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New Day

U.S. and Europe Increase Russian Sanctions; CIA Says ISIS Much Larger Than Thought; Pistorius Found Guilty of Culpable Homicide; Inmates Escape Ohio Prison

Aired September 12, 2014 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: So blown away by 27 pairs of shoes. Impressive.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Twenty-seven pairs of shoes, great cause, great man. He says the only regret of his playing days is that he was only a Jet.

PEREIRA: I feel that's not true.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: What did he really say about the Jets? What did he really say?

(CROSSTALK)

CUOMO: It doesn't matter what he said.

John Berman, I will not be taken to task by you, although you're making me sweat.

Welcome back to NEW DAY. Let's get back to this angry man, John Berman, he has the top story.

BERMAN: All right. New economic sanctions against Russia. They go into effect today. The sanctions by the European Union are in response to Russia's support of anti-government rebels in Ukraine. The new measures by the E.U. include freezing assets and banning travel for several Russian officials and rebel leaders. Ukrainian forces and pro-Russian rebels exchanged prisoners Thursday as part of a cease-fire deal.

An American doctor who survived the Ebola virus is donating his own blood to help another U.S. doctor who is now infected. Dr. Richard Sacra is described as sick but stable right now at an isolation unit at a Nebraska hospital. He's been treated with a serum made from the blood of Dr. Kent Brantly. This is remarkable. The Ebola survivor who travelled to Omaha last week to make that donation.

The mother of American James Foley lashing out at the U.S. government saying she's is embarrassed and appalled by how they dealt with her son's case. Diane Foley says she thinks they considered the family's efforts to free her son an annoyance. She said they even threatened her with prosecution if she tried to raise ransom money. James Foley, of course, was one of the two Americans executed on video by ISIS terrorists.

New details about the NSA's heavy-handed tactics to collect the person data of Americans. According to court documents, the agency threatened to fine yahoo $250,000 a day in 2008 if it failed to comply with orders to surrender a wide array of customer communications. The company fought and lost a legal battle to resist what it believed to be an unconstitutional government program.

It took two years of roving around mars, but curiosity got there. NASA says Mars rover has reached the mountain territory on the red planet it was designed to explore. As one of mission scientist put it, we have millions of years of Martian history just waiting for us to explore.

PEREIRA: That gets me completely geeked out. Why is it controversial?

BERMAN: A lot of secrets. Hunting a lot of secrets up there.

PEREIRA: Is that where all of those secrets are? On Mars?

CUOMO: The question is, can we be the only ones? Can we really be the only ones?

PEREIRA: Are we the best version?

BERMAN: "Total Recall" how much like reality was that film? Two questions.

PEREIRA: Why do you two noodle that, we'll talk weather. You guys be over there. We're keeping our eyes on the skies for the weekend. It's feeling like autumn is on its way.

INDRA PETERSONS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Yes, it's looking for half about that. I see John's face, he likes it, he calls it football weather. I go eh, it's cooling down, there's tons of showers in the forecast as we go towards the weekend, no, thank you.

Take a look at the southeast, heavy rain again today, pushing in towards the Carolinas. The number we saw all that flooding out towards Mississippi, Tennessee yesterday, that the wave and energy into the Carolinas today. We'll be watching it for flooding.

Now, Saturday, almost the entire eastern seaboard, northeast to the southeast, looking for scattered showers, by Sunday it gets better. The northeast dries out. This is not where you want to be on the weekend. We're still talking about more showers even as you go in through Sunday.

Here's the temperature change we're talking about. Two cold fronts went through, reinforcing cold air went through. Temperature differences are going to be huge. If you're in the mid-Atlantic, you're going to notice a good 10 15-degree temperature drop.

So, the 90s are gone, 80s, still nice, we'll see cooler weather as we go in towards Sunday. We'll start to see more of those 70s and 60s, especially towards Boston, highs there 66. In towards the Atlantic we have Edward out there, the forecast is keeping it out to sea, we'll continue to monitor it. It looks like for now it stays east of Bermuda. Fall football weather is here for Berman. For me, depressing.

BERMAN: It smells like football.

PETERSONS: I got to give it to you.

PEREIRA: All right. Indra, thank you for that. Here comes the weekend.

BERMAN: Married to a Wisconsin football player, offensive tackle.

PEREIRA: I know, I know.

BERMAN: It's Indra Petersons, by the way.

PEREIRA: Yes.

PETERSONS: He loves my passion for it, right?

PEREIRA: Or anti-passion.

PETERSONS: Exactly.

PEREIRA: All right. Major developments in the battle against ISIS, the U.S. is now flying surveillance flights over Syria. CNN learns the terror group's fighting force is much larger than previously known. Will the U.S. have the allies to defeat them?

We're going to break it down. A CNN military analyst will weigh in on the president's strategy. That's next for you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CUOMO: Welcome back to NEW DAY.

Listen to this headline -- the CIA now says the number of ISIS fighters has doubled, maybe even tripled from previous estimates. More than 31,000 and 2,000 from the west of that number, which is especially troubling. This comes as the U.S. is already tracking ISIS targets in Syria with regular surveillance flights. Also on the agenda, arming Syrian rebels.

Now, we've been down this road before in this region, specifically. So, how can we be sure we know who the friends are, who the foes are, and what happens with where we go? And are we going to find when we get there?

A lot of questions, we have a man who can answer them for us. Lieutenant Colonel Rick Francona joining us. Obviously, a friend to the show. Good to have you here.

First question, this ISIS when they were a jayvee team, they were like nine guys, now we want to justify this huge war effort, the U.S. wants to justify it is that playing into why the number is getting so big? Is this really a --

LT. COL. RICK FRANCONA (RET), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, there's several reasons. We've always thought there were more numbers than the official estimates. But we're seeing a great recruiting effort as well. That would explain a lot of the difference to go from 10,000 to 30,000 is a big leap. So, it could be that the government is trying to justify what they're doing or maybe they're finally getting an accurate count of who's actually there.

CUOMO: One-second buff of information for people as we try to get our heads around this. Even if they have 30,000, let's say they have 50,000, the Peshmerga alone are 150,000, which raises the question, why do they need U.S. help to fight this fight when they have such numerical superiority. It leads to the suggestion that these guys aren't fighting against ISIS when they have the opportunity.

FRANCONA: Well, the Kurds are responsible for a much larger area. They're not just fighting ISIS. They're keeping the whole area. So, they have a much larger span that they have to worry about. They can put so many fighters on the frontline in any given time.

So, you're talking about, you know, where is the effort going to be?

CUOMO: All right. So, let's take a look at the map. That's why we're starting on this large part of the world here -- Syria. Now, we're trying to highlight different parts of the country. One country, it's like four different parts, like a quadrangle of pain in there right now.

Who are the players? What do we have to figure out about who to arm, who to fight?

FRANCONA: OK. The big players in the group, you have the regime of one side, but on the opposition side, you've got the Free Syrian Army. These are the moderates that the United States wants to back. They're the secular people. They're mostly made up of defectors from the Syrian army. This is a huge organization, maybe about 50,000, maybe more.

They're the ones that we believe are the future for Syria, then you've got these three Islamic groups, you've got ISIS, which we've talked about. And we know the numbers are about 30,000 total. Then, you got two other groups in there, you got the victory front which is nothing more than al Qaeda in Syria. Let's call it that, al Qaeda in Syria.

CUOMO: But not al Qaeda, al Qaeda came from Syria, but they split.

FRANCONA: So, now, you've got a separate organization. Then, you got this other large group of about 50,000, called the Islamic Front. That's made of seven smaller Islamic Salafists organizations supported by Saudi Arabia and Qatar. That's where their money comes from.

They're Islamist, but they're not far radical. So, FSA, Free Syrian Army, can work with the Islamic front. Then you've got Nusra and ISIS. I know it's very confusing. CUOMO: No, I want it to be confusing. I want it to be confusing. I

know that's not one of the main rules of television, but here's why. When we're showing you Syria, there was a yellow and brown. The brown is where ISIS is.

See, that's too simple. That's why I ignored it. I want it to be complicated, when we go to the next big point of news this morning, which we have these 10 countries, Arab states and Turkey, not Arab, as Rick tells me all the time, Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Qatar, the United, the UAE, the United Arab Emirates, it sounds impressive, but it isn't, because of what you just said.

The loyalties go all over the place in this situation. And you don't really know who will do what and why, isn't that true?

FRANCONA: That's a big problem and I know the secretary of state is traveling and talking to all of these different countries, he's trying to extract from them a promise to do something and all of them have done just that. They promised to do something.

But it's always different. We'll provide support, we'll provide money. We'll provide training. But what we haven't heard is that we're going to provide troops.

CUOMO: Right. Remember, this is a part of the world that likes to fight. They have thousands of years, not that we're pacifists here in the west but they have thousands of years of fighting for commercial reasons, let alone blood and religion.

Now, one example -- Saudi Arabia. They're going to be on our side, because ISIS wants to replace them as the main ruler in that region. But there's a big cultural split there. The Wahhabism, their form of Islam there is very extreme and like what ISIS likes.

FRANCONA: But different. And ISIS wants to remove the Wahhabism and replace it with their own brand of radical Islam. They've already told the Saudis the family will be out.

CUOMO: Right.

FRANCONA: And that when they take over the two holy places they're going to destroy the holiest site in Islam. They're going to destroy the Kaaba. This is anathema to most Muslims, so you have this really radical group, even more radical than the Wahhabis.

CUOMO: One last thing as we leave it for here, because this is going to be an ongoing discussion. I just want to set the table for you at home that this isn't as simple as it sounds, like, oh we've got friends on our side, we're going to go fight. It's very complicated there. Israel has not been in the conversation. They're such great fighters there, so much technology and strategy, why aren't they involved in the mix?

FRANCONA: The Israelis have a great opportunity here to just sit back and watch everything else unfold, because as long as these guys are tied up with each other, they're too busy to be threatening Israel.

CUOMO: But what about Israel helping the fight for the greater cause?

FRANCONA: They're watching right now. They're not going to jump into this.

CUOMO: Interesting.

FRANCONA: There's no reason to.

CUOMO: Interesting. Interesting part of the dynamics with the U.S. Rick, thank you very much.

FRANCONA: Same, Chris.

CUOMO: And again, you need to think it's complicated, because it is. And you don't want to get duped by over-simplification when blood and treasure is going to be spent.

Now we are following a lot of breaking news this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)

CUOMO (voice-over): One of the headlines, Oscar Pistorius, he is guilty of culpable homicide. We're going to tell what you that could mean, how much time he could serve. It could be like nothing, it could be a big chunk of his life. We have power house legal team here to break it down for you.

(END VIDEOCLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PEREIRA: Good to have you back with us here on NEW DAY. Breaking overnight, we have a verdict in the Oscar Pistorius murder trial in South Africa.

(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)

PEREIRA (voice-over): The judge finding the track star guilty of culpable homicide in the shooting death of his girlfriend, Reeva Steenkamp. He faces a maximum prison sentence of 15 years.

(END VIDEOCLIP)

PEREIRA (on camera): Want to bring in our CNN commentator and legal analyst, Mel Robbins, attorney also and radio host, Mo Ivory. Ladies, happy Friday, thank you for joining me. So we have to put our South African legal minds on here if you will with me, and walk us through this a little bit. Guilty of culpable homicide. Unintentional but unlawful killing of a person. Mel, that's equivalent to essentially involuntary manslaughter here in the United States, correct?

MEL ROBBINS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: That's correct. Good morning, Michaela. Good morning, Mo.

MO IVORY, ATTORNEY AND RADIO HOST: Good morning.

ROBBINS: What you have is a conviction on manslaughter. And you know, one of the things that you said that was interesting is you said that it's 15 years. The fact is there's actually no mandatory minimum or maximum. And it gives this judge wide latitude, Michaela.

And some of the previous sentences that she's handed down, she's extremely tough on crimes against women. She sentenced a police officer who shot his wife and killed her during an argument about divorce to life in prison and she looked at him, Michaela, and she said you're not a protector, you're a killer. You deserve to be in jail forever.

PEREIRA: So you're leaning towards her giving him the maximum?

ROBBINS: Well, I think you could see her give at least 15 years in this case. I mean, what we've seen from our legal analysts out of South Africa is it's sort of customary to do between five and eight years.

PEREIRA: Five and eight, yes.

ROBBINS: But she systemically rejected Pistorius as a terrible witness. She thought that he was evasive. I don't think -- she also commented specifically, Michaela, on the fact that there were a lot of people in South Africa that are afraid of crime. They don't sleep with guns under their pillows.

PEREIRA: That speaks to my next question that I'll put to you, Mo. I understand that it's a principle of South African law that the sentence is tailored to the culprit as a whole person, not specifically just to that crime. So I'm wondering then, given what Mel was saying and given what we've seen of Oscar Pistorius and how he's been portrayed in trial, how do you anticipate that's going to play out?

IVORY: Yes. I mean, I'm so curious to watch this because it seems that the sentencing hearing could be as salacious and as long - -

PEREIRA: Interesting.

IVORY: - - really as the trial is. It's definitely not one of the sort of what we've seen in our American system. You sort of come in, you are presented before the judge and then you are sentenced. And so we really can't speculate on what else we're going to find out about Oscar Pistorius because new evidence can be presented in that South African court.

What Mel just said is so interesting about that judge. That she's sort of given a lot of her own opinions about what she feels about Oscar Pistorius. And so I really think that, you know, it is true, most have seen a five to eight-year sentence. But it doesn't seem like she really likes Oscar at all and that she's open to hearing more evidence.

You know we also had that other charge that was absolutely not even related to the incident that happened on that Valentine's night.

PEREIRA: Right, right.

IVORY: And she found him, you know, guilty of opening fire in a restaurant, even though there were so many different facts of him saying that he wasn't even the one that had the gun. So there's a lot that this judge brings to the table that I think is going to be important in the sentencing.

PEREIRA: Mel, I think what's really an important point to get at, maybe can you give us insight here, is again the judge didn't feel the state made the case for murder. So she found him guilty of culpable homicide. Where is it that you think the state may have failed in making their case?

ROBBINS: Well, the case was largely circumstantial. And as you'll recall, Michaela, the theory of the case was that he was a gun-loving, fly off the handle, rage kind of guy and that he stormed the bathroom during a domestic dispute and shot through the door intentionally wanting to kill her. And they basically, according to this judge, did not prove the case at all. And she bought the defense's theory that he really did believe that there was an intruder.

And one of the most interesting parts of the case to me as an attorney, is that to be convicted of intentional murder in South Africa, you simply have to intend to kill the person. You don't have to necessarily know, for example, that it is an intruder behind the door or that it's Reeva behind the door. You just have to prove that he intended to kill somebody as they fired. I found it interesting that she stipulated to the facts that he shot, but that there was no proof that he actually intended to kill the person.

She kind of bought that he intended to shoot out of fear and that he believed that Reeva was in the bed. So she, she really did say that the defense's case is right. This is a horrible, tragic accident that was caused by his recklessness.

PEREIRA: Right.

IVORY: Yes.

ROBBINS: What will be interesting is given that 15 years is kind of customary, he was also convicted, as Mo said, of discharging a weapon inside a restaurant which calls for ten years. Who knows what this is going to give in terms of a sentence?

IVORY: Sure.

ROBBINS: To put this in perspective for Americans, we recently had a conviction in Detroit of the guy shooting Ranisha on the front porch.

PEREIRA: Yes.

ROBBINS: He just got 17 years here in the U.S. for manslaughter and second-degree. PEREIRA: We know the state can only appeal if they believe the judge

misinterpreted the law. There will be questions about that, obviously. Pistorius can appeal. Do you think he will, Mo?

IVORY: Yes, well the national prosecuting attorney authority has already said that they are disappointed in the judge's decision and that they will wait until after the sentencing to make a decision on appeal. But I think that this case is, you know, big enough. It has the kind of attention that they need in South Africa to sort of make Oscar an example. So if the sentencing is light, I do believe that there certainly will be an appeal.

PEREIRA: Mo, Mel, great legal minds. Thanks for joining us bright and early this morning.

ROBBINS: You got it, thank you.

PEREIRA: We are following a whole lot of news today. Let's get to it.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: T.J. Lane and two other inmates escaped from the Allen Correctional Facility.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Lane killed three students wearing a t-shirt that said "killer."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: U.S. surveillance flights over Syria are under way.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: An F-16 is not a strategy.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: New reports tonight that Rice came clean to NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell back in June.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He failed to act, there should be consequences.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I really feel that our country let Jim down.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oscar Pistorius has just been found guilty of culpable homicide.

(END VIDEOCLIP)

CUOMO: Good morning, welcome to NEW DAY. I'm right here with Michaela Pereira. Kate Bolduan is under the weather today, but let's qualify what that means.

PEREIRA: We don't believe this is labor, we're not aunties and uncles yet. We are waiting, but she just was feeling a little sick to her stomach.

CUOMO: We're not going to start the baby watch just yet.

PEREIRA: No, not boiling the water yet.

CUOMO: But we do have other breaking news. PEREIRA: Sure do.

CUOMO: A dangerous killer on the run thankfully recaptured.

(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)

CUOMO (voice-over): You're looking at him. Notorious school shooter T.J. Lane back in custody this morning after escaping from a prison in Ohio. You remember him. he bragged about his crimes, wore a shirt that read "killer," smiled when he was sentenced.

Lane is serving three life sentences for a shooting spree at his high school in Chardon, Ohio in 2012, left three students dead. CNN's Ted Rowlands is following developments in Lima, Ohio.

(END VIDEOCLIP)

CUOMO (on camera): A big question for people, Ted, is going to be how did this happen? It's important to know that even though he had horrible killings on his rap sheet, he wasn't in the hardest prison. True?

TED ROWLANDS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, two questions need to be answered, Chris, is how did he escape and is this the right facility for a school shooter who has never shown any remorse?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ROWLANDS (voice-over): A massive state-wide manhunt overnight after three convicts escaped the Allen Oakwood Correctional Institution in Ohio, including notorious killer, T.J. Lane.

KEVIN JONES, WARDEN, ALLEN OAKWOOD CORRECTIONAL INSTITUTION: He did scale our perimeter fence and again, this is an ongoing investigation.

ROWLANDS: One inmate was quickly apprehended, while Lane was on the run for nearly six hours. He was eventually cornered just 100 yards away from the prison where he escaped and taken back into custody without incident.

JONES: I personally saw him. He never said anything at all.

ROWLANDS: Lane killed three students in 2012 at the age of 17 by opening fire at Chardon High School, wearing a t-shirt that said "killer." At his sentencing, where he received three life sentences, he caused outrage by wearing another "killer" t-shirt and smiling.

At the scene of Lane's crimes, classes were canceled this morning. The school superintendent saying support services would be offered. Extra patrols were also offered to the families of Lane's victims.

SCOTT HILDENBRAND, CHIEF DEPUTY, CHARDON POLICE DEPARTMENT: We immediately contacted the victims' families of the Chardon School Shooting. We quickly worked closely with the state, federal, and local law enforcement to insure the safety of our county residents. ROWLANDS: Though the facility where Lane is being held is not a

maximum security prison, a fact that will be reviewed in light of the escape according to the warden, the warden was quick to defend the prison and emphasize lane's recapture.

JONES: Obviously I'm not happy that it's happened. No warden in my position would like something like this to happen. But the facts are, I'm happy to announce that we have Mr. Lane back in our custody.