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Obama Gets Laughs on "Colbert Report"; What Comes After Ongoing Protests?

Aired December 09, 2014 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: President Obama getting lots of laughs last night after he took over "The Colbert Report." The president poked fun at himself, GOP leader, even Stephen Colbert, who's known to mock the commander in chief daily. But the president also talked shop. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): With the White House scrambling to contain crises at home and overseas, President Obama sought some comic relief on "The Colbert Report," and the punchlines came with the purpose.

STEPHEN COLBERT, HOST, "THE COLBERT REPORT": Are you still president after the midterms? Because the Republicans are quite surprised that you're doing anything at all.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Look, the election didn't go as it - I would have liked. You know, I thought maybe a little correction there.

COLBERT: Yes. Yes.

OBAMA: I had a little thought bubble, but as president, the only office where you're elected by people all across the country, you've still got a lot of responsibilities.

ACOSTA: Making the case that he's no lake duck, president fielded questions on the economy, an area where he'd like more credit.

COLBERT: Why didn't you fix the economy before the midterm elections? You win, and then maybe you don't have to come on "The Colbert Report."

OBAMA: Actually, the truth is, the economy had been on a pretty good run. We've had 57 straight months of private sector job growth, over 10 million jobs created.

COLBERT: You've employed a lot of people -

OBAMA: We have.

COLBERT: Mostly as secretary of defense. OBAMA: Well -

COLBERT: But --

OBAMA: (INAUDIBLE). That's boosted our numbers a little bit.

COLBERT: Uh-huh.

ACOSTA: And on immigration.

OBAMA: If you don't agree with how we're approaching this executive action, there's an easy solution, pass a bill. If you pass a bill then we're going to be able to get things done.

CROWD: What do we want? Justice! When do we want it? Now!

ACOSTA: To respond to the growing protests in the streets after Ferguson and the chokehold death of Eric Garner, the president sat down with Black Entertainment Television. Mr. Obama said he supports the demonstrators, as long as they're peaceful.

OBAMA: A country's conscience sometimes has to be triggered by some inconvenience. And the value of peaceful protest, activism, organizing, it reminds the society, this is not yet done.

ACOSTA: And he said he could relate to young African-Americans who complain of police harassment.

CROWD: You can't breathe.

OBAMA: My mind went back to what it was like for me when I was 17, 18, 20. Part of the reason I got into politics was to figure out, how can I bridge some of those gaps in understanding so that the larger country understands, this is not just a black problem or a brown problem, this is an American problem.

ACOSTA: As for the key domestic issue that may have cost Democrats control of Congress, Obamacare, the president poked some fun at himself on "The Colbert Report," noting healthcare.gov's infamous failure to launch.

OBAMA: I think that's where Disney got the idea for "Frozen."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ACOSTA: And the president will be talking about his executive action on immigration later today when he sits down for some interviews with Spanish language TV networks. But on what is perhaps the most pressing issue facing this White House right now, and that is the release of this torture report coming out of Capitol Hill later today. Still no comment from the president. We'll be looking for that later today.

Alisyn and Chris.

CAMEROTA: Yes, that's two and a half hours from now that that gets released. CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: I mean that's going to be very heavy, no

question about it. However, Jim, I'm going to keep my tone very official, but I'm going to ask you now for some more funny. Can we have some more funny, please? We could use some more funny.

ACOSTA: Yes, I know, it's been that kind of week for the president. You know, he is trying to make light of what is some pretty tough news lately. But during "The Colbert Report" last night, you know, he did have a chance to sort of switch places with Stephen Colbert. You know, they did this in front of a live audience over at George Washington University here in Washington, D.C., and it was - it was funny to watch because the president basically took over the program. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: What part of the segment are we in now?

COLBERT: OK, if you want to take a --

OBAMA: What were you going to be doing?

COLBERT: I was about to do "the word," sir.

OBAMA: OK, "the word."

Even I have to admit that Obamacare is the law of the land. And while it's been - it's been politically divisive, there are things that people from both parties actually like about Obamacare. For instance, that children can stay on their parents' policies until age 26. Let's face it, even if Republicans somehow did repeal it, they'd have to replace it with their own health care plan. And once they touch it -- once they touch it, they own it. Then if anything goes wrong, suddenly everybody will be complaining about Mitch McConnellcare.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Good stuff. Sometimes you just got to laugh, right?

CUOMO: That's good.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: Great. Great. Genius.

CUOMO: Not easy.

CAMEROTA: Right. I know - no, he knows how to deliver those lines, yes.

PEREIRA: Excellent delivery.

ACOSTA: Yes.

CUOMO: Not easy. Not easy to do.

CAMEROTA: Right.

CUOMO: Walk-it-off.gov.

PEREIRA: Fracking the elderly.

CUOMO: Or fracking the elderly was good too. That's funny.

PEREIRA: I mean, I don't think your laugh -

ACOSTA: Yes, I loved it - I liked it when Colbert called the president Barackus-maximus (ph), the emperor of executive actions, you know?

CAMEROTA: There were a lot of good gems last night. All right, Jim, thanks so much for sharing that with us.

ACOSTA: It helps (ph).

CUOMO: It's not easy to laugh at yourself, but sometimes you have to. I think it's that -

PEREIRA: It's important to.

CUOMO: The laugh/cry thing is important.

CAMEROTA: Absolutely. You have been enjoying - you (INAUDIBLE) -- I haven't seen you laugh this hard for a few days.

PEREIRA: He's giggling, it's crazy. I know.

CUOMO: Oh, that's funny.

PEREIRA: Yes.

CAMEROTA: Nicely done.

All right. Well, protests continue in the wake of the Eric Garner and Michael Brown grand jury decision. So we have a group of thinkers, all of them provocative, who are going to join us for a conversation about what needs to happen now.

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CUOMO: All right, welcome back to NEW DAY.

We've been discussing the ongoing protest over decisions not to indict two police officers in the deaths, of course, of Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri, and Eric Garner here in New York City. But there have been a lot of cases. You've heard about them in the past. They're bubbling back up now. And the question is, what do we do with what's being experienced right now? Why are we where we are? And where do we go from here? Let's discuss it. Let's bring in CNN political commentator and New York Times op-ed columnist Mr. Charles Blow. We also have CNN's senior legal analyst and former prosecutor Jeffrey Toobin.

Gentlemen, thank you.

Let's start with why we are here and then get to the harder question of where we go from here. Legally, all right, when we were talking about the Michael Brown case, now a lot of these suggestions people aren't going to like. Put it to the side for this conversation. We were not surprised that Officer Darren Wilson was not going to be indicted in that case, and it had nothing to do with race, nothing to do with politics, but just on the law and the facts itself. Is that true?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: I thought so. I mean I thought that was a hard case for the grand jury.

CUOMO: Because?

TOOBIN: Because you had a life and death confrontation in the car where a gun was fired - a police officer's gun was fired twice. There was a follow-up confrontation. Witnesses told conflicting stories. And juries, grand juries included, traditionally, who include, you know, ordinary people from the community, are sympathetic to police officers operating in a dangerous world.

CUOMO: There were forensics involved also, which helped bolster the officer's story. And yet it didn't feel right to people, black, white, green, yellow, left, right, it didn't feel right, why?

CHARLES BLOW, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I think that you take it into the larger context, that it is a drumbeat. People feel like this kind of morbid drumbeat of young men dying at the hands of -- particularly unarmed young men, black men, dying at the hands of police officers, and although the cases, all of them, are unique and you can debate each of them on their merits, there is a certain rhythm to it that is very disturbing. And I think that even in the larger context where people say, you know, step back, look at history as a whole and things have certainly gotten better, but if you are a young person in America today, you only know your life experiences. You can only really experience your own life experience, right? And we all expect things like race relations to always be on the upward swing. The momentum is always towards the better.

If they get -- feel in any particular moment, and particularly this moment, that things are not necessarily going in the right direction, they - that is a real feeling for them. When they say like things feel like it's getting worse, it's not a historical argument that they're making that now -- things are now better than they were in the Jim Crowe or slavery or, you know, when there were massive lynchings across the country.

CUOMO: But is it - but is it true or are we duping the media? Are we duping people, specifically young African-American or black people, whatever the -- you want to use as a correct term right now, into thinking that it's getting worse because you cover Michael Brown as if it were a tossup, even if legally it were not?

TOOBIN: No, I don't think so because the stories are not just about black people being shot by cops. It's about the experience of African- Americans with the police generally. It's about, you know, DWB, driving while black. People getting stopped by cops. People getting hassled by cops. It's not just about shooting. And, you know, I don't think, whether it's statistically or

anecdotally, you can deny that African-Americans have a different experience with the police than white people. And that's - and that is a legitimate story under all circumstances.

CUOMO: But what's the whisper? The whisper is, whether they want to say it to you or not, right? Because we always talk about what African-American people feel but they don't say, it's happening the other way also. You're hearing, don't mess with a cop and you don't get hurt. Don't commit crimes and you don't have to worry about your exchanges with police. That's a cultural affect.

BLOW: But that's actually not even the case. So you take New York City for instance, people say well, don't mess with the cops and you won't have to deal with them. That's not the case. We had stop and frisk for years, we had millions of people stopped and frisked, and nine out of ten of them never received a summons, never were arrested for anything. They were not going out to do something bad and then therefore run into police. Police were running into them regularly, kind of systemically and that is the problem.

CUOMO: Strategically.

BLOW: Exactly. That argument that if you were not doing something wrong, you would never have encountered a cop actually is a fallacy.

CUOMO: So are we putting too much pressure on these cases? Because Michael Brown, you could suggest, nobody is going to argue reasonably with a good heart, hey, this needed to happen, right? It's horrible any way you look at it, but in terms of the justification of it, is it the wrong case to hang these expectations of it being a metaphor for the problem?

TOOBIN: I think there is always a problem with seeing individual cases as a metaphor for the larger criminal justice system. You know, we talked about O.J. Simpson as a metaphor. O.J. Simpson was a wildly aberrational case every respect, but the way we all understand the world is not through statistics, it's through stories. And we see these stories and we respond to them. Of course, it is more appropriate in some intellectual way to respond to the statistics that show black people are more likely to be stopped, hassled by the police, but who responds to the statistics? People respond to stories, but stories are complicated and they are often not illustrative of what we think they are.

CUOMO: So, what do we do? You have two very different realities. I think one of the troubling things right now is that as the protests go on, there is inherent division that's being exacerbated, being made worse, not being made better. There's more noise, but not necessarily more attention and more light. So what do we do? You have these two different schools of thought. It's worse for us as blacks and whites, you don't get it. And then you have this other side that well, I don't know that it is, I think it's more about what you do in your communities and what we do in ours. Where do we go from here?

BLOW: Well, I think we have to look at all of the sorts of things that surround the case like the Eric Garner case. It is not simply about the police officer and Eric Garner in the moment where he puts his arm around his neck and then, you know, that series of events leads to taking his life. It is not simply about the grand jury and whether or not they should have taken action in this case or not, although those are real things, but you have to look at all the systemic problems, which is part of what you were getting at. You know, you have this, the broken windows policy that is part of the policing in New York City, and we have to say --

CUOMO: They say that was a good thing, it lowered crime.

BLOW: Well, here's the question, is there a point at which a good thing starts to produce diminishing returns? Is there a point at which a good thing becomes a bad thing because in effect, you are both using tremendous amounts of resources to do it, even this officer who was involved in this had done this, was really heavily involved in these kinds of cases. Are those things disproportionately affecting poor and minority neighborhoods, you know?

CUOMO: But that's where the crime is.

BLOW: Well, no - -

CUOMO: And then the other side says but you're having lower crime where you live, you should be happy.

BLOW: Here is the problem, Chris. Don't tell people to be happy when people are dying. That's really a hard - -

CUOMO: But that's, but you know that's the opposite side of it.

BLOW: I'm sorry, but - - Well, they shouldn't say that. This is what small groups of bad actors have a huge impact on perceptions. That is very small numbers of people are engaged in violent crime. They have a huge impact on perceptions of what neighborhoods are dangerous. Most of those people in those neighborhoods are just trying to raise their families.

CUOMO: True.

BLOW: And go to work and whatever. Small groups of officers also who are bad actors --

CUOMO: We're not hearing that as much right now.

BLOW: -- have a huge impact on perceptions of policing. So it's - - WNYC did a report recently. Police use, one measure they use of a person who may be engaged in too much police aggression is whether or not they say that people are resisting arrest, right? So if you keep saying people are resisting arrest, you're probably just using too much force and just using it as a shield. Only 5 percent of officers in New York City were responsible for like 40 percent of all resisting arrest charges. It is probably a very small group of people who are doing most of the bad, and that is a perceptual problem.

CUOMO: Right. Let's discuss that, though, because right now, you know, you go out there with the protesters, they're talking about all cops, they're talking about white supremacy. You have, you know, big groups of white students looking at cops and, you know, and saying what are you going to do to me today, even though they probably never had a negative experience in their lives until they provoked one right there? But we're not hearing that. We're not saying, hey, by the way, all cops are good. We do, but we're doing it low now, and is that a mistake? Is that a mistake to now have the pendulum swing the other way and say look at this culture of policing everywhere and how bad it is, and not give the benefit of the doubt to the bigger reality about police?

TOOBIN: Well, you know, it's very hard to have a complicated protest. You know, protests are about expressing things.

CUOMO: But it's how we cover it, too.

TOOBIN: It is how we cover it, but also I think, you know, I think we do a pretty good job of underlying the complexities. But if I could just inject one note of caution about the whole subject. You know, two years ago, we spent a lot of time talking about Occupy Wall Street, and Occupy Wall Street was going to be a big force, and people were going to talk about inequality, and it sort of petered out, disappeared more or less. I have the question of whether these protests will meet the same fate, because there is not a single organizing goal of these protests, and in the absence of a goal, it's very hard to maintain them. So I just inject a note of caution, maybe I'm wrong, that this moment will pass and it will recede in people's mind.

BLOW: I don't know if has to be, you know, a cautionary note. I think that expressions of pain often come before policies. So, in this moment it really is about kind of an exhaling of a collective sense that, you know, this is the last straw. We just, we can't take it anymore. We just have to be heard, and I think people will do that before policy initiatives are undertaken. I even believe Occupy Wall Street has a legacy. I think we talk much more now about income inequality than we ever have in this country, and we would never have done that without them.

CUOMO: You have a good, bad news balance and we'll leave it on that. And I thank you gentlemen very much for your ideas on this. The good news is there is attention to it right now, it is being discussed. The bad news is that as painful as this period is, this is the easy part because we're in crisis. And once you're not in crisis and there's a new crisis, will we sustain the energy we need to have the discussion about the solutions that we obviously need as evidenced by the problems we're seeing right now? Charles Blow, Professor Toobin, always a pleasure. Alisyn?

CAMEROTA: All right, Chris, let's talk about the best of humanity now. Three Salvation Army buckets, three amazing donations. We're not talking about spare change here, we'll tell you about the generosity from people who did not want any credit. That Good Stuff is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) CUOMO: All right, it's time for the Good Stuff. We have a two-for for you today. A little one, but a nice one. Two incredible gifts dropped off at a Salvation Army in two different places.

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CUOMO (voice-over): Massachusetts an anonymous woman dropped her wedding rings in a bucket in honor of her late husband. She also left a note that said, "I hope that the proceeds go to help needy kids."

DREW FORSTER, SALVATION ARMY COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Sometimes someone will tell a bell ringer. In this case, this donor wanted to remain anonymous, but gave this really remarkable, personal sacrificial gift with a specific need in mind to help children this Christmas.

CUOMO: Often those who give the most want the least recognition, by the way. In Florida, an anonymous donor dropped not one, but two antique Mexican coins in the buckets. The face value is 100 pesos. Actual worth $1,400 hundred each.

BRANDON STEWART, SALVATION ARMY: After we received the first gold piece, that would translate into roughly 800 meals for our feeding program here.

CUOMO: 800 meals, a reminder that it doesn't take much to do a lot of good. It's the season to give, please take it seriously.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CUOMO (on camera): All right, and here's our second offering here, right? We recently sat down with Angelina Jolie, but very different, very different situation.

(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)

CUOMO (voice-over): She's directing a movie called "Unbroken." I will tell you this, if you haven't seen the book, this is one of the greatest survival stories ever told. Louis Zamperini is his name, and I'm not just saying this because he's an Italian. He was a World War II POW. He survived a record 47 days in a raft, okay? And that's the least of it. He was captured by the Japanese, two and a half years surviving some of the worst abuse anyone could ever endure.

(END VIDEOCLIP)

CUOMO (on camera): Oh, and by the way, he was one of the fastest milers ever in American history. So, she decides to take on this movie, and it winds up being her choices, what to tell and what not, become about her in a way that nothing else she's ever done is like that. So, we talked to her about it. Take a look at it.

(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)

CUOMO: The idea of surviving was difficult. You've done it in your own life. I mean, when you take on the big "C" that's the fear of everybody, and that's the key to survival, right? Is knowing that you can do it. Do you hope that that comes out of that, that whatever someone's struggle is, if they're dealing with what you dealt with - -

ANGELINA JOLIE, ACTRESS: Absolutely.

CUOMO: -- with your health that they see look at this guy.

JOLIE: Yes.

CUOMO: It's so possible.

JOLIE: Yes, yes. It's not an accident that I was preparing, I had all of my boards up, and I was preparing to direct the film when I made the choice to have my surgery. Not an accident, you know?

CUOMO: You had the film boards up while you were going through your own thing?

JOLIE: I was - - I had my - - I was in the middle of, yes, as I was going through the stages of my surgeries when I was in prep. Yes, I was fighting to get the green light, and then I got the green light during it. But through the process was when I was researching him, and studying him, and putting the boards up, and sitting in my office with all the - - And that's what I did during that time frame.

CUOMO: Preparatory for the - -

(END VIDEOCLIP)

CUOMO: So, she's going to talk to us about this a lot more tomorrow.

CAMEROTA: That sounds like a personal interview. You got a really personal glimpse out of her.

CUOMO: Well, it's about what she wants to talk about, and it's very interesting that there's a message in the choices she made in this movie and the story itself is amazing. The guy you just saw hitting him with the stick is a Japanese pop star. He makes his debut in this film.

PEREIRA: Cannot wait.

CUOMO: So there's huge levels of it. I was happy to do the interview. A lot of new this morning, let's get you to the "NEWSROOM" with Poppy Harlow, in for Carol Costello. Hello, Poppy.

PEREIRA: Hi, Poppy.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Hi, guys. Good morning, good to see you. A lot of news straight ahead. NEWSROOM starts right now.