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New Day

New York Doctor With Ebola; CNN Hero Leela Hazzah; Interview with Anthony Gray

Aired October 24, 2014 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: We learned moments ago that officials are considering mandatory quarantines for any health care worker returning from West Africa. This after a New York City doctor became the latest to contract Ebola overseas and the first doctor to unknowingly bring it back with him. Dr. Craig Spencer is a volunteer for Doctors Without Borders. He returned to the U.S. from West Africa last week. So with about 8 million residence in New York City, how are officials going to contain Ebola?

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: That is the question. Let's try and get some answers. We have New York City Health Commissioner Dr. Mary Bassett, and on the phone, chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta.

So, Commissioner, it's good to have you here.

DR. MARY BASSETT, NYC HEALTH COMMISSIONER: Thank you.

CUOMO: We appreciate you being here. We know you're very busy. The big question is, how is the patient doing and did you get him into the hospital soon enough?

BASSETT: Well, thanks for that question.

As far as I know, the patient is stable. The last word on the patient this morning is he continues to be stable. As you heard, he returned to the United States on October 17th and he had been monitoring his temperature. The first time he found a temperature elevation, he called his employer, MSF, Doctors Without Borders. They notified us. And he came straight to the hospital. So we got him when he had his first fever and got him into isolation and treatment.

CAMEROTA: Sanjay, tell us -

BASSETT: So it all went well.

CUOMO: Good.

CAMEROTA: That's good to know.

Sanjay, tell us the information that you've just received from government officials about what might happen in the future with health care workers, like this doctor. DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (via telephone):

Well, it's a big topic and what we're hearing - I talked to an administration official who said that they are considering a mandatory quarantine for returning health care workers from West Africa. Now, the balance is, and this was the more nuanced part, the balance is that they don't feel that there's a risk of transmission from someone who is not having symptoms, Ebola-like symptoms, but they understand that there is a public fear here as well.

And, you know, part of the confusion, and you know we hear on one hand that Dr. Craig Spencer did exactly what he was supposed to do. I read through the Doctors Without Borders guidelines. He followed them, it sounds like, perfectly. But when you also hear in the next breath that his girlfriend I believe or fiance, I'm not sure of the relationship, but she is now under quarantine, it does raise the question, you know, why are some people under quarantine and some people are no? It is confusing. They acknowledge that and want to try and have some clarity on the situation. But, frankly, even - even, you know, I - myself, I'm not sure I fully understand why some people are put into a quarantine, like his girlfriend, when it doesn't sound like he was, you know, transmitting the virus at the time that he was taken to the hospital.

CAMEROTA: Right. Good question.

CUOMO: Well, let's discuss this because this really gets to the heart of where the panic comes from.

BASSETT: Yes. Sure. Sure.

CUOMO: And one important clarification. You said when he got a fever. We've been getting different numbers. Obviously the more fever, higher fever, the more sick he is. Was it 103 or 100.3?

BASSETT: It was 100.3. And I want to make clear that the patient always gave us this number.

CUOMO: OK.

BASSETT: So the number reported in the press was incorrect.

CUOMO: Because the other number was out there. So his fever was lower. That means he wasn't as far along in the process. That's better in terms of his chance of recovery and the chance that he could have spread it.

So now we get to what I've been calling and many call a mixed message, right? I don't know that it's being handled right on the government side, and here's why. You keep saying the same thing, all of you, you can't get this, it's very hard to get, it's only going to be the health care workers who are really in deep contact with it and that's why the people who were even around Mr. Duncan, may he rest in peace, they haven't gotten it, they're done with quarantine. But then you search for everybody's been anywhere near any of these people and now you're saying you may quarantine all of the doctors. It sends a mixed message. BASSETT: OK, let me just back up and try and be as clear as I can

about this. And I do want to make sure that we acknowledge the courage of this young man and going to work in West Africa, where we know that the epidemic has to be stopped at its source.

So this young man was well when he left Guinea, well when he left Europe to come to the United States. He felt well. He had no fever. And when he arrived here, he continued to feel well and took his temperature daily.

On October 21st, he started feeling very tired, but the first time that he had a fever was yesterday morning, sometime between 10:00 and 11:00. He now has a diagnosis of Ebola. We, of course, are waiting for the CDC to confirm his laboratory test. But I think the fact that he was a doctor treating Ebola patients, that he has a clinical story that matches Ebola and that he's had one presumptive test, all of which have been confirmed so far by the CDC that it's highly unlikely that the CDC won't confirm it later today. So he now has a diagnosis of Ebola.

What we do in public health and what we mean by saying that we have medical detectives is then we then set out to find everybody who he's been in touch with. We leave no stone unturned. There are three individuals who have been served with quarantine orders, his fiance, with whom he lives, and other people who had physical contact with him.

CAMEROTA: You know, this doctor was from Doctors Without Borders, and they are the gold standard of how to deal with Ebola. They have always worn more protective equipment than the CDC even recommended.

BASSETT: Yes. Yes.

CAMEROTA: They know preparedness.

BASSETT: Yes.

CAMEROTA: But he got it.

BASSETT: Yes.

CAMEROTA: How can you be so sure that doctors treating him here in New York at Bellevue won't also be vulnerable?

BASSETT: Well, we know that Doctors Without Borders has logged in thousands and thousands of hours in the care of very, very sick patients under very, very difficult conditions in Africa, and very few have acquired infection. We may never know exactly how it happened. But taking these clothes off seems to be a big risk.

Here in New York, we -- all of our infection control procedures went perfectly from the time the patient was picked up to the hospital. They're wearing all of the guideline dictated stuff.

CAMEROTA: PPE, yes. BASSETT: PPE. And they've also been practicing at it. So practicing

really is key to this. Not only do you need to know how to use it, you need to practice using it and, of course, the buddy system, which Bellevue adopted very early on. So, practice, practice, practice, and we can really eliminate effectively the risk of exposure, but human errors occur.

CAMEROTA: Of course (ph).

CUOMO: Well, we hope you get as little practical practice as necessary.

BASSETT: I do, too. And we --

CUOMO: We really do not want these skills to have to be on display.

BASSETT: No.

CUOMO: We wish the doctor well.

BASSETT: Absolutely.

CUOMO: And we just want to be able to figure out how to let people best digest what this story is about and what it means to them.

BASSETT: Yes.

CUOMO: But, commissioner, thank you very much.

BASSETT: Thank you very much.

CAMEROTA: Sanjay, thanks so much for sharing with us the reporting that you've done. That's good information. Thank you.

GUPTA: Yes, thank you.

CUOMO: All right, another situation that has had a lot of people on edge is what's going on in Ferguson, Missouri. The tensions there still very high. Right now it's because grand jury testimony in the Michael Brown case got out to the public. Who is behind this leak and why might that matter? And what is the family of the teen who was killed think about it? Do the details that have been out, now that they are out, what do they mean for Officer Darren Wilson's story?

CAMEROTA: He, as you know, he fired in self-defense. We will speak with the - well, he says he does - he did. So we'll speak with the family's lawyer and see what he thinks about that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Time now for the five things you need to know for your new day.

Number one, the first confirmed Ebola case in New York City. Dr. Craig Spencer reported the symptoms Thursday, almost a week after returning from treating Ebola patients in Guinea. He is now in isolation at a New York City hospital.

The NYPD is concerned a violent hatchet attack could have links to terror. The attacker's social media activity is raising some red flags. Two officers injured in the attack are now recovering.

Shocking video this morning apparently showing the Ottawa gunman hijacking a car after he shot a soldier to death. Authorities are now looking into the shooter's suspected ties to Islamic extremists in Canada.

President Obama set to meet today with a national security team to discuss ISIS strategy. Hundreds of Kurdish Peshmerga fighters from Iraq now being allowed or will be allowed to travel through Turkey to help fight ISIS in Syria.

Federal prosecutors are looking into the maker of defective air bags that are behind major recalls. They want to know if Takata gave bad information to federal safety officials.

We're always updating the five things you need to know, so go to newdaycnn.com for the latest.

Chris.

CUOMO: All right, JB.

So as we wind down to the end of 2014, I can't believe the year has gone by so fast.

CAMEROTA: It's not over yet.

CUOMO: Oh. But we're going to start shining a light more brightly on our top 10 CNN heroes. You have the chance to vote for the one who inspires you the most at cnnheroes.com.

Now this week's hero is battling to keep African lions from going extinct. Meet Leela Hazzah.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LEELA HAZZAH, CNN HERO: Sixty years ago there are probably half a million lions in Africa. Today there's less than 30,000. If we don't do something soon, there are going to be no lions left maybe in 10, 15 years, who knows.

I spent a year living in the Masai (ph) community to understand why people were killing lions. It brings a huge amount of prestige to the warrior and they were kill lions in retaliation for livestock that were killed.

They started opening up and telling me stories. That's when it clicked. If we want to conserve wildlife, we have to integrate communities. Our organization Kirs (ph) Masai (ph) warriors and it converts lion killers into lion guardians.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): Here are two letters. HAZZAH: When we first hire lion guardians, they don't know how to read or write. We provide all of that literacy training and technical training. They track lions so they can keep very accurate ecological data on lion movements. We never really even imagined that we could transform these lion killer to the point where they would risk their own lives to stop other people from killing lions.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CUOMO: Wow, what an amazing mission, not just because of the need, but what it takes to find the response, teaching people English, taking them all the way - not English, teaching them how to speak and communicate with each other, all the way through saving lions.

CAMEROTA: And what beautiful video there was, all of the sort of Technicolor against the lion habitat there, it was really impressive.

CUOMO: The problem with this process is every time we meet one of these people, we think they should win. And I feel that way now about Leela. But she's just one of our top 10 honorees and one of them, of course, will become CNN Hero of the Year and receive $100,000 to further their work.

And, remember, the best part is, you decide who's going to be the number one hero. You go to cnnheroes.com online and on your mobile device if you want. You can vote once a day. But here's the important part. Every day you can vote as well. All 10 are going to be honored at "CNN Heroes, An All-Star Tribute" hosted by the man himself, Anderson Cooper, on Sunday, December 7th.

CAMEROTA: So vote every day. That's different than politics.

CUOMO: Yes, you should not vote more than once some say.

CAMEROTA: Vote every day usually, right. Good. Good point.

All right, there is more turmoil to tell you about in Ferguson, Missouri, after someone disclosed private information about the Michael Brown investigation. Who's behind the leak and what does the Brown family have to say? We'll find out, next.

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BERMAN: Welcome back to NEW DAY, everyone. Tensions so high in Ferguson, Missouri, as leaks about the Michael Brown case keep trickling out. Everyone is denying they are behind the leaks, but someone is behind them. Attorney General Eric Holder is said to be exasperated at the repeated breaches, but what does this mean for Michael Brown's family? What do they think of the leaks, what do they think about whether Darren Wilson will ultimately face charges?

Let's ask Anthony Gray, co-counselor for Michael Brown's family. He joins us this morning from St. Louis. Thank you so much. And, Counselor, if we can, let's separate the fact of the leaks - -

ANTHONY GRAY, CO-COUNSELOR, MICHAEL BROWN'S FAMILY: Good morning, John.

BERMAN: Let's separate the fact of the leaks from the alleged details that are inside these leaks. First, the fact that there are these leaks. How do you feel about that fact, and who do you think is behind them?

GRAY: Well, I don't know who is behind it. We are certainly disturbed by the leaks themselves. It just deepens the divide or distrust that the family initially came into this process with. They were assured a fair, an impartial and transparent investigation, and now we have these leaks, and that just doesn't help to reassure them that this process is fair and impartial.

BERMAN: I understand if there were leaks as part of this process, it does make you doubt the process. Let's talk about some of the alleged details that are inside these leaks, though. "The Washington Post" claiming that there were a half dozen African-American witnesses testifying to the grand jury that, among other things, they saw a fight for control of the gun in and around the car between Michael Brown and Officer Darren Wilson, that they saw Michael Brown move toward the officer. Do you doubt these claims?

GRAY: Well, not really, because all of that, in my opinion, is consistent with what Dorian Johnson said in the beginning. You have to keep in mind that we have two separate and distinct events that are occurring on this day. One is at the car and one is outside of the vehicle.

All the time we knew going into this that there was something that occurred at the vehicle. So, all of the witnesses are united regarding that fact. There's something that occurred. Whether or not there was a struggle over the weapon, we know that Mike Brown Jr. apparently was trying to get away. He was fighting for his life it sounds like. He had been assaulted by Darren Wilson by the door.

BERMAN: Sir, could I stop you? You said two things. You said two things. You said two things. You said we know that, dot dot dot there was a struggle, and then you say, you know, Michael Brown was trying to get away supposedly. What do we really know? Do you feel like you know all the facts?

GRAY: Okay. Right. And when I say that, I'm relying on those witnesses that I believe, and so those witnesses that other people believe will say what they know. Everybody is taking a side. You know, I'm an advocate for this family and for this cause, and when I say I know, I'm basing my movements, my decision off of the knowledge that I believe in.

And so perhaps if I say I believe that these things are the way that I just described them, you know, maybe that's a better way to describe it and better for people to swallow. But the fact of the matter is, we have an incident at the car, we have one away from the vehicle, and no one, even the six witnesses that claimed that Mike Brown Jr. was coming towards officer Darren Wilson has said he was bum rushing him, and that becomes a critical piece of evidence that's lacking that they claim that everybody's consistent about. BERMAN: Is it possible that, when all the facts come out, if all the

facts come out, that the facts could support that Officer Darren Wilson thought he was firing in self-defense?

GRAY: Not objectively. I don't care what amount of facts you come up with. You have a unarmed person who everyone describes as not having a weapon on him, you have an officer that's 20 to 25 feet away based on his own testimony, and he's firing at an unarmed, unaggressive individual. There's no tussle for the gun at the time that he shot and killed. There is no weapon in Mike Brown's hand that poses an immediate threat at the time he's killed. So objectively looking at this scenario, at the end of the day, you have an unarmed teen that is shot and killed in broad daylight, and I can't imagine any scenario under which that would be justified.

BERMAN: Well, that is a fact, as you say it, there was an unarmed teen shot and killed in broad daylight. What is still in doubt to many people is what led up to that moment. You say there are witnesses that you believe, that you have heard from and you believe. Is it possible that there are other witnesses out there talking to the grand jury that are giving information that you don't know about?

GRAY: That might be, John, but let's go back, because I don't want to get too far afield here and get distracted. We're at a probable cause phase. So, what that means is that if you have witnesses that are giving testimony that describes a crime, something that occurred as criminal in nature, well then you have a crime that has occurred by that set of witnesses.

Even if you have a group that contradicts that, now you have a fact question for the jury. You don't have a probable cause standard that you need to follow, because you have credible people that are saying one thing occurred that constituted a crime. So obviously, you're going to have some witnesses say they saw this and some may have seen something different. But that's for a jury to decide, not for the grand jury to decide.

All they need to decide is probable cause, and that's why I want to make sure that we're focused in our conversation.

BERMAN: Right.

GRAY: Because we're not trying to try the case at this phase and neither should the grand jury or the public try the case at this point.

BERMAN: Counselor Anthony Gray, thank you so much for being with us. I think what we all want are the facts to come out and justice to be done here. We appreciate your time. Thank you.

GRAY: Absolutely.

BERMAN: Alright, Ebola in New York City, a doctor hospitalized, but not before jogging, bowling, riding the subway. Did his actions, after he undoubtedly went to save lives in Africa, did his actions here put people at risk? Stay with us. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CUOMO: Ebola in New York City, what could be a new pattern in terror. There's a lot to report on. Let's get you to the "NEWSROOM" and Ms. Carol Costello.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks a lot, Chris. Have a great weekend. Thanks so much. NEWSROOM starts now.