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Manhunt on for Gunmen in Museum Massacre; White House Condemns Tunisia Terror Attack; Witness Recounts Museum Massacre; UVA Student's Violent Arrest Sparks Protests; What Happened to Kathie McCormick Durst? Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired March 19, 2015 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ARWA DAMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: More than 20 others were injured in the attack, including this man -- visited in the hospital, by Tunisia's president.

[07:00:08] This morning, concern the brazen attack could have been the work of ISIS supporters. The opening of a new front for their violence in North Africa. Out of the 20,000 foreigners that have joined the fight in Iraq and Syria, a British think tank says up to 3,000 of them are from Tunisia, the largest number from any country.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're seeing really, I think Northern Africa is falling now, not just to al Qaeda affiliates, but now to ISIS.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Well the White House vowing to stand by Tunisia in its battle with terrorism. The Obama administration condemning the museum attack and offering help to find the killers.

Let's bring in CNN's White House correspondent, Michelle Kosinski. What are they saying this morning, Michelle?

MICHELLE KOSINSKI, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Alisyn.

Those people murdered in that museum came from at least eight countries. I'm told none of them were American. But immediately after this attack, U.S. officials were in touch with their Tunisian counterparts, not only to offer condolences, but to offer help and say that the U.S. is ready with any assistance that might be needed, to share information, as well.

The White House said that the U.S. is proud to cooperate with Tunisia in counterterrorism and other security issues and will continue to stand with Tunisia in fighting violent terror. Even the first lady, who's traveling in Japan, made a statement on this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHELLE OBAMA, FIRST LADY OF THE UNITED STATES: Our hearts go out to the loved ones of those who were lost here in Japan and around the world. They are very much in our thoughts and prayers today.

(END VIDEO CLIP) KOSINSKI: While she was traveling there, we saw the U.S. ambassador

to Japan, Caroline Kennedy, who herself has gotten death threats recently. There have been other threats around the region that necessitated the closing of the embassy in Yemen. Just this week, temporary closures in Saudi Arabia and Djibouti.

So it was interesting, following this attack in Tunisia, there was no threat that caused the closure, any change in status to the embassy there. These terrorists were only targeting these tourists. A soft target.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: And so many of them killed. A horrifying incident to be sure. Thank you so much for that, Michelle.

We want to take you to Tunis right now. Joining us now, a member of the Tunisian parliament, Sabrine Ghoubatini, who was at a meeting in Parliament very, very close by when that shooting happened. Also joining us, a former member of parliament, Emna Ben Mustapha Ben Arab, and there's also a professor of American studies at the University of Sfax, Tunisia.

Ladies, thank you so much for joining us. Sabrine, I think we need to speak with you first and ask you how are you after such a horrifying, terrifying and tragic ordeal?

SABRINE GHOUBATINI, MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT, TUNISIA: Thank you very much. Well, first of all, I wanted to offer my condolences to the victims' families and people.

Well, as you said, when the attack happened, I was inside the parliament; and we were working inside committees, inside different committees. And we had different sessions organized by ministers.

When we heard the attack, we heard that it was in front of the main entrance of the parliament in what we call -- in front of what we call the Door of Lions. And after this, the whole building was evacuated, and we heard that the terrorists started to kill tourists who were in the museum.

So we strongly condemn this kind of cowardly attacks. And I am really -- I am really very sorry for our next touristic season. And also for those people who have tried to attack a symbol of sovereignty in Tunisia. It's really sad. And I hope -- I hope that it won't really affect our economy, especially because our new government, who was elected during next February after the elections of last October, has started on fighting terrorism and has discovered lots and lots of places hiding terrorists and weapons and arms and all sorts of bombs.

So I think this is the kind of repulse from those people. They are trying to defy us, but the whole Tunisian people are unified, all the parties, all the civil society organizations, all the countries also are unified and are solidarity with Tunisia. And I hope that -- I'm sure that we will fight terrorism and that we will really eradicate it from our country.

PEREIRA: Yes. Well, our -- the whole world gathers with you and joins with you in the support of your nation in the aftermath of this attack.

Emna, we understand that there have been threats from ISIS to your country. We understand that 3,000 fighters from your country have gone to night alongside ISIS in Syria and Iraq.

Emna, what can you tell us about that? And why are so many young people going?

[07:05:03] EMNA BEN MUSTAPHA BEN ARAB, PROFESSOR: Well, Tunisia is in a real war against terrorism. And -- and for that situation, we need a preemptive and proactive strategy. So far we've been reactive, and the dismantling of the intelligence network after the uprising is affecting badly our efforts in this war.

Well, you're absolutely right. A big number of Tunisians, more than 3,000, are foreign fighters. And some of them are coming back to Tunisia. Many of them went to Syria and to Libya with a mission; and some of them are coming back with a mission.

And the two terrorists, the two young people who carried out the terrorist attacks in the museum, came from Libya three months ago; and these are foreign fighters who came back with a mission.

PEREIRA: Sabrine, do you feel that your parliament...

BEN MUSTAPHA BEN ARAB: Our mission is very difficult.

PEREIRA: It is very difficult. Sabrine, do you feel that the parliament is suited and prepared for this kind of terror attack like we saw happening on your soil? Do you feel you have the resources and the power to confront such a threat?

GHOUBATINI: Well, actually, as you can see, and as your reporters can tell you, the department is really secure. But the problem is that it's not the first, let's say, foreign attack that we had in the parliament. It's the second one.

Well, right now we had an attack with murders. But we had, during the opening session of the parliament, we had a very weird thing that happened. One -- one person entered inside the parliament and, as -- claiming that he was another M.P.

And then we heard that the security was -- has been enforced in the parliament. And we heard also that this person was having a gun inside -- inside the parliament and was aiming to kill the president.

So for sure, it's not easy. And as my compatriot said, those people are coming -- coming back to Tunisia illegally. And I've already asked the question to the prime minister, during the past session, and I was asking about the -- those people. They are coming back illegally.

There are about 400 or 500 who are coming back illegally to Tunisia. And we are not really taking action against them. But...

PEREIRA: That is the concern. GHOUBATINI: As the prime minister said yesterday and the president said, yes, there is a big concern. And I think right now people -- people are going to take some things seriously. Because this war is not easy.

You know, we have 4,000 people who are there in ISIS. But these are the official numbers, and I guess that there are people who went without a Tunisian passport, with fake passports, so we don't know, really, the real numbers.

PEREIRA: Right.

GHOUBATINI: And this is the responsibility of the government. And also of the people and of the citizens to -- to call the police whenever they -- they see something weird in the neighborhoods.

PEREIRA: Yes. They need to report something. If they see -- I'm sorry to interrupt you. Emna, Sabrine, we want to thank you so much. We understand these are very tense moments in your country. Please know we send our condolences and best wishes to you and to your fellow members of parliament and to your countrymen; and we'll talk more about this coming up in our show. Thank you so much -- John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks, Michaela.

Protests taking over the University of Virginia after the arrest of a student caught on camera prompted accusations of police brutality. Martese Johnson -- you can see the blood on his forehead there -- he can be heard calling the cops racist during this arrest.

Police say Johnson was drunk and resisted arrest. The governor has now ordered an investigation.

CNN's Brian Todd is in Charlottesville this morning with more.

Good morning, Brian.

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, John.

This is the very spot where this incident occurred. Martese Johnson had been denied entry at this pub, the Trinity Irish Pub in Charlottesville. And this is the scene still -- look down here. This is Martese Johnson's blood still on the sidewalk, about 30 hours after the incident occurred.

This just feet away from the University of Virginia campus. And of course now, this coming on the heels of Ferguson; on the heels of the Madison, Wisconsin, police shooting; on the heels of Eric Garner's death. All of that, now this, have put this college and this town very much on edge.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yo, his head is bleeding! Yo, his head is bleeding!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I go to UVA, (EXPLETIVE DELETED)! I go to UVA, (EXPLETIVE DELETED)!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You racists! You (EXPLETIVE DELETED) racists!

TODD (voice-over): This disturbing cell phone video at the center of the latest claim of police brutality. Twenty-year-old University of Virginia student Martese Johnson, arrested by uniformed Alcoholic Beverage Control special agents outside a bar near the college, pinned to the pavement. Blood spatters his shirt and covers his face.

[07:10:11] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How did this happen?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where's your I.D.?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How did this happen, you (EXPLETIVE DELETED) racists?

TODD: According to a statement from the ABC, Johnson was arrested after he was refused entry to a pub. The third-year student was charged with public intoxication and obstruction of justice and received ten stitches to his head at a local area hospital and released. This gruesome booking photo circulated by the university's Black Student Alliance.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No justice!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No peace!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No peace!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No peace!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No justice!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No peace!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No peace!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No peace!

TODD: Stoking student outrage, including from UVA's president.

SULLIVAN: I felt it in my stomach, seeing the blood run down that young man's face.

TODD: Hundreds of rallying students flooding UVA's campus, including Martese Johnson himself.

MARTESE JOHNSON, VIOLENT ARREST CAUGHT ON TAPE: We're all part of one community. We deserve to respect each other, especially in times like this.

TODD: The governor launching an investigation to determine whether excessive force was used. The officers involved in that arrest put on administrative duties, pending the results of the probe.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For his face to literally be bashed in by concrete, there's no words to describe that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where's your I.D.?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How did this happen, you (EXPLETIVE DELETED) racists?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TODD: Martese Johnson spoke at that rally last night, but as of yet, he has not spoken to the media. His attorney, Daniel Watkins, has released a statement saying that Mr. Johnson is, quote, "absolutely devastated" by what happened. The attorney describes Martese Johnson as a third-year student at the University of Virginia, majoring in Italian and media studies, a student who holds numerous leadership positions with the university.

Martese Johnson has no criminal record, and his attorney says that, contrary to early reports, he was not denied entry to this pub for having a false I.D. -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: His words after the fact have certainly been helpful to the community to hear. Brian Todd, thanks so much.

Well, Mesa, Arizona, can breathe easier this morning. Forty-one-year- old Ryan Giroux, a career criminal, identified as a suspect in a deadly shooting spree there. One person was killed and five wounded in a series of shootings that began at a Mesa motel. No word yet on a motive, but police say Giroux has an extensive criminal record that includes three stints in prison.

PEREIRA: A U.S. Navy SEAL has been killed in a training accident in California. Officials say it appears the SEAL's parachute failed to open during an exercise in Paris. That's about 50 miles east of Los Angeles. The SEAL was part of a West Coast-based team. They have not released the identity of that Navy SEAL.

BERMAN: A Delta connection flight from Salt Lake City to Puerto Vallarta, Mexico, forced to turn around because of paperwork. The flight had less than an hour to go when the pilot announced they couldn't land. One passenger says a gate agent told travelers they were using a smaller plane than originally planned. It is possible the smaller plane did not have the right paperwork to land in Mexico. Delta would only say that all 57 passengers were rebooked on Wednesday.

PEREIRA: This close to paradise. You can taste the margarita, and back home you go.

CAMEROTA: But that's a new one.

BERMAN: Paperwork.

CAMEROTA: Paperwork. I mean, just when you think you are relieved, you don't have an unruly passenger on board...

BERMAN: You have unruly paperwork. CAMEROTA: Unruly paperwork.

BERMAN: You have to subdue the unruly paperwork.

PEREIRA: Goodness.

BERMAN: Tase it.

PEREIRA: Always something.

CAMEROTA: All right. This story that so many of us have been following so closely, could the new murder investigation of real- estate heir Robert Durst provide clues about what happened to his first wife? We'll talk with the brother of Kathie McCormick Durst about her disappearance and what Robert Durst is now admitting to.

PEREIRA: And is the White House reconsidering its stance towards Israel over Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu's election victory? How this plays out could have wide implications in the U.S. and beyond. John King will take a look "Inside Politics."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:17:25] BERMAN: The arrest of real-estate heir Robert Durst has led the FBI to look into other cold cases for a possible link to Durst. Durst is charged in the murder of a close friend in Los Angeles about 15 years ago. This arrest has raised new questions about the disappearance of his first wife, Kathie McCormick. In a moment we're going to speak with her brother.

First, CNN's Jean Casarez has more on Robert and Kathie's relationship.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Kathie McCormick and Robert Durst were married in the early '70s. Friends say they started out as any young couple in love, but coming from totally different worlds. He, the son of the Durst family New York real-estate dynasty. She, a young woman with ambitions of her own, pursuing a medical degree.

But according to Kathie's close friend, Ellen Strauss, as time went on, things changed dramatically.

ELLEN STRAUSS, FRIEND OF KATHIE: From the beginning, it was Prince Charming and Cinderella. Time went by, I would say that it became more and more violent. She would call me late at night, for hours, about his violence.

CASAREZ: Kathie wrote in her diary about her abusive marriage. Friends told her to leave him.

STRAUSS: I used to say, "Leave, get out. The guy's crazy; he talks to himself. Leave."

CASAREZ: But she stayed. In the HBO documentary "The Jinx," friends say Kathie believed her life was in danger.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She said to me, "Gilberta, promise me if something happens, you'll check it out. I'm afraid of Bobby."

And I just said, "Kathie, of course."

CASAREZ: Then, in January of 1982, Kathie disappears. But Durst doesn't report it for four days. He later claimed he last saw her when leaving her at a train station to return to New York City from medical school. Her friends and family were devastated. Law enforcement had very few leads.

JIM MCCORMICK, BROTHER OF KATHIE: We never found her body. We never -- we didn't have a crime scene. She could have met her demise in New York, upstate New York or Jersey or any place.

CASAREZ: Missing person posters went up. But time went on, and no Kathie. Meanwhile, friends and family were watching Robert Durst and believed something just didn't seem right.

STRAUSS: I went through his garbage. And I found that he was throwing her things out right away, within five weeks, at least, of her disappearance. He knew she wasn't coming back.

CASAREZ: Durst was questioned but never charged.

Jean Casarez, CNN, Los Angeles.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CAMEROTA: We want to bring in now Jim McCormick. He's the brother of Kathie McCormick Durst, Robert Durst's first wife.

Jim, nice to see you this morning.

MCCORMICK: Good to see you.

[07:20:01] CAMEROTA: OK. So we understand that you have been watching this HBO documentary along with your family and friends. What is it like, after all this time, to see Robert Durst try to explain what happened to your sister?

MCCORMICK: Basically, it's a fulfillment of the long-held belief that he has been involved and has been covering up the disappearance of Kathie. Obviously, as this thing evolved, I believed that he had something to do with -- everything to do with the demise of Susan Berman. The thing down in Texas with Morris Black, I didn't buy into it; unfortunately, the jury did. So they acquitted him.

So it's been -- it's literally, as I just said before, it's like a 33- year marathon. And now we're at a point where maybe we've got a couple of sprints to go out on the West Coast and then on the East Coast. And finally, we'll have full closure and justice for Kathie.

CAMEROTA: We certainly hope that you can find that justice. It's fascinating that you have not seen Robert Durst in the flesh

since this happened in 1982. And now, you're watching him. Does he seem the same to you when you watch him on film?

MCCORMICK: Actually, when I see him on film now, he looks quite a bit more frail than I recall. He had dark hair. He was more of a hippie- style person -- persona back in 1982.

But the last time I saw him in '82, he had a sister, Mary, who has taken a terrible toll herself on this saga. He had us pick up her remnants, I guess you'd call it, at the South Salem house.

I remember an old fishing pole, a net, and a couple of other items. Because Kathie and I used to sit down by the lake, at Lake Truesdale, and we'd fish and we'd talk. And Bob would literally wander away. And you wouldn't see him for the rest of the evening.

CAMEROTA: We've heard how...

MCCORMICK: I always thought he was shy, but...

CAMEROTA: Yes, how anti-social that he was.

And I want to ask you about something that happened in the second or third episode of this HBO film, "The Jinx." He admits that the story that he told police, the night that your sister disappeared, was not true, that he lied, that he actually did not talk to your sister via a pay phone when she was back in the city. He did not have a conversation with her that night, as he said he had. He also did not go to the neighbors. He had used that as an alibi, that he had been at the neighbor's drinking a glass of wine. In fact, he did not go to the neighbor's house that night.

Had you suspected that he'd lied about those things all along?

MCCORMICK: Absolutely. It just didn't compute. In fact, the investigator who reopened the investigation in 2009, Joe Becerra, who I owe a great deal of gratitude to, told me flat out he was in a police cruiser and he went from Gilberta's home in Connecticut to the South Salem home, waited an appropriate amount of time, as though he were having this so-called meal and bottle of wine, got back in a police cruiser and drove to the Katonah station. He couldn't make the timeline in a police cruiser. Had did Bob Durst or Kathie in that case and Bob Durst ever, ever do that?

As I guess you've heard it, it's a crime of -- what shall we say? -- convenience. It's an alibi of convenience to Bob. He's -- I call him criminally cunning.

CAMEROTA: One of the most hair-raising moments of the documentary is when Bob Durst thinks the interview is over. He goes into a bathroom after having been questioned by the filmmakers, and he's talking to himself. And people believe that this is actually a confession. Let me play this for you and our viewers for a moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) ROBERT DURST, MURDER SUSPECT: What the hell are you doing? Killed them all. Of course.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: What did you think, Jim, when you heard him say killed them all, of course?

MCCORMICK: I was chilled. And actually vindicated, but chilled by the open and unsolicited admission of guilt. That's the way I looked at it.

Some people have challenged his comment. But the operative pronoun in the sentence immediately before, "killed them all" is the word "I." So put that "I" in front of "I killed them all, of course," and basically, you have an admission of guilt.

CAMEROTA: Can you imagine a scenario by which Bob Durst actually does confess to police about killing Susan Berman and/or your sister?

MCCORMICK: Alisyn, I'm a man of faith, and I have a strong belief that the prayers will finally be answered for Kathie, for our family. And perhaps to some extent for Bob. I think there's a -- there's a deep-rooted soul, a spirit within him that's just wanting to get out of the prison he's put himself into. And that I'm hopeful that he'll finally man up, tell his lawyers to bug off, and he wants to have this thing over and put behind him.

[07:25:03] He's hurt a lot of people, including himself. But it's got to come to an end. And as much as he thinks he's going to continue to deny and deflect guilt and, finally, conviction, it's just not going to happen. There's too much, there's a preponderance of evidence out there that hasn't even made the street yet. And I'm hopeful that the FBI will continue in their pursuit as well as the law enforcement jurisdictions.

CAMEROTA: It sure sounds like they are doing that now, despite it being more than 30 years after the fact. Jim McCormick, thanks so much for sharing your family's personal story. And we sure hope that you get some peace at the end of all this.

MCCORMICK: Thank you, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Let's go over to Michaela.

PEREIRA: All right, Alisyn.

How do Americans really feel about the job Congress is doing? A new CNN poll had some pretty bleak numbers. John King will dig through them in "Inside Politics."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PEREIRA: Three terrorists are still on the loose after killing 23 people in Tunisia's national museum. The U.S. is offering whatever help is needed to find them. Seventeen of the dead are tourists. [07:30:00] Two other gunmen were killed by Tunisian security forces.

So far no one has claimed responsibility for that massacre, but a government spokesman in Tunis calls the attackers Islamist extremists.