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New Day

Heated Congressional Hearing on Planned Parenthood; House Republican Leadership Battle Heats Up; Georgia Executes Woman Despite Appeals; Afghan Forces Struggle to Retake City from Taliban; Trump Predicts Paul will Drop Out of Race. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired September 30, 2015 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

REP. GERALD CONNOLLY (D), VIRGINIA: The disrespect, the misogyny rampant here today tells us what is really going on here.

[07:00:06] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Surely you don't expect us to be easier on you because you're a woman.

CECILE RICHARDS, CEO, PLANNED PARENTHOOD: Absolutely not. That's not how my momma raised me.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Congresswomen on both sides of the aisle fiercely advocating their positions.

REP. CYNTHIA LUMMIS (R), WYOMING: Why do you need federal dollars? You're making a ton of dough.

REP. BONNIE WATSON COLEMAN (D), NEW JERSEY: We've got so much good work to do, but instead what do we do? We harp on a woman's right to make choices that are hers to make.

MALVEAUX: Richards then asked to explain the apology she issued after this undercover video surfaced in July. It was the first in a series produced by anti-abortion activists, discussing the transfer of fetal tissue with Planned Parenthood employees.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Which statements were you apologizing for?

RICHARDS: I was apologizing for the -- what was said in a nonclinical setting, in a non-appropriate way. And I don't believe...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can't go both ways. You can't have -- you can't say I'm apologizing for statements in one video and then not tell us what those statements were.

MALVEAUX: Richards reacting to the hearing on MSNBC Tuesday night.

RICHARDS: They are obsessed with ending access to reproductive health care for women in America.

MALVEAUX: Some Democrats at the hearing agreed.

REP. CAROLYN MALONEY (D), NEW YORK: Republicans are doubling down on their war against women.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: Senate Republicans' efforts to shut down the government over the federal funding of Planned Parenthood failed. Today House lawmakers going to take up the issue as part of a vote to continue to fund the government, Chris.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: All right, Suzanne. Thank you very much.

We have executive vice president of Planned Parenthood, Dawn Leguens, joining us right now.

Thank you very much for joining us.

DAWN LEGUENS, EVP, PLANNED PARENTHOOD: Hi, Chris. Good morning.

CUOMO: What happened to the people in the videotapes who said things that were certainly objectionable, unprofessional and not helpful to the Planned Parenthood cause?

LEGUENS: Well, those are actually -- the people in those videos are amazing and compassionate, and wonderful doctors and staff of Planned Parenthood. And what happened is that they were trapped by undercover anti-abortion activists. And what they actually said was left on the cutting room floor.

Planned Parenthood does this because women ask for it. We do it in very few places where we're able to allow women to make fetal tissue donation, and we're very proud of that work.

CUOMO: I understand.

LEGUENS: And like Cecile Richards said yesterday, was what she apologized for was that those were clinical comments in a nonclinical, non-confidential setting; and we talked to those doctors about that.

CUOMO: I think one of the problems you're having here is one of optics and perception. Right? There's no question that this is about abortion on a larger level.

However, this explanation of what these people say on the videotape is arguably inaccurate and certainly unhelpful to you. When they're talking about the Lamborghini and making the money, and making light of these things, it's offensive, period, let alone to those who see abortion as a deeply moral issue.

Why defend what they said on the video instead of saying, "They're out of line. We're going to deal with them, and this was wrong, what they said and how they said it." Don't say it's in a clinical setting, in a nonclinical. That's not helpful.

LEGUENS: Well, what I think was terrible optics was five hours of haranguing and grilling Cecile Richards yesterday and not -- barely letting her get a word in edgewise where she was explaining very clearly what Planned Parenthood does, who Planned Parenthood serves, and why Planned Parenthood is so important to the women, men and families of this country. And what I thought we saw yesterday from the Republican majority was

evidence that they don't understand women. They certainly don't understand women's health. And they certainly don't understand the very programs they oversee, like Medicaid.

CUOMO: Look, I understand what you're saying. And you can certainly suggest that that was not a fair hearing yesterday. I don't think anybody expected it to be. Certainly your organization didn't. This was about defending yourself against allegations.

What I'm saying is if you had said, if your organization had done something to take people to task for speaking this way about something that is so emotional and religious to a lot of people, it would have helped your cause. But you know, I've asked that question; you answered it.

LEGUENS: The issue, Chris -- I'm happy to say, but the issue is, we know that those videotapes were extremely doctored.

CUOMO: But these are their words.

LEGUENS: People edited them...

CUOMO: They're their words, though, Ms. Leguens.

LEGUENS: One question to another question. They left all kinds of things on the cutting room floor. Those are not fair representations of Planned Parenthood or of the work we do or of the 1 percent of our affiliates and health centers that are even able to offer tissue donation which, again, is what women ask for and do of their own accord.

CUOMO: Two -- two issues that have to do with the money. The one is, are you able to show that what you do with fetal tissue research in terms of the harvesting, the procurement and the recouping of money and expenses is net to neutral? Can you show that? And can you show that the federal dollars that you are given do not go to abortions? The two big charges are, you profit and you commingle. Can you prove that those are untrue? And if not, why wasn't it done at the hearing yesterday?

[06:05:15] LEGUENS: Well, I think, Cecile Richards did a great job of actually showing that no federal funds go to abortion, except in terms of three narrow exceptions -- rape, incest...

CUOMO: Right.

LEGUENS: ... and the life or health of the mother. And the other factor...

CUOMO: She said it. I'm saying, could you have proved it? I don't mean to interpret you, but it's a point of clarification. She certainly said it, you're right. I don't mean to suggest otherwise.

LEGUENS: Well... CUOMO: She did not prove it. You know what I'm saying? And sometimes it's hard to prove the nonexistence of a fact, but is there anything you could provide to do that to help...

LEGUENS: I think what you said. I mean, we are heavily regulated. We get state and federal Medicaid funds primarily that are reimbursement for service. We get looked at and talked to and provide all of the documents -- thousands and thousands of pages to the documents -- to the congressional committee, which they clearly had not read. So they would have had the evidence they need to see exactly how Planned Parenthood operates, if they had bothered to look.

CUOMO: What happens if Planned Parenthood is not funded by the federal government?

LEGUENS: Millions of people are denied the choice that they make every year to see the healthcare provider they believe can do the best for them. And the Congressional Budget Office said, over 400,000, I believe, women in this country would not actually have access to care, because in many places, we are the only option that they have.

CUOMO: The push on that is, oh, there are lots of clinics. There are lots of places that this -- they can get -- women can get health treatment. And by the way, you make a lot of money. You can keep on doing exactly what you do now. You don't need this government's money.

LEGUENS: Well, absolutely untrue on the last fact. Planned Parenthood is actually a not-profit organization. And we could not provide the services, the healthcare services, just like a hospital or any other doctor without those federal funds that reimburse preventive healthcare services.

On the other matter, though, just saying there are a lot of clinics in the world does not mean that they do great care, that they're in the right location or that they can absorb the Planned Parenthood patients.

And finally, I think it is so insulting to say that poor women in this country, especially, should not get to choose their own doctor, but the members of the Republican majority in Congress think they get to pick for women. And that's outrageous.

CUOMO: Ms. Leguens, the reason that, you know, we have to test you on the points that matter is because this is an issue that has been very clouded with politics and the overlay of how people feel about abortion that is often -- often not fact-sensitive. People either believe in choice or they don't. So I've got to put the questions to you because it's the only way we advance the conversation. Thank you for coming on NEW DAY, appreciate it.

LEGUENS: Absolutely, Chris. Thank you so much.

CUOMO: All right.

Coming up on NEW DAY, we're going to test the other side, Republican Congresswoman Diane Black, who sponsored the Bill to defund Planned Parenthood. We're also going to have David Daleiden on. This is the man who did these undercover videos. How doctored are they? Why did he doctor them? What does he think they show, and why is he really doing this? We'll ask all these questions -- Alisyn.

MICHAELA CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Meanwhile, Republicans in the House preparing for the post-John Boehner era, the search for new leadership and a new message now under way.

CNN's Manu Raju is live in Washington with more. What is the latest, Manu?

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kevin McCarthy is really trying to differentiate himself from John Boehner, largely because a lot of conservatives are skeptical of Boehner's leadership style, and that was one of the reasons why he was actually forced to leave the speakership, because there was a vote expected on the House floor that would have put a lot of his colleagues in a tough spot.

And so, what Kevin McCarthy is trying to do is emphasize how his style is a lot different than John Boehner's. And he continued to make that case last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R), CALIFORNIA: What you're going to see is a conservative speaker that takes a conservative Congress that puts a strategy to fight and win.

I don't speak ill of any Republican because you know what? Every Republican should have a voice here. And that's going to be the fundamental difference. I believe in the bottom-up strategy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Yes. And that strategy is something that the Republicans were talking about behind closed doors yesterday for their first extended discussion about the way forward for their leadership team.

But McCarthy right now seems to have enough support to become House speaker. There is a larger, more significant, more contentious fight, I should say, heating up for the No. 2 spot under Kevin McCarthy. That is for the position of majority leader.

There are two men who are vying for that spot: Steve Scalise of Louisiana and Tom Price of Georgia. There was an effort yesterday by conservatives to recruit another man, Trey Gowdy of South Carolina, who eventually passed on that position.

So, that fight is very significant, too, because those people will have a huge say in determining the direction of the Republican conference and how combative they'll be, not just with the White House, but with the Senate, too, particularly as we head into a very, very contentious session this fall dealing with the major, major fiscal battles in which Republicans in the White House will need to reach some sort of resolution to avoid yet another fiscal crisis. Back to you guys.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: All right, Manu, we'll be talking to you more about it in the coming days and weeks. Thanks so much.

A series of appeals were not enough to stop the execution of the only woman on Georgia's Death Row. Kelly Gissendaner was put to death early this morning for getting her lover to kill her husband 18 years ago. She is the first woman executed in the state of Georgia in seven decades.

CNN's Martin Savidge joins us live from the CNN Center in Atlanta with all the details -- Martin.

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Michaela.

She was executed, or she was scheduled to be executed at 7 p.m. Eastern Time last night. That hour came and went with no announcement from officials. Now we learn why.

There was a desperate effort that was being undertaken by her legal team. And this is just a break out of some of what they were trying to do.

They went to a federal judge the day before, got denied. They went to the Georgia Board of Appeals. They didn't get clemency there. They went to, then, the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals. That didn't work. They went to the Georgia Supreme Court. That didn't work. And we are told they went to U.S. Supreme Court as many as three times.

Eventually just after midnight, time and hope ran out. She was, in fact, put to death. Protesters were there, as were members of her family, who spoke.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAYLA GISSENDANER, KELLY GISSENDANER'S DAUGHTER: We just want to thank you all so much. We were not able to see our mom today, because the Boards of Pardons and Paroles made us make a choice to either come try and save her life today or to see her. So we chose to try and save her life, and they still denied us.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAVIDGE: Now, we need to point out that, of course, she was tried and convicted for the 1997 murder of her husband, but where there was controversy is the fact that her co-conspirator, her boyfriend at that time, the one who actually killed the man, he got life with the possibility of parole. She, for planning and, of course, supporting that murder, got death. She turned her life around in prison.

Justice, in the minds of at least the parents of the victim, was carried out properly.

Back to you.

CUOMO: All right, Martin, thank you very much.

We do have breaking news for you this morning. Thousands are fleeing the northern Afghanistan city of Kunduz overnight. Why? Well, Afghan forces have failed to push back the Taliban, despite help from the U.S. and NATO.

Those Taliban fighters are now fanning out across the region, shutting down roads, torching government buildings, and there are plans to fight back.

So let's take you to the state of play with CNN Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr, live in Washington with more. We don't talk about Afghanistan a lot. Doesn't mean there isn't an ongoing war there. What's the latest?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: This is the war that President Obama has believed is largely wrapped up. The Taliban, of course, casting a dissenting vote.

They are on the move in Kunduz in northern Afghanistan. We talked about this yesterday. Their biggest victory, the Taliban, since 2001, to be able to take this city.

Now there are reports more than 6,000 Afghan civilians on the run from the city, more than 100 injured and killed as the Taliban continue to dig in, dig into civilian areas, which is making it very tough.

Afghan forces trying to get them out of there, but now there has been a second U.S. airstrike. This time near the airport. We are told this is because coalition forces that are in the area -- you can read that to mean some U.S. capability -- they were coming under threat from the Taliban.

So, again, for the second day in a row, a U.S. warplane had to roll in, drop bombs near the airport to push the Taliban back from that position to keep coalition forces safe.

This is turning into, perhaps, a more difficult situation than the Afghans or the U.S. had expected. Not clear at all when the Taliban will finally be out of there -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK, Barbara, thanks for all your reporting on that.

Meanwhile, Kentucky clerk Kim Davis's legal team says she met with Pope Francis while he was in the U.S. last week. Supposedly, the meeting lasted ten minutes, but there are no photos to prove this. In a statement, Davis says the pope thanked her for her courage, told her to stay strong, and asked her to pray for him. The Vatican will not confirm or deny Davis's claim of a meeting.

PEREIRA: So wait. There -- they did take photos?

CAMEROTA: No.

PEREIRA: There were no photos done at all.

CAMEROTA: No.

PEREIRA: Interesting.

CUOMO: Why? What does -- what does that mean?

CAMEROTA: It means you have to believe her -- you have to take her at her word that she met with the pope. There's no evidence; there's no photographic evidence of it.

CUOMO: Well, it's her legal team saying it, right? So the question is, what's their motivation to lying? It's going to be found out. Eventually somebody is going to say from the Vatican whether or not...

PEREIRA: I think the motivation is obvious, no?

CUOMO: Well, but why set yourself up for that kind of disappointment?

PEREIRA: I don't know.

CUOMO: The bigger question is, why would the pope meet with Kim Davis? And I think that people have to remember, for all the tolerance and what he talks about, he is the head of the Catholic Church. And he said very clearly in one of his addresses that he believes in the ability to conscientiously object to that which offends your faith.

CAMEROTA: Sure. Good point.

PEREIRA: All right. He is the leader of the Republican pack. Now Donald Trump is predicting the future. Did you know he was a future seer? Yes. He says that Rand Paul is going to be the next candidate to drop out of the race. We'll put that proposition to our political panel, see if they agree with him, ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. RAND PAUL (R-KY), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'll tell you this. I think we'll be around just as long as Trump or longer.

How could anyone in my party think that this clown is fit to be president? So I think really, ultimately, we're going to get to the truth. Ultimately, we're going to get to substance. It just takes a while. But by -- by no means am I finished. I'm just getting started.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: All right. Well, just a day after the 2016 hopeful Senator Rand Paul there said that on NEW DAY about Donald Trump, the real- estate mogul returned fire tweeting, quote, "Prediction: Rand Paul has been driven out of the race by my statements about him. He will announce soon."

So is there any truth to Trump's prediction or even Rand Paul saying, "I'm not going anywhere"? Let's talk with our CNN political commentator Van Jones and CNN political commentator and Republican consultant Margaret Hoover. Great to have both of you here.

MARGARET HOOVER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Thank you guys. Good to see you.

[07:20:11] CAMEROTA: All right. Margaret, let me start with you. So Rand Paul was on NEW DAY, and he said it's absurd to think that he's dropping out of the race. That locally he's doing much better than he is in national polls. He said he's not going anywhere.

And then what happened within the next 24 hours is that his super PAC said that they are basically -- one of his super PACs says that they're basically giving up. They're not going to fundraise any more for them. Let me read for you what the heed of that super PAC -- it's called PurplePAC -- says. "I have stopped raising money for him until I see the campaign correct its problems. I wasn't going to raise money to spend on a futile crusade. I don't see the point in it right now."

HOOVER: Right. So you're right, it's one of three super PACs. The founder of that super PAC is also very involved, helped found the Cato Institute. The Cato Institute is a libertarian think tank. There are libertarians who are disappointed that Rand Paul has not channeled sort of those -- the philosophies that define libertarianism, specifically the privacy policies and the -- their lack of wanting to engage internationally in foreign policy.

CAMEROTA: Hasn't he done that?

HOOVER: They feel that he could have done it more, and so they feel like they can't go raise money.

But we know all dollars are not equal in this contest. Super PAC money can't be used to pay campaign staffers to travel to events. The money that is going to be most important to look at with Rand Paul is the money that is reported at the end of the day today, September 30, which is the end of the fundraising quarter. He raised $7 million last quarter. Will he raise a commensurate amount this quarter? That's what's most important for Rand Paul.

CUOMO: Do you think people are getting psyched out by Trump on that side? I mean, if it's true...

HOOVER: Here's the other thing.

CUOMO: I didn't even ask the question yet.

HOOVER: I checked. The only way to keep a candidate in the race is to have another candidate say he's about to drop out. Do you think anyone is going to step out because Donald Trump says they're going to?

CUOMO: Maybe he knows something we don't. What I'm saying is it seems that, you know, you've had people leave the race, somewhat early. Why don't -- if the conventional wisdom is true in your party, which is that Trump won't make it, Carson won't make it, why not hold on? Because the race changes fundamentally if he drops out.

HOOVER: And the reason Trump is on the offensive is because that's the only thing that got him in the front in the first place; and his numbers are falling. That's why he's going after Rand.

CUOMO: I'm saying, why wouldn't he hold on?

CAMEROTA: OK, Van, what do you make of all this?

CUOMO: He's loving it.

VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Exactly. From a Democratic point of view, it is amusing. But let's kind of call the balls and strikes fairly here.

Let's not forget, Rand Paul's father stayed in when he ran for president, when he had not a penny to his name, because he was fueled by the power of his ideas.

The reason you have such an intense conflict between these two guys, Rand Paul sees himself as a serious intellectual. He has serious ideas. He's willing to go against his party sometimes when he thinks his party is wrong, based on principle. As best we can tell, Donald Trump has no principle except being Donald Trump. And so, it's a perfect clash between these two very different types of leaders.

But the idea that Rand Paul or anyone named Paul is going to do anything based on what some super PAC says or what some donor says. This is not that kind of family. They believe what they believe. They say what they say. But they are serious. And they hate, they hate the fact that Donald Trump is so unserious and is doing so well.

CAMEROTA: Rand Paul has also gone after some other members in his party, namely Ted Cruz. Let me play for you what he has just said about Ted Cruz's, basically, kamikaze tactics.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL (via phone): Ted has chosen to make this really personal and call people dishonest in leadership and call them names, which really goes against the decorum and also against the rules of the Senate. And as a consequence, he can't get anything done legislatively. He's pretty much done for and stifled. And it's really because of personal relationships or lack of personal relationships. And it is a problem.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: Has Ted Cruz been stifled?

HOOVER: Ted Cruz -- Rand Paul is not wrong there. I mean, if you talk to any number of -- just go talk to anyone on the Hill or who works on the Hill or knows anything about the Senate. I've not heard many positive things said about Ted Cruz by staff or other senators. He -- the Senate is, for all of the chumminess that is mocked by the outside, a collegial body where people do have to work together. And if you do go against that decorum, you do limit your possibilities for getting legislation through.

Ted, in his own way, lit himself on fire first when he came to the Senate and has limited the possibilities of being able to really adequately represent the people in Texas.

CUOMO: You campaign in poetry; you govern in prose. And what sounds good during the campaign often does not help get you anywhere on the inside, once you're there.

Van, here's your challenge. Bill Clinton is so eloquent, he is so good at making the case. And yet, he's probably the person you want making the case for Hillary the least, so what do you do with this incredibly effective political animal that you really kind of don't want to overshadowing your candidate? What do you do here?

[07:25:05] JONES: I'm going to tell you what to do. Let the big dog bark. I completely...

HOOVER: Bring it on.

JONES: Let the big dog bark.

Listen, Bill Clinton is not only going to overshadow Hillary Clinton. Bill Clinton would overshadow Elvis Presley, Michael Jackson, the Beatles, Jay-Z and Bono all together. He's a star's star. You can't do anything about that. It's baked into the cake. He makes news when he exhales. Let him get out there and make the case.

CAMEROTA: Oh, yes?

HOOVER: Bring it on, baby.

JONES: The reason -- the reason that President Obama -- the reason that President Obama calls him...

CUOMO: You have a thing for Bill Clinton, I think.

JONES: ... the secretary of explaining stuff is because he does it so well. Let's let him get out there.

CAMEROTA: OK. Why do you say bring it on?

HOOVER: I say bring it on...

CUOMO: Because she loves Bill Clinton.

HOOVER: ... for all the reasons -- for all the reasons that Van knows. I mean, for -- for all of the positives that Donald Trump -- or that -- so sorry.

CUOMO: No. You meant to say that.

HOOVER: Bill Clinton.

CUOMO: You meant to try to conflate, President Trump.

HOOVER: What we know is that Bill Clinton saved the day in the Democratic convention in 2012. He became the explainer in chief.

We also know that the Obama campaign had the hook to pull him off the stage as quickly as possible. Because for all of the goods that Bill Clinton brings, he brings in equal, if not more number of negatives, especially in the context of a Hillary presidency. He got her in trouble so many times in 2008. Remember South Carolina?

CAMEROTA: But that's not what Democrats see.

HOOVER: That's not. But...

CAMEROTA: For the primary.

HOOVER: That's also how you know that the Clinton campaign knows that they're in trouble. Their numbers are slipping. And they're -- they have kept him totally off of center stage. And they're worried about her numbers if they're resorting to Bill Clinton this early.

CAMEROTA: Margaret, Van.

JONES: Listen -- look, she's -- she's right. This is the time to bring out the big guns. Why? Because the big guns have been pointed at Hillary Clinton, you know, for months now; and there needs to be a full-force response from her surrogates. She just happens to have one of the best surrogates in the history of American politics.

CAMEROTA: OK. Now we're officially done. Van, Margaret, thanks so much, guys.

Meanwhile, Donald Trump will talk to CNN's Don Lemon on CNN tonight. Tune in at 10 p.m. Eastern.

Also, mark your calendar, everyone. CNN and Facebook will host the first Democratic debate on October 13, 9 p.m. Eastern -- Michaela.

PEREIRA: A Tuesday in Vegas, I love it.

All right. A showdown, quite a showdown in fact, over Planned Parenthood on Capitol Hill. The group's president getting grilled by Republican critics out to defund Planned Parenthood. We're going to speak to the woman in Congress that is leading that charge next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)