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Shia Group Possibly Effecting Coup in Yemen; President to Propose Tax Policies in State of the Union Address; The Relationship Between the Muslim Religion and Terrorism

Aired January 19, 2015 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: It's Monday, January 19th, just before 8:00 in the east. And at this hour heavily armed guards fanning out across Europe in a large scale hunt for terrorist cells. Five Belgians nationals already in custody suspected of working with a terror organization to murder police officers. Two other suspects are in French custody.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: And investigators on the hunt for two potential accomplices of the Paris terrorists whose DNA has been linked to the belongings of the kosher market gunmen, this as European foreign ministers gather today to discuss fighting terrorism. CNN has every angle of this covered. Let's begin with Ivan Watson. He is live for us in Brussels. What do we know this morning, Ivan?

IVAN WATSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Alisyn, Belgian authorities have been very tight-lipped about the suspects that they've arrested and the suspects that they have killed in a police raid last Thursday against a suspected jihadi cell that they claim was planning attacks on Belgian police. Two suspects were killed in a gun battle with police Thursday night. A third was arrested while apparently trying to jump out of the window to escape the apartment where the gun battle took place.

We spoke with the defense attorney for this suspect who is now in Belgian custody. He identified him as a 25-year-old Belgian of Moroccan descent. The defense attorney tells me that his client is innocent of current charges he's facing for participation in a terrorist organization, for possession of weapons and explosives and plans for armed rebellion. He says that this young man was actually a licensed security guard who lived here in Brussels, and the defense attorney says his client was only in the apartment that was raided by police where the gun battle broke out because he was trying to deliver a pair of Nike sneakers to one of the suspects who subsequently was killed while shooting back at Belgian police.

We're starting to get a profile of one of these suspects and hoping to learn more about other suspects arrested in Belgian, in France, and Greece, all awaiting extradition back to Belgian in connection with this alleged jihadi plot. Alisyn?

CAMEROTA: OK, Ivan Watson, thanks so much for that.

Meanwhile, authorities in France searching for two people linked by DNA to the alleged kosher market gunman Amedy Coulibaly. Three women held in connection with the terror attack have been released. Nine others remain in custody. CNN's Nic Robertson is following developments for us live in Paris. What do we know, Nic?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Alisyn, why are these two suspects, the two sets of DNA so important to the police? Some of that DNA belonging to one of these people was found on a weapon in Coulibaly's apartment. It was found on a gun magazine clip containing bullets. So the suspicion of the police there is that this person at the very least knew Coulibaly was armed and potentially dangerous, and concern this person may also have weapons, may be on the loose, armed and dangerous.

The second set of DNA in a vehicle believed to have been used by Coulibaly to get to that kosher supermarket where he later killed four people, again an indication the potential for an accomplice there who knew what was happening. This person also could be on the loose and could be dangerous.

How are the French authorities handling this? The French public believes apparently that they are handling it well. An opinion poll over the weekend shows the French president, Hollande, has gone up 21 points in popularity and the French prime minister too has jumped up 17 points in popularity. Chris?

CUOMO: All right, Nic, thank you very much for the reporting.

We turn to Yemen. There are growing concerns that al Qaeda's branch in Yemen which claimed responsibility, you'll remember, for the "Charlie Hebdo" attack may benefit from growing instability there. An attempted coup by this organization called the Houthi Shiite political faction, that happened overnight. It sent Yemen's prime minister into hiding. The situation is so dire a U.S. official says it is ready to advocate the embassy in Yemen, quote, "on short notice." Senior international correspondent Nick Paton Walsh is only western TV journalist in Yemen which speaks to the violence of the situation and his commitment to the story. He has the very latest.

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Chris, we're still hearing the thought of shutting behind us, and that's all around the presidential administration building. That came under attack, we're told, by presidential officials who are calling this really an attack at a coup by the Houthi rebel movement there. They're Shia. They've been very successful in organizing their tribes and militia. They moved into the capital months ago.

The crisis really started 48 months ago, the chief of staff of the president being kidnapped. Key officials worried they might be next. The Houthis saying, yes, we have detained that chief of staff. The president's men put in a security plan that angered the Houthis. They wanted some of the roads the president's men had closed opened. Clashes began. We're not sure who started what. We do know there's been heavy shelling around the presidential administration.

There have been calls for a ceasefire, for international intervention. But in that meeting to organize the ceasefire, the prime minister came out of it and his convoy came out under attack. As the Houthi representative came out of that meeting he too came under attack. The state TV, state media agency we're told by the minister of I think are now being controlled by Houthis. The Houthis deny that. The Houthis say they're looking to stop a constitution being implemented they don't agree with, but really it seems like a battle for power on the streets is going to decide who is in charge at Yemen. Deeply troubling times, Chris, because at the end of the day the more Yemen spirals into chaos the greater space Al Qaeda has to work with here, the bigger foothold they have in a failed state and effectively the greater chance they have now of launching attacks against the west. Back to you, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK, Nick, thanks so much for that.

Let's talk about what's going on at home. The president is set to reveal sweeping new tax proposals to help middle class Americans. Some call this a Robin Hood plan because there are tax breaks for the middle paid for with tax hikes on the wealthy and fee hikes on big banks. The plan will be a highlight of tomorrow's State of the Union address, but does it have a prayer of passing the Republican controlled Congress? David Simas is a White House deputy senior advisor. He joins us live this morning. Good morning, David.

DAVID SIMAS, WHITE HOUSE DEPUTY SENIOR ADVISOR: Good morning, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Let me put up on screen for our viewers what we understand is in the president's plan. It will increase the taxes on couples who earn half-a-million dollars a year or more. There will also be fees on large financial institutions. The president says it will raise $320 billion over 10 years. Now, it's the first tenet there, David, those tax increases on the wealthy that Republicans have long said that they don't believe would help and that they would fight. So why start there?

SIMAS: Alisyn, first of all, many of the proposals that the president is putting forward actually come from Republicans. The idea on financial fees is very similar to one put forward by David Kemp. The 28 percent on capital gains goes back to the rate it was under Ronald Reagan. And so, look, many of these ideas have come forward from Republicans in the past.

But here's why it's important to do. It's important for us to find every single way that we can to provide some relief for middle class families because as the economy finally after six years gets to the point where people are beginning to feel it, we need to make sure we lean in so that folks have a little bit more money at the end of the week, and, as importantly, that they have all the opportunities they have to get ahead. And so this is why we call this middle class economics and that will be the focus tomorrow night.

CAMEROTA: David, as I'm sure you're aware, Mitt Romney is considering another run for the White House and he says it is actually President Obama who has increased the poverty rate in the United States. Here is what Mitt Romney said Friday night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) MITT ROMNEY, (R) FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Under President Obama, the rich have gotten richer, income inequality has gotten worse, and there are more people in poverty in America than ever before.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: There are more people living in poverty now than ever before. How does the White House counter that?

SIMAS: So tomorrow is the sixth anniversary of when the president took office when there were 800,000 people losing their jobs per month, when we didn't know whether or not we were going into a depression rather than a recession. The policies that the president put in place dug the country out of the hole it was in, and last year, saw the fastest job creation since the late 1990s. And for the first time over this period of time, wages are beginning to increase.

I would just say relative to what Governor Romney said, in 2012, he said that if he were elected president by the end of his term unemployment would get down to six percent. It's now at 5.6 percent and falling. And so we're finally in a position because of the policies this president put in place to move from the recovery to making sure that the economy works for everyone and not just a few folks at the top.

CAMEROTA: And yet, David, let me show you the graph from the U.S. Census Bureau that seems to defy what you're saying. Here is the poverty rate for the past 50 years. You can see it goes up and down. However, since the president was elected in 2008, it has just gone up. And now 45.3 million people are living in poverty and that is more than any time in our recent history. So while you can say the trend is looking good, can't you also say what Mitt Romney is claiming, which is the president's policies certainly have not helped lift people out of poverty yet?

SIMAS: Alisyn, I think anyone who is fair understands the hole this country was in and the work that we've done to get it out. Now, let's just flip it around. When you have people making minimum wage in this country and that wage has not gone up for years and you have Republicans in Congress who are saying that they would never support a minimum wage, Alisyn, that would lift 4 million people out of poverty overnight and have a ripple effect throughout the economy.

And so it's insufficient to simply every four years or periodically come back and express concern for poverty. What this president has focused on is opportunity for everyone, which means increasing the minimum wage, which means making sure that if you want to get a new skill you can go back to community college, which means that if you're a two-earner family, you get a little bit more money in your pocket rather than simply fighting tooth and nail to protect loopholes in the corporate tax code and trust fund loopholes, which apparently is one some of our friends on the other side would rather focus on.

CAMEROTA: So let's get back to our first point, and that is tax increases on the wealthy. The Republicans have always said that's a non-starter for them. So is this part of the plan just an exercise in futility?

SIMAS: No, Alisyn, just the opposite. Look, the State of the Union is an opportunity for the president to lay out his vision, to put forward his proposals. Republicans now in charge of Congress will have an opportunity to put forward their proposals. As I said at the beginning, many of the ideas that we're presenting actually come from them. And so we hope that people of good will sit across the table, work together, and focus on middle class economic growth. And so this is the beginning of a process and we hope that it's fruitful.

CAMEROTA: David, we've had some breaking news this morning out of Yemen. We understand from our correspondents on the ground that there's been an attempted coup at the presidential palace. Can you tell us anything about that and if any U.S. personnel are in danger?

SIMAS: Alisyn, I don't have anything to add to that, but I'm sure that throughout the course of the day you'll have some of my colleagues who will be prepared to respond to that.

CAMEROTA: OK, David Simas, thanks so much for all the information on the president's plan. Nice to see you.

SIMAS: Thanks, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK, also we will have the GOP reaction to the president's expected proposal later this hour when joined live by the Tennessee Republican Congresswoman Diane Black so stick around for that. Over to Chris.

CUOMO: All right, here's some news. Israel has busted the first known ISIS terror cell inside its borders. Seven people arrested. The country's intelligence agency said the suspects confessed to belonging to the extremist group. Officials there say the men were caught just before executing an attack and were practicing on animals to learn how to behead humans.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: The NSA reportedly had knowledge of North Korea's cyber hacking capabilities prior to the massive breach at Sony Pictures. According to the "New York Times," the NSA had already penetrated North Korea's secure computer network back in 2010. This report raising questions about what the NSA knew and why Sony was not warned. The evidence gathered by the NSA is a major reason why the White House accuses North Korea of being behind that Sony Pictures hack.

CAMEROTA: Despite suffering what many thought was a career ending injury, Lindsey Vonn made history today with his 63 career Alpine World Cup victor. The 2010 Olympic skied perfectly, finishing at one minute, 27 seconds a super-g event in Italy. Her boyfriend, Tiger Woods, surprised her at the finish line. The previous record of 62 wins belonged to an Austrian skier and it stood for 35 years. What a comeback!

PEREIRA: Talk about historic.

CAMEROTA: Wow! PEREIRA: It had stood for 35 years. Imagine that, a record that had

previously not been beat for that long. It's amazing.

CUOMO: And done by somebody who has blown out her knee more than once.

PEREIRA: We've of the painful knees, we unite with you, Lindsey Vonn. Well done.

CUOMO: Right. You're like never the same. She comes back and good or better than before. That's a hero.

PEREIRA: All right, with threats of terrorism rising across Europe, moderate Muslim leaders are speaking out. Are there enough Muslim voices, though, denouncing extremism? We'll dig deeper next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CUOMO: Welcome back. ISIS, al Qaeda, Boko Haram. What do they all share in common? Well, they all claim to be acting in the name of Islam. That drives fears about the religion of some 1.62 billion people on this planet. Now, you hear from officials they're not to be mentioned as Muslims, that they should be called terrorists, and organizations like the council on American Islamic Relations and the Islamic Society of North America have both strongly condemned terrorism and said that is not what Islam is about. But do Muslims even need to condemn these acts at all, is that fair? Let's discuss.

We have Ahmed Shihab-Eldin, he's a journalist and professor at Columbia University, and Mr. Dean Obeidallah, friend of the show, political comedian, and contributor for "The Daily Beast." Gentlemen, thank you for being here. This is in the air, okay? Something happens, they come to you Muslims, and they say, look at what your brothers and sisters are doing, what is it with you people? Is that fair?

AHMED SHIHAB-ELDIN, JOURNALIST: I don't think it's fair, I don't think it's productive, and I think the real conversation that we should be having is why do we continue to have this interrogation of the nature of all Muslims? You know, every time this happens Muslims do condemn this, we've seen Grand Muftis condemn this, we've seen even Hezbollah and Hamas condemn this, if you will, I mean that in it's own way is a hypocrisy.

And I think the real conversation we should be having is why are these things happening? You know, what leads to this? What about the cycle of violence, what about the fact that two of the brothers, you know, behind the "Charlie Hebdo" attack said in 2004 that what motivated them to wage jihad, if you will, is the fact that they saw the Abu Ghraib torture photos. You know, half a million people have died in Iraq. You know, Muslims in France, which make up 8 to 10% of the population, are alienated. They are, you know, discriminated against in education, in public life, and I think it's important to note that extremism thrives on extremism. We don't see these same calls when there are Christians, Christian extremists if you will, who bomb abortion clinics, or in Norway, such as Anders Breivik. CAMEROTA: You don't make all Christians have to explain the acts of a few. But, Dean, what do you say to people like Bill Maher who said when there's this many bad apples in the bunch, maybe the whole orchard is rotten. That's a sentiment that not just Bill Maher thinks, that there's a feeling that something must be rotten with Islam.

DEAN OBEIDALLAH, CONTRIBUTOR, "THE DAILY BEAST": It's a perception, and fighting perception is probably harder than fighting the actual facts that's going on. I've written many articles for "The Daily Beast" talking about facts, about statistics that in the E.U. the last five years only 2% of all terrorist attacks have been perpetrated by Islamic terrorists, 2%. And in America, since 9/11 until now, 37 Americans have been killed by terrorism on Islamic nature, 37, that's it. Meanwhile, 30 people a day are killed by gun violence in this country, we're kind of quiet about that. But the perception is you see image after image, Boko Haram, the Saranoff brothers (ph), ISIS, al Qaeda, and I understand, and we talked about this Friday, with over 6% of Americans not knowing a Muslim friend there's no human counterbalance. All you see is negative drum beat after drum beat.

And I used to be of the mindset we did not have to condemn terrorism. There's a split in our community, do you condemn it or not? And then I did this documentary, "The Muslims are Coming," we went to South and the West. We met people. The same issue came up everywhere from really good people. Why don't we hear you condemning terrorism more? So, that was a wakeup call for me that perhaps - -

(CROSSTALK)

CAMEROTA: You believe now you do need to.

CUOMO: But there's a counter-balance to it. You know, when you said, Dean, and we talked, we did your piece here, people should read it about the numbers, when you factor in who's trying to kill Americans, right, terrorists in the name of Islam jump to the top of the list. And when you say, hey, let's talk about why it's happening, no matter how subtly you put it, it sounds like you're justifying the actions of the terrorists, here's why they're trying to kill you, and people don't want to hear that.

SHIHAB-ELDIN: No, people don't want to hear that, people don't want to have conversations about why so many young, alienated youth might be, you know - - We talk about how can we prevent the next attack? Well, there are ways to prevent it by talking about what's actually motivating them versus what Dean is, you know, outlining, which is this notion of this perception that Muslims are perpetually in a clash with, you know, Western secular values.

That's not what this is about. Often times this is about revenge, whether rightfully or wrongfully, in the eyes of the people who do this. So, let's have a more candid conversation and, just quickly to answer your question even though you put it to Dean, I think it should be said that there's an element of racism and bigotry when we talk about, you know, what Bill Maher says sometimes or what certain people say when they say, well, you know this reflects on all Muslims. You know, this happens so much because, as Dean outlined, this is something that has been driven by the fact that the media, not just the news media, for better or worse since 9/11 has kind of adopted this Bush doctrine of painting Muslims as inherently evil. It happens in news and it happens in entertainment, unfortunately.

CAMEROTA: And, frankly, people are speaking out against it, and there are imams who speak out against it, and we in the media do need to do a better job of covering it to give the impression that people are speaking out against it. There were 120 Muslim scholars who wrote an open letter to al-Baghdadi, telling him to stop the behavior, the sickening behavior of ISIS. And then there was the Rotterdam mayor in the Netherlands who spoke very frankly. Here's what he said to the terrorists. I'll read it to you.

CUOMO: Frankly is a nice way to put it.

CAMEROTA: Yes, it is, it gets a little obscene, so stand by. "If you do not like freedom, in heaven's name pack your bags and leave. Be honest with yourself and do not go and kill innocent journalists. And if you do not like it here because humorists you do not like make a newspaper, may I then say you can blank off."

People are speaking out, but we don't always hear about them.

OBEIDALLAH: It's, I think, part of the nature of media, and I'm not critical, I'm part of it. Sensational sells, it gets ratings. New terror alert, there's a terror threat, you can go on and on. How often are you going to have Muslims on talking like this kind of conversation where we denounce terrorism, it's not about our freedom. We can go through our faith and tell you why it's not part of our faith, that's not the most compelling conversation. Maybe five minutes, ten minutes - -

CUOMO: It's also - -

(CROSSTALK)

CUOMO: I'll tell you what, that's the point. It's not productive for two reasons. One, you have the optics of perception and how you move the needle with what Americans and the uninitiated think about the faith. Now you have another one. You two, as far as I know, you're not controlling any terrorists. This state-sponsored terrorism where these countries are, those leaders, how they oppress their people, it's not about, you know, the United States oppressing Muslims, what do those heads of state do? Where are the allies of the United States condemning those individuals? What about that piece?

SHIHAB-ELDIN: No, it's certainly right to bring up the hypocrisy. You know, one of the images that was circulating on Sunday during that big march was a guy, a French guy, who had written a sign that said, "I am marching in solidarity with condemning the attacks, but I'm aware of the confusion and hypocrisy of the situation," pointing to some of those hypocritical notions of, you know, the West selectively choosing when to actually condemn Islamic extremism, if you will, to use the term now that we've learned that the White House is not using I think for the sake of trying to counter - - (CROSSTALK)

SHIHAB-ELDIN: I don't necessarily know if it helps, I understand why they're doing it. I think that it's trying to counter, you know, a decade and however many years of constantly portraying terrorism, or equating terrorism, with Islam solely.

OBEIDALLAH: But, don't you think on some level, though, if you use Islamic terrorism it's helping ISIS and al Qaeda recruit, because someone who might be disenfranchised, might be alienated, goes oh, this is just a strain of Islam and I want to be part of this radical strain, as opposed to there's mainstream Muslims, and then there's terrorists who will kill me and you just as quick as anyone. They can care if - - We talk about a (INAUDIBLE). Overwhelming, the victims of ISIS and al Qaeda are Muslims, they're killing us, so standing up is one thing, but they're killing - -slaughtering Muslim women and children, and I wish that would get more media coverage, too.

SHIHAB-ELDIN: And when this is framed as a war between Islam and the West, you know, between us and them, if you will, as it has been since 9/11, it's really problematic because not only are more Muslims victims of this kind of extremist violence, more Muslims are fighting this on a daily basis. The same day we saw those attacks on Sunday in Yemen outside of a police academy 35 people were killed, and, you know, you don't necessarily see the same kind of sympathy, and empathy, and solidarity against this. So, if this is us and them, why are they fighting us? This is also a war on Islam.

CAMEROTA: And we're going to be talking about that very thing tonight with both of you. We're going to be having- - continuing this conversation. Dean, Ahmed, thanks so much for coming in.

SHIHAB-ELDIN: Pleasure to be here.

CAMEROTA: We're been having this conversation a lot on NEW DAY, and it is so important to have voices like yours. Let us know what you all think. You can tweet us @NEWDAY, you can go to Facebook, also, Facebook.com/NEWDAY, and we look forward to the conversation tonight, we hope you'll join us at 9:00 pm.

CUOMO: And, again, we're talking about how we're going to keep covering this. We're going to take an in depth look at the battle against terrorism tonight, not just for our special, but two primetime specials. At 9:00, our brother, Jake Tapper, is going to go inside the Paris attacks, show you what we've learned and what will be used going forward. And then, as we've been telling you, at 9:30, Alisyn and I will bring you "The War Within Islam," and in depth look at violent extremism and, more importantly, how can we stop it.

Mick?

PEREIRA: All right, another top story we're watching, tax cuts to lift the middle class, tax hikes on wealthy Americans. That's President Obama's plan, but how will Republicans respond? We're going to talk with a GOP member of the House Budget Committee next.

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