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New Day

Massacre at New Zealand Mosques; Trump Nods toward Violence by Supporters; Ethiopian Airlines Pilot Faced Emergency Almost Immediately. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired March 15, 2019 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[06:30:00] JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: The breaking news this morning. At least 49 people, worshipers inside two mosques, murdered in an apparent anti-immigration hate crime, dozens injured. These terror attacks took place in Christchurch in New Zealand.

Joining me now is Jackson Williams, a reporter for Sky News in Australia. He joins us now from Christchurch Hospital in New Zealand, where some of the victims are being treated.

Give us a sense of the latest.

JACKSON WILLIAMS, REPORTER, SKY NEWS AUSTRALIA: It's just an awful, shocking day here in New Zealand. As our prime minister, Jacinda Ardern, says, it's one of the country's darkest days.

I'm outside Christchurch Hospital. Inside the hospital behind me there, 48 people with gunshot wounds being treated, around 20 of them with very serious injuries.

As we know from what police have told us, 49 people are confirmed dead, 41 of those were killed at one mosque, seven of those were killed at another mosque on the other side of Christchurch. Christchurch being a city on New Zealand's south island. A further -- one person, tragically, died succumbing to their injuries while being treated here at Christchurch hospital. So the death toll, as it currently stands, is at 49. Another 48 people, as I say, they are being treated here. So that death toll could tragically yet rise further given that so many people are in such -- such a bad way.

New Zealand is considered such a safe place. That's why the events here today have shocked so many people, not just (INAUDIBLE), not just people here in New Zealand, but people right across the globe.

We know three people are in custody. A male in his late 20s has been charged with murder. He will face a court here in Christchurch tomorrow morning. Another two people believed to be connected to the twin terror attacks in Christchurch earlier today also in custody. Police continue to question the pair.

We do know that earlier today a total of four people were apprehended, were in police custody. Three men, as well as one woman, but police say only three people now in custody in connection in relation to these tragic events. This is very much a country in shock. A country in mourning. Many

people struggling to come to terms, to be able to comprehend what's taken place here today.

BERMAN: All right, Jackson Williams for us in Christchurch outside the hospital, some 48 people killed, another 50 or so injured in the hospital behind you.

Of course, hate knows no boundaries. Apparently the ethnocentrism white supremacy knows no boundaries and has global reach as well.

Joining us now, Sam Vinograd, former senior adviser to the national security adviser and CNN national security analyst. Also with us, James Gagliano, retired FBI supervisory special agent and a CNN law enforcement analyst.

As we sit here, there are two things obviously of paramount importance, the what now and the why. Let's start with the what now, James. As far as this investigation goes, they have one man under arrest. We believe he's the guy behind this hate-filled manifesto. What else is happening and what else needs to happen?

JAMES GAGLIANO, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, John, in the immediate aftermath of this, the New Zealand prime minister, Jacinda Ardern, came right out and called this, and I quote, a terrorist attack. Now, in the U.S., we're normally much more cautious about labeling something like that in the immediate aftermath, but there was enough there from the (INAUDIBLE) that you've referenced all morning and the video of the gunman going in and perpetrating this horrific, unimaginable crime.

As you and I spoke early about this, 33 years in the military and law enforcement, I've seen some things in my time and witnessing the level of depravity that it took to execute people. This was an execution and absolutely a terrorist attack. Why? The definition of terrorism is violence or intimidation in the pursuit of political goals. This clearly appears to be what this is.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: It's so sickening I really can't even think about it. I mean I really can't even think about how -- what you've seen on that video. I know some details, but it is so -- it's such a shock to our -- the normal psyche that it's really hard to absorb what it is.

Sam, you were at the White House. You worked at the White House during previous mass casualties. And so typically, if we can use that word with this White House, what is the U.S. response? What happens right now when there's a mass casualty somewhere in the world like this?

SAMANTHA VINOGRAD, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, Alisyn, unfortunately or fortunately, there is a protocol that's followed at the White House when mass casualties events happen. I was at the White House when the massacre in Norway unfolded tragically, unfortunately.

What happens first is that (INAUDIBLE) reporting or instant reporting comes in via the U.S. Situation Room. In a situation like this, President Trump would have likely been briefed immediately because of the gravity and depravity of the incident, as well as the fact that there is still a real threat to Americans based upon the social media presence of this individual and the fact that this attack could still be inciting or directing others to conduct acts of violence against Americans in the United States.

[06:35:18] CAMEROTA: Oh, it is. I mean we've read through the -- if the manifesto is really his -- of course it's early hours, but it seems like that's what authorities believe. If this 87 pages, it is directing others. I mean he spells out how he wants civil war to happen in the U.S.

VINOGRAD: Yes.

CAMEROTA: He cites the U.S. a lot in here.

VINOGRAD: Exactly.

CAMEROTA: He is instructing people to do that.

VINOGRAD: He is. And I want to note, it's Friday. Many Muslims are going to jumu'ah or Friday prayers today. So there's a real risk to Muslims today going to mosques around the country.

And that's why the next step the White House would engage in would be monitoring threat reporting against high-profile targets here in the United States. But complementary to those efforts, there would be a strategic discussion about the root drivers of this attack. The reasons that this individual chose to act, the people that were cited in that manifesto, the tropes that he used, like the word "invasion," which, unfortunately, we are hearing from too many leaders mouths around the world.

CAMEROTA: Including President Trump.

VINOGRAD: Including --

CAMEROTA: I mean let's just be honest --

VINOGRAD: Let's --

CAMEROTA: Because he talks about it. The suspect talks about it. So we -- I don't know why we would skirt around it.

VINOGRAD: Well, that's exactly the question, how many more massacres do we need before we have a domestic conversation and global conversation about the use of these white supremacist and white nationalists tropes. We had the Pittsburgh shooting. The Pittsburgh shooter cited an invasion. We had the attacks -- or attempted attacks against members of the media. There was the same kind of language that was used. We have Marine Le Pen, Viktor Orban, the far right in Italy, using this kind of language. And 49 people died in New Zealand and that rhetoric is -- is a threat throughout all of these narratives. Any other White House, any White House, should have an honest conversation about how to combat white supremacy. BERMAN: In the law enforcement community, James, is there a fear of

the global weaponization of some of this rhetoric, the anti-invasion, the replacement rhetoric? Because now we heard it in New Zealand. We heard it at the synagogue shooting in Pittsburgh. I mean very similar language.

GAGLIANO: It's 2019 and we have an unfortunate intersection of law enforcement and politics. And I can tell you, John, from 25 years in the FBI, that's the last thing we want. But we have to look at that. Why? Because we want to get out in front of the causality. What are the motivations here? The worst thing that can happen to law enforcement in the aftermath of something like this is not being able to figure out what happened.

We know this was clearly a madman. We know that there were some political implications behind it. But right now in the immediate aftermath, law enforcement is hyper focused because New Zealand is part of the five i's, the intelligence sharing communities between Australia, the U.K., Canada and us. We share everything. Are there any other plots to be uncovered and are there any other people that, to Sam's point, inspired, enabled, or directed this or are going to do this in the future.

VINOGRAD: Can I just make one point? I agree with you, there should not be politicization of this investigation. But the use of tropes, the use of language that incites violence to me is not a political question, it's actually part of what you're saying, James, and that's why law enforcement professionals, even technology platforms that are monitoring accounts, look for certain words that incite this kind of violence.

CAMEROTA: But FaceBook didn't do a very good job --

BERMAN: No.

CAMEROTA: I mean of looking for the kind of words than incite violence since this was all over -- he -- he linked to HM (ph). He had Twitter. He had FaceBook. So I'm not sure what they're doing, really. If they don't -- if they don't have the competence or resources to shut this down before it happens, I'm not sure what good they're doing.

VINOGRAD: This has been reactive. I mean this was -- there are now three individuals in custody. This was not just a guy that woke up and decided he was going to go shoot up several mosques. This was premeditated --

CAMEROTA: He planted seeds everywhere.

VINOGRAD: And this idea was born on the Internet. So there was a digital footprint that unfortunately the technology platforms are likely reactively reviewing.

CAMEROTA: It's not helpful.

BERMAN: I will say, it's not like these discussions were only happening in secret places right now. CAMEROTA: No.

BERMAN: Because a lot of the language that's in that manifesto right now is on TV and coming from very official places every single day.

CAMEROTA: Yes.

Thank you both very much for all of your expertise.

So we continue to follow the terror attack in New Zealand.

Also coming up, did President Trump issue a veiled threat to his political opponents?

BERMAN: Veiled is when you make hints.

CAMEROTA: Yes.

BERMAN: You know, out loud is when it's not veiled at all.

CAMEROTA: An overt threat. We'll discuss it.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:43:20] CAMEROTA: President Trump often talks about violence. He's even encouraged it at some of his rallies. But in a new interview with "Breitbart," he goes even further, appearing to suggest that some of his supporters could get violent on his behalf. The president said, quote, I can tell you I have the support of the police, the support of the military, the support of the Bikers for Trump, I have the tough people. But they don't play it tough until they go to a certain point, and then it would be very bad, very bad.

Joining us to discuss this is David Gregory, CNN political analyst, and Joe Lockhart, former White House press secretary for President Clinton.

Joe, you were so struck by what the president said that you've written an op-ed about it. On this day of global violence where 49 people are dead because -- I mean I'm only going by the gunman's notes in his manifesto if this is really his, he is inspired by the white supremacist movement, he's inspired by violent rhetoric -- what are your thoughts when you hear President Trump say that?

JOE LOCKHART, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I mean, very simply that words matter. And this is the president of the United States and it doesn't matter what his motivations are, people listen. And in some cases they act upon it. I -- you can't draw any connection at this point, but --

CAMEROTA: Well, I mean, hold on, Joe. I mean of course we can't draw a connection that the president isn't somehow responsible.

LOCKHART: Right.

CAMEROTA: However, I'm not drawing the connection, the gunman here -- LOCKHART: Yes.

CAMEROTA: The gunman at the Tree of Life Synagogue and the gunman, or whatever, the psychopath who sent the bombs to CNN, who had the Trump pictures plastered all over his van, they're the ones who are drawing the connection about what their motivation was and where they first heard the heated rhetoric.

[06:45:03] LOCKHART: Yes. And, again, I think -- I go back to words matter.

I think the more -- the insidious thing about this particular comment was this idea that if we don't do things the way Trump wants them, then the police will get involved. A policed state. The military will get involved. All -- maybe we'll have tanks rolling down the street or the bikers, the Hell's Angels. That's -- and, again, I don't know whether Trump is a, you know, evil mastermind or just someone who just never understands what he's saying.

But the fact of the matter is, he says these things and it -- it attacks our democracy. He attacks our institutions. He says, I'm not sure that if I lose the election that I'm going to accept the results. And then he says, I've got the military on my side.

We hear this in the dictatorships. We don't hear this in our democracy. And the -- the most enduring strength of our country, as opposed to around the world is, we have peacefully transferred power for 200 and, you know, how many years, and now we have a president whose hinting that maybe we won't. Maybe we won't.

BERMAN: We keep using the word hint. I don't think there's a hint here.

LOCKHART: No.

BERMAN: I think it's a flat-out statement. He's saying, I have the military, I have the cops, and I have the bikers. And he's saying this out loud in an interview unrepentantly, David.

DAVID GREGORY, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes. And he said during the debates, as we recall, in 2016 that there may not be a peaceful transfer of -- you know, that he would -- that if he lost, that he wouldn't necessarily concede. So it's not the first time he's said it.

You know, if we live in an age where we say, well, we're not going to take him literally, it's just Trump being Trump, that -- that's -- that doesn't pass. That's ridiculous. I mean Joe's exactly right, words matter because the presidency is about something more than the occupant. It's about an institution. It says something fundamental about who we are as a democracy and who we are as Americans. And you don't do this.

At a time when there's so much toxicity in social -- coursing through social media, to have someone with this kind of megaphone speaking that way is like a dictator. I mean there's no other way to say it. And if -- and if the president and those around him are abhorred and -- by the notion that there be any connection between violence that we see playing out and his rhetoric, then somebody needs to go talk to him because it's -- we're not making this up. We have a president who talks about -- who uses the language of dictators to talk about the support of the military and the police. It speaks for itself. And there are people who can hear that and see it as a -- as a -- as a call to arms, quite literally. I mean that's -- that's what he's saying. (INAUDIBLE).

CAMEROTA: And have. I mean, and have. I mean if they don't believe the connection, maybe they should go talk to Cesar Sayoc, the crazed psychopath with the van with all of the photos of President Trump and Vice President Pence. Maybe they should ask him what his trigger was if they really want to know what happens with -- after violent rhetoric.

And, you know, sometimes the president has claimed he doesn't use violent rhetoric. Sometimes Sarah Sanders has claimed that he doesn't use it. I do not like replaying this stuff because I do think that it's dangerous and it triggers people. But I feel we must when they say that he doesn't use it. So here is -- here are just a couple of examples. There's many more. Here are just a couple of examples of the president encouraging violence.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES (February 1, 2016): Knock the crap out of them, would you? Seriously. Okay. Just knock the hell -- I promise you, I will pay for the legal fees. I promise.

TRUMP (February 22, 2016): I love the old days. You know what they used to do to guys like that when they were in a place like this? They'd be carried out on a stretcher, folks.

TRUMP (August 9, 2016): Hillary wants to abolish -- essentially abolish the Second Amendment. By the way, and if she gets to pick -- if she gets to pick her judges, nothing you can do, folks. Although the Second Amendment people, maybe there is, I don't know.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: That's the president of the United States.

LOCKHART: Yes and -- and the comments from yesterday are a significant escalation of that because this is the first time he's invoked the powers of the presidency to -- as the commander in chief, to impose his will on this country. And, you know, in response to what I wrote yesterday, I heard some people saying, oh, you're overblowing this. This is just partisan rhetoric. It's not.

GREGORY: Right.

LOCKHART: It's -- this is dangerous stuff. And, you know, I -- one of the things that -- my reaction this morning was, I went looking early this morning for, what did the president say in response to what happened in New Zealand? And the silence is deafening. And it speaks to this. This is a White House that, when they want to respond to something,

they -- you know, the president -- the president tweets 40 times a day and all he can do this morning is retweet a story from "Breitbart." I -- it's -- it's -- it's -- it's sad but it's also extremely dangerous.

CAMEROTA: Yes.

[06:50:11] GREGORY: And the other dangerous part, just to -- just quickly, is the fact that Trump so overwhelms our system of the news and how we disseminate information. He so overwhelms it with one outrageous comment after the other that responsible leaders in the country and his own party say, well, listen, we're not going to start commenting on everything he says. They just kind of let it pass. That's when the barriers are dropped.

BERMAN: Oh, I wouldn't say it that way. Yes.

GREGORY: What's that? Yes, I will say -- exactly. Yes.

BERMAN: Or they say, I wouldn't use that language. That's not good enough.

GREGORY: Right.

BERMAN: I'm sorry, at this point it's not good enough. You've got to take a stand. I mean you have to make clear that it's wrong.

CAMEROTA: Well, we have lawmakers coming up on the program, so we will be able to ask them if they feel like taking a stand. Thank you both very much.

GREGORY: Thanks.

CAMEROTA: We are continuing to follow all of the developments in the New Zealand terror attack.

And the pilot of the doomed Ethiopian Airlines jet knew there was trouble almost immediately. New details about his words and the final harrowing moments of Flight 302.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: New information that concerns the crash of the Ethiopian Airlines flight and the grounding of the Boeing 737 Max 8 and Max 9. The pilot of that flight apparently knew he was in trouble almost immediately. "The New York Times" reports the pilot requested, and he had a panicked voice, to turn back to the airport just three minutes after takeoff because the plane was speeding up abnormally.

Our Anna Stewart is live near Paris, where the black boxes are being analyzed.

What have you learned, Anna.

ANNA STEWART, CNN REPORTER: Well, as you said there, "The New York Times" article, which attributes all this to a source who has reviewed the air traffic communications, says that shortly three minutes after takeoff, the captain spoke to air traffic control back in Addis Ababa saying brake, brake, request back to home, in a panicked voice. Air traffic controllers apparently tried to scramble to find a runway, but they lost communication with the plane.

Now, the plane was seen observed to have oscillated hundreds of feet up and down. And if you compare that to the Lion Air crash from last year, obviously the same type of plane, it's got a similar altitude pattern. Are they linked? Why did they crash? We really don't know. But the secrets are here in the BEA behind me in Paris. This is the specialized unit, one of the only laboratories in the world that can analyze and interpret the data.

[06:55:18] The boxes arrived yesterday. Those are the flight data record and the recorder that records the cockpit voices. Those are crucial clues to determining what happened. How long will it take? Up to 30 days is usual for this sort of investigation for a preliminary report, maybe less time. It depends how damaged they. As you can see from pictures, they look fairly damaged, but you really can't tell from the outside what it will be inside.

CAMEROTA: Thank you very much for that chilling update. Hearing the pilot's final words was -- is so alarming. Obviously, investigators are looking into that.

We want to get back to our top story, and that's at least 49 people have been killed in this terror attack in New Zealand. So we have the latest details that are just coming into CNN, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:00:07] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

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