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How Will War on ISIS Change After Paris Attacks?; Heated Refugee Rhetoric In Republican Race; Chicago Leader Preparing for Unrest. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired November 23, 2015 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: David McKenzie, unusual resolve there and also resourcefulness to find their way out of that situation.

[06:30:02] Let us know if anything develops there. Stay safe.

Alisyn?

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Well, world leaders zeroing in on ISIS. How the war plan is changing. We bring you the military perspective, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CUOMO: So, here's the news. British Prime Minister David Cameron will call for the U.K. to join the coalition launching airstrikes on ISIS in Syria. But there's more. He's also proposing billions in new defense spending to tackle the ISIS threat.

Cameron met this morning with French President Francois Hollande in Paris. Hollande is getting ready to fly to Washington to meet with President Obama to make a similar appeal to expand this war on ISIS.

Paris and Brussels keeping unprecedented precautions in place at schools and public transit, over concerns of more terror attacks. And a global manhunt for the eighth Paris attacker now entering its tenth day, with one source saying they are tracking the suspect's movements and they, quote, "make no sense".

Alisyn?

CAMEROTA: President Obama strengthening his tone against ISIS, saying the United States will obliterate the terror group.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[06:35:04] BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Destroying ISIL is not only a realistic goal, we're going to get it done and we're going to pursue it with every aspect of American power and with all the coalition partners that we've assembled. It's going to get done.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: But now that ISIS has proven it can strike outside of Iraq and Syria, how will the war against ISIS change?

Let's bring in retired General "Spider" Marks. He's our CNN military analyst. He's currently an executive dean at the University of Phoenix.

Spider, great to see you this morning.

So, now, Russia and France and the U.S. all carrying out airstrikes against ISIS targets. Is it your impression that these are working?

GEN. JAMES "SPIDER" MARKS (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Yes, the air strikes are working, but they need to increase the volume and ferocity of these things. We have experience in the past where we -- a collective body has conducted these airstrikes and have made them absolutely smothering and air bleeding. You know, in our most recent past, we did this against Milosevic in the Kosovo air campaign.

So, there's a parallel to be drawn, that we can increase the air campaign and the real strength of that, but we need to be prepared for the use of ground forces. That's not an intellectual leap from the insertion of the 82nd Airborne right into the middle of Raqqa. There are other, there are plenty of options for the use of ground forces which are inevitable.

CAMEROTA: Such as? I mean, such as, spider? Like spell that out for us. What does your vision of ground force mean?

MARKS: Sure. Can do.

I mean, initially, what we can do, we could create in northern Iraq, let's take that piece of terrain where the Kurds and the Iraqi security forces have secured a portion of it, adjacent to the Syrian border in Sinjar, in that particular area, the United States in concert with regional partners could create what's called a theater support command.

And within that support element, you could have logistics, you could have attack aviation, you could have training and equip missions so that we could put some the additional firepower into those forces on the ground that are willing to fight. We can conduct medical, we can conduct a whole bunch of operations that would allow for a really proximate and persistent presence that would allow operations to be conducted.

We could use that as a staging base for joint special operations, into specific targets. So you could build that, help train and equip, and then take it to the next level. It's not an immediate jump to let's put the 81st or the 102nd on the ground.

CAMEROTA: Spider, let me show you what CentCom says are the targets that have been hit in this past month alone. Look at this -- they say that they have gotten 20 headquarter buildings, more than 100 logistics areas, nearly 100 weapons caches, and they hit key oil supplies.

So, how then, Spider, is it possible they've carried off the Paris attacks? That looks like an impressive list of targets, but yet somehow ISIS is still extremely operational.

MARKS: They are. And what you're looking at, those targets are absolutely essential for the predominance of ISIS to conduct operations and to hold the caliphate that they've created, you know, superimposed over two countries, both Iraq and Syria. But when you look at the Paris attacks, this is a very precise, special operations that they were able to conduct.

So, it's a combination, it's a full array of capabilities that is has from conventional forces, and again, remember that the leadership of ISIS were the former leaders in Saddam's military. So they're conventionally trained, they know how to run these things.

But they also have the capability to go light, go quick, and to sneak through these different filters that exist in a very open Europe. As you know, you can drive from Damascus to Calais, and that's exactly what's happening.

So, it's not unusual that we would see both of these kinds of capabilities, even though we're striking targets with success in Iraq and Syria.

CAMEROTA: Spider, we've had so many people on in the past week to say that there is no military solution to fighting ISIS. And it sounded like even this weekend, Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel seemed to echo that sentiment. Let me play for you what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHUCK HAGEL, FORMER DEFENSE SECRETARY: I always felt that we needed to more clearly define our political strategy along with our military strategy. Because it's my opinion, it certainly was the opinion of the former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Marty Dempsey, he can speak for himself, but it is our opinion that there is no military solution to this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: Spider, do you agree with that? You've just spelled out what you see as your military solution for what they should do next. Do you think there is no military solution to fighting is?

MARKS: Alisyn, there's no single solution of all the elements of power, you can't just have a military solution, as the former secretary said, without an overarching strategy that allows it to fit. But you also have diplomatic, informational and economic efforts that need to be put in place.

The challenge that we have is that military, when you look at all those elements of power, the military is always the one of first choice because it can solve problems this an immediate sense.

[06:40:02] It's not a full solution. I don't think anyone is suggesting that military alone is going to solve this problem.

CAMEROTA: Yes.

MARKS: We've got to change the conditions on the ground and what you don't hear from this administration is that this is intergenerational. This challenge that we see in the Mideast right now is not going away anytime soon, until we start to change the direction of how these young men can be recruited in this incredibly cynical, you know, this amazing appeal of ISIS. It baffles us, but this is what's drawing them in.

So, it's a long-term solution, but the military has got to -- we've got to be able to step this up in order to start putting some real punishment against ISIS, or we will see more.

CAMEROTA: Spider Marks, always great to get your expertise. Thanks so much for being here on NEW DAY.

MARKS: Thanks, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Let's go over to Michaela.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: All right, Alisyn.

The question of whether or not to bring Syrian refugees to the U.S. is igniting both sides of the political aisle. Is it the American way or is it in the interest of national security to keep them out? We'll look at what the presidential candidates have to say, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:45:03] CUOMO: All right. We have seen a turn in things in the election and we must discuss. New national polling from ABC News and "The Washington Post" shows it's working. Donald Trump, a commanding lead over the GOP field, beating second place rival Ben Carson now by double digits. His numbers holding steady, high despite or perhaps because of controversial rhetoric against accepting refugees from Syria and supporting surveillance of Muslims and more in the United States.

Let's discuss, CNN political analyst and presidential campaign correspondent for "The New York Times," Maggie Haberman, and CNN political commentator and political anchor for New York 1 News, Errol Louis.

It's good to see you both here.

Look at the numbers. The numbers do not lie. He is getting purchase for what he is doing and there's no coincidence to the timing in our history and what's going on with public events getting it.

How he's getting these numbers, Maggie, as interesting to you as the numbers themselves?

MAGGIE HABERMAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, and has been this whole time, right? I do think there was a school of thought that after the Paris attacks, would people start looking towards more policy-minded, more serious-minded who were talking with more detail about what they were going to do to combat ISIS.

That is not what's happening. You have seen uptick in his numbers because people are afraid, people are scared, and he is speaking to those fears in very glaring, very sort of graphic terms. But that is what he is doing.

Whether that means he can grow beyond what he has now, has been the question we've been debating here for months now. He has been basically capped at a certain level of support, not much above 30 percent this whole time. That means there's about 70 percent of the Republican GOP primary electorate that's up for grabs for someone else if they can consolidate it.

CAMEROTA: OK. So, Errol, let's talk about what Donald Trump has been saying in glaring terms, as Maggie just said. He's been given his rationale for cracking down on refugees and mosques. And part of what he says is that after 9/11 he saw here in this country, in New Jersey, people celebrating, as the towers came down. No one else has been able to see that. That was not -- people have gone back --

ERROL LOUIS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: That didn't happen, right?

CAMEROTA: through the annals, to look at newscasts that didn't exist in this country, it did exist in the Middle East.

HABERMAN: Yes.

CAMEROTA: Maybe you remember saying that. But here's what he told ABC this weekend about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS, ABC NEWS: You know, the police say that didn't happen and all those rumors have been on the Internet for some time. So, did you misspeak yesterday?

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE (via telephone): It did happen. I saw it. It was on television.

STEPHANOPOULOS: You saw that with your own eyes?

TRUMP: George, it did happen.

There were people that were cheering on the other side of New Jersey where you have large Arab populations, they were cheering as the World Trade Center came down. I know it might not be politically correct for you to talk about, but there were people cheering as that building came down, as those buildings came down.

And that tells you something. It was well covered at the time, George.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: OK, it was not well covered and we can't find any evidence of it. Is that a problem for Donald Trump?

LOUIS: Well, probably not, unfortunately. I mean, if you dig deeper into those same polls we're talking about, it turns out that the same voters say he's not the most experienced. They say Jeb Bush is. They say he's not the most honest and trustworthy. They say that Ben Carson is.

They think however that he'll bring change. They think however that he's most likely to win and that's why I think he's in the lead. It's not because he's factual. It's not because he respects the Constitution, it's not because he tells the truth. There are questions about all of those things.

The people who support him support him for different reasons. So, the rest of us are kind of watching us, you know, with our mouths hanging open, saying, how can you get on national TV and sort of basically support the beating of somebody at one of your rallies. How can you get on national TV and talk about something that never happened and insist that it did happen and just kind of move on. I don't think it's going to affect his poll standings.

CUOMO: And when he says it, it works. And the reason it works is because they agree with him. He is playing into an "us versus them" mentality.

Look at the numbers on the Syrian situation. Look at what the American people say, all right? We haven't seen numbers like this in America since 1938, when people were obviously desperate, obviously running for their lives.

And yet the fear of what they may mean to the United States overcame any of the rationality of that fear in and of itself -- 53 percent are with him, 53 percent believe it's us versus them and Donald plays into it very well. He believes it as much as they do. And he did it to George.

George is as smart as we have in the business, period. He says this didn't happen. The police say it didn't happen. What did Donald say? Not only "yes, I saw it", but he says, we didn't play it, but he says, I know it's not politically correct for you to talk about it, George.

That was as useful to him as anything else that he said in that interview, because what did it do? It made the people who are listening say, "That's right, George is one of them. He's not one of us." And it works.

And you know what? When Trump says this, you know what he's going to say? Why are they being unfair to me on that show again? I thought Cuomo would come around on me. I guess he didn't. And that will also boost his numbers, because they'll say, here's another example of the media not being where the American people are.

HABERMAN: The only thing I think is the exception of this. And he started doing this thing about September 11th and what happened and people cheering in New Jersey at his rally in Saturday in Alabama where it gotten enormous reaction.

[06:50:04] And he was more specific that, I was in Jersey City where thousands and thousands of people -- that was the quote.

LOUIS: Oh, he was there?

HABERMAN: And he was there.

CUOMO: But he was not one of them cheering the towers, though.

HABERMAN: He also was not there in an interview about a week after 9/11, he was in his office apparently when it happened. But be that as it may, he does say these things. He says things that are factually questionable. They don't get questioned the same way by his supporters. They don't care.

And to your point, the way he dealt with this other controversy that started last week with the Muslim registry, he has yet to say where he actually is on that. He has given a bunch of different answers. I was talking about the wall, but a database is OK.

He got asked about it by George yesterday on ABC. He said, are you unequivocally ruling that out? He said, no, not at all. And then went back to start talking about the Syrian refugees again.

So, this is what happens with Trump over and over again. He talks about policy in a very broad way and the only way to try to drill down with him is to offer a sort of menu of options. And in response, he will then say, as he did on Saturday over that, people are being politically correct when they don't want me to talk about this, but I am going to talk about it. It works with his supporters.

CAMEROTA: So, Errol, to close this off full circle, back to his poll numbers, he's leading nationally, as he has basically for months, and I remember pundits saying that his ceiling was 25 or 28. Now he's at 32. His ceiling seems to creep up.

I mean, are you still sure that this is the ceiling?

LOUIS: Well, I have no idea what the ceiling is. I'm just reflecting what pollsters have told me. They've been saying from the beginning, high floor, low ceiling. Now, I mean, this will all play out when the polling actually starts. There are a couple of big events that are going to possibly --

CUOMO: When the voting starts --

LOUIS: Yes, exactly, when you go to the polls and you actually start casting votes, as we've seen in past elections, that can change everything. And, you know, once again, a little reminder, we're in about 70 days now, 70 days out in the 2012 cycle, it was Herman Cain. He was leading everybody. Rick Santorum was in eighth place. He eventually won.

So, we don't know where this is all going to head but very important and interesting to watch.

HABERMAN: And a very nationalized race, too, where a lot of winnowing events have basically been eliminated. The Iowa straw poll, the debates have become very driving. We're in a different kind of election. So we'll see.

CUOMO: Yes.

CAMEROTA: Maggie, Errol, thank you.

CUOMO: You know, again, I just think that Donald Trump is no Herman Cain. I think this is something that's much more real. But here's what I think --

HABERMAN: I agree.

CUOMO: Well, I care what Maggie thinks. Well, I also care what you think. So, get on Twitter, get on Facebook. Let's keep this conversation going. Why does Trump work for you or not work for you. Discuss.

Michaela?

CUOMO: This is something that we'll be discussing as well, Chris. Video of a Chicago police officer shooting a black teenager. That video is about to be released. The city is preparing for the possibility of the unrest. We're going to take you live to Chicago, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:56:30] PEREIRA: Chicago leaders are gearing up for the potential of unrest this week. The city is set to release video of a white police officer gunning down a black teenager. Top officials are calling for calm. Some people, though, already fired up.

CNN's Ryan Young is live in Chicago following all the latest developments for us -- Ryan.

RYAN YOUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Michaela, let's talk about this. People are really worried about what happens when this video gets released. In fact, over 200 members from the community met this weekend to talk about a plan of what happens when the video is finally released.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

YOUNG (voice-over): The video said to be very disturbing. Police dash cam video showing 17-year-old Laquan McDonald being fatally shot 16 times by a white officer. It's ordered to be released to the public no later than Wednesday. Many who have already seen the footage from October of last year say it's tough to watch.

SHYRELL JOHNSON, LAQUAN MCDONALD'S UNCLE: Even when he was on the ground, the officer was still shooting him.

YOUNG: In October 2014, police were called to investigate a man with a knife trying to break into vehicles. Authorities say McDonald had a 4-inch knife and was acting erratically, slashing an officer's tire. Police say when McDonald, who had PCP on his system, ignored orders to drop it. Officer Jason Van Dyke unloaded 16 rounds into his body.

MICHAEL ROBBINS, MCDONALD FAMILY ATTORNEY: There was a narrative put out there by Chicago police, by the union initially, that he was a -- that a police officer had to shoot him in self- defense, that he was approaching a police officer and lunged at that police officer with a knife -- it's not true. He was shot while he was walking away.

YOUNG: The autopsy shows that some of the bullets entered his back. Officer Van Dyke says he shot McDonald in self-defense.

DANIEL HERBERT, OFFICER JASON VAN DYKE'S ATTORNEY: We're confident that my client's actions were not only lawful, but also within department policy and within his training.

YOUNG: Now, the city of Chicago is bracing for the possibility that the video of McDonald's death will ignite violent protests. Activists are calling for calm.

WILLIAM CALLOWAY, ACTIVIST: You know, we have the right, the First Amendment right to assemble peacefully and express our grievances against our government. And that's what we plan on doing.

YOUNG: In April, the city reached a $5 million settlement with the McDonald family.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

YOUNG: Charges have not been filed against the officer. He's on desk duty. The victim's own mother says she does not want to see this video, but, obviously, you can understand why people in Chicago are bracing for what could happen next.

PEREIRA: All right. Ryan, we'll watch you. We'll stay there with on the ground and watch what happens and hopefully calm will remain in Chicago. Thank you so much for that.

We are following a whole lot of news, so let's get right to it.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PEREIRA: Brussels remains under the highest terror threat amid warnings of an impending attack.

DAVID CAMERON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: Together, we will destroy this evil threat.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The security and safety of the residents of Brussels is something that is paramount.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: They're a bunch of killers and we fight them.

TRUMP: I watched surveillance of certain mosques, OK?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right now, it is impossible to vet who is coming out of Syria.

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R-NJ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: What we need to do is protect the homeland first.

HUGH HEWITT, RADIO HOST: Nobody trusts the president to process the refugees.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My nephew shot in the back. Even when he was on the ground, the officer was still shooting him.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have a duty to hold accountable the people that we pay to protect us.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're confident that my client's actions were not only lawful, but also within department policy.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo, Alisyn Camerota, and Michaela Pereira.

CAMEROTA: Welcome back to NEW DAY, everyone. We want to welcome our viewers around the world.

British Prime Minister David Cameron will make his case to parliament this week for the U.K. to join the airstrikes against ISIS in Syria.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: David McKenzie, unusual resolve there and also resourcefulness to find the>