history of them since the age of 12 to the age of 28 and he looked like grossed out and he didn`t speak to me the rest of the time. Maybe that`s a good technique to get him off your back, if he starts to bother you.
BEHAR: Yes. You know, he`s hinting or has hinted he wants to run for mayor of New York City. This kind of thing, these little issues, do you think that will hurt him?
BRAGMAN: I don`t know. If we live in a world where Newt Gingrich can be the Republican front-runner, anger issues don`t seem to enter into play. People kind of like -- they like it in him. They like his feistiness.
BERNARD: Yes, I mean but that`s his thing, right. Look, every couple of years, he`ll have an outburst like the whole --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: It works for Gingrich?
BERNARD: -- like with his daughter, that was very unfortunate. But then, you know --
(CROSSTALK)
BERNARD: You know, he dates a yoga instructor --
BEHAR: Oh, really.
BERNARD: So maybe that is trying to calm him down.
BEHAR: Somebody pointed out to me that he was playing scrabble on the iPad and Xanax was a 26-letter word. Maybe he should have done that.
We`ll have more pop culture in just a minute. 26 letters?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with my lovely panel. Marc Anthony is reportedly threatening to quit filming a Latin reality show with soon to be ex-wife Jennifer Lopez because he`s upset. She`s moved on with a 24-year-old backup dancer. This is why I would never work with George Clooney because Steve would have a fit.
(LAUGHTER)
Now, Victoria, nobody likes a new guy flaunted in front of him after the divorce. Nobody likes that. She is getting a divorce from Marc Anthony, and now she is flaunting this young hot boy-toy. Don`t you think Marc Anthony has a point, or do you?
JACKSON: I have noticed all the reality shows, people get divorced. Kate and eight or whatever.
BEHAR: "Kate plus 8."
JACKSON: The other one, they all get divorced.
BEHAR: You don`t even know their names.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Jon and Kate got a divorce. Who else? The Kardashians have a reality show. Who? Hulk Hogan and his wife, Linda.
BRAGMAN: Camille and Kelsey.
BEHAR: You`re right, Victoria, there`s a trend.
JACKSON: We got offered a lot of money to do "wife swap" and my husband said no.
BEHAR: Really? Why?
JACKSON: He just thinks it`s the bottom of the barrel of the entertainment industry.
BERNARD: Even the title itself is suggestive.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: What about American pickers? That`s not exactly "Masterpiece Theater." What do you make of this?
BERNARD: This is so ridiculous. He`s acting like he`s 18 years old and his first girlfriend broke his heart. This is a lot of money, this show. They`re scouring all of South America for new talent. It`s like some unbelievable scoop. They will find a needle in a haystack and he`s quitting.
But the thing that`s so ridiculous is I don`t think anyone really cares. Who is more famous and who does the show hinge on? If J-Lo quit and it was just the Marc Anthony`s show, I don`t think that would really work. This is not the best strategy.
BEHAR: Marc Anthony is a talent. What do you think? You`re the marketing guy or whatever you call yourself.
BRAGMAN: Listen --
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: The reputation fixer, that`s what you are.
BRAGMAN: After next week, you are going to need me, so don`t be --
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: You found out about me and the dog? Oh, OK.
BRAGMAN: It happens. It happens.
I can tell you, it`s a guy thing. We`re splitting up and I really love them. We both grew apart, I wish them well. All of a sudden they`re screwing a 24-year-old and it ain`t so much fun anymore. I think it`s a guy thing, it`s a macho thing.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: It`s not just a guy thing. Women -- I`m divorced, not one to talk. I was fairly semi violent myself in certain ways. You know, you get angry.
BRAGMAN: Semi?
BEHAR: Are you divorced at all?
JACKSON: I have had a divorce.
BEHAR: Isn`t it nasty when you get divorced, never friendly?
BRAGMAN: The only one not been divorced in this planet --
BEHAR: When they bring a new guy in the picture, everything breaks loose and this happens with men and their wives like this.
BERNARD: Usually not when you have a bazillion reality show at stake and you`re throwing a tantrum in public.
BEHAR: I know, but they don`t care about the money as much as their tempers.
JACKSON: He`s such a romantic, Marc Anthony.
BRAGMAN: People throw tantrums to call attention to the show, too.
BEHAR: Maybe people shouldn`t work together in the business. Mariah Carey, didn`t she have a husband, Tommy Mottola, didn`t work out. It doesn`t work that well. Madonna, Sean Penn. Enough said.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Next up, Rick Santorum continuing his war on same sex marriage, now saying he wouldn`t want gay sexual practices taught in schools. Is it just me or does he think about gay sex more than gay people do? Howard, I ask you that.
BRAGMAN: It`s crazy. The man on the street could care less about gay sex right now. They`d like a job. They`d like health care. They`d like to know they`re going to get Social Security if they choose to retire at 87. They want simple things, which shows why Rick Santorum is polling about as well as I am for president right now.
BEHAR: He`s not doing well as a candidate at all. I don`t think it is because of this. This would appeal to the base, wouldn`t it?
BERNARD: Don`t you think it`s interesting that both Ricks when they`re not doing well, my gay friends are why are you bringing us into it all of a sudden? The gay marriage and friends in the military, where they go when not doing well.
BEHAR: Why is that, Victoria?
JACKSON: First of all, I`m thinking about the Muslim Brotherhood a lot. I`ll push that aside for a second.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Any particular reason why the Muslim Brotherhood?
JACKSON: Because I went to a six hour briefing in Washington D.C. last week. I`m an expert on it now.
BEHAR: The Muslim Brotherhood?
JACKSON: But it`s not one of the questions today, so --
(LAUGHTER)
JACKSON: So, basically, I love Rick Santorum.
BEHAR: You do? What do you love about him?
JACKSON: He stands for what I believe in. I am so sad, if you want to teach little children anything sexual, that`s robbing their innocence and it`s child abuse. That`s what I think.
BEHAR: Basically, he`s saying if you teach children gay people like Howard, how scary is Howard? Give me a break.
BRAGMAN: Hey.
BEHAR: If Howard wants to get married to the guy he`s been with so many years --
JACKSON: They will have to think about sex.
BEHAR: They have to think about the sex, really? When you go to the wedding do you actually picture the bride and groom doing it? .
BRAGMAN: If they`re hot.
BEHAR: I don`t think about it. I think how exhausted they will be and not do it tonight.
JACKSON: I don`t think children should have to think about stuff like that.
BRAGMAN: That impinges on my freedom to marry. I don`t want your kids to think about murder either, but people kill each other. A lot of bad things happen in this world and they come home from school and watching "Will & Grace" and "Modern Family".
JACKSON: Not my kid.
BEHAR: How old are your kids?
JACKSON: They`re kind of grown up now, but I have a grandchild.
BEHAR: You wouldn`t let them watch "Will & Grace."
BRAGMAN: What if she turns out to be lesbian?
BEHAR: What are you going to do?
BRAGMAN: Go to Michele Bachmann`s husband`s party club?
BEHAR: What do you think about pray the gay away?
JACKSON: I think I would pray the gay away.
BEHAR: You would, really?
JACKSON: Sometimes I know a person who is lesbian and gay and going to have babies now.
BRAGMAN: What`s his boyfriend look like and her girlfriend look like?
BEHAR: You can make up a fantasy in their brain.
JACKSON: Everybody does that, right.
BEHAR: You know that joke, a married couple are in bed, they`re married a long time and they try to get it going and they can`t do it. He say, what`s the matter, couldn`t you think of anybody either?
(LAUGHTER)
Let`s talk about another little gay story. A Michigan teacher tried to remove the word "gay" from the Christmas carol "Deck the Halls," because it`s like deck the halls, "Don we now our gay apparel." Do you think they will change "I saw Mommy kissing Santa Claus" because it makes mommy look like a ho?
BRAGMAN: I`m a Jewish kid from Michigan. I grew up in Michigan. By calling attention to this, they make it a much bigger issue. All you have to say is, guys, let`s look at the dictionary, it`s a teachable moment.
BERNARD: I have intelligence on this, all right? We`re all talking about our families tonight. My cousin, Eileen, who lives in Trevor City --
BRAGMAN: Does she know my aunt?
BERNARD: She does.
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Did she pray the gay away?
BERNARD: So she is actually involved in the music at that school and found out that basically the teacher was trying to teach the song for the holiday concert to several different classes. All the kids were giggling. She had another version of the carol that said "bright apparel," so she decided to do that for classroom maintenance, not because she was homophobic.
What cracks me up is that my five-year-olds listen to Katy Perry, crazy things. The fact they would giggle at gay apparel versus Rihanna and whatever else they listen to --
BEHAR: The gay thing has become somehow it`s infiltrated into the school system and people think it`s funny to say "gay" now. I don`t know. It`s a crazy world. What do you think about this one, Victoria?
JACKSON: They probably heard it on TV so they know it`s sexually related.
BERNARD: It comes down to "Will & Grace" again.
BEHAR: They heard about gays on TV. Let me ask you a question. You know the postman could be gay. People that deliver the --
JACKSON: It`s a free country but I don`t want them to teach the little children sexual things.
BEHAR: No.
JACKSON: I don`t believe in gay --
BEHAR: I understand what you`re saying.
BRAGMAN: It has to stop. It`s such a misconception that because my partner of eight years and I got married three years ago that kids have to learn sex in the schools. You teach kids about sex at the appropriate age. They can`t even afford to teach mathematics and reading and writing in school, let alone sex education. I just want to make sure we know this is a big myth we`re teaching four-year-old kids about gay sex or straight sex.
JACKSON: I have a book called "The Marketing of Evil" by David Capelian, and it tells how expert genius Harvard marketers actually came up with the word "gay rights" so that the American public would accept it as natural behavior and they accomplished that.
BRAGMAN: As opposed to what? What should it be called when I`m an American citizen?
JACKSON: It used to be shocking, not be on TV and the last 10 years they had a strategy and accomplished it. It`s a very good book and you should read it.
BRAGMAN: I`m proud of this strategy and calling attention to the fact there are gay people and transgender people and helping kids not kill themselves because they have intolerant parents.
BEHAR: It`s something that exists. You can`t deny it.
BRAGMAN: It existed in this Bible, OK.
JACKSON: So did murder, and adultery. That`s in the bible.
BEHAR: Those are heteros that are doing that.
(LAUGHTER)
Thank you, guys. We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Donatella Versace is, simply put, a fashion icon. As creative director of the Versace Group, she somehow makes running a multimillion dollar empire look glamorous. I`m happy to welcome to my show the fabulous Donatella Versace. I`m so happy to have you here.
DONATELLO VERSACE, DESIGNER: I`m happy to be here. Thank you for inviting me.
BEHAR: When I saw some of your designs the other day on "The View." it was just incredible stuff, just beautiful.
VERSACE: Thank you.
BEHAR: So original, you are. We met actually last year or this year at the correspondents` dinner.
VERSACE: Yes, in Washington. I remember that.
BEHAR: What do you think of the Obama -- there`s a picture of us. What do you think of the Obamas` style?
VERSACE: I think the first lady, she`s very revolutionary in America because no one before her as first lady dress with young designer, daring. And she was -- she has her own style.
BEHAR: She has style.
VERSACE: Lots of style.
BEHAR: Not all the first ladies have such style.
VERSACE: That`s what I`m saying, the first one.
BEHAR: Jackie Kennedy.
VERSACE: After her.
BEHAR: Who even knew what Beth Truman wore? An apron over a sweater.
So we found out today that your family and my family come from the same part of Italy, Reggio, a little town in Calabria. And Reggio is not Florence, not a lot of rich people living in Reggio as far as I can tell. I don`t know what they`re doing now but in the old days. What was your family, rich or poor?
VERSACE: So-so.
BEHAR: So-so, because your mother was a seamstress. But she ran a business?
VERSACE: She was a seamstress and a shop where she sewing.
BEHAR: I see. It was humble beginning, really.
VERSACE: Very humble.
BEHAR: Look at the way the Versace empire has blossomed.
VERSACE: They don`t even think about that this could happen.
BEHAR: You never even dreamed about it.
VERSACE: No.
BEHAR: Johnny, he founded Versace in 1978. You started out basically as his muse. You were not a partner at that time, right? He got his inspiration from you?
VERSACE: I was in Florence at the university when Johnny started. I started to work in Florence as well. On the weekend, we used to meet each other because my mother was very strict. She wanted me to finish study. We got to work together. It was a lot of fun.
BEHAR: It was a lot of fun. I`m sure you miss him terribly. He was very, very sadly gunned down by this crazy spree killer.
VERSACE: It was unbelievable and horrible.
BEHAR: That must have been so awful for you.
VERSACE: I talked to him 15 minutes before. When I got the news, I could not believe it.
BEHAR: That`s so shocking for something so violent to happen to such a lovely person.
VERSACE: Yes. He was a gentleman.
BEHAR: Let`s look at some of the celebrities who wear your clothes. We`re showing a picture in 1994, Elizabeth Hurley`s safety pin dress, a famous one of your outfits. Look at that. That was very original.
VERSACE: It was different, which was unknown at that time.
BEHAR: She was unknown?
VERSACE: She had a dressmaker career because after she wore the dress, she was very well-known all over the year. It was Johnny`s dress.
BEHAR: Johnny`s dress. Is this your dress? In 2000, J-Lo`s green cut down to there, the Grammy dress. Was that yours or Johnny`s?
VERSACE: It was mine.
BEHAR: This is yours. Look at that! Isn`t she cute?
VERSACE: The next day, she was all over the press with this dress, everybody talk about this dress.
BEHAR: They should wear some more audacious clothing like that at the Oscars. It makes more interesting thing to watch, instead of the usual -- sort of very, very -- I don`t know, what they`re going for?
VERSACE: Like a rock star.
BEHAR: Did you like the way Cher dresses?
VERSACE: Yes. She used to dress so much, yes.
BEHAR: She used to have some out there styles.
And let`s take a look at some of the recent collection of yours. We`ll look at that. These are the runway models in the tight clothing. Let`s see those. Your clothes are obviously beautiful, but the average sized woman couldn`t wear them.
VERSACE: No, that`s not true at all.
BEHAR: Not true?
VERSACE: No, because I wouldn`t have a business.
BEHAR: You wouldn`t have a business if you could only fit into skinny girls?
VERSACE: Of course. I know that very well. You put on the runway a style. This is my style. It`s sexual, sophisticated, sexy. But after this, I have a complete collection similar to this but a complete collection.
BEHAR: I see. We`re going to have more with do Donatella Versace when we return.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Trick-or-treat!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Great, here you go. I have candy cigarettes for you.
(LAUGHTER)
Here`s the candy and here`s the cigarettes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We`re not supposed to smoke.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, tell your mom they`re lites. Now get out!
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: I`m here with the glamorous Donatella Versace. They make fun of me over there, too. I think it`s fun. Do you?
VERSACE: I think it`s hilarious.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: You know, it`s interesting, the fashion industry attracts a lot of gay men.
VERSACE: Yes.
BEHAR: The women are not necessarily gay, but the men seem to be. I can give you names. Marc Jacobs, Tom Ford, Valentino, Isaac Mizrahi. What is it about fashion that gay men are attracted to?
VERSACE: You have to be very sensitive and very feminine. But I think women designers are much better in a way, because not only do we know a woman`s body, but we have security.
BEHAR: Do you think that the Italian designers are better than the French designers?
VERSACE: Yes.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: OK, there you go. What do you think of Lady Gaga and her style?
VERSACE: Which one?
BEHAR: Which one? I don`t know. The way she dresses in general.
VERSACE: She likes to express herself. I think she has a fantastic voice.
BEHAR: Oh, she`s talented, indeed.
VERSACE: A little freaky. Rock stars wants to be in strange designs now.
BEHAR: You were just named one of "Glamour`s" women of the year for your support of a children`s charity in China, the Versace One Foundation. Tell me about that before we go.
VERSACE: In China, we put together this foundation to help the children who were orphans with no parents in the house, nothing. And we made a place where they can sleep, eat, and learn. And we provide doctors to help them after the devastating earthquake.
BEHAR: Congratulations on that. That`s lovely. Thank you, that`s very nice. Thank you for doing the show.
VERSACE: Thank you for inviting me.
BEHAR: And thank you for watching. Goodnight, everybody.
END
